Quackalope has been accused of "blackmail" - A level headed discussion.

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0:00 Intro
1:47 What is the issue? What happened?
5:26 Why I waited to cover this.
6:58 How big of an issue is this?
10:21 Into the Unknown's Offical Statement
13:26 Commentary and explanation
13:54 The actual emails both sides sent
15:13 Commentary and Explanation
17:03 Emails continued
19:05 Commentary and Explanation
19:45 Emails continued
20:05 This is the exact moment of the issue
20:27 Emails continued
24:44 Jesse’s official response
27:18 Order is important, offer to reshoot was first
30:38 Thumbnails
32:32 Responsibility with negativity
39:21 Do your research before being very negative
42:00 The final issue that made this all happen
45:12 Harsh criticism asking for money never mixes well
49:17 Be kind.

[@matteoprosperi]

My only interaction with Quackalope was when I commend on their best solo games video to respectfully point out that it was not appropriate to make Gloomhaven the best solo game when they say in the video that they never even opened the box at the time and only played the digital version. I pointed out that viewers may be deceived into buying an expensive game that they would not enjoy solo since it's very rule heavy, finicky to play without an app and very long to setup (great game, definitely not for everyone). They just deleted my comment from the video. If a channel doesn't treat their audience right, I have doubts they would treat anyone else right either.

[@ortizlzitro]

Oooph thanks for sharing. This confirms even more how untrustworthy that channel is. And THANK YOU! Thank you for bringing up that important point. Sorry that comment got deleted

[@TiagoSousa026]

Keep calm because with the recent comment from Isaac Childres "I mean, it was only a matter of time before this tool followed his complete lack of ethics to some place like actual blackmail." it will quickly go out from their tops. 🙂

[@ironwolf56]

@@TiagoSousa026 WHOA where did Isaac say that? That's hilarious

[@malcolmdouglasmichaluk8263]

​@@TiagoSousa026 I don't like Isaac but respect his game. He is so virtuous

[@drinkwatertopreventkidneys841]

I love gloomhaven to death but I agree, that's just absurd

[@BoardGameCo]

Mad respect for this video Michael. The evolution of the way you approach critical content in the board game space over the years is astounding. You managed to cover everything in a way that is critical, fair, with grace and also your opinion. It's hard to do that well and this was done amazingly well. You have absolutely been a creator I watched dedicatedly for a very long time. But I also admit that there are times I've taken breaks when the content wasn't as much to my tastes...this makes me want to watch everything you do.

[@TheKingofAverage]

Thank you very much! That means an awful lot to me and I'm just regretful that it took me this long to start taking things a bit more seriously. Always have and will appreciate your feedback!

[@whytemeet]

Do I see a King & Co channel in the future?

[@zenster1097]

@@whytemeet A hotel trip? Perhaps some wine and roses? ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)

[@HardlyDOTA]

Came here based on Alex’s call-out in his video and I reiterate his comments. Will definitely check out more after this presentation.

[@ErrantSquire]

I'm not surprised, honestly. I unsubscribed back when he started doing fake clickbait titles and then said that "we viewers" were the problem. There has always been something off about Jesse, which is sad because I like a lot of the other personalities on the channel. It might be good for him to consider taking a step back out of the spotlight for a while.

[@ironwolf56]

Remember that 3 hour long video he did that was basically "people on BGG don't like me and I'm sore about it?" Genuinely what other board game content creator has gone THAT far?

[@FMD-FullMetalDragon]

That's when I unsubscribed from Quackalope too. I found the clickbait videos his true form, if that makes sense. Deceptive. Shameless. Only in it for the fame and money.

[@keithgriffin5949]

HA! I did the same thing!

[@DSK2007]

Same.

[@PRC533]

Jesse always struck me as that guy in high school who's constantly a dick to everyone but in such a happy, passive aggressive way that nobody calls him out for it. I just never felt like he was nice to his co-hosts who were supposed to be his friends.

[@ShmavinShmenhouse]

What an amazingly balanced review of the situation. Thank you for a level headed summary of what’s been happening… I’ve subbed! 👍🏻

[@djangofett4879]

You hear that, Mr Anderson? That is the sound of inevitability...

[@zenster1097]

Great reference.

[@heathsmith4864]

Thank you for the time, thought, compassion, and energy you put toward explaining this situation. I commend you on your journey toward being better. May we all follow you on this path. I greatly appreciated your thoughts.

[@darkside2329]

Best advice I ever received - You are your 'brand'. Protect your 'brand' at all costs.

[@eriksjogren800]

Also, another shout out for the “people need to be nice”. Not only in the board game industry, but in life in general. ❤

[@NeoReziel]

I dont usually watch such long videos, but your was really well made, really good choice of words and a clear insight of the situation; very well done Koa.

[@thewarpandrealms9889]

Hey King, this video shows so much personal growth as a content creator - I was out of town and missed the fallout. This is the perfect coverage. Researched, genuine, and with personal anecdotes.

[@TheKingofAverage]

thank you very much!

[@Karadum]

Thank you for the coverage, made it a lot more clear. And funny how fast you read the emails, I had to check if I did not leave on the faster replay :D

[@RainwaterGames]

Great analysis. Thank you for explaining this whole situation.

[@andrewbilling6301]

Thanks for taking the time to go through this mess. I saw a real growth in the way you dealt with this issue. I couldn't help but think that a little more kindness between both parties and perhaps a phone call could have clarified and cleared up many issues. Emails aren't always the best way to communicate and miss understandings can occur. I think there is fault with both parties in the way they dealt with the problem. Hopefully they have both learnt from this experience.

[@Gauweezy]

Sounds like Jesse didn't read the rulebook himself

[@Sthunderrocker]

Well if you take him at his word in the video he talked somebody into coming down and spending a week at his house and that person read the rule book three times and still couldn't figure it out. I'd say you're right.

[@ironwolf56]

His content has long been infamous for constant rules mess-ups; like way above even Rahdo level.

[@markwatson8714]

In the video he states they each (there were 3 of them) took on a section to try and break up the overhead.

[@michaelmueller260]

@@markwatson8714 Which is a terrible way to learn anything. Of course you won't know where to find something in the rules when you've only read a small part of them.

[@angelicdespot2735]

Excellent video, thank you for making it. I wasn't aware of any of this. Really appreciate you objectivity, self-reflection and nuance.

[@sharkey1337]

This was such a fantastic video, you absolutely took your time in gathering the facts and giving an incredibly balanced and insightful discussion on it all. THANK YOU, its content like this that makes me a proud subscriber!

[@raduprofeanu6891]

Happy to see a level headed discussion on this. Good sir this is the type of content that keeps pulling me back to your channel.Great work.

[@PloKoon666]

It's been a pleasure watching you and your content mature over the last weeks and months. Thank you for trying not to abuse your reach and for your continuous effort to provide a fair evaluation of board games and welll-researched coverage of the goings-on of the industry.

[@michael3123]

Thank you for this video Michael. It was well reasoned and objective. I think your point of being mature is very relivant to this issue.

[@LegoAssassin098]

This is first video of yours i have seen and i am very impressed at your astute analysis and nuanced opinions. I look forward to more videos of yours in the future. Subscribed!

