STRANGER THINGS 4: What Worked and What Didn’t | ScreenCrush Rewind

[@prophetess.cassandra]

The last two episodes didn’t feel too long, I enjoyed every second. This was my favorite season overall. It’s not without flaws, but perfect is the enemy of good.

[@safcjoe7062]

This woman complaining about Lucas' character arc when I'm so glad that he had more development and showed his loyalty when it truly mattered. He's allowed to have interests other than being a nerd(such as basketball). Like steve didn't need a redemption arc, it wouldn't have done much for the story in s1, but it's still a good addition to have. Outsmarting stereotypes rather than have Lucas as a side character as a one dimensional nerd.

[@TrueGamer22887]

I felt the jock was super one dimensional. It felt very mean spirited that he ended up dying at the end, as if people who are misinformed or brainwashed due to a traumatic event deserve to die if they don’t handle it well

[@bobjohnson9201]

I would like to add that Lucas was very, very relatable. There are many people that have had the inner conflict between being a nerd and wanting to be popular. Plus, it was not out of character for Lucas to want it. Personally, the one change I would have made was have Mike say he loves El and get her locked into battle with Vecna. Then Joyce saves Hopper from the Demidog. They start killing other stuff, and that actually physically weakens Vecna, which allows El to get the upper hand.

[@d.h.8279]

@@TrueGamer22887 Jason became straight-up evil and murderous. He wasn't some passive trauma victim

[@TrueGamer22887]

@@d.h.8279 he by no means became evil. He becoming understandably vengeful and quite literally saw what he thought was confirmation of a demonic cult right before his eyes

[@GabesEdtiz]

@@bobjohnson9201 isn’t that technically what they did though?

[@cowboybibimbap]

I disagree with them both. It feels like they needed to find things to pick at and critique because they needed something to be wrong with it. Because god forbid, if you consider yourself a professional, you can't ever just enjoy something or think something was done well. There MUST be something you could have done better if you were writing for [x] show and there MUST be something to over criticize. I think this season was written strongly overall and the storylines felt like natural progressions from the last time we saw the cast. Granted, the russian storyline was a bit dragged out, but escaping a russian prison isn't like leaving disneyland and fighting through traffic. It was meant to be DIFFICULT and hopeless. Additionally, I'm usually inclined to agree that narrative monologues can be a lazy way to provide exposition. However, I also believe that they CAN be effective and sometimes the only real way to provide information without adding on another 5-6 episodes. Please tell me HOW the kids were supposed to piece all that information together... I think the monologue was fine and felt in line with the way the story was progressing. Getting different opinions on a subject can be fun, but good lord, we don't have to be dislikeable about it.

[@sirchooch9680]

Exactly and it was an amazing part to leave volume one on as vecna was talking to Nancy and 001 was talking to el

[@samgoldberg1161]

i mean i understand your points. But people can just not enjoy certain aspects of a show without them looking for things to hate. I enjoyed some aspects and disliked others.

[@robertw31968]

@A. Wolf I agree with you 100%

[@aesonica]

You don't have to find things to pick at, the show hands it to you. It was a good season, but there are some really dumb and played-out parts of this show that held back a lot of opportunities to expand on the characters and the world. The best parts for me are the beginning where there is more horror and mystery, then it just stops entirely. They reveal too much too quickly and that mystery and magic is gone. Character plot armor is stupid in this show, nothing feels dangerous. (You know who) should have died, and not just that person. There needs to be more consequences to the main cast to show how serious and dangerous the world is, and not to the new season characters only. The odds should be heavily weighed against the cast, and not just fixed by Eleven raising up her hand and screaming until she get a nose bleed. It's not about "I'm a professional therefore I can't enjoy this". People can want some aspects of this show to be better.

[@aidanpresley2146]

i agree i was lowkey getting annoyed with some of their point but i think they’re looking at it too much from a writer point of view. also the complaints of it being too long is dumb cause it never felt dragged on and why are we complaining when we won’t get to see the next season for another two years.

[@jaysons7581]

I watch Screen Crush because I love how Ryan can dissect scenes and point out easter eggs and symbolism and not be one of those fan boys who are never satisfied and overly critical of everything (like the 2 guests). “It's better to create something that others criticize than to create nothing and criticize others.” - Ricky Gervais

[@SwamSmokey]

Agreed. The guests were just being wet blankets and couldn't explain the reasoning behind their cynical opinions.

[@Matisaro]

@@SwamSmokey It is not even just this video, EVERY SINGLE TIME, these "guests" come on it is to shit on the topic in question. Did they loan the channel some money or otherwise?

[@papayogi9684]

I completely agree, I’ve had this complaint before as well. They are just trying to have a hot take to create some conflict or conversation but both of them come off as wishy washy. Both takes are very shallow in my opinion.

[@aesonica]

They are literal writers of book and comics, wtf you talking about "create nothing"?

[@Father_Daniel]

Exactly! We'll said

[@MartianManHunter_]

I think lucas deserved a story arc and that’s been a short coming of the show. Perhaps heather didn’t understand or care too because it wasn’t written with her in mind. There are however many of us who can and or could see a little of ourselves in him.

[@JooYoungChoi]

Yeah, I was really surprised that she segregated him as a non main narrative character. I found that so bizarre. The way she talks about Lucas as if he is going to become essential through helping Max next season is creepy. Why does she single him out as less essential? I mean… I believe Max doesn’t even appear until the second season-we spent a whole season with Lucas before she was even written in! Also, the way she talks about how Billy is Max’s downfall and Lucas could become a more significant character by lifting her up, ugh, reminds me of how Black/African American roles in film and video have sometimes used people who hold these identities to play roles that only serve to further the journey of a white character. I don’t think she is doing this intentionally, but I think that some of what she is saying seems rooted in subconscious indoctrination into outdated social norms.

