The Mario Movie Problem

The Super Mario Bros Movie released recently, and it's a lot of fun for longtime fans of the franchise. However, the release of this film has caused quite a stir online and it's shone a light on how the internet reacts to criticism in general. This is not just my own review of the film, I'll also be taking a look at the toxicity that surrounded the film's release and how poor the discourse was.
Twitter - / cartoonshi AND / scarfedbrit
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Tracks in order of appearance (Repeats not counted):
Spark the Electric Jester 3 OST - Shopalo's Goods
Envoi - Dissenter (also outro song)
Komi Can’t Communicate OST - マドンナの隣を狙って
SPY x FAMILY OST - Bondman
Picross 3D Round 2 OST - Challenge
Mario and Luigi: Bowser's Inside Story OST - Toad Town
Persona 3 OST - Iwatodai Dorm
Sonic CD US OST - Tidal Tempest (Present)
Copyright Disclaimer Under Section 107 of the Copyright Act 1976, allowance is made for "fair use" for purposes such as criticism, comment, news reporting, teaching, scholarship, and research. Fair use is a use permitted by copyright statute that might otherwise be infringing. Non-profit, educational or personal use tips the balance in favor of fair use.
#rant #mariomovie #entertainment

[@Cartoonshi]

Twitter - twitter.com/cartoonshi AND twitter.com/scarfedbrit Patreon - www.patreon.com/cartoonshi Discord Server - discord.gg/Q2AMHsB Letterboxd - letterboxd.com/Cartoonshi/

[@WSendam]

Great video 👍 ❤

[@Jack_Saint_Archive]

Wonderful video 👍❤️👍

[@dusk173]

Your Mario Movie review is the best one I’ve seen so far. I especially appreciate the nuanced and unbiased approach. I’m also tired of the drama, hypocrisy, and overall toxicity surrounding this film. It’s an absolute mess, and it’s sad to see people get dog piled just for having an opinion.

[@DatcleanMochaJo]

@@dusk173 nah the fanboys may be cringe but the critics deserve no mercy

[@fossilgamersbirds8958]

Same go for Godzilla King of the Monster and Dino Dan because their the base of the movies and shows

[@geboaebo]

I didn't like how they didn't say "So long gay bowser" when they grabbed him by the tail and threw him

[@nicoleflores2054]

neither a "Bye bi" smh

[@AizakkuAnalysis]

I was genuinely waiting for that. There were so many moments in that fight that I thought Mario and Luigi were going to say it. Especially when they were about to deliver the final punch. 😂

[@nicoleflores2054]

@@AizakkuAnalysis same, though it would've been epic if those two had big hammers while attacking Bowser

[@revolverjesus98]

Illumination plays too safe. There wasn't a chance in hell it was going to happen

[@piranhalettuce]

Yeah that was the only moment in the movie that disappointed me, at least let them say "Bye Bi"

[@protastudios]

It's not about not trusting rotten tomatoes, it's about having the common sense not to open twitter.

[@samueltreminivalle3494]

This man spitting

[@davisb69]

fr

[@davisb69]

also the movie was mid

[@chemifan6784]

As a person with Twitter, yes.

[@patrickdixon7202]

@@davisb69 True.

[@Contraverse]

The biggest problem about this movie is that Yoshi only appears for 1 second

[@justinarzola4584]

End credits no less.

[@danielwan2410]

also during the travel montage

[@Tamashiifuxk]

Nah the more biggest problem is that rosalina and daisy got 0 screen time I personally think the mario galaxy games were the best and was really sad that rosalina didnt got screentime

[@hgfghf2399]

@@Tamashiifuxkyeah kinda funny how daisy’s kingdom didn’t even show on the mini map 😂

[@Tamashiifuxk]

@@hgfghf2399 and kinda sad too

[@kingkirby1394]

Love how so many problems can almost always boil down to “Twitter started it” it’s hilarious at this point imo 😆

[@yookeemookee]

Says a lot about how badly it needs to go.

[@jackmclaughlin9911]

Indeed, twitter will say good movies are bad, and bad movies are good. Twitter is a dumpster fire.

[@Abel-Alvarez]

@@jackmclaughlin9911 as it always has been.

[@bricktonmcbricks3969]

@@yookeemookee No it should stay. If it gets deleted all the idiots from that god forsaken site will flood others sites and ruin them

[@dunkleosteusterrelli]

​@@bricktonmcbricks3969 The Great Tumblr Migration.....

[@MasonProductions12]

I would’ve liked it more if Luigi had a sideplot where he broke out and tried to make his way to Mario until the final act

[@slothoverlord4388]

I haven’t seen the movie yet but I assumed that’s what WOULD happen because… why wouldn’t it? That’s like, the most basic plot idea EVER (which isn’t a bad thing) and would actually allow Luigi to do something and possibly even work in an arc of stepping out of his brother’s shadow or being independent despite his fears or whatever. Hearing that it’s not something the film does is kinda baffling to me

[@nemi9217]

@@slothoverlord4388 I’m going to add onto your comment but SPOILERS When Luigi does get captured, we actually see him have this huge moment of pondering that he’s a coward and Mario’s always there to help him. What happens next? He gets sidelined for the next 70 minutes just chilling in prison. There’s lots of character building setups in the movie with Mario, Luigi, Peach, and even DK, but that all never gets brought up again even with these solid foundations

[@piranhalettuce]

Yeah I honestly wish Luigi was there during the Rainbow Road part of the movie, I hate how they just made Luigi sit in a cage for most of the movie.

[@kwayneboy1524]

​@@nemi9217hopefully they fix this in a sequel.

[@ahumanbeing8371]

Spoiler alert I think they could have finished the Luigi plot line by making him grab the star in the end while bowser and Mario were going at it

[@railroader2431]

Honestly, a lot of the Mario Movie’s problems could be fixed if they showed down the pacing, and maybe increased the runtime a little for a few more character moments.

[@IcyDiamond]

Agreed, I feel like it’s clear they had ideas for how to develop these characters, yet didn’t go all the way with it

[@sebastianperezboeff985]

​@@IcyDiamondim pretty sure it was nintendo who demanded illumination to keep it as flat as possible, bc even in other illumination films theres more character development than in here

[@yulee3266]

​@@sebastianperezboeff985 wonder why Nintendo would want that

[@sebastianperezboeff985]

​@@yulee3266bc its nintendo, specifically miyamoto, who prob suggested that idea, they always try to keep mario as flat and simple as possible so no suprise there

[@Nightlizard1564]

I’ll agree on that. I do wish the movie was honestly longer cause at times it was going a little too fast. The sonic 2 film also had the same problem as well if I remember

[@Kohchu]

I think the best argument for this movie is literally: In a game, we can tolerate no story; because the Gameplay can pick up the slack. But in a Movie, the story is the main appeal, without it; why do you care about what you're watching? Yes, one can argue "Mario has never cared about Story." but there's kinda a big difference when the adventure is yours to play, so you can experience the world at your own pace, and let the fun factor of the game push you into the mood. A Movie doesn't have this luxury, because everyone is watching the same experience... without that free form flow... you're left with a flat world with no story, and characters you know and love... but instead of you dictating what happens, it just kinda rolls down a hill slowly.

[@katielee7364]

I mean it has a story, Mario is trying to find his brother and then he gets wrapped up in saving Mushroom Kingdom. It's a simple story but it's still a story

[@Kohchu]

@@katielee7364 Yes, but this is the same story that the rest of the games have (Just, put Peach instead of Luigi). But, the key difference is, if I've watched the Mario Movie once, I already know what to expect if I go to watch it again. There's nothing left to thrill or excite me, unless I wait several years later and rewatch it as a nostalgia flick. Because that's all the Movie is at the end of the day. It's got a lot going for it, but at the end of the day; it's Nostalgia pandering of the highest degree. And that can be fun, I myself loved seeing all the Easter Eggs in the Toad Shops for example... but that can only get you so many points. When I look at Super Mario World or Mario Odyssey... the story is the same, but how I choose to approach the adventure is my choice to make, as there are branching paths and options that allow me to make my own journey. This is the difference between the two.

[@SuperBowserStudios]

My only personal issues with the movie is how it moved too fast and the lack of Luigi but other than that I loved this and it’s by far the most fun I’ve ever had in a movie

[@justinarzola4584]

I feel if another studio animated the movie the plotting could be better but I'm glad they kept the general style of Mario faithful.

[@ElliotKeaton]

_"and the lack of Luigi"_ Damn, they really did keep it faithful to the (3D) games.

