Diesel vs Electric Tug-of-War: Ford F-150 Lightning Takes on the Ram 2500 Cummins In a Nail Biter!

[@upthecreekyt]

It would've been cool if you had shown the battery percentage before and after.

[@nenezaze3252]

That would be a Ram 🐏 fan boy or a Chevy but hurt..

[@redsquarejay]

100% before. 2% after lol

[@luciankristov6436]

Probably lost 10% if i had to guess. Not advocating for EV lol but the trucks battery capacity isnt that bad...its bad but not that bad if you get me . Ill take my 5.0 lol

[@c.carrillo7813]

@@nenezaze3252 It's a valid concern. You seem to be an EV 🐑 jumping straight to insults for a genuine question. It must pain you to know some people think for themselves.

[@travisyarbrough4033]

Has zero to do with it ...... Gas / Diesel are over ...... Won't be missed

[@dingo3190]

Now do It 10 times and see who can still drive home.

[@francesco1998]

Lightning already lost half its range just getting out there

[@IanSizzler]

@@francesco1998 And the other trucks spent more $$ doing the same work

[@r0m6v33]

@@IanSizzler at least the other trucks can do work

[@Prestiged_peck]

I was waiting for the dodge's transmission to blow

[@9663mu]

Lol spoken like a true EV hater 😆😁🤣

[@wrench8149]

I wonder how much the tires matter in tests like these. Seems like an important factor.

[@6.0hhh]

Tires and weight.

[@snapdrag141]

I noticed a lack of tread on the Ram fs

[@Tonyx.yt.]

weight distribution is even more important, f150 lighting is 50-50, RAM i dont think so

[@travisyarbrough4033]

all have street tires

[@LosDoyerss]

Tires is more than half of it.

[@jasongooden917]

The most amazing thing is the tensile strength of that belt

[@whatskrakin37]

You should see those extreme truck tug of wars, you’d be more surprised at the strength of a little belt/rope haha

[@mrchad97z49]

that small difference could be just the type of tread design on the tires. Hardly notable. Or it could be the spot on the dirt where each tire was grabbing. Both the Cummin 6.7L and the Electric were limited by the terrain

[@HotshotJimmy]

5:10 F150 vs Electric F150 8:00 Electric F150 vs Cummins

[@theonewhostandsaboveall6826]

Thank you this what we needed

[@rubenhernandez4394]

You sir are the goat 🐐

[@redneckcomputergeek]

So glad I found this to avoid another BS filled episode!

[@miragesmack007]

@@redneckcomputergeek wow, having to waste a whole 11 mins of your life, that must be brutal for you.

[@ri3m4nn]

@@miragesmack007 you must be young

[@austincoleman4771]

Would love too see them do a rematch of the lightning and the ram on pavement that way traction is the next beneficial part for a tug o war. I also understand they’re being as gentle as they can for their vehicles which is why they’re doing it on dirt.

[@jamesbowman5382]

This whole thing is stupid as long as the lightning only gets like 80 miles towing. I don't care if it has 50k lb/ft of torque... living in Texas that barely gets me out of town

[@derekk6906]

I agree, just an overpriced wheelbarrow with an electric motor. Perfect for hauling bags of Mulch on the weekends. Way overrated.

[@bradhiggins4813]

@Tron Jockey the ram will be on the road a decade after the electric; it’s repairable.

[@IceTTom]

@Tron Jockey Wait... are you saying electric motors... don't burn out?!l lmao You've never worked with electric tools have you?

[@governmentmanagement8537]

They did right. Tug a war on pavement is for weak trucks. Dirt gives the best results cause it shows traction and power with true torque.

[@miltonzinn8732]

Engineering explained broke down the science of this a few years ago. What should take place is the heaviest vehicle with the most force multipliers of torque will win the tug of war every time. I highly recommend watching his breakdown of the cyber trick vs f150 for reference

[@RealJeep]

Correct. Tug or wars mean absolutely nothing. It means the vehicle with the best weight and distribution and tractive effort will win. If I had a 15,000 pound lawn mower with a 20 HP engine and it was geared correctly, I'd win.

[@mguerra310]

But the heavier vehicle lost in this one. Even with having more weight and torque than the lightning the lightning still moved it. And with just using the front wheels. Impressive. ICE’s are on their way out.

[@dee-or9zh]

True, the ram lost only due to turbo lag.

[@mguerra310]

@@dee-or9zh it lost because of instant torque. Its that simple. Like hitting a light switch the light comes on right away. Same thing with EV’s.

[@2wheelobsessed]

@@mguerra310 They are on the way out but not for any of the reasons you’re being led to believe.

[@rickhughes8998]

What happened was almost 1000 lbs of curb weight between the Raptor and the Lightning. The last two were more closely matched in weight. I will take the Ram however as I don't have to wait 5 days to charge at the RV park.

[@neutrino78x]

real problem is that you live at an RV park 😲 Sorry to hear, hope you improve your situation 😞 Having said that, there are high power chargers that will charge that thing in like 20 min. 🙂you have to pay but it's less than half what is costs to fill a gas tank. Plus really everybody should have solar on the roof. We subsidize it here in California, and 46% of all homes in California have solar on the roof. If you have a big enough system, you can put excess power you don't use during the day into a battery, and then use that battery to charge your EV at night while also powering your house. 🙂

[@joshuagarner1654]

What raptor?

[@rickhughes8998]

@@joshuagarner1654 Reading comprehension not your thing? Let me mansplain it to ya boy. I compared the weight of the raptor to the lightning for context. Never said there was any Raptor in the video.

