The Hidden Costs Of Owning An E-Bike - What Is The Real Cost Of EMTB? [REVISITED]

[@embn]

What's your view on this subject? Do you have any tips to help make the components last even longer?

[@embn]

@Click Bait we just read the comments and thought to address the subject a little further. Things such as depreciation and component pricing will change the figure massively. How much do you think you spend on your bike per year?

[@CrazyBikerGuy]

I think what we established is this is case by case topic and everyone is different and this revisited isnt great either. I couldn't care about the first one but the fact you've remade it and still telling people it costs over £300 odd is ridiculous. You made this video cause the people who asked for it want to get into it and people that are getting into it are more than likely riding mostly pavement or light trail. I've put a easy and basic guide in another comment so I wont explain it here. Imo the video should come down and have a open discussion about costs with normies. Majority of people dont have trials of any sort and the ones who have some trials are shared trails. Most will ride these bikes for commuting take make life easier and cheaper, will do a day or two a month on a trails or rougher than pavement trail, looking a new chain some oil and thats about it, mabey a tube/sealant. There will be that percentage who will want to go out and ride in the woods and trails and therefore they're more than likely already got basic know how and knowledge of trails from non ebikes. These people will mostly have a good understanding and will use the bike harder but for shorter (weekenders). Then you have actively pursuing trails and explorers who will spend more than all (hardcore enthusiasts or pros like yourself who get paid to ride). The cost will be higher cause it's used to make you money so is expected in parts but labour should be low as you'll do it yourself. Theres so much to take in when doing one of these and sitting and just screen cutting to a load of people isnt helping no one. 1 : grouping people (novice, amateur, weekender, enthusiast, hardcore and pro) to separate the cost per group. 2 : Knowledge and know how to fix and maintain (this could be a friend, family or a partner ETC) 3 : Equipment they'll have to fix and repair 4 : price of parts for that group and what would labour be roughly if required by breaking it in range low to hi. And I could go on. Poorly done and was a quick video to put out (sure getting people filmed and all was a nightmare we know that, been there done it). Just think it needs a hard reconsider or live with what's been said and move on. Dont know why it had to be revisited, the first one was done in a EMBN way as you with these videos and should have been left. If you have to worry so much a video gets taken down then its time to really look at the subject and why it was heated and think it out.

[@johnoakleymusic]

The sole problem with the first video was everything was taken to the extreme/max and worst case scenario which amplified the exaggeration of the total cost. It should’ve been based on the average rider which would then reflect the general consensus and public point of view would’ve been far more understood and appreciative of realism. However this is a good video which for the honesty and listening to other perspectives along with other opinions and sharing those thoughts brings it more into line with the reality of it all so thank you for trying. Can only applaud you for this video

[@Dan-km1dz]

@@johnoakleymusic I agree with this comment 👍 but also what's the average rider? Some people have hub drive hard tails and others have 10 grand bikes. I ride once a week, sometimes two because I work in the week but some people ride every day and don't look after their bike. I'd hate to know what a worst case scenario actually is

[@Crosshatch1212]

Do you need to worry about water effecting you're torque sensor when riding in the rain ,ife been tòd it effects the bikes motor ,thnks hoping for an answer cheers ,

[@HoudiniHawaii]

My dad flew airplanes, a big hole in the sky where you pour money. Many of my friends have boats , big holes in the water where you pour money. Others have Quads, big holes in the sand where you pour money. I consider my Ebike just a little hole in the dirt where I pour money. It's more relevant to ask how many smiles to the dollar are you getting?

[@kevinmurtagh3434]

Great answer

[@TheSydguy30]

Not really relevant as the video was more on affordability, not enjoyability without regard for money, which is more where you comment lies :)

[@adrianhrusca4067]

And health...

[@uncrunch398]

Even compared to any other powered mode of transportation to get somewhere important. If it's within range (round trip if you can't plug in at the other end) you're saving over anything else.

[@pascalt2708]

Perfect answer. Have the same thinking :)

[@bikaliptus]

I think that we should talk about the cost per 1.000km and not per year. As you mention, depends on where and how much you ride. For me, the most important is cleaning and lubing, specially the drive train. I wash my bike after every ride (unless is really just a slight dust) and lube it after dry. On my Scott Strike eRide 940 (factory settings), i've made 600km so far, just measured the chain and the gauge don't fit with 0.75mm. This means that the chain is in perfect conditions. Keeping suspensions clean and lubed also add long life time and servicing intervals. Washing takes you 10min and lubing just 2min so, why not saving money?

[@nxadventures9510]

Ebikes can have issues with water. Bosch is know to die if you wash it too much.

[@uncrunch398]

@@nxadventures9510 So, use a damp cloth with not quite enough moisture to drip or splash? Or wrap sensitive parts so they're water tight before, then unwrap when finished.

[@GC16199]

@@uncrunch398 Dielectric grease in the connectors and plugs and you don't have any issues, and I've ridden through pouring rain, large waterpuddles and small rivers. And always wash my bike after a ride. And am using a Bosch motor

[@uncrunch398]

@@GC16199 Nice. Thanks!

[@GC16199]

@@uncrunch398 Also learned it from a KZbin comment from a guy that works on fishing trawlers. 😁👍

[@TALLNDIRTY]

Not being on the power while shifting has been very helpful in allowing me not to needlessly wear my drivetrain prematurely. 3000 kms and the gears ⚙ still look good.

