Stealth: A Controversy

This video has annoyed a lot of Serbians.
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Noted errors:
4:14: Mig-25 not Mig-31
26:00: It would be wrong to say "Big Wings" give bad performance at altitude. This was just bad phrasing. What I meant to say big wings give better performance at high altitudes but affect maneuverability, so if you want to fly high but maneuver you need shorter wings etc etc.
34:50: "Over the Horizon attack" is the wrong phrase as this suggests the jet is capable of aiming at things beyond the curvature of the Earth, it cannot. The correct phrase is "BVR" or Beyond visual range.
1:05:28: I guess it would be wrong to say /all/ long-wavelength radar cannot penetrate clouds, some frequencies of long-wavelength radar are better at penetrating clouds than other radar frequencies.
S and C band frequencies are very good at penetrating clouds and are used primarily as weather radar.
X-band is used as a targeting frequency because it is not a long-wavelength radar, it is a very short wavelength and is the exact kind of frequency modern stealth planes are built to beat.
www.ibm.com/weather/industrie...
www.leonardodrs.com/news/thou...
================
References/sources:
Skunk Works: A Personal Memoir of My Years of Lockheed - Leo Janos, Ben R. Rich (www.amazon.co.uk/Skunk-Works-...)
Have Blue and the F-117A: Evolution of the Stealth Fighter - Albert C Piccirillo , David C Aronstein (www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/AS...)
Low Observable Principles, Stealth Aircraft and Anti-Stealth Technologies - Konstantinos Zikidis (www.researchgate.net/publicat...)
A Dynamical Theory of the Electromagnetic Field - James C. Maxwell
(royalsocietypublishing.org/do...)
Method of Edge Waves in the Physical Theory of Diffraction - P. Ufimtsev,
(apps.dtic.mil/sti/pdfs/AD0733...)
Jon Boyd pilot of 810 Dark Angel interview
( • F-117 Nighthawk Pilot ... )
Thad Darger Interview and presentation
( • Interview with Former ... )
( • Flying the Nighthawk w... )

[@lioneljohnsononvacation2635]

The reason you think that Scotland couldnt build a stealth aircraft in the 18th century, is because its so stealthy and sneaky it was lost immidietly after completion.

[@MrJinglejanglejingle]

Meth Head must've stolen it.

[@HIMPDahak]

What, did they mess up and paint it purple or something?

[@SportyMabamba]

Forgot where they’d parked it after all the celebratory whiskey

[@ScottLovenberg]

To be fair, that's moreso a product of booze than the ability of the craft to not be seen. The plane has been parked in the same garage for decades.

[@colbunkmust]

@@HIMPDahak Only the best stealth fighters are purple. Never seen a purple Su-57? exactly.

[@c3n5i]

F-117 is impenetrable, its armored is sloped 😂

[@aidenupshaw1483]

Now that is an amazing shitpost.

[@EA0700]

Criminally underrated comment lol

[@Polyvinci]

LOL

[@AKUJIVALDO]

And so Serbians used big bada boom missiles instead of AP shells...

[@unclejoeoakland]

​@@EA0700agreed. A model of cruel elegance

[@blahfasel2000]

There was a joke in Germany "How do you get your own Starfighter? Just buy a stretch of land and wait until one drops on it."

[@ergosum5260]

Flying coffin

[@Nerdiness1985]

That's also how you catch Boeing parts these days.

[@moeemmanuel9395]

The good ol Bodennagel

[@manwithnoplan89]

@@Nerdiness1985 Yikessssss.......

[@dobber43]

Man its also crazy the whistle blower "ended himself" the morning of the day he was going to testify against them.​@@manwithnoplan89

[@leonidasxiv7881]

“There’s a stealth aircraft in my yard.” “But where is it?” “Exactly.”

[@krispycool1]

I heard Lockheed lost one in their hangar

[@JohnnyTromboner]

I actually was involved in the development of the F-35. But It's not what you think. My contribution was that I once did a single lathe operation on some little brass tubes that did.. something. I also made some muzzle brakes for that 30mm on the Apache and a nut. Lots of Apache nuts. I forgot where I was going with this but I'm captain of the fighter mafia now.

[@bruceedwards539]

With those credentials - you are the Most qualified member. As you are good at spotting aviation nuts.

[@steelfox1448]

Absolute nutter

[@mrouncervideos2905]

My Uncle technically worked for Lockheed Skunkworks in landcaster California from 1980 to 1989. He was a janitor. But his clearance was very high and it took alot of vetting for him to obtain it.

[@geopoliticsmedia1]

I made a video about the evolution of Lockheed Martin, if you are interested in such issues , please support me and watch this video.

[@danielsnook7362]

Well the f35 concept was tricky to work for all branches that doesn't make it bad f35 has its flaws like every early prototype still can be fixed just the same

[@GraingyAircraft]

Anime girl: censored in one shot, uncensored in the next. Conclusion: Anime girl is T-14 Armata

[@georgesears2916]

Exists only on paper and in nerdy fantasies.

[@GraingyAircraft]

@@georgesears2916 Covered in Russian and Chinese [REDACTED]

[@mecharobby]

​@georgesears2916 couldn't come up with a better comparison

[@kalelbarbosa2081]

" no no hes got a point "

[@JPTQJR]

Skunkworks miraculously doing something because they interpreted a couple of papers differently is the stuff of legends.

[@barrybend7189]

The Spiffing Brit of military research.

[@Recordspin]

Military Autism Complex

[@Renewablefrog1224]

@@barrybend7189 Radio Waves are perfectly balances with no exploits

[@finna1121]

it is not "interpreting a couple of papers differently" those papers, and many papers at the time in that field, focused on providing analytical solutions to radio wave reflection amd diffraction. saying applying this to radar is "interpreting papers differently" is like saying "using a shovel to fill a hole with dirt" is a novel way of using shovels.

[@lifevest1]

“We need to reduce our power bill… let’s invent a fusion reactor.”

[@clevtrog]

A wholesome fact about the F-117 shoot down is the pilot and SAM operator ended up becoming friends. With all the bullshit surrounding that conflict and incident it’s heartwarming to see humanity still shine through.

[@ozpin8329]

Reminds me of that WW2 sortie where a German fighter escorted a damaged allied bomber back to friendly lines.

[@risingsun9595]

@@ozpin8329 Pilot Charles Brown and Ace Joseph Franz Stigler. They reunited in the 80s and stayed lifelong friends until their deaths in 2008.

[@h8GW]

If you're talking about Lt. Colonel Zoltán Dani, I hope he's not spreading propaganda about the shootdown to fan Serbian ultranationalism, because that'd be a dick thing for a friend to do.

[@Zachattack-ot2un]

@@h8GWhe doesn’t, he just lives a normal quiet life, he said it himself that he just got lucky

[@Bornst3ll3r]

@@Zachattack-ot2ungetting lucky is good enough

[@Ispeedymg]

If there isn’t a photoshopped SU-34 wrapped in tin foil or a ghillie suit I will be sorely disappointed Mr. Pig.

[@TheEngineer4077]

You mean tin foil AND a ghillie suit, probably made in China, because they need all the luck they can get... And of course both of them will sabotage what little 'stealth' they had. Because making a not very good product and then somehow shooting themselves in the foot is the Russian way.

[@Harley_Mitchelly]

You are disappointed, but he does raise you "Scottish Rick Sanchez," and so he managed to get by.

[@aimlesscrusader_6768]

I'm sorry, how is your comment older than the video?!

[@simpli_histori]

@@aimlesscrusader_6768the video premiered h eight hours before it released, and you could comment then

[@Gerg_de]

I wonder how long it will take for redeffect to make a video on this

[@cncmne7404]

"This video may annoy a lot of Serbians" is a sign that everything here is true.

[@VersusARCH]

Actually he is wrong about several points. Firstly on 30th of April 1999. a 2nd F-117 was hit and damaged beyond repair by the same SAM battery that downed the 1st F-117 on March 27. Next, the "bomb bay door was open when missile locked", the "bombers took the same route" and "spies watching the airbase told the SAM battery that there were no SEAD planes (as if they can't come from a different base and rendezvous with the F-117s in the air) are all US cope propaganda bits. The plane had completed its bomb run and was on the way back when it was hit (pilot's words), SAMs were there not because they picked the approach pattern but because they were forming a ring around the capital which contained a lot of potential targets.

[@kekkoinen]

​@@VersusARCHso the statement was true, it did annoy a Serbian

[@brecibros2469]

​@VersusARCH leave it to the ass hurt serb to call stuff propaganda when it disvalues their only notable military action in the nation's history

[@VersusARCH]

@@kekkoinen I am used to US propaganda it doesn't annoy me. It is usually easily countered with facts and common sense.

[@MostlyPennyCat]

How on earth is "only visible when the bomb bay doors were open" American cope? 😂 It was just a lucky shot. If they had been 2 seconds late switching on the radar, they would have seen nothing.

[@Nala15-Artist]

The F-104 Starfighter has a nickname in Germany. It's "Widowmaker".

[@lnhp5592]

It had even more nicknames: Erdnagel (Ground-Nail), and Sargfighter (Coffin-fighter)

[@littlegrabbiZZ9PZA]

There's a common joke among us Krauts: Q: What's the cheapest way to get your hands on a starfighter? A: Buy a field.

