The Forgotten Hive Fleet - 40K Theories

[@DaimoHope]

The way you said Leman Russ going fishing had me visualizing him sitting in a boat with a dinky fishing rod and a fishing hat.

[@majormajorasic]

Wait you really don't think that's exactly what he did? I bet he even pulled out the "Father" kraken 50 times the size of his boat and said "Nah, too small" and chucked the confused beast back into water.

[@wolfyboy]

it is ALSO what the norse god THOR did, when he caught the midgard serpent. so it might be inspired by that.

[@changer_of_ways_999]

But still wearing his power armor

[@bladedaniels904]

Im just happy i wasn't the only one with that visual in mind

[@Masterblader158]

"Before throwing it back into the sea claiming it was too small" Classic Russ.

[@drgnzach]

It just aint a 40k theory unless he says "During the events of the Horus Heresy"

[@Brutalyte616]

Another theory you could propose is that the Tyranids sent scout fleets towards the Milky Way millions of years ago, but found nothing worthy of devoting the bulk of their forces at that point in time, and so the fleets continued to drift at a more leisurely pace. Then the Pharos lit up and caught the Hive Mind's attention, and so they made a bee-line for what was probably the most interesting thing they'd seen in God knows how long.

[@batuhangocer6642]

Brutalyte616 that explains how they attack from diffrent places. They were passing the galaxy because they haven’t found any notable life because of Necrons sleeping in Tombs. Then Astronomicon lit up and become a light bulb attaracing Tyranids.

[@Brutalyte616]

@@batuhangocer6642 Actually that is explained by the Hive Mind coordinating a pincer maneuver, entering the Milky Way from several angles within the same relative timeframe.

[@spartanalex9006]

Or they were cubstomped by the Old Ones and Necrons during the War in Heaven.

[@Brutalyte616]

@holysoks1 Actually that's to their benefit. Conflict between Hive Fleets bolsters the survivors and allows them to recuperate virtually all losses on both sides, consolidating as a single larger Hive Fleet with the genetic information and biomass of defeated foes, as well as data collected from enemies that have posed enough of a challenge to send the Hive Fleet off course into the path of another. It's essentially the Tyranid equivalent of war games, only death has little consequence to them, so they can afford to go all-out. The Hive Mind could just have them all cooperate instead of acting like animals, but this hands-off Darwinian approach ensures that Tyranids do not stagnate and keeps them ready when the overarching Hive Mind isn't actively directing them, and potentially allows something greater than the current Hive Mind to develop; if a Hive Fleet went rogue and managed to subsume the rest of the Tyranids, it would result in an even more effective superpredator that would continue to perpetuate the Tyranid species. And each individual Hive Fleet does have different doctrines, with some even cultivating Tyranid Agri-Worlds behind the advancing forces, presumably to ensure a slow but constant stream of biomass.

[@Thovargh]

The first known hive fleet was hive fleet Australia, which landed on Terra and posed as a continent

[@azraeldelune2096]

That makes far more sense than it should

[@Epic_747]

can verify, im fighting a loosing battle against a trygon

[@hazel5092]

So that’s why they lost against „Emus“ Thanks for my new headcannon

[@Epic_747]

@@hazel5092 no the emus are the only things holding the great devour at bay

[@hazel5092]

@@Epic_747 that is something A GENE STEALER WOULD SAY BROTHER BARACHIAL GET THE HEAVY FLAMER

[@danieltgrissani]

What if those creatures were never technically "Tyranids" but share a similar genetic profile because they were originally from the same Galaxy? They could have simply stumbled into the Milky Way as they were attempting to flee from the advancing ravenous Hive Fleets like forest creatures stumbling into a neighborhood attempting to flee a fire.

[@SilvaDreams]

That is what I came to conclude, they weren't Tyranids. But the Tyranids had used them as genetic material and had used the bio-morph weapons to morph themselves as they were biological in nature and could be assimilated genetically.

[@phreakazoith2237]

SilvaDreams that's the issue with analyzing a highly adaptive species aint it? If the Nids would consume the milky way and let's say humans and orks would flee to another galaxy (let's say there is one not already consumed) - they would share a genetic profile with the Nids on their heels cause the Nids consumed heaps of them. A shared profile proofs nothing - you could be a form of Nid OR they just ate enough of your species.

[@canis2020]

I mostly agree. The only difference would be, well, they heard how manly Leman Russ was. They just had to take a gander, for none were more manly then they, in their galaxy. They show up and they find SANTA! His bag is full of huzzah, and his hands are itchy to punch holiday cheer!

[@spencerschaepman7239]

Or perhaps the Zoats created the Tyranids and were being destroyed by their own creation.

[@RomanvonUngernSternbergnrmfvus]

@@spencerschaepman7239 I think the space bugs were kinda a control/alt/delete button for the old space gods. They can salvage the genetics from the bugs and revive anything they ate. Either that or it’s a galaxy sized multi-celled organism and humanity got unlucky. It could have even been made by some other god like creationist species for all we know.

[@internetzenmaster8952]

Hive Mind: Okay, I was kinda drunk when I chucked the earliest Hive Fleets toward the galaxy. Can ya blame me for not remembering half of these Hive Fleets?

