Cheating in Video Games & Toxic Fandoms - SimplyPodLogical #65

Shop the new Holo Taco Electric Holos Collection⚡️ + Gradient Dad Hats🧢: holota.co/simplypodelectricholo
On this episode of SimplyPodLogical, Cristine and Ben talk about Dream, Minecraft, cheating at video games, fandoms and the unintended consequences, and how Cristine feels about some of her own fanbase.
0:00 - Hey what’s up holo everyone
3:38 - Cristine is a streamer now
8:00 - Who is Dream?
11:28 - What is Minecraft?
14:22 - How do you cheat at Minecraft?
18:55 - Parallels with the King of Kong
20:52 - Why probability proves he probably cheated
30:59 - Weaponizing your fanbase vs. cheating at video games
33:30 - Are creators responsible for their audiences?
35:49 - Was Simply Nailogical’s fanbase toxic in 2016?
41:57 - Cristine’s comments section before she got popular
45:13 - Creators don’t want fans to spam
52:51 - When did fandoms becomes so promotional?
55:09 - Watch Inside on Netflix (not spons)
The Game Theorists' video on Dream: • Game Theory: Did Dream...
Simply is streaming now over on Simply Not Logical! Join me on Sunday: / simplynotlogical
Ben's secret past as a Donkey Kong record holder: • Donkey Kong, Video Gam...
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©Simply Nailogical Inc. All opinions are our own.

[@alanal3768]

Since you guys and Safiya and Tyler are now doing long form content on Tuesdays, on April Fools day, y’all should switch channels and pretend like everything is perfectly normal

[@melanievanhook9047]

Yes. I love that idea

[@irisarv8333]

That's a great idea!

[@siripunukollu]

That's a great idea

[@bladepanthera]

Got a long time to wait though 😭 I guess we will have forgotten about this by then though haha

[@austincrawford9604]

hahaha good idea

[@lizzyhuffman8892]

At this point, you can expect Cristine and Ben to turn any topic into a deep conversation that you can learn from. Props to you, for someone who doesn't indulge themselves into the gaming world that often, you have really changed my perspective on it.

[@meri9511]

Ok so using mods in the minecraft community isn't an inherently bad thing. Mods can change a lot of things drop percentages (like in the case with dream), adding in new animals and blocks, adding in new mobs(monsters) to defeat, etc. Mods are made to make the game more interesting and the minecraft modding community is large. Most minecraft creators use Mods in some way, most of the time they don't change the game too much, like shaders that make the lighting easier to edit. So the problem isn't with him using mods, it's with him submitting a speed run without disclosing he's using mods that change the game and impact his speed run in such a major way.

[@marmal279]

But wasn't the whole issue that he wasn't aware of the mod impacting drop rates? From what I heard from Karl Jobst (who is investigating this), apparently Dream's mod developer didn't disclose the details of the mod. If I remember correctly, Dream even asked them about the drop rates in October, to which they lied to him about those. They only came clean when Dream asked them *again* in February, apparently since they were afraid of getting fired, which is when Dream then deleted his response video (now knowing he was in the wrong the entire time). And if I understood correctly, the mods were aware of him using the mod, just not aware (like Dream) of what the mod actually impacted.

[@sunrise5710]

Well the issue is using mods in a speedrun that you want to submit, not “not disclosing” it. You can disclose it, you’re just cheating though and it will be immediately rejected. Less of an issue of disclosure and more of an issue of them being installed for a serious run that was submitted for a competitive leaderboard.

[@yesimdead2836]

wasn't the thing that affected the drop rates a plugin and not a mod tho?

[@coelacanth7372]

@@marmal279 genuine question so I hope it doesn’t come off as rude but since he has some knowledge of coding is there a reason why he had to take the word of this person and couldn’t check for himself? Him being misled seems pretty unfortunate if it’s the case

[@sunrise5710]

@@yesimdead2836 I don’t think it was a plug-in because plug-ins are only used on servers I believe, and he was playing on single player worlds Doesn’t really matter anyway, it’s the same effect.

[@Redsammeh]

"People are allowed to have their opinions, I just don't know the value in sharing them all the time" LOL

[@maryread2447]

I'm a fan of Kpop, and most fans actually agree with what with Ben says here, some comments/spamming are not appropiate. But like Cristine says, some fans are very young, they won't even lisen to their own idols. Other fans and even the Korean artists ask to be respectful (most of them are more respectful than occidental artists, in my opinion), but we are talking about millions and millions of fans all around the world, it's impossible every single person is going to listen. On the other hand, kpop fans have done some very possitive things like spaming tags promoted by homophobic groups, disrespectful politicians... making a joke of them. So I guess fandoms and social media have this duality.

[@in_99]

I agree. It kind of makes me sad when people only talk about the negative sides of kpop. There are a lot of problems with the industry in general, but kpop has done soooo much good for the world. People just don’t hear about the good as much as they do the bad. The most extreme voices are always the loudest.

[@anyueda]

I agree. Additionally i don't see the harm of being "used for promotion". Everyone can put as much time and money into something they like as they want. Ofc the artists and the entertainment profit from that and not you directly, but you're happy to see that pay off. No matter if it's a small band getting some posters on the street or a bigger artist getting huge billboards rented out. It all matters as it gives a sense of community of working on a goal together. It just sucks badly when that platform gets misused or when people result in being mean or too much of a show off about it, because then that's what gets seen about the whole project. It's like some people who obviously just donate to show how nice they are but actually they go around being mean to people in real life. It all counts, actions have to match words, things done for love should be only there to spread love. But here we all are again talking about the hate going on in fandoms. It's sad that it will always be there.

[@miZ_dream]

Right! I feel terrible when people make fun of kpop fans because of prejudice. It sucks to know that the loudest part of a fandom is always the most toxic/extreme. And well, I guess it makes sense. These people don't have anything else to do other than ruin people's time, amirite? ;) Fans being promotional is something I don't typically think of. Like yes, fans do so much that some awards are heavily rated with stream/view count (which I absolutely hate, because why not "quality over quantity"???). But on the other hand, these are fans who decided _by themselves_ to stream a video and spend money for the group. They wanted to do this, and so if their group gets some time on TV or an invite to the biggest award shows, that's the prize. The thing they wanted to see happen. (There may be times when you feel incompetent because you aren't streaming or buying merch. DON'T THINK THAT WAY! You being there, supporting the group and actively looking out for them is _enough,_ even if some other "fan" says so.) There's also the conversation about some companies knowing the fandom's power and pushing the group to make the fans want to stick with them more. Like, idk, through ways of "keeping them desirable" and having flirtatious acts occur. I hate that, especially having it so the idols can't date. There'd be fewer toxic fans if they were allowed to :( Alas, we can't change the past, and we can only be glad to see people move forward and care less about an idol's dating life (look at momo and heechul! though there were some comments on their age gap, many were positive and it was basically old news after a few weeks.) *In summary:* Fandoms will never be able to have peace just as the world never can. We try to change the tide by having people hear what's right more often than what's wrong. Still, we just have to seek positivity/growth within ourselves and the ones who will listen and grow along with us.

[@kimdenny7978]

I personally don’t think the spamming homophobic groups is helpful just since they can use it as an excuse to bully more homosexual people for that’s how a lot of groups do it..

[@kimdenny7978]

@@miZ_dream what’s prejudice??

[@LU-qr3kh]

Simply talking about Dream? This podcast is really evolving.

[@Rosytherose]

Yeah👀

[@silvia_3339]

Simply teaches dream how to paint his nails video when?👀 (/hj)

[@sudharanichippada1841]

@@silvia_3339 lmao I would pay to watch that especially cause dream has fingers that are almost the same length

[@almondmelk]

@@sudharanichippada1841 wait what? 😟

[@sudharanichippada1841]

@@almondmelk dream has fingers which are of equal length lol He did this unboxing video where he showed his hands

[@melaniem948]

Fandoms have always been like this. Like the Beatles were literally promoted by their teenage girl fandom. I do think that fan girls understand they work harder than the marketing team and there’s an entire conversation about how exploitative it is.

