Pokemon Gold & Silver Were ALMOST A Disaster

[@JPRPokeTrainer98]

Minor mistake, the thing that looks like Leafeon actually WAS Leafeon, as the coding says Eevee was supposed to evolve with a Leaf Stone. My mistake!

[@stardmg]

As well, that "night time Meowth evolution" is actually beta Aipom, note the hand-tail😅

[@tlst94]

Was Pokemon always meant to continue after Gen 2 as DYKG mentioned? I could've sworn it was supposed to be the series finale. Didn't GameFreak have interviews saying that Gen 2 would be the last game during its development? Why else would it take place in the entire Japan after Gen 1's Kanto?

[@naturalharmoniagropius4486]

6 gens later, that happened. Leafeon, a Gen 4 Pokemon, evolved via Leaf Stone than the previous Mossy Rock location.

[@robertlupa8273]

@@tlst94 According to what Did You Know Gaming found out semi-recently, no, it wasn't supposed to be the final game. - In a interview from July 2000, Satoshi Tajiri confirmed that "no, it's not the end". - Meanwhile, in a 2010 interview, Tsunekazu Ishihara said that during Gen 2's development, he "worked with the assumption that after we put out Gold and Silver, *my* work as far as Pokemon was concerned would be done". _His work_ would be done, not _the franchise._

[@dundee6402]

I'm assuming you only used the mediocre and lacking Bulbapedia article as source, when the website Cutting Room Floor has already documented the demos in great detail. Pretty disappointing and poor research

[@Mr_K_O]

5:15 According to a Gameinformer Cover Story for Pokemon Sword and Shield, they do keep old concepts that can be used for future games! :)

[@wikiuser92]

4:39 That actually looks more like a beta Aipom rather than anything feline. It even has the hand on its tail. 6:11 References to Umbreon's original typing can still be found in the Pokédex, which repeatedly mentions it producing toxic sweat.

[@mindwarp42]

No, it is a cat, but the Rinrin line is a separate line from Meowth, and was Dark type. Berurun, the evo shown here, and Rinrin both have bells at the end of their tails. The Cutting Room Floor has the full list of Spaceworld 97 mons.

[@wikiuser92]

@@mindwarp42 I know that line, but that's not the sprite shown on screen when he says that.

[@ugn154]

Exactly ​@@wikiuser92

[@ciavalen.rie.143]

Umbreon was originally supposed to be a Poison-type Eeveelution that evolves with a scrapped "Poison Stone".

[@wikiuser92]

@@ciavalen.rie.143 Yup. I know.

[@sayvionwashington1939]

Friendly reminder that Kotora was cut twice and was originally a 3 stage line in Gen 1. Gamefreak truly works in mysterious ways.

[@modesties]

Mikon was also scrapped in gen 1, 2, and 4

[@darquezze306]

Fun fact not mentioned in the Honoguma section of the video, Honoguma was turned into Teddiursa later in development!

[@skeetermania3202]

Flame bear to princess bear!

[@cort7462]

and it turned to be a little sprite for a mammal pokemon like Sneasel, Eevee and others XD

[@conansglasses2645]

Friendly reminder, most of the cut original pokemon and evolutions got cut to make room for baby pokemon . So yes, Farfetch'd, Pinsir, and Katora all got screwed over because GF wanted to have Igglybuff and Cleffa in the games so damn bad

[@legendhunter14]

That's simply not true. Igglybuff and Cleffa existed alongside Katora, Farfetch'd Evo and Pinsir evo

[@MaxHeartLeigh]

Doesn’t Farfetch’d Have A Evolution Now?

[@robertlupa8273]

@@MaxHeartLeigh _Galarian_ Farfetch'd does. Kantonian Farfetch'd doesn't.

[@castform7]

I always wished that Farfetch'd evolution (commonly known as Madame) got to see the light of day. I like that we have Sirfetch'd now, I just really like Kantonian Farfetch'd and thought Madame would've been a sick end to the line. Others like Honoguma and the electric tiger are cool too but Madame would've been a highlight for me.