[@karlthetechpriest2905]

Filthy Zeno your only giving us target practice. Lots and lots and lots of fast moving razor sharp target practice

[@darkblood626]

Hive mind- 'I'm never eating orks again'

[@tryagainbragg2569]

Yes you killed my great great great grandmother

[@LordBloodraven]

Hive Mind: Dude, where's my Bio-Ship?

[@DISTurbedwaffle918]

I like the idea of the Necrons freaking out and just dumping Tyranids back in time to solve the problem.

[@RomanvonUngernSternbergnrmfvus]

I mean it’s not the worst idea, that and sending them into the warp sound like good ideas. Creating a black whole near their heart/brain/main mass was another fun idea I heard about.

[@DISTurbedwaffle918]

@@RomanvonUngernSternbergnrmfvus "I got pissed at the bug nest in my backyard so I sent those retards back to the War in Heaven." -Local Necron Overlord

[@RomanvonUngernSternbergnrmfvus]

@@DISTurbedwaffle918 now that’s funny, they came to this galaxy thinking it was a all you can eat Buffett and it turned out to be space Brazil/Detroit and then to top off they get sent back in time to a point in space brazil/Detroit’s history that was somehow even worse is even funnier. People fear the space bugs when they don’t realize the space bugs just got told “welcome to the rice fields” aka “if you think orks are bad just wait till you meet the krok” I honestly almost feel bad for them . . . Almost

[@DISTurbedwaffle918]

@@RomanvonUngernSternbergnrmfvus I'd like to see Tyranids fighting the C'Tan prior to their shattering.

[@bmpikas]

There is a Ciaphas Cain book, named Caves of Ice, where Cains ship crashlads in an imperial ice world and defrosts some tyranids traped in the ice for thousands of years. If I remember correctly, the book stated that they should be there even before the great crusade, but I'm not totally sure.

[@commissarstanley2524]

Basilhs Mpikas and wasn't that also a necron world?

[@bmpikas]

I don't recall anything about necrons but I has been a long time so I cant be sure.

[@bmpikas]

My mistake as weldonwin pointed out bellow..It was the last ditch..anyway my point was that there is a mention of hive ships roaming the gallaxy even before the great crusade.

[@UltramarineXIII13]

True. The planet they were on was called Nusquam Fundumentibus. Cain had originally been given credit for stopping an Orc invasion some decades before. He returned to deal with a secondary outbreak of Orcs with the Valhallan 597th. His transport crashed on the ice planet and thawed out Tyranids that had been frozen in the the ice which then proceeded to wake and revive others so trapped. According to the Imperium's records first official contact with the Tyranids was in 745.M41, while the Ordo Xenos records suggest contact with Tyranid bio-forms as far back as M35. But the Hive Ship fragment that was found on Nusquam according to Magos Izembard has been there for at least a thousand years longer. So Tyranids have been in the galaxy far longer than anticipated.

[@skorm-lm6hh]

they were some native creatures eating throught ice (not that lethal) the necrons on the same world+orks another story

[@levrapport2033]

For further consideration: What if, based on the "long range scouts" theory, the scouts were cut off / unable to report back to the main hive fleets because of not only the hivemind's distance from the Milky Way, but because of the Warp? With out the overwhelming presence of mass synapse creatures to create the Shadow in the Warp, its interference could have disrupted their psionic link, especially over such long distances. This would allow for some Tyranic organisms to enter the galaxy anytime after the War in Heaven (millions of years ago), and then find themselves unable to call in the full hive fleets "early."

[@40KTheories]

***Addendum*** So I missed out the possibility of Hive Fleet Ouroboros/Ouroboris (differing spelling depending on the edition) and Tiamat/Tiamet In regards to Ouroboros it's worth pointing out that while creatures that were known as the Legion of Ouroboris were first sighted in M36 emerging from the Eye of Terror (and destroyed 12 days later), the hive fleet that showed similar characteristics which showed up thousands of years later would be named Ouroboris in reference to the 'legends' surrounding its name sake, there is still the possibility that the original Ouroboris was not a Tyranid splinter fleet, despite the similarities. As for Tiamet, a Hive Fleet would arrive later in the system in order to protect a large fleshy structure upon one of the worlds, but the original organisms had all seemingly turned feral. This structure is rumoured to be some kind of seed probe/beacon that a hive fleet that would arrive later would seemingly be designed to protect. So for the purpose of this, we will still settle on Colossus being the earliest official encounter with a designated hive fleet, as the original 'Legion' and Tiamet strains were never officially classified as such (despite the implications).

[@mattward4916]

I believe that the Kraken of Fenris that fought Leman Russ appears to parallel the story of Thor fighting Jörmungandr. Thor first fought the creature during a fishing trip.

[@fadelsukoco3092]

Out of curiosity, the description you provided for the Zoat hivefleet ships reminded me of www.angelfire.com/games2/warpspawn/WHF.png Would that be close to what they would look like?

[@phreakazoith2237]

And Leman went fishing for Kraken too. But Thor did not threw Jormungandr back into the sea - his scared shipmate cut the fishing line. The emperor almost getting killed by Horus Lupercal primarch of the Lunar Wolfs resembles the story from the Edda when the Fenriswulf fights and kills Odin, the chief god before getting killed as well. Artwork depicting Big E on the golden throne heavily reminds me on Odin, the crippled god sitting on a throne in contemplation while his raven collect intel and whisper knowledge to he humans.

[@godemperorofmankind7255]

They're stealing all the jeans. JEANSTEALERS!

