The Craziest Ban in EDH History!!!!!

[@TheMathmath123]

Wait so jeweled lotus is banned in the only format it works in 😂😂 Jeweled lotus stonks going to 0 😂😂

[@TripsAhoy]

Yup. Crazy.

[@coffeedudeable]

Yeah etched foil dropped from $500 to $150 already

[@imaginarymatter]

You can still run it in commander cube draft...

[@adamrivera195]

In what currency ​@@coffeedudeable

[@_DaneB_]

And they just reprinted it last year!

[@Drazatis]

Godo players everywhere just dropped to their knees in a Walmart

[@Naustrix]

Magda and godo stocks 📉

[@ComedIanMTG]

@@Drazatis 🤣🤣🤣🤣

[@bhaveshkolla1290]

@@Naustrix I think magda is still playable

[@TheStandardKnife]

@@bhaveshkolla1290it probably is but it still took a huge hit today

[@flipsidecat1985]

They were on their knees already ........ but now they're crying .................

[@cheezybred]

Proxy your cards people. Wiz just got done selling you all these reprints and made bank, then banned everything you worked hard to buy.

[@FaelmineMourne]

WOTC isn't in charge of the commander ban list

[@mathewdebol923]

Yeah if anything I’d say WotC is going to be seriously hurt by this

[@McJester_Plays]

​@@FaelmineMourne No, they are not, but they posted this on behalf of the rules committee. They emphasized that this is nothing more than a casual format. No cEDH tournament worth its salt requires real cards anyways. There was no reason to buy them other than loyalty to the manufacturer and pride. You still holding onto those as your entire deck that you've worked on for years crumbles from unwarranted bans?

[@Brandon-zq3wh]

I'm sure RC sold there's before they did this.

[@BP-fu6kk]

​@@Brandon-zq3whWhich brings up a huuuuge underlying problem with the comitee in general.

[@supremecourt4131]

Crypt got reprinted in Ixalan to get banned The One Ring is still legal..

[@acupofnonsense9933]

Don't give them ideas

[@nicholasjohnston7350]

The one ring is fine.

[@supremecourt4131]

@@nicholasjohnston7350 the card has one of the biggest impact on the game - i do not want it to be banned but this is one of many examples why the actual bans are completely irrational You can‘t Hit the wallet of players and collectors this hard

[@Lord_lost13]

@@nicholasjohnston7350agree

[@malmasterson3890]

Which is why I only wish these bans had come much earlier, but they likely were stopped by WOTC.

[@Limkmc]

It’s esper’s world and we’re just living in it

[@rathdaul4377]

Master of keys stocks just sky rocketed 😂

Bro just forgot Breach exist, wait.......

[@9forMortalMen]

Tivit isn't vibing tho

[@austonrobertson5613]

Rip tivit. Now a cool casual deck

[@GabrielBarbosa-gs6vk]

@@austonrobertson5613 Three words: 3 mana ward./ Black Ritual spells (Plural) That's what saves it's ass from worse, not sure if enough for it to not fall from a tier, gonna have to test it first...

[@Gwedyr77]

Oh so we're banning cards that are so good they deserve to go in every commander deck. Me: starts sweating, looks cautiously at my 9 copies of The One Ring

[@SlongestKongest]

I'd sell. One ring may get banned

[@takumumayuzumi7235]

​@@SlongestKongestbut the other 8 will be fine!

[@mythito5120]

​@@takumumayuzumi7235Good joke lol

[@Volkbrecht]

That was kind of always the idea, although at this point I have my doubts that this is still a reasonable view on things. By this logic you could ban zero mana counterspells, rituals, all kinds of tutors... I'd rather they look at unwanted lines of play. Like, when Prophet of Kruphix was banned I was really relieved because everyone would just steal or copy it and turns lasted forever.

[@impendio]

Ring is shit in comparsion, games last 3 turns wow 4 mana for 3 cards!!!

[@ApophisMTG]

Feels like 80 minute round timers may need some reconsideration

[@wwbcwp]

Why? My local cEDH scene is typically 20 minute rounds then everyone else plays casually until the next round. Turns out, with almost half the field playing RogSi and almost half the field playing Blue Farm with the rest playing Kinnan made it pretty quick.

[@Gunpauder_Gaming]

@@wwbcwp he’s talking about how dockside mana crypt and jeweled lotus are banned so the game goes much slower

[@wouter7620]

I play 3 cEDH decks. All of them got hit and none of them will survive if these bans stand. A very sad day for me as a new cEDH player who funded a lot of those decks over the last year. (and yes i have bought both a dockside and crypt recently)

[@chainer1918]

Turning jeweled lotus into a Darksteel Relic without indestructible is crazy

[@D0012D13]

Treasure token without the mana

[@dr.hardballer]

Dargo is absolutely cooked

[@AdaWongMistress]

good

[@alexmusselman7090]

Most effective proverbial middle finger the rules committee could have possibly given the cEDH community.

[@Temzilla2]

How so? The cedh community doesn't care how powerful their games are, they care how enjoyable they are.

[@midnalight6419]

No, this is awesome. The format has genuinely been saved imo

[@alexmusselman7090]

​@@Temzilla2clearly, for cEDH players, playing with the most powerful cards is part of what makes the game enjoyable.

[@dan_hahn]

Absolutely. It is so hard not to feel like there's some weird, spiteful energy here.

