The Case against "The Case for Reparations" | Glenn Loury & David E. Kaiser | The Glenn Show

[@Psychopolitica]

Hey everybody. Some of you are unable to subscribe or turn on notifications for this channel, and when you try, you see a message about content made for kids (even though we made sure to mark it as NOT for kids). This is apparently a pretty common issue as I see other content creators complain about it. I've reached out to KZbin support for help. In the meantime, if you can subscribe, but not turn notifications on (the bell button), you could try unsubscribing, resubscribing, and hitting the bell button again. Thanks for your patience.

[@bradmorse6320]

Glenn Loury is an inspiration. He is so lucid and grounded, I could listen to him all day.

[@ondolite3789]

😁

[@friarnewborg9213]

NONSENSE must be packaged in such a COMPLICATED way to be sold

[@jmonahan1]

The only YT Video Ive ever watched twice and actually took notes of. More please!

[@trumanhw]

I truly just LOVE Glenn. It's just so tragic and literally depressing to see the reality that ... our opposition not only reject the utility of objectivity, but the EXISTENCE of it.

[@jausti2]

lol dude you are watching a reductive half ass KZbin video funded by the Koch brothers on the topic of reparations. The most influential political financiers in America aren’t creating media for you to be objective.

[@augustgreig9420]

Not to mention their top "intellectuals" refuse to come on and have a debate or jus a conversation. This includes Kendi, and that woman who wrote the book about how all white people are racists.

[@jausti2]

@@augustgreig9420 this is such a dumb talking point. First no one who actually reads and studies these issues consider Kendi and Di’Angelo top intellectuals. You won’t take the time to read and learn on the subject but you make demands on a debate? These top intellectuals do panels and lectures all the time. Their main focus is on research and education not debating in front of an undereducated racist internet audience. Also, the actual top intellectuals present their ideas in public forums in front of their peers all the time. If you value merit and education why would you want a PHD in African American studies or related fields to debate ppl like John Mchworter, Coleman Hughes or whatever Koch brothers funded podcaster that hasn’t studied or published work in their field? But Sandy Darity is a top intellectual on reparations and he has a session with Glen. Begging for a debate on a blk American issue without reading on these issues is a dead give away of your racism.

[@farapipsqueek636]

@@jausti2 Glenn Lowery is funded by the Koch brothers? I have never heard that before.

[@jausti2]

@@farapipsqueek636 yup. Look up the Manhattan Institute

[@jamesdellaneve9005]

What a great article that he read at the end. Very good writing. Today’s newspapers are almost unreadable. Not clear and straightforward writing.

[@glennwatson3313]

Thank you for this. This video will change they way I teach high school history.

[@eriknadoban8877]

Very good show Glenn! Please get more historians on your show. Thanks as always

[@Stolat79]

I feel that same pain David, thank you for that reading. What a beautiful project America is, we need to get back to that sentiment.

[@TheShootist]

An American divorce. the woke need to go their own way.

[@anastasiarees2640]

I just had my ass handed to me. I taught a segment on redlining, following the traditional narrative without doing more due diligence. If we speak about racism, we must me do it on honest terms. Racism speaks for itself without having to dress itself up. Covering up facts leads to distrust and white antagonism.

[@TeaParty1776]

Color Of Law, published by a Marxist group, blames govt for some racism. Eg, govt would not insure banks lending to blacks. Urban Renewal deliberately destroyed many black neighborhoods. But, because govt acted thru business, business was easily condemned and govt ignored.

[@billbillards569]

Facts, like in the 1980s and 1990s there was a segment of society calling itself the Bloods and Crips that were too busy shooting up houses instead of buying them. This is not to mention the murder rate was skyrocketing due to this segment as well.

[@sifridbassoon]

interesting conversation. Sad that it will never be presented to the public at large.

[@dabronx340]

As always a pleasure to hear you opine

[@cmcull987]

Great conversation! Thank you, Glenn. One suggestion--could the authors of the books mentioned in this discussion be listed somewhere? I'd like to read some of them.

