Proof Collagen Supplements Don’t Work?

[@HoopersBeta]

Hope you guys enjoy the simple vid! We’re currently romping around Fontainebleau :). Also, just realized we spelled Dave’s last name wrong. Sorry Dave!

[@ryberzome]

Have fun in Font :) Thanks for your vids

[@Terminx666]

Sweet have fun! Can we see some Font footage or just any cool climbing footage you guys got? Even though that's not the focus of this channel... p.s. thanks for the info, my bias is confirmed ;)

[@largeformatlandscape]

Say Ballachulish, Allt a Mhuillin and Buachaille Etive Mor three times to atone for your sins….

[@climbermacleod]

No worries Hopper.

[@HoopersBeta]

😂

[@juaresbarbosa3833]

This is by far the best channel I know for climbers to get health information. Thanks to the people involved in the channel, I appreciate you.

[@HoopersBeta]

Thank you for the kind comment! We appreciate it!

[@bscutajar]

Yeah not only climbers. This applies to any sport and fitness enthusiast.

[@jrashad]

Eric Horst is punching air

[@hyteclowlife]

Screw that snake oil salesman

[@TheMegaMrMe]

​​@@hyteclowlifefair, but his book on training is still good

[@khakicam5400]

​@@hyteclowlifehe's pioneered training ideas for decades, so of course some will look bogus in hindsight (including his collagen sales most likely), but it doesn't mean he hasn't done his best based on available research at the time. It also takes a heap of courage to pave the way, knowing you will make very public mistakes, but someone has to if the game is going to move forward (and provide ammo for heroically shooting someone down in a KZbin comment)

[@JasonN858]

@DT-iw1kt To be fair, snake oil is high in Omega 3 and was used to treat inflammation.

[@joshgruenberg]

I started supplementing with collagen a few years ago based on Eric Horst's suggestion to dose a cup of coffee, wait 45m, then lift and hangboard, daily. I saw significant gains after a few weeks of consistent practice, both in terms of strength and comfort on demanding holds. Sure, the supplement might not have made any real difference (I also load up on other quality proteins), but I loved the idea that some of it might flow straight into my ligaments and tendons, and that imagery was enough to keep me motivated and training for many months. Snake oil or not, it was a factor that helped me get stronger!

[@AllegraClimbingPsychologist]

As a university researcher I really can't get over how much critical judgment you have. Should we show your videos in university? I think we should.

[@khakicam5400]

HD for Hooper!

[@requiemz22]

This is another step in the right direction! Another potential issue with this study is the participants are young. Collagen does seem to decrease as you age. One of the benefits I've heard for collagen is that it helps supplement depleted levels which would be notable among older individuals. Either way, thanks for your analysis!

[@joolsgrommers1466]

Still likely to be maximally mitigated by a combination of good training/diet/sleep.

[@aXque]

Tried collagen peptides for fun. My skin has definitely improved, it's simply more firm.

[@adityakrishna4359]

Eric Horst fell to his knees in the middle of a busy subway after seeing this

[@philipbrocklehurst3745]

Interesting that the study had the subjects consuming collagen post exercise - my understanding of the previous research was that you wanted to ingest collagen with vitamin C 30-60 minutes before exercise for it to be beneficial (and then take whey protein afterwards) and that you wouldn't expect to see any benefit with taking it post exercise. Something to do with having high glycine/proline levels in the fluid around the tendons / ligaments whilst exercising to maximise the effect? Supplementing with collagen post exercise doesn't help due to poor blood flow to the connective tissue.

[@neildutoit5177]

Yea that's what I thought too. They weren't supplementing with vit c either.

[@joolsgrommers1466]

connective tissue (and muscle tissue) synthesis happens over longer timescales. Protein timing has repeatedly shown to have only a tiny effect, vs fasted states. Total daily intakes have a much more reliable effect than timing around exercise.

[@neildutoit5177]

@@joolsgrommers1466 Have you got a citation? I'm familiar with a lot of studies showing protein timing has no effect for muscles. But I thought that connective tissue is different because it has no blood vessels. The way I understood it is that you have to have nutrients in your blood when you excercise because excercise mechanically pushes blood into the connective tissue. Is that just wrong?