[@bobjohnson9201]

Personally, I loved his inner conflict between his inner nerd and his desire to be a jock. I think it’s extremely relatable for so many people. Especially the people that are drawn to this kind of show.

[@GabesEdtiz]

@@JooYoungChoi spot on.

[@JooYoungChoi]

@@GabesEdtiz thank you so much :)

[@JooYoungChoi]

@@bobjohnson9201 I totally agree with you :)

[@brentos96]

I disagree with the "Eddie didn't have to leave the trailer and die" argument. I think Eddie realized that the gate in the trailer is no longer just a gate. It's a wide open door. Anyone can easily climb through...or fly through. He realized that these bat's are getting into this trailer, and if he escapes through the gate hole, the bat's will still be right behind him. Dustin wasn't lying when he said Eddie died a hero. He literally grew the bat's away, saving a town that turned its back on and villainized him.

[@triangleguy4716]

just close the trailer doors and run, either way the gate in his trailer would've broken into the main gate at the end

[@godlikemonolith]

The bats took hours to kill him and just flew around randomly even though there were thousands of them.

[@brentos96]

@@triangleguy4716 If the bats found a way into the upside down trailer within minutes, you bet your butt that they'll find their way out of the real world trailer. He sacrificed himself for the plan that the massive gates wouldn't open. He did it in hopes that everything else was going to plan, and he didn't want to be the loose end the f**ked up by running.

[@SomeGuyFromUtah]

I don't think it was about the bats getting through the portal, they would have gone back to the group attacking Vecna and he kept them busy so they didn't go back. I think it was integral and made all the difference that he bought them that extra time.

[@TheMaxRebo]

I just wish it was made clear why he needed to stall longer like he said for why he did it. Maybe a signal from the other group that the "needed more time" or something. It felt like he determined they needed to stall the bats longer without any proof just so he could have his hero moment.

[@bosuper9403]

I find Vecna far more scary and compelling of a villain than generic evil dark cloud (mind flayer)

[@safcjoe7062]

Thank you, I mean people say Vecna is generic which is fair but having a cloud that wants to kill without any monologue or backstory and it keeps coming back is even more generic. The issue with Vecna's intentions is you can connect him to other pop culture villains.

[@mrchiefbs]

@@safcjoe7062 makes sense because vecna created the mind flayer out of pure hatred and anger with one goal.

[@safcjoe7062]

@@mrchiefbs and always Will and Billy called the Mind Flayer a "him". Plus eleven easily overpowers the shadow form when she shuts the gate which is a good parallel to how Vecna just shows up and controls the mind flayer with ease. I thought him snatching her powers made sense too because part of that spider flayer did crawl away in the cabin.

[@joetyrant4713]

The problem with Vecna is they know how to beat him already. He has limits, I think something will cause him to try to ditch his body and will create the new big boss of s5. I don't think Vecna as we know him will make it as the final villain.

[@Butteryslick]

@@safcjoe7062 nah he looks like grinch

[@derekp1422]

I really enjoy Screen Crush and Ryan Arey, they way he breaks down and composes his analysis. To me, his opinions never come off hot-take-ey but measured and truly analyses the finer details of movies or shows. However every time we do these ask a friend episodes I get so irritated. Maybe they have inside perspective but they always, always, come off as hot-takes and lack the attention to detail Ryan Arey puts together. I find myself stopping a halfway because there are so many times I can say “wtf are you talking about?” Before I have to call it quits. I’ll keep watching the breakdown and analysis videos.

[@zechrojas2202]

I feel the same!

[@JFRA24]

I want to see Ryan collab with the RLM guys.

[@TheXenogias]

Yes these arguments are so bad. This girl couldn’t even elaborate or cohesively put together a simple sentence or point. I had a hard time listening to her

[@annacarollina7703]

the whole bit about max and lucas relationship not impacting max "downfall" (for a lack of a better word), when the show hits us over the head several times with how its that distance that made max's grief about billy unbearable to cope and left her at the mercy of vecna like.............. also complaining about the characters not having arcs and then belittling and undermining the one character that (FINALLY) got an arc of his own.... the math aint mathing we should have made notes before this

[@DavidWilliams-rm7bd]

I totally agree I’m a huge fan of Ryan and can’t stand the other folks…imo they look for critiques and try and sound smarter than they need to be

[@Apropos-YGO]

I would have preferred to watch Ryan talk about this one on his own. The guest criticism was just annoying and slightly pretentious

[@natefreeman1]

I agree, Ryan is great. All the analysts make me feel bad for really enjoying something :/

[@w.matthewgooch3207]

I always loath the videos he does with guests…they always bring the quality of the commentary down.

[@jmckey]

Yeah, we must have been watching different versions of the shows. Season 4 was INCREDIBLY strong and I don't get their wishy washiness at all. Seems like they were looking for analysis points to justify having their roles/jobs. But hey, it's all subjective. Still, I loved it and really wanna watch season 3 & 4 again JUST because 4 was so strong. My kids agree.

[@DTCFilms]

Totally agree

[@KidFresh71]

Guest critics must feel like it's their job to tear things apart and not like them. I don't know what show they were watching, but Season 4 of Stranger things was some of the best content I've watched in years. Action-packed, funny, dramatic, and oftentimes genuinely scary.

[@themindfullone]

Not you calling Lucas “Lewis.” Put some respect on his name!

[@RyboltTech]

I kept wondering the same thing haha

[@ChrisWolfe111]

He kept doing it over and over 😂

[@shannaschueller]

I came here to see if anyone else caught that too. It was annoying.

[@ChrisWolfe111]

@@shannaschueller maybe he was thinking of Lewis from the Simpsons. The only other black kid character on there.

[@shannaschueller]

@@ChrisWolfe111 but she kept calling him Lucas and he still called him Lewis.

