Games That Push the Limits of the Commodore Vic 20

[@bitwize]

The VIC-20 was my first computer. I had no games for it; it was strictly a BASIC machine. It was still awesome.

[@SyntheToonz]

I had one friend in high school with a VIc-20. Everyone else had an Atari, Apple, or C64. He was certain it was evidence proving his parents hated him.

[@basicforge]

How could they have hated him if they bought him a VIC-20! LOL I know that the C64 was better, but I loved my VIC-20 and I still have one that I power up now and then. Great machine.

[@albertlevins9191]

I had a used Vic-20 when I was 6. I used it so much that I wore the ram out. Loved that thing.

[@rya3190]

Man, I was wondering if that was even possible, lol.

[@Newtonip]

The Vic-20 was my first love. Seriously though, I learned the principles of computing on it.

[@JohnnyWednesday]

I wish I had one - I weirdly started with a Commodore +4 then my parents got me an old C64. I assume like a lot of people trying to sell them, they were told the +4 was superior :P

[@brianwilson49]

absolutely the same - i learned so much from the manual which was fabulous.

[@The8BitGuy]

I’m disappointed Petscii Robots didn’t at least make the list. It may not push the limits on graphics and sound, but definitely pushes the limits on game complexity.

[@Sharopolis]

Sorry! What can I say, I just missed that one. I didn't realise there was a port for the Vic-20 or else I'm sure I would have put it in. It would easily be one of the most sophisticated games absolutely.

[@pixelcrunch300]

CROSSOVER OF THE CENTURY?!

[@deanrussell2224]

I had choplifter and Galaxians carts for my vic 20 - absolutely loved them but choplifter was my all time favourite- thanks for the memories

[@JohnnyWednesday]

This is my favorite series on KZbin - I'm a modern game developer that grew up with a C64 -> Amiga but wasn't capable of coding games back then. These systems and their games remain magical in my mind and these kinds of videos remind me why I became a developer - I used to love games :P

[@Sharopolis]

Thanks Johnny! Your Comments are always nice to hear.

[@dyscotopia]

And now that you're a developer you're so over games? 😏 Seriously tho... I miss the days when it was a challenge just to get something up on the screen and one person could make a classic based on addictive gameplay not hours of bloated content

[@fuzzywzhe]

I bet you hate games now that you work on them... I wanted to understand technology. Now I'm an EE in Silicon Valley, and all the interest is gone. I know how it all works now. I solved all the puzzles years ago.

[@mercster]

That's actually my preferred platform to play Doom on. Thanks bud.

[@dirkdex]

Wow - I loved seeing this pop up in my feed, since I really don’t recall seeing any videos about the Vic-20 on KZbin! Thanks for sharing and this is well put together. I remember most of the games, and this was the first computer I remember having! Fun memories! Such a different world back then!

[@TheStuffMade]

Nice 👍 My first computer was a VIC 20 with a datasette, I did have a few games both cassette and carts, but really it was a great machine to learn programming and the user manual would actually teach you how to program. The weakest part was the 5kB of memory and ram expansion carts were very expensive.

[@jeffyp2483]

when i think about that manual i think about it being ring bound and the reference to Pink Floyd

[@basicforge]

I had the same as my first computer. I mostly used it for programming in BASIC, and a tiny bit of assembly and Forth. I had only one game cartridge, Gorf which I played to death.

[@dbranconnier1977]

Commodore was being cheap by not adding 3 extra 1Kb RAM chips to bring the memory up to 8Kb. The VIC-20 should have been released with a minimum of 8Kb. However, I did play some fun games on mine when I was younger (Omega Race, Clowns, Raid On Fort Knox, Cosmic Cruncher, Vic Avengers and Jupiter Lander).

[@basicforge]

@@dbranconnier1977 I have said the same thing myself many times! With 8K of RAM the hi-res graphics mode opens up and you can do much more. Many truly impressive games would have been created if they had done that! As far as impressive games go, I always thought that Commodore's Space Invaders clone was amazing. Omega Race also!