[@Paprika799]

KOA is great haha

[@TheKingofAverage]

Thank you very much! I am indeed trying to be more consistent with that :)

[@masmorden]

This was a really, really good video. Thanks for discussing all the information in a reasonable, non-biased way. A good example of why you've quickly become one of my favorite channels.

[@rcantero1]

i appreciate your objectivity on the matter and in general. well researched, well said! peace and kindness to us all.

[@Tamali01]

I had some very busy months of work and obviously missed the drama. I really appreciate the time you have taken to lay out the facts and explain the fall out in a level headed fashion. I have liked watching Jesse’s video’s and really don’t believe his intent was malicious, however, I certainly hope that he will grow from the experience. Most of us can count ourselves very lucky that we have not had to learn lessons in such a public way. I for one am very grateful, when I think back of stupid mistakes I have made in how I have communicated something. As humans this can be very easy to do. I think this is especially true in written communication from which it can sometimes be very difficult to determine the tone. In any case, I think the way one bounces back from harsh lesson reflects their true character. I for one am willing to give him the opportunity to demonstrate that growth. Thanks again for the video. I have subscribed as a result. Appreciate it.😊

[@DevilboyScooby]

The 'confirmation bias' policy just indicates to me that Quackalope cares more about getting views and ad revenue than about showcasing the games he's playing.

[@Septulum]

The channel is a business. Of course the revenue is a primary concern, whether the audience likes that or not.

[@DevilboyScooby]

@@Septulum Personally I prefer passion project KZbinrs who don't use excessively clickbaity titles or thumbnails, but I understand not everyone is like that.

[@MrPorko2c]

I agree. It's like when he addressed his community telling him to stop with the clickbait titles and his response was "no because it works". The guy is a shill and is ONLY in it for the money and clout.

[@Daremachina]

⁠​⁠@@MrPorko2c I was one of the people that Jesse responded to after the 2-3 clickbait title and said he was emotionally manipulating his community. His response was exactly that and I unsubscribed immediately. If you are fine emotionally manipulating your audience for views you don’t deserve a platform.

[@Septulum]

@@DevilboyScooby I would tend to agree. However, I think it's increasingly rare for youtubers to have an independent income that still leaves them enough time and energy to create high production value content. How KoA keeps making videos at 2am is beyond me...

[@jamesmurray2690]

This is going to be a long response, I hope you will read it? KoA, whilst I agree with pretty much everything you said in this video, I would like to say I feel Quack’s response to this matter is disingenuous, as you have pointed out yourself with the timeline of emails not ringing true to how they are represented within this response. The problems I have with the response, and why I feel he is being untruthful within it, as to the time between his first email and ITU’s reply, and regarding the reasons he went ahead and made the videos, and regarding when he actually decided to release said videos. First off, he keeps saying ITU didn’t reply for a month, when in fact it was actually only 15 days, or 11 working days, Monday to Friday. This to me seems an incredibly short time to decide that the company is not interested so I will proceed without them. As I am sure we have all experienced, companies can take a long time to respond to questions, especially game companies. As an example, I waited 3 months to get a response about a problem I had with a KS I backed, and then another month for it to be sorted…no names. The second problem I have is his “reasons” for going ahead with making the 8 videos. He states in his response… “Over that month, we invited an independent fan to come learn, teach and play the game. We wanted to play ATO, the community was asking for coverage, and so we figured out how to make that happen.” So, according to Jesse himself, inJanuary his community was asking him to create ATO content, I don’t know details of the requests, but, I assume they were requesting playthroughs & impressions etc. This led him to seek out a Patron and fan to help him fulfil these requests. But..if that was the case, why did he not release the videos fulfilling these requests until May? Surely, if these were videos for his community, he would release them as soon as they were ready to go. Now, some may say he had to edit them etc., but trust me it doesn’t take 3-4 months to edit videos. Whole cinema movies have been edited in a matter of weeks, or even in some cases days. And this leads me to my final problem with Quack’s response - the timing of the videos, especially the two that we are all talking about. Jesse made the conscious decision to wait until ITU started their new campaign, when interest would be at a peak, and when it would do his channel the most benefit, and quite possibly, if he felt “snubbed” by ITU, the most damage to their campaign! He did not care about his community and their requests, other than their subs, Patreon money and clicks, otherwise he would have got the videos out earlier to fulfil the request for content he states he was getting, and the reason behind proceeding without ITU, and the fact that he was prepared to scrap it all in order to do paid for content, shows how much he really cares about his community and their requests! Sorry about the long post, but I hadn’t seen anyone else mention this part of Quackalope’s response and defence to this ongoing drama.

[@oerthling]

Every professional YT cares about views and engagement and whatever else determines next months income - because that's what pays the rent. Doesn't mean that they can't care about their community or hope that it all aligns, but they have to care about the views. That's the job. Otherwise you need to be a low cost hobbyist channel, where it's fine if a video only gets a couple hundred views and 3 nice comments and that makes you happy for a month.

[@ThisIsDavin]

Not once in the email trail did Q ask any questions about the rules he needed clarification on. If you are invested in being accurate, you would get your clarifications and reshoot. This is my big issue here: lack of attention to detail and no f**ks given. Also the reason why I watch your channel - you are committed to that detail! Never let go of that 🤘

[@technoartfest8708]

Because clarifications on rules cannot be done when there are no rules at all. For example if i remember one , is that in campaign mode , there is no real specific rules of what to do after reading a story , tells you Go to 001.. but you have no idea and they found broken game mechanics too , that makes the game unplayable and so you need to create your on rules ,so the game don't break.. People say this is worthless content because they did not knew how to play it , but instead is very valuable one ,because teach people the real experience they will get if they try to play the game on their own with the game manuals.

[@elbentzo]

You do realize the email was between Jesse and the CEO of ITU, right? Do you often call the CEO of a company to get customer support? Jesse said he had problems with the rules and asked for help. First he asked if they would be interested in sending a rep to stay with him for a week and make videos, and when they said no, he asked if they could spare a rep for a few hours to watch Jesse play via webcam and make sure they're getting all the rules correctly and help where needed. ITU agreed to this, and the whole thing fell through for unrelated reasons. Seriously, just read the emails. It takes 3 minutes.

[@michaelmueller260]

@@elbentzo All of that was contingent on being paid. You're leaving out that very small detail 😂

[@michaelmueller260]

@@technoartfest8708 Jesse never read the rulebook, neither did West. The only rules source was some patreon dude that clearly missed even some extremely simple rules. They found no broken game mechanics, that is factually wrong. Why are nearly all others rating the game extremely highly if it's so broken and unplayable. It was user error on quack and the gang's company, brought on by a complete lack of effort to learn the rules. Plain and simple.

[@elbentzo]

@@michaelmueller260 I didn't leave anything out. The whole communication was between two businessmen representing commercial companies negotiating working together. Of course everything said is contingent on money changing hands.

[@noahduncan4095]

What a great analysis! This is my introduction to the channel and the impartial take was very very refreshing

[@madrigalhjalmar]

Great video King. As always , your time effort and nuance are much appreciated.

[@TheMarvin676]

Hey, good vid. Thanks for being thorough and fair on this, well done. I un-subbed you a long time ago for various reasons, some you mentioned. I am encouraged by this effort and have re-subbed. Keep up the good work!!

