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Why OW2's PvE Fails, But TF2's MvM Succeeds

  Рет қаралды 817,488

SkyminSlash

SkyminSlash

Күн бұрын

Пікірлер: 3 300
@SkyminSlash
@SkyminSlash Жыл бұрын
Mistake Acknowledgement: - Oil Spill was not the first Mann Up tour, it was Steel Trap. I also completely forgot Destiny 2 was *technically* F2P. Probably because they have several $30 expansions and I always associated the series with having an entry price tag.
@epicguardian44
@epicguardian44 Жыл бұрын
Thank you!😊
@user-qb9pf5jo6l
@user-qb9pf5jo6l Жыл бұрын
potato, tomato. bing bong i still go two cities.
@notthrowing
@notthrowing Жыл бұрын
how can you make this video when ow2 pve doesnt even exist
@dabmasterars
@dabmasterars Жыл бұрын
@@user-qb9pf5jo6l two cities is fine, but i don't understand players who play it all the time. i usually try to play different missions each time. my favoutite one is wave 666.
@belmontzar
@belmontzar Жыл бұрын
@@dabmasterars my respect to the mighty players of Zombie Wave.. I tip my Gibus to you
@z1u512
@z1u512 Жыл бұрын
Mostly because tf2 players doesnt need to wait 2+years for them to announce we are being lied to about every promise they made
@Wendingus
@Wendingus Жыл бұрын
Can't break promises to the players if you never make them. (because you ignore the players)
@JTruong3rd
@JTruong3rd Жыл бұрын
I rather them stop promising anything and drop all news after an update over being lead on
@kingkoopa64
@kingkoopa64 Жыл бұрын
......save tf2
@kamixakadio2441
@kamixakadio2441 Жыл бұрын
Also because there is a lot more unique stuff to be done in MvM compared to OW2 PVE
@hellkaiser1366
@hellkaiser1366 Жыл бұрын
Also the music slaps
@70Lu07
@70Lu07 Жыл бұрын
This is the first time ever i see that the tf2 community just stops, looks at ow2 and goes "i feel you mann"
@areaxisthegurkha
@areaxisthegurkha Жыл бұрын
tf2 gets mvm and community workshop. ow2 doesnt have either so not really.
@thetrophygamer3606
@thetrophygamer3606 Жыл бұрын
@@areaxisthegurkha so it be more like ‘First time?’
@pole8740
@pole8740 Жыл бұрын
@@areaxisthegurkha id say ow2 has the edating custom game modes but i forgot the erp scene of tf2 is just in another league
@Drebolaskan
@Drebolaskan Жыл бұрын
TF2 is in a pretty good place, they gave us a lot of the things we asked for and more. The only problem is that it just stopped. No more changes to improve the game, but also no more changes to ruin the game; we are in eternal limbo
@notthrowing
@notthrowing Жыл бұрын
@@Drebolaskan yeah i love tf2 but i left tf2 for ow2 because i didnt want to waste another 5 years of my life waiting for the heavy update when i could play a game that gets updated every 9 weeks
@yt-ru7dv
@yt-ru7dv Жыл бұрын
Imagine those two people who are still working at TF2 after 16 years those guys must be so dedicated
@magicianslucky602
@magicianslucky602 Жыл бұрын
The janitor and his plant
@Saulgoodman67677
@Saulgoodman67677 Жыл бұрын
There's no one working at tf2 unless you consider pot plants people. It's just some random ass dude or two who pop into the office once every once in a while to clean the dust in the room and check if servers are still running.
@diggyrobinson5859
@diggyrobinson5859 Жыл бұрын
​@@Saulgoodman67677that plant is a spy
@El.fish.the.chocolate
@El.fish.the.chocolate 11 ай бұрын
In reality they give a guy (probably the genitor) 30 minutes a week to work on tf2.
@srdjan455
@srdjan455 10 ай бұрын
Alternativt they could be full of dread and wishing for the game to end already.
@MormonDude
@MormonDude Жыл бұрын
Man Blizzard being so bad at their job that they bring Skymin back from the dead is truly incredible.
@borisvolski
@borisvolski Жыл бұрын
Blizzard is so bad am still waiting 2nd part of Warcraft We still left on a cliffhanger
@tox9809
@tox9809 Жыл бұрын
at least diablo 4 is good
@Archedgar
@Archedgar Жыл бұрын
@@tox9809 No it isn't.
@tox9809
@tox9809 Жыл бұрын
@@Archedgar i like it and that is subjective. you are entitled to your opinion and I am entitled to mine.
@tox9809
@tox9809 Жыл бұрын
@Simbylewhat does that even mean?
@icetide9411
@icetide9411 Жыл бұрын
As a TF2 player who never got into overwatch, I feel bad for the overwatch community. We might never get updates, but at least we aren't promised updates that then get ripped away from us. That sounds like it hurts about ten times more
@lilwintery6434
@lilwintery6434 Жыл бұрын
the heavy update, rip
@lirehsa
@lirehsa Жыл бұрын
@@lilwintery6434 Never actually promised
@1twasmeBarry
@1twasmeBarry Жыл бұрын
@@lilwintery6434 didnt play tf2 back when heavy vs pyro was around but from what ive seen wasn't pyro like incredibly bugged where flame particles didn't actually hit player at the right distance
@lilwintery6434
@lilwintery6434 Жыл бұрын
@@lirehsa just like comic 7 edit: fr tho they did say the loser of the pyro vs heavy would still get an update and the purpose of the event was to see who would get the update first
@Fut_re
@Fut_re Жыл бұрын
@@1twasmeBarry That was just pyro's flamethrower in general prior to getting patched. His flame particles were wonky and were capable of hitting at strange distances, resulting in pyro unintentionally having a much larger range on said flamethrower than he does now.
@NinjaMan47
@NinjaMan47 Жыл бұрын
Valve is unmotivated and takes forever to deliver new content but when they deliver they actually put effort into it.
@deadguydudeman
@deadguydudeman Жыл бұрын
Relatable except the effort part
@Left4Cake
@Left4Cake Жыл бұрын
When they actually make something themselves. They kinda use the "Community Update" set up as an excise to be lazy about it. But at least Valve has some respect when it comes to microtransactions. Mainly that the current Creates and Mann Up tickes are enough and they don't need to add a Battle pass or anything.
@Left4Cake
@Left4Cake Жыл бұрын
Update I stand corrected they tecihnally added a battle pass, but contracts unlike the usual battle passes don't use fomo with time limted missions, you by the ticket and you have as long as you want to do them.
@thecpmr6276
@thecpmr6276 Жыл бұрын
They don't really make games out of an obligation to make money. They make them because they are passionate. When they aren't feeling as passionate, they don't cheapen it by pushing out shit anyway. When they DO feel passionate though, the whole fucking world feels it.
@vivelespatat2670
@vivelespatat2670 Жыл бұрын
- Back 4 Blood proves Valve carried Left 4 Dead Prett good video.
@a0001521
@a0001521 Жыл бұрын
The funniest thing is that both modes took about the same amount of time to develop, but MvM was eventually released
@cursedhawkins1305
@cursedhawkins1305 Жыл бұрын
Valve was also SMART enough to tease the mode prior to release by having numerous easter eggs hidden in the background of the maps as well as the trailers leading up to mode's release. From Foundry having that guarded room behind BLU spawn if I remember correctly, to seeing the carrier off in the distance on some of the maps like 2fort.
@feeltheheat
@feeltheheat Жыл бұрын
Acutally I think it's far worse than that, the original Overwatch had coop at a certain point but I cannot remember if it was removed or not, but it was when OW 2 came and decided to overtake OW 1 where you cannot play the original anymore now. TF2 may have been neglected over time, but at least MvM got released, fleshed out as needed, and probably hasn't been revisited in years.
@CBRN-115
@CBRN-115 Жыл бұрын
And MVM is just better than OW2 in every way
@dragon_ball_sucks_video
@dragon_ball_sucks_video Жыл бұрын
MVM was never good wtf are you on
@kestirix4602
@kestirix4602 Жыл бұрын
@@cursedhawkins1305 mvm had entire ARG
@Dr_Martex
@Dr_Martex Жыл бұрын
Man, Blizzard just keeps killing OW2, every other week, we hear about their latest blunder or cheap marketing tactic that blew up in the exec's faces. Where as valve have only given MvM three updates in total, including it's introduction, and it's still considered better by most sane people.
@plantain.1739
@plantain.1739 Жыл бұрын
I think that's why I personally stay as far away from overwatch as I can. I understand why people don't like painting Valve as a saint, but they're atleast they know when to just leave a game alone. It is night and day how much better they are then most videogame companies. Lets just hope that hardware division is profitable enough they don't decide to fuck around with steam.
