The Difference Between Pulling from your Shoulder Versus Forming a Catch in Freestyle! | Swim

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[@Rodisflawless]

Kudos to anyone who managed to understand this video.

[@alanlockhart1553]

I agree - I could NOT understand what on earth she was saying. Total confusion.

[@robertadams7834]

I understood. Stop pulling/hauling yourself through the water. Let the rotation of the free arm as gravity brings it down power the working arm. This video helped me tons.

[@joejoe-lb6bw]

@@robertadams7834 Maybe more detailed is: let the downward free arm stroke begin the shoulder+hip rotation, which then allows the larger muscles to help the catched arm to push (the power phase of the stroke).

[@steveeb9567]

See my comment above and search 'catch-up' stroke.

[@FlyGuy2000]

She undoubtedly understands the concepts she is trying to convey, but for a beginner like myself the words do not represent anything I can use. I think advanced swimmers would understand this, but they would probably already know this stuff anyway, so she needs to start with the EILIAF concept and move from there.

[@225rip]

I am a lifeguard and I have noticed the the best swimmers spend more time reaching and looks like they are not pulling that hard, but they are moving fast in the water. Other swimmers seem to be clawing the water and going slower. This lady is on the point; I will try her suggestions.

[@speedo1105]

exactly correct, reach for the "stars", and ride out the kick

[@valeriedesjardins]

cool! A great tip! i didnt realized i was pulling. cant wait to try it out next time. Thank You!

[@larsbrown4811]

Good video! This is a complex subject that even advanced swimmers struggle with, as the comments attest 😂… I often advise my swimmers to kick up to the “catch” rather than pulling the hand to the body. That seems to help. Bottom line, swimmers, you want your body to move forward through the water rather than you hand slipping backward through the water. 🏊‍♂️ 🏊‍♀️

[@minaveronicat9828]

Can you please explain what do you mean by "to kick up to the "catch""? (visually)

[@MariaVlezko]

@@minaveronicat9828 when your hand is extended forward and you are ready to catch, you should intensify your kick (propel yourself further forward) then grab that water (catch it!) and pull yourself forward. Imagine as if you were crawling through the sand, you'd be pulling yourself forward by grabbing onto sand, not pushing and throwing the sand behind :) hope it makes sense now!

[@UnearnedConfidence932]

What do you mean when you use the words 'slip' and 'fall' to describe your elbow position? What do you mean when you say you're 'holding water' and 'forming a catch'? Are these phrases more explicitly defined somewhere on your site? Thanks!

[@speedo1105]

to slip and fall in the aquatic realm while swimming , to me, means you've lost the position that activates the lats, the major mover in swimming.

[@jeffreywiddop762]

I thought if using shoulder driven front crawl or also known as kayak. You do incorporate your upper body and shoulders; this by contracting the shoulder blades to your spine, or should say squeezing them together. Same time throwing your actual ball joint shoulders forward simultaneously with the aid of a fast recovery on the arms as a swinging movement. The hands, wrists and forearms then apply holding force under the water surface; before quickly pulling back. (A feeling on the recovery of throwing forward a full contact boxers punch) ...Glutes held firm using a quick, rocking, rotation body motion during the swim.; with a rapid kick downwards from the hip to ankles and feet. You don't have a lot of time to think about it you train so it comes naturally on fast sprints🙂If you agree?

[@jackbdeep]

Great video as always. Suggestion - do a split screen to the wrong and right ways.

[@EdwinChenLoo]

On the first technique the hand is entering forcefully. That was the only difference i noticed. Perhaps a side by side comparison would have helped. The arm is being held by the shoulder so technically both involve pulling from a shoulder.

[@speedo1105]

the shoulder joint and it's muscles, merely pivot, protect and/or position the arm for whatever movement is involved. the pulling initiates from the lats and the smaller rotator cuff muscles , deltoids and some pectoral involvement finishes the pull.

[@clearbrain]

Very informative....makes a huge difference...splendid

[@notmyrealname6272]

Huh?? I couldn’t really understand this one unfortunately. Love the channel though.

[@MG-eo8eg]

Me too. I watched the video again and but I couldn't catch it. So which one is right? Pulling from the shoulder or the other one?