[@bomberman9296]

​@@ElliotKeatonbruh

[@arseneamulet1882]

@@justinarzola4584 not to mention Illumination has a big problem with its trailers. The trailer will just spoil the movie, rather than just introducing you to it. I can promise you that if someone went and watched this movie without seeing the trailers, it would've been all the more enjoyable. I would have been delighted seeing Donkey Kong or the segments that look straight out of the game or the Mario Kart scene for the first time during the movie, instead of in the trailers

[@Termina2018]

Kinda sad too, seeing as how this is also the 10 Year Anniversary of The Year of Luigi... though it was satisfying seeing him kick butt during the climax. And yeah, pacing was a bit quick. Hopefully, a future continuation fleshes things out more, because the worldbuilding was surprisingly well made.

[@entityontheinternet]

When you think about it "It´s just for Kids" sounds more like an Insult than a Defense

[@TheRyanVillareal]

Same with “you have to turn off your brain to enjoy it”

[@entityontheinternet]

@@TheRyanVillareal My favourite of these Non-Arguments that I have seen People unironically make is "It´s meant for Stoners to get high to". Like, how good can something be when you have to be on Drugs to enjoy it

[@revolverjesus98]

That, and "you're not the target audience." Uh oh, this Dr Seuss book is aimed at kids, guess I can't have an opinion on it

[@joshbuoy8661]

It’s not a defense at all. It’s an excuse. If somebody says, “This is bad.” and you say “It’s for kids.” You’re basically saying that it’s ok for it to be bad because it’s for kids. In other words, you’re not verbally disagreeing that it’s bad. The only kind of scenario I can think of rn where this response would be appropriate as a defense would be against something like, “This movie doesn’t have enough blood in it. My disappointment is immeasurable and my day is ruined.” or something.

[@kwayneboy1524]

I mean it's kinda true not every form of media is catered for everyone some of it will be made with a different tone and audience in mind it's like TTgo it's made for kids who just want a whacky cartoon it's not their for a story. Some content isn't for everyone.

[@WildWeavile]

I really HOPE that we have a luigi mansion spinoff where Luigi gets to show why he is the better brother. Like that scene where Luigi thinks about how Mario is always saving him and he is always just playing coward was so perfectly well done.

[@mechayoshi9250]

Nah. Instead you’re getting Yoshis Island, which im absolutely stoked for

[@amyvasquez4268]

Honestly a plot line like that must happen if we get a sequel to the movie (which is totally going to happen if this film does well tbh).

[@kwayneboy1524]

​@@amyvasquez4268i mean people got 2 and maybe a possible third minions movie so I wouldn't doubt it

[@communism-on-a-Monday]

@@amyvasquez4268 the post credit scene literally showed yoshi, it’s not going to be about Luigi.

[@ZyroidX]

@communistfunnyvalentine8990 until you realize who first discovered Yoshi, Luigi did So there is still a chance

[@Eidlones]

News flash to people about professional movie critics: They watch a SHITTON OF MOVIES. It's their JOB. If something's doing the typical, or standard, they generally judge it more harshly than you probly will. Because they've seen it play out in like 15 other movies that year, while you've seen it play out considerably less, and probly while rewatching stuff you already like, not new releases. Take a job eating new flavors of ice cream, and 20/25 flavors all taste basically the same. You'd get pretty tired of it, and think "It's fine, whatever. Could have added some chocolate to spice it up a bit, tho." Then someone at the store gets flavor #14, and says "Wtf are you talking about? This is awesome! Damn ice cream critics don't know shit."

[@bomberman9296]

YOU SIR ARE SPEAKING FACTS

[@normaldude7924]

Bowomp

[@WakerOfTheCryingRain]

Ah yes the same people that gave a forgettable movie (secret life of pets) a higher rating than the Mario movie

[@Docru911]

PREACH!!!

[@Docru911]

@@WakerOfTheCryingRainYou mean they gave a better movie a better score? 😮

[@ImTheGuy]

Twitter users when they learn that people can have different opinions:🤯🤯

[@God-T]

lol twitter never learns to learn

[@d3l3tes00n]

Life existed before Twitter... people have always been like this.

[@locomotivetrainstation6053]

But critics think good movies are bad and bad movies are good

[@levicarpenter5509]

​@@locomotivetrainstation6053if you are going to claim something then prove it other than that stfu

[@asaknight321]

Here's a tip: Never listen to rotten tomatoes, always listen to rotten popcorn

[@kootunesscrewy]

Forget Rotten Potatoes in general

[@muppetonmeds]

I only go there to see the audience score in most cases it's way more accurate than the critic's score.

[@Jack_Saint_Archive]

But Rise of Skywalker got %86 popcorn. (Ignore the popcorn score and form your own opinions.)

[@juliancaraveo5700]

​@@muppetonmeds There is one case I wouldn't say that is accurate. A Loud House Christmas got an audience score of 61% even though it was hated upon by fans of the show.

[@burnypython8230]

@@Jack_Saint_Archive The Rise of Skywalker when it only had one thousand reviews had an audience score of 86%, then when over 50,000 of the audience reviewed the movie, the number never changed which got many people suspicious.

[@IcyDiamond]

People need to realize that critics won’t care about all the Mario references on the film, and that’s okay, all I know is that if the movie got a 90% rating on Rotten Tomatoes by critics, no one would be like “Yeah but they said Cuties was good!”

[@yulee3266]

Why do people say that like the critics are always the same

[@mike-6139]

@@yulee3266 EXACTLY

[@WSendam]

You are like literally everywhere

[@drstrangelove307]

@@yulee3266 because critics are rich and all rich people are stuck in their privilege bubble. Watch The Menu, it’s a great showcase of critic behavior and how they care little for art

[@yulee3266]

@@drstrangelove307 not all rich people are like that but they do exist

[@dripmaster6989]

the fact that people were getting offended and pissed off by criticism of an animated film shows that most adults act like children

[@locomotivetrainstation6053]

I don't respect critics opinions, if an average person said it was 6/10 I would respect. But not from critics

[@protastudios]

​@@locomotivetrainstation6053 Wow, you're literally admitting you're biased. You know Critics aren't all just the stereotypical Anton Ego, politically biased dipshit, right? Most critics have understandable opinions and a lot of experience on watching and understanding movies, just that the most popular tend to be the ones who say the dumbest shit. Being against the opinion of a whole group of people just because of their job is the dumbest shit. Also the movie is a 3/10 for me, let's see how you deal with that.

[@ZeAllMighty1]

⁠​⁠@@locomotivetrainstation6053but why though? What’s your actual reason for “not respecting” critics opinions?

[@locomotivetrainstation6053]

@@ZeAllMighty1 they are mad at a Mario movie for not being feminist

[@lumberIShere]

​​@@locomotivetrainstation6053.. What? Have you seen an actual critics review on this movie? Because even if one "critic" said that they don't like tmm due to it not being feminist, Not all of them have. You shouldn't generalize people like that because you may never find people who agree with your thoughts on tmm

[@Aisenhelm]

It makes sense why the movie is low stakes this is Nintendo's first film in forever and they want to see if it will succeed first before taking risks, but i do hope they start taking risks in their next films.

[@denysvision]

And there will come more movies from nintendo since they will make a lot of money from the mario movie

[@CocoHutzpah]

It'll probably never happen, but I'd like to see Nintendo take a big risk on a Metroid movie. The extreme longshot is where it becomes the movie I wanted Alien Covenant to be.

[@wendigo6667]

Are you forgetting the detective pikachu movie? They took some risk with that one and it was a lot longer between that and their last movie before that then there was between that movie and the SM bros movie. Definitely wouldn't call DP low stakes.

[@redking36]

@@CocoHutzpah I wanna see what it's like surviving on a hostile alien planet by yourself.

[@fightingmedialounge519]

Don't know if that's the issue considering other first films that have more going then this movie.

[@emeraldemuto]

I’d honestly say my only big problem with the movie was it’s pacing. Like, it felt like we moved from point A to point B away too fast at times, especially at the Mario and Peach introduction. But other than that, still a solidly good film that I enjoyed. Peach was my absolute favorite character, which is something I never thought I’d say about anything in the Mario franchise.

[@stopmob1097]

And the lack of story

[@Nightlizard1564]

@@stopmob1097 once again who plays a Mario game for story?

[@rosythewildflower]

@@Nightlizard1564 me. But the movie was fine with story

[@theartisticpaperbag6247]

​@Nightlizard1564 it is a film, films are stories and people are valid to expect a bit more story

[@stopmob1097]

@@Nightlizard1564 I ain’t talking about the games even tho it has barely a story itself

[@WSendam]

Critics vs Audience a tale as old as time

[@paulgilbert5278]

Undoubtedly

[@hugosimpon3605]

It could get it's own movie if it could

[@BatInDisguiseOFFICIAL]

Indubitably

[@LazyOldFusspot_3428]

Beasty and the Beaut!