@brendanboomhour7606
@brendanboomhour7606 Жыл бұрын
​@@plantain.1739 Doesn't Valve also WELCOME user generated content? Unlike Hacktivision who abhor it to the point of fucking over people that made quality of life mods for THEIR broken games?
@fantasmacstrp9239
@fantasmacstrp9239 Жыл бұрын
LGBT people will keep it alive because they swallow all lazy crap they drop happily
@somdudewillson
@somdudewillson Жыл бұрын
@@brendanboomhour7606 You can straight-up sell total conversion/new campaign mods of their games on Steam as separate games. So... ye. (also they include user-created content in TF2 as well as a way to support specifically the original community developers who made it)
@plantain.1739
@plantain.1739 Жыл бұрын
@@brendanboomhour7606 I mean, 2/3 of the Orange box trilogy was made by former mod teams, and Dota. Plus, Steam is debatably *too* accepting of user generated content. Yes, they are lazy, but considering how big steam is, I prefer they stay lazy instead of fucking anything up. Though, they should probably assign people to TF2. Like, just give them better pay or something, idk.
@Bluepenguin28
@Bluepenguin28 Жыл бұрын
9:13 "By allowing creativity you instantly gain replayability" i really really liked this sentence, its so true and today's AAA developers don't realize this imo
@nellzdablackking
@nellzdablackking 10 ай бұрын
It's why Skyrim has lasted for so long if you have access to mods.
@thebug7017
@thebug7017 5 ай бұрын
This explains why Multiversus got neutered, mods were amazing but they had to install the anticheat...
@togeluga_the_cat
@togeluga_the_cat 4 ай бұрын
ngl this is kinda why i love horde shooters like payday 2 that just give you freedom to make some insane builds using perks that just allows for so much replay value that allows tons of fun with just experimenting around making some dumbass build
@ChesterManfred
@ChesterManfred 3 ай бұрын
Garry's Mod, Half Life, (2), TF2, we're only talking about the mods, the games themselves are nothing short of replayable
@Koppu1doragon
@Koppu1doragon Жыл бұрын
Not saying it will happen but imagine the universe where Valve used this as a chance to release MVM content just to poke the bear.
@OrionDawn15
@OrionDawn15 Жыл бұрын
Or hell, any competent studio or company releases that promised PvE mode. Of course, without the Overwatch coat of paint.
@randomboi-mq1cn
@randomboi-mq1cn Жыл бұрын
Valve releases the summer update they promised
@A.Singularity
@A.Singularity Жыл бұрын
Volvo making an update to mvm just to mock OW2 feels like a dream, I know it's not real but I wanna keep dreaming
@drivanradosivic1357
@drivanradosivic1357 Жыл бұрын
@@OrionDawn15 Battleborn had story mode and PVE and PVP on launch.
@OrionDawn15
@OrionDawn15 Жыл бұрын
@@drivanradosivic1357 Yeah, I saw that. Wanted to play it for myself but it was just a tad too hard for me at the time. And at the time, the game was practically dead too. A damn shame, I bet it was a blast.
@Evamme534
@Evamme534 Жыл бұрын
Sad thing is is that we have seen what the OW2 PvE would have been like through Deep Rock Galactic, it literally contains everything that was promised for the original PvE and it is amazing. it shows that if they had put more focus onto it then we could have gotten that original vision.
@670HP-Package-NOW
@670HP-Package-NOW Жыл бұрын
Funni dorfs> Blizzard
@deathshot7623
@deathshot7623 Жыл бұрын
​@@670HP-Package-NOWi rock and stone to that
@vivelespatat2670
@vivelespatat2670 Жыл бұрын
WE'RE RICH WE'RE RICH
@fishyboy2140
@fishyboy2140 Жыл бұрын
It all leads back to rock and stone…
@bongibot1104
@bongibot1104 Жыл бұрын
Good devs and no obnoxious greed make Deep Rock even more special. If you want to put money in it, you always get cool shit for it
@DereC519
@DereC519 Жыл бұрын
Overwatch PVE: Heroes fighting evil robots to save the world from doom TF2 PVE: Ragtag bunch of mercenaries beating up robots for the money they drop and because some half naked guy on a TV told them to
@splat-trainproductions
@splat-trainproductions 6 ай бұрын
Yeah, TF2 sounds way more interesting due to how hilarious it is, no wonder why MVM is better!
@purpleapple4052
@purpleapple4052 5 ай бұрын
the robots drop (burnt) money because it's their fuel
@SloMoMonday
@SloMoMonday Жыл бұрын
Snowball Mei is a symbol of everything we wanted, everything lost and a stark reminder of the absolute pittance that was gained. So long my precious rolly angel, you were too good for this industry.
@mega17
@mega17 Жыл бұрын
F -- from a Mei main
@DumAzzFairy
@DumAzzFairy Жыл бұрын
Sad rolly hours
@RavenGlenn
@RavenGlenn Жыл бұрын
Funny thing is that rolly Mei already exists in Heroes of the Storm.
@IHaveBeenDoingTaxFraud
@IHaveBeenDoingTaxFraud Жыл бұрын
holy shang chi
@belmontzar
@belmontzar Жыл бұрын
There is one extra thing I want to highlight from MVM's Mann Up and its an important detail. You know how you need a ticket to play the mode? The ticket doesn't get used until THE MISSION is completed. Did your server of players decide "F-ck this im out?" Well good news your ticket is still there. Losing the match or squad rage quitting doesn't steal money from your wallet. It just cost maybe an hour of your time wasted trying to keep your team ali- WHY DID YOU JUMP INTO THE HORDES? -cough- sorry... had a... moment... but yes the Tour of Duty ticket you bought doesn't vanish unless the mission is completed.
@conservativedemocracyenjoyer
@conservativedemocracyenjoyer Жыл бұрын
Wait what. The only reason I haven't used my tickets is because I'm afraid that I'd have to leave partway through.
@woofn5918
@woofn5918 Жыл бұрын
​@@conservativedemocracyenjoyer Yup, the tickets you buy aren't consumed until you complete the mission. If you fail, or leave during it, then you'll get to keep the ticket.
@belmontzar
@belmontzar Жыл бұрын
@@conservativedemocracyenjoyer there used to be this huge Toxicity problem where Trader players who were SUPER GOOD at the game would troll newer players by playing with them to the last wave and then quit when the wave began. Dropping players into a solo battle against waves made to fight full teams. Or also booting the new player from the match because they could handle things themselves While this does still happen, now atleast the new player isn't down a dollar each run.
@SkyminSlash
@SkyminSlash Жыл бұрын
My original script had a mention of the fact your ticket only gets used on any missions you've not completed in that tour loop, so you could replay any missions in Mann Up that you've got marked off indefinitely, so long as you had a ticket to offer. I'm not sure why it didn't make it into the video...
@belmontzar
@belmontzar Жыл бұрын
@@SkyminSlash You mentioned your older past scripts were alot more negative towards Overwatch when compared to TF2. Also TO BE FAIR, You were judging MVM based on when it came out, and at the time tickets got used when the mode began. The change to "Used at Completion." Happened later
@alleosussquirt8041
@alleosussquirt8041 Жыл бұрын
Don't forget, MvM has charity events every couple of months run by the community, with community made maps, and community made challenge. It's something OW2 can NEVER have because they just don't care about community.
@scantyer
@scantyer Жыл бұрын
Those community made events rock man.
@FrahdChikun
@FrahdChikun Жыл бұрын
​@@scantyerespecially the April Fools missions
@rydergolde3169
@rydergolde3169 Жыл бұрын
it's as DougDoug said in his video on OW vs TF2 explained with food TF2 dropped and they're like "see something not on the menu you want? kitchen's open, go ham" so we get shit like x10 stats, Saxtone Hale (which iirc became official recently), Tall maps, and jump courses meanwhile Overwatch is just; "what if we could-" "Here's a durian"
@salbill4484
@salbill4484 Жыл бұрын
LoL and DOTA2 exist today because Blizzard bungled the bag and gave players access to make their own maps - since losing billions they are gun shy about giving players the ability to make their own anything - Star Craft allowed you to, but don't expect that in OW. OW2 main mechanic is the cash shop.
@GeorgeDCowley
@GeorgeDCowley Жыл бұрын
Winning because you're winning.
@cmanhanks1
@cmanhanks1 Жыл бұрын
tiny little detail to add about MVM's accessibility: MVM tickets are not considered "spent" by the game untill you have fully completed a MANN UP mission succsessfully
@ceu160193
@ceu160193 Жыл бұрын
Even better - you can replay same mission repeatedly, as long as it doesn't end tour and you spent ticket on it before.