[@notmyrealname6272]

@@MG-eo8eg definitely ‘the other one’ but how you do that/practise it I’m not sure from this. :)

[@CalebChapman12]

Yeah, conceptual I get the 2nd way is right, but I don’t know how to go into the Water and do it from this video

[@cmillholland]

Look into other videos that discuss “early vertical forearm.” A good drill that highlights this is to place the paddles in the palms of your hands so the paddle rests on the palm (fingers curled over the paddle) and your forearm, and then swim normally. It gives up a good feeling of how you engage the forearm at the start of the catch.

[@mary-chrisstaples9767]

me neither:(

[@richcote8109]

SwimVice is still one of the best, most technically sound sources of information and advice... nice job!! One or two drills to improve the "catch" and "pull" at the end would have been a great addition!!

[@33Jenesis]

I will pay attention to this when practicing.

[@speedo1105]

hi coach, this might be atopic for further presentation. lots of confusion in the site. i understand where yu are coming from but i'm an 82 yr.old usms competitive whose been coaching and racing for close to 60 yrs. still my favorite site.

[@ksaskeri1378]

I think I'm making the first mistake that you was demonstrated, but I didn't understand how to avoid it.

[@robohippy]

Well, still trying to figure out where you are going with this. Biggest difference I notice is that with the 'shoulder' variation, you are driving your arms forward with more force than when you are doing 'proper' technique. Generally, I associate 'shoulder' drive with very little upper body rotation, and you can't get power or efficiency if you are not using body rotation. There is a 'shoulder shrug' that happens with freestyle, which involves the full extension of your recover arm out front, and shoulder 'shrugs' up. The 'catch' to me is the flexing of the hand at your wrist before you set up for the high elbow/early vertical forearm, and then you engage your lats and pecs, along with your shoulder shrugging down. Then repeat on the other side. With the 'gallop' style of freestyle, you do bounce up and down a little bit, but not nearly as extreme as with the fly.

[@Lopostok]

bad: pulling yourself, you start generating force while your arm is in front of you, you are pushing the water down and you are engaging the shoulder muscles. good: pushing forward, you are generating force once your forearm is perpendicular to the bottom of the pool. Your lats are engaged, and you are pushing the water behind you.

[@open_water2411]

Everyone who doesn’t get this subtle difference should watch it again and again until they do.

[@jacke.mcneill272]

Thanks for sharing your knowledge, great job!

[@junyang1710]

Forming a catch means you body move forward, catching up you hand (hand just bend ), pulling from shoulder means you hand move back actively( lost streamline). Am I right?

[@SWIMVICE]

Hello @junyang1710 You've got the right idea! Forming a proper catch involves syncing your body's forward movement with your hand's position. The catch should feel like your hand is catching the water as you maintain a streamlined position. If your "catch" arm slips and pulls back faster than your body travels forward, you've indeed lost the catch and streamlined effect. This can happen if you're pulling from the shoulder, which tends to disrupt the fluid motion and efficiency of your stroke. Focusing on engaging your core and using the larger muscles of your back and torso for the pull will help maintain that crucial connection with the water. Keep working on refining your technique, and remember that practice and gradual improvement are key. If you're interested, I have videos that delve into more details about catch and proper technique. Feel free to explore those for further guidance! Happy swimming, Coach Mandy

[@cuhy3406]

​@@SWIMVICE Coach, let's see if I got this. Is catching water or anchoring similar to walking on land where we plant 1 foot on the ground then the combination of momentum and the push from the other foot will move our center of gravity forward to catch up the planted foot ? So in water if we slip our hands thru water it's the same as slipping our feet on ground. Similarly, tearing and pushing (effectively throwing) a block of water away from its whole body (like a water jet) is similar to kicking dirt behind resulting in less movement forward. So fishes move thru water with little water disturbance as we move on the ground without moving the ground.

[@joejoe-lb6bw]

@@cuhy3406 Interesting hyper context: Neil deGrasse Tyson in "How Wheels Really Work" talks about how the bottom of wheel on a moving car is not moving.

[@open_water2411]

That’s really resonated with me and it might just be a light bulb moment. 🙏

[@baohoangz7379]

Yup, exactly the one mistake I was trying to solve for this whole month, but it seem this is not enough to fix it

[@StephenDuncan]

Can't wait to try this today. I think I get it.

[@StephenDuncan]

This definitely helped. Took me a couple of workouts to get it, but "forming the catch" smoothed out my forward momentum. Less bounce/bobbing and felt faster. What I could really tell was it was so much easier to catch a breath without reaching or turning to breath, if that makes sense. Because I wasn't bobbing lower in the water it was easy to just follow my rotation to catch a breath. Can't wait for my next workout. Thnx Coach!