[@joolsgrommers1466]

@@neildutoit5177 Don't know if there are any (non in-vitro) studies looking at this, so no on the citation. It still seems a contrived mechanism that connective tissue gets no benefit from post exercise ingestion of nutrients (we've always hunted/worked before eating). Just don't train fasted if you're afraid it might tip the scales a touch. Eat a pre-workout meal containing protein.

[@paulgaras2606]

I will participate in any reasonably well constructed trial that hoopers beta wants to organize. Pubmed gods help those that help themselves.

[@noahnewkirk1352]

I second this

[@JasonN858]

People just need to try things for themselves and see what works or doesn't work. My hair and nails definitely grow faster when I'm taking collagen. Can't tell you if it does anything for my tendons. My diet is animal based, so I'm eating plenty of protein.

[@thomasshpakow7598]

Always appreciate your unbiased and research/data based perspective. Thanks!

[@HoopersBeta]

Our pleasure! Thanks for watching.

[@TheMegaMrMe]

Those reasonable pieces of advice at the end are so easy it's hard to accept

[@ejdl89]

Thanks for doing the work for us Jason.

[@Assassunn]

Well designed, I beg your pardon? It has many flaws: 1) took only one measure after training, the same day 2) based on collagen, not collagen hydrolysats (huge difference in digestibility) 3) it doesn't mention vitamin C supplementation, which is necessary for collagen synthesis Collagen hydrolysats are denatured into AA only partially, bi and tri peptides are directly absorbed too. I wish I didn't see van Loon in the authors.

[@barnabejoyau]

Could be good to do a collab with Dave MacLeod... Great vid'!

[@SunFishStudent]

I added collagen and vitamine C to my diet almost two years ago. (collagen works better with vitamine C according to some studies) This is what I can say. To give you context, I was already taking whey protein and doing weight training before and I was looking for a way to preserve my joins for when I will be older. After few weeks I did clearly notice my nails growing faster and being harder. Although its not the desired effect, I can say that collagen does probably have an extra effect compare to whey. (difficult to mesure it on the joins) Does it make it a must be supplement ? Probably not, but it's probably not more armful than whey. So, if you can afford it, the risk benefice balance is worth the shot.

[@barnosaurusrex]

As you said at the end: I think its pretty obvious that the only "thing" that really helps is resistance training and a good diet. If collagen supplements do actually work then the benefit is so minor it's probably not worth worrying about...

[@petermozuraitis5219]

I’d add a change to Hoopers prioritized list of Supplements; Hydrolyzed Whey is overrated and overpriced for extra “quality” of protein, Whey Isolate is the sweet spot of affordability and quality bioavailable protein. For me, I have a whey blend (concentrate and isolate make the majority of it) that I mix with my coffee for an early and easy dose of protein in the morning, and an Isolate to supplement my other meals. I don’t think Hydrolyzed Whey would be worth it for most people

[@renciapolous]

Such thorough information. Thank you so much, (and the conclusion of the quoted video is a killer).

[@AntonisK27]

So you're telling me I actually have to train hard and manage training load smartly to improve instead of banking on expensive supplements? 😅

[@bradythompson4664]

Love everything about these vids🥳

[@williamlowry8809]

Hey, at 2:16 you say that collagen is only composed of non-essential amino acids, which isn't true. I don't believe in collagen supplementation, but it's worth pointing out. E: I see now that you meant the most abundant ones

[@sdaiwepm]

I wonder about the age axis, i.e. how well these studies done on twenty-somethings apply to those of us who are older. But one main point seems to be that benefits from collagen are a subset of benefits from consuming complete protein, whether as supplement or food.

[@areichental]

If you wanna get more collagen, bone broth is also an option. Probably cheaper than collagen supplements and definitely tastier.

[@parkeraaa]

high levels of lead and other heavy metals. big pass

[@hetistijmen]

I am very much enjoying the idea of PubMed gods in full shrimp posture on the couch watching this channel and thinking "I should really get my load and recovery dailed in" and setting up this study instead.

[@bbr63000]

Hi, I'm also a physio and I've got a strained on my anular A4 pulley. I'm also vegetarian because of a crohn disease and I was thinking about taking some whey supplement to help my recovery after my trainings. Do you have any thoughts on which one I should get ? Thanks a lot for your videos, and for this update about collagen.