[@_bebeboudeur_]

A lot of bands are promoted by teenagers girls, whether they act on it or not, and that's why I hate it when grown men say that "they're not real fans" thinking they only like the band because they're sexy or whatever.

[@_bebeboudeur_]

(don't get me wrong, it's not a good look that they're doing all this work for free but I would like people to acknowledge that they are obviously involved and care very much about it all)

[@thespankmyfrank]

People really forget this about all of the "classic" bands and artists. Look at who the biggest fanbases were of The Beatles or Elvis Presley, they're mostly teenage girls. They're what made them so big, and they're still what makes artists big. Teenage girls are powerful, and sadly that's taken advantage of by the companies. I was a young fangirl once myself too, I know what it's like when you want EVERYTHING from your favourite band, because that's what they sell you. It's such a gigantic business.

[@tinapaytinapay]

I'd probably be downvoted anywhere else I post this but even as a kpop fan myself I think the way kpop companies market their idols maximizes the whole parasocial relationship dynamic for profit and its very creepy to me

[@cottencloud5811]

As a fellow kpop fan, I absolutely agree. Parasocial relationships are complicated, and I think it's just really difficult or even impossible sometimes to avoid fans building them with celebrities/influencers, but the active promotion of it makes it more weird to me. The promotion of romantic parasocial relationships is extra gross too (i.e. not allowing idols to date bc it would "ruin the fantasy" for fans, and encouraging flirty type fan service).

[@nacuyong]

and it just shows how creepy and toxic that marketing strategy is when you realize that most kpop idols don’t have the privacy that they deserve, they have a lot of stalkers following them around and if they’re ever caught dating someone they might even be canceled because it ruins the narrative in which they’re marketed. I am a kpop fan myself, that’s how I know how extremely delusional some fans are, no matter the fandom

[@silvia_3339]

I agree with everything the kpop fandom IS something else but remember when justin bieber posted on his main Instagram account one of those fan-made picture threads that are like "how to get yummy to number 1 on che charts. First stream while you sleep...". That was a top pop culture moment imo it was so funny.

[@tinapaytinapay]

@@silvia_3339 it's funny because it was wayyy too blatant and done so badly lol but kpop companies have that to a t, they don't even have to say anything. A lot of kpop fandoms will boost their artists on music platforms on their own initiative

[@silvia_3339]

@@tinapaytinapay yeah exactly fandoms tend to do that on their own and it's kind of normal and expected but when he posted that I lost it. I thought it was a stan account or something.

[@cozie6121]

The crossover we've never expected

[@sudharanichippada1841]

But needed lol

[@unruidodefondo]

But i needed!!! I'm a huge fan of minecraft and simply ToT

[@fanpet3912]

But definitely needed

[@elizabettno3846]

The fact that these sort of hats in my language tend to be referred to as "nail hats" (as in fingernails, not the construction nail), makes it even more fun

[@irisarv8333]

Hahaahha that's pretty ironic. Which is your language?

[@elizabettno3846]

@@irisarv8333 Latvian. It's more like a slang way to say it, but still funny nonetheless 😁

[@irisarv8333]

@@elizabettno3846 That's true

[@kat4t4]

@@elizabettno3846 Man tikko pieleca! Naģene tak 🧢!! 😄

[@elizabettno3846]

@@kat4t4 😁 nav viens no tiem modernākajiem vārdiem

[@marysmith3057]

To be clear, most people who do these kinds of speed runs will actually go before starting and intentionally turn off all mods. Its common for YT who produce this kind of content to run mods sometimes, but also to turn them off for legitimate runs

[@eyesack5735]

TikTok has conditioned me to always assume “yt” means white people so I was so confused at first hahaha.

[@eyesack5735]

I literally had to look up what “yt” stood for when I first saw it on TikTok because I also assumed youtuber. Now I’m obsessed with TikTok so it was the other way around.

[@ivanluke3057]

As someone who regularly enjoys Dream’s content, I definitely think that Dream is a bit too lenient towards his fanbase. Like, he is not directly responsible for the toxic part of his community, but he could’ve handled many of his situations a lot better in many ways.

[@zasherakhan6957]

That’s what I think too

[@silvia_3339]

Strongly agree on this one. I'd like to add that maybe he's so lenient bcs he's had hyperfixations and has been a "stan" himself so ig he's more likely to sympathise with the more "obsessed" fans. However it is noticeable that he's trying his best to prevent his fans from sending hate and constantly saying if you do that you're "no fan of his" but with such a large fanbase, most of which I imagine is pretty young, fans sending hate is inescapable.

[@meb1411]

I agree however how do you expect one man to control almost 20 million people. Seems pretty difficult

[@daria8950]

@@meb1411 well firstly by not encouraging it, how about that

[@agneg3135]

I mostly agree, just don't know how he could handle it better. Maybe you have some examples?

[@linmax300]

As someone who considers/considered themselves a “Kpop Stan,” I’d like to explain a lot of stans get annoyed with those people who act inappropriate/share fancams in threads that aren’t appropriate too. Many fans can be embarrassing and I wish that individual fan could be held responsible rather than the entire Kpop community (bc there are so many different kinds of people from all sorts of backgrounds across the globe in the Kpop community-we all have very different beliefs, but happen to enjoy similar artists!) As for idols/groups being held responsible for those fans, Kpop entertainment groups do a really good job at promoting their idols to create these huge, incredibly powerful fanbases. But the idols have very little control over what they can say or do because they’re tied to such strict contracts. I’m definitely not saying they shouldn’t take responsibility for their fans/not controlling their fans (several idols have owned up to their past mistakes) however, I’m saying it’s mot really an option (currently) for them to “control their fans” because their companies are the puppet masters. Hopefully that all makes sense? And Kpop is evolving, it’s slow progress, but every year more and more idols/fans speak out about issues that are close to their hearts or haven’t been (but need to be) addressed.

[@ktea7297]

This is the exact point I was hoping someone would bring up! Well said!

[@katyb2793]

I saw these random comments on an audio book channel that quite frankly has mostly older people listening. I just couldn't help myself, so I replied 'huh? Behind the scenes?' No reply. 😂

[@hp5682]

I have been listening to k-pop for ten years and sometimes I want to go back to that time when everything was calmer because we were just a few international fans. I just get so embarrassed when other k-pop stans do that and when they get called out, they say "you are xenophobic" wtf??? The biggest youtuber in Spain actually called out that behaviour, so they just called him xenophobic like wtf??? They should stop using that word and "racist" for everything, they are taking the importance from them.

[@LuccaPassos_]

I think it's also very important to say that Dream IS a programmer who makes plugins (similar to mods) for minecraft. I meann it's not like he's not knowledgeable

[@AntonioOliveira-ed5yt]

I don't know if I'm crazy or not, but are you brazilian?

[@entername2027]

me after watching 2 hours of mine craft content while playing mine craft i see it on christines channel i can’t escape it

[@marieleelee]

Wait but I find it so distracting to play minecraft AND watch minecraft content. I confuse the content noise for noise that's actually happening in my world lol many a time I've gotten scared by creepers that weren't even in my game lol

[@sudharanichippada1841]

@@marieleelee lmao a fake jumpscare is really the worst

[@YouTubeSupportSucks]

Cristine*

[@entername2027]

@@marieleelee me to lol

[@gemmaleitz9836]

I was literally watching this while my daughter (who got me hooked on Simply) was playing Minecraft! I feel like I may have entered the Twilight Zone . . .

[@lila2793]

Ben looks like a dad in the hats, but Cristine give me like, New Jersey millennial vibes but in the best way. Love the hats.