[@BarryObaminable]

Many parks have 50 amp supply, which means it 24 hours or less

[@neutrino78x]

@@BarryObaminable "Many parks have 50 amp supply, which means it 24 hours or less" hmmm....most electric cars charge overnight if you have one of the company's chargers installed....(with a high energy outlet like for a clothes dryer.)

[@ETXWheelsinMotion]

Im impressed since the all electric f-150 it’s a half ton truck and it stood it’s ground against a much bigger and heavier ram diesel 2500 that’s a 3/4 ton.

[@jeffmusacchio6570]

Very nice tribute to the camera. Thank you Roman and Andre and TFL crew for entertaining me this morning.

[@johnmontana8540]

Hey guys, what percentage of battery did those pulls kill?

[@lawrencemaroun3310]

It would be less than 1%. Each pull only lasts for about 15 seconds. They would have to be flooring it and using the maximum power output for the entire pull to come close to using 1% of the battery. But they couldn't have been flooring it because then the wheels would have just been spinning. So the average power draw has to be much, much less than the maximum power. You also can't draw max power at low speed because your RPMs are too low. If we assume that the Lightning's wheels were spinning at about the right speed to travel 10mph, making the motor spin at about 1,000 rpm, at max torque that comes out to 110 kW. Over 15 seconds, that power draw would use 1/3 of 1% or roughly 0.3% of the battery. Even this is a high estimate because they couldn't have been using full torque on the dirt, so power would have been lower still.

[@brandonweeks]

@@lawrencemaroun3310 I’m a technician that has to work on EV, you’re not even close to being correct

[@heartwinners410]

About the same amount of Gas the diesel burned....lol

[@rickpotera3942]

@@lawrencemaroun3310 That's an awfully technical response that isn't even remotely correct.

[@lawrencemaroun3310]

@@rickpotera3942 what's the answer then? How did you arrive at it? Show me your assumptions and calculations. Otherwise you're just making stuff up. The math is clear as day. 430kw (max power) for an hour is 430kwh. 15 seconds is 15/3600 hours. 430 * (15/3600) is 1.8 kWh. That is 1.3% out of 130kWh. So that's a clear upper bound for energy consumed over 15 seconds and we know that they weren't flooring it, so we know that the true consumption was some fraction of 1.3%.

[@brly4542]

All about tires and gearing and weight of its in the right spot. HP, torque don't matter much, a 50 HP tractor that weighs about the same as these trucks would out pull all of them

[@Welcometofacsistube]

Gearing. I own a 1952 massy Ferguson 55 with a 60 hp 3 cylinder diesel and I assure you that in low in first it would pull any truck around with ease

[@lustfulvengance]

We have a 30 year old 4x4 forklift at work with a optimistic 50hp Perkins in it but the thing is so damn heavy with its counterweight and ridiculous low range gearing I guarantee you that would outpull just about anything on the road!

[@phalanx3803]

the weight alone makes big difference that EV is a good tonne heavier then its diesel counterpart.

[@jamesbeaman6337]

@@Welcometofacsistube with a tractor, the other part of the equation is traction (hence the name). The usually lugged tires as well as the larger contact patch the larger diameter tires and lower pressures give you allow that torque from the low gearing to be more effectively transferred to the ground.

[@Welcometofacsistube]

@@jamesbeaman6337 very true

[@mitchellthomas8432]

They failed to mention tires and tread patterns. I noticed the electric had combination tread, off road and highway compatibility. The ram looked like street only tread.

[@3723kilo]

Ford sucks

[@RedonkaBert]

Now lets do a real world challenge. Haul a trailer across the state and back. 😏

[@lanceripplinger8352]

It was even between the RAM and the Ford Lightning. The RAM appeared to be more planted on the back end too. The Lightning looked like it was fish tailing more.

[@daniel89123]

He was doing that on purpose to try and get traction

[@bostondan77]

Thanks for the video, these videos are not very practical but VERY entertaining.

[@MrGdbsti05]

lots of feelings going to be hurt

[@electroniccheeks]

Not really. It's just for entertainment. No one with a ounce of logic will purchase a vehicle based on this video.

[@MH-kc1eu]

I hope that Ford and RAM will not get rid of gasoline and diesel trucks and replace them with fully electric trucks.

[@LucasDaniel-nr2sw]

Vão continua usando motores ruins

[@LucasDaniel-nr2sw]

Sendo que os elétricos são melhor

[@leonardschleuning3070]

Now to see how it really stacks up, get a high output Cummins in the mix or wait for the new super duty to drop and get the high output powerstroke.

[@FitChaser]

Looks like a win for BF Goodrich tires

[@gd-rn7xm]

always love a good tug of war.......but it only proves which truck is heavier and or has more traction. same weight/traction then it comes down to the driver who keeps their tires from peeling out first. I had a ford courier push a chevy camino back on concrete, because he punched it and was peeling first, my 4 banger didn't have the guts to peel and kept traction.

[@UncleKennysPlace]

Peeling reduces traction.

[@murdoch9106]

Yeah, and EV's has crazy power control, that car or truck dont want to spin it can easily make sure it never will, you just cant get that level of control in a convetional powertrain. Its a very silly thing to do and its mostly just a show that say little to nothing about either vehicle.

[@ryanb7476]

@@murdoch9106 facts.

[@ToAnEnd]

I think another advantage an EV has in a tug-of-war, is that when you’re not accelerating, you’re stopping. There’s just no dead time between being on the accelerator and moving to the brakes. Even if you let off the accelerator in the Lightning, you’ll be fighting the electric motors. Pretty cool!