[@SimonBauer7]

thats how i have over 7000kms on the og casette and it still works perfectly fine i did go through 2 chains though

[@embn]

@Click Bait They do have this on the Alfine DI2 hubs when connected to a Shimano system

[@SimonBauer7]

@Click Bait some bosch motors cut power when you shift they somehow sense this but i ride yamaha so i just lay off the power during shifting

[@JoLe1991]

@@SimonBauer7 i have tested two different 3rd gen cx motors, one felt like it woulds slightly back off power during shifting, the other would crunch through the gears. from an analytical point of view there is no possibility of a specific shift sensing mechanism other than a change in pedal torque. there is no sensor on the shift lever nor the shift cable. Bafang mid drives have a dedicated shift sensor touching the shift cable and cutting motor power completely for a fraction of a second as soon as the cable moves ever so slightly. this makes a huge difference in shifting smoothness and almost completely removes stress from the chain and cassette. in my opinion all systems should have that complete cutoff.

[@JoLe1991]

@Click Bait yeah, a simple kill switch, so every rider has the choice to either destroy or protect his gears and chain. You can't use the torque sensor to "back off" during shifting, because sometimes you gotta pedal to shift gears, and unless downhill, no pedaling happens without torque...

[@VadikRamm]

I ride trails 6 months a year and ride almost every day, except those days when it rains. I do around 5K miles per season. All I need to get through the season is: 1 Full Tune Service in the beginning of the season. (Suspension oils and pivot greasing) 1 pair of new tires. 1 set of brake pads. 1 Cassette. 2 Chains.

[@Vanadium]

That is crazy, as a non E-MTB dude this would not even fit for my Enduro. Depending on racing or big alpine trips tires are down to 4 each season. One chain each year without failures. I bought my third this year and I always buy the xx1. Deraileur hangars a few each year. Brake pads, also depends but if I want the most performance out of them I fuck up every two weeks two sets. When the autumn hits. Fork lower leg every 30h ,full 100h meaning mostly each month a lower leg. Rear is a coil like the front but can handle it for 125h for the full service. All bearing including wheels and headset mostly a year. Depending on how hard I am on the bike some spokes, other bits. Two ergon grips each year, maybe a handle bar each year. Since I got the Direttissima 3 years ago I don't replace brakes but befor 1-3 sets a year. Deraileurs , also depends where I am zero to 4 a year. Rims are solid Newmen A.30 Advanced 29" carbon, 30mm internal but I bought a custom hand made set out of hope / Dt hubs with j-bend spokes and brass nipples, no replacement. So I spent way more then you on a regular bike and that is only one of my bikes.

[@magicmacify]

@@Vanadium Dude chill

[@Vanadium]

@@magicmacify I am crisp

[@rezenclowd3]

@@Vanadium Shoot in 1 year of non-e-bike I have been through 6 tiries (none damaged, just worn) 1 chain, 10 brake pad sets, 1 cassette (smashed on rock)

[@Raumance]

1 tune up isn't sufficient for 5000 miles.

[@MrWombat1975]

I would say I spend about £150 a year, I go through 4 chains, cassette, rear tire, and brake pads. Also shop around for best deals if a cassette is on sale for your bike buy it, then you have it when you need it, I have bought cassettes in the past up to 40% off

[@Digital.Done.Right.]

I ride cross country and have a Gates belt and a Rohloff internal hub. All super expensive to buy but nearly zero maintenance. Tires and brake pads are the main costs. So far, 4000km this year and 2 sets of tires and 3 sets of brake pads.

[@stevejones7956]

We need to get on Gates and Rohloff more for sure...

[@GC16199]

Would enduro style riding and muddy conditions work as well with your setup? Still waiting for an motor and gearbox integration on an e bike. That flimsy derailleur hanging in the vincinity of rocks and drivetrain prone to mud, water and dust is definitely not ideal.

[@Jeppelelle]

GMBN should do this video too for "normal" MTB:s, i bought my first real bike 3 years ago, sure i had MTB:s before when i grew up but the one i got now as an adult is on another level & i actually am pretty surprised about the TCO, it's like when you go to the store: "Im just gonna buy 3-4 small things for 2 bucks each" but then all of a sudden the receipt is like 100 bucks & you have no idea how on earth you racked that up 😂 Same with MTB:s, between tires, new brake rotors, pads, 12 speed cassettes, front ring, pedals, shoes, bibs, kneepads etc etc. I think alot of newcommers to the "sport" don't realise how much all this adds up so would be nice to inform them 👍

[@appealinbanana]

John Walker, what a dude! That’s what’s great about being in your 50’s. You enjoy maintenance as much as riding. I sleep better when my bike is ‘mint’ in the garage waiting for the next ride. And my local trails have 8 types of sh*t to throw at you.

[@simonc4810]

This video illustrates one of my gripes with ebikes - the industry has just adapted bicycle components which, if (like me) your ebike is also a way to stop unnecessary car use, wear rates and servicing frequency require improvement. My car needs a service every 20000 miles. Brakes and tyres last around the same distance. Transmission and bearings are good for 100000 miles plus. Shocks and springs are maintenance-free for a similar duration. Surely the future of ebikes includes enclosed transmissions and spoke-free wheels? Should they be adapting motorcycle technology? Covid has probably stalled progress because trade shows are where ingenuity and mass-production normally cross paths.