[@danielbeall7725]

Might want to go with something hydrolyzed just because it is likely gentler on the gut. I personally use dymatize iso 100, but more out of habit than anything else. As an aside, if you don’t, you may want to consider Creatine. Some interesting pilot studies on intestinal inflammation. I had a friend with crohns start taking it and noticed surprising improvement. (Not at all recommending it as an alternative to normal treatment, but some chance it could help)

[@bbr63000]

Thanks for your answer, I'll definitely give a look on that brand

[@bcyork]

Thanks for the walk through of the study! I've been mixing about 10g of collagen pep powder with 25g of whey protein powder for the last two months after a friend suggested trying after struggling with a knee issue which started improving more quickly a few weeks after. So not making a choice of one or the other. Doing that mix once a day just to supplement a small protein boost. Whey protein though is fantastic though IMO, would never choose anything over that for a protein supplement.

[@HoopersBeta]

Agreed on the Whey front. Glad you found a nice "mix" that you found to be useful!

[@myskina11]

Good information You mentioned whey protein when showing the comparison chart in the video but highlighted milk protein concentrate and collagen peptides. Egg protein and micellar casein protein are better absorbed and utilized overall in my research. Whey protein does have a high bioavailability but is fast digesting and most people may not be able to utilize all the protein in 60-90 minutes, hard to determine how much gets absorbed and how much the body excretes. I do appreciate the information on collagen and agree it may not live up to the hype

[@HoopersBeta]

Hey there! Thanks for chiming in. The benefits of "fast" or "slow" proteins as well as more or less "bioavailable" proteins tend to be vastly overblown on the internet. Also, drawing conclusions from acute studies or basic charts will quickly lead you astray. Muchof the protein timing and absorption advice out there is just influencer/marketing hype. For most people, worrying about these things is a waste of time compared to other things you could be doing to truly make a different toward your health and fitness goals. There are of course some basic guidelines to follow that can allow you optimize your protein intake a bit more, but these are generally quite simple (e.g. make sure you eat enough protein each day to facilitate your goals, don't eat all your protein in one sitting, etc.). I recommend the Stronger by Science podcast for the most thorough, grounded breakdowns of research I've ever come across. For a quick(ish) reference on protein specifically, check out this 4-part writeup: schwarzenegger.com/fitness/post/the-protein-bible-part-1-introduction. Best of luck! -Emile

[@myskina11]

@@HoopersBeta thanks, I appreciate it, I have been in the industry for years and researched protein supplements and studies. I don’t get information from influencers or marketing hype, hence my reply of WPI digestion in 90 minutes isn’t enough time for the body to utilize much protein.

[@HoopersBeta]

That’s awesome that you’ve been involved in protein supplement research! Do you have any salient studies you can share that have caused you to ponder this “90 minutes may not be enough time” idea? I’d love to read more if you have links. -Emile

[@joshewing2118]

At 2:34 you flash a chart showing collagen as having 0.0 of something with eggs having 1. Can you cite that research on protein quantity, please?

[@patrickfinigan2446]

Isn't the argument from the Baar lab that collagen plus vitamin C is needed pre-workout to maximize synthesis? This study seems to be a larger sample size version of a previous study (e.g. oikawa 2020)that already suggested post-workout supplementation doesn't seem to have a benefit for protein or collagen synthesis. I definitely agree with you regarding the limitations of all the research, but this one doesn't seem to any much or anything to the discussion.

[@CrimpingAintEasy]

Shots fired

[@theotherslimshady]

Is this not just a question of dosing? You can hit your RDA of EAAs with both whey or collagen with the additional supplementation of tryptophan. You also show two separate dosages (25g of whey to 11g collagen)when showing the different AA profiles. Im not refuting that it still has a smaller profile of AA just wanted to point it out. I would want to see a study of each group receiving the same amount of EAAs from different sources to see if there is a difference.

[@ДимитърГраховски]

Fifth time I watch this. But now recovering from mild TFCC. My doctor recommended me Collagen supplements, a lot of protein which I usually take with food. Now I'm also thinking of Glycin, just in case.