[@padredave53]

Fascinating insights by a very fair and patient interviewer, and an amazing historian…..who like many intellectuals takes wide swathes and then hones in on a point I wasn’t expecting to hear. I have been told I do that too, so I guess it just comes with the territory……thanks Glenn!

[@SiddharthaNaithani]

Powerful stuff, Professor Kaiser! Great to see you back on The Glenn Show.

[@ondolite3789]

Shut up.

[@nathanngumi8467]

Word. A very interesting discussion, great historical insights from Prof. Kaiser, history is being distorted by people with questionable agendas... so experts in the subject like him must stand up and defend the truth!

[@TheShootist]

Frame Problems, a channel on youtube. this is directly related to Doctor Kaiser's point at 42:30. I am astounded at the level of censorship I've experienced trying to post two comments on this conversation between Doctor Loury and Doctor Kaiser.

[@jamesdellaneve9005]

@@TheShootist wierd

[@TheShootist]

@@jamesdellaneve9005 i before e except after w

[@paigemccormick6519]

@@jamesdellaneve9005 What's weird?

[@paigemccormick6519]

Nathan, thank you so much.

[@Hoireabard]

Kaiser’s concluding quote from the Chicago Defender reflects an important difference between then and now. It reminds me of a Sidney Poitier line in the 1967 movie Guess Who’s Coming to Dinner, “Dad, you're my father. I'm your son. I love you. I always have and I always will. But you think of yourself as a colored man. I think of myself as a man.” When activists say we have a racist society today they are correct but not in the way they imagine. The obsessively existential preoccupation with skin color heard in American neo-racists today is South Africanesque in its neo-apartheid hate. Poitier understood what the race mongers never will. It’s an American tragedy.

[@williamerdman4888]

Excellent Discussion.... I learned so much.

[@jamesboekbinder]

Get him on again and go into greater detail - never knew that about the use of the median in the papers.

[@vernonrobinson1685]

Professor Loury is my new hero.

[@jamesboekbinder]

Great!

[@carltech41]

To liken or compare white domestic workers with any proven ancestory who had rights to vote and/or work freely in this country without any RACISM that BLACK people were affected by is ELEMENTARY in its understanding. Its WRONG. You guys have all the INTELLECTUAL ideas but NOT ONE clear thought on what SLAVERY REPERATIONS is and who it should be given to. The AUDACITY to think that black people who were slaves for YEARS and YEARS who had THEIR OWN PROPERTY taken away from them and then DENIED the freedoms of WHITE DOMESTIC workers is truly concerning that any one hearing this doesnt see this is not OBJECTIVE at all.

[@raymondswenson1268]

California was acquired by the US in the 1847-48 war against Mexico. With the 1849 Gold Rush, the population grew and it became a FREE state in 1850. California was too far away for slave owners to move their slaves 1,000 miles against their will, and people in california did not LIKE black people, and did not want Black slaves imported there. Californians mistreated indigenous peoples and the Mexicans who had lived there 100 years. When Chinese and Japanese showed up, they were discriminated against, culminating in FDR's abuses in WW II. California owes Native Americans, Mexican Americans, Chinese and Japanese Americans Much More than to Blacks in California, which never had Black slavery. California reparations should go to the yrue victims of California rather than the Blacks who benefitted from moving to California voluntarily.

[@christopherconnor5436]

What a powerful finale to such a thoughtful and impressive discussion.

[@Ramiiam]

Great conversation. We need more of it.

[@aq9939]

Excellent discussion. Loved the point about median wealth.

[@stella3265]

Glenn I enjoy your show. Even if I don’t agree with some of the historiography. I enjoyed your discussion with Prof Kaiser. I don’t agree with some of his views on history, but that’s fine. Good show.

[@thehumanpromise497]

Excellent - I enjoy learning and this was a deeply intellectual conversation - Thank you!