[@bmartinot]

Agree with you 100%, the pinion mgu looks like an amazing solution but the bike industry seems to be doing a good job of ignoring it completely, including this channel.

[@normandb8249]

I do agree with the cost I believe Chris is spot on Riding E bike aggressively, maintaining it daily riding it 5+ times a week Punishing the Ebike having a great time ! Careful not to shift under load Sometimes unavoidable I'm I pass all kinds of E bikes riders Most not on same level & who just lollipop around Great replacment for the old motocross days Where's I go through 5 rear tires ,3 fronts a year they go through one! Sram gx wireless Eagle xx cassette Eagle xx chain Trek rail 9 Bosh motor Rocks Cheers Keep up the GREAT WORK THANKYOU

[@kingerz]

Five aggressive rides a week is a bit on the hard side ey.

[@paulsweet6235]

who rides 5 x a week? pros maybe

[@christopherroberts5011]

If you’re spending 5k then you probably can afford 300 quid on parts

[@girlsdrinkfeck]

im amazed the money people willing to spend buying a prebuild bike !!! must be a 200% profit margin, its not hard at all whatsoever to build your own Ebike

[@6996Gunslinger]

i keep hearing this bs on every item and its just not true

[@girlsdrinkfeck]

@@6996Gunslinger eh ?

[@spuddo123]

The more you spend on maintenance, the better condition the bike will stay in for longer, so I think it evens out in the long run

[@cybereye2]

Very sensible video follow up. Obviously Looking after your chain plays a huge part in the amount of wear You'll have during the year. As we live in a cold\temperate climate (I'm from N Ireland), keeping your motor clean and dry is also crucial. How you clean your e MTB after a wet muddy ride will also enhance or negate it's longevity. I'm planning on buying my first e MTB in September or October and I'd like to say thanks for these videos. I'd rather not include depreciation in the equation because we expect our e MTBs to depreciate much more than an ordinary MTB for three reasons, firstly these being heavier we expect more wear and tear than normal and battery/motor care and secondly as we're quite new to e MTBs (10-12 years) the development and changes in battery/motor development has been simply phenomenal which means last year's model can fall far behind in terms of development. Finally many people new to e MTBs don't go on the steep learning curve needed to maintain an e MTB properly, thus second hand purchases show heavier depreciation, although supply and demand means we are probably paying more for a poorly maintained e MTB than we should.

[@Threadexpress]

A full dose of Rock and Roll blue wax lube on the chain every few rides, two years now and still no wear! Brake pads are getting down now, but zero costs in two years riding a few times a week (in drier New Zealand) Cheers Cliff

[@karlInSanDiego]

@11:40 But you can't have rear hub motor and Alfine IGH. AND IGH + middrive torque = broken/worn IGH. Of course you can keep the wattage low, and invest in a bulletproof IGH, but it's easy to break an IGH with homebuilt recipe.

[@gibfear]

Bigger cassettes won't actually increase the chain angle/"twist", if anything they will reduce it (chain is going farther to reach the release and engagement points than a small cassette)

[@Raven34gtr]

I'd love to know where these people are shopping to be paying over £1000 a year on parts and maintenance, I think its more service costs from the bike shops that boosts the price's up, I do all my maintenance myself and for my mates so that cuts the cost down by a hell of a lot, in 3 years I've only gone through one XT cassette, 2 chains, 1 set of brake pads and a set of tyres, I've probably paid out £260 in the last 3 years, if you look after your bike it will last longer, don't let your motor struggle when going up hills, have it in first or second gear, it's less torque on the motor, cassette and chain, less wear on everything. Learn how to do the basic things yourself, if you get stuck, look on KZbin on how to do it.

[@keithwestwood4640]

Great comments and the correct ethos...here here !

[@Jesse-2531]

Wel i am 6 months in on my e mbt (45kmh) and so far it's at 300€ a month + insurance🤔. But I had no tools and I drive 50km a day 30kmh average( yes I regularly schift on pauer). So I kann relate to 1000£ a year. Still a lot cheaper than a 🚗 😉

[@Raven34gtr]

@@Jesse-2531 yeah it's cheaper than a car to run, but on some things I can't believe how expensive they are, my bike tyres cost more than my Low Profile car tyres, that shouldn't be.

[@002device]

Since I got my Orbea Wild FS M10 Oct 20 I've spent circa £700. That's 1 new cassette and chainring, 5 chains, 1new rear wheel and a full bearing service. I've done 2000 miles and ride steep techy climbs and descents mostly through Scottish mud. Add in £200 for a suspension service due soon and you're looking at just under £1000.

[@hansottevanger4112]

I’m a. Maintenance man I’m still on my original cassette and chain after 2,000 km but I do mainly ride in dry conditions use my gears correctly so I am not overloading the drive system, oh and I’m on my second rear and soon be replacing the front tyre

[@thomasamos4055]

So nobody bothers servicing their nice suspension at the recommended intervals then?

[@thierrylerinckx1340]

Agreed, forego that maintenance and you are looking at much bigger costs.

[@TPV07]

no one

[@keithwestwood4640]

I've recently bought a trek powerfly 5,the costs of replacement parts has to be accepted as and when required..I've upgraded my bike and undertake as much maintenance as I'm able to do,the correct tools are key to this I ripped my speed sensor cable so replaced it myself as local shop want £50.00 p/h workstation time + parts...this job was easy to do..moral of this is if you can do it yourself you should..the money you save can be spent on upgrading if you so wish....