[@charliejade8959]

7:22 Holy f**k! Mind-blowing! Ray-casting in 1983 on the Vic!

[@BottomOfTheDumpsterFire]

Raycasting, not raytracing.

[@Choralone422]

After the Fairchild Channel F (my family owned one) and the Atari 2600 (next door neighbor had one) the Vic-20 was the 3rd games machine and 1st computer that I ever had significant exposure to way back when. My uncle owned one and loaned it to my parents for several months right after the C64 was released. I remember playing Radar Rat Race and a few of the other early games mentioned in this video. Good times!

[@hicknopunk]

When I got Might and Magic for the C64 it was so mind blowing to me as a kid. It was hard to understand how all that game fit on a few flat pieces of plastic.

[@jeffyp2483]

my favorites were gorf and raid on fort knox had rat race, but that game frustrated more than the others

[@luissopelana]

That final demo rocked. Treating the 8x8 color block registers as huge pixels to do scrolling backgrounds and other effects was really inspired.

[@REzado63]

Cheese and onion looks like something that could be on the switch. That's incredible for the Vic20

[@michaelcarrillo7859]

I bought the cartridge. Pretty decent game. Even for the Vic

[@AthosJosue]

Yeah, it looks genuinely fn.

[@cronosoft]

Thanks for the mention during the Astro Nell section. 😊.

[@Sharopolis]

Hey great to hear from you! I think we met once years ago in Croydon of all places, at the classic gaming expo 2005, possibly. If you keep me updated about new releases I'm sure this won't be the last mention. My email is in my about section. Cheers!

[@hicknopunk]

My first Commodore was a C64, but it gave me a love for 650x assembly. Assembly is so cool once it all clicks in your head. VIC 20 doom is kinda great for what it is. Thanks for showing that.

[@SteliosStylianou]

My first computer I’ve owned and used great memories of the old computer thus the machine still going strong after all these years.👍

[@markerhabit]

I'm really into the look of Cheese and Onion and Pentagorat in particular. The Pitfall remake is just wild.

[@SteveBrandon]

Atarisoft made an impressive official port of Battlezone for the Vic-20. It doesn't have true 3D vector graphics like the arcade game had but it still has a good approximation of the arcade game's visuals given the limitations of the Vic-20.

[@chrisnizer]

I picked up a C64-Maxi so I could build up a library of C64 and Vic-20 classic games and it's been a blast! Never had any Commodore hardware but the gameplay videos inspired me to jump in the Commodore pool. Thanks for the video my friend, good stuff! 👍

[@redsable6119]

I was 11 when they family got our Vic20. I had the Omega Race cartridge which was my favorite for my Vic20. Used to have entry parties with friends who came over to help type programs in out of Compute and Byte magazines.

[@UKGeezer]

I will always be eternally grateful towards the VIC and the C64. I got the VIC aged 11 and the 64 a few years later. They provided me with the knowledge to make a career in software development. Still at it forty years later.

[@anticat900]

Good to see Bongo glancing as it was. I know of no other game that did all 3 vic novelties. Screen expansion, multicolour mode and smooth pixel movement (well at least for the main character). A great game too.

[@captaincorleone7088]

I have a VIC-20 (boxed, with the cassette unit, joystick and games) Cost Reduced version with a 35K RAM expansion and the SD card loader and I've played quite a few of those homebrew titles but I didn't know about Cheese & Onion. It looks great, I'll have to check it out! Thanks. 🙂

[@gerrytemple5044]

Great fun, as this was my very first computer im 82 - thanks! I really hope there will be new games developed, especially as the remake "TheVIC20" is a fantastic and well made machine. It's not about primitive hardware, it's about good gaming ideas and pushing the limits of the machine. Great job, cheers!

[@canalRetro269]

TTGO VGA32 a microcontroler board have a emulator too. Really low power.