[@MrErik052005]

Every guest on these: The show was garbage. Nothing worked. It fail flatter than Jennifer Lopez’s live vocals. Ryan: I liked it…

[@anthonycurran4345]

Adam's complaint that they didn't stick with a Lovecraftian horror as the main villain is unrealistic from a storytelling perspective. If the writers plan to wrap up this series, they need something that can be destroyed for the finale. You can't destroy a Lovecraftian horror, but you can destroy Vecna. Hence why they had to go to where his physical body was located while they knew he would be distracted. If the main villain was something like the mind-flayer, the only thing they would ever be able to do would be to banish it and seal off the gate, leaving it as a potential threat in the future. I think the writers want the ending to be more satisfyingly final.

[@josephalbertson8834]

But it IS a lovecraftian horror. Just through the media of Vecna. The shadow, the dark cloud. Thats a god man. He gave it shape and melded it. He isnt perfect but it can be

[@MichaelNgTzeWei]

Unrealistic if you aren't a writer yourself

[@andrejosue98]

It is not unrealistic from a story perspective... there is no need for a villain to be defeated to end a series

[@issiahsilva]

You don’t need a fairytale ending for a TV show…no need for a villain to be defeated permanently for a show to end great

[@christophernash8166]

Now with the way they did things with Vecna and the latest Mindflayer reveal, we could easily see the Mindflayer again and bring more monsters in. With Vecna, this helps explain the mythology of old and new monsters. If it was just monsters, there would be no strong way to explain their motives and connections. Vecna brings everything together.

[@LisaYoungmpp]

Overall, I thought season 4 was very good and much better than season 3. I don't agree with the harsh critiques given about this season at all. I absolutely loved the scene of Max running and breaking free in her mind from Vecna in the cemetery. I also LOVED episode 7, "Massacre at Hawkins Lab" and the revelation of Henry being 001. I thought it was great revealing Henry/001/Vecna as the series villain tying all the seasons together. At first, when I thought season 4 was going to be the series finale I was not so happy with the ending in episode 9, but now I'm really looking forward to how Eleven and all the cast will come together to defeat Vecna. I thought Lucas's story arc was good and necessary with his relationship with Max. I loved how Eddie was able to redeem himself and fight in memory of Chrissy. I'm hoping the final showdown of season 5 will be written and directed very well because the story has been my favorite since the first episode.

[@blaze556922]

Those were my favorite moments too

[@erynspiritualdiva376]

Agreed!

[@user-dk8zy6jd8r]

Exactly! I've no idea what these people were complaining about.

[@jaeminssocks]

Respectfully disagree! imo s4 has a lot of inconsistencies (like how some characters are off! Things that don’t line up such as the gate being opened and little things like will forgetting his birthday) and the overall plot is all over the place (the only decent storyline from s4 is max and Lucas!) Also this season was very predictable such as Henry being 001 and vecna. I immediately caught on which was mostly due to the unnecessary screen time they gave his character. Also one thing I hate the most was the fact that they killed off Eddie. S4 literally revolved around him, so killing him off was the dumbest move ever (like kill off robin please she’s useless) I thought his big hero moment was irrelevant and pointless especially considering he’s a new character and so is Chrissy, so his “I didn’t run away this time” meant nothing to me. Overall the season in my opinion kinda sucks but I’ll still watch season 5 because regardless I do love the show!

[@ajani.campbell]

What?! This season was so awesome especially when you look at how the pandemic has affected many tv shows. St still managed to hold it own and it spread the story. Not only in Hawkins and that made it feel like a graphic novel. Everything worked out in the end to give a great and compelling story.

[@Shep2345]

Some people deliberately upload contrarian reviews for the clicks and $. It’s just business. This season was my favourite season of TV…ever. I thought it was fantastic. Emotional, action packed and with deep character and multiple plot line development.

[@thewayofthebeard3680]

To put it nicely, Adam isn’t the best commentator. His opinions are way off & often doesn’t understand things that happen in shows lol. EDIT: Honestly, Ryan, your work is exceptional. You should definitely do more episodes where you share your opinions & theories. But even Heather is way off. Obviously season 4 isn't perfect but the points she's making make no sense. The story could've happened without Lucas?! Or the fact that an episode in & of itself can't be 2.5 hours, irrespective of how good it is? And on & on. She's so off.

[@isaacreymundo7907]

I cant even finish her talking at all.

[@SwamSmokey]

@@isaacreymundo7907 Same. She's just so negative about everything and I like watching this channel to get away from all that and just get a breakdown.

[@DocRyder]

Yeah, I'm with this poster. I'm finding these episodes with Heather and Adam aren't hitting the right notes. I've never read either of their works (to my knowledge), but it seems to me that they are really stating "*I* wouldn't have done it this way," as if they are truly experts on TV production, and bluntly, they aren't. And like the other poster has said, I think Ryan's analyses are more on point, and less out of touch with what consumers are looking for, and that's really what pop culture is about.

[@petrilio]

I completely disagree with Adam and Heather. They fell asleep during most of the season, and their understanding of the characters is immature. Please, Adam & Heather, watch the show before your speak!

[@PassiveAgressive319]

Agree. I don’t understand what she’s trying to say.

[@Dani-rz8dj]

I mostly loved it - I think people are over analyzing and finding critiques just to find them. That being said, there are definitely changes that would make it BETTER I definitely agree. Less Russia - more kids, less Papa, trim some fat of those extra long episodes etc

[@cruzinthruspace]

Per usual

[@WhyfallinLUVwhenUcanfallasleep]

More actual deaths

[@Galen940]

Basically the duffer brothers are scared of killing off some of the characters @@WhyfallinLUVwhenUcanfallasleep

[@bobjohnson9201]

The one change I would make to help the Russia story find purpose would be to have Mike tell El that he loves her. Then she locks into an even battle with Vecna. Then we see Joyce save Hopper from the Demidog, and they start killing stuff. Their killings weaken Vecna which gives El the upper hand. Ties in the purpose of Russia much more.

