Power Scales - The Insane scaling of Shulk & Xenoblade Chronicles!

"Just who the Hell do you think we are? Today we use our power to fell a god, and drill through heavens!"
The long promised (dunno if long awaited) series where I go over power of Xenoblade Chronicles series' characters begins here! Hope you're in for a long one, because these videos will be in-depth & full of lore explanations!
Contents:
- Introduction 0:00:00 - 0:03:47
- Bionis and Mechonis 0:03:48 - 0:10:28
- Shulk and The Monado 0:10:29 - 0:27:10
- The Party 0:27:11 - 0:32:14
- Feats and Calculations 0:32:15 - 0:39:33
- Zanza and Passage of Fate 0:39:34 - 0:52:16
(Counterpoints) 0:52:17 - 0:57:10
- Conclusion 0:57:11 - 1:00:21
Also, lol at the update on my Power Scaling all Smash characters video I guess.
I OWN NOTHING. This video is for free review purposes & I claim no profit nor ownership of any of the characters, games nor art featured in it. All credit goes to Nintendo, Monolit Soft & others holding Xenoblade Chronicles ect. licenses. Please support the official release ect.

[@Marionic9001]

The true power of this game is how all those weapons cling to character’s backs by sheer force of will IMO.

[@Birdthefeatheredone]

Alvis was never retrofit into being an aegis core, the two aegis cores were given background tasks to manage every blade. The specifics aren’t clear, but it could be that the power sets of Alvis and his siblings diverged from a starting point. The fall from the fortress was later confirmed to have been that Meyneth saved them. As for getting shot, Shulk’s body is still mortal. Not to mention that Zanza knew it was coming and suppressed the vision from Shulk.

[@Marionic9001]

"Alvis was never retrofit into being an aegis core, the two aegis cores were given background tasks to manage every blade. The specifics aren’t clear, but it could be that the power sets of Alvis and his siblings diverged from a starting point." - Yes, Those may well be part of the reason for their differences. My main point was however that Alvis is basically ruler of an Universe & beyond, while the others are, sorta reasonably powerful Blades that do as their Driver’s will dictates, while Alvis... well, explicitly doesn’t. "Shulk's body is still mortal" - He is as mortal as a guy moving at immeasurable speeds and fighting immeasurably powerful gods can be. He's here tanking energy blasts from Yaldabaoth that blow the hell out of his party and clashing with god that recreate & destroys universes in single blow without dying... yep, something f_cked was going on with that bullet.

[@mando76m]

"And we have Melia, who is best girl" a fellow correct opinion haver Great video. I've always been an advocate for Xenoblade scaling in the upper echelon of power in vs debates (at least for video game characters) and it's so refreshing to see someone who actually knows what they're talking about with this series

[@ia7051]

Great video! I will wait for the Xc2 video before I give my 2cents about why Mythra and Malos *appear* to be weaker than Alvis

[@FlipzMCL]

So I'm not the best person to explain this since it's Xenosaga lore (I recommend Luxin for full explanations), but the confusion of the Memory Passage clears up if you read it as existing within the Upper Domain (basically a higher layer of the universe where gods and other conceptual beings reside, that is virtually untouchable by residents of the Lower Domain). Basically, during the finale of the game, Shulk (and arguably Fiora) ascends to the Upper Domain, and he carries his party members with him in a temporary ascension, with help from Alvis. (I realize that probably sounds like word salad, but given that the post-credits of Xenoblade Chronicles 3 Future Redeemed basically confirms that Xenoblade 1, 2, and 3 are part of the larger Xenosaga canon, it's worth digging into for the later entries, particularly Xenoblade 3 since both Moebius and Fogbeasts are heavily implied to be lesser equivalents to Gnosis from Xenosaga, which is a tangent on its own.)

[@dave9515]

Xenosaga is not confirmed cannon and i know neither is X. Nothing from Saga can work with blade well either and X could fit but no confirmation if its coming back or connecting but i think it would be better if neither connected at this point. Also Namco isn't interested in selling or bringing saga back. It also wouldn't make much sales at all.