[@Bob_Beaky]

Thank you for making this. I've been patiently waiting for you to showcase the wee chunky charmer. Viva VIC!

[@DocMicrowave]

I loved that computer. It was my second computer. The Timex Sinclair 1000 was my first. The full sized real keyboard, sound and color blew my mind. It jump started my interest in computers. Especially in my digital electronics projects, thanks to the user and expansion ports giving me access to the hardware.

[@Hologhoul]

Another fascinating one, great job! Plenty of good games and interesting to see the improvements in programming as with the VCS as time progressed.

[@noaht2005]

Wake up babe, New Sharopolis ‘pushing the limits’ video dropped

[@paullee3660]

We used to put multiple cartridges in. We had a “motherboard” that plugged into the cartridge slot and it had 4 slots itself which you plugged the cartridges into vertically. We had a 32k memory expansion which had a switch for each configuration. 3k expansion had a different memory mapping for the screen, etc to the 8k expansion. Also 16k and 32k.

[@jeffyp2483]

the Ministry of Shadows, next door to the Ministry of Funny Walks, righ?

[@Sharopolis]

The Pythons probably understated how silly British politics can be, believe me!

[@pixel_fandango]

Very interesting. I had a Vic 20 for about a year after my ZX81, but got tired of it and the 20 character screen, so it's interesting to see some of the games that did exist.

[@bgeek]

Fab video. Unashamed Vic-20 owner back in the day. It was a gateway drug.

[@Leftfield71]

My first computer was the Vic-20, not only did have a heap of games on cartridge (my favourite being Raid On Fort Knox), but I was able to create my own games. It was an incredible little machine.

[@bunnyhero]

was hoping to see SPIDERS OF MARS (1982). impressive defender-type game with smooth scrolling and nice effects. we played it a lot back in the day

[@speedbird737]

I loved my VIC20 - parents bought me it for Christmas (with Jupiter Lander cartridge) when it first came out in the UK - then a year or two later I was bought the C64!!!

[@elnoel1220]

Did the creators of Jupiter Lander not realise Jupiter is a gas giant?

[@exidy-yt]

Holee snappin! Seeing a recognizable and playable version of DOOM on a VIC-20 which I considered primitive even as a kid in 1983 just blew my goddamn brains out my ears! THAT is some impressive coding work, even with the RAM expansion. My hat is off to who ever managed that!!

[@davidhall7648]

The Vic 20 was a brilliant computer at the time, FANTASTIC keyboard!

[@terrypankhurst7601]

I had a vic 20 had a dracula game on cartridge and played it with a friend, but we had to phone each other to see where we had got and give eachother hints and clues, and help when stuck. And I will remember Blitz until my deathbed.

[@kevinhanley6462]

I was surprised to see it being pushed beyond it's capabilities!

[@hiker64]

Second computer for me. First was TRS-80 Model I - Still, I remember the Temple of Apshai games on cartridge for my Vic20. Got the computer AND the game cartridge. Was a fun weekend... by 1980s standards, that is.

[@SuperMookles]

Porting Doom to the Vic is a perfect example of 'just because something can be done, doesn't mean that it should'.

[@smartperson1]

That demo was amazing. It was also a bop.

[@forcedfeedbackclassicgamer5499]

Wow. Some great looking stuff for the Vic. Neat.

[@hangonsnoop]

Anything sold by William Shatner had to be good.

[@TNX255]

A-HA! I knew that was a PWP (Pers'Wastaiset Produktiot) demo the moment I saw the art style! :D They/him (Viznut, maybe there were others, I'm not sure) made many awesome DOS demos in the 1990's too. PWP translates from Finnish to English roughly as "Against ass productions" or "Ass-defying productions" :D Always fun to watch these limit breaker videos @Sharopolis, keep it up ^^ Now where could I get a working VIC for cheap, hmm...

[@SvenElven]

«Gorf» on the VIC-20 is my earliest video game memory!