[@Babyboyo1]

This whole thing is blown so out of proportion. SMH. Nothing wrong with those emails. That was NOT blackmail. Nobody works for free. If a software development company had to rewrite custom software on behalf of a customer they would charge for that labor. People make something out of nothing for the sake of drama. Great job covering this situation KoA.

[@Truemole]

So, for what it's worth I think seeing 'how the sausage gets made' isn't that pleasant for all involved. However, if there's something positive to take from this controversy it is that it's bringing to light some of these business practices which can create conflicts of interest in this industry and which aren't always obvious. These are important for customers, who should be aware when following 'content creators', especially if those same creators are influencing your purchasing decisions. I have no problem with Jessie having a negative review of the game, although I will say it is currently my favourite board game. Having watched both his videos on this I would say some of his criticisms are entirely fair (huge game that's very complex and difficult to get into) and some bare no relation to my experience of the game (unreadable rules, game being unplayable). The fact that KDM is reportedly his favourite game also makes some of the negatives in his review of AT:O seem odd, to say the least, as generally the criticisms of AT:O can be levelled much more strongly at KDM (which in a similar series by Quackalope got a much more favourable 'negative' video). To me, asking for a substantial fee to cover a game as big as AT:O is not an unreasonable thing to do, although if I was a viewer, I would want those videos very clearly marked and sponsorship flagged and reported front and centre if it was a sponsored video, not just a box in the top corner which you may or may not notice, especially if the tone was set as if it was a genuine review etc. I find it much more difficult to accept that Jesse then went ahead with filming for the game and went back to ITU to make it clear he didn't enjoy the game but could scrap the content created if a sponsorship was entered into. For me that's sacrificing a lot of integrity and audience trust in efforts to gain sponsorship money. The most positive spin on this approach is that he didn't have time to actually understand the game and so couldn't proceed without sponsorship but that would still then mean you're willingly giving your audience an inferior/inaccurate video because you hadn't accolated sufficient resources to do it well. Neither option inspire me to return to Quackalope for future content. The fact that he sat on these videos until the release of SOH Kickstarter, I'm sure in efforts to maximise viewership (which he's achieved), while knowing it's likely to harm ITU's campaign shows that he was willing to damage business relationships to maximise a short-term gain. I can understand why ITU don't want to work with him again in the future. If he’d posted these videos around the time they were recorded I would have no issue with them, even if I disagreed with the conclusions. On the other side I'm not that happy with how Marcin & ITU have conducted themselves here either. Reading through the e-mails released on BGG they engaged with Jesse's proposal much more than I would have liked. While you could chalk this up to professional politeness, I don't think they made their position clear to Jesse and that could have helped avoid the issue escalating. We also have to say that ITU's comment on the kickstarter, while completely accurate to the e-mail exchange, was done knowing it was likely to cause some level of negativity to Quackalope. While they were not the initiator here, they could have kept the high ground simply by not responding to the Quackalope video at all or just responding with "you can't please everyone". This issue has definitely taken a bit of the shine off a really stellar kickstarter campaign, well beyond any impact the Quackalope video would have had on it's own. From my perspective, while both sides have lost with this exchange, I suspect the impact will be far greater for Quackalope than ITU. Marcin provided the e-mail evidence to back up his recollection of events, ITU has delivered one of the best board games ever created and have continuously delivered a high-level of support and communication for their games, which genuinely do seem to be the thing they care most about. This certainly hasn't stopped me from continuing to play AT:O and backing the SOH kickstarter extensively. Regarding Quackalope, I don't anticipate watching any future content unless there is a clear shift towards greater transparency on their approach to board game coverage. Trust is won slowly and lost quickly.

[@zenster1097]

Great comment. Have an upvote. I agree. I don't agree with KoA venturing too much into both sideism. I do agree that Quack is more in the wrong than ITU is. But Quack's actions is not as egregious as people are making it out to be.

[@bryanyoung9966]

Excellent comments on this. I definitely feel this could have been handled better all around. Just leaves a bad taste everywhere. Hopefully both parties will actually learn from this and grow from it.

[@manuelkooijman5757]

From the statement of the company itself it maybe only expresses that there is a misunderstanding on language. What Jesse wanted to say (and he didn’t so that is on his account) is that if the game was maybe clearly explained to him then surely the negative points would disappear which would result in probably scrapping the negative video as the comments would no longer be applicable. The company adding prices is not so nice. They are now forcing him to go even lower on his prices as the competition knows what he asks. In Europe you have competition law in place which actually forbids you do disclose this info. It just shows how small the boardgame industry is and how amateurish it still is. Both parties have made mistakes but they were not malicious just borne out of ignorance. And for people saying that other content creators could learn the game, sure but that is a weak statement. The DT for instance go nowhere near a war game other than Undaunted because games like most hex & counter war games are too complex in their opinion with all the different numbers on the counters. I on the other hand find some normal board game rulebooks more laborious to read than some hex & counter war game rulebooks. Therefore complexity is in the eye of the beholder. I agree with KOA that Quackelope should have put both reviews in one video like other content creators do and then everybody would have glossed over it. However, there are now so many content creators that this becomes a cut throat industry unless you are as big as Rahdo, DT or Watch it Played. So if you want viewers and get money from KZbin or build up an audience so game companies want to work with you then channels will do things like click bait and other stuff. As for Isaac Childress, not professional at all. He is riding the woke train a bit and thinks he is all that with having the two largest boardgame Kickstarter campaigns in living history. However in the grand scheme he is nobody as a fantasy writer has shown. Board gaming is still niche.

[@Truemole]

@@manuelkooijman5757 I agree that it’s most likely that neither side had any illicit intent here, although both took actions driven by (entirely understandable) self-interest. However, as I said above, I do still think there’s a fundamental issue that Jessie was willing to reshoot content if sponsorship was provided. That does call into question the integrity of the opinions he gives or show a willingness to provide a sub-par quality video to his audience if that alternative financial incentive isn’t provided. Purely from a viewer perspective those massively devalue any information and/or entertainment I’d receive from engagement with his content. I think you raise a good point that everyone learns at different rates and it could be as simple as Jesse needing more time to wrap his head around the rules but the context here is important. The Quackalope channel was under no obligation to cover the game and KDM is reportedly Jesse’s favourite game. He should have had a leg up on learning ATO (at least the battle-phase) from his extensive experience with KDM and if they had bounced off the rulebook there was no obligation to invest 40 hours more to provide a review for the sake of it, particularly if they had no confidence, they were playing the game correctly. Given the lack of clearly defined product or service for the price Jesse quoted ITU I doubt there’s any real case to answer for legally from ITU’s standpoint, just as the claims of blackmail relating to Jesse conduct around this are hyperbolic. I’m not a lawyer but common sense would suggest neither case would have any real traction in a court of law. That doesn’t mean it was right for ITU to give out this information and as I said before they could have taken the high ground by brushing off the review, with little negative impact to themselves. Regardless of any ideological capture I agree that Isaac seems to have been very irresponsible with his public statements here, it’s disappointing to see one of the most prominent figures in the industry throwing around terms like blackmail, seemingly without care. It does speak to a wider issue where we’re quite happy to apply very serious labels to those we dislike or disagree with online, despite most of these statements counting as published pieces, with many of the same implications as if this had been printed in a newspaper. Hopefully the wyrm is turning, albeit slowly, on that front and everyone will start exercising a bit more care on what they push out to the internet. I know personally that’s something I’m trying to be more thoughtful of as I get older even though I try to keep engagement with social media to a minimum.