[@GarliccDread]

I'm 31 from Passaic County and honestly? Yes lol

[@amac0190]

Middlesex County checking in. This is correct...

[@avantikashaha7959]

Mercer county here and... yeah...

[@LydiaR418]

Is it the hoops? Lol

[@avantikashaha7959]

@@LydiaR418 Hoops, hat, and athletic wear? Not a uniform, but you will see this all over Jersey.

[@TGolemo94]

A plug-in is literally a server mod. He was using a modified version of the game, so Ben calling it a mod is technically correct.

[@lillerr]

plug-ins don't affect single player though which was where he was speedrunning--mods do. i believe dream has stated that the mod (that was supposed to be only cosmetic) included what the server-side plug-in was supposed to do, which is probably where the confusion comes from. it was definitely a mod.

[@snail_smoothie2314]

Yeah as a dream fan I think one of his main downfalls is to impulsively react defensively when people accuse him of things but I'd hope he continues to be more conscious of that and tries to be better lol

[@silentprincess6478]

I agree, he does that a lot in manhunt videos at the very end or during among us. Yknow the way he rapidly speaks like his brain is going a mile a minute. He’s a smart guy and I think his brain is just always going so he forgets about certain social ques when defending his honor or whatever so he ends up offending people. It’s something he needs to work on

[@melanieschwarz2181]

I think that he’ll learn as he gets older how to reflect on what he does before automatically defending himself :)

[@snail_smoothie2314]

@@melanieschwarz2181 yeah I agreee

[@marieleelee]

Speedrunning Minecraft definitely takes skill BUT it also takes a lot of luck. I don't think anyone is denying that either. But the speedrunning community values the honesty and effort it takes to get on that leaderboard. What Dream did wasn't cool to them. It was a bit of a slight to the people who spend hundreds of hours basically JUST doing speedrunning. But Minecraft is more than that and I think the clash between people who don't see what the big deal about speedrunning is and people who do is what is creating a lot of the toxicity. It's exhausting.

[@Marnige]

I agree, but i also can't help notice the amount of people hating on him just because of how popular he became. It was like many people are sick of hearing his name. Many people mentioned 'dream stans' and many things that really don't show their care for the speedrunning community, but just hating on dream. Note that he also mentioned that the paper written by the moderators had aggressive tone and he also had some history with them i think. So based on how everyone just hated him because he was popular, i think it was understandable that he thought everyone just hated him which is why they think he cheated. I blame his mistakes due to little experience of being a large creator.

[@michellelee8933]

@@Marnige i think you’re very right on the comment of “hating him cos hes popular”. You see, I dont hate or love him, but as someone who knows nothing nor hv seen any content of dream (therefore my opinions invalid), my feeling bout him def lean more towards the negative side. It’s just like jenovahs witness knocking on your door and armys of bts taking up every single comment sections, it gets annoying when someone shove things up your ass. As youve said, for the young Dream to take this fact as the determining factor make a lot of sense.

[@margett__]

I eat several tubs of hummus a day, wear holo on my nails, love video games and have absolutely nothing against staying at home for another decade wearing my comfy pj pants all day every day. How am I not your lost 23-year old child? I don't understand. Maybe I am...?

[@benedictdwyer2608]

WHY DO YOU EAT SO MUCH HUMMUS HUMMUS SUCKSSS!!!

[@glittery_cucumber]

Hummus is amazing

[@purrsndplants5444]

@@benedictdwyer2608 homemade hummus is the best! Have you tried?

[@wayneessar7489]

Please ask them to adopt you!

[@benedictdwyer2608]

@@purrsndplants5444 not homemade!

[@mai_komagata]

I would argue that randomness mixed with skill is an important part of speedrunning -- it requires not just skill one time, but consistent skill over many runs so that when you *do* get that good luck, you are able to pull off the same high level of skill.

[@loveliestlies]

Right! There's no question that there's definitely some skill to it, because if there weren't, then I'd be able to hold a world record if I got lucky enough. But I can't, because I am not skilled in speed running, I'm focused on other areas of the game.

[@imadrawer9721]

Soooo...when's the Minecraft playthrough coming out? 👀

[@ozge5948]

as an 26 year old adult with a full time job (an MD to be exact) and also with an active fandom account i can say i agree most of your points. it can become unhealthy really quick but the examples you see all the time are the bad apples in fandoms that you mentioned in the beginning. unfortunately the loudest parts of kpop/bts communities are the ones who promotes under everything or spams dance cams or whatever. they are definitely minority but they are way way way too loud so people only see them and come to conclusion that yep that's what a fan of this artist do 🤷🏻‍♀️. i wish i somehow could show you what a peaceful, excited and fun of an experience i am having being a part of fandom

[@mar8408]

you are so right! the toxic minority is always louder than most of us, ive been a fan since 2017 and its mostly uneducated people that are toxic. but I really hate that everyone points at bts/kpop for an example of toxic behavior in fandoms, we have youtubers, other artists (taylor, ariana, kanye, etc), even series/books have toxic fanbases, its not like we are the whole toxic portion of the Internet lol.

[@jenunboxed512]

I love that you guys engage in conversations about online "stuff" in general---it's a reminder that people can be interested in the stories or workings of other topics outside of their own day-to day without necessarily being 100% invested in that topic.

[@valeriavagapova]

I gasped at the 20M subscribers part, never ever heard of the guy before, wow

[@nocturnalizzie]

I wish I'd never heard of him, lol. Every time I check the trending page on Twitter, there's at least one stupid thing trending because of Dream or one of the other big Minecraft streamers he's friends with. Drives me bonkers! It's like the K-pop spammers all over again..

[@tanyatanya5113]

@@nocturnalizzie there is a “not interested in this” button, you know right 😳

[@nocturnalizzie]

@@tanyatanya5113 I click that *every time* and it does nothing. Twitter is convinced that I am desperate to see every trend involving Ranboo, Quackity, Dream, and the other guys I'm forgetting. I've muted them and their usernames and that hasn't helped, either.

[@celehry]

@@nocturnalizzie it’s a trending page bro there’s constant stuff that trends that aren’t specifically catered towards people’s interests you know what most people do ignore them and if it affects you that badly don’t ever click on them and mute the words but that is kind of odd the words you mute don’t work? i don’t have that problem

[@nocturnalizzie]

@@celehry The "for you" section of trending should at least try to tailor itself to what I interact with on Twitter, no? :| It's really annoying to notice a thing is trending, click on it with hopes of seeing something mildly interesting, and instead just see a wall of tweets from Minecraft streamer fan accounts yelling "DREAM SAID THIS THING!!!" so frequently.

[@kerricacavio6669]

I love what you've shared on the topic of fandoms being promotional. As someone who started getting into a kpop group, every time I see a post about votings/streamings, I somehow feel obligated to participate to prove that I'm a fan. However, it can get really exhausting and just takes the joy out of simply enjoying their music/content, so I do try to pace/limit myself. Nevertheless, I genuinely respect and appreciate those who dedicate their time and effort to obtain great achievements for the idols they love, because I do understand the publicity that such activities bring about too.

[@mitchellee88]

yes! never thought abt it until ben and cristine brought it up but it’s interesting how it’s almost a given to say “stream *insert song*” or tell ppl to vote when ur a kpop fan

[@ozge5948]

i understand to an extent that fans trying to do all they can to give their idols a fair chance to success since world is not fair with all those xenophobia and racism, especially in music industry. but yeah it can become tiring real quick...balance is really important and at the end of the day enjoying the experience is the most important thing

[@silentprincess6478]

I got into kpop about five years ago and I remember all the guilt certain fans would put out about streaming or buying bundles of albums. It used to make me feel guilty but I had no time for streaming or the money to splurge so I never did it. I was just there for the idols music and personality yknow? I can get why streaming and stuff is important cuz you wanna do it for the idols but the guilt tripping is truly awful. Just because someone can’t do it or doesn’t want to stream doesn’t make them a fake fan.