[@aaron-fauth]

That’s where the advantages end

[@ToAnEnd]

@@aaron-fauth Dynamic, thanks for the reply 😂

[@horsefly1020]

Weight

[@u-law8149]

@@ToAnEnd 4 play 😂

[@DG-sf9ei]

Oh little guy, the fights soon over when the electric pile runs out of battery power like an rc car, then gets pulled off a cliff where it belongs instead of the nearest charging station.

[@hayhaylife9525]

The lighting can't drive home now😂

[@nc3826]

can't afford to drive the RAM home😂

[@jdmbeats]

In terms of Torque, it is very hard to compete with electric motors, pound per pound. Now being able to supply power to that electric motor is another story.

[@jeremysmith9868]

I seem to remember that the Lighting had more aggressive tires put on it Hybrid still had the low rolling resistance tires on it.

[@MJorgy5]

If they switched tires, the Lightning would still win.

[@jromem7313]

please do it again on the pavement! all 3 had no traction

[@Josh-179]

Roman said at the outset why they didn't. Really bad for the drivetrains to do tug of wars on pavement.

[@donnelcrunk2122]

@@Josh-179 who cares, theyve got the money, we want to see the real deal dammit!

[@jromem7313]

@@Josh-179 my whole point exactly 💯 see that lightning get pulled in half

[@Josh-179]

@@donnelcrunk2122 , I'm surprised they have enough money to even pay for TFL's large staff. Most car KZbinr's only have 2-3 people on a payroll. Their vehicle's are on business loans.

[@Josh-179]

@@jromem7313 , the Diesel Ram would likely win but it wouldn't be by much. Actually, the Lightening would have a shot because of the instant torque headstart creating momentum.

[@eduardoflores2510]

You guys are nuts but worth every minute of this video.

[@kesselrunner]

Yeah, but can the Lightning haul 5k lbs 400 miles without stopping?

[@chupa3851]

Bro this is literally at its infancy and is already outperforming engines decades in the making

[@kesselrunner]

@@chupa3851 The entire electric vehicle industry is in its infancy. It's great that they have the performance, but I'm not going to be owning an EV until they can go the distance like a gas vehicle can.

[@BatmanisBatman]

@@kesselrunner The tesla cybertruck can go 500 miles on one charge and it takes 15 minutes to charge. So yes the cybertruck can go just as far as a diesel without stopping AND cost 1/4 the price to refill it. Gas engines are a thing of the past.

[@kesselrunner]

@@BatmanisBatman Sure, but hauling a trailer will cut that range in half. The battery tech needs a lot more development if it wants to be as practical as gas or diesel. Solid state batteries look promising, but that might take a couple decades.

[@BatmanisBatman]

@@kesselrunner No hauling a trailer does not cut that distance in half if anything it would be a 10-20% distance reduction at most which is still better than the ford who only gets 400 miles on one tank which is also reduced because it has to haul a trailer. There really is no comparison here, the cybertruck gets almost 100 more miles on one charge for 1/4 the price.

[@Eric2300jeep]

To truly make this fair, you need to have the same tires/pressures or the proper pressures for tire type/vehicle weight, so that they have the same footprint. And please do this on asphalt as well! Side note: Perhaps hold the brakes on the Cummins while bringing up the RPM's slightly, to build a little boost prior to start. Would also be awesome if both vehicles had a gooseneck hitch and you guys attached to there instead!

[@johnnicpon5783]

This is also a tire test. Put a decent set of AT tires on the Ram and redo it. Those Firestone Transucks are AT in name only! And as far as an electric HD, what will that range be towing? 50 miles or less??? Have you guys seen all the 40 foot+, 3 axel fifth wheel trailers, behind 1 ton diesel powered dually pickups that are on the road? Also, love the eulogy to the camera at the end!!!

[@johnnicpon5783]

@@Tony-bg6ql Trucks are meant to be driven wherever they are needed. I use mine to tow a 30' travel trailer.

[@johnnicpon5783]

@@Tony-bg6ql And trucks have evolved since their creation. That is why we have 1\2 ton, 3\4 ton and 1 ton pickup trucks (both gas and diesel). They now serve multiple. purposes. And that includes towing.

[@davidblalock9945]

Watching the initial pull between the Lightning and the Ram, technically it was a draw because the flag only moved because of line stretch. Neither the Lightning nor the Ram managed to budge the other.

[@hybridstoatdragon]

These kinds of competitions are silly because its down to the wheel and tire setup on top of the vehicles weight and torque. If the tires had grip it would be a torque competition and it becomes boring.

[@jameshenson4871]

How about a real world test of pulling max load for a pre determined distance in a certain amount of time? I guarantee the Ram would be victorious! Electric trucks aren't where they need to be-by a long shot. No matter how much the government and private business tries to sell it, I am not sold. The range isn't where it should be loaded. The cars are a different story.

[@matthewseanchapman6310]

I agree with that

[@gingie5246]

@@user-vi9st9lv1q the electric f150 weighs more than the hybrid f150 so of course it’s going to get drug around. Thats why the ram was the equalizer.

[@ronaldking1054]

@@jameshenson4871 Okay, put 3.88 gallons into your Ram and do that versus the electric because that is the tank size in terms of gasoline for the battery. That would be your real-world test. It will lose.

[@dennisl6198]

I knew all the reasons why this would not be a particularly informative video. Yet, I watched and enjoyed it anyway. Nice job guys..we can't always be scientific. sometimes, you have to spin tires on dirt.