[@firewolfy_6]

@@lnhp5592 Erdnagel was a reference to a military manual at the time which refers to tent pegs as 'erdnagel', as such it's more accurately translated as tent peg rather than ground nail.

[@bificommander7472]

Not sure if Lawndarts were ever marketed in Germany, but if they were, that'd be a suitable nickname too.

[@ToaArcan]

@@bificommander7472 That's what the _Canadians_ called it, along with "Aluminium Death Tube." Their attrition rate was almost as bad as Germany's.

[@ethandolbear3834]

7:32 - "Which you probably should know because it was in the title" YOU LIED TO ME

[@Lizzie-Bee]

We just couldn't see it.

[@weeb3244]

It is there, it's just stealthy

[@27duuude1]

Stealth is making a video about the f-111 without making a video about the f-111

[@EyeKnowRaff]

The ultimate stealth mission. 🤌

[@hughgrection7246]

SHHHHHHHHHHH !!!!!! @@EyeKnowRaff

[@liquidpatriot4480]

They already made it, you just can't "see" it 👀

[@seanlee4502]

That’s good

[@MadMargaretGaming]

Bit of aussie pride that the air show footage montage is essentially all RAAF pigs

[@RamadaArtist]

The fact that LP spends minutes explaining what the ground is and its historical military relevance is exactly why I come to this channel.

[@vovochen]

Dont believe everything. He is very, very wrong about the low freq Radar in this video.

[@hyperx72]

@@vovochen Then what's the facts about low frequency radar?

[@abdulmasaiev9024]

@@vovochen I'm pretty sure he's 100% right about the ground and the military importance and utility thereof. And the fact that you're just copy/pasting this without any relevance to what you're commenting on drives his credibility up further.

[@vovochen]

Oh, really ? Mind looking up the Rmax (maximum radar range) Equation ? Tell me, why is Lambda squared the numerator, if he's right ?@@abdulmasaiev9024Lambda squared is the numerator, because detection range goes UP by the square of the wavelength, NOT down, as he states here. Anyone with the most basic understanding of radar also knows bigger wavelengths pick up LESS birds and so on; and Radars do NOT generally pick up "the sunshine", unless scanning the spot the sun is in or at sunset, where there is a second-long flicker on the screen. Hes completely fucked over us engineers here.. he's, in essense, saying we would be stupid fucks for every country using Early Warning Long Wave Radars. All of what he claims is exactely the opposite. Ive sent so many messages, bcz how would I type a custom one to each person, hm ? And the people deserve to know hes got everything exactely the wrong way. But yes, hes mostly right in his video, just not about Radar.

[@Myerknas]

And yet this video is not one of the ones sponsored by Ground News!

[@Kain292]

My grandfather was stationed in Germany during the era of the Starfighter, and worked with NATO countries on crash recovery when those things went down. As he got older he became more willing to talk about his time over there, and he broke down talking about the times he would go out on recovery missions and they would basically have to scoop the pilots out of them. These were guys that he saw on base, had beers with, and vacationed with.

[@Grimm112]

yeah, that must have been rough. I'm just amazed they kept flying them after the first few dozens of fatal accidents...

[@VarangianGuard13]

Gods and Goddesses bless your Grandfather, may the Einherjar sing his name, as the sky warrior takes his place amongst them. And, having brought the fallen home, may the Valkries chant his name, when he crosses the Rainbow Bridge.

[@Claymann71]

​@@VarangianGuard13🤘😎 WITNESSED 'All Engineering Rules are Written *IN BLOOD.* '

[@h8GW]

At least Lockheed went from a company that owes its success from controlling governments to owing its success by building the best shit in the world.

[@marseldagistani1989]

@@h8GW Lockheed makin' best of the best While Boeing falling from grace

[@David-ir6dk]

LP: Let me tell you why the F14 was actually the first Stealth Fighter. Spray: *Spins in Grave*

[@rohesilmnelohe]

In a way... it is true... it can outspot anything that isn't a 5th gen fighter... with the plausible exception of SU35. Peak NCD though😂

[@murphy7801]

​@@rohesilmneloheI mean back then, 4.5 gen fighters wouldn't really be relevant

[@balazsneuperger2063]

With a missile made in 1966, the AIM-54 Phoenix

[@kittenmittenkitten]

The shootdown of the stealth fighter in 1999 isn't really a story about about stealth technology, it's a tale as old as time about military complacency and how any military hardware no matter how advanced can fall victim to it.

[@Eyclonus]

I'd say its an example of forgetting the human element in warfare. Assuming your opponent won't have some kind of attempt at surveillance on your very public airbase is pretty arrogant. Repeating the same approach corridors into hostile air space seems kind of stupid if you're only confirming that they're "safe" because a plane hasn't been shotdown instead of some kind of recon is just asking for a counterplay.

[@Leenre9]

​@@Eyclonus Murphy's law in action, like most of the time. If it can happen, it will for sure, but people tends to forget about it and getting too comfy in their illusory safety.

[@meme4one]

It's a case of relying on technology over tactics.

[@mrouncervideos2905]

They got lucky shooting it down. Their radar caught it with its pants down or with its missile bay doors open.

[@kittenmittenkitten]

​@@mrouncervideos2905 That's true, but the conditions for that lucky shot to take place should never have happened and could easily have been prevented, so I can't entirely chalk it all up to luck.

[@minutemanjnc4552]

I can just imagine the Skunkworks engineers' faces when they first do the radar test. "Man, this thing looks so stupid I hope it just fails so we can hurry up with something else. Oh, would you look at that, we're getting the radar signature of a seagull." [Looks out window] "No fucking way."

[@M4rk58]

Aw fuck now we actually have to built it, this angular blasphemy

[@ricomock2]

Imagine the reaction of those engineers when they found out that they needed to design a "stealth" pole to stick the model on top of, because the pole was reflecting back too much for them to accurately measure the plane

[@r3dgr4v3]

​@ricomock2 just imagine their reaction when they see the return above the pole. Look up and see a bird. The object that's giving them the return XD

[@ricomock2]

@@r3dgr4v3 There was also an instance during testing of the prototype where a military radar station was used. The military guys were told that the plane was using an advanced jammer which should hide the plane. Once the test took place the military guys reported spotting one target on their radar. They began elebrating their victory of beating the jammer and spotting of the plane, when Ben Rich stepped out the door and looked up to see the F117 prototype and a second chase plane following.

[@granatmof]

Designing the stealth pole was actually a pretty big deal by itself. It cost a few millions and took like a year to developed on its own. There were engineers who had to design a stealth pole, and they did a hell of a job at it.

[@MrDmitriRavenoff]

"AARDVAAAAAAAAARRRRRK. Ya happy? I said it." Yes. Yes we are.

[@Lithuanian_NAFO_lad]

If I try to translate this, it adds an extra A to ADWAAAAAAAARK. Google got class (except it is not)

[@kalelbarbosa2081]

W

[@Yogasefski]

I think you can argue Scotland also created the US Navy. Argument: John Paul Jones is born Scottish. He is also credited as the father of the US Navy. Ergo, Scotland created the 2nd largest air force in the world.

[@aidanacebo9529]

My grandpa designed the avionics system for the F-117 while working for Honeywell. he loves the aircraft, it's his baby. he's now in an old folks home, and can't speak more than a few words at a time, but you mention the "stealth fighter" or the "Nighthawk" or simply the "117", he gets all teary-eyed and sits there in his memories. before he fell down and hit his head so hard he went into a coma about 5 year ago, he and I would go to airshows and museums and he'd find anything he could about the aircraft, and pester the curators about it. about 15-20 years ago, we were at MacDill AFB in Tampa, Florida, and they had an F-117 in a hangar on display, two armed guards around it and a rope cordon. he spent 2 hours talking to one of the guys there about his history with the aircraft, long enough an actual pilot rated for the plane came over and joined the conversation, which lasted another hour after that. it was nice seeing him get that excited about something.

[@MDzmitry]

God bless your grandpa, a very passionate and sweet man he seems to be judging by your story

[@ferdievanschalkwyk1669]

This is the best thing you can do for the elderly. Take them to revisit and enjoy the accomplishments of their life. You are a good grandson sir.

[@dY5FUNCT10N4L]

Sir, this is a Wendy's....

[@dr.j5642]

Maybe show him a picture of the recently seen chrome plated F117, so he knows his baby is still flying, and may even have future missions to complete.

[@Bruisewillies]

The thing that I find difficult to comprehend is that someone's Grandpa developed this. The future came and went

[@tomaszskowronski1406]

so basically it boils down to- "good, our enemies believe those idiots and make countermeasures using flaws our stuff doesn't have" quite brilliant actually.

[@VersusARCH]

And Lazerpig, a famously pro-Russian guy wants to point out to the Russians what they are doing wrong? Yeah right...

[@bransonwalter5588]

Sun Tzu if I recall correctly said, if your enemy is making mistakes, don't correct them.

[@iqcool]

​@@bransonwalter5588 "Do not interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake"

[@abdulmasaiev9024]

This is a great strategy so long your decision makers don't start believing those idiots too. Or if it's not about them actually believing it, so long as the public doesn't give a shit about the details of military procurement and so "they're wasting our tax dollars on useless gimmicks with that!" isn't an enticing line to trot out against incumbents as the opposition. So uh, it can still backfire, and if because of that line anyone feels convinced to turn down their anti-reformer autism, don't, keep it full blast. Also let me tell you how good of a platform youtube is so it doesn't shadowban this comment like it did on first try. Boy, it's so great. I love it. Everyone should buy youtube premium for their every device separately.