[@Supermariorpg6]

Beauty and...the audience

[@commanderriptide7723]

Here's how I look at films and what to watch. Critics tend to base their judgment on objectivity, does it have a plot, do the characters develop, etc. Audiences tend to base their judgment on enjoyment, was it bright, was care put into it, etc. So when you go to watch something but are unsure if you want to, think about what your looking for. Thank you for coming to my Ted talk.

[@okuraorca]

It's also about the audience the studio was targetting. Illumination made a movie focus targeted at Mario fans, hence, skimp out on plot, character development, etc... for fan service. It uses Illumation's hyper active 'move from joke to joke so fast you can't breathe' approach. Paramount made a Sonic movie for *all* audiences, hence the Sonic films were seen in a more favorable light because it has actual heartfelt moments and plot points, character arcs. Also, a bit ironic that a *SONIC* movie of the two, is the one to actually slow down and have meaningful character interactions.

[@sirbossk]

Yes! I hate it when people downplay movies as "kids movies". I think kids are more emotionally perceptive than people give them credit for, and children's media has more potential to explore complex themes than people realize. In fact, kids are the most impressionable audience, so wouldn't it be a good thing to incorporate meaningful themes into "kids movies"? They don't have to be just light shows and there are plenty of kids movies that prove it.

[@jakkank]

Adult me now would want to agree with you but deeply thinking about it I don't remember any 'meaningful themes' from what I considered my favorite movies were as a kid XMEN 1, XMEN 2, the Iron Giant, Return of the Jedi, Atlantis, Prince of Egypt and Land Before Time. I could think of their meaningful themes right now, but I am 100% sure child me has no idea of any of that. Family gone>save family>cherish family and Be good/don't be bad are actually the only morals I know I can honestly remember. Any more complex than that and my brain ignored it completely.

[@weirdo3116]

idk. i don't think every movie needs to be Prince of Egypt or Puss and Boots. the idea that it's a kids movie so it's okay if it's one way or another is dumb. but it's also dumb to assume it has to be deep or meaningful. it just has to be good at what it's trying to do. which the mario movie seems like it did.

[@weirdo3116]

@Blended Circuit "not every movie has to be the Minion Movie or The Mario Movie." yeah i agree. what's your point? " Its wierd to assume every piece of media needs to be dumb" where did I say this? where did I even imply this? are you responding to someone else?

[@weirdo3116]

@Blended Circuit "the idea that it's a kids movie so it's okay if it's one way or another is dumb." does that sound like I'm saying everysingle kids movie needs to be dumb?

[@spidermations6495]

It’s very Ironic how adults use the “it’s just for kids” argument, because of their love for a film “for kids”

[@Shuyin781]

It's for kids AND for the fans of the franchise

[@entityontheinternet]

@@Shuyin781 That Argument falls on it´s Head when you realize that the Adults are still the ones who pay for the Tickets. Why else are there Pop Songs and Celebrity Voice Actors in every animated Movie

[@KgEclispe252]

Aren't these the same people that say "Animation is cinema" but then use that exact same argument to shill the movie V:

[@entityontheinternet]

@@KgEclispe252 Cartoon Twitter start having consistent Beliefs Challenge (impossible)

[@Staticblox]

THAT'S LITERALLY WHAT ONE OF MY PARENTS SAID

[@katlyndobransky2419]

I’ve seen this movie twice so far and it is a joy to watch. The movie felt way too short and way too fast, and I’m sure if I was still a kid I would’ve loved it even more. But it was still hilarious, and the animation was stellar!!!

[@loe-h]

twice ???? ive seen it only once and it was like yesterday !!

[@katlyndobransky2419]

@@loe-h once Wednesday with my brother, then again today with a friend. I work at a movie theater and get two free tickets a day, so thankfully I didn’t have to spend a lot lol

[@P-P-Panda]

@@katlyndobransky2419 luckyyyy

[@kriegdoessomething]

Haha, I see I am not the only one who’s watched it twice!

[@Kanoog]

Perfectly designed for children though if you think about it because of their short attention span and that's Nintendo's target audience.

[@threeholepunchjim721]

That is mostly my problem with Illumination. The company can have all the shiny animation (even though mostly character design-wise the designs are too simple and uninteresting), big budget, and marketing strategies they want, but the one thing that Illumination movies lack in is their stories. They play it too safe in the storytelling department. Not to say that every single movie they make needs to be some 50-layer deconstruction of the human mind, but it needs to have something of interest other than shiny looking animation. Even with Disney, they are starting to over bank on the hyper realistic animation department. More focused on the technology of their animation than telling a good story. Good animation should be aimed for, but shouldn’t completely ignore the effort into telling a good story. Equal effort should go into all aspects of a film, no matter the medium.

[@denysvision]

Beuh, it was Miamoto at fault for doing this, all illumination did was making the movie visualls good

[@NuiYabuko]

​@@denysvision You don't know that, but of course people will repeat that ad nauseam.

[@benpodvia5744]

If you want an Illumination movie that actually tries in the story department, then watch Despicable Me 1 (2010). It's got everything you want in a movie.

[@gingerbellz359]

​@@benpodvia5744oh yes I agree, it remains one of my favorite illumination movies because of how memorable it is.

[@rojczan1399]

I feel bad for this movie, its surely a 7/10, not a perfect 10 but its a movie that feels like something made with passion.

[@Eerorri]

idk i didnt watch it its probably like a 3/7

[@thunderousss-285]

I'd argue 3/10 but I'm not a Mario fan, so it wasn't catered for me.

[@luigiwiiUU]

more like a 6

[@ex7229]

10/10 im 35 and my spouce is 36 we loved it with our kids.

[@thechugg4372]

@@thunderousss-285 This. During this entire movie I was like "fuck this frame is an obscure reference to how smb2 USA is a reskin of doki doki panic.... wait no one in this theatre gets that joke" Which means this movie can be a 10/10 like it's a 3/10 for you.

[@mikhaelgribkov4117]

Lego Movie is prime example of how you can make pretty free to interpretation brand and turn it into pretty impactful movie with themes and layers of meaning, so I think downplaying the ability of Mario and Sonic (especially Sonic, who ever since The Animated series will push into some really interesting and even quite mature subject meter half of the time) being quite compelling movies is pretty much admitting that you don't really want franchise being capable more than satisfy your geek shtick.

[@lune_xoy]

I do really agree, I won't say that I would ever conform to this, instead, I imagine this more as a pathway to FUTURE adaptations, in over, idk, 20 years? Or better content. To be honest, videogame adaptations have not really got a good treatment, so I ACTUALLY imagine more adaptations coming in the future that will have even better quality... Imagine being yourself one of the ones who could lead and take parts in those projects!

[@ajthewildwolf]

I don't get people that get mad at other people for not liking something they like. I wish I had that kind of emotional energy.

[@nidhoggsvrede]

The wave effect most likely.

[@tessaPMpro]

I have always said the same thing, if anything I feel bad for them that they can't get the same enjoyment out of the thing I like, it's their loss.

[@porc1429]

You don't want that

[@yookeemookee]

Believe me, you don't. You'll end up just like them: Perpetually miserable and exhausted.

[@ajthewildwolf]

@@porc1429 I do. I'm exhausted. I want excess energy to be mad about bullshit. I don't even have the energy to get mad at actual shit that happens to me. Never angry. Just empty

[@egranger2128]

My biggest problem with the movie is now that they made so much money, Hollywood has more of a reason to regurgitate remakes, reboots and depictions of franchises that already exists instead of creating original ideas.

[@dantediiorio7547]

Did you like Hollywood's over reliance on nostalgia, franchise and remakes? No? Well doesn't matter prepare for busy 3d the movie 6 now in 5d coming to bubsy+ in 2035. don't ask questions just consume product and then get exited for next prduct

[@luigissidekick861]

The biggest issue I had with the film would definitely be it’s time limit. It feels like the people working on it wanted to reference as much as they could while also having development between the characters. Though they had to fit it all into a 90 minute timeframe so some corners had to be cut which led stuff like the story be kinda half assed. Do wanna say that I did love the movie a lot and had an absolute blast, but I really want it to be a bit more. I know we are going to get sequels (I mean look at how much it’s making) so I hope the team does see the criticisms the film did have and try to fix them later down the line

[@oscarsoto8428]

@Alex Wells I honestly don't think the issue was deadline, I think the 90 minutes were mandated. But who knows?