[@jap7856]

I have 2 eMTB's, Fezzrai Wire Peak Comp and Husky Mountain Cross-5. Do to the cost of replacing the 10-speed group set on the Wire Peak Comp and removed and sold the 11-Speed group set that was on my Mountain Cross-5. Installed a 9-speed group set on the Mountain Cross-5, as chains and cassettes are going to be cheaper to replace, then 10, 11, 12 speed parts. It seems that shifting cables, chains, cassettes, brake pads and tires are what eMTBs just wear-out over a 500 to 1000 mile riding time frame.

[@daithidebarradb]

I used 2 sets of cassette chain and front chainring with 1500km rode on road and trails.

[@JohnBaxendale]

600 miles on a Merida One Twenty 9.8000 (non-eBike, SRAM drivetrain) and not had to change anything, no visible signs of wear. I average about 30km's a ride with around 800 metres of elevation each ride. I live in an area where it's dusty/sandy/gritty and ride throughout the season - quick rinse with a hosepipe after a ride and an occasional squirt of oil, no problems.

[@adambcvg]

2.5 years in, one tyre (ripped a hole in it), one XT 11Sp cassette (£52), two SLX chains, a set of pedals, two sets of pads, two sets of frame bushes and I changed the frame bearings too just because I had it apart. One freehub on warranty. Zero mechanic cost as I do it myself. Very similar costs to my old non-ebike but I've done 4x the mileage and height.

[@motorcyclesandthings8633]

What that guy says about maintenance is quite true, and extends to cars and motorbikes, but depends on your ability cheers shane uk 🇬🇧

[@powertapping]

I commented on the first video. In my update I want to include cost of breakage. I ride pretty hard in the mountains a combo of DH, enduro, technical single track and I’ve destroyed 2 derailures. I hit a 1000 miles and had my shocks serviced $150 new chain and that’s it. Tires are close to needing replacement drivetrain is ok. So as John said take care of your gear and your costs can be kept pretty low except for breakage.

[@sterpumihai]

yamaha pw-x from 2019, motor failure at 7000 Km, out of warranty, motor replaced in 1 day at bike shop for 1000€ (display also replaced as the one on the bike was incompatible with the new motor which was had a newer hardware revision)

[@scotty3da]

Prices might be an issue, but what about availablity, I can't get a 12 speed shimano cassette anywhere at the moment !!

[@Djrblocks360]

Honestly, I have put about 150 miles on my new Canyon Spectral on...I clean the bike almost after every ride. the chain gets cleaned every other ride. I don't see really any wearing at all...I can't imagine that it will cost more than a few hundred dollars a year and it also depends if your riding less or more.

[@copisetic1104]

Have owned an Evelo for almost 5years, replaced tires and brake pads. I ride 2-4 times a week city urban riding. About the same as a regular bike.

[@Thebowber]

I've done 1800ish miles on my Cube hardtail and I'm still on the original cassette, virtually no signs of wear. I'm on my 4th chain, 3rd set of brake pads and 3rd rear tyre (last one changed due to a huge slit from a rock) had it for 10 months so I guess I need to be spending more.

[@garybrown5769]

4000 miles on grx on a road bike, still shifts like new after a clean - you’ll be fine mate , hardly worn in !!

[@howardrathbone2120]

Hi, so my take on the last gentleman’s opinion is that when you hit the hill go for the boost button rather than first gear, stick in the mid range gears and let the motor take the strain and put less stress on the chain! And save money…Win all round really, cheers H in Oz

[@thexardas8395]

I think it really depends on a riding style. I am sure someone riding easy local trails can spend 200-300 a year and someone else going for big jumps hard descends and beating the shit out of a bike might need to replace whole thing once twice a year. IMHO time vs money dude is 100% on a point. Maintain your bike and DIY then cost will be low. I do everything myself and save tons of money on mechanics. Only thing I do at LBS is wheels truing but fully intend to learn it myself. All my 3 bikes never seen inside of LBS. My friend spending over 1K in fees a year there for just 1 similar to mine road bike and I ride significantly more then he does. I do across 3 bikes about 200+ miles a week and spend about 1-2 hours a week working on bikes. Doesn't bother me. I kinda enjoy doing it.

[@TheWeardale1]

decent video, and much better than the first one... my experience then... bought a canyon neuron:ON 8 in March and covered over 1000 miles since then, average 30 miles per ride (2000 feet elevation, ~85rpm), and 2-3 rides a week, i only ride in mainly dry conditions (never muddy conditions..) on bridleways, fields and forests, firetracks, and a bit of road.. now I'm able to ride 20 miles in eco mode, and trail mode for riding back up the hill home and usually have 2-3 bars left... costs..? well, i had a hardtail normal mtb, but bought a lot of new stuff - one off purchases - chain measuring tool - £3 sealant injection set- £10 muc off tubeless valves - £15 tyre pressure gauge - £12 bike cleaning kits (sponge, chain cleaner etc) - £10 garden pressure spray - £20 tyre levers - £9 OneUp Composite Pedals - £42 last a long time - 1 stans sealant - £17 (full bottle used now, need new one) muc off cleaning fluid £19 muc off chain degreaser - £15 various silicone / gt85 sprays etc - £8 muc off dry lube - £9 bike parts - spare Shimano SLX M7100 Chain With Quick Link - 12 Speed - Silver / 12 Speed / 126L - £34 keep my bike clean and well lubed etc... suspension could probably do with service, but will wait until the winter months... and i never change the gear under pressure, and always start riding in a very low gear (tho, not always possible), and only rode in boost mode 2-3 times...