[@nebulamachine]

That's why I never claim to be a kpop fan. I do listen to k-pop but that kind of culture sucks out the fun from it

[@franciscariveramartinez]

Whenever i feel kinda guilty about that kind of stuff (specially between my fandom because we're known to be lazy), i just think about the fact that once you close your laptop, block your phone or go to bed none of that will matter... Sure, views and streaming help the artist but is it really that way? We're just helping big corporations to get money (yes a percentage will go to the artist), but at the end of the day it shouldn't be that deep, its just music

[@vigneshnehru9822]

Me: sees notification for podcast and clicks it Ben: Holo super simps! Me:YES NOW THAT'S HOW WE START A PODCAST! I'M A SUPER SIMP DAMMIT!!! Edit: Thanks for the likes! Stay safe 😁

[@seraphiene626]

Nothing wrong about that. 👍

[@vigneshnehru9822]

@@seraphiene626 lmfao

[@cadancekerber1050]

You know what would be cool merch? A denim jacket with the gradient and maybe some holo accents... yes that sounds fantastic.

[@ZilaidaK]

The hats themselves are $25, do you know how expensive a denim jacket would be? 😭

[@cadancekerber1050]

@@ZilaidaK True, but as a Canadian staple, it would make me really happy. I think I might go for a $200(CAD) holo themed jacket. 🤔

[@theclaypixie]

Cristine’s little blushing on her neck is so cute when she’s obviously talking about things that make her uncomfortable. 🥺 As a fellow person who blushes intensely in the face when I’m nervous or speaking to a group, I appreciate her relatability. ❤️ Thank you for being vulnerable with us Cristine. ❤️❤️

[@noeyyang38]

About the inside special: personally, being a fan of Bo’s work, he is known for doing dark honest comedy. This special to me spoke to the hard working side of me that I discovered this quarantine. I learned I needed adhd meds and taking those meds helped me focus on my work and become more successful. While watching the special I related the most to the burn out Bo felt, and some of his frustration, it clicked with me that I felt less alone because what I was dealing with felt so foreign I was sure I was the only person going through it. Hearing other people thoughts on the special I felt at ease that I wasn’t the only one feeling this huge burnout with work, and relationships. Anyways those were MY personal thoughts on the special loved the podcast

[@sijaknorpp4597]

It’s so funny to see them try to explain Minecraft without having grown up with it 😂😂

[@kkiirrii]

I forget that some people don't even know the basic premise cause I've played it for like almost 10 years lmao

[@yarnandleaves9378]

I love the comment section on SimplyPodLogical videos tbh. People seem to actually put some effort into their comments here and try to present their thoughts in a really balanced and considerate way. Must be Ben's and Cristine's good influence on us. Thanks Simply Parents! (I am very close to their age but they just give off such a strong wise parent vibe)

[@hyacinthannah]

I agree! I absolutely love reading all the thoughtful, well-articulated ideas that people have to share! I also love how people are able to disagree with some points and offer their own perspectives on topics in a way that usually doesn't feel mean or overly combative. I like hearing when people disagree when they do so thoughtfully.

[@jbtfp]

right?? i’ve heard so many new perspectives on this channel and i love them all, regardless of whether i agree or not. and also the fact that there aren’t just fucking bots everywhere.

[@maryama.moarmy2093]

To add a different perspective to those fans that promote their artists and stuff, in many cases it could just be about showing appreciation for your favorite artist when other options are unavailable to you. For example, as a BTS fan, I enjoy their content and it brings me happiness but I am unable to show support in monetary way by buying their albums or merch or anything, so I try to get them online achievements and promote them to others. Although, in many cases where those kpop fancams under Twitter posts are insensitive or being spammed everywhere, the objective is less about promoting their favorite artists and more competitive, trying to get as many views as possible on those videos as they autoplay under hit tweets. Many people simply do it to annoy others too

[@CasShadows]

I’m not invested in Dream, speedrunning, or Minecraft on a competitive level but I feel like he should have known using this modified version would have disqualified for a WR. I thoroughly enjoy mods and plugins to help the game along and bring interesting twists to the game. However, these should not have been used in a speed run. Vanilla means vanilla, not vanilla plus a couple of plugins. I think the biggest problem though is he lied, especially since he has such a large impressionable following.

[@raegreene4793]

Yeah I agree but I also think it’s important to understand that they are human, Dream didn’t have to tell people that he did cheat! Whether you believe he was trying to be apologetic or not is up to you. And you how you view those things, personal I don’t care I never watched his speed runs however I have friends who deeply care because they felt the integrity of there speedruns were comprised. (But everyone I’ve talked to said that the standard has actually changed for the better and there thankfully for that!) I believe both sides handle it poorly in the sense why did the mods feel like posting it publicly was a way to go I don’t know if this is what happened but why couldn’t they handle it in private? Both sides imo handled it poorly and I just hope for now on things are changing for the better.

[@bect9439]

Regarding the "using fandoms for advertising" thing... To me, it seems like this has always been the case, it's just that people's reach is different due to the internet. Word of mouth is how people find out about good restaurants, people recommend music to their friends, etc. I was into kpop before it exploded in the west, and I remember back in 2008 or so trying to convince my friends at sleepovers to pull up KZbin so they could enjoy it too. I think the obnoxious fandom thing is basically just... Obsessive interests from kids and teens, which has always happened, along with access to a much larger audience. I could only pester my friends back when I was 13-16, because I didn't often use / have access to the internet. So while I think it's beneficial for record companies, artists, influencers, etc to have fans bring awareness to their brand, I also think fans would do it regardless of what the brand wants. I don't think it's fair to say that it's uncomfy that brands use this to their advantage, because it makes it seem sinister, and while it can be, in most cases it's just natural fan reactions. Brands have always capitalized on word of mouth and fans bringing awareness. When I was a young teen I tried to force my friends into trying kpop since I enjoyed it so much, and I think an awful lot of young fans today are trying to do the same. It's also a way that people meet others with a similar range of interests. Tumblr was the first social media site I used, and when I saw kpop reaction gifs or references in responses to posts in other areas of interest to me, I knew that I could look at that person's blog and potentially find someone with very similar interests. It's how I found a lot of my online friends. These days I can see how it would be annoying, but at that age, many of the people I met did it as a sort of calling card to show their interests to find more users with similar interests.

[@_bebeboudeur_]

I totally see your point, at school, I borrowed my friend's ipod and listened to all the rock bands she liked then we went to a concert together because I liked one specific band and became more involved in their music and fanbase than even her :')

[@Alex-ji7wn]

I hope simplypodlogical encourages people to actually think through things, I don't think anything annoys me more than people who have an opinion they haven't thought through and have no evidence for a proper debate.

[@CactusMuffin]

Gold Star

[@lizzyhuffman8892]

To Think It All Started By Teaching Streamers How To Do Nail Polish :)

[@heather_]

No Ben haircut needed during editing today then ig ;)

[@londonmellow]

being a "kpop stan" - ive noticed stans are like that cause the companies always push numbers and charts and everyone just rides on that - constantly. the idols however are rarely allowed to say something against the fandoms behaviour so we just ride this toxic train.

[@imadrawer9721]

LAST TIME I WAS SO SHOCKED WHEN YOU MENTIOND KARL JACOBS AND NOW THIS

[@mia.reyyyy]

simply and ben: "promoting something you like is unhealthy" also simply and ben: "WATCH INSIDE ON NETFLIX NOT SPONS"

[@wolfrynmothercosplay1769]

My boyfriend LOVES the orange hat but he's worried it won't be big enough for his giant head 🤣 I'm going to have him try on mine and if it fits I'm going to buy him one lol

[@008i800]

Something about your podcasts seem so calming...it helps me sleep. And then I watch it again in the morning when I wake up. Keep up the good work!