[@jesuschristiskingandsavior461]

"Sometimes you just have to spin tires in dirt" Amen to That!

[@crewdawg2008]

In the history of automobiles, exactly 0 tug of wars have ever meant anything 😂😂😂

[@lifemobile33]

This is an very easy explanation. No weight in the back of the diesel truck which means no traction for the rear wheels of the diesel truck. If some weight was in the back of the diesel truck it would pull the electric cord all over the field like it was nothing.

[@leonardrice2830]

Interesting. I get the point. In theory the electric with its weight should win I think. After all diesel locomotives are actually electrically driven. Doing it on dirt however just invalidates the entire test, no?

[@pin65371]

The electric will also have very precise traction control. All the torque in the world doesn't really matter if you can't put the power to the ground.

[@paulhoffman778]

Why not do it on snow also you have a good point sand is loose , why wouldn't you do it on cement or am I wrong.🤔

[@pstoneking3418]

They were both on the same dirt , not sure that invalidates the entire test. I also believe the lightning would win even easier on pavement because of the traction control. The other trucks would be burning up their tire where the lightning would control that from happening. As the other trucks rubber started to melt the lightning would take off.

[@ajs96350]

Did you have to charge the Lighting in between pulls?

[@Aqoura]

Ford probably overheated from the transmission though

[@dakotalambert5479]

Lighting has unfair advantage because the other 2 are running in their factory tires and the Lighting was upgraded to all terrain for the Alaska trip

[@wingsofprosperity]

Thank for the info

[@Harry_Bahlzanya]

Comment section is just pure KZbin gold so many tears of infinite sorrow

[@Chris-yh2xf]

We do this on the farm all the time. This test proves nothing. A 140 hp tractor will walk a 170 hp tractor if it’s weight is balanced correctly.

[@sexynachos88]

Yes, they mentioned this early in the video and stated this was more for fun than to actually test.

[@666cemetaryslut]

Why would HP matter, it's not a top speed run

[@neilkurzman4907]

@@666cemetaryslut It’s more about low-end torque.

[@MoY206]

Shouldn't the gearing help to?

[@mikehankins4513]

The Cummins is the most powerful on a job site doing real work...

[@kingshawn1857]

It's kinda funny how the lightning pulled an old school ford 2 1/2 wheel spin trick and still managed to win by a hamster's left ass cheek 😂😂

[@NDRN88]

Now pull the same load for 101 miles. Can't.

[@kingshawn1857]

@@NDRN88 well I think in the right scenario it could but see it's 102 miles that scares me 🤣🤣

[@RealJeep]

Obviously you know nothing about physics. The heaviest truck with the best traction will win every time. Electric vehicles are god awful heavy.

[@kingshawn1857]

@@RealJeep well obviously you don't hear too well the diesel weighs nearly a 1000lbs more than the lightning and nearly a ton more than the hybrid and btw in this case the tires don't make a big difference the tires on the lightning are not that much more aggressive than the ram so your argument is pointless

[@mguerra310]

@@RealJeep but the ram was heavier

[@J26-e6g]

Man! Andre bending over yelling, “Roman, is the hole too small?” Cracked me up. You guys are better than Top Gear, great video! 2:11

[@Salvitrojan7]

Better than the current top gear sure.. better than the original top gear with Jeremy, James & Richard hello no.. haha

[@Iesous27]

Nothing was mentioned of the tires. Regardless of the torque each truck has, the grip on the dirt road is the most important in a battle like this

[@texaswader]

Now for the next challenge let's see how far the gas and diesel trucks can go between fuel stops versus the electric truck.

[@neutrino78x]

ok, so the electric one has to stop for 20 minutes. The electric Ford Lightning actually has 320 miles of range, in the platinum trim. Do you drive more than that at work? The less expensive one has 230 miles range...again, do you drive longer than that at work is the question. 🙂

[@BrogeKilrain]

Solution found by Tug boats and train locomotives is use a DIESEL ENGINE TO RUN GENERATORS THAT RUN ELECTRIC MOTORS

[@4literv6]

The og hybrids dating back to pre ww2? Except it was diesel electric submarines who employed that tech first. Basically all large earth movers do the same thing, big stinking hot diesel powers a generator driving huge electric motors&hydraulics.😀

[@eriklee1264]

Those TransForce tires on the Ram are totally abysmal!!! I took them off my Silverado HD that CarMax put on ... almost got stuck in my flat yard on grass.

[@danh8302]

Not just weight and power numbers but the way the power is applied and how the mitigation of power is achieved in wheel spin conditions. electric drive is far superior in all these situations. Their weak point is only the lack of energy density in the pack compared to a fuel tank.

[@SweetLou0523]

Which has basically been solved, they are just working on developing the production methon for commercial production. In essence, researchers accidentally made a Lithium Sulfur battery that was stable at room temp (previous the sulfur composition was only stable wwhen hot) This particular chemistry doubles the energy density of conventional lithium ion. So you can either get the same capacity with half the battery size, or double the capacity with the same size footprint.

[@dundonrl]

@@SweetLou0523 It's FAR from being solved! Even the absolute best battery in an EV is the equivalent of about 4 gallons of gasoline!

[@markgeisewite2687]

And that weak point makes them utterly impractical for a lot of us.

[@danh8302]

@@markgeisewite2687 in the mining and heavy equipment industry, we use electric for a vast array of things. It is objectively superior in terms of propulsion.

