Quarterfinal | Javier Dominguez vs Simon Nielsen | Modern |

[@throwaway7425]

Rhystic Studies, please make a vid on this match called "Missed triggers" and talk about some legendary ones like this!

[@jacobgottfried5476]

100% needed!

[@databass6531]

The missed protection from The One Ring doesn't bother me as much as the improper shuffling of Javier's deck after playing Endurance. Both the judges and Javier share the responsibility to catch The One Ring protection, but Simon shuffling Javier's deck was uncalled for. How many times did Simon cast Endurance and shuffle his opponent's deck throughout the tournament? These are pro players, so how can there be so many errors? Poor Javier was digging so deep for Supreme Verdict, only to have his chances worsened by his opponent breaking the rules. The judges should have at least called for a rematch. All these mistakes says a lot about the state of Modern when even pros struggle to keep track of all the triggers and rulings.

[@kasuto-no-machi]

If Javier acknowledged the ETB at any point between TOR entering the battlefield and right after being targeted, then it’s everyone’s responsibility including Simon’s to respect the protection. If Javier didn’t, it’s only his responsibility.

[@DavidslvPT]

When was this?

[@kaspershaupt]

He played endurance in the first game and didn't shuffle. Javier did present his deck to his left every time. But it definitely look like a honest mistake. It was later in a game five with a lot going on and javier places his pretty far from his side further then normal and nothing seems to to actually happen

[@jimbo103189]

Seriously why were the judges even there when the announcers were doing a better job than them 🤦‍♂️ Simon’s victory here will forever be tainted as a result.

[@IvanIurchenko]

It’s not judges’ job to make players not miss their triggers

[@G.Snackwell]

39:20 - Simon's intent seems clear (you can see it on his face @ end of turn / why would he target him if he didn't attack) and it really speaks volumes about the quality of sportsmanship and oversight of the game. Judges should have had a PROTECTION label out so this could never happen and Simon as a professional steward of the game should be respecting the active game state instead of exploiting blind spots where there shouldn't be any. An incredibly weak move in any setting especially to a fellow teammate. And this guy goes on to win it all!? This is embarrassing.

[@marvinreyes4407]

I agree its bart level cheating

[@throwaway7425]

I cant really make out wether there is acknowledgement of the etb on the ring trigger, i believe simon fetches "in response" meaning it is acknowledged on the stack. once resolved Javier has static protection which doesn't need to be declared like how a chalice trigger would work, 702.16a Protection is a static ability, written “Protection from [quality].” The only illegal play is the removal of Javier's energy counter which was done on his part. The choice on suncleanser was illegal because you must choose one, and with no valid opponents to target, a chosen creature must be declared. Illegal plays go Suncleanser option -> Energy removal making simon's the first illegal action. Edit: Maybe you can fail to find a target when choosing the second option making the energy removal the first illegal action?

[@GoodWeatherDev]

It's hard to hear because the casters aren't paying attention. But, if you look at that turn, I believe Simon fetches and acknowledges the protection trigger from the one ring. It sounds to me that he explicitly says "protection" in game 4. He then asks if Javier passes and proceeds to play Endurance targeting Javier. That is either a missed trigger, or an illegal action depending on what was actually said between the two. Then he plays suncleanser the next turn, which would also have been illegal if they verbally discussed the trigger. If not, the endurance is already proof of missed trigger so suncleanser is ok. In either case, the casters did a terrible job not paying attention.

[@throwaway7425]

@@GoodWeatherDevendurance was definitely in response, think he says something then simon fetches and plays endurance in response. Javier might have shortcut the resolving part since nadu doesnt run countermagic

[@0x7000]

TOR protection missed game 3. Simon should not have won that game. SMH Javier cmon man!

[@zetazz17]

To me it kinda looked intentional(the TOR and Suncleanser interaction), because Simon would have otherwise attacked(?) I find it hard to believe that it’s an accident.