[@francesconicoletti2547]

@@bransonwalter5588someone needs to make a video on which bits of Sun Tzu are real as well. Talking about military myths while invoking a military myth disconcerting.

[@LittleMacscorner]

Seriously. U.S. Army veteran and military historian...it is nice to FINALLY watch videos from someone...who...ACTUALLY understands the reality of all this shit. So. Thank you.

[@stefansneden1957]

As a USMC veteran and a trained historian. I 1000% agree with you. My favorite part is him talking about how limited information is used to draw unsupported conclusions as if they are fact. (Referring to his 2+2=7 rant about Low Frequency Radar)

[@Vincent98987]

pro ukr

[@swissarmyknight4306]

@@Vincent98987 You're goddamn right. Are you a pro-Putin fash puke?

[@AlphaGreen58]

Hear all this military rant from the Air Force mafia to the branches and then to the Reformers, it is very interesting.

[@panrandom2127]

One ting f117 was hiped in the movies prier to 1999 like God cards in yu gi oh, all in ex yugoslavia wached movies and sow theat plain, theat is whay it was so special

[@rexringtail471]

My grandad was a Savage aviator in Korea, and got drilled by AAA over Chosin. He hit a 3 wire but the bird was compromised and broke up, started to burn. He had broken both his shoulders in the landing (gear collapsed) and was pulled out by the Chaplain of all people. Have some great pictures of it. He was not fond of the aircraft.

[@VarangianGuard13]

Gods bless that Chaplain. And your Grandfather. Man sounds like a beast, if he survived all of that.

[@Aredel]

“Sorry, Lord. This one’s mine!” - The Chaplain, probably

[@thefreeaccount0]

As correctly modeled in the game "F-117 Steath Fighter", the F-117 is also capable of landing near its target, carefully taxiing around nearby cows and other obstacles, and blasting a bunker to hell at point blank range with its gun and rocket pods. This tactic is not doctrine because of the F-117's main vulnerability - it is incapable of killing cows.

[@godassasin8097]

f-117 vs B-117 (fighter vs bovine)

[@ozpin8329]

I read this in LP's voice.

[@rogirek3362]

@@ozpin8329 Ut is unkeepable of kelling cows.

[@tumage8592]

So it wasnt a old Antiair-system, the serbs weaponised cows

[@0Sirk0]

Ah yes, the fabeled- yet non existent- *AC F-117* AC standing for, "Anti Cow."

[@HappyZavulon]

The Nighthawk is in fact NOT the title of this video at the time of writing this comment, a true marvel of the stealth technology.

[@Kuroth_]

I rarely have so many giggling fits while also hearing an interestingly told and informative military historical story. THAT is why we subscribe. The rambling and humor are the unique and compelling charm of your channel. Crack on, my friend from across the pond.

[@Blind_Hawk]

That's exactly what Lazerpig is about. Even though I think he was a bit funnier back then. But only just by a few bit.

[@DarkRavenhaft]

Regarding the F-14: I remember going through one of many military hardware enthusiast phases back in grade school. For some reason I zeroed in on the tomcat despite never watching topgun. Even did a research project on it, in which my primary focus was the AIM-54 Phoenix missile, not dogfighting. Because having the ability to launch multiple self-guided missiles from BVR means: if you're using the gun, you've fucked up.

[@56bturn]

The F-14, as far as my understanding goes... was a fleet defense fighter. It was designed to basically smack down incoming threats from a standoff distance, and perform other roles, but the AIM-54 was meant for slapping bombers and strike craft out of the sky from as far away as possible.

[@trolleriffic]

I'd be surprised if any F-14 ever used its gun in a dogfight against another fast jet. If it did happen, I'd imagine it was probably during the Iran-Iraq war which is also the last time a dogfight between jet fighters was settled using a gun (in 1988). The last time a US jet needed its gun in a dogfight was in 1972 over Vietnam.

[@sugarnads]

That always shit me about top gun. Who takes a 30+million dollar fighter into gun range when youve got phoenix? It annoyed me when the movie came out and it annoys me every time i watch it.

[@Attaxalotl]

Also the reason Samurai swords (Katanas, Odachi, Nodachi, etc.) were a lot more ceremonial than most people think: if you ever had to use it outside of a duel, it meant you were a shit marksman

[@williampanagopoulos656]

​@@Attaxalotl ....no.. thats so far off the mark your hypothetical samurai would be having to use his sword right about now Katana,wakizashi,tachi.. are just. Swords.. Backups in melee or when you are outside of combat and don't have your gun on you Because they never developed the bayonet. Odachi are bloody greatswords on par with the claymore... And not many used them...

[@claeab255]

Describing a bird as a ball of feathers and anger is the most accurate thing ever

[@ronwalsh]

I am still laughing at that one. My wife thinks I am quite insane.

[@catc8927]

I guess Angry Birds was a documentary, not just a game? 😆

[@Coid]

Birds remember being dinosaurs and have never gotten over the indignity of their present circumstances. @@catc8927

[@peterg1448]

guess he must know about the Australian wedge tail eagle and the magpie.

[@Nostripe361]

@@peterg1448makes me think of the mockingbird. Those buggers can be quite aggressive if you get on their bad side. Used to have one that would dive bomb one of our cats almost daily when he walked by its tree.

[@cruxreturns]

Will there be screaming pig karaoke? I miss the screaming pig karaoke.

[@joshcarter-com]

YES. Please. We all miss your vocal prowess. 🎶

[@Thetiersofmadness]

Once he got big enough, KZbin decided that the karaoke was a VIOLATION OF COPYRIGHT and send all the video revenue from the videos with karaoke to Billionaire record labels, he said so in the French tanks video😒

[@gavinsreid]

You guys miss the Lazerpig karaoke?!

[@thewoodweldingfabricator9300]

KZbin also classified his singing as a hatecrime

[@davitdavid7165]

Same here. I understand why he does nor do them anymore, but still

[@willgeary6086]

I love that for how advanced and game changing the F-117 was it used quite a lot of off the shelf components. The landing gear is from the A-10, the fly by wire systems from the F-16 and the GE F404 engine from the FA/18 Hornet.

[@llmkursk8254]

That's probably not uncommon in industry. The real tech is gonna eat into costs, so using parts off the shelf means saving that little bit extra money. Car companies have done it all the time, the common examples being parts sharing, or using engines supplied by another company (think Shelby and Ford, or Pagani and Mercedes-AMG). Heck, the Lamborghini Diablo used headlights from the Nissan 300ZX (with the Nissan name covered up) and tail lights from a bus. The F-117's engine isn't the innovative part. The real innovation is how you couldn't spot the F-117 on radar.

[@offset7711]

@@llmkursk8254 its very common in all kinds of industiral things. you can make spare parts that fit several different products. Thats a huge advantage for logistics. Its very common in the car industry. You want a good example? check out the grill element of your oven if you have one. there is a part number on it. google that part number and you will find out that your exact grill fits like 50 other models of ovens. even different brands use the same. I just thought of that because 2 months ago i needed one :D

[@lionheart6176]

"I WANT DOGFIGHT! MISSILE MAKE AIR COMBAT NO FUN! NO MISSILE ONLY GUN! I WANT DOGFIGHT!" Pierre sprey maybe. Certified hood classic

[@martinhulin]

MAKE THE M113 A SPACESHIP, A PLANE, MAKE AN F-35 AN M113 Mike Sparks probably

[@brendenhawley2225]

All sci fi movie writers, sounds right, quick let dramatically bank and swoop through space.

[@martingamer7239]

literally me fr

[@baab4229]

I can totally get that. From a spectator's perspective, BVR engagements are boring as hell.

[@MeepChangeling]

@@baab4229 Only because no one writes and shoots them correctly. A BVR enguagment isn't an action scene. It's a suspense scene. If you know that, you can write one what keeps the audience on the edge of their seat. Will the hero's shot connect? How will they evade that next gen misscile coming their way? Are there three enemies, or two?

[@granatmof]

Worth pointing out, the F14 adjusted for inflation has become more expensive per airframe than the F35 due to production capacity and support, which was always the goal for the F35.

[@BlackHawkBallistic]

The F-15EX we're going to procure is more expensive than the F-35A as well and the latest block of F-18s is only a few million dollars less than an F-35C. For what you get in an F-35 it's a steal.

[@MrChickennugget360]

waht?

[@Nmille98]

​@@MrChickennugget360no, no it checks out if we're talking about individual unit price, not R&D budget.

[@TPE429]

​@@MrChickennugget360 the F35 cost around 177 million dollars. Seems expensive but isn't compared to a F14 was 38 million at the time but if we count in inflation it'll be 270 million We could get more advance F35s out of that than making more F14s

[@bluemarlin8138]

The F-14 adjusted for inflation is actually more expensive than the F-22.

[@YourCanadianGuide]

I don't get the big deal, stealth is just fancy and expensive tech that can be shot down by basic anti air missiles. That's what the Russians and Chinese told me. The pentagon should immediately cancel all investments into this project. Wait, why are the Russians investing in stealth tech if it's so usless?