@tonivoul1971
@tonivoul1971 Жыл бұрын
Thank God valve is not a greedy company because of their steam money
@SoupCanMafia
@SoupCanMafia Жыл бұрын
@@tonivoul1971 Nah, they're greedy. They just do it at a different point of contact and at least do it at a point of contact that isn't required for you to interact with in theory, or at least the paywall was minimal (that is, buying the Cloak and Dagger to gain the P2P version of TF2 and not the F2P version).
@V0idRunner4Llfe
@V0idRunner4Llfe Жыл бұрын
​@@SoupCanMafiawdym by buying the cloak and dagger, exactly? Sorry if I'm confused or anything, but you were saying you got the premium version of the game by buying that specific item or?
@RandomBlenderGuy
@RandomBlenderGuy Жыл бұрын
@@V0idRunner4Llfe no just any. i'm guessing they prefer the cloak and dagger :^
@vextex9719
@vextex9719 Жыл бұрын
Why OW2 PVE fails: it doesn't exists Why TF2 MVM suceeds: different gameplay style from the casual mode, exiting boss battles, solidifies the need of team work, the trailer just hits hard even if not a single word is spoken, you can play the MVM theme on the character selection screen (its true)
@P.H691
@P.H691 Жыл бұрын
Another huge plus for MVM, gambling. By spending time and money to get a chance to get killstreak weapons or if you are lucky, an Australium and if Lady Luck is smiling on you, you are blessed by the ownership of the golden frying Pan.
@MooseChicken
@MooseChicken Жыл бұрын
Not to mention the custom community campaigns adding a bunch of crazy new rules, robots, and mechanics to regular MVM.
@High-Pie_Chop
@High-Pie_Chop Жыл бұрын
But let's not forget that mvm has toxic players that will make sure you get kicked on the last wave or kick you for using the gas passer.
@enjoyasalad647
@enjoyasalad647 Жыл бұрын
It has one word "YEEEAAAAAAAAHH"
@P.H691
@P.H691 Жыл бұрын
@@High-Pie_Chop oh yeah, we don’t talk about them. If you have seen the mvm cheating videos by Wheezy, cheaters are like a parasite that ruins the gamemode, but luckily they are so little in number
@arizonaranger6024
@arizonaranger6024 Жыл бұрын
I think something Valve always does amazingly is promise nothing and you’ll always over-deliver. The only time I feel like they put something in a commercial or cinematic is when they’ve already developed it or it’s something that’s easy to commit to. Anytime they scrap or change something they completely swing in the opposite direction so even though we never got the hyper realistic gritty tf2 we were initially promised the goofy game we got is still extremely influential and a great game.
@teddyjackson1902
@teddyjackson1902 Жыл бұрын
Underrated comment. Valve def keeps its cards close to its vest and when it drops something it’s usually already very polished. They know what’s going to work before they publicly recognize it. When HL:Alex was announced it was practically right around the time the game was going to go retail. Wild.
@diggyrobinson5859
@diggyrobinson5859 Жыл бұрын
If you want gritty play tfc
@purpleapple4052
@purpleapple4052 3 ай бұрын
​@@diggyrobinson5859 they mean tf2 was initially promised as a gritty sequel to tfc just months after it released, then took 9 years to release (as Gaben says in the funny line, from tf2's dev commentaries) by which point the style changed a lot to the cartoon it is today
@aslightlydisappointingsala9481
@aslightlydisappointingsala9481 Жыл бұрын
I truly hope there is a class action suit against blizzard for the constant lies and failures to deliver on top of their aggressive monetization and borderline scams in their games
@maestrofeli4259
@maestrofeli4259 Жыл бұрын
unless the laws regarding this sort of problem change, that won't happen, sadly
@alexandredasilvavilasboasrosas
@alexandredasilvavilasboasrosas Жыл бұрын
like that would do anything.
@dannybeane2069
@dannybeane2069 Жыл бұрын
The main issue is the free to play model typically prevents law suits like that cause you can't really claim damages from a "free to play" game and most judges would rule, paying for the cosmetics to be not necessary.
@skiller5034
@skiller5034 Жыл бұрын
@@dannybeane2069 Not to mention the Terms Of Service of pretty much every game typically have a line that goes like "the Game is provided on an 'as is' and 'as available' basis", completely shutting down any possible claim. And you have to accept them to play.
@Wangpi3ce
@Wangpi3ce Жыл бұрын
It's nearly impossible to sue a corporation of any kind unless you have serious capital backing you. They can just throw counterclaims in return and bog down your lawyers until you bankrupt yourself. And the laws surrounding these issues will NEVER be fixed, because those same corporations line the pockets of whoever they have to, to keep it that way.
@risel56
@risel56 Жыл бұрын
Skymin's KZbin career is still more alive than Overwatch 2.
@SkyminSlash
@SkyminSlash Жыл бұрын
That's how you know you fucked up.
@jackharris8661
@jackharris8661 Жыл бұрын
@@SkyminSlash I mean this video kinda popped off maybe you ain't dead yet
@Dalek-br6nu
@Dalek-br6nu Жыл бұрын
💀💀💀💀💀
@NicoTheCinderace
@NicoTheCinderace Жыл бұрын
@@SkyminSlash 💀💀💀💀
@dapidizme
@dapidizme Жыл бұрын
Damn. The ending actually made me a mixture of sad and nostalgic. Haven’t played TF2 seriously in a while, but every single point you made was perfect. Great video
@bungus5774
@bungus5774 Жыл бұрын
Seems like you’ll have to start playing it soon then mate
@pizzamaster-su3bh
@pizzamaster-su3bh Жыл бұрын
PLEASE PLAY IT. YOU WON'T REGRET IT!!! just watch out for the aimbots
@dapidizme
@dapidizme Жыл бұрын
@@bungus5774 I have returned to the game. Been playing almost everyday now!
@dapidizme
@dapidizme Жыл бұрын
@@pizzamaster-su3bh they are indeed a pain. :(
@azrik6084
@azrik6084 Жыл бұрын
The fact they knew the pve was getting scaled down before OW2 even released and just didn't tell anyone is what really makes it sting.
@dpray96
@dpray96 Жыл бұрын
Scaled down implies that what we got/will get is different then what we previously had. Considering we had this already in OW1 before they removed our access...
@draconomega
@draconomega Жыл бұрын
​@@dpray96 it's a scale down from what they promised. no need to be a smart-ass
@JetFuelSE
@JetFuelSE Жыл бұрын
That must count as false advertising lmao.
@azrik6084
@azrik6084 Жыл бұрын
@@JetFuelSE you would think. Not like they will suffer any legal recorse for it.
@onepieceofbbq6357
@onepieceofbbq6357 Жыл бұрын
idk why people are suprised that they would do something like this. They obviously wanted to wait till the game actually got popular before they kick the hornets nest, rather than letting us know that this game would be a dissapointment before we wasted time/money (for skins that are overprised) on it. This is activision blizzard after all.
@CallMeElwis94
@CallMeElwis94 Жыл бұрын
I honestly can't help, but feel extra sorry for OW2 players. Just like them, I was invested in PvE. The only true reason why I wanted to stick around at all, after Blizz pulled the plug on OW1. Now, what's the point? It's just another ruined by greed money sucker, and that's just sad. And unlike TF2, where community keeps it alive, Blizzard ain't giving the fans such freedom. Which doesn't help the game at all. If anything, further sealing the poor fate of what could've been a good game.
@slyr0980
@slyr0980 Жыл бұрын
Only way is to ditch that game into dust. Maybe they'll try to pick up the shambles and actually do something with it. If not, then at least it'll finally be put to rest. Well, that'd be true if there weren't actual buffoons still supporting that game n Blizzard
@sandraswan9008
@sandraswan9008 Жыл бұрын
I don't feel bad for ow2 players, they knew exactly what kinda company and what kinda game they were dealing with
@verymuchadisappointment168
@verymuchadisappointment168 Жыл бұрын
@@sandraswan9008 that is such an inflammatory statement tf. how is the playerbase supposed to know the shady actions inside a company when said company is hardly transparent about their intentions? people are allowed to enjoy a game jeez
@dragonandavatarfan8865
@dragonandavatarfan8865 3 ай бұрын
@@sandraswan9008 Tbf, when the first OW came out Blizzard still had lots of good rep as the "WoW creators" and such.
@DiegoHernandez-sp5ms
@DiegoHernandez-sp5ms Жыл бұрын
I thought PvE meant Player vs enemy or Player vs evil but hearing that it's called player vs environment makes much more sense
@andreasottohansen7338
@andreasottohansen7338 3 ай бұрын
It's Player vs Entity, not Player vs Environment.
