THE MARVELS SPOILER DISCUSSION! | Big Thing

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Join Kristian Harloff, Winston A. Marshall, and Coy Jandreau as they dive into an in-depth spoiler discussion on "The Marvels"! In this video, our expert panel will explore the latest installment in the MCU, dissecting the storylines, characters, and connections to the wider Marvel universe. Expect to hear their thoughts on Brie Larson's performance as Captain Marvel, the introduction of Ms. Marvel, and the impact of "The Marvels" on Marvel Phase 5.
Don't miss out on their analysis of the "The Marvels" trailer, as well as speculations on what's to come in "Loki Season 2" and the future of the Avengers. With their extensive knowledge of Marvel Studios' productions, Kristian, Winston, and Coy will provide you with a comprehensive and entertaining breakdown of "The Marvels."
#mcu #marvel #the marvels #ms marvel #captain marvel 2 #themarvels #marvelstudios #brie larson #captainmarvel #lokiseason 2 #avengers #marvelphase5
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[@TheKristianHarloff]

Hey all! Throw your comments out there! What did you think of the movie?! SUBSCRIBE HERE HELP US GET TO 200K faster than 100! kzbin.info/door/7BZTnHihGgs7XZmXEBirjA OUR SPONSORS: GREEN CHEF: For Green Chef’s best deal of the year, get $250 off with code thing250 at www.GreenChef.com/thing250 PATREON: Become a Patron!: www.patreon.com/TheBigThingShow

[@pillowsheet6646]

I'm pretty sure the Khan family was helping Carol move into the Louisiana house. The Khan family still lives in New Jersey.

[@gregantonio1]

She's Binary. 58:44

[@jq4846]

i have frieds that betrayed me . yall make me feel happy .

[@rquile1]

I think they were helping Carol move in, not moving themselves. Lol. All the boxes had Carol and Goose names

[@Idnthev1]

This is how I saw that scene too I’m surprised nobody thought that was a possibility lol

[@neophyte_reviews]

I also saw it this way. I think the gold plate with Carol and Yan's faces on it should've been a dead giveaway on top of Carol and Goose's names being on it.

[@famousthaneus9810]

@@Idnthev1I give ppl misreading it a pass since the last time the family was on Earth, their home got wrecked by aliens

[@seanfoster6608]

That's how I saw it. It had all of her stuff. They even hint to it when both Capt. Marvel and Ms. Marvel are sitting in the plane. She says she doesn't have the key and she's simply watching for her until she returns.

[@Carlos-zs6km]

I thought the same thing as all of you. I was so confused when they started talking about this today lmao.

[@DustyMoth.]

Point of clarification they did not, DID NOT move the family to Louisiana, the family was helping Carol move in to Rambo’s old house.

[@geoffbache9897]

Yes.

[@eon001]

John Rambo was in this?

[@DustyMoth.]

@@eon001 John J Rambo is a massive part of this universe so of course he was present. How could you have missed it…. 🤣

[@mariajosenegueruelalopez2453]

Lashana was Binary in the post credit scene.The Binary character was an evolved version of Carol Danvers back in the 80`s Uncanny X-Men comics.Carol became Captain Marvel, at one point joined the X-men, they went into space and got kidnapped by the Brood, an alien race that messed with Carol's gene's and turned her into Binary. From the post credit scene I understood in the Fox universe, Maria (not Carol) became Captain Marvel, at one point joined the X-men, they went into space and got kidnapped by the Brood, they messed with Maria 's genes, thus turning into Binary.

[@Knightfall182]

Non-Binary

[@xFRZAg]

🙏🙏

[@heroicDale]

Carol became Ms Marvel before Binary didn’t she???

[@mariajosenegueruelalopez2453]

LOL @@Knightfall182

[@mariajosenegueruelalopez2453]

@@heroicDale , Yes, I think Carol went by "Ms. Marvel" back in the 80's, not Captain Marvel. ;)

[@ameliacraiig4193]

'The Marvels' was originally set to be released before 'Secret Invasion'. That's probably why Nick Fury's emotional state didn't seem to match up.

[@terrymcginnis01]

But Secret Invasion ends with Fury saying the Kree want to meet the Skrulls for a peace treaty. We see the peace treaty meeting in this film.

[@Jimmy_D_82]

44:20 are the Khan’s moving into the Rambeau’s house? I saw it as Carol was moving into the house, as she had fixed the mess she created with Hala so she was moving back to Earth. When Muneeba went through the kitchen stuff and there was that wedding dish with Carol and the Prince on, and the sauce packets. The sauce packets being a very single person living alone joke. If the Khan’s moved into that house it would have been a hell of a commute for Kamala to go and recruit Kate Bishop back in New York 🤔

[@robertwild9447]

I'll see The Marvels next week. But this is honestly the first MCU project where I have not cared at all about spoilers.

[@xcluesivekickz]

Kristian I believe Danvers was moving to the house not Ms Marvel and her family. I think they was just helping her.

[@geoffbache9897]

Yes, it wasn't clear, but it is Carol moving in

[@stormshadow75x]

I was so out of it I didn’t realize it but that makes sense 😅

[@Darthjarjar6619]

Honestly not in a rush to see the marvels but I’ll watch it when it hits streaming

[@TheKristianHarloff]

Fair

[@dannygavin9458]

I’m in the same boat. My local theater is charging 20 for a Matinee. 😢

[@hamhockbeans]

​@@TheKristianHarloffThis was first skip for me. Will see it on streaming.

[@BoskoShabazz]

@@dannygavin9458Jesus Christ, where do you live?

[@famousthaneus9810]

Y'all will have a much better time with it on streaming. It's not a movie I'd say needs to be experienced on the big screen unless you want the space stuff to pop at full volume

[@maddercat]

This movie had no scope, the last two movies didn't, when you have loki zipping around multiverses, becoming infinity, becoming yggdrasil, and Dr Strange able to zip around timelines, America Chavez, She Hulk for gods sake able to speak to the head of marvel and physically force him to change the narrative direction of the entire mcu, the spiderverse where they're zipping around timelines... Where does this movie fit??? It's so inconsequential. The quantum antman movie was an afterthought for the TVA, they mentioned it as a throwaway line. Who cares there's xmen in one timeline, any of those other characters I've mentioned could fix or destroy these characters like they were absolutely nothing. It didn't deserve a movie, this should have been at most another series on +, and probably not even that. Also you have plotholes like crazy. The bangles are a pair right, well why didn't the evil girl get switched with them all when they're all using their powers too? That would have at least been way more hilarious.