[@ciavalen.rie.143]

Madame also was in Gen 1 but was also cut, and its original name is "Empressive" in the Red/Green Beta.

[@MidwestArtMan]

I think that shark with an anchor butt got reworked into Sharpedo. I always wondered why it's only half of a shark. My guess is that the chain spine was too dark/gory for a kids game. It would also make Sharpedo's Dark typing more dark.

[@claymathewselevator8121]

They said Gen 3 was also trying to have less cute Pokémon after gen 2

[@benschiemer]

7:50 Misty’s club foot is driving me nuts

[@SonicTheCutehog]

Red was intended to be Kanto's Gym Leader in the Spaceworld demo. Blue was originally going to assist his grandfather in research.

[@KremBotop]

So this is where Gary's post Johto development in the show came from then. Repurposing cut elements from the games. Team Flare going straight to chasing Zygarde has to be another one.

[@tabbender1232]

Don't quote me on that but i think at some point before gen 2 came out it was advertized that it would be possible to catch trainers' pokemon in it. If this is true and that was actually something that was planned at some point, it could indicate that ColoXD's shadow pokemon concept was actually reused from that, that Johto originally had shadow pokemon and that this concept was in the end turned into the Dark type. I mean, team rocket using sound waves to make pokemon... evolve? Doesn't make much sense. Turning them into shadow pokemon makes more sense and would explain why the red Gyarados went berserk, if it was originally supposed to be a shadow Gyarados

[@seukuka816]

That actually makes sense if you think about how Shadow Pokémon were already a thing since Pokémon TCG2. The cardgame itself uses the japanese term "Dark Pokémon", but those are, in fact, Shadow Pokémon (in japan "Dark-type" and "Shadow Pokémon" are called "Evil-type" and "Dark Pokémon", respectively).

[@PixelPikmin]

As a Gen 2 enjoyer, I hope designs like Kotora and the Pinsir evo come back in future games. Actually just thought this, could be a cool way to do Johto remakes, bringing back a ton of designs from the beta

[@Xylospring]

You know what...? Maybe even a Legends Johto can play with this. And if Johto ever gets more future Remakes, maybe add DPPT underground and make a few Lost Pokemon.

[@mjdxp5688]

I think it'd be more accurate to say "Pokemon Gen 2 Changed Almost Everything". The final versions of the games have nearly nothing in common with the Spaceworld '97 demo.

[@WhoElseButZane]

Neerrrrdddd

[@LunarWingCloud]

Yeah but that isn't as catchy a title

[@rawburtmartinez]

Nah it's still gold and silver

[@Bredstikc]

@@WhoElseButZaneWe're both the ones watching Pokemon content. Friendly fire.

[@KoreeluStromboli]

4:40 Going off of the hand at the end of its tail, it looks like an early version of Aipom. 8:43 I never noticed that.

[@AdeptCharon]

"How many Johto Pokémon can you even catch in Johto" As the decades have passed, I've stopped seeing this as a "flaw" of the game, and more as a sign of Pokémon fans not realizing that the idea of "a region's Pokémon" didn't really exist (at least in a deliberate way) prior to Hoenn. When the devs set out to make Gold and Silver, they didn't set out to make "Pokémon for the Johto region", they set out to expand the (Kanto) roster of Pokémon. When the devs set out to create Johto, they didn't set out to create "a different region", they set out to expand the world of Kanto. So naturally, the new Pokémon added in Gen 2 were always going to be Kanto 1.5

[@matthewbarabas3052]

so...basically, pokemon gold, silver and crystal is just a more complete version of a generation 1 games. makes sense.

[@Mr110074]

This explains a lot about Johto. Like it always felt like it was swaying between being it’s own region and Kanto DLC.

[@gavinaaric]

1:57 Proof the giving time into something creates perfection just like Bayleef comapred to Meganium

[@tlst94]

Imagine if they did that with recent games.

[@gavinaaric]

@@tlst94 yeah

[@lipika2841]

​@@tlst94 Floragato & Tinkaton r a thing.