[@eTreyu27]

Does the study indicate the type of collagen used? If bovine sourced types 1 & 3, probably less effective on connective tissue than if they used chicken sternum collagen type II

[@proboom9]

post excerise Whey 0.072+-0.019 Coll 0.068+-0.017 PLA 0.058+-0.018 P

[@jnniel0]

As you said...not sure any of these studies tell us much of anything. I'd be much more curious to see a study that had different time periods of testing for example during exercise, 2 hours post, and 5 hours post. Then I 'd also be curious to see control, whey, collagen, and whey + collagen. Then finally I'd be curious to see results in healthy connective tissue vs injured connective tissue. For me personally as a person who recently popped a pulley I have been including it with my protein just in case there are some low grade benefits and/or unique benefits to healing injury type. But my whole diet is different during this recovery phase and errs more towards a bulking/excess caloric/protein intake phase to try to ensure that constant sufficient fuel for healing/growth and collagen fits in to that potential box in my eyes/mind. That said I won't make collagen a regular part of my healthy body training program.

[@TheColinShowGaming]

Interesting video. Like you said though, I'd be interested in hearing more about how collagen effects your tendons. I heard several years ago when I started climbing to use 20 grams of collagen 45 minutes to 1 hour before you go climbing to collagen load your tendons, to lower your chances of tendon tears / injuries. I've climbed and collagen loaded for years and I have never had a finger issue, so I'd be curious to see if there's any truth to that. Keep up the great videos! I'm taking steps towards going into PTA, so finding a DPT who's a climber as well, has been a really cool find!

[@HoopersBeta]

Thanks for sharing! Yes, we will always be on the lookout for new / better research. When reading your comment, though, something came to mind (as normally does) that I thought I would share: the fact that you are aware of injuries and taking steps to actively prevent them, may mean that is a more global theme for you. So, you may incorporate other appropriate practices (limiting attempts, listening to your body more if something feels too hard/tweaky, limiting overall volume/intensity appropriate, etc.) that also help lower your injury risk, not just the collagen. Sometimes that one thing we actively think of, is just the "tip of the iceberg" as they say.

[@ihavesolutions3348]

I'd like to see more studies include the blue collar working class 40+ men and women. Not every climber is an engineer, doctor or office employee.

[@IzzyIkigai]

I feel like "not willing" isn't the right phrasing for long-term controlled studies. I honestly would love to be part of a highly controlled long-term study, but I when you have a non-sports job so can pay your bills it's kinda hard to squeeze in time for a long-term study as well.

[@HoopersBeta]

Yeah that's fair! Though... I suppose "not willing" could be interpreted in that sense: not willing to quit your job to participate in a long-term study haha :)

[@Rockmaster867]

Time head to McD's for some chicken nuggies 😊 You know, for them gains 😂

[@hyperfocusfox]

I’m guessing the answer would be the same, quality protein = amino acids so it should be able to be utilized for whatever anabolism is needed by the body…but what about hypermobility issues, where there is essentially a collagen deficiency (my understanding is usually type III)? Whether it’s true EDS or “generic” hypermobility, do you think adequate protein intake still get prioritized properly and reinforce the compromised tissues by synthesizing collagen from the given amino acids?

[@Chiroman527]

Collagen, Collagen, Collagen.... The problem with any supplement is getting past the Hype. Unscientifically, my wife and I started to take 10-12 grms of Neocell Collagen a few years ago. We are in our 70s, retired. My wife has had torn meniscus in each knee. One was surgerically repaired, the other not. Both of my knees have had torn meniscus surgeries 1 in 1996 (from doing Squats) the other in 2013. Both my knees have OA , the right being Bone on Bone. I also suffer with Spinal Spondyliosis throughout my spine head to toe. My wife's knees are less painful and not clicking as in past. I don't actually feel any difference with my conditions. BUT, we both have definite increases in hair Growth and maybe some enhancements in skin looks as well. One thing that is not stressed here (Unless I missed it), Collagen needs to have Vitamin C to work to help produce cartiidge in joints. I will continue to supplement with Collagen to determine if there is any benefit to my Knees especially. Is it Psychological - Placebo affect? More time will tell.