[@thedefinitionisthis]

I was rooting for the movie, but end of the day, it just wasn’t for me. I love all 3 main characters. I was already a Ms Marvel fan, enjoyed Monica in “WandaVision”, and actually liked Carol a lot more in this flick than her previous appearances. The trio’s character dynamics and how they used their powers in tandem were all really well done to me. I also loved Kamala’s family. They’re just so damn charming and relatable to me as someone who comes from an overbearing immigrant family. For me though, the problem was the story and script. They deserved way better than this. There was no sense of urgency to the plot, or sense of the stakes in regards to what Dar-Ben was after and why. The movie never really stops to get us to care about what’s going on. Everything seemed rushed, just to get from one plot point/location to the next. In a better movie, the musical planet (which is from the comics) and the flerkin subplot could’ve been handled much better, but they really do just stop the movie dead and undermine the main storyline. The movie really felt like it was produced by committee; trying to hit certain trope and formula check marks that the MCU needs to hit. I’ll admit the setup for future stories and characters was cool at the end, but it doesn’t make up for what came before. It really didn’t help that when I got home, I put on the “Loki” finale, saw how gripping it was, and was like: “Okay, wow Marvel. This is what you guys are capable of when you have a GOOD STORY to tell, and have it mean something.” This movie was just not the movie the franchise needs right now, given all the criticisms and BTS noise. This was one of the last projects under the Chapek management, so I do expect to see improvements moving forward. For as much as I’ve defended phase 4 and 5, even I had to admit this movie simply wasn’t it. The Marvels as characters deserved way better than this movie.

[@Westcoastspidey]

I was going to comment my thoughts, but you said everything I felt. So just going to reply to you instead to boost engagement for the channel. Was really rooting for this one. I'm glad some people are getting a lot out of it though

[@philstenger3629]

Young Avengers should be a show. Almost all of these characters are introduced in shows. And i dont think they have broad enough appeal to audiences. I havent talked to anyone who is excited for ironheart, cate bishop, young hulk or any of the others (possible exception of ms marvel)

[@thedefinitionisthis]

Y’all DEFINITELY have to do a special Christmas pod where you discuss “Lethal Weapon.” No way Winston hasn’t seen that flick…

[@t.j.giroux5936]

Yo, I'd love a back to back Lethal Weapon AND Die Hard pod. It is the festivus season after all.

[@bfgboy2]

Coy makes some good points about Samuel Jackson's behavior when explaining to Kristian why people think The Marvels negates the main plot of Secret Invasion...but I think what most people are frustrated about on this issue, is the fact that we had an entire show dedicated to the Scrull's problem of relocation by Nick Fury & Captain Marvel in Captain Marvel 1 when they made false promises about relocating the Scrulls that they couldn't keep. We saw how things escalated with a million Scrulls on the earth...WELL, things can only get worse with a planets-worth of more Skrulls added on . Not only that, but due to how the show ended, the entire species is actively being hunted down! Honestly, it's incredible that any Skrull still trusts either Captain Marvel and Samuel Jackson give me how awful the last attempt was. Also, what will the most powerful being in the MCU right now, Gaia, think when she finds out that Captain Marvel, the person responsible for her people's ongoing struggle on Earth, allowed another group of Scrulls protection on New Asgard, while her own people are actively being hunted down and slaughtered!

[@xman48205]

They'll probably never mention Gaia again smh. When are we ever gonna hear about ramifications of a Celestial sticking out of the ocean or ever see what's going on with White Vision or Black Knight?

[@tsheporabekane4172]

White Vision, Gaia, Black Knight, Eros, Eternals, Shang Chi, Modo, Celestials, Strange and Charlize Theron, and now they are introducing the X-Men and Fantastic 4...Marvel have created their own continuity problem by not running their production company properly. When are these things going to resolve??😑😑

[@joonyaboonya]

Kristian's disdain for the musical "bits" sounds like a personal taste issue because ultimately those sections of the film for a lot of people worked great and made sense for this movie. My theater in particular loved the Cats "bit" and we were all singing together. It was great time.

[@hakimzane]

Pretty sure the audience they were pushing for didn't even go see the movie besides a small few. The majority were dudes that are comic book fans. Know your audience. Also, i believe Iman is Pakistani so it wouldn't be Bollywood, but Lollywood. I could be wrong about that though. Also, Young Avengers needs to be a show. You don't hear enough people talking about those characters to validate a movie. I think it's safe to safe a LARGE chunk of your audience doesn't want to see kid stuff right now. They want to see some hard hitting, serious action.

[@FlishCosh-hi9tr]

Well said.

[@aT47157]

Seeing Carol be called the annihilator I think it would’ve been really cool(even though they touched on it a bit) to cold open from the marvel logo to the main villains perspective when she’s witnessing Carol wrecking Hala in Way that is similar to a terrorist attack and showing how much devastation Carol caused on her way to the Supreme intelligence and how scared the citizens are. And it’s ambiguous to the audience at the time as to why carol would do what she did. Until the reveal later on in the movie. It would give some sort of depth to Dhar (I think that’s the villains name) and you could kinda sympathize with her. Idk lol

[@alexp601]

100%!

[@terrymcginnis01]

Absolutely agree!

[@manniking233]

The opening to Thor 4 was great because of the POV of Gorr the God Butcher. If they did it this time, with the Annihilator, Carol Danvers would look like the one thing she hasn't been thus far: Cool. A dominant destructive Carol being seen from the villain, making her sympathetic, would have brought stakes to her fight with Captain Marvel because we had seen proof that Captain Marvel could easily kill her if she messed up even once. The stakes would have been inverted, like the way it is in most Superman movies, but still effective. The villain would have hit home with that one change. Captain Marvel is a crushing hero. The best villain for her is an obviously vulnerable, fallible hero with a McGuffin to help her that she needs to hold on to for dear life while also using her wiles and intellect to give her a dirty advantage. A solely forceful villain doesn't work because we already know Captain Marvel will eventually crush them, in the long run. A smart, weaker villain with an insidious plan to trap her and jail her would be a brilliant plot, especially if the villain saw her on-screen as the Annihilator and lived with that trauma for decades.