[@stevejones7956]

Great feedback TheWeardale!

[@TheWeardale1]

@@stevejones7956 thanks :)

[@markusilomaki8922]

@Electric Mountainbike Network, welcome back to earth 😀👍🏻

[@stevejones7956]

Thanks Markus

[@mikemorgan8588]

One really big expense is in falling for name brand inflated prices. If you are doing your own replacement and maintenance of components you aren’t doing it because it’s the primary fun that is biking. The biggest depreciation of ebikes is the manufacturer disappearing and having designed proprietary major components like batteries and motors that leave no backward or forward compatibility for replacement parts.

[@Rich.enDorseit]

Blimey! I had not idea acting work had dried up for David Tennant, good to see he's found work in a bike shop now!

[@amandiomartins6751]

I have a emtb for 1 Year and 2 months now, it has 2500 Km on the clock never changed a cassete or a chain, of course i make my maintenence and some times take the chain off and clean it with gasoline. Never understood how people change so many chains and cassetes, maybe the weather an trails here in Algarve help.

[@vashon100]

Probably a function of how much climbing is done per km (mile).

[@MarionvillemodelsMultirotors]

David Tennant must have fallen on hard times and is now working in that bike shop.

[@stevejones7956]

I think they pay well......

[@davidpinnington213]

Up here in North West UK we have the bbc weather man Owain - we reckoned he’s moonlighting on the side

[@1kennethsg]

Done 2000 miles in year on Merida eOne sixty different terrains been to Bike park Wales & borders of Scotland. Had bike serviced twice at a cost of £100 replaced brake pads at a cost of £25 a pair. Not replaced a chain or cassette & both working fine. Changed tyres for summer riding but got winter tyres ready to change so will get atleast 2 years out of 2 sets of tyres. Spent around £300 for 12 months maintenance

[@spiritualdeath101]

Hang your chain from a cup hook on the ceiling alongside a new, unused, reference chain. When the chain is half a link longer than the reference chain - this means about 0.5% of stretch and it is time to replace the chain & prolong the life of the chainring and cassette. Monthly deep-clean of chain is good also.

[@Mr.ABFAHRT]

running my ebike for 4400km now and i dont need even to change the chain or casette . Shifting is crips and on point. Only thing is the suspension needs some love 😂👍🏻 Grips need a change soon but overall looking good

[@sjaan7370]

With good maintenance and quality lubes, I spend about $400 - 500 CAN a year... 2 chains, one cassette, 2 rear tires, 1 front tire and pads.

[@pascalkargut3237]

Nope 350 tops

[@freequest]

Thank god I made the right choice on my E-Bike front hub drive with a 7-speed cassette, and when the cassette wears out going for an internal gear system.

[@codebender9435]

I don't wax the chain(yet) but I clean it with gasoline once a week and it really seems to extend its life.

[@roderick9018]

2000 miles on levo so far , one cassette , 2 or 3 chains, multiple brake pads and tires and rear hanger and derailuer for obvious crash reason. Bike shop did a re grease and tune up of all moving bolts and pivots. ( Including the 30ish motor bolts) for $95 too when I couldn't find a squeeks noise on my own.

[@katherinefrost5808]

Hello from Seattle, Washington. First of all, I love your channel. I was born in Wales, so I really enjoy Steve's commentary and local rides. Secondly, right now I have a turbo creo comp carbon gravel bike, which is incredible… for personal preference I swapped out the wheels and tires, but other that that it has required no out-of-pocket expenses (just my meticulous owner maintenance). However, I do have a turbo levo sl expert on order. I switched from GCN to your channel, but don't feel like I really know the presenters… have you done a "meet the presenters" series like GCN?

[@katherinefrost5808]

Oh, and what about adding a female presenter to your channel????

[@stevejones7956]

Great to meet you Katherine! Thanks for kind words. Seattle...now there's a spot. Ha, just spent a week on the Creo, i guess the less power equates to less wear right

[@katherinefrost5808]

@@stevejones7956 Steve, wonderful to meet you as well. May I ask where in Wales are you from? I am from Cowbridge… beautiful place. As for the Pacific NW, I absolutely love it here, too… great trails to ride on (decent beer, wine and coffee as well). Thanks for introducing me to e-mountain biking, please keep bringing us the incredible content. Cheers!!!

[@stevejones7956]

@@katherinefrost5808 Out west Kath, hey dont forget to send in pics from PNW!

[@garybarker9139]

Good point about the hub drives, but I don't think that they will perform as emtb's

[@davidking3699]

This just further strengthens my previous comments about gearbox & carbon belt drives... so many advantages - from wear rates, strength, consumables, time, tools etc. Seems that drivetrains are the high wear and high cost issue... We are being charged 2021 prices, why are we getting 1921 technology?

[@paulbarnett9524]

Totally agree with you But why would shimano or sram make them when they can continue selling chain's and cassette that constantly wear out its more profitable

[@davidking3699]

@@paulbarnett9524 Consumers need to use their power to demand changes... Competitors and small players may be the wedge that cracks this racket open...