[@PushyMeas44]

​@midnalight6419 doesn't this just eliminate non-blue decks?

[@mikeutube011]

Literally just bought a jewelled lotus this last week….. fml

[@impendio]

Make your voice be heard

[@impendio]

Also just ignore this banlist and keep playing it

[@p0rc41music5]

i bought all 3 last 3 months. already wrote an email to the support. people better be spaming it. Making 100+ € cards just have no value all of a sudden is kinda criminal ngl

[@theycallmelittletoe]

I just finished my playset of foil dockside’s last month 😡

[@andrewclark9192]

Laughing at all of you lmao

[@c.beruvides2146]

I got into the format and began purchasing cards to be able to play at actual events because most around me arent proxy friendly. Jewled lotus, dockside, and crypt were 3 of the first cards I bought because of how iconic they were. Fuck me.

[@avall0nNn1992]

In which country is it the case that cEDH events are not proxy friendly? Just curious, I never had an issue at tournaments.

[@SlongestKongest]

So the first cards you bought were 400 dollers You got money to waste my guy

[@Don-Loves-Vladdy]

@@avall0nNn1992here in the US lol my local has 60-70 players on commander night, proxy’s legal only if you can produce the real card. That’s what happens when there’s money involved.

[@LoreExplore369]

@@SlongestKongest its called a job and saving lmao

[@c.beruvides2146]

@SlongestKongest job and I sold out of a very big yugioh collection in favor of a format/game that appeared to be more eternal. Crazy thought?

[@sixsix4867]

It is kinda disgusting tho how they reprinted JL in commander masters just to ban it, people chased that card for nothing

[@takumumayuzumi7235]

You have to remember that WOTC does not run the RC. They're separate entities. For all we know, WOTC might be pissed as Ixalan and CMM are still too selling sets for those chase cards.

[@ekolimitsLIVE]

@@takumumayuzumi7235Nah. They have people on the inside scoop. I don’t think we should assume the two are completely mutually exclusive.

[@BP-fu6kk]

​@@takumumayuzumi7235One of the comitee has come out and said theyve been in talks with wizards for at least a year about these.

[@thetimebinder]

"just reprinted"? That was a year ago.

[@BP-fu6kk]

@thetimebinder "I promise you that bans in commander have a longer discussion and debate period than the 3 weeks it's been since the cEDH RC situation at the end of August. We've been talking about these bans with each other, with Wizards (so they can do their own communications and align bans with MTGO) for a little over a year now. The timing is unfortunate but if you're reading anti-cEDH intent here you're reading something that's not there." -Jim on a discord

[@notyouhaujokefish]

The bit about Sol Ring does make me chuckle though. Every precon would suddenly become illegal, let's not pretend that's not the real reason...😂

[@DangerKennyB]

Oddly, Wizards uses blinged Sol Rings to sell Secret Lairs also. I imagine there was a small conversation about this.

[@jonlamoreaux2228]

​@@DangerKennyBwell scott larabee, one of the only remaining members of the rules committee, happens to be the senior operations manager for wotc. Also, I guarantee Olivia, the wotc schill gobert, is on the committee, although they don't want to admit it yet

[@DangerKennyB]

@@jonlamoreaux2228 In Olivia's defense, she was the only one of the 5 that was against the bans. She's actually an ally here, friend.

[@chrisjanus12]

My major beef is that when the topdeck rules committee tried to introduce their own banllist a couple of weeks ago, one of the reason that they cited is that the regular edh rules committee said that they had no interest in doing anything for cedh. Now, they come out with a banlist that I don't think will impact most casual pods that much. This banlist seems to hit cedh significantly more than it does regular edh

[@ryansalmon6507]

As someone who plays both, I think these bans REALLY help casual. It sucks when someone is on mana crypt in casual. It warps games due to availability especially in no proxy metas. It is fine for Cedh. The meta will adjust, as it always has.

[@LukeSkywalker-pg9ki]

Yeah, it seems to be targeted at cedh.

[@LukeSkywalker-pg9ki]

@@ryansalmon6507yeah, but my wallet won’t. Casuals essentially just stole thousands of dollars from people.

[@fu4mkgic]

@@LukeSkywalker-pg9ki shoulda proxied. Bans still bad though but not for monetary reasons.

[@Discorato]

@@LukeSkywalker-pg9ki essentially you are speaking nonsense.

[@luketaylor1257]

Jewled Lotus ban is awful for the entire genre of big mana commanders which were already suffering. Aatraxa, Etali, Kirrik, Tivit, Godo, all those decks are essentially dead I think, which sucks, they were all fun to play and play against.

[@nicholasjohnston7350]

Tivit is one of the ones that really survives.

[@FrancisSalois]

Exactly, Tivit is going to be fine and even better without Dockside in the format ​@@nicholasjohnston7350

[@BadConAngel]

Absolutely agree that this is a major hit to decks that were already being pushed out of the fast meta.

[@GabrielBarbosa-gs6vk]

@@nicholasjohnston7350 agreed Tivit player here, the fact everyone just lost mana makes it so, that 3 mana ward saved it's ass So hard. Coupled with the fact black can run worse rituals like songs of the damned and culling ritual to try and get that extra mana

[@kalenroberts2849]

The niv pilots are all jumping ship since there’s no longer a single chance for niv to hit the field before a game ends let alone land him and a combo piece now without dockside or jeweled lotus you’re looking at turn 4-6 niv not sure that’s good enough

[@jarhead636]

feels bad for cedh for sure, casual already has a rule 0 and a discussion about what should be played at any given table. cedh needs it own banlist separate from casual.