[@st2rl2]

Thank you

[@Floccini]

What comes to my mind is: Some people will say Jews could not borrow but lend therefore they are rich. others will say: Blacks could not borrow therefore they are poor. Seems somewhat in conflict and BTW many anabaptists neither borrow nor lend.

[@AlabasterClay]

David Kaiser was really moved to tears at the end. The Chicago Defender speaking as citizens, not race groups.

[@1956curtis]

The number of black homeowners went up but the quality of those homes was not the same as those in new suburbs That had an effect on the increase in value of those homes over time. In other words, building family wealth. White people living in redlined areas were affected too, but they could relocate to newer homes that black people were not allowed to buy.

[@unijay2215]

Thank you Glen and Professor Kaiser. I was brought to tears in the end, as well, in reference to the citizenship comment.

[@KeyserSoze23]

Great episode.

[@cmcull987]

I think it's truly important to interview older Black Veterans. And all WW2 veterans, if there are any left. But so many WW2 Black veterans are mostly dead. But The GI Bill today versus the 1940s is very different from this era.

[@jausti2]

Also many blk farmers especially in the south should have been interviewed and their experiences should have been documented better. The USDA lawsuit is such an under discussed story

[@atolliver91]

Good show...

[@mainstreammedia1330]

26:44..."hated blacks so much"🤔. Collateral damage perhaps? This is 1 of the greatest discussions. Thanks Prof.

[@TheShootist]

kill 4 unrelated souls to take out 1 target?

[@mainstreammedia1330]

@@TheShootist I wouldn't put anything past human nature. Even Jesus was falsely accused & Hitler didn't mind killing lesser ethnicities. In the movie "braveheart" the king said "we have reserves"...so it's possible.

[@HondoTrailside]

The big issue US foreign policy analysis needs to confront is the body count. It seems as though over the past 100 years, and a bit, even if you exclude the WWs, that US foreign policy has killed tens of millions of people. Comments like the admission of the Sec. State that a million people may have died in Iraq from sanctions, between the wars; or the idea that 5-6 million excess deaths occurred in Afghanistan, during the 20 year war there. The stats are going to vary between direct deaths caused by US policy (and in many regions people continue to die today from poisons, UXBs), and the "you broke it, you bought it" approach where death followed intentional policies by the US to degrade the livability conditions, or to support violent groups in other countries. But the US didn't pull the trigger. The issue isn't really blame, but cost. The world is a very dangerous place, and there may be justifications for even huge body counts, if to put it simply, they averted even larger disasters. But it starts with the cost in lives, and the impact on US prestige.

[@abupinhus]

What is so bad about claim of A-bomb to Japan because they wanted to scare USSR as secondary goal?! Russians by the end of war took half Europe, had strongest army.

[@jefferywestbrook]

"Banditry with statistics" That's a phrase I'll remember!

[@TheShootist]

42:30 I was surprised that Doctor Loury is (apparently) unaware of this data cited by Doctor Kaiser. It's a website containing economic information, mainly about wages over the period 1940 to present. if I name the website my post is immediately deleted. Kaiser names the website at 42:30 and wishes the listeners to view that site. What Happened in 1971 except WT(eff)Happenedin1971 period and the com word.

[@patsemchism]

Fascinating stats on that website.

[@ballzack2886]

Love Glenn. But I can’t unsee black colonel sanders with his avatar.

[@ondolite3789]

With a philosophy reminiscent of McDowall from Coming to America.

[@oleeb]

I find the discussions of reparations since the entitled Cotes became a name on the internet completely distorted and unrealistic. It's sad really and now serves more as a distraction to vastly more important and immediate problems like full employment at good, middle class wages and Medicare for All. It's time we, as one American people, started to refocus on improving the quality and quantity of life for every citizen. Our government has been captured by predatory wealth (both parties) and has lost its way. We should most definitely reinvigorate and restore the ethos of the New Deal that actually did improve life for all Americans from the most humble to the most wealthy. America is strongest and best for all people when everyone is experiencing a rising quality of life. That means better wages for workers whether blue collar or white collar, working with their hands or in the professions. The uber rich have more wealth than they could ever hope to spend and much of it in the last 40 years has been transferred to them and thus has deprived the ability of the government to invest in infrastructure, education, you name it and we are now reaping the harvest of destabilizing the middle class and increasing the ranks of the poor and desperate.