[@ts5272]

Perfect assessment

[@OMGclueless]

It's intentional, but it's not illegal. In the IPG (part of magic's tournament rules) it says, "A player who makes a play that may or may not be legal depending on whether an uncommunicated opponent’s trigger has been remembered has not committed an infractionn; their play either succeeds, confirming that the trigger has been missed, or is rewound." In other words, Simon is free to try to make the Suncleanser play and it's on Javier to stop him as it's the first moment the protection is relevant and if he doesn't acknowledge it it's considered missed.

[@zetazz17]

@@OMGclueless yes I can agree to that if the trigger was missed, but I do not see any indication that the trigger was missed by both players. Forgetting the trigger upon the resolution of The One Ring is a thing, but having it resolved and still attempting to target your opponent after doesn’t seem to be legal to me, especially because the rule mentioned about missing triggers and not “ignoring an existing condition and attempting a play to see if your opponent remembers”. I could be wrong, but I have seen people get warnings(when I was playing in some local tournaments) for missing a Chalice of the Void trigger.

[@OMGclueless]

@@zetazz17 The IPG explicitly allows making plays that might be illegal. Chalice of the Void is different: Playing spells into a Chalice of the Void is always legal, and then it is up to the controller of the Chalice of the Void to announce the trigger or not. Targeting the opponent with Suncleanser might be illegal or might be OK, depending on whether Javier has missed his trigger. The IPG has guidelines that say it's OK to test whether the trigger was missed by making an illegal play (because they don't want to force players to acknowledge the opponent's triggers).

[@zetazz17]

@@OMGclueless I agree that testing to see if triggers are missed should be legal, yes. But forgetting doesn’t equal to missing imo, because if the protection does exist, targeting shouldn’t even be possible in the first place. Hence my dislike to what Simon did there.

[@mitchelljensenproductions2263]

I am a big fan of Simon Nelson but I did not want him to win like this. Also did he shuffle the deck if so wouldn’t that be a instant loss of match?

[@ts5272]

How could you be a big fan of a guy who will ID "only to his friends" like a little bundle of sticks

[@thisreplywillbeuselessbuth9879]

@@ts5272What does ID mean in this context?

[@Dafastso]

simon is covering his battlefield with his hands during javier's turn

[@johnroth5919]

After watching this, that suncleanser play looks extra sus to me. It’s not like he forgot Javier had protection, he knew Javier had protection from everything, he didn’t attack. The seemingly fabricated “life dispute” with haywire mite seems like a clever misdirection to commit a game rules violation or at the very least failure to maintain from Simon without Javier or judges catching it. The One Ring is the most commonly played card in modern right now, the suncleanser is not. Is it Javier’s responsibility to read his opponents card, suncleanser, and ensure that the ability targets or doesn’t? I couldn’t hear, but if Simon didn’t say the word target and just said choose second ability or something that would be extra sus in misrepresenting the card in my opinion

[@johnroth5919]

Okay he says “target you” in a noticeably lower voice avoiding eye contact, then covers his mouth, smiles and rubs his hands together when Javier lets it happen. To me this looks more and more intentional. Javier probably needs to work on slowing down considering this is the second time this tournament where a grv from an opponent made him lose. Probably hard though when English isn’t your first language

[@OceanicBacon]

@@johnroth5919 If Javier didn’t acknowledge the protection trigger then targeting him is not a grv

[@OMGclueless]

It doesn't matter whether it's intentional. It's not illegal to make a play that depends on a missed trigger. The IPG says: "A player who makes a play that may or may not be legal depending on whether an opponent’s uncommunicated trigger has been remembered has not committed an infraction; their play either succeeds, confirming that the trigger has been missed, or is rewound."

[@44KoRn44]

How can this two experienced pros play the game that sloppy? Missed Ring protection, missed draw, counter an uncounterable t3eferi... Hard to watch...

[@stephenhanlin6287]

Modern is a very complicated format, the stakes are incredibly high, which increases stress, and they played up to 8 rounds of Magic each of the last two days in a row, so they’re likely much more mentally fatigued than they would be normally. Even pros are human. The Ring protection would’ve been easy to forget about with it off the board. It’s easy for us to sit back and criticize when we’ve never been in the hot seat.