[@inayazia8100]

@@WhyfallinLUVwhenUcanfallasleep Yeah but if they do the fandom will prob get mad and ask the duffer brothers to bring them back

[@doctaflo]

LOVED how Max’s run had me alternating from second to second between thinking she’ll make it and thinking she’s about to die!

[@yoeldelgado4935]

How could she ever die, she's a main character and fan favorite...

[@christinemarinaccio3971]

I completely disagree with almost everything she said. This season was great and LOVED by the fans. I believe the 2 guests on the show were overly critical of this season. Critics will be critics I guess.

[@TheXenogias]

Yes I hope they never come back. They were awful guests

[@mediamail2561]

@@TheXenogias Because they have a different opinion than you?

[@TheXenogias]

@@mediamail2561 did you even watch the video? if you had then you will see how horrendously flawed their arguments are. but obviously you didn't.

[@mediamail2561]

@@TheXenogias name the flaws in their arguments please :)

[@zark9097]

No cap she talking all bullshit why he bring her on like if you didn’t like the show say that in a comment and shut up nobody cares bout your bullshit opinion because the show was really good and this season explains and answers almost everything going back to season one how Vecna/Henry/One was behind everything and it makes sense and his motivation

[@RoboPredaTerminAlien]

"This wasn't necessary" "We didn't need this." What is with a show or story "needing" something. ST is popcorn entertainment. It expanded the scope leading into the last season... that seems "necessary" to me.

[@stupidcupidx]

I feel like people are critiquing and finding things to be problematic about the show. To deny that the writing connected and blended the seasons well would be unjust. They definitely put the budget for the show to good use, and these commentators are ridiculous in their reasoning and criticisms. . .

[@safcjoe7062]

Literally Will and Billy described the Mind Flayer as "him" it's obsession with Eleven. The fact that in the shadow form El easily overpowered it closing the gate, as we say One does when he goes to the Upside Down. There's so many other things.

[@jaysons7581]

💯💯💯

[@TheTenthDoctorandHisTardis]

I completely agree. The entire show at its core is about this ensemble of characters who are more than friends, they’ve become family to one another and the love they all share, be it platonic or romantic, is deep. As such a family unit, the season demonstrates that they will do anything for one another, like trying to help from afar when they can’t be together physically. The interconnected of the season and show8ng what is happening in each thread is central to the arc. In the end, they all came together to fight Vecna. It wasn’t a one person show. The two guests today seem to have completely missed this as both a season and a through-line of the entire series.

[@michaelbowler328]

Let’s, like, never, like, have, like, Heather, like, back, like, on the channel. Russia was unnecessary? This season was great.

[@TheSportsHighlight]

I’m sorry but heather just flat out shouldn’t even offer a opinion. Did she even watch stranger things?

[@antonkrieg9831]

Gotta be so boring watching shows from their perspective, knitpicking everything and actively trying to find things to dislike.

[@qew6686]

The epiphany monologs Was the writers acknowledging a trope of cinema the epiphany of self awareness quickly followed by the character's death. They gave every character a monolog to throw off the scent of who was going to die and who was going to be mortally injured it was actually pretty good.

[@New2DM2]

Maybe. I've felt overall in most media today, writers just don't trust the audience to "get it" anymore, so there's way more exposition than there used to be. Everyone has to monologue and explain what they are thinking and feeling. Then again, I'll never forget when I saw Se7en in theaters as a Freshman (hey man... most people just didn't care back then) with a date (BTW, turns out it was not a good date movie), and then coming out I had to explain the ending to my date. After trying again for the second time I noticed that about 7 other people were standing around and listening and some stranger just randomly asked a follow up question (the comments section in the 90s was in person). So maybe today's writers are onto something.

[@schools6555]

I did not think Max was going to die up until she actually died! Then yes I was in shock. What really hot me was the kid who plays Lucas he did a superb job when she passed very convincing. Same as Dusty that hit even harder when he told Eddy's Uncle DAMN!! Lump in throat.

[@parrotrave]

I mostly agree but it feels pretty obvious that Max is coming back.

[@The_Irish_Rover]

It would of been better if they let her die. It carries emotion. It lets the audience know that these characters CAN die and might in the future. But these characters have plot armor and can’t die. So there are no stakes.

[@schools6555]

@@The_Irish_Rover I know right I almost thought Netflix finally had the balls 🏀🏀 to kill off main character and nope brought back from death. That's some very thick plot armor right there!!

[@Mateocabrera2389]

@@The_Irish_Rover original Star Wars trilogy zero stakes no main hero dies. Right?

[@bethb4432]

Lucas made me sob worse than Eleven did when Hopper “died”. That was an amazing scene.

[@ThePritch74]

Ryan, you absolutely rock, and your hard work, and insight is so so so appreciated. But this video is the first I have have ever rolled my eyes at. I appreciate that Heather has co created 2 of the best new characters in modern Star Wars, but she is so off with her input here. Adam began making sense, but soon went wayward too. I got the impression you disagreed with some of their input, and tried to get them to be a bit more precise, but you were facing a losing battle. They are both so wrong on so many accounts of their 'take' on Season 4. It really stinks of something being so popular that it's more cool to find something wrong, and have an alternate take. We have just witnessed some of the best written, thought out, and performed drama of modern times. We as an audience have shared experiences with every single character here, and are gutted/chuffed for them, and it eats away, a sign of incredible production. When a show leaves you wanting more and more, there can be no bigger compliment. The Duffer Brothers are truly talented, and I look forward to what they do in the future. In short, your Co Contributors have given a really lazy take on an amazing Season 4. (Literally) Millions of us can't be wrong. Keep up your amazing work Ryan. ❤

[@curtislindsey1736]

I would have been happy with just your review. I didn't need the other two people. Great season though!