[@bobsilentjay7611]

Absolutely, that would've been great.

[@Maxxximilian90]

This movie was the straw that broke the camel’s back for a lot of people and marvel’s box office. Time to rebuild and reassess like how they did it with HOTD after GOT’s finale.

[@j23roa]

I'm staring and trying to figure out what HOTD means without googling it. I know what GOT is especially in the context of the finale.. it's like reading people's opinions on star wars and everything is abbreviated like everyone is part of their bubble

[@j23roa]

Nvm i think i got it, house of the dragon?

[@Maxxximilian90]

@@j23roayup!

[@mumstheworld]

They were helping Carol move in. They werent moving in themselves. All the boxes were Carols and Gooses.

[@bigjsquare1988]

I really didn't think that it wasn't any question that the Khans were helping Carol move. I never once thought they were moving to Louisiana. Also The Marvels was supposed to come out before Secret Invasion so that explains the Nick Fury thing.

[@jjstarrprod]

I gotta say, I wasn't that much in a hurry to watch that movie, except for Miss Marvel coz I adored the show, but after seeing SO MANY of my favorite youtube reviewers that were just bloody mercilessly INCINERATING this movie, I felt : I gotta go watch it ! I got so curious about why it got so scathing reviews. And quite frankly... I was pleasantly surprised. And was truly baffled by why so many reviewers, especially Greg from RR and Coy, who are usually among the most enthusiastic, forgiving, and good vibes reviewers, seemed to have a physical allergic reaction to it. I believe one of the reasons why this movie is so divisive is because of a lack of tempered expectations. During the weekly breakdowns of Loki, I could see Coy continuously very enthusiastically bring about how Loki's finale would tie directly into the Marvels, while I was thinking, uh, yeah no, buddy, the MCU doesn't quite work like that, right now. During all the Chapek era, a bazillion of projects have been pushed out, he stripped Kevin Feige down of his commander in chief position at Marvel, so there was no head chef in command for the storytelling aspect at the top of Marvel, and Chapek's Disney essentially gave the Lucasfilm treatment to Marvel, aka a trilogy with no plan, but times 20 (coz it's the MCU). All the projects are completely disconnected from one another, and chief among the reason, the system of the scripts of each projects being classified to never allow any leak beforehand is now coming to bite everyone in the ass, since alltheprojects are supposed to be tied in to the next, but nobody who's working on one project knows jack shit about what their neighbours are doing on the previous or next project that is directly tied to theirs. And that's how we ended with messy tonal shifts like Wandavision/No Way Home/Dr Strange 2, where neither Wanda nor Strange feel remotely like the character they were in the previous installment (and I believe that it sadly disgusted Elisabeth Olsen to ever want to reprise her role ever, which is super sad, as a previous interview of her showed her super keen on playing House of M. Wanda truly was wasted in MoM, and now her role going forward in the MCU is in jeopardy, which is kinda criminal, as the X-Men are now in the horizon). Then followed by Thor Love and Thunder after Endgame (where Taika truly didn't know nor care about where Thor had been after Ragnarok, and just wanted to play with his toy and have a summer camp at Disney's expense with the whole cast and crew's kids), then followed by Secret Invasion and The Marvels, where, as Coy adressed, in one, Nick Fury seems like a grizzled spy wearing the weight of the world on his shoulders, and on the other, he's just a jolly BLACK GIRL MAGIC ! motherf... Or getting a She-Hulk series at all. Especially one that looks like the one we got, with Daredevil... Well, being one version of Daredevil... TOO MANY PROJECTS all at once, and no maestro to reign them in. So yeah, seeing VERY obviously for the past 2 years that the MCU is in this current chaotic state, I had no expectation AT ALL that Loki's finale would play a role in any way shape or form in The Marvels, and after seeing all the rage reviews on it, I went in with super low expectation... And I had a kick out of it ! So yeah, I think one of the major sticking points on how to appreciate this movie is the expectations you had beforehand. If you wanted it to be the savior of Marvel, well, scratch that. That was clearly Loki. If you went in with zero expectation it would go well, and would just be a standard generic Marvel movie... That'd be exactly what you get, with the added bonus to have 3 charming leads, chief among them Ms. Marvel. The singing and dancing, that took me a bit off the movie but I felt ok, I get why they're doing this. First off, it's a girl movie, and especially this generation of girls like Brie and Nia have grown up on Disney movies like Beauty and the Beast, and most are certainly fans of Kpop and K-drama, so once Park Seo Joon (who's essentially K-Drama royalty, and I'm pretty sure, Nia's own personal fancast) was on board, i can totally picture her completely giving in her Disney-KDrama-Bollywood fangirl instincts and want to stay there (although I'm wondering if the whole Bollywood likeness of it all wasn't a nod to Ms.Marvel's wedding scene, which, I believe nobody had any problem with). If this is true, I can completely see why Nia wanted to make a 20 minutes scene of it in Aladna, first to enjoy more of Park Seo Joon onscreen (and not waste him as a one and done character like in the final cut), and quite frankly, I feel that would have helped the scene instead of hurting it, coz by 20 minutes, I believe it would have not been 20 minutes of the singing and dancing, but 20 minutes spent on this planet, which would have helped getting some actual screentime for it to breathe, for us to get used to the culture shock, and give it some actual emotional weight once they have to abandon it later. Also, why this scene even happens, I believe is ESPECIALLY tied into the whole hate speeches targeting Brie since the first Captain Marvel situation. One of the most common remarks that seemed to come back all the time is the "she not smiling" Well, yes, the first Captain Marvel did have the problem of being too self-righteous and rigid in its treatment of the character, so in the second one, I can totally get that Nia wanted to loosen things up, AND give Brie a little bit of the Disney princess treatment (which, I can very well imagine might be one of Brie's childhood dreams, who knows ? Or it might all have been a studio note of Hey, your film belongs to Disney, and it has a female superhero ? We have a KDrama superstar ? Bam ! Disney princess singing bit ! It's gonna sell like butter in Asian markets). So it all comes down to intentions, and if it was truly a directorial choice (which I believe it was, otherwise the studio wouldn't have given the note to shorten it), I respect it ! Same goes for the cats bit. We're living in the age of cats videos on youtube making more bank than any of you tlreviews/reaction guys combined. These videos do especially well on women. Again, being of her age, I'm sure either Nia or the studio exec that gave her the note of using more Goose was a sucker for cats videos, but dding that Flerken twist was the comic comedic bit they wanted to spice a bit an otherwise pretty dour movie (one of her home planets just got sucked dry). Now that I think of it, I'm starting to see the pattern of the script of this movie : 1/ Introduction of both Darr Ben discovering the bangle, and the 3 ladies doing their stuff 2/ entanglement/big fight at the Khan's house 3/ the team gathers 4/ first mission : rescue the Skrulls > failure 5/ first emotional bonding (memories) + training montage 6/ 2nd mission : dancing bit + Big fight on Aladnia > 2nd failure 7/ 2nd emotional bonding (Carol apologizing to Monica). 8/ 3rd mission, back to earth, big fina lfight > success 9/ Monica has to sacrifice herself, Carol loses her again 10/ epilogue, Carol moves in Monica's house with the Khan's helping her, last emotional bonding with Kamala, where they iron out their feelings towards each other. On the paper, I see why this should work. Written like this, I don't see anything inherently wrong with this plot (except how the villain is really just a plot device instead of a character, the movie should have started with the 5 minutes of flashback when she talked about how Carol destroyed Hala. Should the movie have started with this, instead of releguing it at the 2nd half, as a "plot twist", it would have given so much more emotional weight to both characters arcs and the plot). It's indeed in the execution that it was messy and lacking, due either to studio notes and editors, or lack of self restraint/experience (never forget that Marvel tends to hire talented but inexperienced independent movies directors /at least, inexperienced with that amount of budget and pressure/ just to save a few bucks and be able to pressure them with studio notes. TLDR : - Temper your expectation (no, this movie hasn't been done to "save the MCU", it's just a movie, and it's perfectly fine like this), and you'll be fine watching it. - Disney Princess bit : it's a girl movie, let them have their little Barbie/Disney princess moment. Plus, they casted a K-drama royalty actor, let them have their fangirl moment. - Cats bit : again, it's a girl movie, and they're millenials, and we all know that cats video on youtube were all the rage (and still are) with millenials. Just let it go, you stinky Gen X male ^^ At the end of the day, no this movie isn't a follow up of Loki's finale. And it's fine like this. No, it was not made to save the MCU, and it's fine like this. No, the dancing bit was not made for you, it was made for Nia and the rest of the mostly female cast (and audience), and it's fine line this. Was it a great movie ? Nope, it was a bit above average. Not great, but not terrible neither, far under GOTG3, but quite a bit better and more enjoyable than Thor Love and Thunder and AntMan Quantumania (and dare I even say Dr Strange 2 MoM, which was a real heartbreak, as it was a botched sequel to both fantastic Dr Strange, WandaVision, and No Way Home, and may have disheartened Elisabeth Olsen to ever come back to her role of Wanda). And this movie tried its best to be a worthy sequel of both Captain Marvel and Ms.Marvel, AND to try and cheer Brie Larson to actually try to enjoy more her role of Captain Marvel. So even if it's not perfect, I'd say it really doesn't deserve any of the vitriol thrown at it.