[@danh8302]

@@dundonrl which speaks to how energy dense gasoline and diesel are. Conversely how much of that energy we waste making it into heat instead of propulsion. On the flip side, how efficient an electric drive is getting that kind of range on 4 gal equivalent. Or conversely how little relative energy is stored in a battery vs a fuel tank.

[@tmcquitty]

Yes, but which one will haul a loaded trailer up a hill for 25 miles?

[@vicpetrishak1077]

One of the most overlooked in this demonstration is the TIRES .

[@jasonwescott3105]

Well the fact that the Lightening only has an 86 mile range while towing a trailer is a complete deal breaker for me. I'll stick with my Ram Cummins Diesel for anything needing to be towed, thanks!!

[@ahuskyslegacy7896]

Basically “the lightning beat the ram but let me come up with something to make me feel better about my POS Chrysler”

[@jasonwescott3105]

@@ahuskyslegacy7896 would you hitch up to a 43' 5th wheel camper with that POS lightening and tow it down the road for 80 miles then stop for 4-6 hours to recharge it to drive another 80 miles?? Spoken like a true Ford fan.

[@ahuskyslegacy7896]

@@jasonwescott3105 I wouldn’t buy a 5th wheel camper when I have a house to sleep in. And if I did my local campground is within 30 miles so yes I would actually. People try to overcomplicate towing range with the lightning. For the 1% of people traveling 100’s of miles to sleep outside go ahead and get a ram and make sure you wear your seatbelt so when your transmission slips 100 times on the ride you don’t hit the dashboard

[@jasonwescott3105]

@@ahuskyslegacy7896 well clearly you’re the utmost expert on all things towing!! Next time I’ll be sure to ask you all about it before I make a stupid purchase like a 5th wheel. Oh, and I do have a house to sleep in as well. Why would I buy a 5th wheel to only go 30 miles? That makes as much sense as a submarine with a screen door.

[@ahuskyslegacy7896]

@@jasonwescott3105 why does it matter if you are 30 miles or 100 miles away in your 5th wheel? Is a 100 mile away camp site better than a close one lol. Let me just drive 300 miles away to park my 5th wheel in the woods when I have the same woods 20 miles down the road

[@mybudinesd4545]

That instant torque is awesome 👏

[@TheGoddamnBacon]

Hey, if EV trucks have at least one advantage, I suppose that's it. At least if they have the tires to match that.

[@carholic-sz3qv]

And the ev 50/50 weight distribution is actually what makes the difference lol….

[@dearbulls]

It is awesome but really it's more of its weight that win the race.

[@flyingsavage8522]

@@dearbulls the tires aren’t being considered here as much as they should be since it’s on dirt and the lighting has a far better tires for dirt than the ram. I agree the weight it also a major factor in this case

[@skrapenpennies9947]

@@dearbulls exactly

[@-Enginerd]

Keep in mind, torque ratings for an electric vehicle and a combustion vehicle should not be compared. Technically, the only time it's appropriate to compare powertrain torque ratings for two vehicles is if they have identical geartrain reduction ratios. That's because, all that matters is tire tractive force. This is the force that is pushing the vehicle forward at the contact patch. It’s dependent on wheel torque, tire radius, and coefficient of friction. To calculate wheel torque, you need to understand all multipliers between the powertrain and the wheels. Ram 2500 6.7l 850 ft*lb (6.7l engine) x 2:1 (assumed torque converter stall ratio) x 3.23:1 (68RFE 1st gear ratio) x 2.64:1 (Borg Warner 44-46 low ratio) x 3.73 (axle final drive ratio) ≈ 54,000 ft*lb (wheel torque peak) Ford Lightning 775 ft*lb (believed to be combined (front + rear) peak motor torque) x ((9.72+9.61)/2):1 (average gear reduction ratio) ≈ 7,500 ft*lb (wheel torque peak) Because the two vehicles have near identical tire diameters, it can be said this Ram has around 7X more potential pulling force than the Lightning. Realistically though, there will be traction limits negating a large portion of the advantage the Ram has. Also, as this video demonstrates, software intervention plays a role too.

[@johnjaniak473]

Nice job breaking that down , people forget about gear multiplication

[@MJorgy5]

Ram hits peak torque at what rpm? Before that, it's way less. ..So, it's kind of a moot point. Towing at speed would be a different story.

[@dalemllns]

can always find the engineer....

[@GAMMA_AF]

Nerd

[@BlankIsTaken]

No one asked nerd

[@ipleedafif8033]

This is the first gen of the F150EV. As the batteries tech get better and the motors get better, they are going to be tough to ignore as a great replacement. Most people here in the big cities drive trucks don't really use it for work. It's just a family hauler.

[@TomTom-gn9mp]

Weight Distribution, gearing, torque proportioning, and tires make most of the difference here.

[@vollmarfarm]

That's was neat watching the electric vs the diesel, I'd like to see a 3500 gas or diesel vs the electric and see how they do

[@flyingsavage8522]

This would be a lot better on some asphalt where the one with better dirt tires won’t win every time

[@edwardpate6128]

You should have used the GM 3.0 Duramax to represent the Diesel. then put 1,500 lb in the beds and do it on concrete. Then we will see how tough those drivetrains are!

[@Propnut48]

I ain’t giving up my Ram 6.7L

[@nc3826]

NP, but someday your RAM, will give up on you

[@shanemorton773]

No one said you had too kiddo, it's okay, your feelings are still intact.

[@Dannamal-hc8pu]

Still more scientific than that "cyber truck pulling that F-150" in 2 wheel drive video.

[@garyscott4847]

The electric truck weights significantly more due to the battery pack.

