Should We Fight About the Faith? | Fr. Gregory Pine, O.P.

Father Pine talks about arguing theology online. He approaches it from the lens of how it affects the people observing the debate, the people we are debating with, and ourselves.
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[@bobjoneswof]

Man this video title appeared right in time to call me out huh.

[@CamiloSoares87]

I love the way fr. Gregory transitions from elevated philosophical and theological language to humorous and coloquial talk Just só easily.

[@kenmagnan]

Speaking the truth in love. That's the rule. I remember being a good Baptist who did not know the well thought out teachings of the Catholic Church. God was patiently bringing me around for 12 years of searching. I hope to be as patient with my Protestant brethren as he was with me.

[@bradyspell4004]

Can’t wait to sit back and watch Fr. pine totally endorse my myriad online fights with orthobros and protescants

[@jozsefnemeth935]

Father Pine raised helpful points. Pray, don't be afraid of not knowing all the answers since 1. you are witness of your own faith, 2. The Church has worked out the theological answers , the experts of Bible, history, archeology, science, philosophy etc On the other hand, it is also true that as far as one s own life and faith and interests are concerned one should seek out the answers. Also every father should be able to form his children's faith and introduce them to prayer. It is a real joy these conversations and prayers with one s child.

[@kevinkelly2162]

Get them young before they can think for themselves.

[@jozsefnemeth935]

@@kevinkelly2162 not sure what you mean, or if it makes any sense. Do you have a child? If you had a child you would know they ask questions....

[@ideas_inkwell]

God tolerates us. God tolerates me in my sin. Thank you Fr. Pine for this message.

[@rcbmmines4579]

Really needed this. Just had a really long debate with a Protestant in the comments of one the shorts on this channel. In the end, things went nowhere and he just deleted his comment and posted it again. I did my best to be as patient and compassionate as possible, without compromising the faith and using everything I've learned from Pints, CA, etc., but ultimately sometimes some fights really aren't worth fighting, and even when you say so much there’s still more to be said that they won’t listen to. Same goes for atheists in other areas of the internet. I pray God gives me the wisdom to know when they are as an amateur apologetic. Haven't yet had to do it IRL in person but I'll be ready when I have to.

[@Catholiclady3]

Very good advice, Father. Thank you ❤

[@newglof9558]

Fr. Pine calling me out. Thank you Fr.

[@TCM1231]

Thank you Fr.

[@timboslice980]

Excellent points. Where i live is part of the south where catholicism is as strange to people as mormons or jehovahs witnesses. Im constantly, constantly defending my faith. I have gotten frustrated and gone on the attack, lost friends. Lost the trust of them, its all good. I know it’s the truth and i just keep marching on, i do feel like it drifts into sin when i do what they do. When i say “oh yeah where’s sola scriptura in the bible? Faith alone? The rapture? Penal substitutionary atonement, the points of calvinism, symbolic eucharist, and a bevy of bible passages that don’t work with a Protestant understanding of the church. They get angry and confused and one person even began to doubt christianity itself if Protestantism wasnt true. I try to just get along with people now, defend my faith w respect but never attack theirs. Its the only way i can feel like im not drifting into a sinful system pf proselytizing

[@atgred]

1 Corinthians‬ ‭11‬:‭18‬-‭19 “For first of all, when ye come together in the church, I hear that there be divisions among you; and I partly believe it. For there must be also heresies among you, that they which are approved may be made manifest among you.”

[@changedlife1904]

Good way to fight about faith is being a great witness to God even when the faithfully are unfaithfull and that means EVEN behind closed doors when Noone is looking , because filth always come to light

[@AJKPenguin]

Fightin'! 14:41 Couldn't help but play that Thin Lizzy song. . . _Fightn' my way back. . ._

[@Aaalllyyysssaaaaa]

In my experience, no matter what side they're on, people treat evangelization as a chess game, which I think is really bad. They will use their arguments as game pieces where they're trying to trap the other person's game pieces, outmaneuver them, and eventually eliminate them. But what happens when you lose your pieces in a game of chess? You might a. get tilted, or b. study and practice and try to get better so next time you don't lose your pieces, try to get better at the game. What you're not going to do is start playing for the other team when you start losing, because how would you even do that? Your pieces are gone! Instead we have to build people up. Stop trying to take their pieces away. Their reason comes from God. We don't want to take away their pieces, we want them to have MORE pieces. You aren't invulnerable to being wrong just because God has shown you the truth. If God stepped back and hid His face, you could be outsmarted in a billion ways into thinking up was down and down was up, or whatever the heck the enemy wanted you to think. Like for example I'm schizophrenic. I did not know I was schizophrenic when I had my first psychotic episodes, from my perspective I knew what was true and what wasn't. I believed my delusions, otherwise they wouldn't have been delusions. How do you know you don't have the same thing? You don't. I don't know if I'm typing on a real phone, or if my cat is real, or whether the words my parents say mean the same thing as I think they say. We all have those weaknesses without exception. We don't know crap. We can only choose to trust and accept the reality that our senses are revealing. Trying to prove God's existence is going to be like trying to prove to a little kid that their mom and dad are real and that they're not hallucinations. Sometimes it is just better to hug that little kid and immerse them in the warmth of the truth. Encountering love is going to make them not care about whether they can prove they're being loved. Like what an asinine distraction. Sometimes I think we are more tempted to play chess with people who are hanging on to chess as the keystone that makes sense of the terrifying confusing turbulent existence they are experiencing. It's their sense of security. When you beat them, going to your side is the equivalent of saying they don't matter and their existence is nothing but chaos and bullshit. That's not going to ever be on the table. It's only going to be "win" or "win the next one." And when you see things in that way, you DON'T let go of the game just because you lost a few arguments and couldn't think of the way to prove you're right. You have to start with being immersed in God's love. Being able to understand and comprehend that love using our senses and intellect is just icing on the cake. It's not even important compared to the fundamental graces you need. It's just extra bonus. The chess games will actually be fun once you both lose the delusion that you're fighting for your souls. Trying to understand who the God you both love is by going toe to toe with someone using the gifts He gave you both. That is the right time to play chess. And you won't care if you lose because it will reveal so many beautiful things to you when you do lose. So proper real evangelization that actually matters and will save souls has to revolve around how to love them.