[@Asm0d3u5]

Beta Pokemon are really cool! Especially the Gible line and Lumineon!!

[@Jlaps941]

A lot of the D&P beta sprites are super interesting, especially beta Giratina which looks way more like Raikou than Giratina, and beta Arceus that seemed a lot more abstract

[@Shadow-Joop-157]

Umbreon has pokedex entries that say Umbreon has poison he can use. So I think it changed late in development

[@SilentRealm6677]

Even though Viridian forest and cerulean cave aren't present in final product the landmark names were still in the files

[@reesecarlton]

Love the way you analyzed this neat history without throwing in uninterestly obscure facts, the overally production quality has been great lately. Keep it up man :)

[@josephlucas.44]

Hey JPR (and editor) I absolutely love the recent addition of the Kingdom Hearts menu sound effect being used but I would like to suggest turning the volume down just a tiny bit more. I found it a little distracting at parts when it was used in a rapid succession (like 4:55) but i still love the use of it!

[@henryhunter9643]

Games can change a lot during development. It's like how Project Dream, which was meant to be an isometric pirate adventure game on the SNES eventually became a 3D collectathon platformer called Banjo Kazooie.

[@christianlorre]

Natu and Xatu are unchanged because they were perfect to start with. Delibird didn't change much either, also perfect.

[@hucklebucklin]

4:39 thats GOT to be related to Aipom SURELY

[@dundee6402]

Yeah it is beta Aipom. I dunno why the maker of this video didn't catch that.

[@TamingTauros]

Honestly, if Scizor’s design stayed the same as the beta, it might be my favorite Pokémon ever

[@AzureFlute]

The beta of Pokémon Gold really is one of the most fascinating things I have ever seen in the franchise. That and the prototype stuff for Gen 1 that Helix Chamber delves into.

[@Bailonus]

That's because Gen 1 and 2 were the experimental stages of the franchise. After Gen 2 and the success of gen 3 they had their formula for future games down.

[@L.Drizzle]

The one you describe as "a night time evolution of Meowth" looks a lot more like a beta version or evolution of Aipom to me

[@awesomeocelot7475]

They still need to make the slowbro/Slowking Shellder evo an actual full evolution of Shellder. Like a split evo instead of cloyster.

[@GamingBoy-nc3ml]

The Lanto Gym Peader is actually Red using his default name from Blue Version. The Gen 1 rival is known as Green in Japan.

[@jesuisunstroopwafel]

Meanwhile, in an alternate universe...

[@robertlupa8273]

5:07 I have a mild soft spot for the first stage of this line ("Manbo-1" or "Sunmola" or whatever you wanna call it), if only because of an OC based on it I saw online.

[@castform7]

I have to wonder what the purpose of Ditto's evolution would be. Ditto's thing is immediately becoming the opposing Pokemon, that's all it can do. Making Ditto stronger is like giving Shedinja more Defense and Sp. Def. Unless it was going to add to Ditto's moveset, I don't see the point.

[@tlst94]

Pretty sure it'd prevent breeding. lol

[@conansglasses2645]

Dittos evi was actually a Steel/Normal type , since Steel was introduced as a defensive typing I think the idea was that the evo would have more HP , Defenses and a better typing so it can safely use Transform as Ditto was too slow and fraik to see any actual use . In fact im pretty sure that Dittos signature item ( metal powder ) which doubles its defenses until it Transforms was a reference to the scrapped EVO

[@avch1209]

maybe Terminator reference?

[@Swagsire_]

10:17 Ohhh so that’s probably where Pokemon *X*D comes from

[@GaioSamurai]

I was today years old when I learned that JPR isn't at half a million subs... Good luck reaching a quarter mil, brother! Hope it comes soon

[@bradwhite5884]

If we ever get a Legends game in Johto (Maybe after Legends ZA maybe), they could revisit some of these cut Pokémon, also the cut starters should return for a future gen for a future gen starters maybe, also we do need a non-legendary electric tiger tbh, we have a fire tiger but that's a starter Pokémon, but yeah, also love to see them revisit and bring back cut Pokémon at some point, especially the Tangella pre-evo tbh