[@mark-kf3md]

The difference is likely due to the differentials. In the Ram the front and rear differentials are open (do not have lockers). Meaning that the 4 wheel drive on the Ram is actually 2 wheel drive because when the wheels start to spin with an open diff all the traction is diverted to the wheel with the most grip. This then results in one wheel on the front and one wheel on the rear having traction on the ram. This is also true of the Ford hybrid. The EV has a different system and has a traction control system which allows all for wheels to have traction. The system gives traction to each wheel and senses slip for each wheel. If you want to make it fair you need a Ram or other diesel truck with front and rear lockers. This will give traction to all four wheels and the Ram will kick ass. A lot of people talk inaccurately about 2 wheel drive and 4 wheel drive. The truth is that 2 wheel drive has only 1 wheel drive in limited traction situations. In 2 wheel drive with a locker engaged it has 2 wheel drive. In 4 wheel drive with the rear locker engaged it has 3 wheel drive. In 4 wheel drive with the front and rear lockers engaged it has 4 wheel drive.

[@perpelle]

I'm quite certain that the majority of all manufacturers have brake based anti slip in all transfer case modes, especially 2H and 4H(if not turned off). The lightning only has two motors, one in each axle with open differentials. It must use the rear locker or brake wheel/s.

[@00coyote80]

The electric truck took 4 hours to charge between each test. Other than that it did great!

[@shamarerskine3987]

lol

[@lawrencemcclammy4686]

Maybe 10 years ago. EVS charge in like 15 minutes now

[@daviddoe2440]

Take them to a track, and hook up to a pulling sled! Then you'll have a slightly more scientific approach, while still having fun! This was still fun to watch !!

[@adventurefishing3190]

Stop it....EV will kill ICE in pulling, not even close.instant torque.

[@GLC-1979]

@@adventurefishing3190 lol dude learn physics ...you're so wrong.

[@nmelkhunter1]

Hook them up to a gooseneck stock trailer with 20 650 lbs calves and pull the 16,000 plus lb load 200 miles to the sales barn over rolling hills at an average altitude of 5500’. The diesel will win and be back home in time for dinner since EV will have to stop and charge for five hours.

[@daviddoe2440]

@@nmelkhunter1 that'll change in time. Its getting better already. Just need more competition, and innovation! For example, look at the HP wars in the diesel market in the last 15 years! I miss pulling a heavy trailer with a Cummins!

[@garyposthuma9607]

@@adventurefishing3190 it different on pulling sled the weight doesn't come on till 200 feet down the track then motor already wound up so it doesn't matter how much torke u got coming out of the hole

[@neilforehand1121]

Next test, see who wins on a 1,000 mile race!

[@sherylellingson3538]

I’ll easily do it I’m my 2019 F-150, ecoboost

[@donaldunal7039]

My condolences..RIP PANASONIC LUMIX GH5..May your service will never be forgotten..

[@colinhoward74]

In a tug of war with 4x4s , the heavier vehicle wins , especially on dirt

[@jasonperry7970]

100 % yes. I've seen rust bucket 80s 4 cylinder Toyotas out pull brand new diesels. Of course the beds were full of sand or scrap iron....

[@tyrrellroach5872]

So I watching this the ram and the lightning I think , yes we saw the benifit of the instant torque but we also saw the down side of the electric motor. Because what I think we saw is what happens when an electric motor meets its max load. When a electric motor meets its max load it just stops a traditional diesel or gas truck it will continue to try and pull hence why the electric didn’t dig in but the diesel did. You see this with all kinds of electric motors.

[@jackwsandoz]

I'm pretty sure that just comes down to different methods of traction control. (Brake based vs power based) If the electric motors had just stopped, the Lightning would've given up ground rather than gaining a very slight amount of it, over the truck that's spinning tire.

[@AvgDan]

I think it had plenty of power to peel out on dirt and traction control prevented rear tire spin.

[@ryantroester2648]

Battery may have more torque but until they figure out the life of that battery while towing I will keep my diesel. Good video guys

[@jim2498]

For me it the cost of the EV vehicles and the cost to replace the battery.

[@4literv6]

@@jim2498 why worry about that though? Since 2010 at the cell level ev pack's have gone down over 800% per kwh. Also all evs sold in the U.S. have an 8yr or 100,000 mile federal ev battery warranty. 👍🏻

[@jim2498]

@@4literv6 still a lot of money to spend on a battery. And vehicle last well over 100k

[@4literv6]

@@jim2498 average new vehicle is 12yrs otr here in the U.S. Again why worry about the pack replacement cost when it's covered for at least 8yrs or 100k? Ev pack's are not cell phone batteries. These are highly engineered very well designed heated&cooled pack's.

[@Cal56347]

@@jim2498 You'd realistically never have to replace a battery pack. The new packs are 300k-500k mile packs.

[@lf3566]

Tug of war has nothing to do with power and everything to do with traction.

[@Treyk901]

Did you disable traction control? Did you lock the rear diff? The hybrid looked like the 4x4 wasn’t working.

[@gregelton1045]

That is exactly what I was thinking. The Lightning would probably pull my 2003 FX4, but I guarantee my front and rear wheels would be spinning.

[@larrysmith6797]

It's an EV.

[@Treyk901]

@@larrysmith6797 ?? The very first pull was the lightning vs the hybrid… I was asking about the hybrid.

