Serge Bo vs KFlash ECU Tune - Which One is Best?

[@jackbryden8512]

Hey Liam, Great video as always and thanks for reaching out to make this happen! There a few points you have made in this video that I think do require some more information for viewers, Regarding open loop on wide open throttle, Yes, this is great for throttle response as long as the AFR's are correct but more importantly, they need to be safe! For a typically "Flash Tune" we offer, there will always be variances between engines condition based on maintenance and mileage. we chose to go down the safer route in an effort to preserve our customers engine's longevity and typical aim for our fueling to be with in 5% off perfect then allow the ECU to do add/take fuel as required. We do offer road and dyno tuning for the more extensively modified cars in which we do use open loop on WOT. But without logs and corrections made where required we just aren't comfortable potentially jeopardizing our reputation or risking our customers' cars blowing up if, for example, their fuel pump started to fail or even something as common as a bad tank of fuel. Hopefully this clears up any confusion. TLDR - safer is better. if people want instant throttle response at the potential cost of their engine then that is their decision to make.

[@KiwiCarLife]

Cheers for the info Jack! This is some important stuff I forgot to emphasize

[@mailtsauce]

What would’ve been really interesting is what numbers you would get on stock ECU vs serge vs kflash

[@KiwiCarLife]

Yes true

[@jackbryden8512]

Stock ecu would typically be around 125kw

[@CL9k24a3]

You have that dyno on k flash instagram. Mods on stock ecu vs tuned. Can't link it here but it is 16th picture if you count down from the top

[@jackbryden8512]

correct yes we do, but this is with the ecu compensating for the supporting mods so it's inflates the "before numbers"

[@ReJaggrd]

Another great video, can't believe the quality of these videos lately. Cheers for the content

[@KiwiCarLife]

Thanks man!

[@CL9k24a3]

Serge flash , after ading mods, is running 14afr at 25.5 ign timing. That is really good for the engine.

[@KiwiCarLife]

No idea what any of that means haha

[@Esdru221]

Didn't you say that serge flash is bad because the engine run lean?

[@KiwiCarLife]

@@Esdru221 well it's not "bad" it's just the tradeoff you make by running it open loop

[@mailtsauce]

@@KiwiCarLife it is bad. 14 afr is not good

[@CL9k24a3]

@@Esdru221 sarcasm. Its fkn trash

[@kebzaccord]

Great video bro. I originally wanted to do Serge’s tune but i don’t think he is tuning anymore. Then i was thinking about getting flash pro but it is super expensive i have an 06 and i don’t want to deal with having to get a new ECU and all. So i think i’m going with this Kflash 👍🏽

[@KiwiCarLife]

Yeah not sure what's happened to serge frankly

[@kebzaccord]

@@KiwiCarLife would you say the reflashclub tune is reliable long term?

[@KiwiCarLife]

@@kebzaccord yeah well I mean if there's no initial issues with the car after it's tuned, what is there to go wrong?

[@colinleder5683]

Just letting you know he's back in business. He tuned my CL9 yesterday

[@kebzaccord]

i ended up getting the kflash, pretty happy with it!

[@hello-do9vl]

patiently waiting for the automatic accord euro + kflash tune!! sounds promising

[@KiwiCarLife]

Will probs be a couple months away

[@danbyn9335]

Very interesting results, cheers mate for the vid!

[@KiwiCarLife]

All good!

[@spadgm]

Interesting vid mate!

[@KiwiCarLife]

Cheers!

[@choiceparalysis]

Is the KFLASH tune the standard Reflash from the Euro Group provided by the guy in NZ? Opposed too an actual KTUNER tune on a TSX ECU? Would be cool to get ur hands on a HONDATA & KTUNER as well with the Tsx ECU; also surely a video on that modified auto!

[@KiwiCarLife]

Yeah would be cool to try a Hondata... And yeah he is based out of NZ and is the dealer for reflash club. They just tune the stock ECU. Modified Auto vs Modified manual vid on the way!

[@grahamchan4266]

Great amount of information! Do you know if the Sergebo tune is available for the CL7 Euro R 6mt?

[@KiwiCarLife]

Yeah sure is

[@alanghee9520]

i have flashclub aka k flash im glad i went with them, more expenisive t ho

[@KiwiCarLife]

Yeah it's good man

[@alanghee9520]

@@KiwiCarLife yea man he's the real deal just gotta buy your own tool . It's 300 to get it to the states

[@craveboost24]

I was gonna go with sergebo tune ....but now I'm really interested in kflash tune...for the kflash do you just send them the ecu ,key,and immobilizer ? Can they remotely flash it?