[@ericlinville564]

My first computer. I remember playing with GoreTek and the microchips a lot, and typing out the programs in the spiral bound book

[@MichiganPeatMoss]

I would've guessed that about Jupiter Lander - Enjoyed back in the day and was quite impressive compared to the bounds of games written in BASIC.

[@steveleadbeater8662]

My first Home Machine. Two words that still haunt me - Scott Adams. 8 year old me played his adventures for hours.

[@dyscotopia]

I'm convinced the 6502 must be the most fun processor to write machine code for just based on the amazing things people get out of these limited systems. Wonder what would have happened if they'd kept evolving the architecture past the 65816...

[@mrkitty777]

Zilog Z80 was at 4 megahertz comparable with this.

[@dreambyte7926]

I always thought the Motorola 68000 was the most beloved one, due to Big Endian, the lack of requiring segmentation etc..

[@luxocrates]

It was torture. Only three registers, and all three were specific-purpose. No support for 16-bit registers or math, unlike the Z80. That people got amazing things out of it was down to their ingenuity and hard work. The one thing it had going for it was its low cost, though by the eighties, the savings were marginal.

[@chad0x]

Absolutely loved allteh scott adams text adventures on this machine. And there was an early game from rabbitsoft (?) that I really enjoyed too. Cant remember what it was now but it was ace! :D

[@kildogery]

Brilliant mate, my first ever computer/games machine. Thanks so much for being so bloody niche, you mad bastard. I hope i can get away with that. I promise to send you some money when i get a new job. I think I've watched all your videos. Well dine mate. Thanks.

[@Sharopolis]

Much appreciated! Comments like yours keep me going! Support is always welcome, but look after yourself first mate.

[@ScavengerFX]

I loved this video, thank you!

[@johnmc3862]

Love the 'Throwaway- Holiday camp' accent.

[@kevinlawson1746]

I can't remember the game, but Xonox made a game that had this really cool floor effect where it looked like it wrapped around and curved, man I wish I could remember the game , but I never seen any other Vic do that effect. It was very impressive.

[@barry-allenthe-flash8396]

Cool. Never expected to see this in the feature; the Vic is super obscure. i think I've only heard it in passing a few times because it's so old. Just like I'd figure we'd never see.... um.... I dunno....a "Games that pushed the limits of the Vectrex" on this channel or something, lol. I don't even think I knew what a Vic was since I've only heard of it so few times, lol. Thanks for the history lesson; It's great to see stuff I'm familiar with, but it's also always interesting to learn about these things and see what they're capable of!

[@Heike--]

It was one of the best-selling personal computers in 1980-81. I wouldn't call it obscure.

[@amerigocosta7452]

it's not super obscure in the slightest, it's just very old, before most people on youtube's time

[@Nickbaldeagle02]

I had the cartridge of Omega Race. I was blown away by it.

[@sabretooth1971]

Got my Vic 20 Christmas day. Plugged in, turned on...pooof. Thing shorted out; dead. What a christmas that was.

[@ScrapKing73]

Instead of eating R&D on the Commodore Plus/4 and Commodore 16, Commodore should have released a VIC-20 with expanded RAM and a cheaper case and keyboard as the budget competitor to the Speccy that the Plus/4 and C-16 were originally intended to be.

[@JMFSpike]

I can't believe someone actually managed to pull of Doom on that thing. Some may argue that it's missing a lot of content and runs poorly, but that doesn't change the fact that it's still Doom on the Vic 20. It's a super impressive feat, as are most of those other modern day titles. Very, very cool.

[@scotthayes4135]

One of the best gaming systems. The Vic-20 had some of the best video games.

[@LavaCreeperPeople]

Games That Push the Limits of the Commodore Vic 20

[@donkeytonk]

I would love a series that looks into the demo scene on different consoles!

[@dbranconnier1977]

Berzerk MMX is another fairly new game for the VIC that pushes the limits and there is also a Donkey Kong Arcade remake that also looks impressive.