[@connorpoole2194]

Had us in the first half lmao

[@jloiben12]

To be fair, the Russians still haven’t invented stealth yet

[@Hyper_1989]

The Chinese don't say it's useless. They're investing in it for more than russia and they are relatively capable.

[@ChucksSEADnDEAD]

​@@Hyper_1989 They still promote the "stealth is useless, quantum radar any day now" narrative.

[@Ob1sdarkside]

The T 14 armata

[@Notllamalord]

Citing Maxwell for stealth is like a car company citing grog the caveman for the wheel

[@Captain1nsaneo]

Very smart. Grog is litigious.

[@bombercbc9431]

Grog is responsible for the military industrial complex

[@antonhengst8667]

Yeah that part was bewildering to me. At first I was like... Is there another Maxwell?? Like citing Newton for the Space Shuttle

[@El.Gatito.]

grog is responsible for much of civilization

[@Captain1nsaneo]

@@El.Gatito. and legal precedent

[@eriquedobson7523]

1:21:20 Loved this point! I'm surprised you didn't go into this a bit more. Missiles don't work like they do in movies, planes move crazy fast, and the missile is typically launched before you can see the plane... You don't actually have to be completely invisible, just invisible long enough so the guy you're bombing can't react in time or the missile can't correct trajectory. Sometimes these engagements are tens of seconds, so fooling a RADAR for 10-15 can be enough to secure a win, and this example just nails that home.

[@amamdawhatever]

As a former USAF aviator, you completely nailed the Air Force ego hierarchy.

[@richardvernon317]

Must have not served in the 1950's or early 1960's. During that period, The SAC Bomber boys were king in the USAF.

[@billeastwood597]

bruh thats a very small period only 10 years?@@richardvernon317

[@reallyidrathernot.134]

@@richardvernon317 Really? Why was that? I've always thought that it's fighter pilots that have the tougher entry requirements etc.

[@richardvernon317]

@@reallyidrathernot.134 Yep, those requirements were mainly being short in height and low in weight. In the Air Force I was in for 30 years, the basic entry requirement was you had the potential to fly anything when you joined up. Streaming happened after Basic Flying training based on ability and service need. A former Squadron Leader I know finished his Career as the Boss of BBMF (flying Spitfires, a Lancaster and such) after doing tours on the Jaguar and as a Team member of Red Arrows. He Started his operational career flying Chinooks!!

[@vovochen]

Dont believe everything. He is very, very wrong about the low freq Radar in this video.

[@ArmorCast]

It was also in the land that would become modern day Scotland that the oldest sexually reproducing organisms were discovered... So yes, Scotland invented the concept of sex. ... or so I like to tell people.

[@crentz8387]

Nice to see you here❤

[@ggwp638BC]

So we have to update the joke now. Scots invented sex, the Greeks decided to do it with people, and the Romans introduced it to women.

[@gargolus.]

hello armor man. Not to be a cunt, but where are the sources to your videos?

[@shaider1982]

Nice to see you also watch LP's videos👍🏻

[@SonOfAB_tch2ndClass]

*SCOTLAND FOREVER!*

[@namdarkness9630]

Congratulations you now converted me from an a-10 fan to an F111 aardvark enjoyer.

[@lysandermorgensonne9850]

Yet again you continue to be one of our favorite creators. My partner laughed, then sent me a timestamped link to this video. "Here, watch and tell me what you notice." Okay, this should be interesting. "Yeah, sounds like a standard inter-departmental pissing match- IS THAT RUBY WEAPON'S THEME-" You made our day with that, and I regret that we only have one "like" apiece to give :D

[@charlesdaum6007]

Not sure if anyone else has brought this up. But during Desert Storm, the US deployed the F-117 over Baghdad on night one. At the time Iraq had a well developed, well tested radar system which covered most of the country with experienced operators who gained on the job experience during the Iran-Iraq conflict of the 80s. The system was integrated with good redundancy and command and control. It had varied weapons systems for engaging targets flying at multiple altitudes, including SAMs and radar guided AAA. It was only after the F-117s had successfully struck their targets that the system realised it was under attack.

[@JSmith19858]

An American radar system designed and built by ISC and it's sale fully endorsed by the CIA through a South African proxy deal. It would be hard to tell if it failed to spot the F-117 because it was that good an aircraft, or the Americans purposefully sold them a pile of shit that wouldn't have spotted a passenger jet.

[@thunderspark1536]

Idk why everyone is so terrified of UFOs, brother, WE have the unidentified flying objects. With missiles.

[@snowsnow4231]

I like how muricans describe Iraq as some sort of a developed industrial European country to add valour to themselves for defeating a microscopic country of 30 million people which is mostly empty flat desert with no water. A country that had two scientists in the entire state while the rest couldn`t read or write all of a sudden turns into a country with "well developed, well tested radar system" with "good operators". Next time tell us how you bravely defeated Yemen Navy or Argentina Airforce. Ex colonies where people were picking cotton till late 60s. I recommend you to get into an Abrams and push into Artemovsk now, Lazer Pig have been telling us how Bradleys and Abrams are packed with superior western sci fi high tech, so why don`t you demonstrate us how Abrams destroys 50 T-90s with one shot? Or what was your ratio in Iraq? Ah sorry, forgot, your hyper modern 70s tech only works when on the other side there is some clueless Iraqi farmer who picked figs his whole life but all of a sudden became "experienced radar operator". American hawks are literally a bunch of clowns sucking off to themselves in their echo chambers, then 2 days in Avdievka and they go home. "Sorry, I reconsidered my life priorities, I think my family is more important". All of a sudden they stopped liking war. All of a sudden it turns out all this exceptionalism is the result of never getting a proper ass whooping. As soon as a couple hundred thousand Jonnies come home in a box, start acting like normal humans and all this Hollywood bravado ends.

[@JagerEinheit]

The mission was so secret, that the 117's could not report anything, So CentCom put CNN on, hell everyone had CNN on, as they had as much insider information as anyone being one of the first true televised in real time conflicts. both sides had issues with information getting leaked via reporters in the room etc. Luckily for CentCom, Saddam put some of his command and control links inside the "international tower" which held all the civilian satellite links and communication connections out too, figuring that the US wouldn't be as likely to hit it due to the civilian equipment. . When the 117's hit, every news channel lost its link as the tower was a target /was hit too. CNN was reporting live, then BAM ...static, and CentCom knew, the 117s got in and were getting out. it was awe inspiring to see Baghdad literally lit up from tracer fire and the random SAM launch, only to hear time and again, the reporters saying the targets were being hit, and no planes were lost.

[@fort809]

@@thunderspark1536playing spot the difference between ET and a coked-up 90s Lockheed engineer

[@joshuahadams]

The bit about the Nighthawk getting shot down is wild when compared to the F-35 the US _lost_ last fall. Pilot bailed, the plane’s autopilot kept her going, her transponder was off, and she just fucking disappeared. They found her a couple days later, a mess of parts in a field.

[@nolongerblocked6210]

"Found in a field" means it wasn't really lost they just hadn't searched far enough yet

[@barrag3463]

The funniest thing to me about that incident is that everyone acted like it was a ludicrous thing to happen, but it isn't even the 3rd or 4th time a military pilot ejected from a plane in a bad situation or by accident, only for it to stabilize and just keep going.

[@kameronjones7139]

It was a marine pilot if that tells you anything. However jokes aside you will be surprised at much this stuff happens in history regarding weapons from different countries

[@youdontneedtoseehisidentif4939]

@@barrag3463 And at least on that occasion it didn’t end up killing a random Belgian :/

[@KertaDrake]

​@@barrag3463 It's the F-35. The press is contractually obligated to insult it in every way possible.

[@blankityblankblank2321]

So as a physicist, Maxwell was instrumental in electromagnetism and such, but his contributions are slightly overstated from my understanding. I'm by no means a historical expert on the subject, but my my understanding, simply put, he took a few pre-existing theories reconfigured them and combined a lot of pre-existing theories into one bundle. This isn't a simple feat and the man was smart, but he didn't just give virgin birth to an entire field. He like others stood the shoulders of giants before him and became another giant one which we still stand on.

[@garymiller6151]

JCM came up with the idea of the displacement current, thereby showing the duality of the electric and magnetic fields. He showed by these equations that light was an electromagnetic phenomenon and calculated the speed of light very accurately. His contribution was one of the most significant in the history of science - placing him on par with Newton, Faraday, Einstein, Schrödinger, etc.

[@wingracer1614]

That's true of EVERY scientist. Even Einstein who probably comes the closest to having a truly original and groundbreaking idea, really got most of those ideas from other works. He couldn't have done it without the work of others before him.

[@magosmarechferracioli1128]

32:48 As someone that works for his school's archives - a smaller scale, I know - I got the distinct pleasure of working with said damp boxes. The large amount of unidentifiable mold was certainly a fun experience once we realized that it was mold and not chipping paint.

[@casbot71]

Isn't it _curious_ how UFO's in the early 80's were mostly *black triangles.* It even influenced the X-Files, the pop culture idea of an alien spacecraft had moved on from a saucer to a triangle, and stayed that way for a while even after the F-117 had been revealed. It just seems strange that Alien spacecraft keep flying around the same areas where the US airforce tests it's experimental aircraft?