[@gregelton1045]

@@larrysmith6797 What is an EV? We know the blue one (the Lightning) is an EV. All 4 wheels seem to be turning on it. The question is, why on the King Ranch was the front wheels not spinning. After looking closer I think I see why. Because it was not an FX4. Not sure on newer trucks, but my FX4 has locking front and rear differential. Meaning 4 wheel drive is really, 4 wheel drive. The standard 4wd is really 3wd and sometimes 2wd. Meaning the tire with the most traction gets the power, sometimes leaving the other with no power. So, it would seem (I don't know this), the EV is a "true" 4wd drive vehicle with motors at both axles. The King Ranch was the standard 4x4 which means, at best it was down 1 wheel on traction. The results may had been the same, but we will never know with a bias test example. Also, knowing the EV has instant torque, the KW (and Ram) should have been brake torqued at an RPM closer to their peak torque. Just to be a fair comparison.

[@Austin-iq7ds]

@@gregelton1045 f150s have never had a locking front diff. They do have locking rears. I think the hybrid 4x4 was working, just the open diff in the front was doing its thing and we never saw the other front wheel

[@duggydo]

We can see the framing of the new building in the background. Did you guys set up a time lapse for the construction? Those are always good.

[@terrafirma9328]

You guys are awesome at this. 👍👍👍👍👍

[@benthorsgard]

Should have included a John Deere tractor. It’s just as useful for long distance towing as the electric.

[@lukekennedy4538]

Can’t do a test like this on a surface that gives. A true test is true conditions.

[@TaigaTurf]

The instant torque of electric can't be beat.. They should have loaded the lightning to be same weight as the Cummins to be fair

[@nicksrandomviews1296]

I much rather have the diesel any day.

[@ryantroester2648]

If you watch at 8:03 Roman had a slight advantage when he said go he was on the accelerator because he new it was coming Andre had to play catch up because the human brain doesn’t process fast enough to keep things fair you really should have had a third person start things off. Would it change the outcome probably not but it’s all in fairness.

[@matthewseanchapman6310]

Ryan Troester your right

[@mtb4l673]

They cheat because they're biased

[@trackworker9826]

They have to make Ford look good so they'll continue to send test mules.

[@bricegreen9616]

Funny how the front tires on the king ranch spun to start with but at the end was only spinning the back tires

[@GeraldPUR]

Just in case you were wondering. The Cummings 6.7L engine is an inline 6 not a v8 like in the Ford's pickups. Very cool test guys 😆

[@Danzilly]

I would like to see the lighting pull a weight sled!

[@4literv6]

There is some video of a rivian r1t doing that at a tractor pull event on tik tok and Instagram.

[@doubled8247]

@@4literv6 and it rocked a full pull lol

[@jdlutz1965]

When Ford launched the Lightning, they did a cool demo of pulling a fully loaded freight train with the pickup.

[@FrankTheTank417]

Great video guys. I don’t really ever comment but so am today. I wanna help you with the algorithm. To be continued with the HUMMER EV!!! 🙌🏼

[@vonJaerschky]

After a couple of hours the Ram will win because the Lightning will run out of charge. ;-)

[@LTVoyager]

The biggest determinants in a pull like this are weight and tire tread and pressure. Torque only matters if you don’t have enough to spin the tires. Once you have that much torque, anything more is wasted.

[@davidmarshall6243]

Tug a war is all about traction. Weight, contact patch of tires, torque to turn the tires without breaking traction. In that order. Theres tricks to make up for uneven comparisons.

[@gorillaman08zx]

How much battery did the lightning go through

[@davidanderson-22]

No one asks this when it's fossil fuel vs. fossil fuel. Just saying.

[@gorillaman08zx]

@@davidanderson-22 because we can go to a gas station and put diesel or gas in a truck in about 35 seconds not 13 hours of charging

[@4literv6]

@@gorillaman08zx and any homeowner with this truck can pull up plug it in overnight in 3secs come out the next day and it's fully charged. Can't do that with any ice truck's and definetely not getting 70-80mpg out of an ice truck either. My emc gives me enough free energy to charge a lightning for 800-1000 miles a month. 😎

[@gorillaman08zx]

@@4literv6 pull a 12,000 to 14,000 pound construction trailer 80 miles to a job and try to get back home, you can’t do that in any EV either, some of us actually use our trucks to work not just grab groceries!

[@4literv6]

@@gorillaman08zx isn't that more a 2500 series trucks tow weight? How far does your very inefficient slow diesel get towing a load like that on 3.5 or less gallons of fuel again? Gas 2500 towing that load wouldn't even get 30miles at hwy speeds on the same energy a lightning has. 🤔 Yeah I use my truck for actual work purposes to, over 80% of its miles have been with at least 2 people in it, carrying tools and stuff in the bed and or a trailer behind it. The lightning works just fine for those jobs and many more like it for those of us. Who aren't driving a truck just like a cowboy Cadillac or pavement princess type. 😀

[@safetylast911]

more spinage then poppeye

[@robwatson10]

I think this is really a test of traction... I have 1300lb/ft of torque in my Cummins but honestly I'd probably lose that battle as I'd struggle to plant it... Fun to watch though. 👍

[@chrismcdowell5515]

agreed, where as my 99 land cruiser with lockers front and back and aggressive mud terrain tires would more than likely beat all of these...and it is gutless.

[@zachsheffield1325]

I can just see the for sale descriptions!! Lightly driven by my daughter she’s very cautious! It’s never towed anything! The truck has very light use age!

[@Wolfsden_Gaming]

I'd love to see the King Ranch against a TRD Pro Tundra. Both with TT3.5V6 that would be pretty fun

[@regsparkes6507]

Tires, surface condition, rope stretch, who's on the throttle quicker,.. all those and other factors come into play here. Maybe a better way is to load up a large/heavy trailer and pull up a steep hill on asphalt against the clock, whaddya think TFL? Now there are three trucks that I would not want to buy after this LOL.