[@JustAnotherBlader]

People talk about exposition like it’s the absolute worst in bad writing…. But in a show that has lots of questions and answers, how else is all this stuff supposed to be explained so the fans are satisfied? Exposition/flashbacks is fine when it’s done well and I thought the One/Vecna actor delivered it all extremely well.

[@testfire3000]

And he was super creepy about it too! Could it have been shorter? You can make anything shorter, that's the easy part.

[@MichaelNgTzeWei]

Show more than just tell us

[@testfire3000]

@@MichaelNgTzeWei Well I think they did. They mixed exposition with the flashbacks. It's not like he sat Eleven in a chair and talked to her for 45 minutes. I personally didn't feel like there was much "dead air" in any of the episodes. They kept the story moving forward, everything built on what had come before. Its OK if someone explains the how and why of it as you go along.

[@Endgame_01]

I love Screen Crush to listen to Ryan give his take on stuff with the occasional sass from Doug. These panel discussions however, they always bore me to pieces

[@tarag7292]

They bore me too. They're pointless. I just want to watch Ryan and Dog's take on shows. I don't like the discussion panel.

[@sirexuiz]

Couldn't agree more! Feels boring and fake, like they know they can't have 3 people agreeing so they "invent" some opposition/conflict

[@MargaritaOnTheRox]

"Could they actually be at a conference? 100%!" Uh, no. Then people, including you, would be like, "this conference feels contrived. It's awfully convenient they need the parents to be gone, and they're at a conference. Maybe the parents should have their own adventure...."

[@Rolex-xr6rw]

Seriously, she keeps bactracking

[@acbennett7]

Things that give reason to the Russia plot. In the 80's not only was it the Cold War but we were conscious of the fact that the Russian people were not really different than us and it was something that really did play into our psyche. So Hopper and Enzo talking about their kids and realizing they are both just Dad's. And it doesn't matter where you live, the human experience is not all that much different. 2. We learned for the first time about Hopper's guilt over his daughter's death and thinking he was the cause due to his exposure to chemicals in Vietnam. This is was NEW information that helped us understand his character. 3. JOPPER JOPPER JOPPER...we wanted to finally see them fighting for each other instead of just fighting with each other. I could say more, but I won't.

[@ThePsychojoker]

I LOVED the season and it was such a different experience .. but i like when YOU break this stuff down not to be rude when anyone else is on the videos with you i just really relate to your style oppose to anyone else telling me about the shows and breakdowns/ easter eggs

[@christinemarinaccio3971]

I agree! I am really disappointed in this video. I would rather hear Ryan talk about the season. For such a great season it was so disappointing to hear these 2 guests tear it apart 😡

[@insoxicatedfan8550]

Is she really complaining about the finale being too long after Disney keeps rolling out these incoherently rushed 30-minute episodes that miss the mark week after week (with a few exceptions)?

[@Вселеннус]

Honestly, I liked those large episodes. Before series were too short. 40-50 minutes can’t explain and cover everything and everyone that happens, so movies were better then. Now i think I’m starting to prefer series more. Having nine episodes with so much time felt really good. I’d like to see Doctor strange: MOM this way.

[@soupking5]

I agree, why are people complaining about more content? It’s kinda wack.

[@cornjobb]

despite your critique (which i completely disagree with) you have to admit, this season brought up some genuine emotion and i feel so connected to the cast at this point that i will go back and watch the season again very soon (through the lens of knowing what ultimately happens). cheers to the cast, producers, directors and writers for coming up with a genuinely heart-warming and terrifying ride. i bet stephen king loves it.

[@YungBenGriffey]

The Vecna reveal was not a retcon, Gaten basically gave this away in a s1 interview - they were planning this the whole time

[@hersheybarber1424]

In that interview, he was referring to his favorite fan theory, not any confirmation of him knowing what was going to happen with the actual story.

[@YungBenGriffey]

@@hersheybarber1424 even still, there’s a reason why they never showed 001 before

[@hersheybarber1424]

@@YungBenGriffey I agree. I'm not saying they retconned it by any means, but the interview was about fan theories. I assume they at least had it laid out after they wrote or released season 1.

[@joetyrant4713]

It is a retcon. Vecna could have easily killed the cast from the Creel house in the UD at any point in the series. Even if he couldn't open the gates yet, he could have taken out his enemies before they could get stronger. Many plot holes

[@YungBenGriffey]

@@joetyrant4713 incorrect, he couldn’t reach from one dimension into the other until he got Eleven’s powers in the s3 finale

[@TalkThrash]

Lord, she couldn’t get a sentence out without sounding like she was making something up just to say it. This season was so much better than they give credit for. Enjoy it, stop watching it just to find things to hate. You take the joy from watching from yourself. It’s just so cringe to be a contrarian here. These kids are growing into fantastic actors right before our eyes. Just watch and be happy we get to see it happen. The show rocks. I loved the season finale!

[@JoseMarquez-dj7nj]

lol who is Lewis???? come on Ryan it's Lucas, Lucas, Lucas !

[@lazysod3]

Ryan, I need to congratulate you. You finally did the impossible. You found a guest with an even MORE dumbfounding, exasperating, missed-the-point perspective than Adam Lance Garcia. S4 Stranger Things was the most exhilarating, emotional, badass content I’ve seen probably since Endgame. Watching Ryan debate these 2 reminded me of the Neverending Story scene where Artex is choosing to sink into the mud of sadness while Atreyu desperately tries to pull him out. I’ve only ever seen 1 or 2 guests on this type of vid that actually get it and these 2 here are THE WORST. I fear people like this becoming execs at studios.

[@timhayes120]

The complaints about “flashbacks” especially from the lady. Are STUPID. It was great. This season was fantastic

[@SeLinaa553]

I couldn’t agree more. Idk what she’s thinking. Those scenes were great.

[@TheXenogias]

She doesn’t have two brain cells to rub together. Just a terrible take.