[@Naedlus]

I'm rather impressed by the effort they put in for wall textures on the Doom port. I would have expected them to just go with mirroring the top and bottom of the walls as they had in Capture the Flag to cut down on computing time, but seeing that they actually did raycasting for the complete wall, as well as adding in enemy sprites, is rather impressive. I do think they could streamline the process however, by playing with the textures until they could just mirror the top and bottom of the maze, and just draw enemies on top of it. Hell, they went with a black floor and ceiling in the Doom port. With mirroring they were able to have a "distinct" floor and ceiling texture

[@michaelcarrillo7859]

I read somewhere that by the end of it's run the Vic-20 had sold 2 Million Units

[@manicminer4573]

It was the first computer to sell a million units.

[@robertsissco2439]

God that ad @8:50 showing the 1581 for $189. I paid close to $400 for mine about 2 years ago

[@linkthehero8431]

Cheese and Onion reminds me of the Super Game Boy in how it uses color.

[@scottbreon9448]

Berzerk MMX is also a system pushing game, especially the + version, which includes in-game speech

[@shaunbebbington6411]

For launch titles, look to Japan, as the VIC platform was launched there first. A hint would be the cartridge numbers. Also note that the VIC had some excellent Arcade conversion (PAC-Man) but Commodore did not have the rights to distribute it outside of Japan, so it became Jelly Monsters in other territories by doing the old trick of changing the game name and storyline.

[@Flappatackle]

5:40 Damn those Kirsty Lukes!!

[@basicforge]

I did see a KZbin video demoing a version of Pac Man for the VIC-20 that looked and sounded as good as the version for the Atari 8-bit computers. I wish I knew where to download that!

[@shawntucker9283]

My first computer was the Vic. Keying in pc games in binary with a tape drive all weekend was a favorite nerdtopia with a pizza hut pizza.

[@BabaLee]

Nice video and sone great looking games that have shocked me tbh, in a good way tho. I've still got my Vic20 in its slightly ripped box, one of the F keys has snapped off and I can't find the cassette reader, but I doubt I'll ever part with it.

[@Barcrest]

Some very impressive games there. I had a vic 20 back in the day and i wasnt a fan. My next computer was a plus/4, in the end i got a c64 towards the end of its life.

[@techtinkerin]

I'd have been blown away by doom on one of these back in the day😂

[@SHEARMINATOR]

I was A commodore man growing up in the 1980s as A child. I remember my dad buying me A TV for it with A glass door. My TV set on fire 🔥😭 Never been so scared. As the years went by....I had A commodore 64 and then the commodore Amiga batman pack. ❤❤❤ the good old days. We were the original computer Heads and now nearly everyone on this planet has A computer in the palm of the hand

[@Emudude1963]

Sword of Fargoal is my favorite on VIC20 and C64.

[@vortexspinner4470]

The way forward was 100% machine code..Jeff Minter knew and capitalized on it.. All ViC carts were near Arcade quality to my knowledge.. Omega Race and Vic Avenger (Space Invaders) were great..

[@glennmorrow2755]

I always thought the Vic20 was way more basic than this. That's not bad at all. Interesting.

[@mrkitty777]

ROM of a cartridge mapped in cpu address space, so cartridges weren't limited by the little memory

[@jeffyp2483]

'The Shat' you rolling on the other side of the pond?🤣

[@randysmith7094]

This machine never gets the credit it deserves. The famous "Video Game Crash of 1983" wasn't really a 'video game' crash, it was the boom of home computers. Brought on almost entirely by the VIC20 when they dropped the price to $99. This caused massive cancellations and returns of Atari 2600 systems. ET always gets the blame, but it was almost entirely the Commodore craze.

[@scottbreon9448]

Funny enough, Radar Rat Race was initially an official port of Radar Rate Race (albeit it was only released in the Japanese market) But it was changed for the North American and European markets because of threats of a lawsuit

[@ryancraig2795]

The Vic-20 was my first computer, and "Avenger" was the first cartridge I got for it. A very good "Space Invaders" clone - and I do mean clone. Much better than the official Atari version. Cut my teeth as a programmer on it, too.