[@gpcrafty9570]

Hey if the only criticism is that there wasn't enough, that's when you know it's a good film.

[@GFirenight]

​@@gpcrafty9570 That's not the only criticism and it's not a good film. It's enjoyable, I guess. Personally I hate it when video game adaptations focus too much on game mechanics and not enough on story. But it's hard to call a movie that barely pretends to have a story a "good film".

[@gpcrafty9570]

@@GFirenight I loved it and that's my opinion

[@GFirenight]

@@gpcrafty9570 That's fine. You can absolutely like a bad movie, you're clearly not the only one. But the only criteria of "was it a good movie" cannot be "did I like it?"

[@Exotic_Soul18]

The Mario Movie is just a fun film to watch in general. Can't wait for the sequel. 😁

[@chippy2023]

Same here! X3

[@manuelzabdiel4991]

Same here

[@kwayneboy1524]

Didn't see but I hope we get one

[@hatbros4463]

Is there gonna be a sequel? I haven’t seen the movie yet

[@P-P-Panda]

Yep❤

[@turtletum]

I really like this perspective of the movie. Just because it’s a simple franchise, doesn’t mean they should’ve “abandoned” the basics of engaging storytelling. A story is a story and I think that Nintendo had Illumination Studios on a VERY tight leash, so they felt kinda obligated to add more Easter eggs than a more intriguing story.

[@NuiYabuko]

And you'd know that, how?

[@okuraorca]

@@NuiYabuko Quoted by Turtletum "... and **I think** that..." They literally said it's their hunch, not fact.

[@Kaimax61]

and who cares of "storytelling" when it can be entertaining like the games. And this is why hollywood has a story problem, forcing story for the sake of having story.

[@simpltonn6162]

Miyamoto is very anti-story when it comes to Mario so it wouldn't surprise me if the Movie team wanted to do more with these characters but weren't allowed to

[@dcscruz2970]

@@NuiYabuko cause Nintendo f up paper Mario story. Because of Mario’s creator being more into the simple gaming stuff

[@SkibidiSFM69]

This film really needed an extra 20 minutes to flesh out some things.

[@1billdorito]

Some of the bad reviews from critics (looking at you, Grace Randolph) really generalized the reviewers down to people who are idiots, don't know what they're talking about, and shouldn't be listened to. More than half the critics thought it was at least okay (ala at least a 6/10 rating). I read one review of the film that gave it a 1.5/4, and it was from someone who loved Mario since they were a child and passed the same love down to their children today. They did raise a pretty good point, why are we taking something like Mario and accepting the bare minimum in storytelling? We can acknowledge the movie was fun, but at the same time had the potential for so much more. I hope the sequel takes more risks.

[@nidhoggsvrede]

Spot on. You don’t need to expect something on the level of Shakespear but it is fair to feel that something this large would have better focus and care put into its story. Its the same reason I as a Godzilla fan was dissapointed with Gvk. And it does suck that movies these days that get praised mainstream this way are just ”fun” movies like this, Gvk and Willys Wonderland.

[@jaryRim]

Absolutely, this movie looks great but that's all it is, it has no substance. Most people didn't go into PiB:TLW expecting much since it was a 11 year sequel to a so-so Shrek spin-off movie yet it blew away everybody's expectations both fans and critics alike.

[@jacksonvoet8312]

Well now that we’ve gotten an actually good Mario movie, I’m sure the next will be even better now that they have a foothold.

[@NuiYabuko]

​@@nidhoggsvrede And what's so bad about that? There should be a place for all kinds of movies, even just fun flicks.

[@aolson1111]

​​@@NuiYabuko Why do you expect good reviews for bad movies?

[@theplanwiththeman7028]

This film's critic scores are a perfect example of why hype is a double edged sword and why people should learn to keep their expectations low from the beginning.

[@drstrangelove307]

Or it’s an example of the critics being pretentious privileged self centered idiots who think they’re “too good” for certain entertainment.

[@fruitloops2058]

Feel like low is a bit too pessimistic. Keep your expectations in the middle to begin with and lower/elevate based on info you get, even then that's easier said than done.

[@SupraViperhead]

I'd say people also need to be aware of what movie they're seeing. You don't go into a Tyler Perry movie expecting a Psychological Thriller with logical twists and turns.

[@ScuttleBugReal]

Hype CAN be good if the thing being hyped is as good or EVEN GREATER than the hype, but it still IS good to keep your expectations low so that you’re excited during the movie, instead of going “oh… i hoped that (blank)”

[@VagabondRetro]

The RT website is to blame more than the critics. The average rating is like a high 5/10, which isn't a bad rating. The RT system is just arbitrary and broken.

[@Croutonking65]

One of the defenses of the film I hate is “they should’ve played the games”. That’s like going to a book adaptation film and retorting to criticism with “they should’ve read the books”

[@jenniferhamels1176]

When you make brain dead comments like what Grace from Beyond the Trailer said about the Cat Suit, of course people are going to bash her opinion/“criticism” that was based on a terrible nitpick. Calling the Cat Suit goofy when the gimmick of powerups that were explained is basically goofy in itself already.

[@AJHornet1]

Why does anyone care what a random person, who knows nothing about Mario, thinks about a Mario movie?

[@waddlekid96]

@@jenniferhamels1176 i have never heard of this person ever but this comment about the cat suit is so weird, it's supposed to be goofy it's literally mario tf did you expect?

[@kyperactive]

​@@AJHornet1 You answered your own question.

[@malenaavalos7829]

@@AJHornet1 I knew nothing of Harry Potter but then I watched the films and I knew what the story was about. Just because it’s a movie based on an existing product that doesn’t mean it should be EXCLUSIVE to the ones who knew the product at first hand

[@RyderPlatinumWarpstar]

I’m glad I’m not the only one who thought the Sonic Movies were better at least as movies. Mario definitely is the more faithful adaptation, but I was more invested in Sonic as a movie. I cared about the characters in that film.

[@kirbyboycoolness6734]

Yeah, though both movies were good

[@ItchHeSay]

While I wouldn't say the first Sonic movie was very faithful, I think the second one was very faithful in many ways, while making some necessary changes. Sure, the wedding sequence felt a bit out of place, but I think the complaints about that sequence are somewhat exaggerated and it was a fun way to introduce G.U.N. However, the main point is that a more faithful adaptation doesn't necessarily make for a better movie. Something I appreciate about the Sonic movies (more so the second one) is that they thought about making an entertaining movie first that captures the essence of Sonic instead of focusing on filling the movie to the brim with references and nods to the games. That's not to say that those can't be fun and enjoyable, but I don't think it should be the primary focus when making a movie. What I like most about the Sonic movies is that there is still a clear respect for the source material, but the movies still feel new and fresh to a fan like me. The Sonic movies are not the most amazing things ever made, but I won't lie when I say that the upcoming third movie is probably one of my most anticipated pieces of media, and it's because they've been able to establish a sense of development and respect for the characters of a franchise I've loved for many years. If they manage to nail the third Sonic movie, there's almost no question that it will likely be my favorite video game adaptation.

[@RyderPlatinumWarpstar]

@@ItchHeSay Yeah that right there is pretty much why I like the Sonic Movies, specifically the second one, more. While there are plenty of references to the games, it still feels like a movie with characters that go through their own arcs and follows an overall story.

[@nicoleflores2054]

the first movie has flaws but even then, i felt invested through Sonic's past and his dynamic with the newer characters like Tom and Maddie, which the sequel managed to make the build up and development more meaningful.

[@kirbyboycoolness6734]

@@nicoleflores2054 Agreed

[@Lego_loves_cheeseburger]

I think that in sequel will be shown more story and lore, *and there will be much longer*

[@paulgilbert5278]

Yeah

[@pistoluity]

I hope so, imagine having Rosalina in the sequel only to rush her character with 4 other characters and keeping her interactions low, I don't think fans would be happy especially since we already have now a movie full of references of the Mario world.

[@kwayneboy1524]

I feel if we get a sequel it will have Lugi as a focus and probably have Daisy in it.

[@cybertramon0012]

Yeah. The movie was likely to test the waters. Get the setting and characters established. Now they know it can work, they'll likely branch things out. Mario and Luigi could go on an adventure while Peach holds the fort.