[@tsheporabekane4172]

Quite an interesting reading. I commend you for taking the time to write all of that.👌🏾 The reoccurring theme in what you wrote is "It's not for you, and that's fine." However, the "people" it was made for didn't show up, at all. All the cat lovers, k-pop, Disney princess lovers, all didn't show up. 65% of the audience was male. Another assessment: You mention that the MCU got the same treatment as Star Wars, under Bob Chapek...But Kathleen Kennedy got all the blame, and Kevin Feigi is receiving no criticism at all, not even from you. That is what I observed...🤔

[@jjstarrprod]

@@tsheporabekane4172 Thanks, I appreciate that you appreciate. About the 65% male audience, that's the first time I hear about it and I'm pretty surprised by it. I'd be curious to see your sources. As for the difference between Kevin Feige and Kathleen Kennedy, she wasn't even part of my comment, but if you want my views on it : one is a fan that makes movies for fans, a man that has shown nothing but respect not only for Stan Lee's extensive work over the decades, but also to the fans going to watch said movies ; the other one is a spiteful woman whose career grew in the shadow of men far greater than her (Spielberg, Lucas), and once she was in power, she actively sought to undermine if not destroy Georges Lucas's legacy to install her own (her "The Force is Female" crap, that was born out of spite to have had to work under men her entire career, she's not doing it for the women, she's doing it for herself) atop of it. Feige's Marvel before Iron Man was an underdog that clawed its way to success from the brink of bankruptcy through sheer grit and quality, only showing success over success over the first decade of the MCU (with some occasional bump on the road), and it's only when Chapek came into power at Disney and stripped him from his power of command in chief at Marvel that the failures started piling up and we're now at the current MCU state of 50/50 success/failures ; while Kathleen Kennedy has inherited the top cinematic franchise of the world....and has been piling up failure after failure in Star Wars, with the only occasional success being the ones she didn't have much to do with (Rogue one, Mandalorian s1&2, and Andor). And for some reason, Feige, despites the success, got sidelined by Chapek, while Kathleen, piling on the failures, never seemed to get even just a slap on the wrist for it. Now that Iger is back in charge (not that he's a better human than Chapek, as we have seen his true colors during the strikes, but at least he knows to put storytelling in front of business, coz he knows that storytelling quality = good business), at least, he reinstated Kevin Feige back at his old position in command, and then some (I've heard he also has a say in the comics contents, for more interconnections between comics and shows/movies), and Kathleen was basically told that Indiana Jones was her last chance, or she'd get the boot (and we all saw how that movie ended, on a whimper, and I have no doubt her next Star Wars project, the Acolyte, which reeks of her greasy palms on it, will very likely flop), so all's in order, and we should see both these franchises getting back on track in a few years. If the damage has not been too big yet, and the audience is still there (which is unsure for Marvel, and quite frankly, defunct for Star Wars, at this point)

[@duanecardinez1826]

I was surprisingly tickled by the musical number. It wasn't too long, Brie apparently still has a good singing voice and it was hilarious. But more importantly, it served the story. We get a sense of where each character stands. There is more to Carol than we know about due to her absence and she is more than just a spaceship killer. She has a whole other secret life. Monica is not into it and is the more serious, analytical character as she is stone-faced the whole time. Kamala is very go-with-the-flow and is excited to be in a new place and see her hero in a new light. If you are not into it, you can relate to Monica and if you are, you relate to Kamala. It was brilliant and the criticism makes me realize that the audience is looking for more serious gravitas in their Marvel movies which I guess is fair after Thor 4 and Ant Man 3.