[@MeepChangeling]

Its why the only UFO reports I give any plasuability too at all are the few from before aircraft were a thing at all (there are two of those), and the ones the USAF has made (there are four of those). Even then, they all have logical explanations other than "ALIENS!" but, like, seriously. Those are the credible sources. Also the best one of those? The time the guys launching a weather balloon spotted a UFO, reported it, launched their weather balloon, and had their balloon mistaken for a UFO by some civilian.

[@RamadaArtist]

This is basically an open secret. The USAF loves alien conspiracies because they don't even have to address sightings of their projects; the media will whip itself into a paranoid frenzy and misdirect away from any meaningful information, and the Air Force can quietly go back to testing x-planes or whatever else.

[@WereScrib]

Gonna be honest, I've absolutely seen at least one UFO that was definitely stealth something. MUFON actually got angry when I told them I didn't think there was any extraterrestrial anything about it. An odd black triangle moving VERY SLOW and absolutely silently in the early 00s. Must be aliens, right? I definitely don't live next to a place that used to have a sign saying SECRET SUBBASE on the front of it and a NAVAL RESEARCH FACILITY, or the building that at one point was used to try and make mind controlled murder dolphins and everyone knows this fact who knows anyone at the base. Hell, one of the major aerospace manufacturers is nearby. (also, all this information is very old and I've seen it reproduced on the internet, so this isn't some huge leak, lol, I'm leaving out the stuff that I honestly think could theoretically be relevant or secret beyond 'BOEING TESTED SOMETHING!!!' cos for all I know it could have been a lifting body test, a glider test, a reentry vehicle test, them trying desperately to win back the JSF/F35 contract, a frickin weird blimp, or even some local eccentric built a dirigible again but this one was a triangle instead of a tube.) TBH Even if Bought UFO shit, I'd be buying the Ultraterrestial hypothesis or other 'yeah this shit's actually basically magic, bro', the only really inexplicable reports, by EVERY REAL STUDY has been 'we can't explain this but it definitely wasn't aliens because if it was aliens, we'd have to assume the craziest logic imaginable, everything from 2 foot tall raygun holding tiny astronauts stealing pies, to giants forcing people to eat 14th century peasant recipes' People leave out that Blue Book and Grudge were literally like. "Yeah, a lot of this stuff is an absolute mystery, but there's literally no evidence of it having anything to do with extra-terrestials, russians, or is a threat to the united states." Hell, there's a reason why the people who actually did serious studies abandoned extraterrestrial, the entire hypothesis is basically a new religious movement.

[@lordcthulhu17]

the black triangles had a brief moment, most ufos reported have historically been egg, pill, and cigar shaped which might as well be the shame shape from different points of view

[@ggwp638BC]

Back when I was a kid, I LOVED playing Ace Combat, specially AC4. But I never liked the fictional airplanes, so I'd always avoid the X-02 and the F117A.... Boy, was I in for surprise.

[@GOPGonzo]

My son just got hired by Lockheed Martin to build the kind of stuff you can't tell dad about. LP's description of the personality fits perfectly.

[@garyslayton8340]

My grandfather worked for boeing in the 90s and solved the problem of the blackhawks falling over during destert storm

[@rapoker847]

i have seen this phenomenon personally. on August 15, 2004, Puerto Rico defeated the USA Basketball team 92-73 . when i moved to the states , i was surprised to learn that Americans dont find that match particularly important, most of them dont remember it. in Puerto Rico, it's the stuff of legends.

[@dominikoulehla5902]

I'm not usually interested in military equipment and its history and I don't have the faintest idea why this video fell into my recommended feed, but it is incredible. The video is super well produced, fun to watch and very well researched (at least from the view of a total layman). Absolutely wonderful job!

[@darthbrandon3856]

Praise be unto our lord and saviour Lockheed Martin, whom bestowed upon us unworthy mortals the F-117 Nighthawk, the F-22 Raptor and the F-35 Lightning.

[@anthonykafka42]

And a good contractor job for vets

[@kekistanimememan170]

It’s wasn’t always Lockheed Martin used to be just Lockheed until the last sūp3r in the 90s.

[@Matt-xc6sp]

In Dick Cheney’s name, Amen

[@arugula9253]

P-38 too

[@John2r1]

The only stealth aircraft that can take on the F-22 and F-35 is / was the YF-23 Black Widow II by Northrop/McDonnell Douglas . Which is better at stealth than the F-22 and capable of Mach 2 at least the prototype flew at Mach 2 during demonstrations. So the only fighter not made by Lockheed Martin that can fight on the level of the F-22 is also made in America and now sits in a museum because it wasn't picked and Northrop/McDonnell Douglas decided to scrap the project.

[@TheClaw47]

As someone who deals with Department of Energy archives...they're more like the warehouse in Raiders of the Lost Ark except everyone who put the index card filing system in place died 30 years ago and the filing cabinet with the index cards has been moved after a fire set off the sprinkler system and nobody knows where it is anymore. Which is to say this is a completely accurate depiction of US government archiving.

[@life_of_riley88]

Having worked at a DOE physics lab, this is accurate not only about records, but also IT, building infrastructure, and personnel standards.

[@GeorgeJoubert-id2cv]

Nothing like hearing the worlds unipolar nuclear weapon hedgemony is about as organized as a teenagers bedroom

[@antlionworkerfan2007]

I would make a breaking bad joke about how Department of Energy Archives acronyms as DEA and how the reason why Hank couldn’t find Walter is because of the archives, but that’s stupid

[@Xenomorthian]

@@antlionworkerfan2007Don't belittle yourself its not stupid, you just couldn't immediately think of a funny way to phrase it

[@johnnobody3078]

​@@GeorgeJoubert-id2cv If you find that worrying, don't think about how the missile control systems are still operating on computer tech that is still reliant on magnetic reels and true floppy discs, but staffed by 19 year olds who are seeing a CRT screen for the first time...

[@waltuhgaming6523]

I think lazerpig should just make a video about desert storm, granted he'll probably start it by talking about the garden of babylon

[@gaius9240]

You are not a bad KZbinr. This was informative, entertaining, and hilarious. I burst into laughter multiple times while watching this and tried my best to explain it to gf who was very confused. Thank you for all the hard work you do. Looking forward to the next one. Cheers

[@Blind_Hawk]

Man, your gf is a GEM, protect her with all your might!

[@Nala15-Artist]

He is just being britishly self-deprecating, he's okay.

[@Sigma-gb9yd]

"The F-117 is still flown to simulate enemy stealth planes-" Literally everybody else: "IF I HAD ONE!"

[@jdcrosier2682]

For now, true. But give it 20 years and most of the militarized world will have one. The UK, Italy, and Japan are making one, so is France with some partners I don’t remember off the top of my head, and theoretically so is China.

[@Gillymonster18]

@@jdcrosier2682yay! They’ll still be 20+ years behind the US…provided we can actually settle on a design that doesn’t cost 100s of billions of dollars just to make 😛

[@kf8228]

@@Gillymonster18 Eurofighter Typhoon and the Rafale are about as old as the Super Hornet and better at a similar price. Europe has nothing like the F22/35 for now, but they’ll likely catch up with 6th gen.

[@kf8228]

@@_not_sure_ Ok.😆😆 I guess I should have put it differently: Europeans have no plane like the F35 among their own self made products. Sorry if my post was misunderstood. Yes, I know EU countries fly and even produce F35. And EU 4.5 gen fighters - the Rafaele, Typhoon, and Gripen are so excellent they are more like 4.9 gen jets - if we call Super Hornets and Block 70 F16 and F15EX 4.5.

[@kaloyandraganov9462]

@@jdcrosier2682 "Give it 20 years and they'll have technology the US has had for 50 years"

[@identity7536]

In the Bundeswehr and The Luftwaffe of the German Armed forces there is a little joke about the F-104 : "the fastest way to own a starfighter is to buy a strip of land next to a Luftwaffe Airfield and wait"

[@TheDuckofDoom.]

Everyone forgets that the problem was bad training and operations in the first few years. The luftwaffe had been ...on holiday... since 1945 and they lacked experiance. When the luftwaffe restructured their f104 operations and training the accident rate fell an order of magnitude to approximate other fighter operations and why Germany kept flying them into the 1990s. The USAF did not have the absurdly high accident rate with the F-104 it was only retired because the USA had a huge budget and was constantly advancing to newer stuff. NASA and Italy continued to fly f104 into the 21st century.

[@identity7536]

@@TheDuckofDoom.True enough but the joke still exists today. I was not trying to make it look as if the plane was 100% unusable, just adding a little anecdote

[@wolf310ii]

@@TheDuckofDoom. Another big problem was, they took a nice weather interceptor an use it as an all weather fighterbomber

[@hermann5411]

@@TheDuckofDoom. Wanted to say the same thing. Thank you

[@hermann5411]

@@TheSpylight doesnt really Change the Situation or does it?

[@c4sualcycl0ps48]

I think Lockheed Skunkworks might be the Valve of military contractors. You don’t know what they are doing until they show off something that is utterly insane and remarkable at the same time

[@joeblow9657]

I love re-watching Lazerpig's videos a few weeks afterwards and seeing the slight changed to certain parts, most notably the footage.