[@paulalaflamme3207]

Wonderful conversations as ever.

[@veir4666]

Good talk, very interesting. But maaaaan the tempo of the discussion--if this was jazz it would be free-form jazz. Cutting in, cutting out, etc. Both have so much worth leaning, but maybe they could've used some decaf. Or maybe something else to smooth it out.

[@williamchurch711]

Could someone explain the significance of utilizing the median?

[@paigemccormick6519]

MEDIAN, not medium. Median is the midpoint of a bunch of data. 50% of data points lie above the median, 50% lie below. In the case of "wealth gap" there is no difference between blacks and whites below the 50% median. No difference. However, if you take all the medians from different data collections, and average them (0 for wealth gap, 20 for something else, 40 for another something: 0 + 20 + 40 = 60, 60 divided by 3 = 20), you get an average difference of 20. Blacks trailing whites by 20%. If you just look at wealth gap alone below for people below the 50% median, you get 0. Zero.

[@fernandoadame5834]

Mexican American people in the U.S. Southwest were not part of FDR's New Deal either. The black/white paradigm in the U.S., very interesting discussion. Thank you gentlemen.

[@psikeyhackr6914]

The Half Has Never Been Told by Edward Baptist

[@katrina8077]

so, the historians take is although there was governmental harm, black people were still able to overcome. does that then negate the harm done overall? the wealth lost? and please explain how I am to take his word on (this person's take is right because I agree) but Mr. Coates' take is wrong? Knock it off

[@jamesbarton1969]

I was the year before, National Guard. Basic and AIT at Fort Dix

[@paigemccormick6519]

8:08 DK: Thanks to wokeness ... Please, please, please, my brothers and sisters, listen to this (somewhat rambling) analysis of the revolution against objective history. We will be losing history now, and then we lose everything. Edit: word choice

[@michaelmcchesney6645]

I have memories from my childhood in the 1970's of adults being afraid of integrated neighborhoods. That fear wasn't so much because of animosity towards black people (though I doubt many of these people voted for Obama) but concern over property values. As it was explained to me, once a neighborhood had a few black families move in, it would be considered integrated. But once the neighborhood integrated, white families would worry that the neighborhood was changing and decide to move in the phenomena known as "white flight." If white families started moving away, property values fell. I am sure there was a lot of racism among those adults. But the insidious part is that you didn't need to be racist to fear integration if you believed racist neighbors would move away and depress your home value. My earliest memories are living across the street from my grandfather's house on Decatur Ave and 198th Street in the Bronx. In 1972, when I was 4, my grandfather died and we moved across the street. But we sold the house a year later and moved to Woodlawn. The South Bronx had a well deserved reputation as being less than safe. Woodlawn was about as far North as you could get without actually leaving NYC. My grandfather's house might have once also been considered to be located in the North Bronx. But something else I heard from adults was that the South Bronx moved further North every year. It was a phenomena known as 'block creep" from which Woodlawn was somewhat protected. I once read a newspaper article that described Woodlawn as "an island in a sea of change." That's because it is cut off from the rest of the Bronx on 3 sides with Westchester County to the North. Woodlawn Cemetery lies to the South with VanCortlandt Park to the West and the Bronx River/Bronx River Parkway to the East. Was it racist of my parents to sell a home in a rapidly integrating neighborhood and move North to a lily white neighborhood? Maybe. But it was definitely the smart thing to do, because 6 months after we sold my grandfather's house someone burned down the block. I don't think Woodlawn could honestly be called integrated today, but there are a noticeable number of minorities living there. Ironically, the neighborhood remained mostly white because of a large number of illegal immigrants that settled there. Of course, those illegal immigrants didn't walk across the border, but instead arrived at JFK from Ireland. Well I am sure some arrived at Newark airport too. Building a wall does nothing to stop the 40% of illegal immigrants that arrive legally on tourist visas and just don't go home. Although, that percentage is probably lower today because of the border surge. But I was writing about white fear of integration in the 1970's. I think that fear is dramatically lessened, though probably still exists today. I think the biggest difference is the NYC crime rate. Starting under Rudy Giuliani and continuing under Michael Bloomberg violent crime fell over 75% from its high in the early 90s. It is a shame about Giuliani's mental decline because he really did transform this city. If only he had sold his soul to the devil instead of someone far far worse. Anyway, I felt safe enough to move back to the neighborhood my family fled in 1973. Two years ago, I bought an apartment 7 blocks from where my grandfather's house once stood.