[@tktyga77]

Funny how many of the aspects covered (not just the scrapped mons) would go on to sway/influence later gens, even with a ton of second installment weirdness ongoing. Apparently, Gen 2 was gonna be part of what was originally gonna be a duology instead of a series that we have & the studios weren't expecting it to be popular outside of Japan, which is what led Gen 3 to change many things including a much more substantial game (but the same thought wasn't given to RS postgame, sadly) in a bid to get people to actually buy instead of renting them (since game rental is illegal in Japan)

[@TrvisXXIII]

The irony of persona music after the intro lol

[@lucafreak5]

Really nice vid, the two weeks upload cycle seems to help you a lot!

[@alexthetiger7806]

11:22 my ankles stlll hurt everytime I think about Razor scooters (the radical pain)

[@gavinaaric]

Love your JPR Happy Every Other JPR Friday

[@TF8ase]

It's always really interesting to see what was changed but I think some of the story changes interested me the most. To see how things could have gone.

[@HybridHero]

Why are your doors open

[@spontaneouswizard358]

We did get a pre-evolution of Mr Mime in Generation 4 with Mime Jr, so it all worked out in the end.

[@UmbraStarWolf]

My goat Lugia would have never been in the games if it wasn’t for that development cycle

[@tlst94]

What if in an alternate timeline, anime writer, Shudo Takeshi had worked at GameFreak? And designed Lugia as a 150th Gen 1 Pokemon? While Mewtwo became a 152nd Mythical. And if both Mews were catchable rewards for showing Oak the completed Pokedex?

[@vaya-dragon1998]

5:11 that Palworld roast was genius 😂

[@chickennwafers]

I was having an awful day. I got sent home earlier from work and was about to punch a hole in the wall, but them I saw you had uploaded and my day got slightly better.

[@ShadyRK9]

Happy JPR Friday! I hope in the future they reuse these Pokémon designs!

[@HatsuneChiYu]

I just paused Persona to watch this and am greeted by Persona music in the intro, had to double check if my game was actually off lmao

[@icephoenix174]

Your channel reminds me a bit of Jwittz.

[@k2basior]

Wasn't Silver mascot initially the silver Tiger/Lion

[@youtube-kit9450]

1:27 This sprite screen really made my inner pokéboomer come out. There's no benefit to doing it this way instead of every pokémon having a sprite/model, it's more inconvenient and lazier if you did it that way, but jesus does a part of me wish that you could toggle an option that made the pokémon menu sprites/models grouped categories instead of a specific pokémon. Those sprites just tug at my 30 year old heartstrings, man.

[@Diz_27]

Love the persona 5 background music 💜

[@Lando-kx6so]

Honoguma became Teddiursa

[@raykreiger4123]

ey jpr, whos your pick for the daytona 500?

[@dkfunentertainment3778]

Great video! I loved it!

[@mapmeister333ttv2]

I would have easily watched an hour long video about this.

[@moyai5317]

kinda sad that HGSS never added any of the mons cut from gsc development or finished everything

[@Dad_Shoes]

Prior to Generation 8 in 2019, all Pokémon games of a generation were compatible with one-another and needed to have the same roster. Adding things that didn't exist in Diamond, Pearl, or Platinum would have broken compatibility.

[@miikaroos3809]

​​@@Dad_Shoes USUM were not fully compatible with Sun and Moon, because they actually had totally new Pokémon. And let's not forget the new Megas and Primals in ORAS that didn't exist in XY.

[@Dad_Shoes]

@@miikaroos3809 3DS games were more advanced than DS games. There might have been technical limitations that prevented it from happening.

[@garchompelago]

We had the chance to have Gorochu in this game but they went with the useless Pichu just because Baby Pokemon and Breeding were the main highlight of this generation. Like really? Pichu?

[@castform7]

I'd agree with you.... but Pichu is too precious to not exist.

[@geekgo4]

Japan loves cute things.

[@tlst94]

@@castform7 Plus, it got a few short films and TV specials. Even in Pokemon Channel(Gamecube spinoff about watching TV with Pikachu). They made my childhood. Who wouldn't love cute characters like them?