[@snake_plant]

I'm still wondering if there is any benefit to taking either collagen for the extra glycine or specifically Glycine alone for the other speculated benefits (e.g. sleep quality, stress) or would the smaller amount present in ordinary whey protein still be sufficient? Particularly thinking for vegans/veggies who may have a slightly lower glycine intake from food sources?

[@alexgalays910]

Do you think connective tissue also don't care about a protein deficit? That would be odd. I'm assuming everyone in the study had a decent protein contribution, even the ones in the placebo group?

[@oliverroberts5119]

Really appreciate this and Dave's take on it all, but I'm still interested to know if it can aid recovery from injuries. Got an A2 pulley tear and wondering if it would help speed things up/help prevent making it worse in the meantime. I've heard claims about it supporting tendons but what about their pulleys? I just really hoped the answer would be yes 😂 and for it to be simple and already backed by research. Oh well... 😅

[@HoopersBeta]

Our analysis and conclusions in this video apply to injuries as well :)

[@Jarom.M]

One thing that you didn't mention as a limitation of this study is the sample size. 45 people in a study is extremely small.

[@neildutoit5177]

I mean I also regard this as objectively small. But for an excercise study, they're usually

[@joolsgrommers1466]

Quite a normal sample size in this field though.

[@kilianjobin703]

2:55 "Buy the whey"

[@TheBeastlyIguana]

Why hydrolyzed whey specifically at number one? What does it provide over a typical whey isolate?

[@HoopersBeta]

It’s essentially just broken down into smaller aminos meaning absorption/bioavailability should be higher. -Emile

[@Aku.0000]

Since when "well designed reserach" goes in pair with sample consisting of 45 individuals (even if random) ?

[@PLaYerEnte]

What do you think about collagen supplementation if the only Protein source in your diet is plant-based protein? As far as i know they can lack these amino acids that also help make collagen.

[@nitricpumps]

late response but collagen also has a very poor amino acid profile. you probably want something like a vegan protein powder that emphasis amino profile

[@jonathanstudentkit]

for how long did they take it?!

[@Lukas-ve9uu]

So from what I gathered in this video supplementing glycin, for example, would make (more) sense in a plant based diet as there are no plant based sources for it (or at least none with relevant amounts)?

[@Lukas-ve9uu]

Nevermind, 100g peanuts and 100g lentils a day would be sufficient, providing about 3g of glycin.

[@joolsgrommers1466]

One small detail worth adding: Whey does also include Glycene (roughly 1.5%) So if you are an omnivore, chances are you're getting enough Glycine if you also have whey (or eat more than just chicken breast.) And there are plenty of vegan sources of Glycene too. Just don't think there's a good argument to supplement collagen.

[@DonatRC]

I’d be curious to know about how plant protein supplements (like Vega) compare to things whey protein. My gut doesn’t like whey…

[@HoopersBeta]

Mine doesn't love regular whey either but hydrolyzed whey is great! It is a bit more expensive though.

[@danielbeall7725]

Fully Hydrolyzed should be good for almost everyone even with lactose intolerance. But! Plant protein will be fine as well if you like it better.

[@johnnylevek9757]

​@@danielbeall7725 what about people with a red meat allergy?

[@HoopersBeta]

Whey isn’t made out of meat, it’s milk protein

[@joolsgrommers1466]

Long term there don't seem to be any differences for hypertrophy. No research on connective tissue though.

[@koko4620]

I need some feedback on spirulina supplements because they seem to be taking over the holistic market right now

[@HoopersBeta]

I haven't done enough research, personally, to speak on that - Jason

[@ReaperUnreal]

So you're saying I should have a reasonable sleep schedule eh?

[@danielbeall7725]

Impossible I know 😂😂

[@Domm1702]

Any reason high quality protein powder (especially vegan) is on 3. compared to whey being on 1.? So far I have not found evidence that high quality vegan protein powder is less effective compared to whey or at least not significantly.

[@HoopersBeta]

Hydrolyzed whey is #1 in our opinion because it’s essentially pre-digested to facilitate better absorption, which should make it slightly better than non-hydrolyzed protein powders (and eliminates digestive issues some people experience from lactose). Regular whey protein powders (whey isolate and whey concentrate) on the other hand are not necessarily any better or worse than a well-formulated vegan protein powder. Overall, it doesn’t reeeaally matter what you choose as long as you’re getting enough high-quality protein in your daily diet. -Emile

[@Domm1702]

@@HoopersBeta Thanks a lot for your fast answer. I am vegan, so whey is not an option. However, some vegan protein powders are fermented like Vivolife. Maybe that has a similar effect for absorption?