[@angelalee2296]

I want my kids to take swim lessons. I have some questions and would like your opinion about my options locally

[@mariec.vannest5701]

I'm so happy with the results after using these tips!

[@mariec.vannest5701]

Such a useful video!

[@MG-eo8eg]

So which one is the correct one? I didn't understand it.

[@EssKayTee1]

The second one.

[@dallasnoble8329]

Angle of leverage I suppose?

[@jacke.mcneill272]

Super helpful information here!

[@jonw8132]

Maybe a side by side would have helped more or slow motion comparison?

[@jamesj.shehan6572]

Wow, I never knew there were so many techniques for swimming!

[@shem44]

Great tips! But what it actually means?

[@rogerford703]

Didn’t really get this one unfortunately. Couldn’t tell the difference other than entering the water more forcefully in the first example.

[@andrewd.costello8219]

Good insight on how to become a better swimmer.

[@andrewd.costello8219]

My swimming game is getting so much better after watching this.

[@andrewd.costello8219]

What a fantastic tutorial!

[@jinq8616]

As others suggested, the explanation in this video is misleading. To freestyle swim, you have to pull from the shoulder. The first technique “focuses” on pulling when arm passes the waist, the Second technique focuses on “catching” by reaching arm forward more and maintains better streamlining, and spends less energy on the pulling phase, thus reduces drag from the water and goes faster.

[@jacke.mcneill272]

Excellent instruction from a swim pro here!

[@aljerones99]

I don't think this was well explained and this is tge complaint many folks made here. Bottom line is to stay as streamlined as possible while moving through the water. As the power comes from the catch, the benefit comes from the glide. The muscles used most in order to catch should be the large back muscle called the latissimus dorssi (lat) and not the shoulder (deltoid). When the shoulder is used, ostensibly, there is little stretching in order to glide through the catch. The streamlining is lost because using the shoulder tends to pull the body upwards and out of the water causing exposure to periodic resistance.

[@salimr4718]

I understand the description of the problem, which I'm guilty of, but I don't understand the solution. Could you make a follow up videos to explain in detail and include some drills?

[@SWIMVICE]

Yes, those drills and specific progressions are included in the SWIMVICE Speed program. This video aims to emphasize the distinction between pulling from the shoulder spontaneously and creating the catch with your core and lats. If you're interested, you can explore more details through this link: linktr.ee/swimvice

[@daviddawn9043]

Say what,

[@chrisforeman4240]

I always say the first challenge in learning a new subject is understanding the terminology. And, sorry, but after watching this video twice, I still don't understand the word, "catch".

[@joejoe-lb6bw]

'catch' term is used all over youtube videos and unfortunately described differently. From what I've seen it is the configuration of your arm and hand AFTER your hand enters the water and extends forward. If done correctly it sets up the arm to facilitate the subsequent push using the core body muscles via rotation. As @cuhy3406 commented, it is an anchoring (catching of water) so that the body moves to that position, then applying pushing power toward the feet. Olympic level swimmers are applying power all the time, but it seems that for us normal swimmers the catch should not be too forceful. ???

[@speedo1105]

i know y9our confusion and it is correct. many of my clients express the same thought. my imagery that i present to them is to envision a ball that you palm out in front and as y9u do you should feel some resistance..............................that;s the catch and you send that ball straight back in line with your shoulder.

[@andrewd.costello8219]

Love it

[@jamesj.shehan6572]

The instructor is really knowledgeable on this subject.

[@ksaskeri1378]

Can you give more detail ?I guess ım struggling with this.

[@mariec.vannest5701]

This video has it all - form, technique, and tips for success!

[@RicardGomes76]

Wow! That is a beautiful face you are!!!

[@pauleohl]

Forget about the "wrong" technique. Just show us exactly what you want us to do with our arms-shoulder-wrist-forearm. As it is, this video offered me no useful advice. FWIW, I swam 2 1/2+ miles this morning in a 25 meter pool and I am 80 y/o.

[@steveeb9567]

Wow, my comment got deleted because I said it could have been better explained ! Fragile ego...

[@PaulSimonNumberOneFan]

I dislocated my shoulder following this advice. DOWNVOTE!

[@EssKayTee1]

You must have been doing it wrong. Doing it properly reduces the risk of shoulder injury