@mishagaming1075
@mishagaming1075 3 ай бұрын
@@andreasottohansen7338none of us can agree, can we?
@andreasottohansen7338
@andreasottohansen7338 3 ай бұрын
@@mishagaming1075 nope, and because of that and how words work, we are likely all correct
@MythicTF2
@MythicTF2 Жыл бұрын
I think a big reason why MvM was as successful as it was is because Valve iterated on feedback. MvM when it first came out was still pretty good, but wasn't nearly as good as it was today. The Mecha Engie update adding in bot variety and new maps, as well as the 2-cities update basically giving medic an entirely new mechanic and expanded upon the existing content perfectly, as well as adding new maps and killstreak kits. MvM also wasn't teased as a reason to make a new game. Valve didn't say "hey guys, we need to make a brand new game and stop giving you TF2 content entirely because we want to make a PvE mode!" No, Valve released that as a FREE update to the game then continued to iterate upon it. OW2 was teased as the reason for needing a new game. Whatever, the engine they used for OW1 was probably bloated af and they didn't want to bloat it, plus they fixed up the big issues with the PvP side of the game alongside that which is nice. Where they failed wasn't that they got to ambitious over it, it was that they refused to even put in the same amount of effort that made MvM so successful in the first place. They scrapped everything about it that even made it interesting and unique in favor of being able to go "hey, we technically still delivered our promise, but with MORE micro-transactions" as well as setting a precedent that you'll have to PAY for future PvE content in the game. Another $15 every season just to get the new PvE content for something so bare bones.
@destroyer4929
@destroyer4929 Жыл бұрын
Honestly though I feel like if they released MVM as a new TF game it could be better because if I remember correctly TF2 has insane spaghetti code
@MythicTF2
@MythicTF2 Жыл бұрын
@@destroyer4929 Yeah, TF2's source code is a lot of spaghetti. But Valve wouldn't say the reason for a new game is just because they want to add better PvE content, then force you to pay for new content every few months. If anything, TF2 would get a remake to update it to source 2, and thats about it, otherwise valve probably wouldn't spend resources on making a new game.
@aquilesgarciaperez5918
@aquilesgarciaperez5918 Жыл бұрын
For reasons like This, Is why Tf2 is (if you forgive me to say it): *A timeless Masterpiece*
@dragon_ball_sucks_video
@dragon_ball_sucks_video Жыл бұрын
MVM was never good wtf are you on
@aquilesgarciaperez5918
@aquilesgarciaperez5918 Жыл бұрын
@@dragon_ball_sucks_video MVM is Optional, The 12v12, Highlanders, 6v6 and LITERALLY EVERY OTHER GAMEMODE (created by Valve or the Comunitty) is 10 times Better than Overwatch. ¿And you know why?: because they're are FUN
@dragon_ball_sucks_video
@dragon_ball_sucks_video Жыл бұрын
@@aquilesgarciaperez5918 ah yes, free labor again
@aquilesgarciaperez5918
@aquilesgarciaperez5918 Жыл бұрын
@@dragon_ball_sucks_video dude admit it, Overwatch is not Fun anymore (not even the first one after playing it by 2 years), at least Valve and the tf community has a Better Social Image than Blizzard.
@dragon_ball_sucks_video
@dragon_ball_sucks_video Жыл бұрын
@@aquilesgarciaperez5918 Dude admit it, you're biased, and you enjoy being dicked by Valve for years now + tf2 is overrated
@lolzism1
@lolzism1 Жыл бұрын
I think the main issue that people forgot when it came to OW2 was that it was supposed to be a COMPLETELY DIFFERENT GAME. It was not supposed to override the $60 OW1 with a free to play, pay-to-win, gutted out bastardization of what the original was.
@DawnApon
@DawnApon 8 ай бұрын
This is unfortunately why I will never return. It just makes no sense to get treated worse than ever in the game I bought like 8 years ago.
@leophyte9663
@leophyte9663 Жыл бұрын
Another point that I thought of when watching this video: if the lore is locked behind a paid service, will it ever have a satisfying ending, like a real story? Would they have multiple campaigns to never stop making missions? Or would the main campaign just be really long and (probably) boring until it ends to bring back people?...
@RdTrler
@RdTrler Жыл бұрын
It won't. Just look at Destiny 2 -- it's got this story that just goes on and on and on and on. Every few months they come out with a new season, and every few months its some new dialogue or story or whatever. Since the devs are being paid to continue a story, they have a financial reason to not end the story. Stories are good when they *end.* It's a paradox of what they want, and what everyone else wants.
@Frenchaboo
@Frenchaboo Жыл бұрын
I remember being really hyped for OW2 when it was first announced because I played the first game obsessively. I eventually got frustrated with it and stopped following the news until OW2 released, and I decided to download it blindly. My sheer astonishment when I saw that this was the exact same game with a couple more maps and an obnoxious way to access cosmetics... they didn't only not deliver on the game they promised, they also completely ruined OW1. I was a completionist who had almost every cosmetic for every character from just playing, never bought lootboxes. Now it's impossible. And now they demand more money for PVE, while the game is free, except if you paid 60 bucks for it at release. And that's without even mentioning all the Blizzard scandals. Just... ugh. They turned the most popular game in the world for a while into one of the worst ones.
@Alex-vl1mk
@Alex-vl1mk Жыл бұрын
And yet with all this said, people still play it. Isn't that wonderful? :)
@FlakkerDPS
@FlakkerDPS Жыл бұрын
It's pretty wild to me how MvM has been neglected since 2 cities and it STILL has more content than the product of a big budget studio, even putting aside how much more extensive community server MvM gets, the base game still has more than OW2 is offering,
@dragon_ball_sucks_video
@dragon_ball_sucks_video Жыл бұрын
MVM was never good wtf are you on
@Mordecai02
@Mordecai02 Жыл бұрын
@@dragon_ball_sucks_video _That_ would be your _mother._
@dragon_ball_sucks_video
@dragon_ball_sucks_video Жыл бұрын
@@Mordecai02 you are getting pegged by my mother?
@notspookwagen
@notspookwagen Жыл бұрын
@@dragon_ball_sucks_video I think Mordecai is saying your mother is never good in bed
@Azazel386
@Azazel386 Жыл бұрын
​@@dragon_ball_sucks_videoYour opinion isn't that important buddy, just because you don't like it, doesn't make it a bad gamemode. And no, replying with "your opinion is also not important" doesn't make you any original.
@unlikelyhydra926
@unlikelyhydra926 Жыл бұрын
The mood the first minute of this video was actually me... Not paying 15 dollars for about 1 Hour of story gameplay. When I can actually pay 15 dollars for a different game with more variety and replayability. My god they dropped the ball so fricken hard.
@starmaker75
@starmaker75 Жыл бұрын
And here I thought about paying $3.00 to $4.00 to get a small chance to get a golden/Australinum weapon was somewhat ridiculous
@leonel392
@leonel392 Жыл бұрын
@@starmaker75 I mean, if you are like, super lucky, and you get something like a rare australium or golden pan, then you can sell that shit for several times its original price, that alone created a huge trade community in TF2, and that alone made the mode even more prominent if possible
@potatoes5829
@potatoes5829 Жыл бұрын
here are a couple titles you might recognize, which you could buy for $15: undertale stardew valley phasmophobia don't starve together terraria iracing Gmod L4D (2) portal (2) ... Or you could buy 3 story missions in OW2
@Arekkizu
@Arekkizu Жыл бұрын
@@potatoes5829 left out deep rock galactic, one of the best pve games out there
@delusion5867
@delusion5867 Жыл бұрын
@@potatoes5829 Those are all probally about a several months worth of fun (a far greater amount of fun for gmod, L4D, terraria considering how much content people have made for those and they're multiplayer) and far more valuable that 3 story mission that you'll finish in an hour, and replay once or twice
@flipadoodles8677
@flipadoodles8677 Жыл бұрын
on the topic of cutscenes, this is one of the few times where Halo infnite actually had an amzing approach to them (even if they have been cancelled, big sad). The multiplayer story cutscenes featured your own custom spartan, OC's are a big thing in the halo community and it was honestly incredibly cool see my own character interacting and playing part in the larger story with the other characters. Furthermore they made 2 scenes per event, last one unlocking when you complete the event. They basically countered youtube by giving you personal investment, and putting a buffer on the upload time making it just as fast to play the game yourself than just waiting for an upload. Still a big shame they were cancelled though :(
@HappyBeezerStudios
@HappyBeezerStudios 11 ай бұрын
They went with the "if your custom character appears in a cutscene" meme and made it a feature.