[@chrisgoff1417]

The point about allowing the reformers to rant on uninterrupted because it made potential adversaries think they were protected reminds me of the great banana controversy in Australia. Australian banana farmers were ready to riot over trade barriers being lowered to allow imports from cheap rivals like the Philippines. There were protests outside trade conferences for years. As a result, the banana tariff became a major bargaining chip which Australia played hard-ball on and extracted all kinds of payoffs for. Thing is... because of Australia's strict biosecurity laws no bananas could ever be imported anyway. Not unless they went through expensive and slow quarantine steps by the end of which all you had left were a bunch of brown soggy banana-shaped lumps. Nobody in government ever bothered to assure the farmers of this because their outrage was great bargaining banter.

[@concept5631]

That's hilarious.

[@raccoonking7566]

At least you wouldn't have to wait for the bananas be overripe to make banana bread.

[@anthonybrennan4416]

Or like in America when ever anyone becomes But Hurt like that, using actual evidence or science means you are in the pocket of (drum roll) BIG PHARMA !!!!!!

[@shcdemolisher]

That feels like something american farmers would riot over all the corn they grow and food they are paid to grow.

[@Saleemsan]

Avocados from Michoacan

[@lonereaper4287]

Never have I heard a more beautiful description for Skunkworks as an "Insane Asylum disguised as an aircraft factory"

[@Longlius]

Putting a bunch of insane people in a building until they accidentally invent sci-fi war machines feels like a very American thing to do.

[@epiblue2]

Sunkworks was just lets take every mad mechanic engineer and designer we could and put them all in one place

[@HeaanLasai]

They explained the 'fighter' designation in a documentary: Pilots during basic training were all trying to get into the best program. Bombers were literally assigned to the bottom of the barrel, the dudes who consistently came in just above the bar for passing, but nothing more. So to get pilots all giddy and excited about getting to pilot this new plane, they called it a fighter. It was allegedly a pure internal politics thing, and so that their pilots could go home and retain some dignity because at least they didn't get assigned to a bomber crew...

[@CruelestChris]

That's a quote from the project manager, yes. To be fair this was at the end of a period where a couple of other tactical bomber aircraft got F designations, most notably the F-105 and F-111, so it might have been even more mundane than that.

[@MrChickennugget360]

well F-117 follows F-111 so... F-111 is not exactly a fighter. Technically both should be A-117 and A-111

[@phluphie]

@@MrChickennugget360And if they were Navy, they would be.

[@CruelestChris]

@@MrChickennugget360 Having looked into this further, the designations aren't really related like that. The aircraft with 100 designations (the century series) pre-date a change to the aircraft classification system in 1962. 117 was just an arbitrary radio callsign in use during test flights which Lockheed put on the front of the plane's service manual as "F-117A" which then never got changed. It's likely another layer of deception since every other aircraft after the F-111 to get a century-series designation was a captured Soviet aircraft under evaluation.

[@sammiller6631]

@@MrChickennugget360 "F-117 follows F-111" is really bizarre logic to hang that argument on. If the definitions are arbitrary guidelines, then your opinion of "should be A-117" is bogus and wrong.

[@carmencrincoli]

LazerPig, you're literally the first military historian on KZbin who has ever taken even a remotely nuanced stance on McNamara and what he was trying to do. So many others just assume the various branches would have done the right thing if he had gotten out of their way, which is hilariously laughable when you look at how petty and wasteful the top brass was in the early cold war. There's a reason EISENHOWER warned America about the influence of the miliary-industrial complex, of all people.

[@AgentM3tallion]

So did Kennedy... I like to imagine there's a timeline out there somewhere in the universe in which he managed to delete the 3 letter agencies and the world got to do it's own thing instead of being under the thumb of the American military industrial complex.

[@Tank50us]

I mean, when you get to the nuts and bolts of the theory, he is on the money. If a part works in X and Y, than by basic economic theory, the procurement and operational costs of a given piece of equipment should be lower. The reality is that Economists aren't the ones who have to fly, fight, and maintain these things. Pilots, Soldiers, and Mechanics are. And contrary to what some would like, the manual gets chucked when something is found to not work, or when shit hits the fan. For example. The first attempt to put a 76mm gun into an M4 Sherman.... in 1942. The guys who had the.... pleasure... of testing it had some very colorful things to say to the engineers after they tested it. Later one someone figured out they had a mess of Turrets no one was needing, and so they mated that to the M4, and developed a new 76mm gun for it, and the ergonomic problems were solved.... in early 1944. Now, fast forward to the 60s, and the F-4 Phantom. A great aircraft, and one of the few that actually worked out.... once some other problems with weapons and training were worked out. Namely, making sure the AIM9s and 7s came off the rail and tracked their targets, and that the pilots knew how to use their weapons effectively. But it's honestly the exception that proved the rule. It was originally designed for carrier work, and most of that was kept in the USAF models. This meant that pilots could afford to abuse it a bit when the need came. It also meant that it could deploy from forward bases if needed. But ultimately... as I said, it was the exception that proved the rule. Aircraft designed for one branch do not always work for the other.

[@p.strobus7569]

Since Eisenhower was in charge for the coup against Mossadegh and handed Bay of Pigs off to Kennedy with less than four months warning, his level of prescience should be weighed with salt.

[@DDayJayke]

Where are you getting this "so many others just assume" stuff? Cite your sources, cause I have yet to see that totally real claim come to fruition

[@winzyl9546]

​@@DDayJaykeyoutube shorts

[@lukebrown2674]

I like what I heard from an air defender about radar. "Radar can see everything stealth is just making your thing so small that it is lost in the background" so if you plane looks like a bird the system has to be set to look for birds which can give way to many contacts and flood the screen of the operator.

[@womble321]

A strange thing happened to my late Father. He used to work as a civilian on a US airforce Base in the UK. He mentioned he worked on Japanese codes in WW2. The base commander found out and one day an officer arrived and said Sir we checked your background and would like to show our appreciation for your service. In the 1980s/early 90s he was driven to a hanger and given a full guided tour of the F117. At that time it didn't exist and definitely didn't exist out side the US. He never said a word untill it appeared on BBC news that it was in the UK. This was years after his tour! Apparently they even got the CIA to check his security background!

[@tyler1107]

As a physicist/engineer hybrid, I can confirm the Skunkworks didn't have to look hard for people mentally unstable enough to try. Within the two fields, I've met 1 mentally stable person. I'm still not convinced he isn't a serial killer because who is _that_ mentally stable, but also a physicist?!

[@H1Guard]

You obviously haven't hung aroung civil engineers. Firstly because we are oh so civil. Almost as civil as Sophisticated Sophistication Man. But mostly we're stable. We're stable because we have to deal with construction workers. Those guys get really upset if we design things that can't be built and blame it on them. I know, not fair. But those guys have to build it or we don't get paid for our clever design.

[@tyler1107]

@@H1Guard My brother-in-law is a civil engineer :D He's... Well, he's abnormal in a completely different way. He is an 80-year-old man in a 25-year-old body. I think that's still insane. But yeah, I guess I do hang out and interact with materials engineers, mechanical engineers, and chemical engineers the most. I have a much smaller sample size for civil. Maybe they are mostly normal! Though, I'm not sure if interacting with the people who make it makes them better. As a physics student, I have to make designs for makeshift apparatuses for random experiments and then have the guys in the basement machine shop make them. He had to sit me down and instruct me on how to properly do that before I even submitted a document. I've heard many a story of him spending 3 weeks on making something because the scientist made the measurement 3.3975cm where 3.4cm would have been sufficient. Every researcher I have met has been some degree of clinically insane. I love them all dearly. It's amazing. The machine shop people... They probably don't. Given, there's also a difference between working for physicists and being a normal construction worker, so

[@space_artist_4real138]

Tyler I can confirm, especially the physics engineers, those aren't on the levels of pure science physicists but they are QUITE high on the nerd scale. What quantum physics and electromagnetism does to a mf. They are an order of magnitude more nerdy nerds than the rest in an all-engineering university, that says something.

[@Carewolf]

@@H1GuardEngineers turn terrorists. They are where terrorists come from. Scientists turns supervillains.

[@heikkiremes5661]

In machining, we call that tolerance. In most cases, the 0.025 mm is vital between stuff working properly and totally f**king itself. @@tyler1107

[@an_rc_guy8256]

LazerPig: *disappears for a month into the dark after conquering the entire Tank Museum* Also LazerPig: *arrives back from the dark in his Have Blue chariot with a bottle of fine wine*

[@bottheskitarii8881]

His slowly making an army I KNOW IT! Why do you think he has conquered the tank museum?!

[@stuartdollar9912]

Those of us who have been here for a while know this is the same LazerPig.

[@fematrailer]

Something tells me the bottle of wine is not particularly fine.

[@nandayane]

Laserpig Arrives exactly when he means to, when you have a huge ass glass of wine and several open bottles.

[@bandit6272]

33:14 It's all these thoughtful little pieces of shade, like the red quotation marks around "military strategist" that really show you edit with love.

[@nate2064]

My father worked on the F117 nighthawk back in the 80s. He was transferred out of New York to Nevada to work at area 51 on the fighter about a couple months before they came public with the fact that it existed. My dad’s favorite story is that in the build up the invasion of Panama the night before it started he noticed they were loading real bombs onto the plane, and when he went and asked why they told him they were test rounds. my father pointed out how obvious it was that they weren’t test rounds which they said “like you would know what a real bomb is.” Later that night operation just cause began

[@sebastianarmy089]

Interesting!