[@urazerkal6769]

Rules 0 is the best alternative of this shit

[@8Smoker8]

​@@urazerkal6769no, it's not. They have to coexist.

[@Veznikcpg]

This is the most clear way to demonstrate that Rule Zero doesn't work

[@Creme_theDON]

Best comment

[@ArnoutGoris]

Facts

[@nikolaitheundying]

Wouldn't rule zero let you play these cards? To my understanding rule zero is just "have fun". Nothing stops you from using these with friends.

[@CMCNinja1337]

The comment just shows that you either don't know how to properly have a rule zero conversation or how to enforce it

[@monkeeb]

it has nothing to do with casual commander rule zero, it has everything to do with the current cEDH meta being "win by turn 4 or your deck sucks."

[@Snamify]

Someone must have felt like god today.

[@jonathanmorris8362]

and many felt like victims

[@davidmorales-dm7xm]

A lot of 2 mana clones were played to get a second dockside, this is going to have a lot implications for more cards.

[@alexmusselman7090]

Cedh fr caught 3 strays

[@jcjackson9367]

caught all 4. Nadu was a good cedh deck. Wasnt #1 but I would say rank 5-7, somewhere in there. I liked it. But oh well. Guess they didnt want anything but kinnan reping simic.

[@DraftFrame]

You and other pro players, should rise your voice for us. This banlist needs to be reconsidered

[@jamescobblepot4744]

He's dead jim

[@davidew345]

4+ mana commanders and 4th seat are banned now

[@marmics96]

Because the odds of you getting those cards on your 4th seat are much higher than somebody pulling even more ahead of you in the other 3 seats... Suuure

[@fosterdawson7339]

​@@marmics96i mean dockside was one of the best cards for decks in 4th seat

[@davidew345]

@@marmics96 4th seat is statistically less likely to win than any other seat. And now there are less ways of catching up to the rest of the table.

[@voluntarism335]

@@fosterdawson7339 after the 3rd player not by much

[@koruto721]

​@@marmics96Im gonna go out on a limb and say you don't play cedh

[@michaelsmagic3132]

This almost feels like retaliation in response to the cedh rules committee that tried to form

[@jxhook]

Sure does.

[@fluffylegend294]

I 💯 thought it was a joke, too. I think Mana Crypt and Dockside bans are gonna shake up the format wildly. I think we should just have a separate cEDH ban list, I suppose, at this point…I just built Baylen, too, and it feels like I have to change my deck all over again…

[@kingofredlions8729]

That was my next deck, and there's no point now that you can't run dockside

[@tym6217]

The funny thing is I sold off my copy of Dockside Extortionist last week. I always felt like an asshole when I played it, so I got rid of it.

[@p0rc41music5]

this is awesome hahaha, uppers my mood a lil, ty for sharing

[@8Smoker8]

Good karma

[@johnwillamson970]

Mana crypt ban feels like a slap in the face after Ixalan. Would've liked to see thassa oracle rhystic and smothering tithe go over jeweled lotus, mana crypt. Jeweled is important for those higher drop commanders. Id have rather seen lions eye diamond go and really kill of some strats and shake things up. Nadu can be saved by changing one word. Sissy and Rog-si tear is about to be gross.

[@ratdoto2148]

The banning of Jeweled Lotus utterly hoses so many decks that are already pretty mediocre. Also many of these decks use Mana Crypt as a psuedo second copy of Jeweled Lotus so they really just got screwed.

[@Denver_Titan]

Just lost $950 in a day, only proxies from now! Wotc just lost my business for good, sell two full sets on the back of the jeweled lotus in the past few years then let some soft group of whiny losers ban it in the only format it is made for?! Stores and pods should regulate themselves and have better rule zero conversations, not be told what to do by a few people. Give the babies a seperate game mode called battlecruiser, no one can interact with anyone for 10 turns while they build their boards and do their thing and then they duke it out on turn 11 so that everyone feels like they have won. Don't stop everyone else from having fun just play with a different group who likes to play your style.

[@pelosuelto70]

Bruh 😎

[@broheem73]

Reeks of "casual players think these cards are too strong, and can't afford them so let's ban them" what happened to policing your own pods and setting your own parameters for what games you want to experience in terms of casuals vs more fine tuned high power games

[@broheem73]

​@@Cybertech134nah just the flip flop of them saying the overall arch of edh is for players to shape the pods and play experience to what they want, the hand holding of outright banning cards is asinine, if you think cards are too strong then don't play in pods with people playing at higher power. It's like a foreign concept for lgs players that they can just refuse to play with people who aren't playing around their level like be social and communicate, I don't need the RC holding my hand and dictating what can be played and in the same breath not ban sol ring because it's the "flagship" of edh like tf lol where's the thassa ban, where's the tutor bans

[@broheem73]

​@@Cybertech134no there's a difference of cards like hullbreacher that actually create a one sided negative play experience compared to a card like jeweled lotus that helps get your commander out quicker, it just smells like broke bitch casuals not buying cards or just bitching instead of using their big boy words to police their pods, instead they let spikes into their pods and run rough shot all over them and then run to reddit saying xyz card is op and needs to get banned I have no issue telling people to leave the pod or that we aren't playing those types of games when we're playing 50 dollar budget decks and they're rolling up their high power 3 thousand dollar decks

[@benclements5808]

⁠@@Cybertech134 what need to be balanced what about all the other zero drop mana rocks and sol ring they make for explosive turn ones and shoot you miles ahead. Banning crypt but not sol ring is the thing tha doesn’t make any sense to me.

