Postmodernism | Gad Saad and Jordan B. Peterson

[@carolynsherman4544]

Two of my very favorite thinkers talking with each other!! Does life get any better than this?!

[@proudatheist2042]

Life*. Yes, I can say that life gets better if you get to meet Dr. Peterson in person and he takes your question as the last VIP Q & A question for the night.

[@proudatheist2042]

Life can also get better if you get to hide under a giant desk with both of them at the same time.

[@bush_boi_bass_bone]

If postmodernism is intellectual terrorism, Jordan Peterson is like the John Wick of intelligentsia.

[@marty7442]

In that case, I am glad to tell you there is far more than merely one "John Wick' here. Jordan Peterson is not alone; Not by far.

[@bush_boi_bass_bone]

@@marty7442 I agree. However, the existence of numerous "John Wicks" sounds awfully postmodern to me... :)

[@marty7442]

@@bush_boi_bass_bone : Heh. Good thing it was just a metaphor then.

[@_Matt_Matt_365_]

and he is on a revenge quest since they killed his dog by asking him to use gender pronouns...

[@dustinpriest5111]

I miss Jordan Peterson showing up on my KZbin feed and watching him so much. I feel like he really cares for people and has the answers for humanity.

[@NNPerfection]

Good to see Dr. Peterson looking well!

[@jfmm99]

"You cannot go on 'seeing through' things for ever. The whole point of seeing through something is to see something through it. It is good that the window should be transparent, because the street or garden beyond it is opaque. How if you saw through the garden too? It is no use trying to 'see through' first principles. If you see through everything, then everything is transparent. But a wholly transparent world is an invisible world. To 'see through' all things is the same as not to see." ~C.S. Lewis "Abolition of Man" Go Jordan Go!!!!!

[@Wikingersohn93]

This fits excelently on the exemple given.

[@Individual_Lives_Matter]

Postmodernism reminds me of when I was meditating a lot and I thought I would eventually see through the thoughts and words I had imposed on reality. I would see the world as it truly was. I felt better breathing deeply. I was calmer. I was less wrapped up in BS and drama but the world was still there. But I wasn’t seeing through some illusion or walking through walls or whatever other mystical happenings I might have anticipated once I ‘transcended’. Postmodernists still have to (or at should) wipe their asses, no matter how socially constructed things might or might not be.

[@joeyschwartz5150]

Excellent episode. Peterson is stronger and his cognitive health improves week by week. So happy he made it through his illness.

[@willyghost2213]

Peterson is getting back in the groove with every interview. Looking and sounding great!

[@JL-hz5li]

I had a conversation with a feminist and my feeling was like that “dancing hyena” exactly. It’s like, every time when I spent 10 min establishing a tiny piece of common ground to build up the discussion, she said “nope I teleport to another continent now”.

[@amoeboidtendencies5137]

Indeed. And just to play devil's advocate, what would have happened if you just broke through the fourth wall, cut to the chase and told this individual they were being intellectually dishonest? I can already safely imagine..

[@cameronbrown9424]

If what postmodernists say is true, that there is no objectively better idea than any other, postmodernism is no objectively better an idea than modernism, or any other idea

[@adventureswithjonny87]

Haha truth!

[@ExistentialWill]

That's called epistemic humility, not refutation. Peterson should try it sometime but he doesn't.

[@BoRaCutie]

@@ExistentialWill so he's 'epistemicly arrogant'?

[@facundomora1845]

Mr Peterson thanks for sharing this! Greets from Argentina!

[@marty7442]

I have discovered one of these universal concepts is stoicism. Every successful culture seems to have a concept of 'getting over one's self' combined with 'letting things you can't control be'.

[@ExistentialWill]

Idiocy prevails when stoics enter the picture, thinking cherrypicked utterances of themselves makes themselves universal.

[@marty7442]

@@ExistentialWill : Nietszche? If so, he wasn't exactly consistent about stoicism. He would say stuff like that, I read them myself, but then turn around and embrace the Amor Fati, which is a stoic concept. What do YOU actually think on the subject?

[@GrubKiller436]

@@marty7442 I doubt they are thinking.

[@marty7442]

@@GrubKiller436 : I suspect this is just nonsense from what Nietzsche would refer to as a 'bloodless educator', in regards to that veiled insult here. I mean someone who just parrots what they read without understanding nuance or perspective, then pretends to be smarter then everyone in the room.