[@Lego_loves_cheeseburger]

@@cybertramon0012 yes like sonic movie

[@rosythewildflower]

I liked it my only problem was the fast pacing. Im also upset wario didn’t show up

[@jskywalker58]

it fully i felt like there could have easily been a scene where mario and luigi's former boss told them he found replacements for them and those replacements were wario and waluigi

[@Lego_loves_cheeseburger]

​@Freesmart and wario will be a villain

[@rosythewildflower]

@@Lego_loves_cheeseburger and obviously waluigi

[@rosythewildflower]

@Freesmart yeah but tails at least showed up in the post credits scene. I expected wario to at least be a background character glaring at Mario when he saves brooklyn

[@Lego_loves_cheeseburger]

@@rosythewildflower yeah, like they are from alternative world or their copies

[@Hazelw0lf]

The lack of a story feels more like Nintendo meddling than anything. Miyamoto got lots of credit in this thing and he… simply doesn’t do complex stories in relation to Mario. I’m sure a lot of fans can remember his alleged reaction to Rosalina’s story time in Mario Galaxy

[@thunderpantz]

Didn't someone trojan horse that plot line in the game?

[@NuiYabuko]

​@@thunderpantz No, they didn't. Koizumi showed it to Miyamoto and he approved, but of course that doesn't help the "mIyAmOtO hAtEs StOrY." argument, so it gets widely ignored.

[@Hazelw0lf]

@@nerd2814 I said COMPLEX stories in relation to MARIO. I don’t deny other projects and properties he’s been involved in do have more narrative focus, but he’s always preferred Mario to be accessible and narrative light. In this regard, the film actually makes more definite assertions about the characters than the games ever have done.

[@God-T]

@@NuiYabuko that so dumb and this is why sonic will always be better. the guy really needs to change that mindset

[@triggerfairy4070]

Mario dont need a complex story

[@Kiri68419]

The fact that the movie is called the Super Mario BROS movie and Luigi is absent for like 70% of the runtime is probably the real reason 50% of critics didn't like it: False advertising

[@IcyDiamond]

I agree with the Grant Kirkhope thing, I think it’s weird they didn’t credit him, hopefully they credit him on any rereleases of the film I see they also didn’t credit the artist who made the song from Bowser’s Fury, same argument as Grant Kirkhope, credit them!

[@randomcomentor16]

I didn't go into this movie expecting some re-evaluating life message or even a brilliant story, I just went in hoping to have a good time with it and that’s exactly what I got. It's definitely far from perfect and I can understand the divide on reviews for it, but, at the end of the day, it's just an adaptation of a videogame better known for its world building than its story. What were we really expecting?

[@cybertramon0012]

To see two Brooklyn plumbers, a princess, and a gorilla fight a giant fire-breathing turtle voiced by Jack Black. And hey... that's exactly what we got. No subversions, no shocking twists, no watching the entire plot get derailed. It's almost like the film was giving us what we wanted.

[@cjspyker]

I was expecting at least dungeons& dragons story or ready player one. this is the most theme park ride movie ever

[@aolson1111]

​@@cybertramon0012 "I saw the thing that I know and I clapped! I clapped when I saw it!"

[@Kaimax61]

@@aolson1111 and you're not helping the problem.

[@bemiatto67]

​@@Kaimax61 are they wrong tho

[@ZeroDeMighty]

Haven't seen the movie yet but I'm gonna say this: people need to stop treating like it's a big ask for a series like Mario-one where the only story and characterization is found in the RPG and the sports games of all places and almost next to none in the mainline games, to have the bare minimum of storytelling for its big theatrical release. I'm still gonna watch it, but the fan reception has really has soured my expectations.

[@jacksonvoet8312]

It’s barebones, but it does have the DK rap, which is cool, for a first movie, it’s great, I agree the pacing was a bit fast, and not enough Luigi, but otherwise, it was pretty good! Hope the sequel patches out the flaws!

[@aolson1111]

​@@jacksonvoet8312 "I saw the DK rap and I clapped!"

[@devofficialchannel]

@@jacksonvoet8312 Now if only they actually credited the composer for the DK rap, cuz I didn't even see Grant Kirkhope's name on the credits.

[@nicoleflores2054]

Now that i think about it, your point about how Sonic 2 managed to give actual development to the characters unlike the Mario movie reminded me that there's a scene in the movie REALLY familiar with one of the Sonic movie, specifically with two characters dynamics that just happened to be related with (SPOILERS ALERT) parents issues.

[@sbfchillidogs9288]

(Spoilers below for the people that haven't watched the movie) You are absolutely right, however I feel like the Sonic movie did it a lot better since Sonic and Knuckles actually talk about their issues and sort of managed to connect a bit, unlike in the Mario Movie where they mention it and then immediately drop the subject only because DK hates Mario, showing absolutely no character development for the two making the scene feel kind of pointless.

[@nicoleflores2054]

@@sbfchillidogs9288 that's actually what I think as well, both dynamics are rivalry ones (with surprisingly similar scenes) but Sonic and Knuckles's rivalry managed to be written well and their friendship felt earned after they bond over the loss of their parents. the Mario movie felt like they didn't wanted to make serious plotlines but i feel like they could've got the chance to develop their characters and dynamics, specifically Mario and Donkey kong's but the moment they become friends, i thought it was rushed..

[@NuiYabuko]

So you're comparing the second Sonic movie to the first Mario movie?

[@nicoleflores2054]

@@NuiYabuko technically the similarities and different executions of Sonic and Knuckles's dynamic with Mario and Donkey kong's dynamic.

[@dakurisu3431]

Sonic has always been more in tone with a "teen" audience mindset and has always tackled some pretty heavy personal themes making it far easier to have raised stakes in a movie about it. Mario is Nintendo's MAIN ip, and the one they are most particular about. I believe a slower pace and a 2 hour showing would have allowed the writers to flesh out some of the characters and themes they wanted to explore more. Making it better than what it is but it still does not really stay on any meaningful topic for more than a few seconds in the movie.

[@Jack_Saint_Archive]

*People should realize that Mario movie does have a problem with the pacing.*

[@kirbyboycoolness6734]

Yeah

[@arjunbaweja7755]

that was my only problem with it tbh

[@JosephKChen]

Which is insane when this movie didnt even have a B plot. How can you have a pacing problem and no B plot?!? What exactly were we watching? just pretty colors flashing by?

[@dantdmfangamingrich9802]

@@arjunbaweja7755 I noticed that during the movie Edit: The movie was amazing except the random songs when they could of put Mario ost and it went to fast because the rainbow road or bowser invading felt to fast. Also not enough Charles Martinez

[@arjunbaweja7755]

@@dantdmfangamingrich9802 yeah it was wack

[@martinalejandro224]

the same people that are saying "it's just a kids film bro" were the same people that were spouting "animation is cinema" like parrots a few months ago

[@HugoSoup57]

Exactly, fans can be very hypocritical and dumb. Critics might not be right about everything, they’re not perfect. But they can view a movie more critically than audience members who tend to judge a movie’s entertainment value or how faithful an adaptation is.

[@Lefaid]

It sounds like the Mario movie is exactly what we could expect from an Illumination Mario movie. Thank you for your honest feelings.

[@Mr.encore]

FUCK YOU STOP SAYING OH ITS BECUASE ITS AN ILLUMAINTION MOVIE I GETTING TIRED OF THAT BULLSHIT EXCUSE

[@Mr.encore]

AND PLUS ITS THERE FRIST MOVIE AND I SEE THE MARIO MOVIE AS MORE OF A FOUNDATION FOR OTHER FILMS AND INCLUDING THE MARIO MOVIE SEQUEL TO BE BETTER JUST LIKE SONIC FRONTIERS ITS NOT PERFECT BUT ITS A FOUNDATION SO ITS THERE FRIST FILM AND STOP SAYING THE RESON ITS QUTE ON QUTE BAD IS BECUASE ITS AN ILLUMAINTION MOVIE I HATE THAT THATS EXACTLY WHY I HATED NICKS MARIO MOVIE DISOPORTMINT VIDOE BECUASE HE DOESNT SEE THAT ITS THERE FRIST MOVIE AND NO CARTOONSHI HAS NOT SAID ONCE THAT ITS BECUASE ITS AN ILLUMAINTION MOVIE SO STOP WITH YOUR BULLSHIT AND JUST BRUNNIN HELL

[@uncreativeusername8362]

@@Mr.encore Jesus Christ! Calm down with the caps lock

[@Mr.encore]

Sorry but He said oh its bad because it's an illamation movie crap bullshit excuse like and keep saying how it played it safe will if it was playing it safe we would have a peach gets kidnap story again they would explain the world instead of showing us the world and that's what the film did and also just because it wasn't a narrative heavy story doesn't make it bad

[@Mr.encore]

Abd that's like saying how sonic movie is bad just because it's a paramount film live action

[@Cornin33]

I genuinely did not think that a movie about an Italian plumber could stir up the internet so much

[@kurxis1930]

Take note it's not just a movie about an Italian plumber, but a a movie about an Italian plumber post-#MeToo Movement

[@prestonk8155]

That’s Not just Another Italian Plumber that’s Mario.

