The GHOST OF ROLLS GRACIE! WHY HELIO GRACIE IS TO BLAME FOR KRON'S FAILURE

[@thataintnomoonsucka]

Who is this dude? How do I not know him? Knows his stuff and I could listen to him all day. Renato Babalu does not get enough credit. He combined them very well. Underrated. Do we know for a fact Kron didn't train wrestling? I believe he trianed at Steve Maxwell's academy in Philly for a while. Steve is a decorated wrestler and they have Judo classes. So do we know for a fact he didn't train takedowns? Sorry for the rambling haha.

[@TheUmmahFightCamp]

@thataintnomoonsucka: First I thank you for your compliment! As for who I am: I come from a family of black bare knuckle boxers, having my first bare knuckle match at 12. Later went to karate when that also was bare knuckle. Eventually wrestled and founded a group in 1976 to cross train Bare knuckle MMA. That would be 17 years or so BEFORE the UFC. Had never heard of youtube and one day a former student told me that people were teaching that sliding around on their "A" was the greatest martial art ever and that I should post some videos to rescue them from their naivete. That was 12 years ago, and when I get bored with the ignorance, I don't post. if there is something I want to say, I do. As for Kron and wrestling, perhaps he "did" some, but like anything that involves fighting, that which is instinctual can be counted on. His wrestling is not. Welcome, Sayf Carman

[@TheUmmahFightCamp]

@thataintnomoonsucka: You have not heard of me because I am the myth buster lol. People do not promote myth busters.

[@thataintnomoonsucka]

@@TheUmmahFightCamp I have studied the Gracies extensively and you are on point. If Rolls was here, we'd probably have a more well rounded bjj. I will say the academies I have trained with are incorporating more standup, which is good. It always baffled me why a groundfighting art would neglect getting it to the ground. I am thououghly enjoying your videos, man.

[@thataintnomoonsucka]

@@TheUmmahFightCamp What inspired you to do so much research. I also believe Carlson's side does not get the credit it deserves. He would let anyone train with him and they evolved the techniques. If you watch Helio, it's all cross chokes from guard. No disrespect to him, but I do not think ''most'' of bjj came from him. I would say Carlson's team, Rolls, and Rickson. What do you think?

[@TheUmmahFightCamp]

@@thataintnomoonsucka Actually I NEVER did research on the Gracies lol! Let me explain: I started boxing at 9 years old and that was in 1970. I started wrestling in high school in 1976 and since I have always been very proud of my black heritage (The by product of the 60s), I kept in contact with any great black martial artist and what he was doing in his career. I once went to a seminar ran by a Darrell Gholar who was a great black wrestler in college who after deciding to fight in Vale Tudo in Brazil was hired to teach the Brazilian Top Team made up of several good fighters including the Nogueira brothers, a young Victor Belfort, Bustamante, Mario Sperry (Team captain) and others. Because I kept in touch with the people who joined me at that seminar, I was told what was going on in Brazil from 1987. That included the Gracies, Chute Boxe and other groups. All by simply telephone. Never really thought any of the info mattered to be honest. The info only came as part of talk about family and friends. I only mentioned what was said after I realized, most people had no clue and got their info from unreliable sources.

[@RueTheDay001]

Good video. Rolls was key in the development of BJJ. But it goes back even earlier, to Carlson Gracie, who Rolls originally studied under. Carlson famously said "My jiu jitsu has nothing to do with Gracie Jiu Jitsu...Gracie Jiu Jitsu is old......they say strength doesn't count but it does...Carlson Gracie Jiu Jitsu is a combination." Carlson was the real fighter. He fought 18 vale tudo matches in the 1950s. Helio's "fights" in the 1930s were mostly just gi grappling matches and Carlos never fought anyone.

[@atshabal]

Rolls has cross trained and incotporated elements of judo,wrestling,sambo he has modernised Gjj at his time.

[@mr.xavierrises]

I think one of the things hurting bjj is the lack of pins for a win. Every grappling art has pinning as a way to win.

[@MarcoRico-ws1pd]

That's also its strength. If pinfalls ended a match, Royce never would have beaten Dan Severn

[@TheGoddamnJefe]

This is ESSENTIAL. As a black belt in Judo and BJJ, I can tell you that Judo has taught me better pinning control.

[@cesaralvesdemoraes3187]

Nah, that's just not the game. How would pinning help if they can't even get top position?