[@sebs726]

I agree with everything you said apart from not taking the moral high ground. While I think their statement was very measured about being a big proven company and game, a game being called unplayable is enough to put off huge swathes of backers and without tackling it head-on could haemorrhage funding. I’ve seen successful campaigns utterly fall apart and been defunded and never come back before. I’ve not seen the post they made as it’s not a game for me, but I can understand why they fought back… not to defend themselves but to make people go and do more research on both sides and then make an informed decision. This review of the situation itself gives that very balanced view and if I was a borderline backer, this is the kind of information/video I would be looking to watch before commuting or cancelling on my pledge.

[@reasonlost]

Keep staying objective and independent King. I love hearing you discuss these issues and really respect your channel.

[@MagicManAleister]

Awesome vid. Major personal growth here. Your recent stuff has been great!

[@utahman06]

Very mild criticisms is actually a dead giveaway for reviewers in publisher’s pockets. Look at Tantrum House for one of the most obvious examples of this. Mayonnaise caked onto milquetoast.

[@matiasamengual856]

Your “Responsibility with Negativity” part NEEDS to be viewed by everyone, independent of what they do. It’s a masterpiece in the importance of language, emotions, and the human brain and relations

[@matiasamengual856]

47:22 this is a perfect “conflict of interest” situation. Never good

[@bassmeo3937]

Not that anyone asked for it, but my 2 cents. The reach-out e-mail claiming it's hard to dive into a full-campaign game, yet ultimately does it anyway because subs asked for it and it gathers views. Specially when you claim you have the specific audience for a game like this (see "my audience is your marketplace" comment). There was also absolutely no reason to mention he basically had "negative" content lined up to publish unless they do a sponsorship. This was not needed info to get a sponsorship yet it was used to "persuade" them to do the sponsorship. In the Oathsworn example he claims that the game was on many of their top 10s simply due to them being able to spend time with it. Clearly pushing the idea that you will also be paying to get into their top 10 video's, else you wouldn't mention this either. Then they play the game regardless and have a patreon member over (to teach them the game?) and yet struggle with the rules. For a boardgame channel struggling with the rules over 50 hours is just straight up weird. At least take your job seriously. Wanting to "be as accurate as possible" only when you are getting paid is just bad form towards your followers and just shows the underlying mentality Quack has. This coupled with "my audience is your marketplace" should leave a bad taste in everyone's mouth that's subbed to him. And apparently he also complained in practically each video about not being paid lol

[@Schlagathor78]

Well said!

[@ortizlzitro]

Facts

[@oerthling]

As long as we don't pay for videos etc on the internet and the business is ad financed, we're always the product. In every case (professional channels who made this their day job). That's just how business on the internet works - except for a few subscription services.

[@arthurdent9281]

The reason for mentioning the negative content was in conveying his issues in learning the game despite having put that much time into it. There are a lot of problems with the rules, and that's on ITU. Everyone seems so quick to dismiss that. Even positive reviews can contain criticism. We see that all the time. People saying that he would hide it are simply blaming him for something that never happened. He could have offered some constructive ways to improve the rules or their presentation as well as giving a positive review of the game itself.

[@kusheil]

@@arthurdent9281 jesse said he didn't read the rules though. Yeah the rules are complicated, but definitely not game breaking by any means. He just didn't even try to learn them.

[@avp2survivor]

what a GREAT video !! i will tell you this : after watching you for a long time i LIKE you and respect you and i know you a great person to be with and play with. I NEVER had this attitude toward Quackalope, i always was instinctively averted away from him, i found his behavior cringy, predatory. I would avoid a person like this in RL like hell. This whole ordeal only highlights what i always felt. (PS- i never subscribed to Quack either!). Long live KoA ! PS - i respect you even more since the time you moved away from that little bit of drama and clickbait (i still remember my heart being in my throat after your thumbnail "KDM is dead;D")

[@TheKingofAverage]

Thank you very much :) Funny enough, I literally don't even recall a thumbnail like that. I believe you, but goes to show that I definitely put less effort in my thumbnails for a long time than I should have (and still probably don't actually). But I am trying to improve :) Hopefully that's been noticed :)

[@abandonlife111]

KDM is dead. ATO just took it's crown!

[@TheKingofAverage]

@@abandonlife111 ooooh yeah I recall that :D

[@catello4444]

After reading all mail exchange I side with ITU

[@arthurdent9281]

I don't. I think they made unwarranted assumptions and were very much at fault as well. Posting those messages in their comment section was also extremely unprofessional, and borderline slander.

[@abandonlife111]

@@arthurdent9281 ok two-face.

[@kaijuh]

anyone with common sense and remedial reading skills would also agree lol I seriously do not understand why KOA would say "Whos at fault?" when the proof is out there

[@arthurdent9281]

@@kaijuh ITU looks much worse based on the emails. If Quackalope was having that much difficulty with a game that should be right up their alley, then it makes sense to ask for help. They were proposing a completely normal sponsored content deal, which would replace the content that they had already created, because it would be a better representation of the game for their viewers, and ITU's own policies would prohibit them from releasing the negative review content in that case.

[@jahockaday]

This was a great video about this situation. Thanks!

[@harrox]

This was the best coverage on this issue that I have seen. Thank you for providing such great coverage!1

[@samhugo5870]

Being not a native speaker myself, what is the difference between both? Or is this a joke, I didn’t get?

[@remconet]

Thank you for discussing this and also giving insight in how the business/KZbin/content creaters work. I've never held ANY value to sponsored content.

[@TheKingofAverage]

You are very welcome!

[@arttavoularis3855]

Totally agree with everything you said. Thanks for putting this together. I have noticed over the last year or so that your reviews have been better thought out (i.e. less hardball and more softball as you put it). You started off as a KZbin Padawan and now you are a KZbin Jedi. Soon to be a Master! Great job KoA!

[@v3nom905]

Thanks for being kind and thoughtful. Definitely agree with you, words matter especially when it affects others livelihoods.

[@kcn6753]

KOA mentioned it but i think its understated: quack made a 15 min video that can be summarized by Jesse saying he cant think of ANY gamer he could recommend this game to. so he felt strongly that the play was too frustrating to actually get to the table, that the game is unplayable in its current state. however, if ITU had responded to his original email, paid him, and sent a developer to play, all of that would have been swept under the rug. so you, as his audience, would have had no idea about his true feelings. now extrapolate that to his other content.

[@kpr7228]

exactly this. this is the main issue here from gamer/buyer/viewer point of view. was it blackmail/extortion - not for us to decide if it will ever has to be decided. we basically learnt that he can have some negative opinions and not share with his audience when paid (because it is nothing strange that if publisher is paying for such service, they expect positive result coming from it). if this deal would take a place, the real victims here would be his audience.