[@Splozy]

MY LEVIS

[@orangvii3633]

And selling the jeans to flayers

[@scottmurphy4946]

This would kill canada as they live in Jean Jackets

[@GaIvatr0n]

The Necron theory makes brilliant sense

[@markedwards7505]

"Bee-he-moth." :)

[@caos1925]

The last theory you presented could also explain all the frozen tyranids in the Cain book "The Last Ditch" and why they were aggressive to other tyranids.

[@LordBloodraven]

Many tabletop players agree tyrranid inter-fleet hostility is much like the inter-colony hostility between ant colonies. Even though they are the same species, each drone is strictly loyal to their respective queen (norn queen in the case of tyranids).

[@bmpikas]

Was it the "Last Ditch" or the "Caves of Ice"?

[@weldonwin]

It was The Greater Good, which is a follow one from The Last Ditch, because it featured the remains of a dead Hiveship that was killed at the end of The last Ditch. The caves of Ice I believe had Cain fighting Orks and Necrons

[@bmpikas]

Probably yes..my mistake

[@Zaprozhan]

Eldaari, humans, orks are all capable of interspecies warfare. Why not Nids?

[@wahbegan]

Fucking love the Necrons' attitude. "Fuck it, that's a problem for my ancestors to deal with. ZAP"

[@willrogers3793]

To very loosely tie this video to your earlier “Can Tyranids be Tamed” theory video, it seems possible that, if certain organisms like the Kraken or Catachan Devil are indeed Tyranid bioforms that have regressed to an animalistic state over thousands or even millions of years, then it might be possible to train if not outright tame some of these bioforms. At least, it should be, provided that they have indeed evolved to the point of being completely outside of the Hive Mind’s control. To be honest, I am putting this forward mostly because at some point, I really want to see a Radical Inquisitor with a beloved pet resembling a Lictor. Especially if said Inquisitor rides said almost-Lictor into battle like a cavalry steed.

[@ANDELE3025]

But who is the pet? The Lictor or the Inquisitor?

[@thefirstprimariscatosicari6870]

Will Rogers That sounds a awful lot like something directly from "Humans are Space Orcs". Eldar 1: "So you are telling me that a human managed to SEVERE a Carnifex from the Hive Mind and then TAMED it? You must be joking! There is no way to tame a Tyranid!" Eldar 2: "I'm not joking! And said human uses it into battle!" Eldar 1: "I now understand why our Empire at its golden age lost against them..."

[@therexyogaming]

Honestly, why not just make an artificial hive-mind and forcefully link rogue Tyranids to it, thus gaining control of it? No need for risking an attempt at taming lost Tyranids.

[@RomanvonUngernSternbergnrmfvus]

@@therexyogaming I don’t trust anything that powerful tbh unless it’s big E himself and he is sadly busy, it’s grim derp where we have super space marines instead of painful and costly evolutions of the raptor project. Go look at how they fuel warp engines.

[@internetzenmaster8952]

Query: Why has the Hive Mind made it a point to actively avoid re-absorbing certain strains of Tyranid, specifically the Ymgarl Genestealers?

[@Brutalyte616]

Self-imposed handicap.

[@zacharyhawley1693]

Internet Zen Master space aids

[@MCcrepperify]

imperfect strain, not good enough

[@GoingRampant92]

MirrorMajishion Can improve. Will give back; better.

[@Lord_Kantor]

They got reabsorbed. That's why in the codex you get the Ymgarl bio artifact.

[@mizuhokusuha]

I suddenly just realized what are the white genestealers on the olethros in the deathwing game - ymgarl genestealers. They have the exact characteristics. Bonus point to the development team for using detailed lore.

[@sanguiniusonvacation1803]

Aww man. I missed the lizard centaurs ?! ...thanks Horus .....

[@ArchArturo]

I'm kitbashing a Venator Gang for Necromunda, and one of my champions is a Zoat that uses heavy weapons.

[@KallenMalefic]

Fucking Horus!

[@danielmiller3596]

@@KallenMalefic We all know it was really Erebus.

[@brandonaughtman9091]

The Zoat deserve to make a comeback. They could be a rebellion against the Tyrainds and Genestealers.

[@ANDELE3025]

Rebellion against Nids with Jeanstealers (remember, the pant thieves are a "new" human genetic basis nid species and not exactly fully integrated into the swarm) which results in the complete Leviathan fleet entering the Milky Way.

[@ordohereticus5530]

Brandon Aughtman The Zoat were literally tyranid agents imo. They tried pulling a genestealer by trying to intergrate themselves inside of imperial space/society since the imp is the largest threat to the tyranids military wise and when they were refused they tried doing as much damage as possible.

[@daswordofgork9823]

Out of curiosity, could or did the Zoats get control of certain Tyranids for their own purposes. Or maybe the Zoats created the Tyranids and their experiments turned against them but in a bid to stop them, the Zoats turned them into an animal like state so that way the Tyranids had a crutch when invading other galaxies.

[@40KTheories]

Not sure, but it would make an interesting video topic to consider.

[@RocketHarry865]

I wonder if Hive Fleet Colossus represented a throwback stage of Tyranid evolution before the coming of the Hive Mind that took over the other tyranids.

[@MrPooleish]

I was going to jokingly suggest that Hive Fleet Tiamat is building a time machine, but the Necrons beat me to it.