[@alanghee9520]

@@craveboost24 they do it remotely the bad part is you need to get your own obd tool and they cost about 270 and take 2 weeks to ship. The tune was $90 for performance and 50 for pops and bangs from kflash

[@craveboost24]

@@alanghee9520 ok thanks for the info! Can you point me in the direction of which obdII scanner tool I need?

[@danielglace1227]

Hey bro I have a flash board .. can I get a tune map for my 2003 cl9 accord

[@KiwiCarLife]

@@danielglace1227 you sure can

[@M_Pirke]

Mine Cl9 K24 AT 08 have same flash and im happy.I never want to tunned her (232ps)+some little tricks measured on 100octane fuel.Cheers my friend.Your videos are fantastic,you you presented in one video how (2006-8) K24A AT was fun with little tricks! Thanks my friend to tune her with style -First owner!

[@KiwiCarLife]

Nice!

[@Kantoh22]

I currently run serge bo's tune here in the US, and have had no issues with it. I am not running lean either, considering how black my fujitsubo legalis r exhaust tips have gotten on the inside, and how my plugs look when I change them every year (yes I change mine once a year). It also passes inspection (smog here in NJ only), and has a high flow cat as well. I do believe he asked me if I had a cat or not, and thats why the o2 was not disabled in my case. Car still hauls, and feels like it has instant throttle.

[@KiwiCarLife]

See now I have the same symptoms... spark plugs are fine, exhaust tips are black. Yet on the dyno it was very obviously running about 5% lean once it hits vtec. I'm confident that a stock accord tuned with the serge tune would be fine, but once you modify it, it stops being able to retune itself at higher rpms and doesn't put enough fuel in.

[@Darylrb1983]

What high flo cat did you use

[@Kantoh22]

@@Darylrb1983 I have a Fast Line Performance high flow cat.

[@Darylrb1983]

​@Kantoh22 oddly enough I also have a cu2 in nj tuned by serge bo. Then I got stationed in Hawaii where the fuel quality is much less so the car haaaates it lol

[@ogdom1809]

Very nice thank you 🖐️

[@KiwiCarLife]

Lovely

[@tonyallpress]

You are telling stories "the car doesnt bang gears because its open loop" - SHARN

[@KiwiCarLife]

It sure does! Can see an obvious difference in the response when quick shifting

[@yellowwolf9389]

It would be interesting to see the difference in fuel economy with a closed Vs open loop system.

[@KiwiCarLife]

The fuel consumption won't be different because the serge tune is only open loop above 4500rpm. Below that it reads the o2 and adjusts afr

[@cartertwowheels3358]

Is it easy to swap the throttle body for a cable type and just go that way? Seems like that would be the dream.

[@KiwiCarLife]

Nah coz it doesn’t come with all the power benefits as well

[@cartertwowheels3358]

@@KiwiCarLife what power benefits do you get with an electronic throttle over the cable? I assumed the inlet was the same? Obviously you'd lose cruise control, but no hang or delays sounds worth it to me.

[@bhaveshkumar1206]

Hey man, to swap ecu’s you would’ve disabled the immobilizer right?

[@KiwiCarLife]

Yes

[@user-rp6ei6jg4z]

Hey Liam - How have you found the kflash now some time has passed. Still safe/going well? Thank you!

[@KiwiCarLife]

Yeah man would absolutely recommend. No issues at all and the car runs great with good performance

[@user-rp6ei6jg4z]

10/10 reply time mate - appreciate your channel. Thanks

[@GMWsho]

Great video. Love Dyno comparisons with IRL driving.

[@KiwiCarLife]

Cheers!

[@Angel-rg9dh]

Is serge the same perdón as littlebo? If thats the case he could be found un different honda forums, in Spain for example, and his remaps are still being done by others Who he has given authority to do so, It can be done for around 350 euros

[@KiwiCarLife]

Yep same guy

[@SBBUK]

Any opinions on hondata flashpro map? I like the idea of being able to tweak myself rather than having to back to a tuner and pay again

[@KiwiCarLife]

Yeah it’s certainly good but naturally you gotta pay more

[@sukhrajsingh1714]

How much does the k-flash ecu cost?

[@KiwiCarLife]

Like 500 or something I think

[@baileyharwood7831]

Im looking to get a pop and crackle tune done to my accord, however I have no idea what I need to get it done or how to do it. Any tips?

[@KiwiCarLife]

Kflash will do a crackle tune. Hit them up on Instagram

[@lachlanwong8160]

time to add a 50 shot of nitrous to my legend to keep up

[@KiwiCarLife]

hahaha you did well to keep up my man! Very even

[@boygenerallasian1653]

Will the KFlash be able to tune cars from US TSX?