[@ZMLsavage]

This is such a slap to the face for CEDH too. The rules committee is basically a suggestion group to tell you what the best fun experience playing commander is as they say you can rule zero anything you want. The problem is that CEDH is not a sanctioned tournament from Wizards so any tournament scene is community made. Now the community that makes the rules just slapped the CEDH community over night because any casual table they will say you can still play them if you rule zero we just suggest these are banned. Why would you maybe not kill but stab a format over night that needs help as a community to exist since wizards refuses to acknowledge it as a sanctioned format and hold major events like modern or standard? Such shit as a fan of CEDH. Now sans red decks will be all you see.

[@marmics96]

Maybe finally CEDH players are going to make it the own format that it needs to be with its own banlist. I am so tired of all those banlist, card price and proxi argmuments where edh and cedh players are talking against a wall. I play duel commander and the own banlist is such a bliss there

[@BrashM]

After Jim’s comments about cedh needing to self govern, this feels like an obvious hint to the cedh community that they meant it. We should have our own ban list. This is a terrible list that leaves orcish fish and rhystic and makes rog even better

[@MattCorrales]

My loss of hundreds of dollars today aside, this is horrible for format diversity and only hurts seat four players who can’t dockside to catch up. Shivam really got his revenge on Cedh today. Hell, even casuals who want to use their fringe commander and play them before turn six can’t do so now. Meanwhile, sol ring and the more expensive rocks aren’t banned, so it’s not like they’re being consistent anyway, except these are rocks people actually own.😢

[@coreyhayslip5418]

Welcome to the meta where we will see rogsi, kinnan, tnk

[@andrueurbane7361]

"These bans are totally fine for CEDH." Agree. A meta shake-up isn't a bad thing, it will breed new strategies to explore. BTW, I love your overall positive attitude on the changes, even those you disagree with.

[@impendio]

Rogsi is still the best, maybe thrasios tymna becomes top 3, nadu people will be back on kinnan, ufarm is maybe top 2 instead of top 1, much fucking change. Now every RGx deck is dead, fun.

[@edpaolosalting9116]

@Northernheros In the end its always about the money.... Sigh... Its not even about the CEDH....its about how much you friggin spent only for you to get hosed. Literally this is ALL the complaints I am seeing. They lost money. Can't you see what is wrong here?

[@NotyGG]

This is the worst ban in history.

[@jawsomejasper8353]

I feel like banning dockside is pretty bad for cEDH. It removes the ability for decks to play catchup if they're 4th in turn order and also destroys a lot of turbo strategies that (in my opinion) kept the format from falling into a true midrange value soup.

[@Imanmagnet00]

I'd agree if catch up was all that card was used for.

[@wwbcwp]

It also removes the last seat player's ability to generate 10 mana on turn 1...

[@thetimebinder]

No one caught up with dockside. They rocketed ahead.

[@MVRS_23]

I think they really screwed over card shops the most. Imagine you just have store credit to someone for a $200 mana crypt now you can’t even sell it for $100. When product already has very small margins

[@Brandon-zq3wh]

Especially with wizards pushing reprint sets with the cards in them now those sets on shelves are worth little to nothing.

[@muffinoffun1843]

It's well known that the RC has historically had a massive hate-boner for anyone playing "their format the wrong way", so I guess it was inevitable they would eventually go for the nuclear option. Shame honestly. I don't really have much reason to play anymore, especially if we're basically not allowed to play anything 5 CMC anymore.

[@mattkent5869]

yeah on top of being totally immune to any common sense decision that would hurt hasbro in any way. They spent an entire page justifying that they will never ban sol ring? Every precon of every shelf in any store in the world is now illegal to play. That's it. See? I did it in half line. Shaking my head so much. Power is in the wrong hands one more time.

[@bryceahlberg8170]

I would be happy if they also added sol ring to the ban list, keeping it around just because “it’s iconic haha” was kinda sucky

[@MrGGLz]

I just traded into a Jeweled Lotus; And finished filling out the Najeela list I've been working towards for years. RC can get bent.

[@mcandrolallendelapena6375]

My biggest gripe about this ban is that Blue was basically untouched while 50% of the reason why you'd want to be in Red is banned. Rakdos and Gruul are now relegated to shit-tier and it makes Boros even worse than it already is now with these bans(strictly talking about the 2 color combinations only), all the while Blue still gets to enjoy Rhystic/Remora. And oh, who could forget Thassa's Oracle???? If the RC were looking at it at a perspective as to which cards are explosive for casual play, then yes it makes sense (but less so for Dockside as it's explosiveness depends on the powerlevel of the pod). However, in a casual setting, being able to draw 2-3 extra cards off of a Rhystic/Remora sets you up for explosive turns down the line. So, why was blue untouched??? I can already hear people saying "well, you can play around a Rhystic/Remora by paying the 1 or not feeding the fish". Well sure, while you also allow the blue player to get ahead of his/her gameplan by being able to play his cards without any drawbacks. Losing Crypt will hurt, as virtually almost all cEDH decks run the card, JLo less so. But banning Dockside significantly nerfs non-blue decks in the format. Nadu can go away from the format. F*** that Bird!