[@Rabbit640]

She didn’t like the last 3 episodes, then her commentary here is no longer needed. Some people feel the need to be the smartest people in the room. She can’t even context her own thoughts.

[@killmongertherebel3139]

Man that lady was a Debbie downer this season was 🔥

[@thellamapool2328]

I thoroughly enjoyed the story… and Lucas’s story, he’s had a lot over the seasons and the show would be lesser without it. I also think the finale length was perfect and a sign of what shows can be now. How many multi-part finales have we had? From Community to Doctor Who it’s common. But they’ve always been broken apart because of time slot restraints. In S4 we got to see a multi-part finale as a whole, edited and paced to be as compelling as possible instead of trying to hit conclusions each episode and having to restart. It’s a trend I hope to see a lot more of. I think the One/Vecna reveal regrounded the series to being Hawkins centric. It all comes back to Brenner and brings new fresh questions back to the origins. I didn’t think it felt forced, I think it felt like they had a concise story they wanted to tell to tie everything together and bring new gravity to the series. And lastly it felt honest to its 80’s roots down to the story telling. Classic villains in horror monologuing. It’s an homage and I’m glad they didn’t try to reinvent the wheel which would go against the voice this show has had all along.

[@DaiMongar]

I loved seeing Hopper using the Atlantean sword from Conan the Barbarian, nice little understated 80's reference.

[@stephanielouise1998]

Finally!!! I’ve been dying for your take on this season!!!

[@erynspiritualdiva376]

The monologue is a very 80s thing and I thought was initially used by the Duffer Brothers. Personally, I loved it and felt like it belonged with the overall feel of the show.

[@nbassano]

Ryan you need better guests. These folks are coming in and clearly winging it. They clearly did not put nearly as much thought into their critique and it shows

[@ginawolfe155]

I felt the same way. Claiming Lucas and the Hopper story lines were not needed shows how little they paid attention. Hopper needs to come back for El to have a support system…Hopper can’t just appear with no explanation as to how he got back. We would all be frustrated and claim lazy writing if he came back and there was a quick flashback with exposition as to how he got back. That would be lazy writing. And Lucas…Lucas and Max’s relationship is important. It is how two people are supposed to communicate when one person is struggling with depression. I felt it was a great way to show case how to help a loved one through grief and depression. Max was obviously not around El, the only other person she could talk to, and Lucas and Max love one another. The criticism from Ryan’s guests was just lazy.

[@godlikemonolith]

I agreed with most of what the guests said. They made valid points. Now you are free to disagree with me and their points but let’s not use logical fallacies to make your case.

[@TheCaballo777]

Ryan I truly love your channel, your breakdowns, theories and your bromance with Heavy Spoilers. But these two guests? Man, this season of STs is one of the best seasons of any show, and they are trashing it? Lol Not much of real experts here, just people who feel like they have to critique something to feel like they are doing their job. This season was a masterpiece, with Letter to Billy being probably the best episode of the series, and the 001 reveal scene making that episode a close second. And these guys critique is that they didn't need a big bad, or episodes were too long and explain too much? Lol please don't bring these two ever again. Instead make a collaboration with Heavy Spoilers, as that would be epic!

[@Lawthefilmmaker]

I agree I watch Screen Crush and Heavy Spoilers and love them both. Not feeling these Guest Host, the series episodes where too long, we didn't need a big bad, what? Vecna is the best villain.

[@fernandofsalvia]

Louis = Lucas ... got it

[@brentbarr4679]

K I'm 40, having said that vecna was the bad guy I've been waiting for

[@Bub1029]

These opinions: "I'm so upset that they had the big bad reveal of the dnd campaign where the big bad's plan comes to fruition and the big bad wins a battle focus so much on the big bad instead of the other characters! We've only had 3 seasons focusing on their struggles and growth and a 5th season in the works to look even deeper into it! I hate learning about the thing they've been fighting!" It also sounds like nostalgia whiny people whenever they say "We didn't need this," because they have this platonic ideal of the show that, it turns out, is not what the show is.

[@dance_vik4494]

Please don't just try to find the faults by ignoring the brilliance of the series...

[@tarag7292]

If someone doesn't like it, the they don't like it. Let them not like it then demanding that they must like it because you do.

[@FreshyFilmz]

The whole Mike & Will thing is A lil Off to me honestly ..

[@tommygeno92]

She lost me at "Was Lucas story necessary?" Really? Is any story necessary? They did a wonderful job with his character and the actor grew so much he really sold every scene he was in

[@mikecameron6667]

Thank you for having people with different opinions than yours. Previous episodes like this were just three people gushing over the show.

[@AnnieMar]

I don’t understand a lot of the criticisms. Okay, maybe I wanted to get out of Russia. But I don’t know what kind of perfection people expect. Do you want a show at all? If you want perfect realism go live your life. Some of us like fantastical escapism where you can suspend disbelief and understand that there’s a story being told, so the villain is gonna explain his plan. It’s fine. The absolute negativity towards this show is baffling to me when I feel like I watched something that I feel like not even movies can do because you can’t sit in a theater for 4+ hours. I love this channel but I’m clicking out of this episode.

[@amywalker7119]

I total agree

[@manavbhalla2861]

What’s wrong with people expressing their opinion and criticising things? Stop crying and take your own advice. You do you and let other do themselves.

[@moptop4355]

@@manavbhalla2861Lmao if you really believe that statement. I don’t think would have added it under this persons comment. They’re expressing an opposing view to the criticism in this video and sharing their opinions (they’re essentially criticizing the video). I think they’re allowed to do that….it’s not like they just wrote a paragraph of insults.

[@manavbhalla2861]

@@moptop4355 it seems to me that they are criticising that fact that the video is about criticism of the show or ‘negativity’ according to them.

[@moptop4355]

@@manavbhalla2861 yeah, and I see no problem with that. If that’s what they interpret from the video. I guess they’re allowed to express it. Maybe just agree to disagree.