[@KertaDrake]

Wonder if the birth of Slaanesh was enough to attract a few hive fleets. This is why you add an electrified metal grid around your psychic beacons...

[@VoiceOfTheEmperor]

I think that the Necrons sent the Tyranids back in time wherein most became enslaved to the Outsider and he spent millions of years building up his forces whilst the remainder of the stranded Tyranids more or less "Evolved" to fit their new environments.

[@mikesnow285]

Sends tyrannids back in time, great idea.

[@michaelhowell2326]

Question: since the necrons showed up about 65 million years ago, do you think they had something to do with the extinction of the dinosaurs?

[@Spacefrisian]

No cause that happened 64 Million years ago and several changed into birds, so they didnt realy go extinct.

[@michaelhowell2326]

Spacefrisian actually smartass, it was between 64-66 million years ago. Though some did evolve into birds, over 95% of land animals went extinct. Anything over about 10 pounds died out. That's why it's called the great KT extinction, not the KT evolution revolution. And since we're talking about a period of time that no human was around to record in detail exact date/time groups, and it's a fictional universe, I would recommend not being such an arrogant ass.

[@princesstinklepanties2720]

michael howell Lmao youre a dopey sluy

[@Symbioteposion]

They didn't appear 65 million years ago, they went to sleep 65 million years ago

[@matthiuskoenig3378]

the whole bird to dinosaur thing i iffy at best, after all the oldest bird is older than the oldest brd-like dinosaur, in other words dinosaurs evolved similar traits to birds after birds had already evolved. not to mention bird lungs and lizard lungs are too dissimilar that many scientists argue they would have to evlove alot earlier if its possible at all (some going as far as to say that birds need to have their own evolutionary tree going back to fish due to how different bird lng systems are). also no dinosaur has been proven to have feathers, the closest thing is 'proto-feathers' which are structurally more similar to hairs than anthing else.

[@zachrich7359]

In the Ciaphas Cain novel, "The Last Ditch," Cain discovers on an ice world a strain of tyranids, including at least one hive ship, on an ice world. Entombed in ice until Cains transport ship crashing onto the planet thawed some out and those thawed tyranids began to wake others. It also almost set free a hive ship till Cain and company overloaded a geothermal plant and basically caused a volcanic eruption, killing the ship. This strain was confirmed to having been on the ice world long before Hive fleets Colossus or Behemoth entered the galaxy, possibly around the 33rd or 34th milleniums. I would quote the exact line but I cannot find the novel at the moment. Also, the same strain was also touched again in a second novel, "The Greater Good." There the Mechanicus had managed to salvage a bit of the hive ship, a cortical node, and used it to essentially psychically "jam" the influence of a hive fleet attacking the forge world Fecundia. The reason I bring it up, is that the tyranids have seemingly been around much longer than many realize but only now have become aggressive towards the wider galaxy

[@ANDELE3025]

IMO, combining old and modern fluff (nids know of the warp/warp knows of nids, nids bend gravity to travel but dont have a problem traveling in the warp if sent there by another party) to make the "small sections of nids from the future that were sent into the warp got spit out by chaos back in time" explanation seems like the best option to both have actual nid ships and swarms around long pre M39~M40 in weird locations while also not having to deal with "but why didnt the rest of them come along to nom up the galaxy back then"?

[@zachrich7359]

Was just pulling from a Black Library novel, and if I am not mistaken, it is canon. They don't say how they got there, only that they were there. Also, while it may not count for much, the 'nids of Nusquam Fundementabis, the ice world from "The Last Ditch," are from a previously unknown hive fleet with a unique color scheme and a hive ship entombed in ice. Possibly more than one if the world is unlucky. Suggests one of two things, 1) these tyranids did get "displaced" from their original fleet via the method you described. Or 2) they never left in the first place. I had heard a theory that the 'nids are basically a creation of the Old Ones gone completely nuts, much like the Orks, and were sent out from the galaxy during the War in Heaven. Only to be drawn back by the Beacon. Its possible with the second theory, that during the War, this group of 'nids was left in this galaxy and eventually drifted to Nusquam and became entombed in ice. Or during the war, the 'nids were flash frozen by some unknown weapon (there were tens of thousands of different bioforms already deployed on the surface, and when freed of the ice, began to dig up their kin. Possible hint of fight on Nusquam but nothing beyond circumstantial evidence to prove it.) Edit: another possibility is that the vast majority of 'nids were displaced outside of the galaxy while a few scattered groups were for some reason, not and continued drifting.

[@Reddotzebra]

@@zachrich7359 It is canon as far as I'm concerned, what is more interesting is how the cortical node can be used to jam hive mind communications because this would point to the different hive fleets not only being able to interfere with each others communications but also giving an explanation to why they tend to fight amongst themselves when in close proximity. Also Cain meeting the Death Korps of Krieg makes these two my favorite books in the whole series.

[@clintmorgan1491]

Love your videos dude. You put in a TON of effort and it really shows.

[@willrogers3793]

^ What he said. *applauds*

[@augiechiavuzzi4907]

What if the zoets were actually gaging how the galaxy reacted to them and that's why hive fleet behemoth was do aggressive seeing humanity as pretty much always hostile and then the later fleets adapting after seeing how the first failed And the zoets being like hey join the hive its great like bug preachers

[@fumarc4501]

Great theory. Makes you wonder if the Zoats are just evolved time displaced Tyranids?