[@arzellwilson6491]

Can’t really say how I feel because I’d get banned 😂

[@Snamify]

Those poor Korvold and Magda players

[@brendans1983]

I spent hours, days, weeks breaking down casual decks and buylisting cards to create 3 cedh decks this year. Went all out and got book and judge promo Crypts, etched Dockside's, borderless Lotus'. Traded in so many cards. It feels like someone has come into my house and taken something while i was sleeping.

[@jonlamoreaux2228]

I see a lot of people thinking the rc and wotc are two seperate entities. Theyre not. The leader of the rc is senior director of operations at wotc.

[@fuenkchen1234]

as a guy that likes to play fringe, cmc heavy commanders i am really sad and dont have much energy to play them anymore

[@aR0ttenBANANA]

@@Cybertech134 man, you're a genuine fuckin loser. nothing else to add.

[@SethVeit]

Well, guess I'm taking apart Korvold, as that was Dockside.deck. The Jeweled Lotus ban just makes low-color decks weaker in comparison to all the 4-5 color soup running around. I think Mana Crypt hurts the most because it's been in the format for 15 years and now needs a ban? Whatever I guess. Also, I don't know why they also won't ban any busted blue cards (aka Rhystic Study) but constantly target cards that hurt non-blue strategies the most. My money is on them banning of the One Ring next.

[@noahcheng2401]

Hope you like midrange…

[@edpaolosalting9116]

I'm game on that!

[@robertschumann6960]

As a Korvold player, this hurts a lot I think there has been really good input from casual players that state that games with people you don't know, no matter what discussion happens, will lead with these cards just taking the game as their own, in a format that takes 1-2 hours per game. Being in a hostage situation against some who just had an amazing start as most have used these cards in casual usually have high-powered decks. But for Cedh players who used these as staples, having cards you either traded up for or saved up for maybe years feels bad out of nowhere mainly for Mana crypt (they had previously mentioned both dockside and jeweled lotus as cards with their eyes on). It can also be equally frustrating when cards the knowledge like sol ring get a pass for reasons that amount to "Vibes", but good for sending bird to the astral plane you will not be missed.

[@michaelaraya2464]

$800 to the trash basically... i think i would sell all and proxy :/

[@hip5702]

Same. Selling all my cards now, i'm done. Proxies only now.

[@droor24]

My thoughts exactly.

[@guim3419]

Same. Just sold

[@Naustrix]

@@hip5702yep I thought the exact thing f this game I’m done then I thought I love draft I’m just gonna make a cube

[@jonathanmorris8362]

I'm so sorry guys :( You were all betrayed today and it breaks my heart. WOTC knew months ago this was coming they they kept selling expensive boxes

[@DCode504]

As someone who only watches and doesn't play cEDH, I welcome the shakeup (and it was kinda boring to me that everything revolved around dockside in so many games; besides: it's a messed up card in casual) and look forward to following the first tournaments before the meta is settled (akin to how competitive DotA 2 is at its best right after a big balance patch). That being said I ofc feel bad for all the people that bought these cards and lost a shit ton of money; and in the end cEDH is for cEDH players, so I'd totally be on board if your community collectively decides to ignore these bannings.

[@LukeSkywalker-pg9ki]

What I hate about it is I saved up for about six months to buy my mana crypt and now because of some self-entitled, whiny casuals who don’t run the card anyway, it’s banned. I was pretty tired of how toxic and restrictive casual has become before this and now I’m questioning whether it’s worth my time to keep buying and playing cards since all that’s needed to get banned is price.

[@briankirz231]

don’t buy cards

[@r0flcats]

Kkkkkkkkkkkkk

[@LukeSkywalker-pg9ki]

@@briankirz231 can’t play the game otherwise.

[@briankirz231]

@@LukeSkywalker-pg9ki I’ve been playing for years and never bought a card

[@ryantice1186]

I feel like the "won because of turn order" is now going to be way more apparent. Because despite how much people "hated" dockside, without it now it pretty much feels like 4th seat is just 4th place.

[@impendio]

This so much, the 4th seat dockside winning into a tapped out board for ramped rocks?

[@caterinagerbasi1594]

sure but now that we dont have Mana Crypt how good do turn 1 are? genuine question

[@voluntarism335]

That doesn't justify dockside's existence of how meta warping it was in cEDH glad it's gone.

[@andresarancio6696]

As a primarily big mana commander in CEDH, I am hurt. But... I dunno, I am kind of interested in seeing how CEDH looks like now. Like, a big shake up of the format is something I prefer over the format not moving

[@kevinsimmons5343]

Pouring one out for the homies

[@jcjackson9367]

This was a terrible ban. Not sure the nadu ban was needed. I didnt know a single casual who would sit with it so rule 0 was taking care of it in casual. And dock scaled with table power. Jeweled and man crypt was just a slap to the face of every player that even tried to have real decks. Remember people proxy. Wotc and RC doesnt care about you, so dont care about them. Maybe make NBL (No ban list) commander popular.