@zombieguy4444
@zombieguy4444 Жыл бұрын
1:18 In case anyone's curious, here's that list: - F2P model that requires you to spend a lot of time or spend money for new heroes in a game that’s about counter switching - Downgraded user interface/experience - Features taken out from OW1 that rally had no reason to be - Inconsistent matchmaking throughout its current life - Rank rework that made little sense and messed up the system as well as players perception of rank > skill - Removal of loot boxes (which were easily earnable for free) replaced with an overpriced shop - The time to grind the currency for a legendary skin takes entirely too long, almost like they want you to buy their stupid premium currency - Sense of progression erased. Progression is now tied to a seasonal battle pass that’s wiped at the end instead of a player level that would reward you with a loot box - Half assed balancing and reworks at the beginning of OW2’s life resulted in several heroes feeling out of place or worthless - New heroes are over-kitted, as their new philosophy is supposedly to make heroes more generalist and somewhat interchangeable as opposed to specialists for certain situations. Best seen with Ramattra being a master of none and lifeweaver having way too much in his kit - Kiriko immediately contradicts this philosophy due to the absurd utility of Suzu Cleanse making her a must pick in many situations. Ana constantly nading your team? Kiriko. Mei ccing your team? Kiriko. Any hero that has applicable status effects or kill combos? Suzu. Counter an entire ultimate? Suzu. - Push fucking sucks ass to play. It’s super snowbally and absolute agony for immobile heroes (Ana, Zen, Mei, etc.). The matchmaking makes this mode worse than it should be with uneven team skill levels. - The Blizzard polish is gone. This game has had an insane number of bugs, both visually, minor, and game breaking, that shouldn’t occur from a triple A developer whose reputation used to be “polish”. - Game altering bugs can be unresolved for months, but as soon as there’s an issue related to the shop and money, it’s fixed as fast as possible - There’s no simulator for Baptiste to sell me life insurance - I’m serious, Bap could sell me life insurance all day and I’d be content with OW2 - They gave Mercy a Karen haircut - They don’t arbitrarily nerf Genji every patch - We still don’t have speedo skin Roadhog - Not enough gay - Too much gay - We still haven’t seen Kiriko on her bike - I actually hate Kiriko - Like, burning passion hate everything about Kiriko from a visual design and character standpoint - Again, why isn’t Baptiste selling me life insurance?!
@rararasputin8608
@rararasputin8608 Жыл бұрын
Hey, you beat me to it. Thanks man, you're doing Saxton's work.
@dragon_ball_sucks_video
@dragon_ball_sucks_video Жыл бұрын
You dont spend shit to unlock characters. Interface is the same. Ranked is better. G "Grinding" is better then playing 1k for an ugly particle effect. Slander about new heros. Tf2 has no Bugs at all, and is perfectly bot free. Tf2 isnt gay at all. Genji isn't op, just Play Moira, Winston, Zaria, or just dont shoot him when he's reflecting. And you're not funny + MVM was never good wtf are you on
@Neko_Medic
@Neko_Medic Жыл бұрын
Speedo roadhog. Aight working on that fan art. Gonna put skymin there as well.
@Rookie417
@Rookie417 Жыл бұрын
Gonna be honest no loot boxes is better
@dragon_ball_sucks_video
@dragon_ball_sucks_video Жыл бұрын
@@Rookie417 wtf
@fractalisomega9517
@fractalisomega9517 Жыл бұрын
It's more of a Valve vs Blizzard issue Valve basically lets employees work where they want, and as long as it's making some money they're good Blizzard is more of a "traditional" business, you work where you're TOLD, and maximizing the profit is the main goal The issue for Blizzard is that they're willing to put people on projects who don't love their game, they'll cut out content to save money, and they'll lock things behind paywalls to maximize the cash flow Valve's issue is that flashy new games and projects are more likely to get a larger staff group working on it, while old games like TF2 are left with a skeleton crew because they're old Both have problems but between the two, TF2 was made with love and for enjoyment which is why it is still standing today.... OW was designed as a way to separate they player from their money and will wither and die when Blizz makes a new game to push
@izzywood2874
@izzywood2874 Жыл бұрын
Valve has that indie spirit
@starburst98
@starburst98 Жыл бұрын
It sounds like overwatch's main issue is the quantity of characters. If there were 9 characters like tf2 then giving them all skill trees would have been WAAAAY easier.
@Tamamo-no-Bae
@Tamamo-no-Bae Жыл бұрын
I point at another blizzard game called Heroes of the Storm. It has way more characters with 2 ultimates each and talent trees as you level.
@HappyBeezerStudios
@HappyBeezerStudios 11 ай бұрын
They could've just scaled down the skill trees. Maybe even have some shared skills. If you have 30+ characters, giving each of them 40 unique skills is a lot of work. But if each gets 10, you instantly reduce the time needed.
@mariustan9275
@mariustan9275 3 ай бұрын
​@HappyBeezerStudios Yeah I mean heck most of the upgrades in tf2's MvM aren't unique. Stuff like firing speed, reload speed, projectile speed etc are all basic upgrades basically everyone can use. There are SOME unique ones. For example medic and engineer given they're different roles and damage output get unique healing based upgrades and building upgrades respectively. Some get unique upgrades like snipers explosive headshot, bit yes a lot of them are the same
@freezingjazzy
@freezingjazzy Жыл бұрын
Blizzard Activision making moves so bad it brought Skymin back. Keep doing it Blizzard Activision.
@british35
@british35 Жыл бұрын
The Activision half isn’t much better
@NeoKaiser0
@NeoKaiser0 Жыл бұрын
It's nice to know that there's someone else who's aware that there's more to competition than just aiming.
@jacob7649
@jacob7649 Жыл бұрын
It helps tho
@MK_ULTRA420
@MK_ULTRA420 Жыл бұрын
Movement, communication, positioning and situational awareness are more important but aiming really does help.
@jpjfrey5673
@jpjfrey5673 Жыл бұрын
Unfortunately the current iteration of Overwatch enforces and rewards exactly that: solo performance and mechanical skill over teamwork (which used to be necessary in 1). OW2 puts far greater emphasis on personal performance with 1 tank, lack of barriers and healers fending for themselves This is one thing Skymin got wrong: we're not taught to learn more than aiming in OW2, *we're forced to learn aiming regardless of role*
@ryanlorenzo5003
@ryanlorenzo5003 Жыл бұрын
Blizzard: We're squeezing as much money out of the customers, cut the developer budget. Valve: Send in the Seal.
@donder172
@donder172 Жыл бұрын
I don't know why, but at 0:02 I swear I read the first time "the day *Skyrim* lost her mind".
@Believe086
@Believe086 2 ай бұрын
XD
@redmii69
@redmii69 Жыл бұрын
I'm glad KZbin recommended this video to me, it's been nice to see you again, considering you were one of the main people who got me into TF2.
@maxav1wolvman874
@maxav1wolvman874 Жыл бұрын
The absurdity of industrial robots built in the 60’s-70’s, have money as their power source, is much more appealing to me then standard technological hacked robots in the distant future
@welcomefire
@welcomefire Жыл бұрын
Hearing pve decompressed as "player versus environment" rather than "player versus enemy" gave me whiplash.
@OrionDawn15
@OrionDawn15 Жыл бұрын
You didn't know what it was before? Player versus Enemy can have a pretty broad meaning, it can apply to both players and AI. So it wouldn't make sense to make it mean that.
@NeonDripKitty
@NeonDripKitty Жыл бұрын
im in the same boat, always thoght it was enemy, tbh I think engine as in game engine would make more sense cos enemey could mean human players and environment sounds like its a survival game
@hexagonrz7813
@hexagonrz7813 Жыл бұрын
...Isn't PVE short for Player vs. Entity and not Enemy or Environment?
@OrionDawn15
@OrionDawn15 Жыл бұрын
@@hexagonrz7813 Nope, you can search it up. "Player vs. Environment" is what it is.
@paperclip6377
@paperclip6377 Жыл бұрын
​@@OrionDawn15 spreading misinformation based
@TheSeabornGaming
@TheSeabornGaming Жыл бұрын
I honestly hope that we get more MvM stuff at some point. I think I almost fell off my chair when I saw that they were going to end up charging for PvE
@tonivoul1971
@tonivoul1971 Жыл бұрын
What do you mean end up charging for pve?
@sovietunion7643
@sovietunion7643 Жыл бұрын
@@tonivoul1971 charging as in money required to use
@tonivoul1971
@tonivoul1971 Жыл бұрын
@@sovietunion7643 thanks
@diggyrobinson5859
@diggyrobinson5859 Жыл бұрын
Don't MvM tours cost money to get into
@tonivoul1971
@tonivoul1971 Жыл бұрын
@@diggyrobinson5859 it's like 1$ to buy this doesn't not compare to the cost overwatch will make you pay
@joehutchison3929
@joehutchison3929 11 ай бұрын
Let's just not forget that people were saying Overwatch was going to be the TF2 killer.