[@florix7889]

I have a différent theory : The hive fleets already came billions of years earlier and ransacked the milky way galaxy then left leaving dormant tyrranids in the ground. Then the planetes réformed their atmosphère and life came back. The dormant tyrannids were slowly killed of by disease, falls, other big enough regular créatures or even natural catastrophes. This would take billions of years. Only a handful managed to make it through the billions of years and this is what we see today.

[@ThePhantomFeather]

I personally found this particular episode to be fascinating... gives me more to consider and play with in my Deathwatch campaign =3

[@TheJibbajabba12]

Did I hear that right at 1:49 "During the battle for . . . Ma-Crack"

[@thegreatboi8357]

In another universe Hive mind: Splits into multiple hives

[@onairwithjarvis]

"Great Scot!" "This is heavy!"

[@SgtThiel]

this leads to another question: if cronomancy is a thing... why not go back in time to warn the necrontyr about the c'tan?

[@majormajorasic]

Because then they'll still continue being assfucked by Old Ones. So unless you send entirety of Necron race to help Necrontyr wreck Old Ones without C'tan it's not going to happen. And if it does it means Necrontyr will not become Necrons, so no Necron race is going to time travel back to help kill Old Ones, meaning C'tan will be made and Necrontyr will go through their rebirth to Necrons.

[@SgtThiel]

one would think that a race as advanced as the necrontyr would be able to figure out how to extend their lives to a satisfayable degree. I mean, as backwards as the Imperium is, it is child's play for them

[@majormajorasic]

It's because Old Ones forced Necrontyr to only be able to colonize systems and planets similar or same as their home world, so to keep them "unchanged". Main reason Necrontyr got a humongous hateboner for Old Ones is because they saw them as gods and asked to help them cure super cancer they're all plagued with due to their species evolving on planet super bathed with super radiation and Old Ones basically said "lol no that would change you" and prevented them from colonizing non-radioactive wasteland planets or systems. Even if they somehow manage to cure few cancers and extend their lives for a decade or two they'll still suffer from literally hundreds of other cancers. Living as a Necrontyr was a lottery in how long can you live before you win super cancer. Even if you manged to cure the first 14 cancers that ail you you'll still die to that 15th one you don't know how to cure and you'll suffer through all 15 equally.

[@Gormathius]

This is obviously the setup for Home Alone: Hive Fleet Edition.

[@gagaplex]

It is a bit odd to me that creatures like Kraken and Devil even have the ability to reproduce. If I remember correctly, this isn't something most Tyranid creatures could do on their own, that's how specialized they are. The exception are the Genestealers, i. e. infiltrators. This suggests that perhaps the Kraken and Devil are more obvious, more destructive types of infiltrator organisms, sent far, far ahead of hive fleets to cause damage, test defenses and land easily recruited organisms ahead of the arrival of the Hive Mind's influence (assuming Kraken, Devil and others can be taken over by synapse creatures, once they come into range).

[@jackrogers5712]

Yeah, I had a similar assumption. The Devil, Kraken and other similar creatures were just advance scouts sent super far ahead of the rest of the Hive Fleets. Interestingly enough I also think that most/all of the Death Worlds in the Milky Way are the way they are because of Tyranid influence. Tyranid micro organisms landing on a world and altering the flora and fauna on a genetic level in order to survive being isolated from the Hive Fleets.

[@C0wsmacker]

So what your telling me is the Cryptechs go into their hyperbolic time chambers to train and become Super Necron legends?

[@wakko151]

Hence the little known saying "Barabas has killed us all"

[@GrimSqueaker]

Great vide as always. However what about the Old One angle? If the Old Ones made the Tyranids as a Cytan counter measure then that has a number of possible avenues for how random Tyranid organisms might have ended up spread about

[@ابوعابد-س4ث]

[wolvesbane spoiler] Since there’s apparently werewolf daemons inside fenris, is is possible that the reason the slace wolves went from vikings to wolf wolves is daemonic corruption? Haven’t read the book but I heard there is wolf daemons from the adeptus podcastus.

[@leonvalenzuela4096]

Order Nodificationus, Present!

[@manu_spawn]

the Nekron time travelling theories are the absolute best

[@SweatyDynamite]

Would it be possible that the Mecharachnids of Murder are time displaced Tyranids? Since, if I remember correctly, they are similar to them

[@jackrogers5712]

I've wondered about that too. Even if they aren't time displaced, they could just be a sub-species of Tyranid that arrived in the galaxy far, far in advance of the Hive Fleets.

[@michaelhowell2326]

Question: what has Belakor been doing during the current 40k lore? Has he been helping the Chaos forces fight a reanimated Guilliman? Does he have the same lore as old fantasy warhammer?

[@LocalHeretic-ck1kd]

9:40 Me: Pls not Eldar. Pls not Eldar. Pls not Eldar. They have enough of their own scwerups already.

[@UncleMikeDrop]

Skitaranid!! I think it would be supremely cool if the adeptus mechanicum got a hold of some of the more effective tyranid combat forms and modified them in order to make a superior form of skitarii. I think of that every time I see a video about the tyranids.

[@Reddotzebra]

One of the less known assassin temples already tried this. It didn't go well for anyone involved. I'm saying that the reason it's "less known" is that this was that temples only project, and after it went rogue and nommed its way through enough biomass they closed the lid on the project and then followed up by closing the lid on most of the personnel involved...