[@curtisjackson5793]

@@marty7442 as you actually read them, would you confirm something to me (I just read Marcus Aurelius)? Stoics have many correlations with plato-aristotelics when it comes to their epistemology, moral teachings and virtues cultivation, with their biggest differences being their respective metaphysics, as the stoics adopt a materialistic view? Are there more points of contact and divergences between them (apart from the implications from the different cosmologies)?

[@beemo9]

"The holy trinity of bullshit" - love Gad's bluntness. He won't be canceled.

[@מיכאלמרטיןבנדיקטוס]

Dear JBP. Maps of meaning just arrived via the atlantic. Buying it was the first thing i did upon liistening in to the times interview. Rarely been happier to pay for a book.

[@HSANCTUARY25]

Much love love and peace to you both. You are respected and loved thank you for your great work. 😇😇❤️❤️❤️😍💖💖🌹🌹♥️💜💜💜💕💕💕💕💕💕🙏🏻🙏🏻😇😇😇😇

[@Rampart.X]

If nothing is objectively true or real, then on what basis is that claim both true and real?

[@mikolajochocki2810]

that's actually a really good point

[@4grammaton]

It merely represents skepticism about the idea that there is an objective and universal authority that we can appeal to in order to derive what is true and real, given the conceptual and logical inconsistencies inherent to that kind of conception of truth. It proposes a search for alternative approaches to conceiving of truth that might avoid those inconsistencies and be more useful. Jordan Peterson is a postmodernist, by the way.

[@Rampart.X]

@@4grammaton - just a word salad.

[@penitentone6998]

@@4grammaton "Skepticism" more like denial of truth. And if you think Jordan is postmodernist then you have no idea what postmodernism is

[@4grammaton]

@@penitentone6998 More like a denial of ideological dogma that masquerades as truth. Postmodernism is a philosophical climate brought about by the failures and atrocities of Modernism, that is broadly characterised by skepticism and distrust of modernist meta-narratives such as Marxism and a tendential affinity for decentralised, non-universal ontologies.

[@T_Fizzle]

Thank you both.

[@philanthropicnightmare1206]

This podcast was excellent excellent excellente.

[@GrubKiller436]

I think I became semi-postmodern at some point without anyone ever introducing it to me ever. It's a serious, horrific ditch that just about anyone can drive into with enough self-hyperintellectualism.

[@dreamingdreamerdream]

Same here, Im glad I found a way out too. It's bullsht in there

[@MashiroRedo]

Seems like he's back people!

[@joelmutagwaba255]

Seems like so

[@EmmanuelLambertCanada]

So refreshing! Thank you

[@johnbrien6313]

The Childrens story of ‘the Emperors NewClothes’ is instructive While the crowd interpreted what they saw subjectively It took a small boy to see the situation for what it was- BS!!!

[@podorperceiverofpitfalls2059]

To THINK: an internal conversation to choose via risk vs reward what to say or what to do before speaking or acting to achieve a desired result; internal dialogue utilizing memories of previous experiences and their results; talking to oneself Social situation: Three people. Persons A, B, and C. Persons A and B are conversing. Person C joins them. Greetings are politely exchanged. A and B continue their conversation. C feels excluded. C feels A and B would rather be alone. C politely excuses themselves. Question: What if A and B are not two people? What if A and B are one person...thinking (talking to themselves)? Perhaps if we don't consciously make an effort to focus on the words of person C, we don't actually hear them. Could this be why we all seem to be talking passed each other? Could this be why we feel no one listens to us? Or ever listens? Could this be why we feel so lost and misunderstood? Perhaps "proper" socialization means knowing the import of taking turns. Perhaps, though we don't realize, we arent truly taking turns during a conversation. Others want a turn to talk to us, but never get the opportunity because we arent sharing ourselves, and we simply up to this moment have not understood. All games require taking turns. Especially this game; the greatest game, the game of life. Thanks for playing.

[@nhafkm]

I finally am reading thisss.

[@robertlusk8988]

When Gaad spoke with the lady at dinner he should have found out what she really cared about and then deny her opinion or feelings about this topic. For example, let's say he found out that she was an environmentalist, he should bring up some horrific pollution event to get her opinion on it. He can then guide her to agree that some things are objectively wrong.. or right. You have to get to what they care about because it is all about feelings and preferences with them.