[@SpideyFan777]

I loved the Vecna monologue. It was cool how he shared it with both Eleven and Nancy with that screen switching action. And it makes sense because his character would totally go off on his master plan. I think the guests' critiques were a classic case of missing the forest because one is too focused on the trees. Regardless of why Millie Bobbie Brown went on a side a quest (other projects, etc.) it made sense story-wise, and that should be all that matters. The big picture.

[@Didntknowhewassick]

Heathers complaint about Lucas’s arc not being necessary because his character hasn’t been explored in depth in previous seasons… I just do not understand this line of thinking? I think it was his time to take on a bigger role and honestly thought it worked really well and the actor knocked it out if the park especially at the end. Idk as soon as I heard her say this I couldn’t take any of her other criticisms seriously. Talk about nit picky

[@lootingwithlogan8880]

Fr tho. I thought it actually was necessary we haven’t seen enough from Lucas.

[@w.matthewgooch3207]

Season 4 was easily the best season since the first. After season 3, I thought maybe the writers had run out of material, but I was pleasantly surprised with season 4. I really enjoyed it. RIP Eddie.

[@Evelyn_Richardson]

Lol yall writers are so hung up on narrative devices imo. You know how the sausage gets made and that gives you a certain perspective the rest of us dont have. I had no complaints personally

[@heatherwarner2603]

Season 4 was amazing. I disagree with Lucas’s arc wasnt necessary . It directly correlates with max . Lucas realized what’s important and it essential helped save max, I know El revived her but at Max’s final moment , she realized she wasn’t ready to die . Lucas helped her realize that through his own inner awakening . He’s still a main character and so important

[@jonathangoldsmith7832]

Why is Adam Lance Garcia hanging out in his grandma’s room? Is that random gallon jug of vinegar behind him?

[@Peachgorillafit]

This video makes me realize we have entirely too many critics on KZbin. Sorry screencrush but I feel like these people need something to criticize. I don’t enjoy when you bring in other “critics”. Stick to your Easter eggs because you’re awesome.

[@AdonisButlerOfficial]

I really enjoyed the 2.5 hr finale. Did anyone else not enjoy that aspect like the lady in this video?

[@shaijuthomas4540]

Don’t think their meaningless opinions was necessarily required. They both lost their way in explaining what they disliked/liked.

[@jondehoff4512]

“We didn’t need to see him change and get his powers” uh why not? I would want to see why someone goes from normal looking to monster.

[@saratanartist]

I LOVED the season. I didn't mind that the episodes were long, I enjoyed every moment.

[@lootingwithlogan8880]

Idk how someone can consider that a bad thing. It’s not like it was boring at times. Always good to have more content

[@ZrodyApo]

What they said at the end about "if they done it in 1 episode" reminded me of the side story from season 2 about the other girl with power They literally did that into a single side episode and almost everyone hated it and felt it was disconnected from the rest of the show, so asking to do that again and thinking it might be good makes me doubt a little about how these people perceived this season 4 And it ends up being and feel like "I don't like this type of storytelling so it's meh" rather than something else

[@RezzPactMugen]

My man... You called Lucas by the name of Louis and that dont sit right with me. LMAO.

[@mattviggiano]

this season was better than 95% of the other stuff airing in tv or streaming. i was disappointed in the end but still loved every second of it.

[@MrMitchbow]

Max definitely had plot armor. FYM?? They literally pulled a force hearing moment

[@jusskb5]

All ima say is if you can write a better ending or season pls be my guest.

[@ayaeternity]

Max's scene at the graveyard from start to finish was the best scene in season 4.

[@HutchTouch416]

I don't understand the issue with the flashback sequences. This was a fantastic season. I love the veil being pulled away to show us what's been there all along. We needed/deserved to see how it started and understand that Henrry was the architect of the upside down as we know it. Leave this show alone lol

[@joshcrates]

Stranger Things formula so you never have to “not be over” a character death again: 1. New character is introduced to the gang 2. Character is obviously death bait so they don’t have to kill main cast

[@KINGCORLEONE11]

A ton of nightmare on elm street vibes this season

[@boemsf]

I love Ryan’s commentary, but I will say it doesn’t sound like anyone has listened to what the Duffers have said. Vecna isn’t a retcon, they stated that the overall vision has been in place for years. They work out the nuances as they go, but my understanding of what the brothers said is that this has been planned. Also, personally it felt like it all fits perfectly. It makes the other villains make more sense when we see the greater purpose and origin.

[@Khail707]

The woman speaking is a fan of Disney+ she looks her shows short and all over the place.. but fun & cute 😂

[@Efinem3787]

Vecna had been best villain of the series so far.

[@raydiokilla]

too long? bloated?! who tf said that??!

[@CesarIsaacPerez]

I loved it! My favorite season since the first one.

[@wolftitan]

This season 4 of Stranger Things had 100 times better writing then Star Wars The Lost Jedi. Oh I meant Loser Jedi, oops Last Jedi.

[@kathrynstewart5397]

On the point that some of the sub-plots could have been skipped and it wouldn't have impacted the story, I completely disagree. My absolute favourite thing about Stranger Things is that they set up for future seasons very naturally, I'm confident that everything in this season was intentional considering the next season will be the last.

[@nayr2432]

the way you guys geek out for everything marvel but critique this so heavily is funny.. stranger things s4 was awesome.

[@Godkabu]

Completely agree. It was kinda annoying to watch

[@isaiahthomas5885]

“Evil Eleven” exactly what I don’t like about Vecna. It’s so tropey/stereotypical to make the bad guy just a evil version of the good guy

[@chaddy59]

So did no one else hear him call him lewis not lucas .....