[@paulbarnett9524]

@@davidking3699 true but the reality is that nothing will change just look at tyer size now for example most bike's are 29ers no 27.5 option ebikes are overpriced.we may moan yet we still pay the price it's a vicious circle but mountain biking is fun.

[@gddfhjiufcv]

In the interest of sustainability and minimising wastage people should really be riding components until failure or until they are visibly unsafe to keep riding. I bet the bike shops love these 'enthusiasts' who come in every two months saying 'oooh my performance is decreasing it must be the chain has stretched a mm or the cassette teeth have lost 0.1% traction I need a new one' paying out thousands a year unnecessarily. Unless you are a racer or professional just enjoy your bike and carry out routine maintenance without worrying about peak performance at all times.

[@theepimountainbiker6551]

Im this kind of person. Ride it til it dies then replace it. LBS once tried to tell me oh your cables are all stretched you need to replace them. 2 years later same cables are still working just as well as they always have, just needed to pull them tighter. Both my rims on my devinci are bent from a 1 foot drop, shop wants $200 per rim 😂 theyve been bent for 3 years still work fine, doesnt affect the handling at all so why bother.

[@summit461]

After a year and a half and 1,500 + km, only expenses are a few bottles of chain lube and bike cleaner. Clean / check / service after each ride. Rear brake pads will be soon, but all else is like new!

[@jamescleeton8440]

How about the cost of frame bearings? I can’t imagine a well ridden bike not needing them replaced in the first year

[@JoLe1991]

same experience with chain wax, litteraly no wear on the chain and no dirt accumulation. pure wax though is not great under load, it really needs about 2% dry lubricant powder (ptfe or ws2)

[@DonaldMays]

Out of USA, i get about 2000 miles out of chain and cassette cleaning weekly and use a wax-based lube with no labor cost but if I had to pay for labor at 120 dollars an hour so I spend about 300 dollars a year

[@stephenshoihet2590]

I've got 15K km in the last 2 years on my 1kW mid drive fat bike, I ride up steep hills with heavy loads and I've never broken a chain. If you're breaking chains, you're doing something wrong.

[@rohankilby4499]

John’s comments gold, if you’ve owned dirt motorcycles you’ll get the maintenance thing, time, good lubricants and cleanliness cheaper than replacement parts. 🤙

[@Whiteknuckler57]

I have seen no extra expense in my E-bike maintenance - I have a Haibike Full 9 - I have only changed out the tires (1,500 miles)

[@Stegen63]

Really awesome. Thanks, keep on.

[@derrick5507]

What about maintenance cost of your suspensions? Especially when professionally done.

[@lukecarolan4425]

Agreed, If you use the suspension oil spray and use it every few months, you can halve the suspension service intervals.

[@adrianorossi72]

Good afternoon everyone on the channel. First I would like to apologize for my writing because I'm from Brazil. I've already watched many videos and I was curious about one detail... what would be the estimated durability of a Shimano E7000 engine?Pointing out that I use my E Bike in moderate conditions.

[@droneboy1562]

Oh no, iv done 1200 miles and never checked my chain, every 300 or 400 miles does seem a bit much do you not think?

[@peterreeton6051]

my chain and cassette are still good after 12 thou miles,mine is a custom direct drive ebike

[@jimbo4203]

On my levo sl , i wore out a set of tires , had it for a year and i just broke a tooth off one of the cogs on the cassette

[@stuartcareless9550]

I have a question how come there are so many high end EMTB for sale On the 2nd hand market ? People only have them for a few months and sell them on Why ???

[@frafra224]

Thieves...

[@ceriway380]

Mr walker know his stuff £300 is about right ,I maintain my bike but change cassette and chain together which last 9/10 mouths then brake pads , Yorkshire has mix ground and ride we all over the place .

[@tjeers3098]

Good one thanks!

[@TheSydguy30]

How much would you say from your experience (if you guys have any) based on just road riding to and from work for example? What would the cost be in that regards for those of us who just do that? Would it be closer to $0 some years and minor amounts others such as your last speaker was saying?

[@Antidepressiva1980]

2 sets of tires and 2 sets of brake pads and 1 casette and 1 brake flooding every year on average. doing 10-15km each day . around 200-250 € per year on average if you maintain it once a week and keep it clean .

[@deadseven1]

What about the cost of servicing the motor?

[@lucienbenoitlacombe1073]

Hello, here are my stuffs to maintain my ebike (Scott Egenius 910) for 3500 Km /year ride enduro mountain only: One rear rim (crash) 3 chains 2 rear tires 4 brakes pads 4 XT dérailleurs (rocks, branchs...) 1 cable on drop saddle. 1 Ergon grips half liter no tube liquid Lubrican and soap around 550 euros : 470 GBP My tips to help make the components more longer: Chain Wax Squirt (x2.7 more distance !) Hard foam (Vittoria) for the rear inner tubeless (low pressure 1.2 kg/cm2: 17 PSI) To improve the bike: more and more money (Hope, Miranda, SMP, Mavic, bosch nyon 2...)

[@uncrunch398]

What wax does JW boil with his chain in it?

[@thisisme4595]

My analogue Whyte T130 has had about £150 spent on it in 5 years. Honest. But my Trek Rail ebike is more expensive - but I ride daft changing gears under load. And it’s abused a lot more. Lessons have been learned. Riding Coed Y Brenin, Peaks and pathways

[@jimthompson717]

I spend $6000 per year on alcohol. $15,000 per year on home repair, maintenance , appliances. Ebikes are cheap.