[@pewpandagamermom]

First BEEYYYYYYN malfunctions at the opening, and then Cristine has this gem of a sentence: " the most excited item you are for" Guys, take a vacation lol

[@kristelstarlinnelllord4929]

I think people also take the fact that he's faceless for granted, and it makes home easier to persecute, because at the end of the day he's like 20 or 21. He is not that old and he's absolutely bond to make mistakes. The difference is people see him as an entity instead of a person

[@beatm6948]

Yeah. I really think he just needs help from others. Similar to Mr Beast, he's young, and needs other people who have knowledge.

[@mckennareeves2764]

As both a dsmp and simply fan I’m very excited for this episode

[@birdseyechilis8772]

Want to chime in on the discsussion, esp on the topic discussed towards the ending about fanpage (mostly kpop) and whatnots, apologies in advance my english is not that great as it is not my first language. For one, I do agree that if a fan is posting it on places that is inappropriate (i.e. unrelated to the idol at all, on a tweet about a tragic news) that behaviour would be considered toxic and as role models, idols should at least recognize and discourage the issue if it is appearing more commonly. But at the same time, I disagree with Ben's statement that if someone use kpop as their persona online is "unhappy" or "unsatisfied with their life" (pardon if I intrepret it incorrectly). I personally think that if they do it on other people's content (such as in comments/twitter threads) doing it too much would be very annoying for the creator and of course shows a sense of unawareness of certain social context. But if they're doing it on their own profile/page, I don't think that we could just generalize them as unhappy with their real physical life. For me it's just meant that they are passionate about it, maybe it's the only personal facts about them that they are willing to indulge publicly, maybe in that account they connect with fellow members of the fandom or maybe you're seeing someone's 2nd account that they intentionally made only for kpop stuf. But I think more importantly, within the parameter that they are in their own account and not directly harrassing other people, they are probably just doing what makes them happy and I don't see anything necessarily wrong about that. Extreme parasocial relationship with public figure could be dangerous ofc, but for the most part it is someone liking an artist and expressing their love, there's nothing wrong with that. Although I don't think it's what Ben intended, but this discussion could be expanded further to the general statement of: judging people for liking something is never cool, unless it's something truly horrific. Esp in terms of KPop although yes I do agree with some arguments of using them for marketing or like extreme fangirl/boying, I really dislike how their boom also in a way spark a new stigma from people and more generally the culture of like judging people based on a certain (non dangerous/violent/-ism of domination) preferences such as music/hobbies. TL;DR if they are harming others/on something irrelevant, it's not okay and in extreme cases should be highly discouraged. If they're not and it's on their own page, let em be. For context, I personally don't really care much about Kpop but I have close friends and family members who really do and I would admit that I have some bias towards it bcs I have seen how it could really have a positive impact on someone. I don't really get it, but hey it makes them happy so I am happy for them. Plus I'm Indonesian and Kpop has been prevalent for a while here so it's not much of a "boom" for me personally so I always kind of been icked out by how some people respond to this. Wow that's a long one, love how this podcast stimulate critical thinking when it's 1 AM and I'm trying to sleep for a 7.30 class. Lov the podcast as always and happy taco tuesday everyone!

[@beatm6948]

I agree that obsessive stans have some void they are trying to fill. Non obsessive fans are a case by case basis.

[@Solstice_539]

Also Matt Parker made a really good video about the statistics, it's kinda math heavy but I recommend watching it if you want to know more.

[@cece_marie]

Was going to recommend this as well! it's a well-made video, accessible, and funny. (I love my personal crossover between Simply and Standup Math/Numberphile/3B1B/etc via Ben's brother, Matt)

[@CarbonBondedBooks]

I would love to watch Ben and Cristine play "It Takes Two" my boyfriend and I are playing it now and are having so much fun!!

[@metalfortanks]

Agreed! It's a great game. Would make for nice, long form streams over time.

[@CarbonBondedBooks]

@@metalfortanks yeah, and my boyfriend and I are very casual gamers and nothing has been frustratingly difficult yet 😂

[@flic9393]

Yes this would be so cool!! I hope they try it out

[@yamicout2]

Ben: "Whats on my OTHER HEAD?" I´M DEAD

[@AleinAki]

This was very briefly mentioned & I never comment but I think it's worth it to point out that the fandom environment in the "kpop" sphere (i put kpop in quotation marks because we're still talking about various different artists with different fanbases & backgrounds) is the way it is for complex reasons as well, aside from the trolling posts done on tragic news tweets by burner accounts & very obvious non-fan accounts, the culture of pushing the artists you like into visibility makes sense in the context of these artists debuting in such an oversaturated market, they kind of need that push, it might be annoying to some but i don't think it's inherently evil or toxic in the way that a lot of people portray it. For example, a lot of people know bts as a huge act that's constantly getting active support & push from their fandom but lack a genuine understanding of their background, history & fanbase, they're an 8 year old group that started in a tiny, not well funded company in south Korea & they were able to still navigate the Korean music industry & grow by fan support mostly, when you're talking about artists like them, who are pushing their way through something like the music industry in general (& its well known uneven playing field) with mostly only their music & work ethic, you're going to need that kind of fan support, more so when taking into account the way that the western music industry treats non-english speaking poc acts, they *need* people in their corner & if you have a fandom that cares enough about your craft & connects enough with your art to independently look for ways to support & push you/your music forward, I think that's a good thing, not a toxic example of fandom or fandom exploitation by the artists. The promotional tactics you see a lot of people engage with are fan driven efforts started by people who connected with their favorite artists music & therefore wanted it to reach other people as well & ofc the artists & their labels appreciate that, we know. I understand that toxicity exists with some specific ways in which people will try to push an artist & that emotionally manipulative dynamics can also develop when artists don't set boundaries or have respect for their fans but that doesn't make active fandom support & promotion inherently bad. Ig all I really wanted to say is, hey, fandoms aren't anonymous monolithical blobs of people who don't understand what's going & you guys seemed to talk about them with that much nuance for most of the podcast until the end, I think that this way of looking at & judging fandoms & the people in them when you don't really know much about them, nor understand the dynamics inside the community, between fans or between fan & artist, & talking about them like they're a bunch of mindless followers being manipulated & strung along with no real sense of what's happening, is very reductive & insulting? There's just a lot of assumptions going on here, please don't do that, like really, please don't, it's so unnecessarily demeaning & not very productive if you actually want to understand what's happening there.

[@lindseysg]

you put everything i wanted to say into words omg

[@creativityjune3591]

As another kpop fan I thought this was a well written response!

[@nnnspa1]

Love your comment! Very insightful and respectful.

[@brybita]

As an ARMY I appreciate this because when ppl use Kpop when they probably just know/mean BTS and they think that these terms are interchangeable, they definitely don't know the context behind the fans and the artists (talking about BTS only cuz I am only an ARMY, but hey, it probably applies to other artists too)

[@danielaandreasalazarpinzon936]

I'm just gonna say that promotions are everywhere. When youtubers say share, like, comment ... isn't that just another form of promotion?? ... less organically because its asked for. I just feel sometimes people in general feel kpop fans are a new kind of "promotions and boots behaviour" but I feel they are just more inclained to share, like and post because they want and love something in particular. I do understand sometimes is anoying and really insesible and out of context but I don't like that particular narrative because its really polaraizing and stimatizing. I don't see this much energy being look down on other kind of fandoms more normalized than kpop. sports for example.

[@TheEliseRodgers]

If the current technology had existed in the 1990s, it would have been American Boy Bands in this kPop story. …actually, as a 30 year old, I think that even with what tech did exist in the 90s, Boy Band fans were also known for acting similarly. And we know that the studios encouraged the behavior in fans & kept the bands in very tight - and secluded - contracts. TL;DR - I think you’re right about kPop fans, particularly as this isn’t something we haven’t seen in similar situations, historically.