[@auburnmann3630]

Definitely had potential. I think if we had gotten more backstory into Carol’s revenge on the Kree world & more time on her reflecting & reconciling these actions would have made the movie that much better(not to mention further screen time of Kamala coming to grips with horrors and scar tissue of being a hero).

[@Westcoastspidey]

Kamala seeing the horror of her hero Carol making the hard decision to leave people behind to die was completely abandoned. Had the potential to be a great theme for the movie and learning point for Kamala

[@grayden4138]

Agree with Kristan and Coy on wanting a little more character development at the beginning. Having an opening scene with Carol and young Monica back in the 90s to re-establish the emotional bond that they shared set against Carol being gone for so long. A quick 5 min scene would have done a lot for the emotional payoff at the end that didn't really hit. I attribute this movie to how Trek fans say that Insurrection was really just a two part episode with a film budget. It didn't feel like a movie and that's how I felt coming out of the theater. This could have been a series and given more room to breathe.

[@aditmahmood5737]

I thought they helped Carol move to Louisiana, the khans didn’t move there.

[@ready2reactr2r47]

Coy, you are forgetting that this movie was supposed to come out before Secret Invasion but was delayed. That is why some of the film with Nick felt off as he hadn't gone through the Secret Invasion problems yet.

[@heroicDale]

There was still continuity problems even if this come out before Secret Invasion

[@thenatural1sttrpg]

I just got back from the theater and I had a good time, I wasn't expecting a huge MCU interconnectivity moment. I thought it was a good stand alone-ish movie. I have nit picks like Dar Benn could've been fleshed out a little better, though Zawe did a good job with what she was given. The flerkin eggs coulda been introduced a little earlier, and the flerkin evacuation scene got me laughing and a lot in the theater too (Afternoon monday don't bring a big crowd). I like that the final battle wasn't over done battle sequence, or sky beam. I don't mind a musical, so I don't dislike it. More or less I think this movie coulda used a bit more time on the clock for the emotional parts to land. Definitely not a movie for everyone but no movie really is. Except for Paddington 2. And Intergalactic wasn't in Star Trek, that was Sabotage.

[@hartshaped]

You 3 are great by the way, it’s good hearing different views and each opinion actually being respected.

[@TheKristianHarloff]

Thank you!

[@anthonypludwig]

The director, actors, and writers all not being responsible for the failure of the movie is quite a take.

[@mahatmasloth6543]

You've never hear of studio execs coming in and fucking up potentially good movies?

[@marcusdrake2400]

That’s because it’s not their fault

[@bryanwouters443]

@@marcusdrake2400 cope harder😂

[@marcusdrake2400]

@@bryanwouters443 right back at ya

[@arpitakodagu9854]

@@mahatmasloth6543 Yeah, I'm sure Kevin Feige was responsible for the cringe dance scene and the flerkens.

[@kevthepoet]

There's definitely gonna be a directors cut with a 20 minute musical number on Disney + lol

[@brannondunlap3408]

LOVE the spoiler videos with the boys! I enjoyed this video more than I thought I would. Not perfect by any means but I enjoyed it. And yes Winston I watched the WHOLE thing. Love you guys.

[@brannondunlap3408]

Oh my gosh I did a typo... I meant "Movie" not "Show" that's embarrassing. Thank you guys for the amazing content.

[@elsaandnoah]

I much rather rewatch the Marvels movie than Quantumania. I can’t even rewatch Thor Love & Thunder! Never finished Secret Wars, couldn’t get through episode 2-3 somewhere around there

[@damonasberry288]

I understand all of your points, but for me this movie is about mistakes and making things worse when trying to fix them. The emotional beat that got was Carol’s realization that everything was her fault and she had just made things worse the whole time. I feel like that really affected her. I also think that this applies to her revenge on the Kree, and also her relationship with the people she loves.

[@Jjbarrea124]

Fwiw I think it’s carol moving to louisiana. Not Kamala’s family

[@ilanhernandez9885]

I think for me the moment losing Monica still managed to have a lot of emotional impact. Larson sells it with the devastated expression on her face. It ends up doing two things for me which relates to the overall feeling of love among the three and in particular Carol and Monica's concerted effort to protect Kamala throughout. Primarily it's a private moment for Carol to grieve that necessitates and underscores that desire of hers not to fall apart in front of Kamala to better support her. There's definitely an interesting aspect to Carol, that could have been given a closer look here, similar to what was present in MOM with Dr. Strange about the struggle between the weight/strain/isolation of the duty of heroism and the very human longing for connection that is difficult to craft within that lifestyle. I still agree there could have been more done here around that ending and I think a big theme of why this movie works for me, this Larson moment as a microcosm, is how effective the trio's acting is to invest you despite it being clear that the movie holistically would really benefit from more time and intention to strengthen their work.

[@zaneplatt3533]

Whether the movie is bad or enjoyable seems to come down to how much weight one puts on storytelling vs character interplay and chemistry. The people who care about plot, motivation, meaning etc. have been dissapointed. The people who are satisfied with fun character interactions and fight scenes feel the opposite.

[@marquisjohnson2081]

Very insightful. I agree.

[@mahatmasloth6543]

So what ppl wanted it to be vs what it was? Expectations vs. Reality? When you go into a blockbuster action flick you expect citizen Kane or just want some good action set pieces and some decent bits to brake up the serious tones. I am not saying the movie was great or anything, but it was good enough for what it was to be entertaining. Don't get me wrong, I would love for marvel to pop off some arthouse adulting titles in the vein of joker but I can tell by previews when something isn't that and don't set myself up for disappointment in my expectations

[@marquisjohnson2081]

@@mahatmasloth6543 i think you misinterpreted that as a specific story but what I think they meant was a good meaningful story that felt like it had weight. Paddington is about a stuffed bear but the story still has weight and emotional depth while still being fun and silly

[@zaneplatt3533]

@@mahatmasloth6543 Marvel movies don't need to be gritty or arthouse flicks. Winter Soldier, Guardians 3, Iron Man 1 weren't. They just need to tell a better story and stop going for the cheap laugh and easy reaction.