[@copisetic1104]

Where I live you are 4-5 months getting an emtn bike, used ones are going for about the same as new.

[@jeremycox8261]

5,500 kilometres in on my 2019 RM PP Altitude. 1 cassette, 2 chains, 1 chainring, 1 set of tyres, lower fork leg service, 1 set new pads and 1 set new grips. I wash the bike after every ride and pay special attention to the drive train and lube the seals on forks, shock and seat post. I ride dry, ledgy and steep rough trails. I do all the work myself. So I’m into it for about $850.00 AUD. That’s £224 per year.

[@gravity.gourmet]

I rode around 2800km and replaced the chain once, the front brakepads once, the rear twice. The rear tire once, the grips once and thats all. So since April 2020 about 200€. Upgrades not included... Fork and damper are getting a big service in winter. Costs about 250€ but then it should work like new 😊

[@Raumance]

You need to change the fork oils at least every 1500km if you are riding trails, more sensibly every 1000km or when you feel them drying. You are basically running your suspension dry.

[@erickort1987]

i like to know what percentage you peddle and percentage you use the battery

[@vashon100]

pedal vs peddle

[@acelectricalsecurity]

The way I look at it is, if you can afford to buy an expensive bike you can afford to run it. Or you get handy with the spanners, there's a you tube video for everything.

[@evo5349]

Well said I boil my chain in wax from Putoline and have used for years in motocross and e/bike.

[@Wofinet]

Pretty fascinating. By fitting an electric hub motor you’re putting the power through a set of components that were intended for human power. Big strong riders have always worn out components quicker, but now with electrics everyone is a big strong rider! Seems like specific group sets build stronger for e-mtbs are needed. Would people chose them over the lighter human powered components anyway ? Maybe the answer is hub drive that takes the load off the drivetrain?

[@koborkutya7338]

my thought too - but adds to weight below springs (or however you say it i English). Anyway I also have a rear hub drive and am happy with it specifically because the chain is out of the game with that. Am commuting though, no mtb-ing

[@CrazyBikerGuy]

Cost is equal to how much you do to take care of the vehicle and knowledge. If you dont know what you're doing then your costs will be higher and you'll pay extra throughout. If you have the knowledge and keep a good service and check of the bike then it's very cheap.

[@CrazyBikerGuy]

The other thing to take into account is your set up. High price gear then a high price repair and vise versa for cheap bikes. So many factors.

[@onerider808]

700 hard trail miles and I changed my chain, brake pads, and rear disc. The 500 dollar battery replacement (and another spare) looms on the horizon, though.

[@oquefizhoje]

mine KTM macina ride 292 2019 costs me 40€/year for Bosch's servicing. Mine Purion shows a service logo (spanner tool) as soon i complete a predetermined number of KM. The bosch technician links the Purion to a computer and from there He got a report about everything about eletric system, bosch motor and battery. He chooses the number of Km assuming my own Km average. I barely do 1.000Km per year, cause i only ride my ebike on the peak of summer.

[@speedmatters]

I've ridden a GT Karakoram for over a quarter of a century (over 100KG) and it's still on the original chain and cassette without any issues! Okay, so she creaks like the Mary Celeste in a storm but if it ain't broke... Thanks in part to this channel, I have just dropped £5K on a Cube Stereo Hybrid 140 HPC SL and I'm fully expecting the same level of durability as my GT!

[@bonzobanana1]

I realise hub motor bikes aren't as effective as mid-drive for e-mountain bikes but to their credit because they separate the motor from the drivetrain you get hugely extended life out of your drivetrain because when you hit the hills which causes the majority of wear the hub motor maybe takes up half the work. So its not surprising that a cassette on a hub motor bike lasts up to 10x as long as a mid-drive e-mountain bike. In fact a lot of hub motor ebikes just have low end crappy freewheels and they still last a reasonable time because the wear rate is hugely reduced. Personally I feel if you have a rigid e-mountainbike, no suspension front or rear and something like a Bafang mid-drive motor. You can probably have a nice light decent light off-road bike with very low maintenance costs. Unless you have jumps and drops on the trails you use you don't necessarily need suspension. If you simplify the bike and use lower end components that are strong but heavy then you can save more money again. There are diminishing returns with high end e-mountain bikes. Look for the components that provide the best bang for the buck.

[@yordankrushkov8488]

That's what I have. Bafang bbs02 on a second hand good xc hardtail bike, total is under 1200€ battery included and I just clean and grease everything properly, changed pads once, tires once and will change chain at the end of season + fork maintenance kit is like 12€. I would say 100-150€ per year including tools, consumables, bike stand and basic clothing

[@vonyp6018]

Depreciation is cobblers. It only applies if yours going to sell. Also, Heavy people wear more parts out faster. Go cheap drore, they're all mix match. I'd say 200 bucks parts and 100 oils and greases.

[@stevejones7956]

Yes weight has a big effect for sure....

[@richardsmith3350]

I run Bafang ultra motor with 160nm torque. I use a Hope hub with steel freehub.. 9 speed HG400 all steel cassette. £35.. Saint short rear derailer and 9 speed chain. £14. It is as strong as I can get without going to a geared hub. It still gets jammed up every ride, we need stronger gears, NOT larger rear sprockets longer derailers and thiner chains!

