Pillar breech rifles - The missing link?

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You know round ball, you know patched round ball, you might know squashed round ball and of course you know the minié(ball), but do you know the Tamisier bullet and the pillar breech rifle? You will by the end of this vid!
A dive into a short 4-5 year period when pillar breech rifles were the best of the best in terms of fast loading accurate muzzleloading rifles.
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[@Oblio1942]

I think Chap is a great part of the channel.

[@Legitpenguins99]

Nonsense

[@thebotrchap]

@@Legitpenguins99 Well, you're not getting christmas card this year, hurrumph 😤

[@wierdalien1]

​@@thebotrchapbest part of the channel

[@joearledge1]

You accidentally misspelled "...is THE great part..."

[@michaelwhite9199]

I agree.

[@EXO9X8]

Came for bloke. Stayed for chap.

[@simonjones6128]

Lovin all the geeky nerdy details. Proper hands on stuff. Chappie. With all the history. Excellent job

[@danielwarren8539]

Thanks. I love learning about these old rifles work.

[@worldtraveler930]

I can just see Ian and Chap sitting down at a bar somewhere or his workshop and absolutely Geeking out over French military armaments!!! 🤠👍

[@colinarmstrong1892]

Another excellent video. I particularly like the explanation and demonstration of the cleaning tools. More please.

[@jamesbromstead4949]

Bravo Monsieur Chap. A bit of much appreciated history. Thank you.

[@haroldofold8045]

With Arthur van Rossem, keeper of firearms and artillery at the Royal armouries in belgium, which houses a collection of thousands of iconic weapons from throughout history

[@MrTwiggy93]

Great Video as usual! At 6:45, the Kingdom of Sardinia was another Country that adopted the Delvigne System with their famous Light Infantry, the Bersaglieri. They used the "Carabina da Bersaglieri mod. 1844", a quite unusual Rifle for its Time, and the Model 1848 Carabina that looks more familiar. The faced off against Austrian "Kammerbüchsen" in the First Italian War of Independence 1848/49 and they still used the Delvigne System during the Crimean War. They only changed to the Minie System relative shortly befor the War of 1859

[@thebotrchap]

Fascinating thanks! I was unaware that Delvigne ever faced Delvigne.

[@christopherreed4723]

I thought the Bersaglieri were Piedmontese. Isn't the iconic Sardinian regiment the Sassari?

[@MrTwiggy93]

@@christopherreed4723 They are the same. It was the Kingdom of Sardinia-Piedmont...

[@christopherreed4723]

@@MrTwiggy93 I hadn't known that. Thanks. Sardinia and Savoy/Piedmont aren't regions I've generally associated with each other.

[@SvenTheSveed]

As ever, an excellent production - informative and entertaining

[@yt.602]

Having seen Brett's discussion on the Tige and pillar breech rifles, I was interested to see your take on them. Fascinating intermediate step and well presented. Cleaning too! Some sniggering was involved of course.

[@marcusott2973]

Much awaited, much appreciated looking forward to excellent insights as always from you.

[@cedhome7945]

I used a Enfield for American civil war battle re enactments for over 10years , we would shoot about 40plus rounds in a short display and after i witnessed about everything in the way of cleaning you can imagine.lots of the regiment had no clue that enfields had a stepped Breach so god knows what there breach face looks like 👍 one method that seemed popular was boiling water with an additive . This made the barrel very hot but it then dryed very fast . Good to find out about these transitioning firearms and a clear relaxed explanation 👍

[@dp-sr1fd]

What is a "stepped breech" I shot an Enfield P60 and P53 for many years and I have never heard of one.

[@ExF1Guy]

Great video and very informative history lesson! I particularly appreciated the borescope footage.

[@TheWirksworthGunroom]

Very good presentation. The boresight camera is especially good to illustrate the system. Interesting how the patch holding jag is broadly similar to common modern British shotgun jags. Perhaps the latter followed the Continental pillar type for some reason now lost but then became "standard"?

[@derekp2674]

Chap, thanks very much for another informative and educational video.

[@Zorglub1966]

J'oubliais : Bravo pour l'outil de nettoyage, moi j'imaginais un truc qui aurait beaucoup intéressé S.Freud!

[@jackbrown3689]

excellent, i love these intermediate systems, belted ball would be the remaining pre Minié aspirant i can think of off hand unless theres a video somewhere i havent seen, although i understand it was favoured by 'Les Rosbifs' and is therefore questionable!

[@thebotrchap]

The "fitted bullets" are indeed another rabbit hole, be it belted ball, hexagonal bullets or even the Russian winged conicals. I believe British Muzzleloaders is currently exploring the Brunswick rabbit hole. Compression bullets are another, which Paper Cartridges has covered through the Lorenz rifle.

[@AdelaideRegiment]

Hi Bloke, the Danish m/1829/33 Sergeant's Carbines were converted from flintlock to percussion with Delvigne breech. I used to have one :)

[@thebotrchap]

The DK, SE and NO guns of the time are fascinating, they weren't afraid to try everything.

[@Zorglub1966]

Vraiment très intéressant! En plus sur un sujet plutôt obscur pour le profane! 👍

[@carlcarlton764]

Nice uniform. Btw: Die Franzosen mit den roten Hosen und den blauen Jacken, kriegen was in den Nacken. The things you learned from your grandparents.