[@Terrestriellie]

Loving the dad caps, now you guys are really our parents

[@sheescapesreality4683]

1:53 Zyler is so handsome, the camera couldn't help shift focus ❤

[@mcpossum]

I think HoloTaco should bring back the Holo it's me shirts. They were never in stock in my size when ever you use to reup merch

[@nataliavalenciacastro5055]

Honestly, Inside to me felt completely different from you Cristine: it felt a lot like a self reflection on depression, anxiety, spiraling and many other mental health issues that got aggravated by self isolating in quarantine. It's extremely interesting to see how many different takes you can have on the special depending on your experiences. After listening to what you said, I can relate to that too... We've all become content creators whether we like it or not.

[@_bebeboudeur_]

I've got the same ideas out of it, because people at university weren't always the most empathetic about mental health issues and it really got to a point where most of them went through the stuff I've been dealing with for years. Now they kinda understand I guess

[@christymartinez9701]

Hi, I love the podcast and I love watching you two. In regards to the fancam k-pop idol stuff, I agree that the posting of fancams can be annoying and done in extremely inappropriate circumstances, however I have never seen any k-pop group encourage such behavior. I'm most familiar with BTS and I have never seen any of the members ever tell fans to try and promote their popularity with fancams. Like you mentioned, they are popular and there is going to be toxic people in the k-pop community. It does not mean that the idols are promoting that kind of behavior.

[@beatm6948]

In fact, they are the ones who kinda suffer from it. Shipping, stalkers, controlling behaviour. They might be a bit of the problem, but rarely. Taehyung has said MULTIPLE times to not ship Taekook (though a good friendSHIP is fine), but do the shippers listen? No, no they do not. There is RARELY a kpop idol who encourages this stuff, and if they speak on it, it is almost always from a standpoint of being hurt.

[@brybita]

And I'm gonna chime in here and tell you that ppl come and blame ARMYs for spamming when a lot of the times they just assume any bg is BTS when a lot of the times it's not even a BTS fancam cuz that's not encouraged at all at least on my TL on Twitter

[@peachxtaehyung]

46:10 im a kpop fan and yes we always try to hold those people responsible not only to honor the person who passed away etc but to honor and not bring a bad name to us or our favorite group(s)... unfortunately alot dont care. But also i want to point out that while its alot of people who do that its not a big issue in our community because we have sooo many people in it and so we almost always only see the good in our community. Its only a very small minority despite what it seems like lol. And also the groups themselves usually couldnt speak on the toxicity even if they know about it and want to. Because not only could that potentially really damage their popularity but they would get ALOT more hate than they do already because they would be looked at like they dont appreciate what fans they have or something. Also theres some companies that dont allow their artists to speak on things like that anyways

[@christinado4776]

YES! I 100% agree with this!

[@Mona-ch1yt]

"Minecraft? I don't watch that." iconic, Cristine, iconic

[@Katniss777]

as a fan of dream i can say: he still has a lot to learn in the way he responds to criticism. i am glad that the speedrunning controversy is over now. i like him for his personality and how his content makes me forget about my troubles for a short time :)

[@cinnamonfairyfluff]

YES. I agree, as a fellow Dream fan. He needs to work on handling criticism better, as well as hate. He's very quick to respond and quick to deny, rather than thinking his thoughts through. I have ADHD, like he does, so I can relate to the struggle of having a lot of pent up thoughts that come out with no filter. Since he's got a platform, it's sooo important that he gets that under control. Still, I imagine it's hard to stay cool headed when there's huge groups of people who are consistently and relentlessly hating on you and trying to doxx you. I imagine his hostility towards criticism has a lot to do with the downpour of hate he receives. It'd be hard to decipher hate from criticism in an environment where everybody is overly critical of you.

[@raegreene4793]

I feel the same!!!

[@raegreene4793]

@@cinnamonfairyfluff I’m the same!!! It’s not something I feel you can control b ut I believe it’s something you can grow through if that makes sense!

[@Marnige]

@@cinnamonfairyfluff you mentioned a great point. Its because of his influence, he needs to know better. I reckon its because of how fast his channel had grown, he has no time to catch up on his influence. Its a new thing for him and he probably didn't realise how important it is for him to be morr careful now than a few months ago.

[@hayleywagner6077]

Re: Bo's special: What I found relatable about "Inside", to someone who is not a content creator, is that we are all performing online. No one is completely authentic online and we all curate a persona for our social media accounts. On top of that, experiencing mental health issues or mental illness, especially during quarantine, was/is hard. You feel alone, isolated, and worried that what you feel won't go away. Bo bared his soul for us, and it reflected the fact that we are all human, we are all experiencing life on the internet, and we all struggle. It was profound, funny, sad, and I absolutely loved it.

[@sofi.leeeee]

definitely was not expecting this crossover!! Minecraft speedrunning, though it very largely relies on luck, some of it requires skill. You could be the luckiest person in the world and still not get a world record because you need more than a basic knowledge of the game. Also I think that while its pretty evident that he cheated, his defense of himself was not completely baseless, as people on the moderator team openly hated him. In other words, he had reason to believe that the claims of him cheating weren't real and "for clout". Anyways this was kind of a mini rant, loved this podcast and I thought that your perspectives were lovely, considering the amount of straight up hate that the Minecraft community gets. :)

[@crimsonnin2]

There's also seeded vs seedless runs, with seeded probably being more similar to the kind of speedrun Ben is familiar with, with a set route and strategy and so on

[@daria8950]

Even if they hated him, that's not the way he should've resolved things. Very immature of his end.

[@geekwitchnails]

I hope they bring back the, "Holo it's me" shirts

[@crimsonfarina7097]

so as someone that is invested in the minecraft community the thing is that it’s more complicated than him just having a mod. he was using a plug in. when someone uses a mod it’s very clear from when you load up the game. plug ins run entirely in the background. he said that these plug-ins were initially installed on his server game play and they were meant to be installed on his single player worlds. also he had hired someone to create these plug ins and he himself didn’t install them beforehand. most minecraft content creators use plug ins to make the game play easier to watch and helps with youtube compression and they’re allowed in the speed runs. so it is reasonable that he could not know. however it seems like he just didn’t die his due diligence to make sure he was doing legit runs

[@katgirlofthenight]

As a K-pop fan, I take mild offense to Ben's generalizing of fancams/spammers on Twitter and socials. I know there are people who post a lot of content, or who overuse tags and try to get higher visibility for their comments. But I also personally suspect there are a number of trolls on social media who capitalize on the dislike people have for K-pop fans, or ARMY specifically. Like the example of a traumatic news story having fancams in the comments; I would privately assume those posts are made by trolls intentionally trying to give K-pop fans a bad name, and not the fans honestly trying to spread visibility of their artist. Considering how much ARMY tries to do positively, whether it's donations or supportive comments about mental health, I can't see the majority of those fans thinking it's acceptable to post K-pop content on unrelated or sensitive topics, except for hijacking racist/sexist/etc tags and drowning out the negativity.

[@brybita]

Specially when it's not even a BTS fancam (which I'm telling you is the VAST MAJORITY), that to me as an ARMY is such a blatant obvious troll

[@imadrawer9721]

I SAW THIS AND CLICKED SO FAST

[@jmac3061]

Me too yayaya!!!

[@sunrise2160]

I honestly respect everything you said about the situation, but the part about Dream cultivating his fans to attack the moderators just a little bit incorrect, you might not have seen it but Dream makes sure to constantly constantly tell his fans not send hate to anyone no matter how awful they were to him and he always say if you send hate you are not a fan of mine, so yes there is a part of the fandom who is toxic but you cant blame him for it especially when he keeps saying not to get mad on his behalf, and for the part where he attacked the moderators at the time Dream genuinely thought he wasn’t cheating so imagine how you would react to someone accusing you of cheating while you are so sure of yourself, yeah its not right of him but everyone gets mad sometimes and make mistakes at least in Dream case he apologized for it multiple times. I really enjoyed watching this episode it was cool to see the outside perspective of someone who is not biased.