@IRidez
@IRidez Жыл бұрын
I remember when OW was touted as the TF2 killer. Here I am watching this with a giant smile on my face @ how the tables have turned 😂
@mjrobo1795
@mjrobo1795 Жыл бұрын
Tbh as a tf2 + OW fan it was definitely possible. Blizzard just mismanaged the heck out of it. The game was on track to be huge and then they made horrible owl decisions and balancing decisions that pushed away so many people to make OWL more exciting to watch.
@Laza721
@Laza721 Жыл бұрын
@@mjrobo1795 Who would have thought that ignoring your game would actually save it from destructing itself. Both funny and sad for TF2
@Glitchmouse2
@Glitchmouse2 11 ай бұрын
@@Laza721 it was possible that overwatch would have killed tf2. All they needed to do was make overwatch 2 keeping everything they promised IN THE GAME. That would have 100% killed tf2. But due to how bad blizzard is at keeping games alive, well they lied to their community and made many overwatch fan move to tf2.
@ZerotheBlade
@ZerotheBlade 11 ай бұрын
When was OW ever considered a TF2 killer? Jeff said it himself that OW will never kill TF2 back in 2016.
@ILieToEveryone1337
@ILieToEveryone1337 11 ай бұрын
Given the money people have pumped into their tf2 accounts, I doubt tf2 would ever die
@DaRealBruner
@DaRealBruner Жыл бұрын
Bruh imagine buying a game, and then basically having to buy it *again* to experience the main selling point.
@1twasmeBarry
@1twasmeBarry Жыл бұрын
ea
@OrionDawn15
@OrionDawn15 Жыл бұрын
@@1twasmeBarry As far as I know, EA hasn't tried that... yet.
@1twasmeBarry
@1twasmeBarry Жыл бұрын
@@OrionDawn15 nah i remember og battlefront from 2016 (i was 10) and they made all these op characters just dlc and locked so i guess pay to win. on second thought you are right I can't remember ea locking the primary function behind a pay wall
@rudysarmiento8700
@rudysarmiento8700 Жыл бұрын
0:50 what's even more taunting is the fact in the first story mission he actually does that move with his shield
@pneumaofthedreamrealm8977
@pneumaofthedreamrealm8977 Жыл бұрын
Not sure it it quite fits the model, but Salmon Run, the PvE mode from Splatoon 3, seems to meet most of the points you were making, it’s a team of four matchmaking mode in which you fight off hordes of salmonids and taking out bosses in order to collect eggs you bring to the basket at spawn before time runs out to clear the wave. There are three waves per shift (with an extra boss fight wave occasionally happening) which can each have a different tide level and gimmick. And your weapons are randomized from a pool for your team. It’s got a lot of variety, it’s the best way to make money in the game, and it’s accessible as soon as you reach lv 4 (which you get after about an hour of play in the main game mode, alongside all other shops). I know it’s not F2P, but I think it qualifies as a good PvE mode based on the criteria presented here
@atkvin
@atkvin Жыл бұрын
Splatoon is definitely not F2P though, you need Nintendo Online to even play its online game modes. Not knocking on it, I love Salmon Run more than the pvp mode now.
@phantomsanic3604
@phantomsanic3604 Жыл бұрын
Salmon Run is goated
@borndrago
@borndrago Жыл бұрын
I hecking love Salmon Run
@SirPembertonS.Crevalius
@SirPembertonS.Crevalius Жыл бұрын
OW2 co-op being canceled bummed me out so much, it genuinely got me hyped to play some casual, campaign-style overwatch 2 with some friends. But we instead got the worst rug pull I've ever seen for a video game.
@justatankwithinternetacces8338
@justatankwithinternetacces8338 Жыл бұрын
Another pemperton sighting
@an0rmalname179
@an0rmalname179 Жыл бұрын
Aye same here but without the friends part... I was looking forward to hammering down on some robots, or doing something like what Genji did in the trailer...
@SADmemer.
@SADmemer. Жыл бұрын
@@justatankwithinternetacces8338he’s every where
@bradaloop
@bradaloop Жыл бұрын
Afaik the coop isn't cancelled? In fact, you can only play the pve with other players?
@Kalmaro4152
@Kalmaro4152 Жыл бұрын
At this point, we might as well go play DRG
@Pharrow
@Pharrow Жыл бұрын
I’m over a week late, but thanks for using my Momocon pic of your Cabana Ana cosplay! I felt super giddy seeing it again after so long.
@SkyminSlash
@SkyminSlash Жыл бұрын
I really need to put it back together! The gun has broken in multiple places and I never got around to replacing the top so it actually matched the pants.
@twelve1844
@twelve1844 Жыл бұрын
Imagine being so mad over discontinued promises to the point that you made your script about a detailed rant about it speaks so much. Keep up the good work bud, hope you dont get a wave full of Überbots
@yumyum366
@yumyum366 Жыл бұрын
11:27 Soldier's ability to carry around his healing station was shown off in the trailer I think. I remember some content creators calling it out specifically thinking that the april fools was going to be a preview of the upcoming pve content. I guess it was more "let's recycle what we have" 18:55 Most card games have their story mode locked behind either a paywall (usually $15-$20) or an in-game currency grind-wall. (Usually takes 1.5-3 weeks to grind out, low end is TESL, high end is HS) These modes usually provide unique cards as reward, alongside the story missions. Hearthstone's are sort of unique, because they gave up on the story missions at some point and the older story missions can only be purchased with the premium cash currency now. The monetization is very similar to how hearthstone's. (3 act story mission for $15)
@SkyminSlash
@SkyminSlash Жыл бұрын
The card games I play are rogue-lite, soooo I definitely have no knowledge of PvP card games like Hearthstone and Magic.
@heinrichkrull2523
@heinrichkrull2523 Жыл бұрын
Also him having biotic field attached to him was in the April Fool's patch.
@sauronplugawy3866
@sauronplugawy3866 Жыл бұрын
Gwents story mode fucking slaps. I Played it in Polish and i fucking loved characters and the story.
@yumyum366
@yumyum366 Жыл бұрын
@@SkyminSlash Magic doesn't have a story mode. They sell physical books or post the story online for free (they flip flop between the two every 5 years or so). Digital card games (Hearthstone, Elder Scrolls: Legends, Eternal Card Game, etc., etc.) have a story mode in game that usually sells unique cards and solo pve content.
@novaseer
@novaseer Жыл бұрын
Meanwhile Legends of Runeterra puts Path of Champions in for free. So free that you physically cannot pay for it, in fact. Imagine having worse monetisation than RIOT effing GAMES.
@WaylonTF2007
@WaylonTF2007 Жыл бұрын
It's been 11 years since MVM and it's still the best PVE gamemode I've ever played in a first person shooter. Oh well
@DellConagher1
@DellConagher1 10 ай бұрын
I have 2000 hours on tf2 and most of them were spent on Bootcamp
@sergiutudor333
@sergiutudor333 Жыл бұрын
i just got back to playing tf2 and i was visiting the tf2 youtubers i used to watch to see if they are still doing content. i almost tought u dissapeared after i saw that the last video was posted 5 months ago. thank god ur still here
@LuxiBelle
@LuxiBelle Жыл бұрын
They should have taken only 5 or 6 heroes, given them fully fleshed out kits and made levels arund. Then added more heroes over time and tweaked things if needed. Doing it for 30+ heroes feels like massive scope creep.
@scantyer
@scantyer Жыл бұрын
Skymin i just wanna say you're really one of the best youtubers when it comes to explaining why somethin is flawed/good. I know ur not posting this type of video much but i love that.
@keecko8169
@keecko8169 Жыл бұрын
also should note that mvm botkillers were a big reason to play, alongside it being really cheap to play, you were guranteed 1 botkiller that could come in a variety of variants, even today blood, diamond, silver, gold, basically any botkiller other than rust hold up really well and still look beautiful
@RobbertRobbert12345
@RobbertRobbert12345 Жыл бұрын
Only issue is actually getting into tours that give botkillers because everybody plays two cities just to get horrible killstreak kits hoping for a professional fabricator, just for it to be rigged to give you professionals for bad melee weapons 90% of the time.
@wyslanniknewworldorder9525
@wyslanniknewworldorder9525 Жыл бұрын
@@RobbertRobbert12345 Collectors Professional Killstreak Unusual Warp Paint Haunted Australium Minigun! (Price: *~14,000,000 keys* )
@johnny88j9
@johnny88j9 Жыл бұрын
I love how 8 years later TF2 is stll helping to give you content! It has outlived so many EA and Ubisoft titles!