[@warrioreon11]

Try having a (functional) brain and an opinion to go with it ..

[@Joshua-qs6hj]

What kind of Plumber??! Watch your mouth. 😂

[@onepresence9460]

The only issues that i had with this movie were the pacing and lack of some characters appearances. Other than that, i thought the movie was very enjoyable and it makes me want to watch it again. It’s a fun movie for Nintendo fans. As a Mario fan, i approve this movie 👍

[@Cornin33]

I’m guessing that if a sequel were to be made, maybe some other characters like Rosalina and Wario + Waluigi

[@aydenrozzelle7691]

​@@Cornin33 ya characters like Bowser Jr will probably be in a sequel.

[@NuiYabuko]

More characters wouldn't have helped the pacing though.

[@Cornin33]

@@NuiYabuko I’m not sure. It might have extended the run time, but the pacing would have been even faster if they wanted to flesh out the characters. Especially if they wanted to develop them further

[@thepotatoshow1887]

I legit JUST left the theater with my mom, Cartoonshi lives in my walls.

[@Termina2018]

👁👁

[@lckaboom6810]

People are so unapologetically hypocritical when it comes to critic reviews that it’s kind of hilarious. Like, you didn’t exactly see anyone saying “what do the critics know? Make your own opinion!” about Quantumania’s low RT score.

[@jmann531]

And then they are like "always trust the audience scores" when there's a load of movies that the majority hate but still have a high audience scores.

[@greatesttudor]

@@jmann531 ye

[@locomotivetrainstation6053]

Lots of people said that about Quantumania

[@locomotivetrainstation6053]

Also critics are just bad in general

[@Apexthebeast]

I just finished watching the movie and fresh out the theaters, and gotta say I LOVE EVERY SINGLE THING ABOUT IT💖💖💖😭😭😭 while I can also see through my critical lens and admit there was a bit of a pacing problem where things seemed to be going a bit faster and could have been slower with more lore and story building, especially since they hinted at them making a potential second movie at the end there, feel there could have been more dialogue between Mario and Peach, DK, and even Luigi, to make them more depth and compelling. Everything in the movie IS GORGEOUS, visually appealing and the imagination they put into each and every single scene was BREATHTAKING. The iconic tracks were brought in as well with a glorious twist in, Bowser as a whole took the whole shows with his stellar performance and his hilarious and adorable simping for peach was fun to watch. The story itself was base at best, but it felt right for it being the first movie, and as a whole was a LEGENDARY experience to have in theaters,🙏🏻💖😭😆

[@SeekerOfFun]

Damn right

[@poyomaster3858]

Am I like the only one who kinda agrees with the critics? Like not what their saying but the rating of about a 6/10 I felt mixed on the film as well when I walked out the cinema.

[@jmann531]

I really enjoyed the movie but could also understand the critics.

[@zeemmy33]

honestly it really is a 6/10 movie, I feel like all the references tricked people into thinking it was better than it actually is (not that a 6/10 is a terrible score)

[@natsuki7325]

​@@zeemmy33 EXACTLY

[@Goldfighter5]

@@zeemmy33 You have a good point, considering the fact that most people agree it’s a simple fun time, I think that 94% or so is way higher than it should be.

[@Spongeboyking]

It’s an endless cycle. It is just gonna keep getting continuing, continuing, continuing until they learn which they will never mind

[@Spongeboyking]

I said which they will never learn

[@Lego_loves_cheeseburger]

What

[@exploshaun]

There's no valid excuse for kids movie being bad in this day and age, when there's so many kids movies out there that are amazing.

[@pizzarat3275]

Have to say I saw this reaction coming from a mile away. Gamers lose their shit whenever an anticipated title doesn't get the score they think it deserves even before they've had a chance to play it themselves. Game reviewers have received death threats because a game got a 9.7 instead of a perfect 10. It's ridiculous, and I say that as someone who has been playing video games since the Atari days. The Mario movie looks cool but Illumination doesn't exactly have the best reputation for strong stories and writing. I don't think I've liked anything they've made since Despicable Me 2. I'll probably see the Mario movie at some point and I'm sure I'll enjoy it for what it is, but I absolutely agree that the people trying to excuse the writing by saying it's a kids movie are wrong. That just a cop out.

[@imastupid5876]

I Ramble About the Movie. Some spoilers ahead. I'm not afraid to say that my love for the movie is mostly nostalgia-based. Everything in the movie that was even slightly nostalgia-based made my beart sing. Though, I think I would have loved the movie so much more if they had slowed down and just focused on one thing at a time. I really hope that, if there is ever a sequel, they will try to focus more on their characters. I realize it's a lot harder to visualize a slower scene when you have to write and read it, and you feel like it's going to be a lot slower than it actually ends up being, but more people will love a video game movie when there is substance. I still loved the movie. I loved the background music and the songs they chose to play, even if they did take me out of the scene. I'm going to show my 5 year old, Mario-obsessed baby brother this movie at some point, and my dad, too. I'm going to rewatch this movie many times, but the plotlines they bring up and never do anything with are going to bother me, especially the part where Mario suggests that Peach could've come from his world and it's so quickly forgotten about. The movie is cute and fun and so enjoyable to me, as someone who has had Mario be a constant in their life. That's all it aimed to be, and I hope to see sequels in the future. Criticism should still be given, though, and the "it's just a kids movie" excuse makes my blood boil. Regardless of if it's a kid's movie, adults are going to see it, too. Adults should be able to enjoy a movie about characters that were in their childhood, too, without feeling childish. Being a kid's movie has nothing to do with its value. I want story with my Mario movie, I want characters to have goals. If I'm desperate enough, I'm sure AO3 will have something, lol.

[@HimmelsDaemon]

I loved it, and I would agree with you. It was very heavy on the nostalgia for the adults and setting the era. (the music selection) I was wondering if Illumination tried to pull that into the animation aesthetic. I had that though when Mario made that suggestion and it just sorta dropped. Feels like Mario would of had a follow up question, but the question go answer and done. That's all a hint or reference of Galaxy's and Rosalina, there's the luma. Maybe Daisy, but not hinted at. So many things like that are hint/references to things, and possible sequels/spin-offs. I was actually a little surprised they even worked in the babies at all, and used it as quick explanation for "why is Peach the ruler of the Mushroom Kingdom of toads." I think there's a perfect line for how the movie's plot feels about exposition: when the toad's ask who Mario is and she says, "He s not important" and the toads drop it, cheer, and they promptly leave. Either you (audience) already knows or is going to pick it up, we're moving. Plot pacing is definately an available critique, it is very very fast. "It's just a kids movie" or "It's for kids" has meant exactly that for a long time. Essentially meaning "It doesn't matter, why do you care." and it's the attitude people treat other hobbies and interests. "For Kids" is even a long standing corporate paradigm that has that same mentality and that "kids" are inept and incredible stupid; either needing excessive explaining of the simple/obvious or just flashy colors, with no connection whatsoever. Any kind of complex interaction or themes are above them, so not worth the effort or money. So on and so forth. (Ex. It's part of the reason PIB2 is getting the high-praise for story. Since that was mentioned.) Might also include shying away from euphemisms or anything close. Personally, I don't think Mario falls into that due one of the possible critiques: That being that nothing is really explained, either you already know or you have to see it, see it happen or what it does, and put that together. That alone goes beyond the "for kids" paradigm. ( I could be very wrong, am very biased here, I like just being dumped into a world and not having it explained. It's one of my favorites, though here I obviously mostly already know and seeing how brought together. ) That excuse is annoying; don't diminish your own interest and on top of that validate that paradigm. To similar semantics, one could explain the simple story as being a children's story as a reference to the simplicity of (small) children's book. However, that only servers only as an explanation and is neither a defense or an intent complaint. What's being said is not that though, but the above "for kids" silliness as per usual cliche. "Being a kid's movie has nothing to do with its value." is very true. There's plenty of reasons why the mentality is detriment, but I won't get into that. And yhea, critique should be given; in my opinion, I think an idea like something should be well executed, well done, etc. regardless of it it's "high-class" or not. That "for kids" paradigm can be summed up with a word: disregard. And "childish" is it's own other trope/cliche and issue, with a bunch of misrepresentation... whole other discussion. Some people have mentioned the time restraints, which maybe. While I'm really impressed with how they melded so many games together, that's is part of the issue here I think. There is so much to have to show, and there's still places left out. They could of left out DK as kingdom, but it seems to used that to both work in DK in general, Country, but also Mario Kart and Smash Bros. It also setup Peach as royalty with that request to another kingdom. Had they not done that, it could of been a tighter plot with more time. But DK as an original connection was probably considered to important to leave out. I do hope of that for squeals, too. Now that are in, will focus only on sort of the area of the adventure. Saying that, that gave me a though of another way to describe this with the time limit: it had the requirement of adventuring though everywhere, even though why it's needed is a bit for the sake of it. I don't know if there's a trope name for that kind of thing.