[@loveliestlies]

Exactly, I wish they put themselves in his shoes. He does always tell people not to send hate.

[@sapnap9003]

Or he does it knowing that his fan base will defend him more and attack and harass others to a greater extent, if he tells his fan base not to do it. It’s just like kids doing the opposite of what they r being told to do. Dream knew exactly what he was doing.

[@sunrise2160]

@@sapnap9003 huh ? so you’re saying what ? he should’ve said nothing and let them send hate ? Or told them to send hate ? I- ? And if they are going to send hate anyway how is it dreams fault then ? He did what he had to do and more its not like he can go to every single fan and stop them, you are asking and expecting too much of a single human being, all he did was defend himself of something that can be extremely damaging to his career, anyone in his shoes would’ve done the same or probably worse tbh

[@justwalkingby3882]

There's a video of him live on stream disliking a vid someone analyzing his runs. ONLY THEN, did he remove the dislike and tell his stans not to send hate, what kind of role model does that make him

[@sunrise2160]

@@justwalkingby3882 oh no he disliked a video talking shit about him what will we ever do, And you said it once he realized it was on stream he removed it and told then to not send hate, if he purposefully want to condone this actions he would’ve disliked it on stream and not take it back and care that we dont send hate to the video owner, again Dream is doing the best and individual human being can do, if you want to believe he is a bad person you clearly dont know enough about him and I’m clearly not gonna change your mind so let us leave it at that.

[@katmaniakat]

I loved that you mentioned Bo's special, I'm totally obsessed with it from the moment I saw it. To me, that special was mostly about anxiety, overcoming that anxiety and anxiety driven creativity. He speaks openly about his mental struggles, but to me that being "locked down" in a room because of the pandemic is just an example how a person with anxiety feels stuck in his/her own head with all those thoughts "all of the time". Maybe that's a stretch to interpret it that way, but I feel that is a powerful metaphor. And overall I am just so impressed by Bo, starting as a bullied kid, stuck in his room with a piano and youtube and now coming full circle, be brave to stand on his own for what he creates, be able to come back after the mental breakdown he had. Also, I felt such a relief seeing him back, I was worried that after "make happy" his comedian/songwriting career was really over. But he powered through despite all this, showed us that you can be vulnerable and still be powerful and impactful. Sorry for the rant - I always Iook forward to listening to all Taco Tuesdays, no matter the subject, but it is just so cool when I can relate to things you and I both enjoy like Bo's work :)

[@urmom1603]

Dreams mod that got him into this mess was because he got someone to make mods/plug-in and his excuse was that he didnt know that this mod creator put a drop enhancer on the mod used to up the quality of the stream. Mods and plugins are commonly used when streaming and playing in general for these streamers. He checked his mods but didnt realise what was in the mod.

[@Naluvaz]

Finally someone speaking calmly and reflectively! I get really put off other podcasts because of the high energy they're on while discussing. Thanks a billion!!

[@unavailable2705]

25:55 I think Ben said something about minecraft speedrunning not being as much of a big deal, helped by the fact that it’s so luck based rather than a test of skill. I honestly think a big reason minecraft speedrunning has gotten as HUGE as it has is because of those luck elements (along with just, Dream popularizing it on his own). The luck in this game isn’t only about drop rates of items, but also what kind of terrain you’ll have to traverse, what structures you’ll come across, and in turn what methods you’ll use to get the items you need. This makes it pretty different from something like Mario as you mentioned, where I’d imagine there are only a few people who can really gun for that number one spot by grinding the exact same level over and over to achieve perfection. If you haven’t already been a part of that community, it seems pretty impossible to start getting into it now, competing against people who have already mastered it. In contrast, there are thousands and thousands of Minecraft players who probably have the skill to get 1st in the leaderboard, it all comes down to who gets lucky. Someone completely new could join without feeling hopelessly far behind, and it’s not so repetitive. In a way that makes speedrunning it a lot more accessible, which is why the community of speed runners and fans have blown up so much.

[@sydneydorawa5134]

"Inside" had me feeling such an amazing range of emotions. At the beginning, I was cracking up and really appreciating how well he captured different internet tropes. As it progressed, I began to feel the stress and pressure that he (and other content creators) felt to constantly perform and be present for his audience. As a regular person, my greatest takeaway was a sense of triumph and pride for just surviving the past year. I felt like he wanted to convey that however you coped with the pandemic is okay, whether that was by making jokes or using the internet a lot more or getting help from friends/family/a specialist, as long as you survived. I related to his depictions of desperation and frustration, like in the shots where he's laying on the floor or doing takes of the same shot over and over again. It was a really powerful piece!

[@hayleysboringdallasvlogs8829]

i saw this coming when ben gave his "apologies to" outro to karl jacobs two pods ago xD im here for ittttt

[@layabala3582]

Tuesday's my favorite day in the week for the pod and Safs stream! Also love the electric holos and dad hats!

[@TooMuchTimeToCare]

I loved Bo Burnham's "INSIDE" special too! Lately I have been feeling much like the happy and safe bubble that I have been living and operating in for the past year is really beginning to collapse and my whole world is really coming down around me. That is probably the theme that I gravitated to the most and that I really got hit with in the second half of the special. This says a lot because I have always identified as an extrovert and have always needed more personal contact than I have received while being stuck at home with my family, but I was adjusted and I was content for the most part. In a way I was resigned to living this "new normal." Now I feel like I am being forced to come back out of that bubble that I was finally starting to be ok with to suddenly having to confront all the things that I didn't miss about the world like the breakdown of my government, the death of democracy, the cult of the individual, the end of the most fruitless and costly war in my country's history, and all the other shit that I have been very happy to have the pleasure of not thinking about because I was too busy just trying not to die from COVID. It is a lot. I need to rewatch it for sure, but I need to be in a better headspace before I do.

[@shaunandsqueak]

Two weeks and many hours later I have finally finished watching the podcasts from the beginning so I can join in with the current ones and maybe submit a question or two when y'all ask for them... Love love love how normal you guys are, not showy and very real with intelligent and well thought out conversations . Your podcasts give an awesome sneak peak into yours and Ben world and it's very refreshing. Thanks guys for all the hard work!!

[@melanievanhook9047]

Taco Tuesday is the best day!!!! Love the podcast! I have been listening to it every Tuesday since it started. Thanks for being so good at what you do

[@rawrbunnehz20]

I've been using these podcasts as background for when I sleep. I find them really soothing.

[@elliekelley8758]

just finished this after turning in my psych stats final! LOVED bo’s special, i watched it like 5 or 6 times already. related a lot to the social anxiety and internal ridicule. but damn that lighting was amazing

[@kellyjowang]

petition for ben to continue calling us "holosimpians"

[@zhenye7402]

Ben so excited for Taco Tuesday he fudged the intro 🤣

[@tigerlily515]

As someone who's been an international (i.e. not Korean) K-pop fan for over 10 years, Ben brings up a really interesting point about promoting idols everywhere. K-pop is a genre of music that, until relatively recently, wasn't accepted by mainstream Western pop culture and wasn't seen as "legitimate". It was seen as "uncool" or "weird," and I myself (and many others) would get made fun of for liking "feminine looking Asian guys" or whatever. As a result, early K-pop fans would promote their idols as a way to get K-pop music and culture into the limelight and bring awareness to the existence of this genre and all the good/interesting things it had to offer. Over time, I think this became a go-to move for many INTERNATIONAL K-Pop fans. I also want to stress that many of the more annoying fans of any fandom (K-Pop, KZbin, etc.) are often younger and therefore more immature, so they're more willing and excited to get into "fandom wars" and whatnot and promote their idols as a way to seem cool on the internet. As for the "stream XX", it is now a meme as Cristine said. However, the reason why this is a meme is because a lot of K-Pop groups from smaller labels, which are created (arguably artificially) by said companies, debut making a lot of monetary losses and if they don't become profitable then these groups disband and you never see them or hear their music again. So you WANT them to be profitable enough so you can continue to see or hear them. (And then it became a meme and is now used somewhat ironically but also not really to promote bigger groups or idols that don't need it.....)