[@ezunino1711]

i don't like jesse a lot, but if i understood correctly, is not that he didnt like the game, is more than he didnt understood it, so he had a bad time playing it, and it was frustating, so he wanted someone from the developers to go and teach them how to play, so they can review the game how it was supposed to be played, at the end of the day, he just don't understand a lot of games, watching some of his KDM playthroughs that is supposed to be his favorite game of all time, he makes so many mistakes, that it seems like he is playing for the first time

[@DonPers]

@@ezunino1711 - Q could have started with reading the frikking rulebook by himself. How about that? Qs difficulties understanding the rules are based on the teaching from fireman they hosted for helping them with the game…

[@elbentzo]

You're forgetting 2 very important things: 1. If they had paid him, it would mean this was sponsored content, and he would have made it clear in the video. Whenever you see a video which includes sponsored content (Quacklaope or not, boardgames or otherwise), you know that it doesn't necessarily reflect the creator's views 100%. This is true in any field where advertising exists. If Jesse had chosen to hide the fact it's sponsored, that would've been the scummiest thing on earth, but that didn't happend and you can't just pretend it did. 2. The video you're talking about is an exaggerated negative response, and it's paired with a twin video which is an exaggerated positive response. I personally hate it, but the whole point of the "conformation bias" series is that one video ingores all the positives and just dwells on the negatives and how they can ruin the game, and one video ignores the negatives and just glorifies the positive parts and how brilliant they are. And this is made clear in the video itself. Like I said, I think it's a dumb way to review things, but it's certainly not malicious and if you only watch 1 video (when it's explicitly explained it has a twin with the opposite view), then you have no one to blame but yourself for misunderstanding.

[@elbentzo]

@@kpr7228 Wait, do you think every person you see in a coke commercial doesn't prefer pepsi? Do you think when MMA fighters open a can of monster energy drink when they win it's because they love it? That people in an iPhone commercial don't sometimes prefer Android? With paid/sponsored content, there's always the possibility the creator has some negative views they're hiding. It's only a problem if they *hide* the fact they're being paid. Which Jesse didn't. He talked about it openly (about contacting them and asking to cooperate for a fee).

[@ironwolf56]

I fall 80% that Quackalope is a mercenary channel that was more about prominence and money than love of the hobby (which I kind of always suspected) and 20% ITU probably does need to learn a little bit better to take some criticism.

[@joseseptien]

Yes he is. Will do anything to create issues with gamers, companies, and more if he do not get a $ from it.

[@TiagoSousa026]

@@joseseptien Why do you say "20% ITU probably does need to learn a little bit better to take some criticism"? On the opposite, I think they were very open to getting feedback to improve.

[@ironwolf56]

@@TiagoSousa026 I think they could have handled things a touch more professionally on some of the valid points people have raised about the opaque rules. Now I do mean just a little, like I said it's 20% maybe even less. The vast majority of this is on Quackboy

[@TiagoSousa026]

@@ironwolf56 I hope they take the feedback and fix it for the second print and for the new standalone. Hearing the feeding it seems to me that it's very fixable, isn't a problem on the game core that changing it would be a different game.

[@technoartfest8708]

Im the other way.. 80% that ITU is full of corrupt developers . Quakaclope is doing reviews for far longer than ITU games and they have a perfect track record doing FAIR reviews , even when the game in question is SPonsored.. As it was the case of Darkest Dungeon.. 100% fair review , and they even critisize it for its too much fiddling. And told in the end , is not their type of game.. Still was a 100% fair review. In my opinion Quackalope need to start a lawsuit against ITU for their very strong accusations of extortion. This is a criminal accusation ,and they need to be forced in a court this claims. and forced to pay millions in repations damages when they can't prove their claims.

[@sanpurdue2115]

I really enjoyed how you handled this situation with your video.

[@TheKingofAverage]

Thank you very much San!

[@eriksjogren800]

Thanks for a non-polarizing and fact focused content. This is a possible example of the principle of rather talk than email, since emails can be read in a completely different tone than intended.

[@LegoAssassin098]

Once it became obvious that conversations had broken down, a quick zoom call would have cleared everything up.

[@duke5799]

Yep. Just don’t say anything out loud, sweep everything under the rug, let the money talk, don’t show any proofs, everybody be happy… all rainbows & colors. Good job!! Happy video!!

[@eriksjogren800]

He has a valid point in ITU shouldn’t have put out those comments, especially in the light of the ongoing campaign. It’s like being a manager, talking about colleagues with other employees, even when it’s valid to criticize them, even if you’re in the right, it’s always a loose-loose to start addressing that in public. Instead of starting a shit storm, better PR would be to just answer neutrally and bring focus back on the game itself instead.

[@technoartfest8708]

The elephant in the room however is how ITU developers tried to Sabotage Quackalope , and ruin their review site with false claims of blackmail or extortion. The other elephant in the room is how ITU was caught in their own email , demanding only Positive Reviews and that comparisons with other games is a NO NO. In other words ITU offering cooperation to Quackalope only if ITU get favorable reviews.. LOL but the fanboys defending ITU will not see ,what is obvious ,that ITU was happy and not offended to continue collaboration with Quack and that it was only until they published their real Experience , of being UNplayable game experience , that they attacked them. IF they refuse to provide help with the game ,to how is played ,then it shows they are mediocre developers. SO a big F U to all this defending ITU corruption and tactics.. They were happy to work with quack , they say it on the emails until they published their real video experience. And they were caught demanding only Positive reviews about their game.. LMAO... Quackalope can sue ITU Developers with a multimillionaire demand in UNited States, for ITU strong accusations of blackmail and extortion against Quackalope. That way they will teach corrupt developers to stop intimidating small review websites , for telling the truth of their real experiences. Quack never said they did not liked the game , they only told , it was frustrating the game rules and impossible to play the campaign as is , without waving the rules . and even told ,that they really wanted to like the game and asked help to ITU and all they got was a backstab in their back .

[@michaelmueller260]

@@technoartfest8708 Wow, that's one....opinion I guess we'll call it? Way to look at things from both sides. Quack was the one that sat on the negative video for months, and waited until ITU's reprint and new content campaign was launched. Do you thing that was by accident? ITU wasn't intimidating anyone. Quack came asking for money, ITU was willing to listen, but in the end didn't want to pay. Nobody got stabbed in the back, that's hilarious. Quack didn't get his money, got frustrated, and made one of the most pathetically over the top and intellectually insulting "reviews" ever made. Sorry you don't always get what you want.

[@abandonlife111]

@@technoartfest8708 There's a reason why Alex from Boardgameco wants to distance himself from Jesse as far as possible.

[@elisabethcruz2424]

@@technoartfest8708i’m sorry but i have played ATO and it’s perfectly playable… thousands of people have been playing ATO without problems. But to play correctly a boargame not just ATO, you have to read the rulebook, and Quack seems that needs to be paid in order to read…

[@TableTopWolf1984]

Great breakdown mate an i had the same thoughts, seems very handbags at dawn by the both of them, just hope the blowback from this doesnt effect smaller channels more when they genuinely like something

[@kaijuh]

BoardgameCo had a short segment about why he separated himself and his brand from Quackalope more than a year ago. He didn't go into detail but Alex mentioned that he did NOT LIKE the way Quackalope did business. Alex was probably aware of all the shady dealings and probably realized they will eventually all come out and didnt want to be associated with him when they did.

[@zenster1097]

We don't know for sure. It's implied. But I also read there was some personal fallout (don't know anything details beyond that). Where the personal and business ends and begins is often murky and grey.