[@weismeister121]

Just Cause, you say?!...was there a guy with a grappling hook and infinite parachutes involved?!

[@VladLogimane]

32:10 As a professional archivist that gets assigned to job's in all kinds of places, Mr Pig´s description of Archives is completely accurate to a FRIGHTENING degree!

[@Lucas-gt8en]

The greatest trick the B117 ever pulled was convincing the world it didn’t exist

[@XOFInfantryman]

Real and true 🗿🍷

[@hyrulejoe7825]

True Stealth

[@Carcerothim]

Awesome video Only thing you left out is that though it's been retired from active service the F-117 still flies out of "Nellis AFB" with a 2topseektrit4U squadron the "Dark Knights"

[@navy1lord1]

12:12 fun fact as I rewatch this for the 18th time. When I was airborne we used to sit there for hours just knowing the jump would get canceled, but we would sit there because whomever called it off first, the Air Force or the army, would have to pay for it… so it was a hurry up and wait fest just staring at each other till someone scratched it.

[@cynthiaherbst3909]

My husband is a loggy and even there he says he couldn't escape the hurry up and wait.

[@Suojeluninja]

The advantage of stealth is nowadays more operational than tactical. Like being able to fly deeper into enemy air space before interceptors get scrambled.

[@john-hy3gb]

and to get a somewhat normal range for detection required L band radars with worse resolutions meaning less advanced missiles can be used (probably wrong but) and need better weather also they can do SEAD better

[@mcgherkinstudios]

Always has been. It’s always been possible to detect stealth aircraft, but the range at which you can detect them and how accurately you can detect them (accurately enough to shoot at them?) has been the key advantage.

[@solreaver83]

It's to allow you to identify and send your bvr missiles without being detected by the enemy looking for you.

[@tyler1107]

There's also the benefit of missiles not being able to easily lock onto you and hit you.

[@KevinJDildonik]

No. I'm talking kind of next gen but. Okay the F-35 is stealth. But Loyal Wingman drones and datalink means one F-35 could be linked to a squadron of seriously invisible drones each carrying a missile or just being suicide lemmings. Or linked to a missile boat like the newly remodeled F15EX which iirc carries like 11 missiles per plane. So the one stealth F-35 doesn't have one or two or four missiles. And it doesn't need to open the doors to fire them. It has 50 missiles loaded on various platforms, and it can direct them in various ways without revealing itself or getting too close to a target. That's the new battlefield. Like a stealth AWACS that can defend itself.

[@jloiben12]

Pig: Militaries generally keep important things on the ground. Me: So does Russia not have a lot of important things in their military since so much of Russia’s things get absolutely yeeted into the sky?

[@TheBirb101]

one way or another XD

[@Armanelos]

Turning your infrastructure into a space program costs money. Let your enemy do it for you. Smart.

[@lucasokeefe7935]

No no their tanks just have self-esteem issues. You see, when you're expected to be amazing but have social anxiety it can sometimes be enough to make you blow your top..

[@hunterh1175]

well, their jets and helicopters must be even more important then

[@TheBirb101]

*realises the joke* thats cruel but i like it XD @@lucasokeefe7935

[@xenobarbital]

During the "on the ground" part I honestly was expecting a ground news ad :D

[@ampeater777]

You can tell an idea is gonna be cutting edge if the reformers dont like it. As much of a hindrance as they are, they are certainly an effective and accurate barometer for measuing how good a concept is

[@raccoonking7566]

Soo, I'm Serbian... Hearing people around me and online bring up the Nighthawk shootdown and brag about it "not being invisible" makes me cringe (we don't really have a word for stealth, so it was mistranslated as invisble) and makes those people look like dumbasses. Same with the constant depleted uranium stupidity (no, the Americans didn't put depleted uranium into all their bombs to poison us. Not to mention that depleted uranium isn't really radioactive - I'm a radiology tech, trust me, I know). Oh, and the genocide and ethnic cleansing denialism/support also makes them look like dumbasses, but I'm pretty sure they won't stop that until we get Dresden'd.

[@Hypernefelos]

I remember back in Greece at that time reporters wouldn't stop talking about 'uranium bombs'. That cringe has stayed with me.

[@demonbre]

"Prikriven"...? BTW I also heard of toy bombs that the Americans dropped. That really was a rumor going around.

[@MrVonkliest]

Slobodan would like a word.

[@raccoonking7566]

@demonbre Technically the most accurate term would be "Avion sa smanjenim radarskim presekom", because "prikriven" can still have VISUAL connotations.

[@raccoonking7566]

@Hypernefelos The uranium shit really goes on my nerves. People constantly blame rising cancer rates on it, even though cancer rates are rising globally, mainly because we live longer, the shitty food we eat, sedentary lifestyle, and pollution. DU has military uses, like penetratpr cores in sabot rounds, but it isn't put into bombs just for fun. Its radioactivity is VERY low, pretty much the only way you could be killed by it is ingestion (it's toxic) or by being shot by a sabot. Every time I correct someone with this, they just call me a traitor, and then say how we need to go back to finish the job or something.

[@acidous]

As an actual archivist, I laughted hard when you brought up the part about how big of a mess the archives are. So true, especially the part about some random documents laying in boxes on the floor in some forgotten room :D

[@vovochen]

Dont believe everything. He is very, very wrong about the low freq Radar in this video.

[@acidous]

@@vovochen I'm not saying that every archive in existance is a mess, but I saw (and worked at) multiple enough to know that at least in my country, they're usually underfunded and not taken seriously. Documents come incomplete and disorganised, you lack the power to enforce the order (or just get them from someone who got them from someone who got them from the unit that was disbanded 30 years ago and there's noone with enough meritoric knowledge to do tide them up), titles of the files are misleading, for the older ones you usually lack any records to check if you even got everything, you lack the time to organise them yourself, storage rooms are too small for the amount of the documents you recive every year, so some of them ends "temporarily" in the boxes on the floor and stay there for years, forgotten... now it's a bit easier to manage everything with all those fancy electronic systems, but I'm willing to belive that at least some US army archives looks like the ones I saw myself :p

[@CZpersi]

As a historian, working in archives, I share your pain.

[@belluh-1huey102]

@@acidous He's a bot, because how does talking about archives relate to radar

[@llYossarian]

@@vovochen How? In what way?

[@SeanP7195]

Without the F-104 we would have never gotten that amazing movie. “The Starfighters”.

[@anthonymigliaccio3492]

I was promised salty Serbs in the comments. Where are they? Balkan internet anger is almost as funny as Turkish internet anger.

[@homegrown6845]

Most of them are in the replies of one of the top comments.

[@fematrailer]

I know you mentioned it at the end, but it's just mind boggling that the the Serbian shootdown is considered such a big deal by some people considering that the target had already been hit by the time their air defense had detected the F-117. The greatest achievement of Serbian air defense is an operation in which nothing was successfully defended.

[@nolongerblocked6210]

It's cope, they've gotta latch on to something to pretend to save face

[@albertofernandez2490]

Well, tbh that "command post" was probably worth 1/100th of a Nighthawk.

[@chasecash1363]

Well can the serbs even afford a nighthawk

[@MiishaKorvian]

@@albertofernandez2490 How much knowledge was lost when the command post and its staff died in the strike? This is the Sherman tank thing all over again. The F-117 pilot survived, rescued, and more nighthawks flew and returned. The cost of a trained, experienced, and competent troop often outweighs the expensive gear that was designed to sacrifice itself. Why do we give a grunt with mere high-school diploma body armor that has to be replaced when hit? Why do we give pilots ejector seats? Hell, "suicide missions" are a known thing. The cost in equipment and personnel lost are weighed against the desired operational effect.

[@fematrailer]

@MiishaKorvian Exactly. How expensive was the R9X missile used to take out Soleimani? Obviously the math checked out, and the cost of the missile as well as whatever damage the Iranian response targeting al-Asad and Erbil caused was worth it.

[@jakobmax3299]

Fun fact: the way brittish pilots could intercept the u2 was not actually by slowly climbing to its altitude. It couldnt do that. Rather they would fly close to their operational ceiling, speed up as much as possible and then pitch up. This way they would go on a semi balistic arc trading speed for altitude. Edit: some horrible spelling errors i removed.

[@danpatterson8009]

So the question becomes "What could the Lightning do once it reached the U-2's altitude?" Could it maintain that altitude? Could it close with the U-2 and get a radar lock? Could the pilot maintain attitude control, or did the Lightning tumble like a leaf, out of control until it fell back down into denser air?

[@ToaArcan]

Yeah that sounds deranged enough for Lightning pilots.

[@jimb9063]

I remember listening to a former Lightening pilot who said that only one or two individual aircraft could reach the required altitude, rather than something they all could do. Just one of those unexplainable engineering outcomes, some engines just work better than others of the same type.

[@duncanhamilton5841]

@@jimb9063 There were a couple of 'hot ships' on the Lightning fleet which were faster and were used for promotional gigs such as U2 interception, overtaking Concorde, etc. Never seen an explanation as to why, but I'd guess probably as much down to airframe as engines - Lightnings were all handbuilt before the days of CAD, CNC, and so on, so no two were identical. A similar problem existed in the Nimrod fleet, which has enormous issues with upgrade packages because what would fit in one plane might not fit in others.