[@ChrisTheAspergerGuy]

I gave most of my thoughts on the spoiler review yesterday, so no need to repeat myself, but Roxy pointed out a couple of things on Only Stupid Answers I forgot to mention. One of those things was how Carol didn't think to go back to Hala and reignite the sun right after she caused what she caused until Dar-Been started going after her and other planets, so she pretty much left those people there to suffer for many years. And the reason she never came back to visit Maria and Monica before the snap was that she was simply embarrassed of what she did to Hala. Yet, she couldn't be bothered to fix it back then? It kind of makes Carol look like a bad person, I don't know. Again, I don't get how destroying an AI system could wreck a planet like that, but that's the script for you. And again, it was Carol moving into Maria and Monica's house, not Kamala and her family.

[@alexp601]

Well Carol mentioned that she didn’t think she was capable of restarting the sun by simply flying into it. Monica gave her the pep talk to at least try it. And then yeah, Carol just had to simply fly into the sun at the end. It was all poorly done.

[@thelibrarianofalexandria6200]

Huh. I agree it could have been more fleshed out. But I loved the Andala scene and the flerkins. And the stuff that worked worked so much for me I dident mind the so so villain. I am planning on seeing it again soon.

[@TheKristianHarloff]

Glad you enjoyed!

[@iam_ad629]

The biggest issue was the runtime. If this movie was 2 hrs and 15 mins long ppl would have been more forgiving

[@famousthaneus9810]

That entirely depends on what would've been in those extra minutes though

[@iam_ad629]

Agree but I think if we had more backstory to the villain and just more scenes with the main trio together that would’ve help a lot 💯

[@Supercaculo]

I did watch the entire episode. And my opinion is I am utterly confused that is my general felling when it comes to conversation around this movie.

[@geeksontapshow]

The Marvels was supposed to come out BEFORE Secret invasion. That is why Fury felt odd.

[@AngryTeddyBear98]

Maria Rambeaux in the post credits scene clearly ad on the Binary costume originally a moniker of Carol Danvers in the comics

[@anthony5777]

Family was helping Carol move in to the house. They were not moving to Louisiana.

[@coachmiller5226]

I really enjoyed the movie. It was a blast for me. With that said, I can totally see why it just didn’t work for some people.

[@jimfarley8542]

Last Marvel movie I rushed out to see was Guardians Vol.3, everything else I saw at home because of the Pandemic or waited it out since I was busy and it was convenient. Given the lack of quality, the amount I saved on gas and concession stand food meant the FOMO was worth it

[@marquisjohnson2081]

That was the last Marvel movie before this one lol

[@FlishCosh-hi9tr]

I haven’t eaten since lunch. Frankly, I am over food.

[@andothersuchnonsense2685]

Iman Vellani is great in this and I hope she continues to appear, prominently, in future MCU things. I didn't like much else about this and I doubt I'll watch it again but there's a large swath of MCU stuff, even that I've liked, that I've only seen once so that's not even much of an indictment tbh

[@Knightfall182]

It's easy to stand out when the two other women play the roles completely stoic and lifeless.

[@The_Marvelorian]

@Knightfall182 That's not even close to being true.

[@btbcc12859]

I just watched the movie and had a good time. With that said, Capt Marvel has been used twice and she doesn't work. Move Ms. Marvel and her family up front. She brings the audience into the film that Caroll doesn't. As for Rambeau, this was pretty much her orgin story, and we get the ramifications of the blip that really wasn't explored in Wanda. Last the villian, I'm glad she was racking up the bodies but that also left the Water planet unresolved.

[@visual1221]

This was a 2 out of 10. Danvers upgraded suit was a symbolic representation of this film - colorless and lifeless. No threat in the dismal plot where no one was in any real danger. The characters were uninteresting; and no amount of CGI action and sporadic comedic quips was going to save it.

[@simonlachance6956]

Hey guys great review! Personally I liked the movie and had a good time. There were definitely some flaws in the editing and the writing. I would have loved to see more emotional weight in some scenes like when Carol tells the girls that she caused the fall of Hala. But the action, most of the humour and the connection between the 3 leads worked for me. Overall it for me it was good but had so much potential to be way better. I think one takeaway we can make about the recent mcu project is the writing. Marvel should really make sure they have a tight scripts before starting shooting. Like Coy said the focus should be more on REWRITES rather than reshoots! (And maybe I'm wrong but it was my understanding that Carol was the one moving in Louisiana, not the Khans. They were just helping her move I think?)

[@johnashford6897]

The Escape Pod scene was WTF to me. Who builds a station and not enough escape pods?

[@jim1242]

I dont know if there will be much interest with the Young Avengers. The audiance will look at this and say this looks like a cheap gimmick, and could be seenn as brigining in lessor versions of the beloved original avanegers.

[@jonathangomez9548]

Maybe but I want a team again to many stand alone players at the moment so I’d appreciate the young avengers

[@The_Marvelorian]

Just to give you guys some context regarding the singing planet scene. I hated it too, but it was actually inspired by a Kelly Sue DeConnick run where Carol visits a planet where they talk in rhyme and she marries Prince Yan.

[@robertwild9447]

Yeah, Winston really overestimated the box office on this one.

[@TheSwaggyBlerd]

It happens. 🤷🏾‍♂️

[@Ahhdamn86]

I understood going into this movie that it was supposed to come out before Quantamania and secret invasion and thats why Fury comes off normal. He hasn't been through the events from secret invasion yet.

[@mattgarcxc9]

Lashana Lynch was a version of Binary, based off one of Carol’s identities in the 80s

[@UCanGetWitThisOrUCanGetWitThat]

Just two corrections guys: The Marvels was initially scheduled to come out before Secret Invasion but it switched places with Ant-Man. Remember this movie was delayed multiple times. If this movie came out when it was supposed too then the Nick Fury character continuity problem wouldn't exist. And 2nd the Khans weren't moving to Louisiana, Carroll was moving in. Remember when they went through the moving boxes Kamala's mom pulled out that gold plate with Carol and Prince face on it.

[@famousthaneus9810]

Nah there'd still be a Fury issue, cuz dude deadass said there wasn't another place the Skrulls could go, yet ran into a colony of 'em (chronologically) weeks before

[@UCanGetWitThisOrUCanGetWitThat]

@@famousthaneus9810 that was literally destroyed.....so it makes sense

[@bkslippy1]

Now that the movie is finally on Disney+ and I’ve finally seen it, I’m here for your comments and discussion.