[@ddanford1]

As much as I love your channel and will continue to watch every video you release, I’m so tired of people picking apart every detail of every movie/show/book/game/any other means of storytelling to say that it “didn’t work” or just negatively review it. That’s actually probably why I do enjoy your channel, because it’s fun Easter eggs and nuggets about stories that I like that doesn’t feel like it’s trying to convince me it’s bad or that my tastes are pedestrian because I like it. Kinda feels like that’s where fandom cultures have been for a while. We’re not allowed to enjoy things, just criticize everything. That said, I loved this season in all of it’s corny, drawn-out, forced glory and both the guests feel like they watched the show hunting for something to complain about.

[@TrueGamer22887]

Do not critique only consume product and wait for more product

[@acbennett7]

I feel sorry for you guys having to watch everything as "seeing the sausage being made"...those of us who just enjoy pure entertainment and love to see all these characters, LOVED it. Sure I personally could have done with less Papa, but others may really like that. I think the Duffer Brothers are making a show that appeals broadly. My .02.

[@testfire3000]

I really like this channel but this episode was such a downer on the series. wow

[@katealeksen4168]

"But now here's my take on this season: I liked it!" Thank you! After so many youtubers stretching things to fit the time needed for monetization this sounded refreshing LOL

[@mrgotitfordalow]

Haven't really heard from anyone that they didn't like it.

[@SPACEKNOCKERZ76]

Just tv/movie snobs are nitpicking. lol

[@MarvelousMusicmmusic]

Cause you know everyone?

[@rikybarbeito4123]

I dont understand her complains, she says that some characters are static and whatever But then she trashes Lucas arc because “he was never a main character”. Like do you want them static or not?

[@petrilio]

Yeah. The show became a phenomenon because of these four kids: Eleven, Mike, Lucas and Dustin. They are the truly the main characters of the show. I wonder if Heather is a racist.

[@thepilgrim8336]

I loved it, still not over Eddie. I do think if he hadn’t done what he did then the demobats could have been unleashed on Hawkins starting with Dustin since the gate there has been torn wide open.

[@misterdarwin]

While I understand and share the desire to keep a lovecraftian mystery going with the Upside Down, the reality is viewers want everything explained. Walking Dead viewers were still clamoring to find out what started the zombie apocalypse more than a decade after the show started. Whether planned in advance or retconned, I think they did an excellent job tying these threads together with One. And if you still want your unknowable horrors, remember One didn't create the Upside Down. He didn't create the Demogorgon. Outside the Mind Flayer and UD Hawkins, it looks like what was there preceded him, and will remain after him. The idea of a human becoming a part of the Great Unknown Evil is also a lovecraftian theme, and that's how I'm choosing to see it here.

[@jimmyk4445]

Weird hearing these takes. I thought it was the strongest season since season 1. One of the best seasons of television in the last 5 years. "In no world can you justify a 2 hour finale that can't stand-up as a standalone film" really? You can't justify that? It's on Netflix. We all binged the first half of the season anyways? What's the difference in putting unnecessary stops and starts in there. Just let it play out. If you have an issue with the pacing that's one thing, but to open with "in no world can you justify it" you make it sound like the pacing could be perfect and you just wouldn't like it cuz it's long.

[@Graehaus]

Personally S2 was my weak point, S3 I enjoy more, and 4 was great.

[@matthewbryanshaw]

Season 4 was brilliant. People LOVE to nitpick what's popular. But this is all just good, fun storytelling that was elevated by a REAL threat. Like Star Wars - there are haters who want to take apart every little thing. Stranger Things is a cultural phenomenon that isn't perfect but it's perfect for many. And it feels so good because the Duffers write damn good characters that you can care about over 4 seasons, 1 season, or 1 episode. That's a tough feat. I love ST - it's my favorite show of all time - and this season might be the best yet. It's OK for sequels and subsequent seasons to be BETTER than the original. Despite the loud voices of minorities...it happens. A lot. For me the season worked well. I hope they use Johnathan, Mike and Will better next season but I understand why they couldn't be in the MAIN story this year. Can't wait for season 5.

[@YungBenGriffey]

Personally I thought this season was the best of the show besides mayyybe season 1

[@michaelleggo9318]

That Heather girl has no idea what’s she’s talking about.

[@safcjoe7062]

She's complaining that the villain had intentions rather than "I want to kill" lmao.

[@itshard2spell]

Really enjoyed Ryan's takes. Spot on with the pros and cons of the season within the series. This season did a great job of pulling the story back together as much as they could.

[@bryanheilman4376]

Loved this season, it had a few draggy moments, but 9 for me!

[@john8062]

Super draggy I fell asleep second to last episode and I hardly ever do that

[@ryandailey]

@@john8062 Hope you can get more sleep.

[@john8062]

@@ryandailey I did because it was so boring.

[@RustySh4ckelfrd]

@22:14 "Why did they go back to the jail after they escaped?" Were you even paying attention? They literally explained why. All the characters fully acknowledged how ridiculous it sounded even. They knew the demogorgon/cloud thing/demodogs were still in the jail and they knew that the only way they would be able to maybe provide some help to the kids given their situation was to try to kill them since its a hivemind and they (upside down monsters/Vecna) would all experience the pain as one. The only issue I had with it was that they were willing to potentially sacrifice themselves based on the idea that the kids *might* need help. They didn't actually have any way of knowing what the kids' current situation was. But to not even understand why they went back into the jail shows an impressive feat of somehow watching something close enough to feel as though you can make criticisms about it but not close enough to understand pretty significant plot points that are explained plain as day as exposition beforehand. Well done.

[@jimmyk4445]

Did i completely misunderstand the Russia thing? Wasn't it implied that burning the creatures in Russia was the single reason the tentacles retracted and released Steve Nancy and robin? And why the bats stopped attacking Eddie and didn't attack Dustin? Wasn't that the direct implication? Killing the monsters in Russia the hive mind was hurt long enough for the kids to be successful? Obviously the timing is extremely convieniant but that's what it is