[@theseweresomesongs]

Love these points!

[@cinnamonfairyfluff]

I completely agree with all of these points. I came into the kpop scene pretty early on, mostly because of the fans who promoted it and who politely encouraged me to give it a try. Nowadays, I think people are less likely to try kpop music, even if it'd be up their ally, because of the relentless pushing from the huge fandoms. That's kinda what drove me away from the fandom, to be honest.

[@shenshenxoc]

About KPOP fandoms "Posting in every thread" - As a Millennial with an actual job, it doesn't make sense to me either. It has just been part of KPOP Twitter culture nowadays. And yes, we as fans are aware that we, in some way be it intentional or not, are part of the marketing. Us requesting the KPOP songs on the radio for instance will make the music reach more people. I think it comes from how different fandoms within the KPOP community are SOOO COMPETITIVE, they want to make sure that the content that their idols make reach more people.

[@misspiece22]

What's up Super Simps?! Ben laughing his way through that made my day!

[@BradleyBoy]

The King of Kong documentary is free to watch on KZbin if anyone is interested in learning more

[@transarchivist]

This came at the perfect time!! I am loving all the Simply content right now

[@lizlluvia653]

This is an interesting episode! Speaking from someone who didn't know much about dream or Minecraft, I think Ben summarizes the drama perfectly, and I enjoyed listening to Cristine's insightful opinions! The part about whether celebrities should be taking responsibility for their fans behavior really had me thinking. It reminds me of last year, a singer's fans got an entire fanfiction site blocked in China because they didn't like there's porn of their idol on the site. The singer and his team did nothing to respond to the matter, and kinda just disappeared for a while and hoped everyone would forget about it by then(I guess also because fanfiction was a grey area & porn is still a sensitive topic on Chinese social media). Well, it definitely wasn't that easy, and it now seems that the hatred between fanfiction creators/readers & this particular singer's fans is never going to end. I've always wondered if there's a better way to deal with this sort of things on the celebrity's perspective.

[@blancacribas]

hey, we’re super simps again! love that for us. Happy Taco Tuesday super simps!

[@smileyriley1001]

54:01 Ben please don't forget that we're still talking about a small percentage of fans. You're listening to (and getting weirdly worked up over) the little guy with the megaphone instead of the majority that are just minding their own business.

[@cinnamonfairyfluff]

You're 100% correct

[@KarmiSelua]

Holy crap, you mentioning Bo Burnham just made my day; I can't get Inside out of my head. I definitely agree with Cristine that it both commented how a creator feels creating things and also very much spoke to regular people (like myself) and on a very personal level on how they use the internet, how they felt during the isolation and so on. I think Bo talks about it because he is both - a creator and also just a person. It something he knows. And there is something wonderful about an artist that speaks their truth about their thing in a very honest way. It's something that drove me to both Cristine and Bo. I think it's the only correct way to be a creator in a long term. I actually think Bo would be a wonderful guest to this podcast because he absolutely shares many values with Cristine about how to be a responsible as a creator, he shares some of her anxious energy, but also is a creator who got famous very quickly being very young and had a very different path. They kinda mirror each other in this way? I don't know how to put it. Anyway, PETITION TO GET BO BURNHAM TO BE A GUEST ON SIMPLYPODLOGICAL!

[@tiffanychavez8457]

A crossover i never expected, love this podcast

[@adricsoti3719]

"No cap" "Please stop saying that" guys I love you so much😭💖

[@_Gianna_R]

This once again came at the right time when I'm about to write some more for my design paper. Thanks for the entertainment, you guys podcast reaaaally cures the boredom

[@justmaddie7944]

Hat came in and still waiting for the new collection. Had a little shipping mishap but Your team fixed that in so swiftly.!! Shout out to Drew and Ria for the great customer service!!

[@kosza4321]

Something about Inside really moved me idk why. I think I related a lot to the depression and depersonalisation side of things but also even though I'm not a content creator in a way I've always felt like I put on this persona when I'm with friends to sort of portray the side of me I want them to see, something that's entertaining to them to try and make them happy. That's just how I've been most of my life so it resonated with me and almost this constant battle in my head that I want to make my friends laugh but also fighting with my own depression. And then in regards to the internet/social media I go through phases where I really struggle with the concept of social media and just want to delete it all but then there's the fear that I'd have no contact with anyone because that's like the mainstream way to communicate now. I also just liked the journey through lockdown of going kind of crazy that pretty much everyone has felt 😅

[@silentprincess6478]

I hopped on the dream bandwagon when he had 2 mil subs and I thoroughly enjoyed his content and personality. I’m still subbed but haven’t ever been invested in him socially cuz I had no interest. He’s always been a pretty great personality online and gives off great vibes and usually doesn’t let the rapid fame go to his head at least from what I could see as someone who only watches his KZbin. I didn’t really pay attention to the official speedrun stuff cuz I didn’t care about that aspect of the game but you can’t help but be curious about the truth right? It is disappointing and he could have handled it so much better. But I’m not gonna flame/drop him cuz in the end it’s a mistake he’s made. I think his original actions in strong defense and denial was due to a fear of being attacked online which we all know can be career destroying so I get his actions even if I don’t agree with them. Since he’s done a lot for me in quarantine I’ll give him the benefit of the doubt. In the end all I’m gonna hope for is that he learns from all this and works to be better and think more about the consequences of his actions. He’s a very smart guy but he’s not perfect and I think more people need to see that. I appreciate your guys insight cuz it’s interesting and you provide an outsiders pov that’s mostly unbiased. Not to mention your own experiences with fame and youtuber things. :)

[@crystalgacha2218]

* sees dream on the thumbnail of simplypodlogical * Me : :D * Sees the title * Me : D:

[@LostApotheosis]

It's so funny to me even hearing the term 'faceless youtuber' when applied to gaming. I was watching youtube when commentated let's plays were just getting started. They existed as either a guide to get you through the game or as a sort of guided tour through a game to show you everything the game had to offer. The people making them were mostly kids who bought a 60 dollar dazzle capture card and were using all pirated editing software and bad mics. When the youtube partners program first began it was basically impossible to get partnered because youtube didn't see gaming content as valuable. No one had a webcam. Everyone was faceless. Now there's an allure to being faceless and gaming is one of the most lucrative types of content. And now there are people deliberately getting into gaming content because it can make good money. I'm glad the creators I watch are getting paid now, but I do kind of miss when you knew that everyone making content was doing it because they loved it. It's really hard to find small youtubers anymore who feel as if they're really in it for the fun of it.

[@johannacxiii]

I finished all of the podcasts! The ones you've published anyway. And after a binge of 65 hour long conversations I just want to say: thank you. Your conversations on any topic are wonderfully calm, respectful and nuanced. If there's ANYTHING the internet needs a lot more of, it's nuance. So thanks. And keep on trucking! Also, I agree with what Cristine said: I don't like following content creators I feel like I wouldn't be friends with, but listening to you I can really imagine having a conversation with you and my husband over a glass of something on a quiet evening. HMU if you're ever in the Netherlands, lol :)

[@elsitahanson]

You were subtle and careful about ur thoughts on BTS Army. Im part of that Fandom and most of us are very well aware about "Big Hummus" (BigHit) marketing tactics, but no one feels taken advantage of, we love to support the group, they deserve it. Sadly as in every fandom we have the toxic fans, and even tho they are a minority, they are louder, more visible and obnoxious. But most of us are ur normal everyday hard working , functional person, with normal life and responsabilities that enjoy the fandom in their free time 💜

[@leeroyjenkins3391]

Hear hear👏👏👏