[@FlipzMCL]

@@dave9515 Future Redeemed directly namedrops Dimitri Yuriev on a radio broadcast from a radio manufactured by Vector Industries, and the post-credits scene is _heavily_ implied to be KOS-MOS falling to Earth at the end of Xenosaga 3. I'd recommend watching Luxin's video about the radio in Future Redeemed if you don't believe me, he goes into detail on why and how it lines up, including the thing about Bandai-Namco and IP rights.

[@2yoyoyo1Unplugged]

@@dave9515then you’ve been intentionally ignoring recent canon. That or you’re just stubborn and/or didn’t play FR.

[@2yoyoyo1Unplugged]

My one issue is that to my knowledge (admittedly not having played Saga) Gnosis were not sentient, at least not to the extent of say a Moebius.) Plus, Fogbeasts were DIRECT corruptions from the impending merge of dimensions, heralding the erasure. Moebius were deliberate refutations of change whose purpose was to never allow the merge to compete.

[@PenguinSage]

​@@FlipzMCLDimitri Yuriev was born thousands of years after Earth was lost in Xenosaga. Klaus's experiment was done in a USA controlled station while Grimoire did his in Canada. Shion and Allan also canonically lived in pre experiment Earth and built KOS-MOS Refrain. The names may be from Xenosaga but they can not be the same characters at all. FR Dimitri and Shion are not the same as XS Dimitri and Shion. Dmitri is hundreds of years old, not 5000+. Shion is only 23.

[@icezantthatoneguy6042]

Cant wait to hear your take on the rest of the series

[@Nelsito99]

31:33 riki was also recognized as a true heropon by the nopon sage instead of being the yearly heropon who works and fight to pay off debts

[@pedro_6120]

I just wanted to say that i realized something that could be used for scaling xenoblade character's speed. Spoilers for xenoblade 3: At the end of xenoblade 3 its stated that nia and melia comunicaded with each other using light. Mind you, this was before the merger of the two universes, meaning that that light had to travel at least at an infinite speed to even reach melia and nia. Meaning that light in the xenoblade universe moves at infinite speed, so any character that is stated to move at the speed of light already has infinite speed (i.e Rex, Jin, the aegises, and potentialy shulk and alvis.)

[@justjames4]

I had the entire hour long video playing while I was writing in a different tab. I didn't focus on everything you said, but the video sounds like it was very detailed and well-thought-out. Great job. 👍

[@HEX33C1FF]

So THAT'S why I like the ending of Blazblue so much!

[@Nelsito99]

23:52 due to the Apocrypha generator being able to shutdown or suppress the monado by releasing opposite waves, similar to noise canceling tech, and that the generator itself can fight back to protect itself similar tech can be used to make a weapon seeing bothe the replica monados and the Apocrypha generator are both technologies of the machina it makes sense and was basics were pre-established

[@PenguinSage]

Monado replicas being formidable also makes since when the Monado itself is highly advanced technology.

[@Nelsito99]

53:29 it could also be argued that it's both a surprise attack seeing as the fogging had stopped and that Dickson was using a special bullet or power as he can turn into a giant much stronger than mechon but didn't use that earlier as he was undercover holding back and alvis was doing the same as he was able to use an art to destroy the telethia that would have killed melia in the tomb but doesn't have that art when he is a temporary party member fighting smaller telethia when teaching shulk purge also it seems like Dickson's weapon transforms with him when he is a giant being a sword, cannon or hammer

[@Wolfiyeethegranddukecerberus17]

Been waiting for this since the Smash video! Not even a Xenoblade fan

[@Marionic9001]

Thanks! Hope it was at least partially worth the wait!

[@Cool-Vest_Leo]

You should become a Xenoblade fan! Right now!

[@catbot5521]

I love the increadible sHulk

[@Marionic9001]

"SMASH Art!"

[@Nelsito99]

33:08 the result of the attack can be seen when in sword valley as the monado wound which is a big crater in the sword itself

[@Nelsito99]

50:38 seeing as when zanza and meyneth clashed monados they acted like real swords in a bind but shulk's was able to effortlessly cut though them both Think of zanza and meyneths monados as bananas but Shulk's is a real kitchen knife something like that as an example

[@2yoyoyo1Unplugged]

I wish you’d have kept going with the rest of the story. The power scaling only got crazier and more interesting with 2 and 3 and their expansions. Alvis is just Ontos. One core of the Trinity Processor out of three. You owe it both the fanbase and YOURSELF to complete the analysis. You just explained a third of the intended narrative and called it complete. Takahashi merits better right? This was GREAT, but you COULD make a true masterwork.