[@yggdrasilsaltar]

the entire mario movie discourse probably made me lose 10 years off my life but thats most video game adjacent discourse anyways lmao

[@GravitySucksGD]

Something that really bothered me that nobody else is talking about is the use of slowdown scenes. One or two or even three in a movie is fine but I noticed a lot more used to pad out the already short runtime. It had me rolling my eyes in the theater towards the third act making me think to myself "just get on with it already", which is ironic in that the overall pacing was making me think "woah slow down it feels like this movie just started." However, a thing I liked that again, people don't seem to be talking about is the 2.5D scenes. There was a perfect amount of those to where it didn't feel gimmicky, I think there's one in each act? It shows that, despite being bare bones in any plot or world building elements, the Mario movie is unique in that sense. For me, however, the criticisms outweighed the praises, enough so that I left the theater feeling very disappointed. The only things that make it worthwhile for me and not mediocre trash (like the majority of Illumination films) are the references and the soundtrack.

[@CheesyLizzy]

8:17 I've also heard people complain that they don't like the Sonic movies because they're not direct adaptions But I really like them for being a new story. They're just a fun alternate story where Sonic was raised by owls and then ran away to Earth instead of the canon of the games.

[@yookeemookee]

Still, it would've been nice to see Sonic actually on Mobius and not in the mundane real world.

[@TheUltimateMachineGod]

​​​@@yookeemookee Well considering that its been confirmed they are attempting a cinematic universe mobius could be a location for plot moments someday but who knows.🤷‍♂️ After all it's been hard confirmed they are aliens.

[@adventuresteamstudios242]

This is why we need people like Cartonshi, he is very good at criticism and reviewing at animation, keep up the good work

[@TooningIn2008]

He’s come a long way

[@loe-h]

mhm !... i hope the guy is ok irl though his life seems rough according to some vids

[@diming7616]

@@loe-h huh

[@AizakkuAnalysis]

They really needed more Luigi in this film. It felt like Peach took his place by having him be the damsel in distress for basically the entire movie. The movie should have made sure that nobody was captured so that Peach, Mario, Toad and Luigi got an equal amount of screen time or just stick to tradition and have Peach be captured like always. Giving peach this personality really held back what Mario and Luigi could have done together, and also made Mario seem useless in the movie because Peach could've taken on Bowser all by herself. They literally show her in the wedding scene singlehandedly immobilizing Bowser before stopping all the prisoners from hitting the lava.

[@nidhoggsvrede]

Tbf she did need an ice flower to do so but Yeah I understand you.

[@happycamperds9917]

Yeah, Luigi is the only character who really had a character arc so more screen time to develop that would have been nice.

[@joshuareynolds23]

I'd say that Luigi being removed from the plot for most of the movie was actually a good thing as it allowed Mario to bond with the other characters without his relationship with Luigi getting in the way. I thought it also worked pretty well as a plot device for the heroes to come together. They both have a shared interest in stopping Bowser which gives them a viable excuse to meet peach a princess and, for them to get involved in a conflict that has nothing to do with them. Otherwise you'd have to go with the incredibly tired we must save your kingdom to get sent back to our world trope.

[@joshuareynolds23]

@@happycamperds9917 Mario and, dk had the arc where his family learn to respect him

[@patrickdixon7202]

@@joshuareynolds23 No all it did was portray Luigi as being useless, contradictory to the movie's title.

[@SeekerOfFun]

I don't care what the internet says. This movie is amazing and it already has a cherished place in my heart

[@naan000]

frr

[@alexandremuise8889]

kids love it cause it's funny and fun, adults love it because it reminds us of when we first learned to play video games with Super Mario and all the hours we spent falling off ledges, being hit by turtle shells or bit by plants, only to try again and again; cause we "just don't know when to quit." (as Bowser said about Mario)

[@SeekerOfFun]

@@alexandremuise8889 BROOOOOO I *LOVE* IT!

[@yachtysworld]

It was cool I guess

[@Brando-wc8fz]

It was mediocre, just stop

[@Slug_ssbm]

My thoughts for the SMB can be best summed up as “6/10 couldn’t stop smiling”.

[@browhathow1397]

Wow I’ve seen so many people start talking about this movie, guess this thing really did bring a reaction out of everyone

[@night1hal1]

Bringing up Puss in Boots, I think critics were just spoiled by that movie narrative wise. Forgive the food analogy, but this was like going from masterfully cooked meal by a renowned chef, to a decorative cake. Sure, the cake is delicious and satisfying, but its depth pales in comparison to the meal you had just before.

[@Whyamibzsdmh]

Lesson of the day is don't use Twitter

[@falendemo546]

Or better talk about the movies after all the shitstorm surronding it is over.

[@fixedfunshow]

L + don't care + toxic + ratio + insert unfunny meme pls twatter i need them internet points

[@crfstewarje]

^ Or a better lesson, just change your Twitter feed, if all you see is negativity. You're in control of your timeline.

[@squeaks5677]

A big thing I noticed is just how much of the great parts of the movie are spoiled in the trailers. But then you said that a movie can't just be action and fun, and then I realized that was it's biggest problem.

[@arseneamulet1882]

Illumination trailers are best known for spoiling their movies lol, you're better off looking away once you see that Illumination logo lmao

[@squeaks5677]

@@arseneamulet1882 but this one was even more spoiled then normal

[@epic73011]

I genuinely want to know why cuties has such a high critic rating tho 💀

[@Goomba1309]

Yeah, perhaps it's best not to know...

[@walterb.3592]

You know you can just read the reviews

[@tedtheodore5715]

Pedophiles

[@NoName......]

Why would anyone who would hate that watch it in the first place?

[@NoName......]

Imagine if this movie was made by DreamWorks.

[@Termina2018]

If made with the same quality (and team) as "The Last Wish" then it'll be phenomenal... even from a story perspective.

[@bemiatto67]

​@@Termina2018 Miyamoto was NOT gonna let that happen

[@Jean-Paul-Lane-Valley]

Even their most cashgrab movies tend to be better and more thoughtful than Illumination's work, however, as someone said above, Nintendo would have never allowed it. They are handing their licenses with great shame because they have been doing kinda bad, but they are still super protective to an extend. If they were ever going to develop a Mario movie again, they had to give it to a studio with no voice or style so the big N themselves could micromanage the whole thing, no wonder this is the best Illumination movie, lmao.

[@rexyjp1237]

The stylish graphics would have been good for the mushroom kingdom. In brooklyn the realistic style should have worked.

[@NovaBoi7]

probably be the same but with toned down humor

[@nas0518]

Excellent point, Cartoonshi. An excellent point on the critics and audiences thing.

[@AJTheInvisibleGirl]

It felt like I was in the theater for like 20 minutes and I was like “mmm popcorn oh shit it’s done?”

[@eclipssezz]

I feel like the critics rated this movie from more of a movie perspective. Especially with there's no plot and it's kinda messy sometimes, which I totally agree with and it is low-key acceptable. On the other hand fans actually rated it higher since they found it as a cheap fun animated movie, no really deep thoughts about it.

[@pureinnocentboi]

I think the main reason for this whole controversy, is that the general audiences doesn't understand that when critics gives a movie 5 or 6/10, that doesn't mean it's bad. It's only mean that the movie is average at best. It's inherently the same as common people who's arguing that the movie it's 7/10, calling it: "fun but not great". But the differences here, critics has watch a sh*t tons of movies that their 7/10 spots is reserved for something more prevalent. I mean, if you only had watch 50-100 movies top, that consists of Disney's animation, Netflix romances and MCU, of course your 7/10 spots would be more available. But for a critics that has watch 1000+ movies in their life, 5/10 is an honor really!

[@AizakkuAnalysis]

I don't think the movie deserves what the critics gave it, but at the same time I think the fans are trying to combat this but giving it overall positive feedback is even worse. There's no way anyone actually thinks this movie is a 10/10 and deserves a 98% on rotten tomatoes. Just write an honest review.