[@lilarose5512]

Why would people leaving drop the price if people were willing to buy?

[@michaelmcchesney6645]

@@lilarose5512 It was just a function of supply and demand. Higher demand drives up prices while lower demand causes prices to fall. As white flight became a thing, it was possible to sell homes in an integrated neighborhood but only at lower prices than the home might have sold for before the integration.

[@africkinamerican]

That has been my impression as well as I have read from time to time about the motives behind so-called white flight. Perhaps second to that, concerns about crime. People don't talk much about "black flight." My parents moved us from the south side of Chicago, out to the suburbs and the reason they gave us was the superior schools in the burbs. (I don't think crime was really the issue back then in the mid 70s.)

[@michaelmcchesney6645]

@@africkinamerican I never had kids, but my sisters did. My youngest sister moved to LA right after college. She and her husband delayed their wedding in order to buy a house. When my oldest niece was in 7th grade, they sold that house to move into a smaller home that costs significantly more money just because of the school district. My other sister is a NYC public school teacher. She had been living in a co-op apartment in Yonkers, but when her son was 2, she moved to a beautiful house with a huge yard in Putnam County a little less than an hour North of NYC. She wanted her son to have a yard, but even more important to her were the excellent schools. Both of my sisters were willing to make sacrifices so that their children could go to better schools. My sister that is a teacher and I disagree about school choice and charter schools. She worries that if the parents who care the most about their children's educations abandon the public schools, it will make it much harder to educate the kids left behind. I think she has a point about that. But I just don't think it is right to force kids whose parents can't afford to spend a million dollars on a home or to move far outside NYC to remain in failing schools. I think that parents should be given a choice between sending their children to public schools or being given a voucher/scholarship that would let them send their kids to a private school, whether secular or sectarian. So long as it is the parent making the choice to use a voucher for a religious school, the Supreme Court has said it wouldn't violate the Establishment Clause. I believe Florida just passed a law establishing that type of system. I very much hope the competition serves all the children well.

[@glouconx983]

Does anyone have a link to info on Samuel Cronin mentioned at 17:25?

[@jpwright87]

Nice intro music

[@gabrielsyme4180]

COMMENT COMMENT COMMENT Push the video up the AL-GORE-RHYTH

[@paigemccormick6519]

Break the algorithm world. Enhance other media.

[@TheCrusaderRabbits]

Let Kaiser speak. There was no need to interrupt him. Come on...

[@ondolite3789]

How does Lousy feel abowt reparations for jews and native americans??

[@NancyLebovitz]

So what *did* happen in 1971?

[@advocate1563]

Reparstions are such a dead end. I'm Irish. We suffered 400 years of English rule. The results were death and oppression and America saw the results first hand wuth the millions who emigrsted to her shores in the 19C. So, shall we rise up and demand reparstions from the UK? People have the potential for great evil. Its white on white, black on black (Rwanda), and all shades in between. Forgiveness is in such short supply, but feels like the only way forward. Ironically my family came to England to find work in the 1950s. They still encountered prejudice with signs reading No Irish, No Blacks in boarding houses. We have made a success.of our story. It is enoigh, becase it has to be withoout losing agency (victim status) or bitterness (psychological corrosion). Of course there is a specific situation being discussed ere; and i know little about US history.