[@gagaplex]

Perhaps there were small, separated scouting hive fleets attacking millions of years ago? Destroyed by the Necrons, Eldar and Orks, long before humanity existed? Is it known whether the Hive Mind can re-establish control over Kraken and Devil with synapse creatures or whether these and similar creatures have changed/evolved away from its influence by now? If it's the latter, it might suggest a rather longer time-frame than a few thousand years.

[@Tonz_of_Fun]

If enough chronomancers got together, could they go back to before the C'tan became too powerful and kill them to prevent them from becoming the necrons? Which would in turn remove krorks and wraith bone weapons from 40k; theoretically.

[@majormajorasic]

If they stop themselves from become Necrons they stop themselves from attaining Chrononmancy, which means they can't stop themselves from becoming Necrons. Repeat ad infinitum.

[@benjamingoodwin2093]

I guess we know who killed the dinosaurs! Very interesting and very much a mind trip. Keep up the good work

[@1985Cyrus]

The reason the Hive took notice of the Psychic Explosion is due to the same rigid patterns the Tyranids have when invading, they are the same on the micro (Planetary scale) and macro (Galactic) they sensed a massive burst of psychic energy and thought their scouts had found somewhere that had enough for the main body to waste time and energy feeding on, a bit like a C'Tan, needs energy but cannot risk spending more than it receives, so it uses scouts to determine level of resistance and undermine it, just like on a small scale with a Genestealer cult, now just imagine it with hundreds of bioforms, from microscopic to void craft like The Kraken. The Kraken, I think, is an old Tyranid vessel or at least its progenitor was, isn't there a Tyranid vessel that looks like a squid in fact? Theory, The Hive Mind is a C'Tan?

[@redsalamander9999]

There's one thing that you didn't mention that could explain the presence of pre-behemoth Tyranids: the warp. It's pretty much like the Necron situation you mentioned, but might have happened more often on a grander scale. Remember that ships lost in the warp can get sent back into the past, not just the future, and I'm quite sure there are mentions of certain hive ships surviving getting sucked into warp rifts and re-emerging later on. Great video though, and I really liked the Necron hypothesis, I always love it when time travel gets involved!

[@willrogers3793]

Makes sense, especially considering that a big-ass chunk of one of the Hive Fleets (I think it was Behemoth but not certain) got dragged into the Warp when that one Emperor-class battleship suicide-rushed them and detonated its Warp core. Who can say where, or indeed, when, those chunks got spat back out of the Warp?

[@redsalamander9999]

Will Rogers Yes, and not just Behemoth, but Leviathan too, when the Great Rift opened up and swallowed the vast majority of the hive fleet. I'm certain there are mentions of how elements of it have been scattered across the galaxy in the wake of rift. Who's to say that some of them were not sent into the past or future as well?

[@palehorseman8386]

Just want to point out it's better to fling someone into the future. Theoretically you'd be better prepared for your next encounter then

[@owenbevt3]

It could be the other way around. If the theory of the old ones creating the tyranids is correct than these various creatures could be pre-existing creatures who's dna they harvested, combined and edited to create the tyranids.

[@Iampower123]

hmm, what if these xenos called zoats had biomorphs as a technology and then had it go awry and start infecting flora and phona creating the tyranids. Im think something along the lines of the relationship between zenomorphs and the engineers in the Alien movies

[@kosmiclawyer]

“Bayamoth”

[@40KTheories]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/q3K1qKWIjbKXZ9U

[@dans9097]

Bay-hay-moth(umlauts required) is more appropriate. Be-he-moth is a mispronunciation by a people who have literally no claim or understanding of Hebraic speech or pronunciation.

[@bow2572]

So basically, the Zotes are Species 8472 escaping Janeway

[@crispico4727]

I like how you pronounce behemoth

[@ZivTheWyrd]

Imperator Crispico you mean properly?

[@azarinevil]

There were a few hive ships lost to the Warp during certain events add that to the possibilities of chronomancy and one could potentially account for all the Tyranid bioforms already present. I'm sure between Necron short-sighted choices and Tzeentch having fun with an ever-changing , wet dream of an organism like a Tyranid.. you would find lots of reasons why they show up in odd places across time.

[@balistak6225]

Ooooo gotta love the nom nom aliens xD hey Remleiz I’m curious, are you doing any new lore videos to coincide with the new releases from GW?

[@komotheloresheep1158]

Ah the zoats

[@farkasabel]

What happens with surving tyranid units when a hive fleet is destroyed?

[@joevines3428]

They turn feral and disperse into the eco system.

[@SaaWeeWeeRockyStudio]

My theory is that the hive mind may have send multiple scouting fleets to multiple galaxies to find the one with the most biomass. At the the hive mind choose another a galaxy over the Milky Wave Galaxy because it had more biomass, but instead attacks the Milky Wave Galaxy when it detect Pharos's light and assist that the Milky Wave Galaxy will present a big threat to it. But on the other hand Necron's Chronomancers sending Tyranids into the distance past is probably the right thoery.

[@brandonaughtman9091]

Say 40K Theories, will there be any theories about daemons of Malal? He is a Chaos God, so he must have some domain of his own in the Warp? Or better yet, a theory on Daemons banished by their gods, like Scarbrand and The Masque?