[@TheStudioborsbeek]

Dont forget lube ... That stuff can add up . Definetly if u use wax Also bearings from pivots are a major one in rainy europe

[@cho4d]

OK so i haven't watched this video but for 3k lets see.... 3 years ago i built my first ebike for ~800, probably put a half dozen brake pads and tubes and a few chains on that so lets say 900... then i just recently rebuilt that in to a new bike... 350 for the bike plus 250 for various upgraded components so we're at 1500 for 2 bikes over 3 years and 4-5k miles. idk what this video is going to show.... edit: so watched half the video now and i gotta say, good job! seems spot on. i think i save a lot of money by doing everything myself and buying second hand stuff a lot of the time (and never expensive casettes. lol why save grams when you've got a bloody motor there torqueing the thing to destruction. just get cheap strong steel). it's a lot of work but also kinda satisfying and i do ride something bonkers and unique and faaaast ;)

[@thierrylerinckx1340]

Hot Waxing (wax + 10% ptfe powder) the chain is the best way to keep it up. Buy 2 chains and swap them almost every ride and your drivetrain will last up to 5 times longer. And don't forget your suspension!!! It's indeed a time/effort vs. money balance act

[@SaundyB]

At $22 dollars kiwi for 2 shimano chain quick links, single use they say, not much point taking the chain off a lot to clean it, might aswell buy a new chain more often

[@vashon100]

I had a similar observation about sram powerlocks for rotating chains. They say one use. Many say they reuse. It'd be nice to see an official test of some type.

[@Ruffest]

I go through chains and cassettes like hot dinners. I'm riding all the time on steep tech I try not to change under load bit sometimes it's just not possible. I do about 4/6 tyres a year Chains 300 miles if I'm lucky Cassette and chainring every 3rd chain. Then there's damage from crashing 😂 probably spend 2/3k a year on it. Don't forget clothes and shoes and helmets.

[@Jeppelelle]

Chain 300 miles? That seems like an insane wear rate, do you have one of those 9'000 watt bikes? 😂 Maybe time to downgrade to 9 speed with one of those "fatter" chains, if you havn't done already

[@Ruffest]

@@Jeppelelle I ride in the worst possible terrain for chain wear trust me. I clean it off my bike every ride and re lube. I'm on 9 speed 😂 I do ride turbo lots though and I'm heavy. Kenevo rider.

[@trailsanddales4356]

@@Ruffest every time I change my chain having checked it was not worn I have to change the rear cassette because it slips on top two gears. Now a rear cassette is 80 - 100 quid instead of £45. annoying

[@Jeppelelle]

@@Ruffest A fair enough 😄👍

[@Ruffest]

@@trailsanddales4356 yeah I have a mate the same 😂 he gets the dremil out on the one gear he uses alot. If only they let you buy single gears from the cassette

[@TK-OK]

I agree with less is more mantra. You have extra power ya don’t need 12 gears. A box components 8 speed Ebike set is under $160 usd. Cassette, chain, and shifter. Helluva deal and super nice considering cost

[@stevejones7956]

A great option..

[@Tommi462]

If you're smart about your bike care and maintenance, even if you run 12-speed, the maintenance shouldn't be that bad for cassettes and chains. But those battery replacements are crazy expensive, so if you need a battery replacement often, it will cost you a lot. I read somewhere that you should expect to replace it every 3-5 years, which sounds crazy to me, but if the battery costs close to 900 euros, it will be 300 per year if it only lasts 3 years, and that is horrible. But I have not had first hand experience about that yet, and I know you can get batteries cheaper too if you shop around, but it will still be hundreds. Even if you find one for ~600 and it lasts 6 years, it would still be a lot of money in my opinion.

[@ericphillips9240]

But what is the difference between between ebikes and none e

[@terryvillegas3133]

All of those prices are ridiculous the only cassettes available are XO1 and XX1 along with the only chains available are $50+

[@Zurbaganification]

Cleaning the chain is a very important maintenance item. Of course, it is better to clean it by removing it from the bike. I use White spirit (Stoddard solvent) as the first stage in a plastic bottle with a wide mouth and cap. shake, shake, shake. In the second step, I pour it into another bottle to degrease (simple). shake, shake, shake. We take it out and wipe it with a dry cloth. The chain is like new, it all takes 10 minutes. Remember to dispose of waste properly)

[@stevejones7956]

Now ive never heard it called Stoddard solvent....and my mate Stoddard clearly hasnt heard of it hahaha

[@bddorling]

I don't understand why some Emtbs are being specced with stuff like SX eagle derailleurs, basically plastic. This will create accelerated wear and tear and no amount of setup will rectify this.

[@andyarchitect]

The SX and NX stuff is pretty good really... does the same task pretty much as well... only slightly less premium feeling. In terms of cassettes I would like it if i had an ED driver or microspline hub, but when looking at the cost and durability of an NX cassette in comparison with the 10 tooth options i'm happy to live with having an extra tooth or 2 on the chaining instead. I'd expect to get many years of life out of either an SX or NX derailleur, and if it did break its cheap to replace... or presents an upgrade opportunity if the owner suddenly finds they got richer lol.

[@akeluify]

New Shimano Linkglide drivetrain lasts 3-5x longer than 12 speed. If you want ultimate ebike shifting performance and longevity, run linkglide with waxed chains. Cycle between 3 waxed chains every few hundred km . Great for dry weather not so great if you regularly ride in the rain.