[@KiwiCarLife]

Yeah I believe so

[@tinowiik7145]

Do you knowi If i can get this for My stock ecu of 2004 Accord euro or do i needto get 2006+ ecu and do they ship the tune to Finland :)

[@KiwiCarLife]

Yeah you can do it and have a chat with kflash nz he's going on holiday in the UK soon and might be able to ship a tuned ECU to you

[@sashak853]

you can do it in Finland, just message them

[@tszhincheung9261]

Is it worth it to tune an auto accord with k24a engine?

[@KiwiCarLife]

Yep auto/manual, doesn't matter achieves the same effect

[@jc-2134]

One thing to note is that while sergebo only seems to re-flash k24’s, KFLASHNZ/rfclub can tune basically any honda, even the new generation ones with Turbo engines

[@KiwiCarLife]

Yep that's also correct, although in speaking with serge he claims he can also tune other Hondas too, just doesn't seem to advertise it

[@707DBC]

Wait , how do I get my hands on a k flash?

[@KiwiCarLife]

Go on his website and make contact with Jack

[@alperena4698]

What's the difference when it comes to reliability? Will it be the same? Btw I finally ended up buying a manual accord euro. Took me a while to find a cheap one but finally did🙂

[@alperena4698]

And also which one would you say overall is just better? After watching the video honestly the kflash just seemed a bit better to me. Just because it's safer like you said and makes more power too. And pops and bangs too😁

[@KiwiCarLife]

@@alperena4698 yeah kflash

[@mosesmalone28]

So Ktune is reflash club?

[@KiwiCarLife]

Yep

[@biggiecheese6277]

how does the open/closed loop work if you have no cat?

[@KiwiCarLife]

Doesn't make a difference

[@Sizan0071]

Great vid. Thanks for sharing the comparison mate. Keep it up.

[@KiwiCarLife]

Cheers!

[@sycboyspi]

Hondata K pro v4 with Bluetooth and a custom wire tuck is the only way to go

[@KiwiCarLife]

Sounds expensive

[@sycboyspi]

@@KiwiCarLife not too bad when you install yourself, running kpro v4 on my k24 ap1 s2k and hondata s300 on my b16 del sol. Dyno tuned and well worth the price 🔰💪

[@desirabledrives44]

Interesting results. Everything comes at a cost though. Is your engine designed to rev to 8k regularly whilst still preserving engine longevity? I know my 2zzge can rev up to 9k but it will poop it's pants unless mechanical improvements are installed.

[@KiwiCarLife]

Yeah these engines are very undertuned from factory, they can handle 8k rpm fine. Any more though and the oil pump struggles but for short bursts to the redline it's all good. My engine is still very healthy

[@Esdru221]

@@KiwiCarLife man, k24 oil pump are not capable of reving to 8k without cavitation...there are a reason for everybody change it for a k20 one

[@KiwiCarLife]

@@Esdru221 it's fine. Obviously banging limiter at 8k for long periods of time would be a bad idea but for short bursts it won't do any harm

[@balancemode4112]

@@KiwiCarLife your K24 would rev even higher with Integra Type S oil pump or Type R oil pump from the K20A red top

[@CL9k24a3]

@@Esdru221 on ctr fn2 k20 is the same pump as on cl9 and fn2 revs way past 8000. Personally I wouldn't rev my engine past 7800 even with r pupm...not because of potential problems but because I'm not racing it and those extra revs dont give me any more enjoyment.

[@TopMiner1]

Do you know what Sergo Bo's contact information is?

[@KiwiCarLife]

I don't know, he's disappeared off the face of the earth. No one's been able to contact him in years

[@TopMiner1]

@@KiwiCarLife I wonder if he’s got some impersonators.

[@Variant86]

Serge Bo reflashed my ecu yesterday remotely via whatsupp. Contact him on his FB.

[@clipclop1592]

Anyone have feedback on this? kzbin.info/www/bejne/gpiXZaeXlK98a8k and this 1:53 onward kzbin.info/www/bejne/sIGpqXhsraycl5I apparently some real high level tuners are saying Reflash Club = amateur hour. Not sure if they can damage the engine or not

[@KiwiCarLife]

Well given when I got my car tuned with Serge it was running really lean at the top end because his tune is open loop, whereas with Reflash Club because it's always checking the O2 sensor value so runs at the right fuel ratio (and makes more power) I think the proof is in the pudding.

[@moonbrothers9098]

Is the launch control the same? Might be worth a video..

[@KiwiCarLife]

Yeah already done a video on launch control. Both tunes set it at the same rpm

[@moonbrothers9098]

@@KiwiCarLife Your a Champ!!