[@avch1209]

Gorochu would be mega Raichu or Raichu gigamax

[@Chorongy-]

Don't remind me of that pokebal video, RIP Quickball

[@docalpaca]

Hoopsandhiphop wants your approval in his newest video!

[@claymathewselevator8121]

You owe me a new hard drive 😂

[@briansanders8748]

5:52 do you have a NASCAR channel?

[@TangerineTux]

Those are interesting tidbits but I’m not sure exactly how they support the idea that it was almost a disaster.

[@justinn8541akaDrPokemon]

I do hope another person like Iwata will come and help Game Freak optimize their games.

[@GetPhiledIn]

Nighttime Meowth? You mean Aipom! 🤦🏻‍♂️

[@Morgil27]

What about the donut mascot?

[@Samorutt1324]

I mean, if you can only find jotho pokemon like Houndour in kanto, isn't it teknikly a kanto pokemon then?

[@Illumisepoolist]

Can you do history of pokemon types series like Flying or Ground?

[@ULTRASKY220]

Love this channel

[@ChicagoMel23]

Aw I wanted the Tiger Pokemon line

[@claymathewselevator8121]

I’m happy Whitney wasn’t earlier

[@tlst94]

What if every Gen included 256 unique species? Including scrapped mons like Gorochu, Kotora, and the Pangshi line.

[@miikaroos3809]

Why 256? That's specific. If every Gen had that many new species, Dexit would have happened way earlier.

[@tlst94]

@@miikaroos3809 Because 256 is a perfect even number. Everything divides evenly. And is perfectly balanced. As all things should be. Plus, Gens 1 & 2 each had 256 slots.

[@youtube-kit9450]

Considering how many dex entries talk about how the sweat or whatever the hell of Umbreon is poisonous, it makes sense that thing at some point was meant to be a poison type.

[@tlst94]

What if Dark Types never existed? And if Ghost Types had been strong from the start? How'd that have changed the gameplays?

[@bp1991able]

I will always be a Johtoddler!

[@AbstractOddity]

FYI you said disparagement but I think you meant discrepancy in the code lol

[@matthewbarabas3052]

a common mistake of many youtubers is that they keep the videos short.

[@Xderda]

The story behind Lugia's creation is actually quite sad. DidYouKnowGaming has a good video on it.

[@MasterofSpiders]

4:47. Christ. Kill it.

[@raulnatokapa]

It's me or this dude looks like an American Tom Holland?

[@tlst94]

He should've kept his face hidden like Batman. As the reveal reduced him to a mere man. And ruins the fun mystery around it. Something that Joker hates.

[@paweldik3193]

Bellibolt = Beta politoad

[@TheYoshiChannel-7]

40:39 That isn’t a scrapped meowth evolution it’s beta aipom

[@Shadow-Joop-157]

The Chikorita family is the only original starter Pokemon that came into the full game. And it's the least popular of them all

[@miikaroos3809]

This was an interesting video. I certainly didn't know most of these things. Sadly, even though Gen 2 clearly turned out better than it could have been, it's still the worst Gen, imo.

[@tlst94]

How'd Gen 2 have looked like if only Johto was included?

[@JKSlevenS77S]

The voodoo doll possibily became Mimikyu

[@HMMadsen]

Or Banette

[@JKSlevenS77S]

I honestly spaced about that. Very very true there.

[@TheFanVoicePodcast]

Bring Kurusu Back!!

[@matchstick546]

Hello daily downforce guy

[@MajorUpgrade760]

Since you said pretty please.. I suppose I can subscribe...

[@OmegaSean]

4:40 that’s……aipom

[@MojaveKnight17]

Meh old news

[@Y_tho]

Nice

[@cullencrossing3578]

Funny to think that Pikablue was at one point Pinkachu.

[@RayGunga13]

johto

[@GDitto]

Those sound effects are horrible. Please do not use them again.

[@ShredAimlessly92]

Last

[@reesecarlton]

Does he know