[@yfw123]

Why won't they ban Gaea's Cradle, Ancient Tomb, Mana Vault, Lion's Eye Diamond, Chrome Mox, Mox Opal, Mox Diamond, Mishra's Workshop, Rhystic Study, Smoothering Tithe, Dark Ritual, The One Ring, Necropotence , Necrodominance and all OG dual lands as well? At this point, I believe there will be more cards like Nadu being printed at first when wotc do not playtest the cards as always and the cycle will always repeat.

[@impendio]

Rule zero doesnt work if they cant stop casuals from playing good cards and “ruining” games to others. Like if a casual is playing nadu and jlo, are they really casuals or just pubstompers? So yeah, might as well ban every good card if we cant trust players from not playing them and actually trying to win, and I guess its not about money either 😂 because of course not

[@tombapilot04]

The exact reasoning they gave for banning Mana Crypt applies to Mishra's Workshop which isn't banned, except Mishra's Workshop doesn't deal 3 damage every other turn and has virtually no drawbacks in a colorless artifact-themed deck. How is the average 7.5 damage by turn six or 10.5 damage by turn eight (per their turn 6 to 8 explanation) a "meaningless drawback"??? That is nearly 1/3 of your life total in 1v1 Commander, and 1/4 of your life total in EDH after making yourself a target. Force of Vigor and Abolish are turn 0 answers. Vandalblast, Meltdown, and Nature's Claim are turn 1 answers. And cards like Collector Ouphe shut it down and turn it into a liability. It's not as easy to turn off Mishra's Workshop w/o straight up land destruction (Strip Mine slows you down too at a table of 4). Jeweled Lotus is 1 mana better than Dark Ritual, but is limited to being used to play a commander. Banning it means it's illegal to play in every format, period. If you're opponent has a Swords to Plowshares, they are getting a 2-for-1 and your commander now costs 2 more to cast. Dockside can "go mana-positive on turn two". And? And it can "start generating substantial Treasures after that". And? And it "scale[s] well with the power level of the table". Okay, so why is it banned? The only banning I agree with in today's announcement is Nadu, which is a boring inherently infinite-combo commander or card in the 99 that is easily abused while slowing down the game.

[@tombapilot04]

I guess I overlooked the fact that Jeweled Lotus works in a limited way in Legacy with Doubling Cube. But I think I've made my point.

[@alexeigalan2538]

And that way there was a group of player that wanted you to take over the format. Letting organizers make their own banned list. Fuck this new banned list. If wanted to play slow I would be playing standard. Fuck this list

[@danielchristie6190]

I think this just made jeweled lotus a budget card! Gonna pick those up cheap and rule 0 with my friends.

[@impendio]

No one is going to sell, I know I wont

[@pow_ELL]

Yeah thats the end for me…i can burn money in much funnier ways

[@diegorezi5760]

I just lost 2 docks and 2 cripts...yeah, gave up on mtg

[@John_Doe742]

@@diegorezi5760crypts still pretty high

[@jamesshively7382]

Yeah I'm out, selling everything. This gonna affect a lot of other card prices too.

[@Brandon-zq3wh]

I have 5 copies of each and a few are full art foils I HAD a 600 mana crypt

[@RegimentJoker]

We need a competitive rules committee. This sucks. You. Cam and Lua need to make a competitive rules committee. This is ass cheeks

[@Gaiametris]

Shooketh i am

[@zeopks3440]

Yuriko emerges from the shadows! so keen, bowmaster next please

[@bretts3046]

While the player in me agrees with the bans, the collector in me just died a little.

[@VexylObby]

? Now it’s more affordable to collect…

[@SSolemn]

If it's about investing, it is just like the stock market, things go up and down....

[@FaelmineMourne]

if the cards going down in price hurt you as a collector, then you aren't a collector

[@bretts3046]

@FaelmineMourne It does, with me being an avid collector of expensive things.

[@broskander3671]

This feels more like a "lets ban stuff so that people stop saying the RC shouldnt exist on twitter" more than anything honestly.

[@impendio]

Retaliatory as fuck

[@Lemon_Sage9999]

Standard twitterbrain behavior... RC can GFSF

[@Thoughtmage100]

That's what I was getting from this. They've done literally nothing for the longest time, so long that people question what they even do, then they drop this. 😂

[@broskander3671]

@@impendio imagine retaliating after you told an entire subsect of the community to fuck off and "do it themselves" 🤣 wild

[@broskander3671]

@Thoughtmage100 yeah it's weird. This really feels like a half baked attempt to do something. It barely affects casual edh at all and they claimed to not want to deal with cEDH.

[@bowler9785]

No ban for the one ring, presumably because it's still selling packs and the coward committe doesn't want to upset Wotc.

[@impendio]

Crypt was reprinted this year tho, lmao

[@bowler9785]

@@impendio And pack sales from that set have fallen off after people spent a fortune on them lmao. Bellend.

[@rogerrabbit132]

Kinda funny how all this happens just after the TopDeck/CEDH banlist debacle.

[@RhodRamapo]

Topdeck just caught an updraft.

[@Emblerfied]

This will just force the creation of the cEDH rules committee. It lets the competitive kids play with their toys, and keeps it out of the casual format.

[@diegorezi5760]

I will be waiting for that

[@majormartintibor]

I've been advocating for this for years. casual EDH and competitive EDH need to go 2 seperate ways, it would be the best for both communities.