[@mr.blackman3312]

Lmao ive been waiting for you to talk about this. Always a pleasure hearing from you. God bless

[@TheUmmahFightCamp]

@mr.blackman3312: Had to figure out what I wanted to say about it. I sometimes give other people the chance to say something other than "he lost" or "he won". LOL

[@DouglasBuenoGomes]

MMA has evolved far beyond the Gracie family level, they are like a good basketball team from the 90s but the world has evolved and tactically the sport has evolved we are in 2024 now.

[@WolframtheBlessed3499]

Very insightful, Sifu. I think you are definitely on to something.

[@Italiangentleman2394]

Absolutely agree with you ! Rolls death was not good for jiu jitsu. I also feel bad for Kron

[@sebastiandavid2546]

Excellent as always 👍

[@HouseOfDues]

Dead on point with this Bro! The only pure BJJ is in GI. Everything NoGi is Luta Livre (which we all know is Catch based) Is and always has been. All of a sudden everyone is putting out Catch techniques in BJJ like is something new and they created it. I made this statement on a platform about Gordon (which he was on) in which he just responded with, “😂😂😂😂😂😂”. Smh. Gordon is and has been using Catch techniques for quite some time now to establish his dominance. If you don’t know Catch or any other Wrestling you wouldn’t know. So the BJJ community sucks it up as some advance technique, and he along with others are putting it out as such now. I don’t believe he’s that ignorant not to know what he’s teaching without researching but he does get it all from Professor X, and may just take it and run with it. I get it. Its a business now too and it Marketing a brand. I get it. I love it because it proves Catch and Wrestling is dominant overall (and thats NOT to take away from his BJJ skills) but its so obvious where the adjustment are made in his game if/ when you watch. Just acknowledge the origin man - (but we know John knows)💯😏

[@TheUmmahFightCamp]

@HouseOfDues: LOL! So true!

[@J40JesusIsLord]

Interesting points you made about Rickson, he never did go out of his way to fight the top fighters when he did MMA, probably because he knew his weaknesses and was trying to just maintain his legend.

[@jasonfairbanks4714]

Very informative. Thank you! I see Kron differently now. Kind of sad!

[@legitprowrestling6653]

Outstanding video! Thank you sir!

[@HerreraCam]

RIP, Master Rolls. Oss.

[@Dungeonofman]

Be well Sayf glad your still rising up

[@Jack_Tisson83]

This whole thing with Helio Gracie seems to be something that happens on a regular basis within martial arts, I’ve seen wing chun guys complain the Thai leg kick isn’t in their style so they can’t use it, I remember back in the early 0s my boxing coach used to tell me to not throw an overhand right because it wasn’t a “real punch” -- even if it landed hard, It seems some people get so attached to style that they become attached to the structure of their art and therefore limits themselves, due to believing that deviation from the style is a form of disloyalty--it’s crazy,

[@TheUmmahFightCamp]

@Jack_Tisson83: So true mate!

[@thepierianspring2353]

Great video! When Helio denied wrestling to be incorporated into BJJ BJJ turned in on itself. Now we have poor wrestling in BJJ and butt flopping and scooting across the floor on your butt is the takedown system. Pathetic.

[@victorgarza6084]

I enjoy all your videos sensei. Very indepth

[@neocloudmarts9613]

It just shows that bjj has reached its peak; like other martial arts people have already figured out the style. UFC Mma made the Gracie Bjj but the irony is that it is the downfall

[@FightStylin]

My great friend and first main instructor was Brazilian who is an amazing older black belt. But, he doesn't have any wrestling. So my move to an MMA gym after he left saw to it that our grappling game would have a fusion of intense wrestling. My game became more complete once I got it. Without wrestling, an amazing black belt can just be held in position. It was pretty sad watching Krons last fight. Something isn't right with him.

[@Wade-1]

You're right about wrestling. Mark Schultz supposedly went an hour with Rickson before getting submitted. Schultz was an elite wrestler but had never done submission grappling and never heard of BJJ or GJJ at that time. One of the main reasons Marcelo Garcia was so good was because of his Judo game incorporated into his BJJ. The arm drags, trips, etc. Gotta have something with takedowns with you BJJ. Another reason most or the Dagestani guys crush American wrestlers and BJJ guys in MMA. The wrestling is on level but Sambo gives them the trips, and throws.