[@snake_plant]

From what I've read different vegan protein powders have differing levels of amino acids and are all slightly lower than dairy sources in the key aminos for muscle building (leucine for example), but some are better than others. From the tables in the study below Soy and Pea appear to fair better, with Oat and Hemp seemingly having worse profiles (so I'd assume you would want ensure the latter were at least mixed with a bit of the better pea or soy protein to get a good balance): www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6245118/ no scientist though so take with a pinch of salt! I do think this channel mentioned something similar in a recent video around Vegan protein bars and how they may not provide sufficient aminos if they use a less favorable protein source (as the total protein in a bar is lower I guess so it's even more important the balance is right)?

[@maguirekelly8417]

6:10 I tell ya what, if anyone is doing another study on this and are in need of willing candidates that will allow for maximum control and duration, sign me up. Tryna kick this medial epicondylosis.

[@ruinedchimera9064]

If I want to bulk as a climber, how would I go about it?

[@dreamland923]

eat a lot (preferably clean), and climb hard.

[@joolsgrommers1466]

Slower than a bodybuilder probably. 1% of current BW/month is a decent ballpark. Eat enough to feel like it's benefitting your training, something you can measure by keeping similar exercises in over time and check how they improve (benchmarking). Don't be surprised if it starts with a dip though, seems to be standard while your body adapts to the change.

[@brianagenbroad5289]

I think I trained too much. Interested in boosting recovery. The vid didn't directly address that. I have to infer, and I usually infer badly.

[@joaco264]

2:56 "by the whey..." see what you did there

[@alpinepat]

Bottom line: eat more chicken nuggets

[@HoopersBeta]

😅

[@climbermacleod]

I'm sure you'll soon be able to buy powdered chicken nuggets.

[@alpinepat]

⁠@@climbermacleodonly if they come with good marketing

[@khakicam5400]

​@@climbermacleodBig Mac's too?

[@climbermacleod]

@@khakicam5400 By the comments on my McDonald's experiment on Insta, I think some folk already thought they were made from powdered something or other.

[@niczzzs]

Hilarious comment from Dave.

[@dczech4138]

Isnt it already know that Collagen type I and III are good for skin and type II is for joints?

[@HoopersBeta]

Define "known". I'd say it's more like, assumed. If you're referring to ingesting those types of collagen that is.

[@joshjones3733]

Disclaimer: this is my personal experience and should not be taken as a factual statement. For me, I feel like I’ve responded quite well to collagen supplements. Most days I get plenty of protein (over 100g) but found that my skin did not recover very fast. My climbing session last were always limited by skin, not strength, and I would never seem to heal fast enough. I choose to take collagen pills as it would work well with the rest of my vitamins. When I take the pills, I feel like the very next day my skin is more calloused and stronger. I usually take about 1/4 of the recommended dose. If I take too much my hands become hard and they crack and split. But, that’s just my personal experience. There are a bunch of factors that are hard to account for in my life. It may very well be coincidental

[@bscutajar]

I'd say it's easily a result of other factors which are a lot more reasonable

[@loganf6259]

wish whey protein didnt make my acne worse :( well at least I think it does from personal anecdotal evidence

[@sanyo_neezy]

If collagen doesn't help with passive structures, does that mean eating brains doesn't make me smarter? :O

[@emurray100]

1 b is my favorite. :)

[@ranchery]

I shall call him .... "mini me"~~~~~

[@noreenwauford9551]

Thanks for the thoughtful analysis! hoping a study will eventually address pre-workout collagen for building tendons/pulleys :) as someone with injury prone pulleys, it’s worth it for me to keep taking collagen as long as there’s a reasonable chance it helps

[@PaulKentSkates]