[@Staticblox]

It seems that's everyone's shared problems the pacing and it's honestly also my only gripe However, that doesn't mean I didn't love it any less, I loved trying to pick out all the references I could

[@Novaconis]

I love how this rant is a pretty smartly explained

[@zkoopa4445]

When your brain is larger than your body it's not quite as impressive to have such perspective reviews.

[@NeonDefense385]

I agree with the critics cuz theres a lot of enjoyable and well liked films out there that has a low critic score, its cuz they analyze movies based on the technical side and not because of how fun, iconic, or popular it is

[@matthewfischer9630]

This was such a nice change of pace from all the Pokémon. I hope there’s more of this in the future.

[@doot6538]

The movie just needed to be longer

[@jillnyethegirlwhosbi3772]

exactly. the pacing was WAY too fast

[@jeggsonvohees2201]

The defenders can be pretty unreasonable too. Try suggesting that the movie could have been written even slightly better and some of them start foaming at the mouth.

[@sdbzfan1]

What you brought up about Puss In Boots I find perfectly answers the issue on its own People didn't think a kids movie could be smart and enjoyable to adults so why should they assume the Mario Movie would be any more than a dumb kids movie when they defend it It all stems from the same place, people just naturally assume that animation is for kids and nothing more even though Comics, Anime, Gaming and Animation have all gone mainstream the stigma behind them never disappeared the words were the only thing that changed, people still view all this stuff as for kids because we haven't moved past not giving a shit what others think, this leads into people caring way too much about a score to justify their own point of view when all that matters is did you like it

[@Mr.encore]

That's what my problem is with people saying how the mario movie is a kids film and only for kids well number 1 it was mad for everyone and the mario movie had not once treated kids like idiot and this comes to me who actually see the film like I never understood why and with marcus review the frist half until the end was fine and give good criticism until he said which pissis me off said that mario movie is a kids movie and also his firend said how ralph did better I was like what becuase number 1 ralph isn't a vidoe games movie its a movie about ralph going to other vidoegames and we never spend too much time on Ralph's world and also he also compering puss in boots 2 and truning red to the mario movie which is number 1 really dumb and number 2 puss in boots 2 was a spinoff of the shrek franchise and is about the wishing star and truning red was about a girl with an ability to trun into a red panda due to property and that's my main problem with those people who had no idea about the diffrence of when to give good criticism to compering to something that the mario movie wasn't meant to be in the frist place its an vidoe games adaptation movie

[@Mr.encore]

And also the oh its because it's an illamation movie criticism is so dumb and stupid and that's like saying the sonic movie 2 is bad just because it's live action abd yes would have been nice to have an animated sonic film but at least sonic movie 2 was good

[@thisthatomega6545]

I bet if the movie didn't have Super Mario in the title then there wouldn't be this much controversy and everyone would have called it another average Illumination movie

[@Supermariorpg6]

If the Mario Movie should learn from the Sonic Movie is have slower and character focused moments. That's exactly why I love the beginning half of the film, and the Flashback scenes.... They were great, I need more of that!

[@mandemulus_of_the_somnabulist]

The Super Mario Bros movie is one of the Isekai movies of all time.

[@crakhaed]

Is Mario the self insert protagonist with the harem?

[@mandemulus_of_the_somnabulist]

@@crakhaed Yes but the harem stuff happened off-screen. Kids movie and all.

[@tako8198]

I just realized this movie is an Isekai

[@MustacheDLuffy]

@@tako8198 Mario was always one

[@sonicfanboy3375]

​@@tako8198 That means Alice in Wonderland and The Wizard of Oz are Isekai too

[@moistisprobdead]

I’ll probably have some enjoyment from the movie, although my expectations are low now that I heard the plot was barebones and I started caring about plots after my 3 rewatches off PIB2

[@paulgilbert5278]

If you care about a certain wholesome dynamic, boost your expectations way up

[@VukSol]

Looks like the Sonic franchise isn't the only victim to Toxic Positivity.

[@locomotivetrainstation6053]

Well i liked the Sonic movies and I will probably like the Mario movie but I respect your opinion if you don't

[@franze4]

for once i agree with the critic score A LOT MORE than the audience score. the audience just saw mario and luigi well animated and creamed their pants. weak ass plot, weak motivations, if any other movie had a similar plot it would be called a lazy cash grab 100%

[@bomberman9296]

Same

[@ciscovaiese7535]

Yep that is true about the super mario bros movie 2023 a blatant cash grab by illumination

[@maverick8203]

I could not be happier that I am not on twitter. Sure, I miss out on some important announcements and whatnot but it seems to generate way too much unproductive negativity for me to want to get on the platform. Sure, there's unproductive negativity on YT too but at least it's in videos that often give the viewers the chance to understand an argument in full than just a short, often out of context statement. But yeah, I wish the movie was longer and spent more time on impactful scenes, maybe a Luigi's mansion movie that didn't need to establish the mechanics of the world and have a smaller cast might work here? Who knows

[@pond0479]

Thank you Cartoonshi, even if I don't fully agree with the review of this thing. You perfectly described the controversy and the bad actors involved. Seeing the "the critics/reviews are wrong" and "It's just a kids movie" sentences everywhere, is really maddening.

[@self-absorbed5269]

I always like these kinds of scenario reviews , gives a lot of perspective. And I'm not exactly a people person , so I didn't even know this was an issue. Thanks for the heads up , you earned my subscription.

[@Deez-Nuts6969]

my boy cannot stop posting good content, keep up the amazing work and giving us insight into the differing medias of the internet! also, cannot wait for the "final" video about The Owl House since Watching and Dreaming came out not long ago, one of the videos I have most been waiting for considering every aspect of its beautiful ending (in my opinion)

[@seeinred]

"It's just for kids" has the same energy as "It's a movie about space wizards". Which is weapons-grade stupid. But than again, people on twatter mostly *are* like that, so it's not suprising in the slightest.

[@jupiter9099]

It was actually impossible for this movie to be released without this image being used as a KZbin thumbnail at least once.

[@ManuelV.S.]

peaches peaches peaches peaches peaches peaches peaches peaches peaches peaches

[@MrGameAndSwap]

mario: so you might be from my world? peach: there's a huge universe out there mario: THE HELL AM I SUPPOSED TO DO WITH THIS?

[@Remythechef]

The fact that this movie was giving to us by the teen titans go guys is surprising. Pretty much goes to show that if they pulled their heads out of their asses more often and actually put effort into what they do, we would agree with them when they make take that’s at their critics.

[@itunesaccount760]

It felt like a generic movie. My biggest gripe was the choice in music. We don't NEED to hear thunderstruck, generic rock songs, and mr brightside in every movie. Sick of all those songs. Literally so many things you can add to set the mood and you choose the most besides songs

[@M567dk]

There is a difference between making a video game and making a movie. In a movie, an actual storyline is needed to make the film enjoyable. Super Mario bros. Movie has great visuals and nods to the various video games, but lacks any real storyline that makes it worth seeing. It is too safe and too over reliance upon the Mario Ip to make the film truly worthwhile watching. If they had more time to craft a storyline that works for this film, then maybe the criticism would be less.

[@Silent_Mochi]

"No no no how dare you have an opinion, how dare you want the movie to be better Our mushroom lord is absolutely peak watch your Martin scorccesse film instead cause this is a kids movie for fans, how dare you want standards"

[@robymammon610]

Who would’ve thought a Mario movie would cause an internet war?

[@PMW591]

I did from the beginning

[@tedtheodore5715]

And it's sad cuz the sonic movie was a thing

[@Kanoog]

A war with adults haha the movie was made for children with some adult fan service included, that is why it's funny to me. Kids love this style of movie because of their short attention span.

[@robymammon610]

@@Kanoog I thought Mario fans were better than this. I never thought this movie would have the same effects that Ghostbusters, Joker or Captain Marvel did.

[@hassathunter2464]

What doesn't these days?

[@givecamichips]

I'm just wondering how the hell people tried to make this into a culture war issue, and stranger, that they somehow got literally any buy-in from anyone.

[@dantediiorio7547]

Their brain is so deluded with the culture war fantasy that they say anything they like is antiwoke and anything they dislike is woke

[@dadadadeadgirl5602]

Honestly what's ironic is how most who do that, specifically anti sjws, would complain about sjws interpreting every entertainment as political and virtue signalling, when they are literally doing the same thing. Legit saw a grifter who "reviewed" Puss in Boots the Last Wish but it's mostly just him using to film "to own the libs". Like I do not respect people like that at all who are this unaware of being part of an insufferable system.