@Iminyowalls
@Iminyowalls Жыл бұрын
This video has been in my feed since it came out and I’m kinda glad I watched it now. I’ve gotten into mvm now and finally experienced the tf2 community firsthand during this time and I can say for sure this video really hits the spot
@kraztar
@kraztar Жыл бұрын
I think leaving the community made work for tf2 entirely is actually unfair. I totally get setting it aside because we want to focus on the on release specefic content. but even just on release tf2 having the ABILITY for community to develop and engage with the game in that way simply doesnt exist in Overwatch. technically overwatch has a mode that lets you change a couple numbers but the actuall creation of new models maps modes content doesnt exist at all not to mention overwatch traps you into using there built in restrictive system and to my knowledge you cant combine it with the pve stuff anyways. my point is that so much of the games industry has moved away from giving communities any level of control over the games they engage with and consume instead only being locked in to the forcefed (and payed for) systems that the industry delivers to the players, they literally dont allow for community tools because they DONT WANT TO COMPETE. This should be on the face of it ridiculous and so tf2 even having that OPTION even before anything gets made is a HUUUGE point in tf2s favor and so removing it entirely from the discussion is foing tf2 a disservice (not that it needs it lol).
@SkyminSlash
@SkyminSlash Жыл бұрын
You seem to understand why I left it out in the first place, so I don't have to reiterate that. I did initially have a small portion of the video where I mentioned the community servers, but it was intertwined with a misunderstanding on a portion of information, so I ended up just cutting it entirely, because it was only like 2 sentences. You can see where I cut it because there's an abrupt mention about OW2's custom games in regards to previous seasonal PvE.
@heinrichkrull2523
@heinrichkrull2523 Жыл бұрын
I think we can have this discussion if or when you can play the PvE parts in custom games, so you can alter them in the Workshop, then we could compare community made MvM vs Overwatch Workshop PvE.
@BustyCatbot
@BustyCatbot Жыл бұрын
Holy shit Skymin is finally getting the views she deserves again, it's about damn time!
@BustyCatbot
@BustyCatbot Жыл бұрын
@Simbyle Are you okay? What the hell are you talking about?
@baldgagits2107
@baldgagits2107 Жыл бұрын
​@@BustyCatbotit's chronically online behavior sadly, that person is sick so I recommend ignoring them
@BustyCatbot
@BustyCatbot Жыл бұрын
​@@baldgagits2107 I can't even comprehend what the hell was going through that person's head, I'm legitimately concerned for their mental health.
@Aabicus
@Aabicus Жыл бұрын
@@BustyCatbot They have Main Character syndrome, the only thing that matters is what they personally do, so if they stop watching a KZbin channel it stops existing, like how a toddler without object permanence sees the world
@mr.monkey354
@mr.monkey354 Жыл бұрын
​@@BustyCatbotseems like a quote referencing something
@Yarharsuperpirate
@Yarharsuperpirate Жыл бұрын
The difference is, TF2 is actually fun and not some bare bones cashgrab that is more cash shop then game TF2 at its core, just has alot more passion and heart put into it. And the dedication of the playerbase shows it in return
@radishinglad998
@radishinglad998 Жыл бұрын
Bro how are crates and keys not cash grabs
@eyeballreal
@eyeballreal Жыл бұрын
@@radishinglad998 You aren't obligated to buy crates and keys. Most of the weapons are given for free by playing the game. Crates are mainly just for cosmetic items, you can also get free crates overtime. Majority of crates and keys are rather cheap plus the cosmetics you can get are actually well made. Don't forget you can scrap items that the game gives you to make different items making it so you don't actually have to buy crates and keys at all.
@soakematic
@soakematic Жыл бұрын
@@radishinglad998 and to be fair, with a lot of grinding and patience you can turn all of the weapons found in drops into your first ever hat for 1 ref. atleast back in the day idk about now...
@sumretard
@sumretard Жыл бұрын
I think what's worse is that, IT EAS CANCELLED WAY EARLIED THAN WAS TOLD... and I got that feeling that Diablo Immortal's Abhorrent Microtransaction System succeeding somehow influenced the higher ups of **Activision-Blizzard** to scrap the PVE for something that is a shell of its former self, one of many reasons why it is what is for OW 0.5
@Kalmaro4152
@Kalmaro4152 Жыл бұрын
Once again, I ask, is it Overwatch 2, or 1.2?
@leonel392
@leonel392 Жыл бұрын
@@Kalmaro4152 Overwatch 2, but like, because they managed to CUT content, the fans call it that
@dpray96
@dpray96 Жыл бұрын
Considering they removed access to the previous version, and removed (At launch and even then they still drag/dragged their feet) earning rewards through gameplay without additional payment required...
@2-Way_Intersection
@2-Way_Intersection Жыл бұрын
i mean... thats how cancellations tend to work.
@trainuk8797
@trainuk8797 Жыл бұрын
At 13:17 if anyone wants to know how to fix this issue, you just have to use the console command hud_reloadscheme (I use the command as i enter the game to make sure it works)
@skipmanghondarg
@skipmanghondarg Жыл бұрын
An angel dropped from the heavens, thank you.
@thechillgamer6607
@thechillgamer6607 Жыл бұрын
It's been almost a year since this "sequel" has been out and we still don't have pve
@AngeryCrow
@AngeryCrow Жыл бұрын
TF2: You pay us to play PVE, but you could make a profit back. You need lots of tickets as well, yeah, but you can choose to play the free one if you'd like. Oh, and it's customizable, not to mention that you can also -*the list goes on and on* OW2: We take the thing we promised you for free, turn it down, take it back up, and make you pay for it again! You can't play it on solo as well! Ha ha, more skins! More BP! We fired more good members of the game dev as well! Cause screw you! We are Blizzard! We can't make a skill tree cause it's too hard, yet we made something like Heroes of the Storms! Diablo! Edit: Yes, the long run isn't gonna be profitable unless you got a really good item like the comments told me. RNG reward system was mentioned 8n the video. Also, for the OW2 free part, I thought the PVE was supposed to be included from the first purchase and come later as an update. Which was the first and main reason why people buy OW2, get the PVE.
@ags8507
@ags8507 Жыл бұрын
pve was never going to be free
@vivelespatat2670
@vivelespatat2670 Жыл бұрын
Big emphasis on "can make a profit back". Remember, the house always wins.
@chrismonge3215
@chrismonge3215 Жыл бұрын
​@@vivelespatat2670 fr, the only way youd make a profit would be if you got something really valiable in your first few tours But the longer you go the less profitable it becomes in the long run
@johnmatteson2590
@johnmatteson2590 Жыл бұрын
Gonna echo this yet again, because some people need to hear it: MVM IS NOT “PROFITABLE”, IT IS AN ADDICTIVE RANDOMIZED GAMBLING FORM, AND JUST LIKE ALL OTHER GAMBLING: YOU WILL LOOSE MORE MONEY THAN YOU WIN. Otherwise, we’ll said.
@tairhan52
@tairhan52 Жыл бұрын
and we’re ignoring the part where you can play mvm without spending a single dollar, if you dont feel like gambling
@Warpix7
@Warpix7 Жыл бұрын
You pretty much put in words my feelings about Overwatch 2 PvE... Something I can't do because I'm so frustrated with the news. Feels bad. It saddens me even more knowing this PvE business model is probably going to work since people are stupid and just buy anything thrown at their face if it has "SKINS" written on the front.
@alexv3375
@alexv3375 Жыл бұрын
_"Good news! We're not dying! We are going to live forever!"_ _"I didn't say that! I just said we've actually got some form of PVE in our game."_
@DizzyScorpia
@DizzyScorpia Жыл бұрын
Destiny 2 forcing people that want to actually play a story to shell out even more cash every update is always a fun one
@rory8182
@rory8182 Жыл бұрын
If you want something like what the OW PVE mode would have been, try vermintide 2, upgrades that persist, a vague story, characters that interact, the works
@DakkaScrappa
@DakkaScrappa Жыл бұрын
OW 2 is the definition of "If OW was owned by EA" into reality
@HappyBeezerStudios
@HappyBeezerStudios 11 ай бұрын
They are almost there, they're owned by Activision.
@SunpixZephyr
@SunpixZephyr Жыл бұрын
Team Fortress 2's Summer Update for this year is having it's submissions on the workshop locked in on May 1st, I'd love to see you cover some of the items submitted and also maybe give your thoughts on what an update for TF2 could look like after all this time without one
@j.m9047
@j.m9047 Жыл бұрын
It's cool seeing you do video essays again Skymin! But try not to burn yourself out. Hope you're doing well. Much love!