[@Pixels1920]

I am doing my research on first cars and my dad (annoyingly) said that I have to at least buy a car from 2012 ish and up. I wanted a cl9 but I am afraid I can't really get one. But I can get a cu2 which imo matches my needs better as a comfortable daily that can have some torque and some pull when it's night ;). If I slap one of these tunes on a cu2 would it be pretty torquey and lively? or would it just be a slow big fat mess. And yes Australia got quite a few manuals.

[@KiwiCarLife]

Yeah get a manual cu2 and get a tune and an intake, lowering springs and good tyres and it'll be awesome

[@Pixels1920]

@@KiwiCarLife Is the CR3 of the same era better or is the euro just better to drive. Also thanks for responding.

[@KiwiCarLife]

@@Pixels1920 yeah tbh the CR3 is a really good car. A lot more than the CU2 tho

[@Pixels1920]

@@KiwiCarLife so should I be chucking mods onto a cr3? I heard they are smoother too.

[@KiwiCarLife]

@@Pixels1920 there are less mod options for the CR3 than for the cl9 and cu2 tbh

[@tantofumo5527]

Thanks Very useful information

[@KiwiCarLife]

All good!

[@tiles3458]

In the United States I don't know of serge bo or kflash but I do know of hondata flash pro and ktuner. I bought hondata and did those modifications too. I'm not sure how much different they are.

[@KiwiCarLife]

Hondata is similar but requires a tsx ECU, whereas these companies can tune the stock accord ecu

[@tiles3458]

@@KiwiCarLife ok, and yeah as far as the tsx goes hondata only can tune the 06-08 models im pretty sure. The older ones require an ecu swap

[@KiwiCarLife]

@@tiles3458 yep

[@froilandmarqueses3489]

Need a drag race between the two tunes. Dyno doesn't represent entire picture compared to drag slips.

[@KiwiCarLife]

I think the dyno plots make it quite clear which is faster

[@froilandmarqueses3489]

@@KiwiCarLife that jolting under shifting is losing the car time...

[@KiwiCarLife]

Yeah that's the tune's fault coz it's closed loop

[@froilandmarqueses3489]

But that's why it needs to be tested. It's like saying more power and torque wins everytime even when figures aren't hugely different(age old Hondas always lose to V8 not matter what). Which Tuning strategy is the real produces better times.

[@felixchetlanddevries2998]

👍👍👍 nice

[@KiwiCarLife]

Yuuuurs

[@felixchetlanddevries2998]

@@KiwiCarLife when is the 3sge rav video coming out lol?

[@KiwiCarLife]

Ahh gonna be a while away sorry haha

[@felixchetlanddevries2998]

@@KiwiCarLife No problem, can't wait to see what's coming next.

[@Hoktew]

I need a tune please 2005 acura tsx k24

[@KiwiCarLife]

Hit up kflash

[@JonathanDMichael]

Another banger video bro 🔥

[@KiwiCarLife]

Cheers man!

[@oscarkabowski8413]

K pro for the win!

[@KiwiCarLife]

Expensive tho...

[@davidzebar6876]

where to get the serge tune in the US?

[@KiwiCarLife]

Go on the global website linked in the description and find your local dealer

[@davidzebar6876]

@@KiwiCarLife there isn't one

[@hernanortega1279]

Find it on Facebook, as serge boo has a tsx on the profile

[@bign1667]

We need ktune in Australia

[@CL9k24a3]

This is reflash club guy. I think you have their service in Australia.

[@KiwiCarLife]

Yeah the guy in nz services you Aussies too

[@cmurda9388]

Can I use it in my CU2 automatic?

[@KiwiCarLife]

Yep

[@cmurda9388]

@@KiwiCarLife I can jus change it without going anything to my engine?

[@KiwiCarLife]

@@cmurda9388 yeah these companies retune the factory ecu in your car

[@moonbrothers9098]

I got my cu2 manual re-flashed , well worth the money.

[@ridzsheik6036]

Excellent numbers👍

[@KiwiCarLife]

Thanks 👍

[@ridzsheik6036]

@@KiwiCarLife you know that a stock G7 GtI makes around 125kws on the wheels😂

[@KiwiCarLife]

@@ridzsheik6036 Gee is that all? Gotta be more than that

[@ridzsheik6036]

@@KiwiCarLife yup that's all on stock. Stock cl9 k24a3 makes 108kws on the dyno, 140kw at the flywheel. The rest is your mods. Your car is making much more than 170kws at the flywheel. Its around 190kw on the flywheel if you getting 143kw on the wheels👍mighty accord