First: poor form not linking the study Second: I very well may be missing something but this doesn't seem to fit well with the research on collagen supplementation for tendon of the lower limbs. Admittedly I am not an expert and I have no academic experience, but I am confused by the assertion that people are taking collagen for muscle growth. Collagen is obviously not an effective protein for that use, it is not even a complete protein. The amount of whey needed to get the amount of glycine proline and hydroxyproline in the blood equal to the levels of 15 g of supplementation (during the hour before exercise) would be nauseating. (And since there is next to no difference in a 10g collagen and 200mg vit c group and placebo, yet a substantial increase in tendon growth for 15 grams and 200mg vit c over the 10g collagen 200mg group, that leads me the think the research you are speaking to is missing something. I don't know, I haven't found the study you are referring yet. My understanding of the research on Achilles tendon tissue, collagen and vitamin C, didn't control for extra exercises, but the ones I would consider decent did regulate excersizes on the Achilles tendon tissue (timed isometrics if I recall). Achilles tendon is notoriously poor at regeneration so maybe the effects are best seen in more difficult tendons to rehab. Or maybe I'm missing something. Collagen supplementation has been shown in Achilles tendon studies to be not useful without enough vitamin C. (Excess of 200 mg for the average test studies). I need to read the study you have cited and dive into it. I'll do that if I get my hands on it, and I'll return to edit my comment. Some of the sources I use (unfortunately I have not been able to find a couple of them): Collagen and Vitamin C Supplementation Increases Lower Limb Rate of Force Development, International Journal of Sport Nutrition and Exercise Metabolism journals.humankinetics.com/view/journals/ijsnem/aop/article-10.1123-ijsnem.2020-0313/article-10.1123-ijsnem.2020-0313.xml Nutrition for the Prevention and Treatment of Injuries in Track and Field Athletes, International Journal of Sport Nutrition and Exercise Metabolism journals.humankinetics.com/view/journals/ijsnem/29/2/article-p189.xml Vitamin C-enriched gelatin supplementation before intermittent activity augments collagen synthesis, The American Journal of Clinical Nutrition doi.org/10.3945/ajcn.116.138594 Another useful study about female soccer players with some degree of diet monitoring. I found this looking for the research paper that you failed to cite in your video description (a massive peeve of mine and I'm not even an academic) www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9910607/

[@HoopersBeta]

Hey, sorry about the link! We post all citations under the "Research Citations" section in our video descriptions; however something went awry with the link shortener we used and it's now linking to the wrong page. We'll fix that, but in the meantime here is a link to the article: pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/37202878/ As far as the rest of your comment, it seems like you might not have watched the full video? The research article is not about muscle growth the way I think you're describing it (like muscle hypertrophy), it's about muscle *connective protein synthesis*. There is connective tissue inside muscles, and that is what they studied. We also talk about this in the video, so again I'd recommend you watch the video more closely before making any conclusions. But thanks for chiming in! Hope you find the article interesting. -Emile

[@frednolasco]

Its not the studies that are godsent. *ITS YOU*

[@HoopersBeta]

🥰

[@thor1511]

I'm on the carnivore diet, but I do take multivitamins and Dr axe. collagen, they help alot with joint pain in my shoulders, but the best way to prevent joint pain is ofcourse resistance training ans proper stretching

[@harmandash7147]

bullshit need lubrication of jointsss .. i drink bone broth 4 days a week

[@Qadow]

Looks (or more sounds) like you forgot to edit the background noise from the audio.

[@climbing_thomas]

why are there less women in the study? this is such a data bias, and it is sad really! half of the humans are women, and from what i know and see they tend to always be underrepresented in medical studies! which is quite ridiculous if you think about it, considering how different bodies from different genders are! as always, thank you for the video!

[@sncaterd]

Fix the painfully loud white noise ffs, do people not watch their own videos before posting anymore?

[@HoopersBeta]

No idea what you’re talking about, I’ve listened to it on multiple devices

[@HoopersBeta]

Oh wait, I hear it! I had to absolutely blast it on my phone speakers haha. I never listen to it that loud, but I’ll put some more noise suppression on future vids!

[@jakerehm4341]

@@HoopersBeta if you get a sound blanket or two and set them up behind the camera, that could help to dampen white noice and reverb without having to manipulate it in post more.

[@sambailey8378]

Quite noticeable listening through earphones. About half phone volume. Not the end of the world, but I'm sure addressing it would help improve listening quality :)

[@ratterz.]

Copy paste and repeat 😴

[@HoopersBeta]

?