[@mrgbulldozer1384]

Skarbrand got to big for his boots and tried to cheapshot khorne who in turn bitchslapped him so hard that he went a little insane

[@majormajorasic]

Malal is basically Chaos Undivided, he's the essence of Chaos in the warp, can't ever be truly killed or removed, just put in the nursing home.

[@IronWarhorsesFun]

one word: MECHARACHNIDS!

[@rm2kking]

According to the Word Bearers trilogy, there is at least one Zoat imprisoned within the Dark City of Commorragh (or perhaps it was the slave pens of a Dark Eldar ship, I don’t quite recall). Dark Apostle Marduk sees it as he’s escaping the laboratory of a Homunculus. It is described fully as a semi-cybernetic, heavily muscled, reptilian centauroid creature. It’s also said one of the Demiurg was in an adjacent cell, so it’s likely intended as an Easter egg. Still pretty cool though.

[@ArchonSeachmall]

Didn't know the "h" in Bahemoth is silent.

[@Kreevox]

Idk if you're being sarcastic, but it isn't. Remleiz has a bunch of weird pronunciations in his videos

[@spiritvdc5109]

Fun fact, his pronunciation is accidentally pretty close to the original Hebrew, in which the "h" is very soft, so "behemoth" would be pronounced closer to "beyamoth"

[@granziii12]

Tyranids who began as spores or whatever who got separated from the hive and became out of the range of the hive mind and live uninterrupted by any significant threats would mutate to become a beacon for the hive as well as begin a new hive fleet so the invasion could already be started from within. In a nutshell, these separate tyranids would grow to become an engine of reproduction as well as a beacon to any other hives in the area. If you have say, 4 tyranids on 4 separate planets that live, they will grow in the same way but gain mutations based on their surroundings and the dangers of their planet. They would sense other hives as they all grew in size, number and presence. This would spark an even greater rate of mutation, new forms, new abilities, an even greater presence to each hive. They would branch out to other planets. Probing for potential food sources to further develop and advance newer forms to aid the hive as they communicate between the other hives to attack said planet and gain a stronger presence and finally merge into one giant hive fleet with a presence strong enough to attract the attention of the closest hive fleet on the outside fringe. After that it becomes a giant game of telephone where one hive fleet communicates to the others and they report through the chain of hives before it quickly reaches... The Big One...

[@AsbestosMuffins]

legend has it there was an earth chronomancer who built a time traveling device out of a crude pattern of Terra Age transportation vehicle, and managed to travel back and forth. Could he have accidentally transported tyranids from the future back to the past?

[@demilung]

I love the idea of Necron time shenanigans being to blame

[@Zaprozhan]

My guess is either an early attempt at invasion, or a lost hive fleet blundered into the galaxy. Weakened, disorientated, or wounded, it was unable to sustain the momentum of a full-scale nom-nom, and scattered, splintered and degraded into the far-flung species and variations mentioned.

[@Matt-md5yt]

I got a question, What is Sly Morbo's Background origin? could he be a lost Primarch like rumors said?

[@jaega4247]

In one of the first three books of the Horus Hersey series, members of the Emperor's children legion (among them Lucius, who would later be known as the Eternal) fight alien creatures that are very much described as Hormagaunts. I think the theory stands, that these creatures, along with the Kraken of Fenris, the Catachan Devil and many more, were part of a much earlier tendril of the Hive fleets. Most likely they were merely scouting parties, and couldn't pose a real threat to the warring species of the milky way galaxy, and they were eventually destroyed, or lost contact with the Hive mind, with the few survivors becoming feral.

[@Rawkit_Surgeon]

0:29 I declare this video, AWESOME!

[@mattgrandich3977]

The Shelled Slasher! I remember that xeno from the old Xeno Biologis article on GW’s website about creating your own xenos creatures.

[@DaimoHope]

Also the music used in the background reminds me of Metroid

[@lusians3]

ther could have beenn a forgoten hive fleet during height of dark age of technolgy. since humanity, aeldari empires and posibly other xenos civilisations woud be ath their peak strenght thus tyranid treath would be while great much much less than it is 41st milenium. it would also partialy explain mankinds decision to completly switch ower to men of irion as means of warfare. it would also explain creation of mechanivores or omniphages since they would be nearly prefect counters to tyranid invasion. Beacon itself also copuld explained by this since it was either ar means of lure when mayor powers of galaxy were ready to destroy them, was used in some way or maner to hide milkyway galaxy and confuse them or was creation of civilisation or faction over run by genestealer infiltrators and would call hive fleets towards milkyway galaxy as it happened in battle for sotha

[@edboi6929]

Me: Googles the word Bayo-moth

[@spiritvdc5109]

Fun fact, his pronunciation is accidentally pretty close to the original Hebrew, in which the "h" is very soft, so "behemoth" would be pronounced closer to "beyamoth"

[@dansakalis3986]

Is it possible that a tyranid invasion happened and was defeated during the Dark Age of Technology?

[@streetfighterguy1909]

I would like to think this is the true history of what happened, seeing as the technology during this period was the pinnical of science. The men of iron totally dominated the first Tyranid incursions into the galaxy destroying causing the Hive Mind to stop further attacks until given a better opertunity with those creatures that remained becoming feral monsters across multiple planets.