@KerMaWaffLe
@KerMaWaffLe Жыл бұрын
Funny, Skymin doesn’t make TF2 content and her views are low, but as soon as she makes a TF2 analysis all of a sudden she rises back from the dead
@TheBeaz3
@TheBeaz3 Жыл бұрын
I’m here from post overwatch pve launch, and it’s just a bunch of shoot robot, grab thing, and then wait until you need to grab another thing
@grayling2
@grayling2 Жыл бұрын
while I wasn't too big into overwatch, it was fun for me at release when things were much more casual and nobody has any idea of what they were doing, leading to chaotic dumb fun. overwatch's pve was what really would have gotten me into the game. it's so unfortunate where it's all ended up.
@Psyche_TH
@Psyche_TH Жыл бұрын
Very good video. I wanted to point out that the power-up canteen you get from the achievement is basically a legacy item and you don't really need it, because ages ago they added a normal quality canteen to the default item inventory but it only shows up as equippable when it's applicable, same as the grappling hook and spellbook magazine. In fact the game pesters you every respawn until you put one on. Also the one that you get from the achievement can be obtained from the 'bootcamp' missions you mentioned as well including community servers that have infinite money mods or other things that make it much easier. So aside from it being recommended to unlock useful weapons, as stock is not the best in slot most of the time, you can jump into the mode with no pre-requisites whatsoever. I do think it's worth highlighting the dark side of MvM though which is that in Mann Up mode unless you queue with friends you are practically guaranteed to land in a team of not very nice people that want the game played their way, so that offensive Shortstop strategy would not fly. It is common to be harassed in both text and voice chat over your class, weapon and upgrade choices if they don't perfectly align with the vision of whoever is bossiest in the lobby. And sure blocking them is an option but then you just see a votekick being called against you instead (if one wasn't happening already). Do not give TF2 players the credit of having common sense or independent thought, either, since the chances are that even if you did nothing wrong and the rest of the team is not already friends with the votekick caller, they'll vote 'yes' anyway. So playing the premium/paid version of the mode was bent away from fun and enjoyment into grind and repetition long ago and it's very difficult to recommend. Was that one australium weapon across 100 tours really worth the stress? Even if it was a golden frying pan (good luck ever actually managing to sell one for thousands of USD) I think I'd rather just be happy. It really is just a casino except all the other patrons are abusive towards you specifically so you walk out with a frown even if you won the jackpot.
@willy_b_coyote
@willy_b_coyote Жыл бұрын
The biggest reason why MvM succeeds where OW2 fails is that MvM was actually released.
@chillbizz74
@chillbizz74 Жыл бұрын
This is when a company turns from a beloved company into a corporate company
@sandraswan9008
@sandraswan9008 Жыл бұрын
That's funny because in my eyes blizzard was corporate for a really long time
@GBeastEX
@GBeastEX Жыл бұрын
I love the designs of the OW characters and I want to play the game. I just feel like it's so hostile to the players now.
@tuabuelor6646
@tuabuelor6646 Жыл бұрын
If I remember correctly (I don't know if it's still the same now) you could use more or less 9-12 refined (from the scrap you made by recycling your weapons) to buy the ticket for MvM
@mandeadd
@mandeadd Жыл бұрын
MvM ticket prices are at 38 ref rn. The value of refined metal crashed a while ago.
@MetalPcAngel
@MetalPcAngel Жыл бұрын
This is one of the most humble videos when it comes to OW2s and TF2 PvE videos.
@raptorjack5467
@raptorjack5467 Жыл бұрын
Honestly, if TF2 was given a campaign at some point (Unlikely but cant hurt to hope) I bet the entirety of the TF2 Community would be in a roar of excitement cause we'd get to play a gamemode which is in line with the lore (Again, unlikely but hoping), much more than what Blizzy the Money Stealing Company introduced to the OW/OW2 community
@PMMillard
@PMMillard Жыл бұрын
The real story mode was the friends we met along the way
@McLolzable
@McLolzable Жыл бұрын
GOOD NEWS EVERYONE, WE'RE GOING TO LIVE FOREVER.
@camerongrondzki2716
@camerongrondzki2716 Жыл бұрын
honestly the only thing that's killed OW2 pve is the higher ups at Blizzard interfering with the work of the team to the point Bobby literally had them spend months on an idea he had that he would later scrap, doing this multiple times took literal YEARS off of the development of the game
@TehConqueror
@TehConqueror Жыл бұрын
In Blizzard's defense in terms of yacht money acquisition, them orcas are really doing a number on them.
@armsfan1726
@armsfan1726 Жыл бұрын
Ninjala has a story mode that's locked behind a paywall
@nvvv_
@nvvv_ Жыл бұрын
Glad to see you, you're one of the better casual tf2 players 😁 Always happy to see your content, and I'm glad to see you're well.
@pokcmvmxckm2715
@pokcmvmxckm2715 Жыл бұрын
The first and only MVM tour I did when it originally came out gave me a Bot killer Minigun, I was so damn hyped I got something for one of my favorite characters I never bought another MVM ticket again. And now I get to still enjoy my Bot killer gun with the summer update, it feels great!
@Steelstriker
@Steelstriker Жыл бұрын
The whole, 40 talents thing, sounds like they were trying to incorporate BattleBorn's combat trait system. Also, BattleBorn had a free version that people can play but the main game and more game modes are still locked behind paying for the full game.
@N.Bluesky
@N.Bluesky Жыл бұрын
Frankly, if we compare Blizzard's promises to what was already in Battleborn, it really looks like Overwatch 2 was trying to be Battleborn. Fun facts, this whole OW2 pve thing is good publicity for the Battleborn community who try to resurrect the game... Yes, there are still people who want to see this game again, and not just a little : at least 2300 signed an online petition called "Battle Re-born", even some members of the development team participated. Quite frankly, if Battleborn were to return now, I'm sure it could take the place that Overwatch 2 tried to reach.
@jesteryn6243
@jesteryn6243 Жыл бұрын
YOOOOO I MISSED THIS VIDEOS SO MUCHHHH
@Harvey_Oppenheimer
@Harvey_Oppenheimer Жыл бұрын
I haven’t watched a skymin video in like 4 years
@moekakiryu
@moekakiryu Жыл бұрын
Super great video!! Strongly agree I would have easily paid $60 for a full OW PVE (MVM was by far the biggest draw to TF2 for me, so can't tell you how excited I was for OW2). As soon as I heard OW2 was going to be a microtransaction-fest I jumped ship and left when OW1 shut down. It sucks to hear how badly they're handling the new game mode, but also I hate to say that I'm not surprised either :/
@ColorHeartCarlie42
@ColorHeartCarlie42 Жыл бұрын
Part of me wishes there was a way to mod the overwatch characters into tf2, but I know that Activision would never allow it.
@meraybg8371
@meraybg8371 Жыл бұрын
Most you can do is overwatch hud in tf2
@ianmason96
@ianmason96 Жыл бұрын
Meet the Tracer
@xman9354
@xman9354 Жыл бұрын
You can mod the abilities almost one to one since you can't copyright a teleport or huge explosion
@uningenious
@uningenious Жыл бұрын
​@@xman9354 VScript to the rescue.
@somefries3101
@somefries3101 Жыл бұрын
In my case i would rather mod touhou characters in the game tbh
@Wasker20233
@Wasker20233 8 ай бұрын
3:26 as a 2007 baby i can confirm we are 16 now
@taborbrandon7673
@taborbrandon7673 Жыл бұрын
man I was soo looking forward to the pve because the pvp got so focused on being competitive that it just wasn't fun anymore. sadge.
@joshlee8657
@joshlee8657 Жыл бұрын
A great video. As someone who played TF2 for years but only really connected with it after MVM came out, I was so excited for blizzards version within Overwatch 2. I effectively moved over from TF2 entirely to Overwatch. I was gutted when the news dropped, though not as gutted as Overwatch’s content.
@myleswelnetz6700
@myleswelnetz6700 3 ай бұрын
0:06 The music never starts.
@freddyfoxyton7813
@freddyfoxyton7813 Жыл бұрын
This is just hearbreaking to see. All of things we want to see. True list of things they will do, fun gameplay, and an open relationship between creators and players are now a rarity to this day. It wasnt as much of a norm back then. Especially when Valve took the riegns and show us what we could have. Now we all either have to learn to be careful about what game we want or just give the money and gamble to see if its a good game or not. There is more RNG for games themselves than Valve's chances for me to get Australium Pan! Could we just be truthful and more open guys? All of these lies are tiring. Alright rant over.
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