[@44KoRn44]

@@stephenhanlin6287 yeah understandable, but still, they are pros and play Modern every day. They get a lot of Money for this and sure, one misplay can happen, but then you focus yourself and take your time. This was very questionable and costs Javier the Game in the end.

[@pereyraeduardo5m]

if you wanna watch perfect magic, play on the computer. welcome to the real life

[@coolrunner4095]

If you could do so much better how come you didn't make top 8 of the pro tour??

[@44KoRn44]

@@coolrunner4095 normally when I ignore opponents Ring protection or shuffle opponents library after endurance when opponent digged real deep for an out, there is a judge dq me... So I dont know...

[@bricknolty5478]

I don't understand why Javier didn't just go for Wrath on 3 in that last turn of game 5?

[@throwaway7425]

its x ww, he didnt have the mana to pay since he has to bounce first to remove the static ability

[@SamuelGilbert-wp5ur]

Shuffling the deck post endurance and smiling the whole time while refusing to stop shuffling is suspicious as hell.

[@zackaryolson7921]

Was Simon drug behind a a card right before this match or something? What’s going on with his arms?

[@DavidslvPT]

Mosquito bites allergy/reaction - he mentioned it in his twitter account

[@zackaryolson7921]

@@DavidslvPT that makes sense. My son has terrible reactions to bug bites as well. In the summer time he constantly looks like he was fist fighting a pack of stray dogs.

[@tvadan2586]

39:34 Simon does an Oh Shit face thinking he's been busted, luckily javier didn't catch him nor the judges.

[@diogoborges00]

G5, why not bounce the creature than wrath it?

[@BosSoxFan15]

Cause he has no mana to make enough energy for wrath the skies to kill anything but the tokens.

[@Trivedi_Tuesdays]

39:02 Why couldn’t they investigate Simon? He had multiple instances of shady play and no punishments. Is it bc he’s a pro tour star? Yall DQ’d someone in the tournament for doing much less 😂. Him winning this match and the tournament is dishonoring Kai’s legacy, yall should be ashamed.

[@Shadowbow1000]

I agree. An obvious mistake and they DQ a player just to get the favourite player into the top 8 so they can say their pre-written lines. Obvious favouritism at hand here

[@albertpnc]

So crazy that even with all the little tags they have, they don't have one for "Protection." The one ring was the most played card in this event, no? Even if it wasn't malicious. It is wild that there were no repercussions after the round 13 or 14 reversal 😢

[@celsuskintanar]

​@@albertpncthe one ring granting protection is a triggerred ability, and it is the owner's responsibility to demonstrate awareness of the triggers. Nethergoyf is a static ability which the game rules do not allow to be missed.

[@bricknolty5478]

​@@Shadowbow1000WotC said Bart Van Etten was found to have intentionally misplayed to make his Goyf bigger, which is why he was DQ'd.

[@lostingreenbay]

The guy DQd was a known cheater so yeah…..

[@Ambushw23]

How’s Simon not get at least 1 warning for either the shuffle or the missed draw he took the draw so that 100% should be a warning and the shuffle should be too he’s lucky he didn’t game loss. I’m not up to the newest rules on that if you can get a game loss off game warnings in a final game of a match or if 2 does it anymore and you need 3. 2 in one game was automatic game loss at one time but that was when you could get dqed off game warnings

[@kasuto-no-machi]

Honestly it looks like Javier didn’t announce the TOR ETB, nor mention protection when he was first targeted, hence the judges not bringing it up. Unless Javier or table audio indicates something different, it’s plain old sloppy play not cheating AND bad judging.

[@insooofficial]

I thought this was professional level magic?

[@Dafastso]

simon knows this game lol as soon as javier reaches for his lands he moves his one ring to the graveyard

[@PokeGrillz]

Damn Javi how u miss that? How the judges miss that? That TOR protection is very obvious and played so much I can't believe the judges didn't see it.

[@OMGclueless]

Judges do not notify players of missed triggers. If the player does not acknowledge it the first time it would be relevant, then it is missed. 99% of games do not have judges looking over the players' shoulders and they don't change how things work just because there are a lot of eyes on this match.