[@BootsofBlindingSpeed]

I've heard anthropology is quite well respected. Can someone explain to me the difference between that & the cultural variation Gad talked about & why, if anthropology is indeed respected why cultural isn't?

[@mitchells5619]

Postmodernists throw mud into the gears of our conversations and minds, slowing down If not stopping our ability to process.

[@siyaindagulag.]

Mud of the most abrasive type .ie. sand, broken glass, and the stone of the enlightenment , put through a crusher. Laughing hyena my ass. Insane.

[@ugjhgjf]

Science is constantly proved all the time. If we take something like any fiction, any holy book, and destroyed it, in a thousand years' time, that wouldn't come back just as it was. Whereas if we took every science book and every fact and destroyed them all, in a thousand years they'd all be back because all the same tests would be the same result. Ricky Gervais

[@adventureswithjonny87]

Hell yeah! The lobster king and the honey badger! 🦞 🦡

[@GrubKiller436]

They're back!

[@philanthropicnightmare1206]

We need an animation of that lmao

[@HaikesXO]

5:19 so once I kind of recovered from the complete utter bullshit that was being spoken to me I clapped back with some straight fucking facts

[@4EyedAnimation]

GREAT!

[@adamcallaghan2135]

Amazing

[@ashleeheaston2202]

Shackles is a strong word how about grounded in truth and objective reasoning?

[@joannedobie765]

Wow we are in deep dodo. I hope and pray this comes to a STOP in our schools . No wonder we are living in a weird world the sense of what is truly real is going out with the baby water.

[@GrubKiller436]

Schools will teach us to be victims rather than empower us.

[@froopzoop5739]

This "quasi marxism" I think is hegels master slave dialectic as thair conceptual basis. The rejection of absolute truth makes them stuck in the master slave dialectic making it go to the extreme.

[@nobodyreally]

As im looking up the word Sin in the Hebrew & Chaldee dictionary #2398 "a prime root; prop. to miss". I think I stumbled across a ironic abbreviation typo 🤔 "prop." in Strongs Concordance 😆. 🌻

[@BoRaCutie]

Seafarers watching this be like: 👀

[@cormacjudge7678]

With Derrida it’s the text. Saad said language, so no. He should be more specific. It’s about finding that phrase that seems like an afterthought and building a critique from that, encompassing the entire text; getting to the heart of it. Derrida did this to Foucault’s History of Madness. Foucault didn’t talk to him for 10 years after that critique. He did this to Claude Levi-Strauss. He did this to philosophy books, as far as I know, only philosophy books. He was charitable though, because his critique wouldn’t have existed without the text. As far as I know, The Beast and The Sovereign is when Derrida goes into Biopolitics/biopower. I haven’t read it but I’ve listened to lectures. I think neither Saad nor Peterson are experts on Derrida or Foucault or postmodernism.

[@podorperceiverofpitfalls2059]

Little one? Ever notice how a President seems to age dramatically over the course of their term in office? Weight of the world. Stress. No bueno. First sign of stress is frustration. Walk away. Music. Beauty. Love. Life

[@jorgem8384]

Lets goooo

[@JaketheJust]

Dr. Saad please tell us that you acted like a father figure to your student and said, “Son, I’m not going to lie but you could do better!”

[@podorperceiverofpitfalls2059]

Little one? This piece is entitled, Intra-atomic Equilibrium of a Swan’s Feather. That's a mouthful. Sounds brainy. Sounds way over a Little one's head. But is it? Up for a challenge, Little one? Let's tackle it, together, and see if we can make sense of it. Slow is smooth. Smooth is fast. "Inch by inch, life's a cinch..." So? So, let's go through one thing at a time... Okay. Hmm. Let's have a gander. Shall we? The young, strong hand is reaching for the pen; whilst the old decrepit hand (the crusty paw) is moving back to "the old way of thinking." (Looks like a rather sad and rotting brain stem, right?) Swan's feather? Anyone? Used in making quill pens. 1947. War is over. Big year for the "pen is mightier...". Many agreements ratified. Truman Doctrine. Marshall Plan. UN Partition Plan-Resolution 181. Swan also a sign of beauty, trust, loyalty, soul mates. "A watermelon is a large berry whose swollen roundness and vibrant red flesh connote fertility and sexuality. Dreams of watermelons, therefore, signify love, lust, passion, and fertility, family and harvest." "Shells are usually perceived as feminine; a symbol of birth, good fortune, and resurrection. Bivalved mollusks represent the womb and fertility." "The potato is and will always be a symbol of love." That seems like a head scratcher, but it's a direct quote. Looks like the artist may foresee a bit of a "baby boom?". Guess we will all have to wait and see if he is right about that particular premonition. Seriously...who does he think he is. Silly mustache...flamboyant..odd behavior....now he prognosticates future events? Oh wait. Baby boomers. The biggest explosion in birthrates in history. One supposes it WAS a pretty good time for love. Who was this guy? Shrug Thanks, Father, for Google and Wikipedia and seemingly flamboyantly insane fellows with funny moustaches, and new perspectives. ❤️ art. Thank you for my Little one. In thy hallowed name we 🙏. Amen.