[@ed8212]

robots and ai would be the perfect counter to Tyranids... shame it won't happen

[@Triumph263]

@@ed8212 T'au: are we a joke to you?

[@ed8212]

@@Triumph263 yes.

[@megarural3000]

More theory, albeit pure conjecture. If a hive fleet or scout fleet entered the galaxy towards the end of the Age of Strife it may have not been able to communicate with other such fleets outside the galaxy. And as the fleet lost cohesion due to warp storms it could have fragmented with only the strongest hive synapse creatures able to maintain control. But this control was on a timer, when Slannesh was birthed the mightiest of these creatures would have fallen to the psychic shock wave within the interstellar medium. Colossus would have been a follow up searching as to why contact was lost with the initial group. This may help explain the feral xenos with Tyranid stock predating the Great Crusade.

[@dennissuijkerbuijk8065]

nice video. loads of details i didnt know about. ANOTHER THEORY. About nids being present in the 30k universe and before. it had been suggested that the Tyranids is a biological weapon unleased by the old ones that fled our galaxy after the War In Heaven. If this would be the case perhaps these lifeforms that where in the galaxy before the hive fleets entered our galaxy are prototype spiecies of sorts?

[@RocketHarry865]

If the Tyranids are biological weapons unleashed by surviving Old Ones then its likely that the Hive Mind is the mechanism the Old Ones use to control the Tyranids and Hive Fleet Colossos may represent what the Tyranids were before the Old Ones created the Hive Mind to bind the Hive Fleets together under their control.

[@AD_Gray]

Absolutely mind blowing :O

[@xelmarik2671]

The theory I subscribe to is that the Tyranids are another creation of the "Old Ones". My theory as the the Old Ones actually survived the War in the Heavens and left the Milky Way to regroup and one day return. Under this theory the Tyranids are their creations sent ahead to transform the Galaxy the way they want it to be when they arrive and also to eliminate the Necron threat. Creatures on planets that seem to be of Tyranid relation are possibly early forms of the Tyranids the Old Ones created before their departure or the creature were there and the Old Ones used them as their experimentation subjects before their departure. After their departure they eventually perfected what is known as the Tyranids to fulfill their purposes. Basically, the Tyranids are the Old Ones self destruct button so they can restart their plans with a fresh plate.

[@oportorat6127]

the first hive fleet was actually oroboris

[@okolepuka808]

The best lore channel by far

[@UnsoberIdiot]

Arch Warhammer.

[@Gnomkiller2000]

Always thought the old ones created the tyranids to wipe all other lifeforms from existence aka rebooting the system and once it was rebooted leaving certain forms behind to recreate a natural functioning feral world which would lead to races evolving in a normal way eradicating the old ones error of playing creators xD

[@sanninjiraiya]

Just to throw this out there/workshop the idea: Given the Kroot's unstable genetic makeup and ability to direct their evolution, it's possible that they may have been the origin point for the tyranids or their ancestors and experienced some dark age/disruption to their civilization leading to a splintering of the genome.

[@squidgyfishy]

Could Zoats have engineered the Tyranids? Many tens of thousands of years ago? Zoats could have been effectively the norm queens and were sending out these disposable troops to other galaxies to explore. But they evolved too quickly for the Zoats to control, and evolved their own norm queens (or perhaps some Zoats themselves became the true norm queens), and the Zoats were overpowered and the survivors fled. The story they told those sentient races they met whilst they fled from their creations was that they were the ones who were "enslaved". That would explain why Zoats could use technology, and why they could use the biotech of the Tyranids as well.

[@lordinquisitor6233]

Perhaps the tyranids sent scouting forces (a bit like probs) to assess the number of lifeforms in the galaxy and created new tyranid bioforms in preparation for the invasion

[@joshuablakeney2983]

We can look to mass effect for answers. Replace the reapers with tyrannids and there you go. Every so many millions of years whenever the psychic energy of the galaxy grows enough to attract them, they will come and devour everything and then leave to wait till their galaxy garden regrows.

[@Xogroroth666]

It would be logical that "feralised units", when these feel their ancestor "Directive Prime Mind", or the Tyranid Master Brain, whatever it may turn out to be, would be re-integrated into the Hive. In the end, the Tyranid are a single being, call it Legion, or, "The One That Is Many": A biological form of The Borg in Star Trek.

[@Ranmus]

I should probably set out that nid bug zapper again... thought the infestation was done for.

[@Imperator_Chrysalis]

What's the name of the intro song?

[@PapaJafari]

Theory: the Tyranids consume and wipe clean entire planets to sustain themselves but the hive Mind also seems to be self aware enough to realise that a barren universe is pretty bad for Thier survival. As such the Tyranids roll around the universe consuming much life but leaving some planets which are only just beginning to bud lifeforms. This way by the time they have moved on and come back around again there will be much new life to harvest. The recent appearance of the hive fleets may simply be Thier return and it might not even be the first time they have come back...

[@thobsandst]

Necrons are the GREATEST!

[@blandedgear9704]

I blame the great old ones, when H Mind not so capable, notice psychic activity from Great Old Ones, and send weak scout organisms that mess up, get blasted but not entirely, or whatever. Maybe Norn Queens destroyed?

[@Robustacap]

I like to think that the Tyranid never came to our Galaxy, but rather Milky Way moved into Tyranid Space. As I like to think Tyranid are the explanation to the Great Attractor, even Dark Matter itself..