[@jausti2]

Go tell this to the groups that the US has already paid reparations to. In fact we made a large payment during the Obama administration and we pay these out every year. It’s obvious that so many ppl only have a problem with blk ppl in this discussion. The only principle that is consistent is racism

[@paulalaflamme3207]

What? Only 93 comments? I'd write more but I can't see a damn thing. Too paranoid to get my emphysema suppressed immune system to the eye doctor.

[@furyofbongos]

Oh, how politics inspires lies and deceit.

[@charlescooper4081]

you're preaching to the choir. all the 13% hear is whitie owes them some free money .

[@michaelweber5702]

If we had universal service now , still , we likely wouldn't have this extremely divisive and nation killing 'woke' weakness which , god forbid , may spell the end of our freedoms , our democracy . This reality is so sad ...

[@GambitYuGiOh]

26:33 He's making a bunch of claims that sound good but just as he says the other book is not persuasive you could easily draw a coherent through line that his opinions are unpersuasive. First, he notes that black workers who did receive the industrial benefits got a hire portion as it relates to that output, however he doesn't mention raw numbers. He admits blacks were the minority of the possible pool but forego giving absolutes on many of families affected. My point is just saying "blacks got more than they expected" is likely a true statement but grossly misleading. He then goes on to say there were more white domestic and farm workers than blacks. Of course there was solely based on population sizes and access to career. He then uses this premise to smuggle "It's unreasonable to think white legislators would exclude those whites just to exclude the blacks". This statement seems outlandish to him when it's very reasonable. One, what percentage of the white population 1) worked in industrial jobs vs 2) domestics and farm. How does that ratio compare to that of blacks? The problem with only presenting certain statistics (favorable to your narrative) is you can paint any narrative. I'm not saying he's wrong (I believe he is) but he's basically painting as unpersuasive an opinion as those he criticizes.

[@williamerdman4888]

First paragraph - you're amplifying a really minor point he has made. Its kind of like "so what". Second paragraph - you ascribe ill-will to Kaiser with your "reasonable" comment and you do so with no evidence. Why take this position with no evidence? Your bias is showing. My sense is he has stated it here correctly. But I am objective enough to believe that it is possible some legislators may have done what you propose, but not the majority - you need to provide evidence to make that case.

[@GambitYuGiOh]

@@williamerdman4888 I'm not sure what you construe as minor in the first paragraph, it's rather important as it's bedrock to his opinion of dismissal. I didn't ascribe ill-will, I even said "I'm not saying he's wrong" I just believe it's likely because of the more obvious statistics he uses and the more meaningful ones he ignores to use that would be more salient to his point

[@ms-jl6dl]

Ok,so you think "It IS reasonable for white legislators to exclude huge groups of whites just to exclude the blacks", presumably for being racist against blacks. No it is not resonable. It is stupid. Whether it is what their motivation was is questionable. We can judge that only from their statements. But if racism was their motivation than their actions were stupid AF. Certainly not "reasonable".

[@GambitYuGiOh]

@@ms-jl6dl we can say racism is bad idea. You're not going to get me to disagree with that. But bad ideas can be rational, coherent , and a motivation for those in control at those times.

[@jausti2]

@@GambitYuGiOh exactly! So much of racism that is pumped out by Glen and other Koch brothers funded social media content lies in what they don’t tell their mostly ignorant audience. It’s all based on reductive arguments that feed preconceived narratives

[@michaelgranville7269]

Dear Mr laury your guess is saying that these things went on but because black people survive it's okay

[@ondolite3789]

A big fat yes!

[@edwinamendelssohn5129]

Straw man

[@GambitYuGiOh]

41:13 Again here are disingenuous arguments. He notated that evaluations listed blacks as a negative feature. He then presents that "there are more whites in those neighborhoods than blacks". However, this point is aparallel to his opinion. What percent of blacks were relegated to these areas? Through sheer population size it's obvious there will typically be more white people even if it's "black areas". He goes on to mention that black house ownership increased from 21% to 56% however we know that due to redlining those houses would not have had equal value to the 43% to 75% increase in white communities. This guy basically just spat preferential statistics to support his narrative and I'm a bit upset that Glenn did not call out how irrational these arguments are.