[@Marionic9001]

I hope you stay tuned for part 2 and 3 then. I’m sure that both the scale (and the narrative) will get their due eventually…

[@bobromorca7198]

Xenoblade Chronicles lore? Good luck with that! The whole series has so many religious references it is insane. And that is before the radio happened. As for Alvis, it is said that he is the arbiter between his siblings/other trinity procesots and heavily depends on their power and also the main core responsible for majority of the preocesses when the space station was still standing. So when the experiment happened, he transported into XC1 universe to as he was still following his original programing and making sure that the experiment is sucesfull. Then there was some other things, like how Alvis was influences by Zanza's other half who regreted destroying the universe which explains why he decided to assist Shulk and co as Alvis probably saw that Zanza will mess things up again. The other monados? Likely reflections/replicas of the other trinity procesors with Zanza probably using Pneumas and Mayneth using Malos. This is more of a speculation, but hey, that is Xeno lore for you!

[@PenguinSage]

Your lesser Monado theory is interesting but I disagree slightly because of how personas are tied to the cores. While Logos never showed the power to predict the future, I think if the lesser Monado were reflections of the Trinity Zanaza needs to have Logos because he is the male aspect of Alvis' trinity. Meaning Meyneth's Monado would be a reflection of Alvis' memory of Pnuema.

[@zeinmohammed4370]

So , overall a kratos and sonic victim

[@ArchieSonicOP]

W

[@wanderson4360]

whenever you said "warriors" I thought you were saying Wario, lol.

[@gormottigrebel9978]

54:53 i mean that was explained as a result of Meyneth using her power to save them Also regarding Shulk being shot by Dickson, all of Shulk's regular visions up to this point were from Zanza right? And during the Zanza fight Shulk says: 'It shows me my enemy' could it be possible that because Shulk did not at this point recognise Dickson as an enemy he could not perceive a vision warning him of being shot?

[@karbyboi8489]

I don't think that's it 🤔 remember shulk before that point had thoughts of why he and his abilities were changing so rapidly. He questioned why he didn't have visions anymore. It was because he was getting so strong that he didn't need visions, if he focused shulk would KNOW what happens in the future. He explained that to reyn and the gang So maybe the reason he got shot was because his visions/future sight were replaced with a clairvoyance that he manually needs to activate

[@Marionic9001]

Ah, yes, I suppose there was a line about Shulk asking if it was her doing & thus implying that se did, in the scene where Meyneth awakens when Egil first starts moving Mechonis. It is my mistake for not making a note of it, after all, the fall down itself makes no reference to this and none of the party members guesion how they made it. Well, I suppose that would make it inconsistency like the ones I mentioned (since Shulk implies the fall would’ve been a big deal via this line, despite how it realistically shouldn’t be). …or alternatively, maybe this line is referring to Meyneth saving the gang from Egil just a second before the fall & Shulk just refers to the whole ordeal as a singular even by saying ”back when we fell” since it happened right after. I mean Fiora/Meyneth seemed pretty inactive afterwards anyway & may have lost consciousness too, so did she actually save them...? Dunno about that interpretation though. "could it be possible that because Shulk did not at this point recognise Dickson as an enemy he could not perceive a vision warning him of being shot?" - I don’t know, not likely? The Visions don’t solely happen based on if something dangerous is gonna happen to Shulk or the party, they can show anything of importance really (for example, all the Visions about important people like party members he would meet or those side-quest collectables you sometimes find before receiving quest). Likely the reason Visions didn’t activate because the event was predestined to happen by Zanza (as he details in the very next scene) & thus it was unavoidable, or it was just blocked…

[@wanderson4360]

Ate there any spoilers for Xenoblade 3 here? (it is the only one I haven't played yet)

[@wanderson4360]

I took the risk and can say that this is safe from Xeno 3 spoilers 😀 (heavy Xenoblade 2 spoilers in the middle section though, and Xeno 1 spoilers everywhere too, obviously)

[@PenguinSage]