[@Sixinthefield]

they did exactly that in a video not long ago...........

[@regsparkes6507]

@@Sixinthefield Opps! I missed that one., I'll look it up.

[@classic89deerefever80]

Now if only it did more than 83 miles under light duty towing 🤔🤦‍♂️

[@crhu319]

Genset in bedbox.

[@Sixinthefield]

@@crhu319 using a gen set kinda defeats the purpose of the EV, no?

[@michaelgreer8659]

Ain't the letric heavier than both? Hitch heights and wheel base can matter too

[@keyalpha1]

"Is the hole too small?" .... a dollar for every time I've heard that, I'd have.... 2 dollars.

[@whiskeybuilder6335]

This is how the steam locomotive guys must have felt when the new diesels rolled in the yard.

[@ArthurDeKeersmaeker]

I want to see it on hard road

[@jessehensley1812]

Dude trucks pull way more in four wheel drive than pulling that ram, if that truck breaks down its just because it's a shitty ford which ford in general leads in more recalls in the past few years so, put them on payment

[@GalaxyFur]

Imagine the pulling power of an all-electric Ford Excursion if Ford made one. That would be cool to see. 🙂

[@FullsendOffroad]

🤮electric

[@pflanagan1]

It's still no match when you consider the range on an electric once you attempt to tow anything. Then you also have the recharge time. No thanks. When I can recharge in the same amount of time and get the same milage as a gasoline vehicle, that's when I'll switch.

[@lyman135]

Why would it be different than the truck? It's not like it's going to have more power because of a different body style.

[@GalaxyFur]

@@pflanagan1 Can you show me in my comment where I was saying "imagine the range of an Electric Excursion"? I said pulling power. Its pulling power would be better than a diesel or gas vehicle.

[@GalaxyFur]

@@lyman135 The Excursion would be more powerful than an F-150 electric because it's in the 3/4/ ~ 1-ton weight class. So it would in fact get larger heaver electric motors. But also because the Excursion was the largest consumer SUV ever built. So an all-electric version would be an extremely heavy vehicle with heavy-duty electric motors and a larger battery than the F-150 Lightning. The Excursion also comfortably sat 9 people.

[@gbipit1]

What I go to bed worried about is the decline of America in investing in with my tax dollars in fake claims in climate change

[@DirectCurrentRides]

Even if there is no climate issue, electric is still better than buying fuel from hostile countries.

[@gbipit1]

@@DirectCurrentRides we were energy independent but you got brainwashed into Dems thinking now we gotta buy lithium from China and destroy our rainforests to get it you lose again plus don’t think their won’t be a Federal electric tax coming all in the name of saving the planet again wake up and do your research before you believe everything you hear

[@DirectCurrentRides]

@@gbipit1 tell that to our primarily Russian oil reserve supply

[@davenhla]

lol, immediatly you get two replies of propganda informed people claiming muh Russia. Two years ago America was a net exporter of oil. Current admin sent that packing, just so people that come to this comment know the truth. Fairly recently current admin sold our federal oil reserves to chin4.

[@gbipit1]

@@davenhla exactly

[@billymadison8036]

eleven and a half minutes of my life I won't get back

[@williamfoley5687]

Never had a truck.I think they are cool looking!

[@kiefershanks4172]

Two words: tractive effort. Whoever makes the most torque and weighs the most wins. EVs have lots of tractive effort but what they lack is gobs of energy to keep it up for a long time. For all internal combustion's faults, it still cannot be beat for pure endurance.

[@neilkurzman4907]

And how long do you think the test would last? That’s the part that you ignore. Does it have enough energy to complete it’s task.

[@yarrik701]

@@neilkurzman4907 probably when speaking of endurance; long haul towing, etc. I see it with the lawn equipment i have. My gasoline and diesel equipment just run longer between fill ups where i get a fraction of the run time out of my electric power equipment..

[@neilkurzman4907]

@@yarrik701 Absolutely. So if the test was who could go further on a single Fill-up then the electric with loose. This test shows the strength of electric.

[@yarrik701]

​@@neilkurzman4907 Kind of... but not in any meaningful way. Other people have touched on the topic of curb weight between the trucks involved already and how that plays a role in this "test". And when one of the bigger "selling points" of EVs are all about being green\good for the environment, weighing about as much as a 3/4 ton diesel pickup (~roughly 3tons, right?) the EV's truck pull advantage plays a big role in its range disadvantage even compared to its ICE counterparts. Probably does wonders for the wear and tear on roads too..

[@neilkurzman4907]

@@yarrik701 It’s interesting how people will just come up with rationalizations for anything they want to be true. They don’t even put a lot of thought into it. Tear up the roads? A vehicle that weighs less than trucks semi trucks cement trucks ect. And all the sudden you’re worried about tearing up the roads? rationalizations for birds? for recycling batteries? Yes it’s heavier, that means it’s going to need bigger tires and they’re not going to last as long. but for a Tesla it’s equivalent to an ford expedition. Are you concerned that expeditions are tearing up the road? In the end for this specific challenge an electric vehicle has the advantage for several reasons. I had to head gasoline or diesel just isn’t going to win. Just like in a distance race an electric vehicle is not going to win. On a race with a long downhill slope, the electric vehicle has the advantage due to regenerative braking. Where is a gasoline vehicle with an automatic transmission is going to burn up its brakes. Throwing a manual transmission, and that advantage is gone.