[@vvv7696]

39:10 Wow blatant cheating is rewarded in pro play, apparently

[@thisreplywillbeuselessbuth9879]

Simon not pointing out Javier’s missed trigger is actually not cheating by MTG pro level rules

[@jjbantle]

23:12 How did Javier cast Counterspell with a plains?

[@stephenhanlin6287]

His other land was Mystic Gate, which let him filter white mana into double blue! ☀️->💧💧

[@Ambushw23]

Judges absolutely wiffed Javier should of won but he also missed the one ring protection

[@brucegray2614]

nice 60k they got to share with the team

[@Beale_]

Nielsen needs to be investigated man

[@kaspershaupt]

That judges should have called that out that is his job! Otherwise why are they even there? But bad judges are in all sports and if a ref misses a penalty then it is what it is. No need to call simon horrible things

[@juliocesarayala600]

Javier paid a counterspell with a plain at 23:06 ?

[@mtgkid0205]

He had Mystic gate which filters the white into double blue mana

[@juliocesarayala600]

@@mtgkid0205 Oooh, got it, thank you

[@bilgekaganozoren7385]

51:15, that bastard knew exactly what he was doing. The smile on his face, refusal to stop shuffling after Javier quickly warns him. Should have his pro status revoked and sent back to learn the fucking basics.

[@eacy7deacy]

You don't really know if it was intentional though. There are a number of reasons for smiling in that setting. I do think that it should maybe result in some sort of rewind or game loss.

[@kaspershaupt]

Have you watched simon ever? He's just a eery giddy person

[@cashcolin1537]

Newer player here, this is discouraging to watch. Seems rigged towards certain players and makes me not want to get into competitive play.

[@MrRomeyo93]

it all comes back to Javier's playstyle were everything seems rushed he cant even keep track of his own cards

[@garrettbaugus7959]

Why is everyone talking about the one ring miss?! Game 2 was a botch! Javier should not have won game 2! Watch between 22:00 and 23:20! Javier casts an illegal counterspell on Nadu with no 2 blue mana. Javier passed the turn with an Island, Plains, and Meticulous Archive untapped, Simon casts Shuko and Javier casts Tune the Narrative in response. This leaves a plains and meticulous archive untapped, which is not 2 blue mana! Simon proceeds to cast nadu which Javier then tries to cast counterspell which he cant do!

[@RobertPompaGaming]

It was a mystic gate, not an archive

[@dr.luiz.osorio]

Thanks for painting that out

[@youngmanghramcrafter3601]

if you watched two seconds after that seems like the judge asked the same question and yeah the mystic gate is a filter land he had the mana available.

[@verververververver]

Sloppy and terrible match

[@brandondherin2558]

asterisk for the win

[@oops3034]

Its why wizards needs to be bought by someone with a brain

[@exposfan94movies]

Pretty savage to come up with such a convoluted plan to cheat your own teammate out of a win.

[@alexcaffri9091]

Simons a cheater

[@alexcaffri9091]

Simons a dirty cheater. He snickered when he checked the protection. This whole tournament is a freaking joke. These judges suck so bad it's almost hilarious, are they all casual commander players or something? Seems like they've never seen a scam or a goyf or a ring before.

[@OpticAssassin]

Simon Nielson cheating.

[@KMProtectionServices]

How did they miss the counterspell in game 2 paid with a white mana? Come on!!! He knew he couldn’t do it, you can see he realized it and then did it anyways… more cheating, what a surprise.

[@WoodsyYOB]

He had a Mystic Gate untapped as well.

[@KMProtectionServices]

@@WoodsyYOB yeah you right… thought it was a hallowed fountain… still all the other mistakes and everyone brushing them off and laughing is ridiculous. These are supposed to be the pros but if we mere mortals do the same we would get in big trouble…

[@ts5272]

40:44 Listen to what Mani says, "We saw Simon not attack." That means HE KNEW about the protection from The One Ring. He played Suncleanser anyway as an angle hoping the opponent would not notice it. His prize money should be forfeit. That should have been a game loss and DQ. He just proves again SN is a despicable person.