(Spoilers for everything 1, 2, and 3) Ontos's role as the arbiter of the Trinity core is pretty tricky to define with what we know. While some say it denotes power, I think its dependence on the other two aspects as well as Logos and Pneuma's own showings make me feel the role is closer to tie breaker/leader. If he is stronger its not by an insane amount. All of the trinity core, and even non core people, are shown to be drastically stronger when working with others. Malos in Xb2 was never able to fight freely and without doubts alongside another (like Jin) unlike his siblings. As such in that game he is by far the weakest. Pneuma as Mythra was weaker than that basic Malos, but also was afraid of her powers and could not use them to the fullest. But as soon as she was able to fight alongside another freely she went from being a very strong blade to rewriting reality on a whim as Pnuema. Similarly, Ontos/Alivs does his most impressive feats when working with either the original trinity core(creating XB1 world), his recreated trinity(Bionis/Mechonis/Monado powers), or Shulk and his friends(recreating the world and changing fate). Strong emotions and desires boost their abilities by a lot, to the point where Alpha prioritized Na'el over rejoining with his literal other half of power. N, using the black Origin Blade with Malos' spirit, was able to with his Moebius emotions overpower whole Ontos/ Na'el. Ghondor with just Orobouros could split Ontos' personality and power in half. Then a host-less Alpha using the desires of all of the city people was boosted to such a degree that Logos, Pnuema, and the FC party's emotions were needed to defeat him, further showing how potent they are. Granted in FR it is hard to say if the cores are stronger or weaker after the conduit disappeared, but seeing as Ontos was able to stop Z, who froze the time of two infinite universes for over a thousand years, its hard to say if they got weaker at all.

[@Night_ssbu]

The bions is the about the size of Japan said from developers

[@Marionic9001]

Where has that been said exactly? Quick google search doesn’t give me anything.

[@Night_ssbu]

@Marionic9001 I got it from this videokzbin.info/www/bejne/a3vHaYJ5r9Nsfq8si=AFcotpzNh8aNB-WL . It's from an old ign article In 2010. He shows the article in the intro.

[@Marionic9001]

@@Night_ssbu That is very interesting, I did not know there was statement about the size and it even matches with the common calculations (at least somewhat) …well, assuming Takahashi meant that Bionis/Mechonis are as TALL as Japan from north to south (some 3800km give or take), but this statement could also mean that the two giants hold livable surface area that is equal to the surface area of Japan (377 973 km² according to google), leaving out how tall they are to the guy’s with calculators. From the looks of the statement it kinda seems that he says that the area players can access in-game (where you play) is the size of Japan, you know, compared to character models, but that’s probably not the case, & wouldn’t be the canonical size of Bionis either, since not 100% of it is covered in-game or story. IDK if this statement contradicts anything really, I’ll have to check bit deeper.

[@Xenowolf8]

21:38, the real explanation is that the trinity processor is shoehorned retcon that doesn’t fit the pre-established rules of Xenoblade 1.

[@dave9515]

Xenoblade 1-3 take place in virtual worlds so any powers blade characters show is irrelevant when it comes to powerscaling as they could not do any of their feats outside the virtual worlds. Takahashi has confirmed this in the artworks and interviews recently that xenoblade 1, Xenoblade 2, and Xenoblade 3 all take place in virtual worlds. This video is pointless. Blade characters could get washed by some of the weakest gaming characters since blade characters have no real powers.

[@Neon2hu]

This line of logic only works if we actually have evidence that they're weaker outside. This is like saying Yozora is featless because he only ever fought Sora in Quadratum.

[@cabrinius7596]

what's your source for this? the only thing i can find is that XC3 might be a simulation, not that it is one, just that it sorta works like one, because of stuff that's explained later in the story and would be spoilers

[@alexandredevloo6577]

No, they take place in pocket dimension where space and time work differently and when the dev call Aionios a *virtual world* it’s more a methaphore, it’s not actually like the Matrix

[@Marionic9001]

This statement will be addressed in 3rd video obviously, but for now, I guess I could say that Project X Zone and Smash Bros. appearances, AKA portrayals sanctioned by the series authors, pretty much disregard this fact... if it would have any effect on the scaling at all, it’s not there.

[@gormottigrebel9978]

That statement is just straight up untrue, I believe what he said was that you could think of the mechanical design of AIonios specifically as a virtual world, 'even though it is still 100% real it is supported by artificial systems