[@littleboots9800]

"Stop trying to take their pieces away." That was such a good analogy, the chess.

[@user-sd6yu1xs4g]

yes, he should have left it at that! don't u think?@@littleboots9800

[@lmuzquiz]

Hello Father Greg!! Could you please do a KZbin episode explaining the difference between ethics and morals? I have listened to or read many explanations on how they differ, but they often seem to converge in practical application. Some argue that ethics refer to societal or communal standards of right and wrong, while morals are personal principles guiding individual behavior. This does not make sense to me. Sometimes I think the word “ethic” is just some sort of euphemism for the word “morals” the term "ethics" might have gained prominence as a way to navigate discussions about right and wrong in a manner that's perceived as less loaded or judgmental than "morals." This could be due to the association of "morals" with personal, religious, or cultural judgments that can sometimes be divisive or controversial in public or diverse settings. In contrast, "ethics" often refers to principles or codes of conduct in specific contexts like professions or organizations, which might be viewed as more neutral or universally applicable. The transition from using "morals" to "ethics" could then be seen as an effort to ban religious thinking on society It would really really really help me because I am troubled with this !!! God Bless

[@thossi09]

Yup. I'm really really bad at articulating my faith or putting up any sort of defence of it in real time. I don't think that detracts from my faith all that much. Sort of like my belief in geography. I believe there are two countries, Uruguay and Paraguay. Without google, I can't tell you which one has a coast and which one is landlocked. There is no way I can prove the existence of either country, apart from actually flying to Argentina and then crossing either border on foot. I probably won't know which border I'm crossing until I'm there.. Same situation with Laos and Cambodia. I must have a defect in my brain, because for the life of me I can't remember which one is landlocked and which one has a coast. Guess I should fly to Thailand and attempt to walk across the border, and then maybe I'll learn the difference.

[@_SYDNA_]

I see history differently. Sometimes the peace of our faith leaves us lazy. History bears some of the strongest witness to faith available today. Anti-believers have just worked harder at mining history than Christians and Christ himself warned that believers can be less aware. Nowadays we are also less invested in community than the Christians of old. So our first instinct is to defer to non-believers in terms of who brings the facts into the argument. We will rise again when we stop treating Christianity as just our personal source of affirmation and rise to seek and speak those historical truths which illustrate the precious blessings laid on our culture by God through the Judeo-Christian hand. Yes, the followers of Satan will scream.

[@kevinkelly2162]

You sound teally sick and hateful. Get well soon.

[@shiny7958]

Judeo-Christian is an oxymoron

[@user-sd6yu1xs4g]

fight for faith or simply your own position?

[@scottmcloughlin4371]

Teach. Teach HOW. Teach HISTORY. Teach PHILOSOPHY. Teach PHILOLOGY. Teach HERMENEUTICS. Do NOT "debate." Real life is not Mexican Wrestling. "Debating" is a waste of time.

[@chipgarcia8534]

Estoy ofendido.

[@avengingme]

"Do not debate with people who do not argue in good faith" is more accurate. Two true believers having a good faith debate about interpretations or meanings of various things is healthy.

[@kevinkelly2162]

I know you know you are wrong but just don't want to be questioned. Weak.

[@scottmcloughlin4371]

That happens VERY RARELY in private far away from microphones and cameras. Here's the KEY REALITY to grasp: MOST Americans raised on TV-English slang DO NOT KNOW what words (and phrases) mean. And here I mean COLLEGE EDUCATED Americans. Often, TV-English phrases are just old (and more recent) advertising slogans and "mean" NOTHING at all. Heroin and arsenic are "plant based" for example. Now imagine fools correlating words like "angel" to winged people in silly paintings (it means messenger) or imagining that "church" (ecclesia) refers to buildings or that "faith" (pistis) refers to "mental states." Americans are in BIG trouble and lack a working vocabulary to "debate about." @@avengingme

[@libertasinveritas3198]

St. Nicholas literally slapped Arius...Not that I'd condone violence, just saying. 😂

[@TCM1231]

:/

[@hailchristandmary]

Day 1 asking Matt Fradd to invite Francis Chan to PWA