[@jesseyoung9043]

Great discussion guys!

[@sqeg24]

They did try (albeit a weak attempt) to set up the flerken egg pods, the scene with Kamala's parent when they're first brought into Fury's office, I think it was the mom that made some comment about Goose looking pregnant (paraphrasing).

[@josephashley4122]

I wonder if meeting your heroes could be theme like Disney Pixar Coco? Ms.Marvel meets Carol find out her dark past, Carol tries make right with victims of planets, not being there for Monica & better role model Ms.Marvel while dealing with villain/victim wants payback?

[@themambaking2478]

The family wasn’t moving to Louisiana Carol was. The mom was talking about the plate with Carol on it and she tells the mom to keep it. The plane was there and carol tells iman she’s taking care of it for Monica. The family was helping carol move in not the other way.

[@TheKristianHarloff]

Then HIRE MOVERS!!!

[@themambaking2478]

@@TheKristianHarloff hey I had nothing to do with the movie I’m just saying what I think happened

[@zaneplatt3533]

Marvel are more focused on being entertaining rather than compelling. Now more than ever, they sacrifice meaningful storytelling for quick laughs and easy reactions. Whether someone loves The Batman or Guardians of the Galaxy 3, those films had a clear vision and put their storytelling first. Marvel films (besides the aformentioned Guardians 3 and No Way Home) haven't done that consistently for so damn long. In Doctor Strange, they used a bunch of cheap cameos, in Love and Thunder they undercut the drama with humor and so on.

[@tsheporabekane4172]

👌🏾👌🏾👌🏾

[@thedefinitionisthis]

I’d say NWH, Wakanda Forever and GOTG3 put storytelling and character first and foremost, before having to “check the boxes”, so to speak.

[@mahatmasloth6543]

How did 5 min of cameos ruin a 2 hr movie for you? I swear, MoM only gets hate because it was in phase 4

[@zaneplatt3533]

@@mahatmasloth6543 That is far from the only issue with the movie. I mentioned the cameos because Marvel sure loves them and that movie had a lot of them

[@zaneplatt3533]

@@thedefinitionisthis I agree.

[@juicewick]

I really liked the chaos. the chemistry, the fights in that chaos. It needed a solid 15min+ more to be gravity to the emotional scenes. Its the "middle" of MCU. theres way worse and way better. Ms. Marvel i love and need so much more her.

[@IsiahBradley]

YAY!!!! THANKS for this, Capes and Cowls Gang!!!!!

[@Kalesauce]

You aren't the only people I keep seeing say that Carol moved the Khans to Louisiana but if you rewatch it's clear that they are just helping Carol move in - The boxes have her name and its items that belong to Carol like the dish with her and her "husband" painted on Also i'm 99.99% sure that Lashana is playing Binary in the post credit scene

[@hartshaped]

I have to disagree to a point with the issue over Carol not reigniting the sun sooner and it being something she could have figured out sooner, the common thread throughout the entire film although perhaps poorly undersold was that the 3 in them lacked confidence in themselves and their abilities… Monica didn’t believe in her abilities enough to confidently fly, Kamala was too wrapped up in hero worship to understand her own worth and Carol obviously was dealing with a lot of baggage of being a failure… it took Monica to tell Carol she was more than able to reignite the sun… my criticism is that after Monica got trapped, that there wasn’t an emotional scene between Kamala and Carol where she is reminded of what Monica wanted her to do, instead it’s a throwaway line when Kamala is asked about where Carol is, she just says “she’s gone to keep a promise” or something along those lines but the discussion is never shown My big criticism of the villain is she just had no screen presence and wasn’t at all menacing, I think they probably should have cast a bigger name and properly shown the aftermath of her stealing the resources I didn’t mind the singing planet as a bit of silliness, to me it felt like something I could have seen in Guardiands of The Galaxy, I could easily imagine the same set up with Star Lord having married a girl to gain something and needing to go back for a favour, I can just picture Rocket rolling his eyes at the singing… I agree though about the whole suit transforming into the princess dress I really was disappointed with the cinematography, I thought it started out incredibly promising, the shot with Carol leaving her ship and just floating out into space looked fantastic and I thought if it keeps some visual standards to that consistency this is going to be stunning but then everything else other than the house fight was bland, it really needed some inventive camera work and visuals on a par with GOTG vol 3.

[@CleansHaven]

Surprised they hadn't heard about the Young Avengers scene. That's the one that was the original post credit in the leak on Reddit months ago.

[@fearlessweaver]

As far as I can remember, ALL the dialogue RE: Carol being responsible for destroying the star was ADR, so I think that plot was constructed in post. Really curious as to what the original plot was. Release the DaCosta cut!

[@myaccount1861]

I saw the movie on Sunday. It was a fun light hearted silly little movie. Not everything has to be a masterpiece or heavy.

[@ChristianKrogh-Denmark]

Kinda ironic, that they felt the need to put in three iconic MEN from the MCU, in their final trailer, in a last desperate attempt to try and lure people into the Cinema 🤷‍♂️ Sorry, couldn’t resist. I saw it too. I don’t hate it, I just don’t care for it at all. The Marvel glory-days are over. It was an impressive 10 years run, but it’s done. Next they’ll bring back Iron man and Cap-A, and I don’t believe in a million years that they’ll be able to do it justice. It already feels desperate, and they’ll only make what happened before feel less important. But hey, money talks (and Disney NEEDS it at this point) Can Marvel get back to a better, more stabile state again? Sure, but it’ll never be nearly as grand, new and good as it ones was. The time has just passed, and these MCU Tv-shows just ain’t cutting it either. Most of it feels so lazy.

[@ready2reactr2r47]

Kristian, they only moved Carol to the house in Louisiana. The family was just helping her move in. Watch the movie again if you and you will see, although it wasn't a great movie.

[@mattlink6416]

Personally enjoyed the movie. In regards to the moving scene, I’m fairly sure that it was Carol moving into the house and they were just helping her move.