[@zeroisnine]

The idea that people wouldn't be upset with a cEDH rc baffles me. There have been plenty of voices for banning Dockside from the cEDH community

[@voluntarism335]

lol was tried and rejected. No one is going to play that format unless it's legitimized by wotc

[@FaelmineMourne]

@@voluntarism335 rejected due to the reason that some of the people who wanted to run it were terrible people

[@zonimi]

It's like they had a number of high dollar cards that they wanted to ban and they figured to do them all at once to get one round of negative feedback instead of upsetting the cart multiple times.

[@aaronsoat5480]

Good thing they reprinted most of them recently to boost sales before they banned them.

[@dub253]

Bring back the separate banlist

[@thetimebinder]

there was never a seperate banned list

[@MrNoob_11]

Banning jewelled lotus and mana crypt feels weird since it's always seemed like people were able to self moderate the speed of their mana base at casual tables. Not surprised to see dockside go considering how game warping it is for mid power level games though I am surprised smothering tithe and rhystic study didn't go with it.

[@supremecourt4131]

I‘m in total shock This only hurts the wallet

[@TwiZt3DLoTuS]

Okay I think this is a win in my brain for dockside. I feel like playing with a "banned" pirate on the seas hits the theme so well. :D

[@IronGriffon05]

THIS is why we need a separate cEDH ban list. There may have been problems with the committee that was proposed, but that doesn't mean it's not needed.

[@impendio]

This so much, the “explanation” that mana crypt is bad for the game because it powers 8-turn wins is bonkers

[@SiliconSicilian]

I don't think we need a separate ban list for cEDH...will take it a step further and say we need a separate ban list for people in the "rules committee." They don't speak for the majority of players, to be honest. Casual doesn't need these bans and cEDH doesn't want these bans. The whole list needs a review with the widespread community in mind, not a handful of people with racehorse blinders on. Even their reasonings don't make sense. Nadu is banned because it doesn't win? Crypt is banned because it can generate lead to a turn 6-8 win? Lotus because it allows you to cast a 5-mana commander turn 2? Dockside is the only one that even comes close to a reasonable explanation. But, it also means the artifacts that just got banned with it make less sense.

[@thetimebinder]

There is. Conquest and no-banned list edh.

[@Limkmc]

I’m starting a new rules committee, and my first bans are for lime scooter, as well as all proxys not featuring Kermit the frog

[@Limkmc]

My second action will be an errata to ashnod’s coupon. The recipient of the drink, IF the drink contains alcohol, must be of legal age to consume said drink.

[@Duskraven377]

Nice! My Flubs is a Kermit proxy!

[@93msimpson]

Starting my own rules committee with blackjack... and hookers!

[@christopherchapman5299]

Played a quick pod online and it felt so light in nature. There wasn’t a pressure I felt that was just “Dockside is coming down” and it was kind of freeing. I’m excited to see what happens from here on

[@omarua3435]

Never wouldve happened if Saint Sheldon was still alive

[@hunteralford90]

The RC is just desperately clawing for viability after our beloved Sheldon's departure. It is time we may a diverse and inclusive RC, or destroy it and let power 9, ante, and rule 0 be the only bans.

[@CoL_Drake]

so you say he prohibited needed bans ? god i am so thankfull this is banned

[@yfw123]

Pretty suspicious when the RC did this after Sheldon past away... In his interview with the professor, Sheldon said they don't do why this, not that because the associated cards getting ban will be way more than intended and now this becomes the truth.

[@Talton77]

It absolutely still would have happened.

[@FaelmineMourne]

@@CoL_Drake they aren't needed bans

[@marvinmuller4003]

This feels like the Mox Opal Banking in Modern. - If you don‘t know modern, it’s the format that hardly anyone is playing animore because the decks all lack character after the banning. - We‘ll see if cEDH will be the same. - I hope for the cEDH/EDH split

[@koreyg8552]

Dimir and mid range decks get a lot better which seems what the committee wants, hence all the slow play talking points

[@Andrei_Blanton]

Ian, I’m actually surprised to hear you say Jeweled Lotus is totally fine to see go! That was actually the one I was, oddly, most heartbroken about. My belief was firmly that JLo made our format significantly more diverse. Historically, prior to JLo, the format was comprised almost completely of partner commanders because they offer the most colors while also being castable. JLo solved that problem by giving 4-6 MV commanders the ability to be cast and have impact in the mid or early game, which means there’s a reason to play them over a partner pairing. I think this ban specifically will cost us an absolute ton of fun and viable fringe strategies that we so sorely needed more of. I am, like you, heartbroken to see dockside banned as it was allowing several wedges to compete and without it I am concerned for the diversity of the format. Rhystic Study is so powerful that there being no way to punch through a midrange grind efficiently will mean little reason to play non-blue or non-white decks in cEDH. P.S. Zndrsplt is kill. Good bye mana crypt rest in piece my beloved. I am, fwiw, of the mind that a separate banned list is a wonderful idea at this stage. However, I am happy to be proven wrong!

[@chadlewandowski9930]

THEY JUST TOOK MILLIONS OF DOLLARS OUT OF MANY MANY PLAYERS POCKETS WHO WORKED SO HARD TO SAVE MONEY TO BUILD 10-20 DECKS IN THE LAST 10 YEARS

[@twizzla1139]

Why would you actually buy these multiple times? CEDH needs its own format because these not in casual is fine with me.