[@TheShootist]

relegated? the redlined areas are still majority white today. Unlike segregated restaurants, rest rooms, accommodations, schools, doctor office waiting rooms and water fountains, the redlining was not specifically directed at Blacks. That is the point Kaiser made. If financial restitution is deserved, it is deserved by all who who suffered under redlining.

[@GambitYuGiOh]

@@TheShootist He actually says in the video that they called those areas dangerous because of black presence. And absolutely they were relegated to those conditions

[@jausti2]

@@TheShootist because the country was predominantly white. The only group with specific negative outcomes tied to these policies based on race were blk ppl. White ppl had the option to move. How hard is that to understand

[@jausti2]

@@mxiivx7610 oh yes. I think the last 30 years has been damaging for poor white Americans. However I think we have to look at the policies and programs that were available to other races and not blk Americans. It’s a major impact. I don’t think it’s the end all. I don’t think it denies white oppression. I just think it’s something that needs to be thoroughly examined. For example my parents are the first generation of my family to have equal access to education and they were able to produce two college grads. So we have to make up for generations of lost opportunity

[@SvenErik_Lindstrom3]

Quite a surprise that this great historian has not been canceled already merely because of his surname: "Kaiser" = "Emperor"

[@gertrudewest4535]

What about reparations for women?

[@TkilfurdDienfahl]

Its disgusting how everytime this dude reads a misleading statistic to misrepresent the history of black opportunity he laughs. It seems he cannot stop himself from showing just a bit of what he's really thinking. Gotta love this meritocracy.

[@roijohnson5422]

Count the times Dr. Kaiser says "it may have been a factor," and then goes on to dismiss the possible bigoted intentions of those who controlled the power structures of the south in local, state, and federal levels. Dr. Loury comes up short by refraining from asking the question "why is that" when Dr. Kaiser draws a conclusion. Maybe the Chicago Defender had affinity for FDR because of the tireless strife for inclusion brought on by Eleanor Roosevelt who sought to overtly give dignity to all citizens of the US.

[@oldschoolsaint]

I don't think he was "dismissing" anything. I think he was simply providing balance and context to the one sided narratives promulgated by the likes of T. Coates. Does any of what he says diminish the horrors black people in this country have endured for centuries? Not one bit in my estimation. I think it's healthy and necessary to understand that history is complex and not amenable to black and white interpretations. I think the latter has set the stage for the sort of racial reductionist thinking we see today and tragic outcomes that lie ahead.

[@TheShootist]

he dismisses nothing. he notes that the bigoted intentions weren't a major factor. don't use the median as the measure.

[@tjjh3771]

"So what you are saying is....." Dr Kaiser was pretty clear what he meant in referencing the Chicago Defender article as the others replying here note.

[@paigemccormick6519]

@@TheShootist Right. Do use the median as one measure.

[@GambitYuGiOh]

@Roi Johnson you are so correct here. See my comments as well. He dismisses legislators in some of the more racists times in our history and just says "that's not possible". I'm a bit surprised Glenn did not push back more.

[@jps0117]

Is every topic going to be race-based?

[@TheShootist]

it's been that way since Obama's first election. Facts are fluid in this brave new world.

[@entropyvortex2484]

That's Critical Race Theory in action, which posits that systemic racism is the root cause for every problem in our society.

[@jausti2]

@@TheShootist yup. So many studies have been done that show the link between the rise of racial based hate activity and violence to the election of president Obama. I suggest you look at the facts listed in several FBI reports that show agitation of racial tensions and violence coming from far right groups. In 2009 the FBI warned of increasing white supremacy based groups infiltrating law enforcement. The ppl who now complain about CRT didn’t say a damn thing. Do you think a day will come when these ppl just admit that they are racist?