[@talesfromthehoodtv503]

Not a well written movie and it's not the director's fault? She helped write the film lol and i believe the director has a huge part of the blame,she was inexperienced with big budget films

[@ericsietsema2044]

I am neutral on this movie, I didn't like it, but I didn't hate it. My biggest question I have is, how old is Carol Danvers supposed to be? She was for sure in her 20s when she got her powers while in the air force, then fast forward almost 40 years????? When did they describe her powers at light powers? She got them from radiation from the teseract, never thought of that as light powers. I thought Carol was moving into the house in Louisiana, the platter with Carol, and her "husband" was in one of the boxes. Liked the mid credit scene, didn't need the shot for shot remake of ms.marvel trying to recruit kate though. Rather see a Disney ➕️ vs a movie

[@flintybraz1]

It's weird how neither Carol nor Dar-Benn has aged at all since the 90s.

[@rhetro777]

ikr? Carol looks like she's about the same age as Monica, who was a child 30 years ago. Carol should damn near be a boomer by now.

[@Mattsuniquehandle]

While Goose didn't act like a South Park cat in heat, it was eating random things and puking a lot the entire first half of the movie (including puking the Kree in Kamala's living room), which I took it to be a reference to pregnancy cravings and morning sickness. I had noted it as weird behavior for Goose, but didn't put it together as pregnancy signs until after the pregnancy was revealed, so in that regard I thought it was the right amount of subtle, but if you weren't enjoying the movie I can see it not registering.

[@swwolf3640]

My partner who LOVED Ms Marvel TV show, watched the Marvels with me and the music came on.....😮. She turned to me in the cinema, shook my hand and mouthed. W.T.F. WE DID IT Together. I'm a huge comic book nut and Marvel fan since 1977. We hated it. Someone in the writers room with their child and Disney-fied it. DC& WB BAD choices. It was shocking. Shocking

[@sethb4135]

Maria Rambeau is the character "Binary" in the post credits scene

[@lcrisman]

Lashonna Lynch was playing Binary. Which is an alternate version of Captain Marvel.

[@coolleyhigh]

I am in line with Kristian. Also what happened to the water planet. Did they take all the water?

[@jesussalazar1901]

I think the fact that elemental had the worst opening weekend number for a Pixar movie, and yet it still manage to be a modest success; makes me wonder if The Marvels could potentially run into the same scenario, specially giving the fact that there is almost no competition for the rest of the year.

[@Planet_Yavin]

On the Kamala holding and consoling Cap Marvel for her inability to save everyone. Its the right idiea, but it should be the other way around. Kamala is the rookie of the trio. She should be the one who's broken after that sequence. Cap Marvel is the experienced, grizzled veteran. Shes seen it all. Danvers should be the one holding Kamala, understanding how she feels because shes been there and seen that. Awesome spoiler review gentlemen. Always loads of fun!

[@icandy5593]

Can ppl remind Winston that it is not a showdown. He doesn't have to talk 100 words per minute

[@damonhawk6543]

Marvels was supposed to be released before Secret Invasion. That’s where the disconnect with Fury comes from.

[@andrepierre9169]

32:38 she did, that's when Goose was licking herself in front of everyone. If one character could have made the comment on Goose's behavior (the eating too)then it would make more sense.

[@visuallearning1620]

Kamalas mom does make a comment after the living room fight

[@mufasa37]

Times like these I really really really miss Jon Schnepp.

[@xFRZAg]

Thumbnails are going off 🔥

[@philrm99]

Loved The Marvels. I really enjoyed the bonding between Carol ,Monica, and Kamala. I was thinking of a extra post credit scene could've been Tatiana Maslany reprising her role as She-Hulk and Krysten Ritter as Jessica Jones making her debut in the MCU meeting Carol at her home in Louisiana for a night on the town.

[@ZachBobBob]

I'm with Winston all the fight/action stuff in this film was the best part. Truly something I haven't seen before. Overall the film was fine, just light-hearted fun. I'd watch it again over Love & Thunder or Quantumania or the first Captain Marvel. I truly didn't mind the musical planet either. Yeah of course it was a bit but what's wrong with bits? Not every single aspect of a movie purely has to play into plot, sometimes we can just have a bit of fun for five minutes. The people in my audience were all laughing during that part.

[@s.p.lawrence894]

She’s Binary. Another version of Captain Marvel from 80’s X-Men Chris Claremont era. Carol was experimented on by the Brood. Pretty sure, going off of memory. 😂

[@angelods417]

The marvels was supposed to come out before secret invasion. Continuity wise for nick fury the marvels events first then secret invasion.

[@Panthror]

About Nick Fury: Just imagine The Marvels takes place before Secret Invasion, then the events of Secret Invasion haven't happened in The Marvels and Nick Fury isn't the changed man he is at the end of that series. Marvel has done a lot of reshuffling of their schedule, so I can't be sure if that was the original order these project were supposed to come out in, but Nick Fury's behaviour would make more sense if The Marvels was originally planned to come out before Secret Invasion. I hope Marvel will confirm this, but for now that's my head-canon.

[@terrymcginnis01]

My head Canon would like to disregard Secret Invasion. Wow... That was awful.

[@mufasa37]

It was pretty clear to me that they were helping Carol move back into Rambo's old house in Louisiana. 🤷🏾‍♂️

[@SketchyDoodle]

Regarding the inconsistency with Nick Fury: chronologically, Secret Invasion apparently takes place after this movie.

[@terrymcginnis01]

I don't know... Secret Invasion ends with Fury saying the Kree want a peace treaty and we see the meeting in this movie.

[@CgNtech16]

People in the comments aren’t “smarter” than y’all, Winston. Y’all just missed where Beast says that Binary found Monica. Just wanted to add to the engagement. Love listening to y’all each week.

[@TheSwaggyBlerd]

lol our theater was full cause it was a screening so people were SUPER loud at the scene. Looking at box office numbers, sounds like people were able to hear at that moment…👀

[@CgNtech16]

@@TheSwaggyBlerd haha yep, that makes sense

[@SheilaDione]

38:41 Re Fury - I do believe this movie was supposed to come out before Secret Invasion.

[@jarednavarrete1740]

The family's great, everything that came out of the brother's mouth made me crack up....

[@Gunslinger199]

Pretty sure the Monica's house was supposed to be for Carol and the Khans.

[@georgiyshirinyants530]

You guys rock

[@BlackNerd94]

That Skrull refugee planet, why couldn't they have just taken their oxygen, but also it be written that they had plenty of ocean also, to take. Then no more singing planet