[@kaijuh]

@@zenster1097 BoardgameCo did SPECIFICALLY say himself on video that he did NOT like how Quackalope does business and stepped away from him. Alex saw the shady side of Quackalope long before us and now we are all catching up

[@guimauve-rose]

@@kaijuh he didn't say this, stop putting words in people mouth, he said they didn't have the same view on creating content anymore and that's it, doesn't imply anything, just what it says. With this kind of affirmation you're part of all the people who made this thing worse than it should be. Stop interpreting what people says. There could be one million reasons for someone not agreeing with someone else.

[@zenster1097]

@@kaijuh People say a lot of things. People can also think there's more to the story than what someone let's on.

[@sethwinslow]

Disclaimer: both Alex And Jesse live within a few blocks of my sister. I’ve played games with both of them while on trips to Cleveland. (I have never played with both of them at the same time.) I have also corresponded with both via email and text (to arrange meeting times for gaming and the like.) With that out of the way, I have no idea why they went separate ways. I never asked. While I’m naturally curious, it’s none of my business. In any case, I never heard either say anything negative about the other. Ever. Alex said something recently about different approaches to content creation, and nothing more. That could mean a lot of things. I don’t know anyone commenting on this thread personally, so I’m speculating here. But I think I might be in a position to know more than others, and I don’t know anything. Think about that before you jump in with interpretations and insinuations.

[@paleblue8922]

Definition of blackmail: demanding payment from someone in return for not revealing damaging information That was happening

[@stevekozlowski5963]

Great coverage of a delicate topic. I'm glad to see a nuanced view and I hope a lot of people watch it. It really just seems like a miscommunication and some questionable actions on both sides, which is what I had assumed all along, but certainly not blackmail. People are WAY to eager to get out the pitchforks and storm the castle though, and trying to calm them down is almost impossible. Anyway, glad to see your take on this

[@bryanyoung9966]

That’s the worst part. People love negativity. Which is exactly why the negative thumbnails get more clicks. Could both parties have handled this better? Absolutely. But don’t think it is as egregious either way as some people have said.

[@TheKingofAverage]

Thank you very much and I'm glad my more recent shift in coverage style has been noticed/appreciated. There's certainly some fault on both sides, and some overreactions. From what I've seen of the aftermath, I think it certainly leans toward the side of Jesse as more at fault and I think I agree in general. While there is a MUCH better way of calling out poor form (the harsh critical video for the sake of being harsh) - the fact that it was posted after a failed business deal is just asking for trouble and will again if the trend continues. Hopefully both sides learn from this.

[@bryanyoung9966]

@@TheKingofAverage Well said. Agreed. He should have used a lot more subtlety about how he approached so many aspects of this entire thing. Keep up the good work!

[@ShelfClutter]

The price tag doesnt seem that unreasonable considering how massive the game is (which is then multiplied by the people needed to play it, the hours of planning, filming, and editing) and the limited time I'm sure they have... I put out 1 video a week and struggle with that 😅 ..

[@pawemalon2502]

I was waiting for this video from you KoA and you didn't dissapoint!

[@kitcarpo4745]

Nice vid. Thanks, I hope things settle down, I think there are a lot of regrets all around.

[@velveteenv76]

Blackmail? In the industry they just call it business.

[@TheKingofAverage]

Hah! True that for some

[@ajeckler]

Really fantastic, thoughtful, even handed treatment. Best video on this drama I’ve seen.

[@TheKingofAverage]

Thank you very much! :)

[@DakonBlackblade2]

I dunno if they were blackmailing anyone, but they definitely should just pay attention to the rules they read cause there is nothing unplayable about Aeon Trespass.

[@yagsipcc287]

Yup! big time even more funny his how they love KDM and that can be a mess with everything. The only major complaint about ATO I have seen or have is to do with space needded for everything to be out at once (map tiles, game board) this is becoming more common with big games but a game like ATO requires alot of space or you can put things away and back on the table again. Its a bit of a pain but thats it and more than worth it.

[@DakonBlackblade2]

@@yagsipcc287 I know this is a hot take, but games that are this big are better played when they have a TTS mod or a steam version like Gloomhaven. I like playing the physical thing cause it's just fun to get the cards and minis in your hand, but I usually have more fun playing them when these automation tools are available. That said, the rules themselves are complex but anyone can learn and master them in a couple sections of play, certainly 50 hours in you will know all of it inside and out, they were exaggerating for views for sure on the video.

[@yagsipcc287]

@@DakonBlackblade2 I would not disagree tbh, the difference is your experenice you get from each of them. Like I love eitherfield and wow it can be rough because of the amount of cards and management is just so much and changes alot... but I still love it :-) things can be a negative or even a big negative one still doesnt ruin the game. management is always an issue but I dont disagree with your comment :-)

[@DakonBlackblade2]

@@yagsipcc287 Also the game takes up an entire giant table in my living room cause there is no way I'll tear it down then set it up again next weekend every time lol.

[@elisabethcruz2424]

I’m ok with all of you have said, but ATO is only unplayable for those people who doesn’t read the rulebook.

[@dio1122able]

Part of this issue is that Quackalope has developed a slimey reputation as being a mercenary outfit who will say anything to its viewers. While getting sponsored content isnt inherently bad, Quackalop was clearly willing to sell out its viewers on a game they didnt particularly like. To me, that is the biggest issue.

[@arthurdent9281]

They could still do positive content with some critical feedback about the issues with the rules and how to overcome those issues. Other reviewers offer criticism even in sponsored content. I don't see why they couldn't as well.

[@williamskogen9895]

Quack would not have made a video calling the game a "masterpiece 9.3/10" if he didn't particularly like it.

[@cookbookforcannibals]

@@williamskogen9895 but also a video stating it's unplayable.... soooo he also hates it? or he's after some cheap viewing figures

[@williamskogen9895]

@@cookbookforcannibals The answer to that is yes to both. You can love something and hate it at the same time. The videos make it clear that it is an epic and fun game while at the same time being difficult and incredibly time consuming to play. I personally have never wanted a game so bad while at the same time not wanting to lay a finger on it, so I understand the position. Also, he makes his living off of KZbin videos. More views = more money. Check the numbers on the negative video - more than twice what he got on the positive. Not faulting him for that. Also, shorter videos tend to do better than longer videos, so two 15 minute videos will probably see more clicks individually than one 30 minute video.

[@prototypep4]

​@@cookbookforcannibals That's LITERALLY the point of confirmation bias.

[@siturl5834]

I don’t see how both sides are at fault. At no point was a payment agreed. It reminds me of people that drive around offering thier services to pave your drive. Sometimes they start work without permission and then expect payment.

[@SexyGandalf89]

Great video! Everybody needs to stay calm a bit more 😄

[@seansmith2650]

Makes sense boardgameco distanced himself from quack. They do no content together anymore. Alex prob got the vibe the dudes no good

[@Shawne01]

Well said and appreciated the effort in reporting on this subject and taking the time to discuss this and bring out the evidence and clarity on this subject. As for the queen we are sorry took him from you for a whole day but KoA is a great reporter and researcher and we need this level of detail nowadays when being truthful is a crime so apologies to the QoA. Again another great video continues to grow and be successful as always best wishes. I appreciate and value the nuance and depth of your content.