[@ericd.7592]

Encore une belle vidéo technique et instructive sur un système que je connaissais pas, mille mercis 🙏

[@dazaspc]

A great rundown of a step in development. No surprise it didn't last to long as I would imagine having to strip the rifle down to the barrel to clean it wouldn't have been to popular or even done to often.

[@thebotrchap]

My guess is that in the field they just used soaked cloth ribbons wrapped as shown. More work than the pump method but not fundamentaly different from cleaning any other muzzleloader.

[@dazaspc]

@@thebotrchap Indeed I was thinking that could be the case but as it wasn't mentioned I wasn't sure it was allowed due to how well they stuck to the cleaning doctrine they used?

[@thebotrchap]

@@dazaspc There's aways going to be some discrepancy between official doctrine and practice, if anything else when forced to adapt due to lack of time or resources. At the end of the day soldiers cleaned whichever way they could to meet inspection standards, especially if no officers were around. Holds true to this day no doubt 😶‍🌫

[@custardthepipecat6584]

FANTASTIQUE !!

[@Sman7290]

I'd wondered how to get those clean around the pillar. Thanks, Chap.

[@johnfisk811]

Well done young Chap. Excellently presented. OT I note the Danish rifle is beech stocked. A sound choice. I conceive of the Minie cup follow up as the cup working as a pre inserted tip of a Thouvenin tige and the gas pressure in lieu of the pillar.

[@Kaboomf]

Norway went for a unified Tamisier style grooved bullet for use in both pillar breech muzzleloaders and in Kammerlader rifles, adopted in 1855 as the standard projectile throughout the Army. This meant the muzzleloaders had larger diameter bores than the Kammerlader rifles which were loaded from the breech end, but all fired the same diameter Tamisier projectile.

[@thebotrchap]

Yes, I used to have both a NO KL and Thouvenin and I used the same bullet in both. What I currently use is just a scaled down version of the NO bullet.

[@Kaboomf]

@@thebotrchap That reminds me, I should perhaps do a kammerlader Mad Minute. Need to make a better nipple first, the rifle shoots fine but there's a tendency for caps to get stuck as I didn't use enough of a cone angle on the nipple. Found a 1860/67 cartridge conversion as well, but it needs more work as it's missing a couple of parts.

[@daetslovactmandcarry6999]

Facinating.

[@barenmarder]

Chap rocking the hat, such a Zouave guy. ;p

[@thebotrchap]

Zouave and sophisticated ((TM) patch in the works)

[@raptor4916]

I've always been confused as to why the Minié-type ball took so long to invent it seems like wheels on luggage type of invention.

[@BlokeontheRange]

Hindsight is a marvellous thing indeed!

[@thebotrchap]

Delvigne actually came up with the basic idea of a hollow based bullet in the early 1830s, with a straight walled cavity in the base to bring the weigh foward, so not intended to be purposefully expanded. The Belgians even did some extensive testing on it and it showed great potential but strangely, or perhaps politically, no one was interested.

[@raptor4916]

@thebotrchap but even then, humans have been using rifles for 3 centuries at that point, and it wasnt until the early 19th century someone sat down to try to improve the firing speed of their rifles?

[@thebotrchap]

@@raptor4916 Battlefield tactics hadn't substantially evolved in 3 centuries to warrant the investment in time, funds and training. Even the best minié rifles are only of any real advantage in the hands of thoroughly trained infantry

[@raptor4916]

@@thebotrchap Ah I found the answer in a papercartridges video manufacturing tolerances weren't there yet to use an expanding base bullet design.

[@macnitt4039]

Feeding al gores rhythm. Thanks Mr Chap

[@geraldgriffin8220]

Somebody told me that in a pinch they used human urine ..but they may have been kidding.

[@thebotrchap]

I think that trope is as old as the handgonne

[@joearledge1]

4:14 squished balls are almost never a good thing...

[@thebotrchap]

[@cedhome7945]

Oddly some do like that.......

[@joearledge1]

@@cedhome7945 yeah... those people have serious problems.... with precision

[@JohnTBlock]

How much powder per load, Chappie? Bore diameter, bullet weight, etc. How many Feet per second, roughly?

[@thebotrchap]

About 75gn F1, bore diameter is around 16.5-17mm (difficult to measure a 5 groove barrel), my bullet weighs 540gn, 16mm diameter. No idea of fps.

[@canicheenrage]

Pff, encore une vidéo sur le seul sujet plus rebattu encore que l'AR15...

[@thebotrchap]

Et pourtant la majorité des poudreux semblent l'ignorer, tout comme le système Delvigne. Bizarre, étant donné le prétendu déluge d'information à ce sujet que vous insinuez.

[@canicheenrage]

@@thebotrchap D'un, je n'insinuait rien, j'étais parfaitement direct; de deux, je sais que l'ironie passe parfois mal à l'écrit, et que l'on est sur internet... Mais tout de même...Cela dépassait l'hyperbole. Enfin, c'est l'intention qui compte, et corriger une fausseté perçue est digne d'éloges.

[@thebotrchap]

@@canicheenrage Désolé, je n’ai pas perçu l’ironie 😅

[@canicheenrage]

@@thebotrchap Aucun problème, comme je le disais, à l'écrit, et surtout sur internet, ce n'est pas difficile. Ravi d'avoir découvert le sujet ( le site "armement réglementaire français", pourtant plutôt complet, n'en parle pas ), ces vidéos sont toujours un plaisir. Et bonne continuation !

[@thebotrchap]

@@canicheenrage Merci! Au fait la version FR sortira prochainement