[@amigaalive6266]

how does the C16 compare to ViC20? does it make sense to make a "games that push... the C16" video?

[@LeeCorne]

VIC Avenger was definitely one of the best rip-offs of Space Invaders on the 8-bit machines - I'd even go as far as to say the most true to the original version. The official Atari VCS port is a very poor conversion. Andrew Gwynne is a local politician who I found out a while back also had a VIC 20 as his first computer (like me) and I was due to meet him months ago, but I had to cancel at the last minute. Hoping to catch up with him at the conference next week.

[@anophelesnow3957]

TIL The Perils of Willy was an official game. I've seen a version with Stairway To Heaven as the in-game music.

[@errollleggo447]

Wow, who knew the vic could look so good. I knew omega race was great, but pulse?!?!? That's crazy good looking.

[@Nickbaldeagle02]

I had the Omega Race cartridge. I remember being blown away by the arcade quality graphics. Played it to death.

[@RoaldvdM]

Started with a ZX81, quickly changed to the VIC20. Happy until I saw my friends 64. I then made the move to an MSX1 machine. Eventually we both upgraded to Amigas, until I started studying and switched to a 386 for wordprocessing. I started collecting all of those pre-386 machines for nostaligic reasons - but with all emulators available, it has become kind of pointless, at least that's how I feel. It was a fantastic era, growing up, learning to program, and till this day I use VBA for models in Excel.

[@221b]

"Shadow Ministers" are what you call the Prime Sinister's cabinet.

[@HelloKittyFanMan]

Hey, how did Dragon Wing scroll all that graphic stuff over the hard border?

[@bob23301]

First computer i owned when What every woman wants here in Glasgow were selling the Vic 20 for a song back in the 80s.

[@Newtonip]

Fun fact. It's true that you can define your own custom characters and thus define objects in screen on at the pixel level, you cannot add extra characters to the predefined character set. You can only edit existing characters with you custom ones. For instance, you can replace the lower case 'a' with a happy face and use it to put happy faces on the screen, you then no longer have a lower case 'a' character.

[@FadkinsDiet]

The spec sheet for the vic that was shown in one of the ads said it could have 512 different characters on screen at once. Maybe there was some way to switch between two different character sets at one of the scan lines? I can't see any other way for capture the flag to work. (EDIT) The VIC-20 Wikipedia page says that the VIC graphics chip can has timers that allow the program to switch between two character sets mid-frame.

[@Heike--]

My Dad bought me the machine language book for the Vic-20, but not the assembler monitor cartridge (it was too expensive at $89.95). The program that changed the letter A to a hat was the only BASIC program in there. I typed and typed and couldn't figure out why those MOV and JMP instructions only resulted in ?SYNTAX ERROR. :'(

[@manicminer4573]

@@FadkinsDiet The screen is 22 x 23 characters = 506 characters.

[@FadkinsDiet]

@@manicminer4573 So why did the spec sheet 1:32 say 512 displayable characters, and claim that Atari and TI could only display 256?

[@manicminer4573]

@@FadkinsDiet IIRC it has 512 bytes of character RAM. If you resize the screen to bigger than 2x23 you could use more.

[@timoloef]

There's a HERO for the VIC??? I'm gonna try it asap

[@johnathanstevens8436]

I used to think it was pretty fly until I finally tried to write a long program and realized it only has like 3K for BASIC.

[@michaelpegg4288]

Loved my Vic 20. I'm old

[@pelimies1818]

Capture the Flag made bigger impression than the doom port. - No ram expansion used. - TWO 3d views. - released 3000 years earlier

[@leuat]

My own vic-20 demo from 2019: kzbin.info/www/bejne/gZ7EfGuoqpejsJo

[@Nickbaldeagle02]

I still play Gridrunner in 2023 on my Steam Deck.