[@dumas8112]

Great coverage. Thank you.

[@hmuzza3166]

Great video. I actually agree with everything you said. Thanks for being a calm voice in this maelstrom. I might not like his channel but no one deserves the hate he has received.

[@joachim4889]

I was really surprised by Issac and Eric m langs responses. Yeah on One Hand it is Just Issac being Issac. But it also means he had issues with Quackalope in the past. Imo Jesse should really rethink his approach in some ways. If multiple publisher feel that way, there is probably some Truth to it.

[@NeilY1000]

Quackalope is finished with industry. No one will touch him now as his channel has bad vibes. Doesn’t matter whether he is ‘good’ or ‘evil’. Toxic is toxic

[@buddywahlquist2467]

What did Lang say?

[@malignpariah]

@@buddywahlquist2467 I'm not sure, but if some said "a designerr had a bad/ridiculous take" my first thought is "must be Eric Lang".

[@abandonlife111]

@@NeilY1000 Time to go back to selling used cars, I guess.

[@patrickperl8741]

Where can I find Eric Lang's and Isaac Childress's responses??

[@RangonTheGreat]

I think this was a very well thought out video and take here. I think overall it is just bad for both game creator and video creators in the board game sphere, I can see the faults of both and at first wanted to quickly jump to side but glad I took a step back to get the background on it and this video helped to put a lot of it in perspective. Props to the dedication and level-headed takes on this issue, hope that we can all learn to move on and develop this space we all enjoy in a more communicative and healthier manner for not just the creators but for all board gaming enthusiasts alike!

[@meewarwoowoo]

Im going to assume "dog whistle" means "whistle blow" but that is not a good mistake to make.

[@jonsmith9518]

Dude, you’re the best at what you do. Keep up the great work. Cheers!

[@KBrandes]

The timing was my greatest concern. A video suggesting a game is unplayable is released at the most integral stage of a game's funding period. It really suggests to me that it was a device used as a kind of retribution.

[@baktubak]

I think the controversy will simply make more people aware of the campaign and ultimately generate more backers though. The old saying "there's no such things as bad press".

[@patrickneky9638]

​@@baktubak honestly I thought the same thing. A good controversy brings more attention.

[@MrScrawnjuan]

The praise video also went up. Why wouldn't they post a video about the campaign, during the campaign

[@MrKogarou]

Do you only want to hear the glowing praise while a game is being kickstarted? Sure, Quack has an unusual technique of splitting the praise and critique into 2 different videos - it's cute, and it plays well to the KZbin algorithm. Projecting all these sinister intentions onto him doesn't feel realistic to me.

[@cryoakira7095]

A few pushbacks on the points you made in this good video. 1 - If you're considering sponsored videos to be perfectly usual, then so are the requirements from the publisher for a sponsored video. Given Quack do almost only sponsored videos, they perfectly knew what that implies, even before the publisher formalized it with its mail, so "order" is not important. Right from the start, they're asking for money to tell good things about the game, even when they (seasoned players) are having a hard time with it and considered it bad. That's a problem. 2 - It's not just about those 2 videos. Quack did a series on that game and, in all of them, asked for money. That's a problem. 3 - There is a line between sponsored coverage (KS, preview, reportage) and actual reviews. Reviews shoud alway be honest (without having to say it in the title of a video...) and stay away from money consideration, wether it's direct or indirect. At the end of the day, here is the question that matters to me : Would there be a "negative review" if Quack had its money ? No. And that's a problem. A really, really big integrity problem.

[@markwatson8714]

The counterpoint to that being that since most reviewers already filter out the games they dislike (by not actually reviewing them in the first place) the sponsorship makes no difference - they presumably wouldn't have much criticism of the game to begin with.

[@cryoakira7095]

@@markwatson8714 Probably. But that's also a problem. That's what you get when the ecosystem is dominated by youtubers gone big rather than structured website/press outlet with a more comprehensive coverage. In many sectors (movie, music and even video games), beside youtubers, you still have these "professionnal" sites/outlets where reviewers don't choose what they review, and have to cover the good, the average and the bad. Not perfect by any means, but a bit better IMO. Sadly, the Board Game industry rised during the youtube era so...

[@thebrewgeek]

In happier news, I played Witcher Old World today and really liked it. Keeper. 👍👍

[@jb4882]

Dude I’m still waiting for my shipping notice! Super pumped to eventually get it to the table.

[@KMReviews]

My issue with jesses emails as well is that he says he needs help with rules to understand the game.. and they offer him help multiple times.. and he never asks ONE rules question.. so I don’t believe he struggled with the game so much and they “wanted to be accurate”. He acts like the only way he could put effort into rules is if they paid him.. it’s all just very manipulative in wording..

[@abandonlife111]

very manipulative

[@williamskogen9895]

Very much appreciate a nuanced, mature discussion of the matter.

[@kumanight]

Really appreciate the time and research you put into this King. This wasn't blackmail or extortion. I don't like the way Jessie handled the situation at all either though. I'm glad we got to see the receipts, if only for the fact that now I know what all encompasses sponsored content. I won't be watching any of those videos anymore.

[@technoartfest8708]

The elephant in the room however is how ITU developers tried to Sabotage Quackalope , and ruin their review site with false claims of blackmail or extortion. The other elephant in the room is how ITU was caught in their own email , demanding only Positive Reviews and that comparisons with other games is a NO NO. In other words ITU offering cooperation to Quackalope only if ITU get favorable reviews.. LOL but the fanboys defending ITU will not see ,what is obvious ,that ITU was happy and not offended to continue collaboration with Quack and that it was only until they published their real Experience , of being UNplayable game experience , that they attacked them. IF they refuse to provide help with the game ,to how is played ,then it shows they are mediocre developers.

[@kumanight]

@@technoartfest8708 I imagine Sponsored Content only having positive things & no comparisons are pretty common among industry players. Doesn't mean I like it though, I'm avoiding any sponsored content like the plague from now on.

[@kpr7228]

​@@technoartfest8708 lol. But quack didn't want to sabotage their campaign, having materials ready in Feb, but despite demand of his audience, waiting till May to publish, right? big shock. paying for service and getting negative result. I'm sure business works like that lol. It's obvious it was gonna be paid positive content. Otherwise why ITU should pay him at all? Especially after he admitted he will be covering ATO anyways xd

[@hughroe8598]

Excellent commentary in a sea of toxic responses. I perused reddit briefly on the saga and shortly thereafter regretted it as it was akin to wading through fetid sewage. The video is a strong indicator of how KOA's own approach has matured and become self-reflective. Keep up the good work.

[@bryanyoung9966]

Agreed with the maturity. I still am not always a fan of the thumbnails (I can agree for the need for clickbait because of The algorithms and still dislike them) but overall think KoA has been less impulsive and more mature in his responses to things overall.

[@not_another_board_game_page]

I think you nailed it when you used the word “maturity.”

[@gregorycook3550]

I sure hope we can move beyond this soon. Otherwise, I'll be forced to having to start learning the actual board games I have on my shelves.

[@TheKingofAverage]

The horror! :D

[@ScottnCarol4JC]

Haha, same!