[@soroushbahrami438]

"Holy Trinity of Bullshit" LMAO

[@marcpadilla1094]

Posmodernism is then denihilism and resentiment.

[@Keeronin]

I really hope Jordan speaks to Jonathan Pageau about postmodernism. I think Jordan overemphasises the negative aspects of it and fails to see the positive aspects - ie in awakening modern materialists from their blind, enlightenment certainty, and forcing them to look at the role of consciousness in the formation of the world.

[@blackeyesforyou]

You look so healthy Professor Peterson. The good fight has just begun. Ministers wouldn't stand a chance against you in the House of Commoners.

[@alisrour8460]

Ayy JB ... it would not kill you to smile for once in your pictures

[@noxot13]

lol. but then I recall that in the beginning I was with God just like Jesus told his disciples. perception is important. in the beginning the word was with God. the lamb was slain before the foundations of the world. atheist don't believe that language is the ultimate. but I suppose I'm slightly surmounting postmodernist. either that or there's a difference between a master and a disciple. a lot of people claim to clearly understand Christianity and I claim that I understand it better. there's the actual person and then there's a person's perception of them. perhaps some can look into something deep enough to find truth in it. this is because Angels surmount demons.

[@yvesjeaurond4937]

Hi, Gad Saad: loved your thoughts about women, money and dating on Joie Rogan's podcast. About postmodernism? Look, read Lyotard, _La Condition Postmoderne_. Please get it right: the great narratives (religious, political---including marxism), could not hold up to science when they tried to justify themselves. But science, when it tries to justify itself through a narrative then fails due to the same flaws inherent in all great narratives. This paradox, the failure of justification through great narrative, is postmodernism. Postmodernism is useful to cut off righteousness about absolute, unfair social truths that affirm their solidity based on a narrative. Postmodernism doesn't attack reality. It attacks bad legitimation. It attacks the real terrorism of ideas that are unfounded but say that they are. You have both built a strawman by showing postmodernists as raving mad idiots who deny truth. They don't. They deny the legitimacy of non-experienced truths (hearsay), pretty much => as does a court of law. Pseudo-truths derived not from facts, but from narratives. New discoveries, scientific and sociual theories, basic savoir-faire, common knowledge are NOT under attack. Give yourselves, and postmopdernists a break. Talk about the real issue: legitimation. Confusing experienced, witnessed truth with hearsay, rumour, anecdotes is as old as the world. Courts of law uphold the distinction. Why don't you do so to? Relying on hearsay from an undergraduate date? :-) Would you do science that way? Sociology? Psychology? Please give postmodernism a fair shake. Thanks

[@MZGA2009]

You can not have this conversation until you recognize modern warfare. The psych operations and propaganda are ignored here. Instead you "philosophize" about what makes a conspiracy theorist.

[@juliagamotska182]

Language is the tool with the help of witch functions human contiosness and that is why it determines the reality.

[@lianeboeckx3700]

There's hope for Canada yet. . . . & he's back in the saddle again. . . Go team go!

[@rd4660]

GadFather....you get a haircut and you lose 20 pounds! Envy.

[@steven5054]

Jordan "I can redefine the meaning of belief in God to suit my purposes, but everything else I disagree with is Postmodernism" Peterson.

[@joker503703]

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[@oojasperoo3454]

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[@joaopedrof25]

@@oojasperoo3454 3nd

[@666Zerschmetterling]

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