[@impendio]

After they reprinted mana crypt _this year_

[@Lemon_Sage9999]

I have a friend who speculated... He is out $1.4k in a single morning. It's more about "cardboard isn't an investment, it's just fun"

[@Lemon_Sage9999]

Before someone tells me I'm a bad friend, I have told him in the past, he's asked me about other forms of investment, and he's kinda always held his money in Magic cards, can't budge a ship sailing

[@xZyrux]

I mean people who invested huge sums of money into a cardgame without being aware that it's a highly volatile investment have only themselfes to blame.

[@GoriNapalm]

Literally no reason to play red now except for Underworld Breach.

[@Turn2Ugin]

My entire shop’s group chat collectively agrees that we will not comply

[@thetimebinder]

That was always allowed. It rarely holds. Events are going to use the new banned list.

[@bradross7488]

Wizards gave us a good excuse to proxy after the 30th anniversary debacle. The rules committee just ensured that we would. Hate losing 500 bones. It won’t happen again.

[@ArchDanDan]

goodbye Niz, it was nice knowing you...

[@pomposso_typer]

It would be interesting to see what a cEDH specific banlist would look like. I think in a way it free up both casual and competitive ro explore the things each group wants to get out of the commander experience.

[@LightPink]

Every single cedh deck now has to get updated

[@thetimebinder]

So? That the intent. Bans change the format. Every set of new cards change the format. This is nothing new. Tell all the Winota players from last year that go their deck basically banned because stax stopped being good. It doesn't take a ban to change the meta.

[@LightPink]

@@thetimebinder it's just crazy to think that banning basis would have changed less decks

[@RRC-xq9yy]

If fast mana was the point of CEDH, then the mox jewels and black lotus would be a thing I agree with the meta doesn't changing as much and artifacts maybe being viable now

[@eddipl5055]

It’s so hard to understand for the committee that not everyone love to play 3 hours games with precons?

[@freddyberr1523]

It is a severe breach of trust for players in the value of cards, one has the feeling that a collection can lose its value from one day to the next. Even the supposedly so good rule 0 will become a farce, because you don't need bans if it would work or you need a precise regulation as in other formats. Nadu was the only correct Bann.

[@shadow-.-9764]

i see why dockside, but holy shit hitting mana crypt, nadu and jeweled is crazy

[@AndyG3173]

Nah, Dockside and Nadu were definitely ban-worthy. I say this as a person whose $1,000 Nadu deck is now worth like $600 after prices drop. Crypt and Lotus absolutely baffled me, though. My jaw dropped.

[@shadow-.-9764]

@@AndyG3173 nadu is a powerhouse deck, but the other meta decks are better, so thats a casual ban, but banning dockside kills a lot of decks. this ban also makes rogh/sci 100 times better. dockside jeweled crypt are not casual cards.

[@AndyG3173]

@@shadow-.-9764 I don't disagree with you. I've also got a cEDH deck and dabble when I can. Dockside getting banned really screws up quite a few meta decks. I agree that Rog/Si gets better here, as does Blue Farm, Kinnan, and Najeela. Sisay will be hurting a lot. As will K'rrik and Tivit. I'm curious what will happen to cEDH. Clones won't be nearly as good, all Dockside lines are gone, obviously, Kitten lines will be effected by the two zero cost rocks being banned, Mox Opal is definitely getting a side eye in a lot of decks. This is wild lol

[@shadow-.-9764]

@@AndyG3173 Tivit, etali are dead. they want to make the format slow, but in cedh we dont want slow, even the stax decks, play fast

[@victorholguin5768]

All i know is my chtonian nightmare tech in blue farm is dead, my elsha deck is now slower, but rogsi and kinnan decks aren’t affected much. This ban was definitely casual. Crypt wasn’t warping the format, neither was Jelewed. Dockside was an accelerator, especially going 4th at a tourney.

[@bullnutzz]

This is huge, as a new player just building these decks and who recently purchased a dockside… I’m quite shell shocked. Great that Nadu gets a ban but all the rest are shocking to me.

[@devildueler]

Winota got hit hard

[@diegorezi5760]

Now she is not cedh vai able anymore....korvold also

[@devildueler]

@@diegorezi5760 it’s ironic, this man and his winota got me into cedh. Sure, I have 5 decks now and winota isn’t the strongest but I kept her. I love her. I’ll still rock her and who knows what’ll happen. A lot of people are calling for cedh being its own format. Either way, it’s a huge shake up and I don’t think it’ll end here. I don’t think anything will get reversed but something is bound to come from it, in a positive matter…one can hope.

[@tedirons5580]

WILD, WOKE UP AND WAS SHOCKED!!

[@lilwigese1]

Red is dead cedh is dead ppl sell your cards while you still can get some money back

[@ComedIanMTG]

I do think this falls under a bit of an extreme reaction. The format will be fine, just wasn't a good move overall for players wallets

[@lilwigese1]

@ComedIanMTG hundreds down the drain this will continue sell your cards ppl buy proxies until cedh events are forced to allow proxies

[@koruto721]

​@@lilwigese1just bought proxies last week lol, already most of my local events are proxy friendly. Real cards are a thing of the past now lmao

[@tylerhicks9137]

Can we have our own rule committee now?

[@bretts3046]

Jhoira, Weatherlight Captain artifact storm rejoice!

[@renato_n.n]

lol