[@sammiller6631]

You still have spelling errors in your comment. Also, "fun fact" isn't fun. Saying "fun fact" tends to suck the fun out of any fact.

[@mattmiller4233]

Ben Rich's memoir "Skunkworks" is SO good! The bit about the bats gave me chills.

[@petitblanc7343]

I remember this being my favourite jet as a kid, it was really cool to find it in the old Jane's USAF sim game. Had a toy too, that tail is not fun to step on.

[@ethanstine426]

Oof

[@TheAnnoyingF2P]

Relatable. I can't be entirely certain, but I believe I remember stepping on the tail of a model one as a kid and getting stabbed. Now, it may have just been an elaborate psy-op to make us BELIEVE it's stealthier than it is. It also may have been so stealthy I didn't see it, or it could have been so painful I blocked it from my memory. But something's there.

[@Jokoko2828]

As someone who was once studying to be a librarian and museum custodian both of those places are organized messes and the only way you're finding a good chunk of the stuff in the storage is if you find the person who stored a book or object and ask them where they put it, chances are they won't know and so that thing is lost to both space and time until it one day suddenly resurfaces when you already ordered a replacement for it.

[@KGEssig]

I work in archives. Well. It‘s quite fascinating how many archives work similar. Even with a functioning numeral order system. People just tend to rather ignore that and put stuff wherever.

[@Statueshop297]

Hopefully one day we will be offered a job to properly sort, catalogue and perhaps digitise some of these lost storage messes.

[@penelopegreene]

However, the U.S. military DOES have The Ark of The Covenant stored there... 😁

[@killingtimeitself]

OR.... you turn over EVERY document until you find it, or don't find it because its not there.

[@epikmanthe3rd]

​@@KGEssig You guys aren't exactly restoring my confidence in my ability to go through with my PhD program. Especially since much of it will be archival work.

[@satyrony]

28:38 :"This turned out to be a good thing..." Wait.. Is Lazerpig... "Because in 1964, General Dynamics..." I have been deceived into a feeling of safety. There is no way back. "Would achieve..." It's happening. I'm not ready. "Perfection" [bliss]

[@xenobarbital]

30:46 THANK YOU! I've been waiting for this for freaking months!

[@jackdaugaard-hansen4512]

For those who are wondering, the nebo radar takes 15 minutes to set up and packup, this means that a low flying cruise missile would need to be over detected 200km away in order to get it time to move

[@Evolution_Kills]

I always thought the F117 was purposely mislabeled as deliberate counter espionage. Just one layer in the onion designed to protect the secret that was the world's first stealth bomber.

[@americankid7782]

Same reason the U-2 spy plane had the U (utility) designation instead of the O (observation) designation or R (Recognizance) designation

[@VersusARCH]

Correct

[@userofthetube2701]

The number is quite cleverly chosen. A Soviet intelligence analyst sometime in the 1980's receiving some vague intel about a plane numbered F-117 would probably estimate it to be some obscure prototype from the early '60's. Because that's where it fits in the USAF numbering sequence. And so he would promptly ignore it in order to do something more important. Like drinking vodka.

[@kekistanimememan170]

Like the MK24 mine.

[@spejic1]

@@userofthetube2701 The airplanes between "F-111" and "F-117" were designations given to captured Soviet aircraft used in secret investigations and training. Maybe they wanted any leak of the 117 number to be mistaken for another one of them.

[@Rosatodi2006]

Two points: 1. Ufimtsev is often credited because Ben Rich credited him in his book Skunkworks. Ben said the CIA gave them a translated copy of his work. 2. You had the characteristics of radar wave backwards, the higher the frequency the shorter the wave length the more it will reflect stuff like clouds. The Lowe the frequency the longer the wavelength the better it will penetrate stuff like cloud cover. Commercial ships will often have an S-band radar for bad weather and an I/J (aka X band) radar for better precision. Other than that, it was a fine presentation.

[@tedarcher9120]

Bomb bay doors also have nothing to do with it. Radar guided missiles are radar guided, they need radar response all they way to the target for minutes and minutes of flight

[@moonasha]

kind of crazy to think some random russian guy in a village invented the radar equations used for stealth, and nothing ever came of it until it landed on some guy's desk at the skunk works. Russians easily could have come up with the first stealth plane instead if they had a free thinking organization like skunk works

[@HypoceeYT]

I believe the idea was that they could initially *pick out* the 117 on their cluttered-up low-frequency scope because of one or two very bright returns while the door was open. Good enough to tell the system to lock onto this return amid the various phantoms.@@tedarcher9120

[@HypoceeYT]

Sorta, but TBF they didn't have the doctrinal need. In the Cold-War-turns-conventionally-hot scenario that every military planned for, both sides came to the conclusion that the Soviets would surge out and grab Europe, and that NATO would try to slow and reverse that attack via their allies and overseas logistics and deployment from the US. They also both concluded that the US in particular had developed a lot of experience and a predilection for air superiority in WWII, and would simply stop at nothing to ensure that it came about in a Red Storm Rising. So while the Soviets certainly built fighters, they also assumed they'd end up fighting the air, and invested much more heavily into SAM tech and populating all their units with serious autonomous air defense equipment and training. This in turn led to lots of profitable and politically useful SAM exports to Communist-aligned, and later to just chaotic nations. While it's always nice to have any given capability, the SEAD/disruption/decapitation function the 117 provided was much more valuable to the US, as a hegemonic power that routinely had or 'had' to go in and mess around in places bristling with Russian missiles. @@moonasha

[@mcgherkinstudios]

Comment needs pinning or something. Absolutely correct with regards to radar, lower frequency = better penetration but also = less accuracy, so whilst you might get a return that you wouldn’t have at higher frequencies, you don’t necessarily have an accurate enough one to do anything about it.

[@xB2KxRewindZ]

We literally made a missile that cuts you, instead of blowing you up. I forget the name, but you should do a video on that if you haven't! I know it was invented to cut out civilian casualties if a target was in a building with other people and other stuff like being able to penetrate deep too. But it literally has blades that unfold lol

[@lyonsy143]

One of the most costly parts to maintain of the f/11 is the ejection pod, thats what ended up grounding the aussie ones in the end

[@michaelramon2411]

Serbian Nationalist: "We once shot down a stealth fighter!" Someone Else: "How many did you fail to shoot down?" Serbian Nationalist: "..." Serbian Nationalist: "We once shot down a stealth fighter!"

[@jdreyes3745]

"It took us hundreds of tries, but we still got one!" (There was another hit that still went home, but was found to be FUBAR)

[@MPhussarW]

Like the saying goes “Throw enough shit at the wall and something will stick”

[@wisemankugelmemicus1701]

Whats wild is that the reason they brag about it is they legit think this was done with either a bolt action or a handgun

[@colbunkmust]

I mean, technically it wasn't a fighter, F117 despite the "F" nomenclature could only drop laser guided bombs but stealth strike bomber is a mouthful.

[@CharlieNoodles]

To be a little fair to the Serbs, they did everything right. They knew where the aircraft would be and roughly when it would be there. They gave themselves the best chance of achieving what was considered impossible. They got lucky, they got luckier than they had any right to be, but luck often sides with those who are best prepared.

[@CaptainDemo779]

At this point, I wanna see LP just do a deep dive on the F-111. He seems to REALLY want a chance to talk about it at length and frankly? He deserves to.

[@williamchamberlain2263]

It did go quite fast

[@mrzfunk]

We just need to cut and paste all the times he's already talked about it into one video!

[@chuckygobyebye]

Aye

[@danlorett2184]

I will give you the short version: gud plane, go fast, way too expensive to maintain because swingy wings etc

[@junahn1907]

Gaddafi gave the F-111 zero stars. Would not recommend to a friend.

[@firepa498]

Welp you earned a sub from me. My Folks did work on the electronic countermeasures on both the F-111 and the B-1B Lancer. If interested in the history of that B-1 project probably would be a fun topic to go over. Anyway good video man!!

[@jonathanlaforce9465]

What is England overcompensating for by going on this way about the 1966 World Cup? The loss of their empire?

[@alexwinfield9540]

The same way you compensate for your eighth grade reading ability by screaming USA and freedom like the illiterate moron you are

[@andrew6978]

I can feel the vatniks' rage already.

[@MostlyPennyCat]

"But, but, but, _akshullyyyyyyy"_

[@andreatomasi3755]

​@@MostlyPennyCatakshhhhiuallli as you can read on this article of Russia today...........

[@diggman88]

"And a compact fusion reactor" BattleTech fans: YOU DID WHAT?!

[@matthewbeale5083]

I am now awaiting LM's announcement of Mackie production.

[@jimmyseaver3647]

@@matthewbeale5083 And GM finally unveiling the Marauder.

[@Maganac1]

Also BattleTech fans: Da fuck GM, get your asses in gear! You're already 4 years late!

[@badnewswade]

The F-104 Starfighter was so bad, the band Hawkwind created a side project concept album called "Captain Lockheed & The Starfighters", which is so awesome I use it for background music when I'm playing flight sims

[@TheAmericanAmerican]

Silly Pig, the fact that you ramble is why I am subscribed to you! Your enchanting voice + your soothingly chill music choices are a truly magical experience😁