[@gasa5251]

to see a review of Aeon Trespass Odessy by a reviewer who didnt really enjoy the game look at The Esoteric Order of Gamers, wonderful review, not for him, but still highlights what he sees as great things about the game. This review looks like integrity to me.

[@CheddahSlammer]

I just watched Board Game Co's vid, while he didn't cover the issue, because he doesn't like covering drama, He did say the issue is effecting his channel as well, even though he and Quack haven't done vids together for 1 year. Said he lost around 100 subs. He then went in detail on how he runs things on his channel, and what he thinks is ok, and what isn't. It just surprised me that people included him in this issue, when his and quacks content are very different.

[@abandonlife111]

He has said he will never do another video with Jesse again.

[@oerthling]

Well said. Totally agree that the confirmation bias split of videos is a major part of the problem here. I understand that YT creators live under the shadow of the unforgiving YT algorithm and Quackalope is hustling the system like most professional channels will eventually (clickbaity titles and thumbnails, shifting to formats that optimize views). But the confirmation bias videos, as much as they help with the clicks, are risky timebombs and easily misunderstood.

[@talk2thehand]

Come on.. if they say they are a professional board game reviewer, the minimum you need to do is read the freaking rules... He states multiple times that he didn't... And then start complaining about the rules... What a surprise 😂

[@kusidjur4284]

The game has like 25+ pages of official errata and "mandatory" community player aids and trackers to make the game playable per even die-hard fans

[@arthurdent9281]

The rules are rife with errors and omissions from what I've heard.

[@Fenraellis]

The FAQ Errata file is an 11-page document: -- 7-page FAQ (for things that are almost all explicitly and plainly stated within the rule book, but a few might need be inferred from how other rules function, if not read completely, and clarifications are provided) -- 2-page Errata (of which 12 of the 22 points are just minor, such as swapping two letters in the middle of a word, clerical/spelling errors) -- 2-page Assembly guide for a single wing of the Sun Descendant that cleanly detached during transit for a decent portion of boxes. The community player aids are helpful, as it's true the game does not come with pages separate from the rule books, and it's great that people have come together to make things like an abbreviated keyword reference, but they're certainly not mandatory. Personally, I appreciate the ATO Scribe App, as it saves on space, and needing to erase and re-write things, but would have been fine playing with the Cycle and Argonaut sheets if that was all there was. When I occasionally want to check something, the Index from the rule book is very easy to use. I won't deny the game is a beast to get into, though, and it takes several hours, and perhaps a session or few, to internalize the brunt of the rules. Also, the provided insert does not play nicely with fully sleeved cards. I haven't looked into a replacement insert... yet, but I probably will eventually.

[@talk2thehand]

@kusidjur4284 , it doesn't matter right? It's his job. If he wants to cover the game he needs to learn it... Is the game too difficult to learn, go to the next game... There are thousands...

[@arthurdent9281]

@@talk2thehand It absolutely matters. His viewers wanted to see coverage of it, so he spent time trying to learn the game, but it's very difficult to learn due to all the problems with the rules. That's obviously something that his audience would want to know about.

[@viewersdelight]

Nice job breaking this down. Hood points on ur commentary as well!

[@mistercreed5507]

Nice overview about the struggle. Thanks.

[@janvanosselaer7075]

Like the nuanced arguments you presented here. Also wanted to mention that I love your newer style. In my humble opinion, the older KoA was a little bit more 'self-rigthious'. I did notice a shift since half a year, with a way more mature way of approaching (often more difficult) topics. I really do love that change in your approach, and I feel this place is the place for the best insight on what plays in the industry. Keep up the good work KoA :)!

[@zachras9643]

Very well done!

[@JonoNZBoardGamer]

Thanks for great coverage on this issue Michael! I stay away from social media so when I started hearing smatterings of drama with quackalope, I was glad I could watch your video to get clear understanding of what is going on without taking sides. I really appreciate it!

[@TheKingofAverage]

I put some thought on if I wanted to really read everything, but I felt it I chose bits out for people who hadn't already read it that it'd seem like I was picking and choosing. Glad you liked it! :)

[@clivecrous]

Thank you for the time and thought and effort you put into covering both sides.

[@kevinpk8970]

Very comprehensive and balanced commentary, thanks! One thing I really don't get is how you can shoot 50h+ of video before having a solid understanding of the games' rules. Also, if the rules are that confusing, you just contact the developer to clarify right away once you've read the rulebook or at the latest a few hours into gameplay. Quackalopes' decision to just go ahead with video production instead seems like an utter and amateurish waste of time and is completely on them, imho.

[@TheKingofAverage]

It's certainly different than my experience but also how I operate when I have questions. Even with the prototype I recall shooting ITU email questions and getting answer so I ensured I played right. Also, thank you for the kind words :)

[@tayhhuck]

Have you ever given a close up of your game collection? I always love seeing the backdrop and see many of my games on your shelves, and your tastes appear very close to mine. Would love to see what games I might be missing!

[@thegreatyeti33]

Awesome coverage over this and video

[@FryMcFly]

Your content is awesome. You deserve more subs! Keeping fingers crossed for that video that skyrockets :)

[@joshhart379]

Great insight as ever

[@arcubal]

Great examination, as usual. Thanks, Michael. One niggly... I prefer you reading highlighted excerpts at normal speed over reading everything at 1.25 speed. But hey, I get that you were trying to be complete yet also not draw out the video too long. Keep on rockin', brother.

[@TheMarvin676]

Click in settings and you can slow down playback speed to .75 during those email reads.

[@Octavian2]

The question is, would he have posted the, 'game is unplayable' video if he was paid. In all likelihood, he wouldn't have.

[@steveowen7508]

Thanks for the nuanced and thoughtful discussion.

[@pecktec]

Super fair coverage your a class act.

[@LatenightLyle]

I know KoA didn’t seek to be the board game community’s warning siren, but that’s where this road has led him. Thankfully, KoA has both owned it and evolved. The new direction of more thought and research, with less knee-jerk emotional response is a very welcome growth for the channel. In the past, I’ve unsubscribed and resubscribed several times. KoA would turn me away with (in my opinion) emotion based rabble rousing. The videos often felt accusatory with unsubstantiated assumptions. However, cut through that and at the heart of it was a channel providing a very important service as the best source covering these controversial problems in the industry. Now, KoA’s channel is growing into something much better; more measured. The coverage of this issue with Quackalope is KoA’s best yet. Very well done. Hope the channel keeps evolving and continues to cover these issues!

[@draphsor]

Wholeheartedly agree on all counts here.

[@iansutton7416]

I'll also acknowledge KOAs adaption. 1-2 years ago I still respected the willingness to speak up on issues that others shied away from, but there was also over-reach and a little too much shooting from the hip. Is the coverage perfect? No, but it never will be when the subject matter is contentious. I'm just appreciating that there's more investigation and nuance, and that helps to better frame the issues. Improvement deserves acknowledgement.

[@LatenightLyle]

@@iansutton7416 Exactly.

[@georgemiller9888]

Awesome, well thought out video. I'm curious how many people commenting here actually watched though. In a video calling for less nastiness, there are so many nasty comments here from people acting like they agree with you?!?! I think they just assumed they knew what you were going to say without watching the video...

[@martinhoffmann3730]

Great Video! I 100% agree with your assessment