[@TheUmmahFightCamp]

@Wade-1 The main reason MG is the GOAT is because of wrestling infusion not Judo! He does not do many body throws from Judo. Add to that Wrestling has trips! Upper body take downs!

[@saullopez3073]

Gracie ego prevents them from adapting to the new age of fighting, it is why they always get decimated in a modern day mma fight, ppl know how to counter bjj because they train against it, this ain’t the pre 2000s

[@Gottiline_Ace]

This is part of the reason why I joined our Carlos Machado affiliated school. No ego and arrogance. Learn and use what works and makes you a better martial artist and competitor. Not "staying true to 'pure BJJ'".

[@neocloudmarts9613]

Also it is strange that their is a belief that, just because you have Bjj skills it doesn’t mean you are (elite or otherwise) fighter, neither does genetics prove you are a beast. They need to drift off into the sunset and believe in their legendary status.

[@khairt1731]

Dont feel sorry for Kron, Shaykh. His father Rickson Gracie told him how to train. He lived very close by to the Inosanto Academy and his farher Rickson TOLD HIM to go train muay thai, silat, kali and all the other arts but he refused to listen to Rickson. Thats why Rickson has been very very mad at his son Kron and they havent talked in years. Thats why Kron moved to another state and started his own bjj gym there. Its very unfortunate. I think everything went LEFT for Kron when he started hanging out with the Diaz brothers. Kron did way better in his last fight tho, better than the one before that.

[@TheUmmahFightCamp]

@khairt1731: Rickson is on record saying the only thing you need to win in MMA is GRACIE JJ. Helio made sure that Rorian and Rickson would only use the classic BJJ and that was ok before wrestling made it's big splash and learned what was needed to pull of a submission. Now, they better fuse the 2!

[@khairt1731]

​@@TheUmmahFightCamp ​ I believe he used to say that but he also said it himself that he trained muay thai and the other arts in order to get used to their movement so he wont be surprised in the actual fight. I just know that Kron wasnt listening to Rickson. He didnt want to learn muay thai and kali and catch wrestling from Dan Inosantos established students. Rickson didnt like him hanging around the weed smokers Diaz bros. Thats why you dont see Rickson in his corner. They dont talk at all.

[@TheUmmahFightCamp]

@@khairt1731 I can understand rickson not wanting him around the Diaz brothers lol. The Diaz brothers are ONLY good for the Diaz brothers! I will say this, Mr. Inosanto is not the one to train with for mma! I think he is the nicest guy, but not the one.

[@rippedup4546]

Relson Gracie said all you need is Gracie Jiu Jitsu in MMA. Rickson believes Modern MMA goes against the philosophy of his Jiu Jitsu. Which is no stand up from the ground and no rounds. He wants to tire out the bigger guy and go for the submission

[@RadicalTrivia]

BJJ teacher from Pennsylvania here. We wrestle.

[@Gottiline_Ace]

Their arrogance is their downfall. Even Royce had to shoot takedowns in UFC1 to use his "Shoeshitsoo". 😂

[@wanabisufi8843]

Brother when is your new channel out?

[@TheUmmahFightCamp]

@wanabisufi8843: IA soon. I will be posting one video on this channel in 24 hours that will give an idea as to what kind of material will be on the new one.

[@DouglasBuenoGomes]

In the last 25 years I haven't seen any relevant Gracie in the UFC, Royce Gracie tried to come back but lost easily against Wrestler Matt Hughes.

[@ignacionemarich1877]

The more the Jiu Jitsu community strays away from the gracies the better it is for the evolving of the discipline. In about 10-15 years we will see the fruits of american wrestling merging with the brazilian Jiu Jitsu, eventually, the west will reign again in the MMAs realm. Until then, we will have to endure watching the Krons, Chase Hoopers, etc..

[@momentum8640]

Nice video.

[@DouglasBuenoGomes]

The Gracie family was important in creating the UFC but let's be honest they haven't been relevant since the 90s, When was the last time a Gracie was UFC champion in 1993?

[@DCJiuJitsuGeelong]

Helio was not an innovator, roll was but Carlson was the biggest influence and evolution in jiu jitsu Jiu jitsu needs to adopt the Carlson method

[@pedrogarciasantisteban7808]

Hence they need Judo or wrestling otherwise gjj is useless

[@wingoreviewsboxingandmma3667]

Just like the stories in scripture, generations in the present and future paying for the sins of a previous generation.