The Middle East's Roots Lie In the Fall of the Ottomans (w/ Eugene Rogan) | The Chris Hedges Report

[@akpanekpo6025]

At the risk of disregarding Eugene Rogan's magisterial work, what keeps drawing me to Chris Hedges are his deep-rooted sense of humanity and unwavering moral consistency - leaving aside his sublime intellect.

[@stevesayewich]

Chris, you are a great teacher. Thank you for enlightening me about the history of the Ottoman Empire. We are all suffering from ongoing colonialism worldwide. It is an addiction that many never realize and cure.

[@xeimaras8]

While Colonialism was bad, that does NOT make the Ottomans/Turks good by any means. They abused the Christians for hundreds of years, and carried out a genocide of the Armenians, Greeks, and Christians from what is "Turkey" today.

[@BarbarraBay]

@@xeimaras8 the Armenian issue started around & in WW1 due to political powerplays. Armenians naturally would be allied with Russia. Most Greeks left Turkey in the 1923 Population Exchange, again an issue related to WW1. Prior to the 19th & 20th century wars, the Ottoman Empire was pluralistic. This is why my non-Muslim ancestors are from there. Why don't you listen to the video rather than post comic book comments?

[@sofukadir2454]

​@@xeimaras8In Ottoman Empire Christians and Jews were ruling ethnics and Turks were slaves. Founder of modern Türkiye Mustafa Kemal Atatürk liberated Turks from Ottoman Empire. At same time Atatürk was military officer in Ottoman Army. Under his command British Emperialist Army was defeated in Gallipoli ( Çanakkale). İn Gallipoli Ottoman Army was loosing the battle, the head of the Ottoman Army was German, he passed the authority to Atatürk, German didn't want to take blame for the defeat of Ottoman Army in Gallipoli. But Atatürk who was extremely brilliant militaire with strategies and vision, succeeded - European Emperialist Army was buried in Gallipoli! Meanwhile he was in touch with Lenin, leader of the October Revolution in Russia. Emperialists were defeated in Euroasia! It's time for history to repeat itself! 😃

[@xeimaras8]

@@sofukadir2454 The Sultan opened the Ottoman Empire to Jews and welcomed them, so the Ottomans could use them to replace the Christian merchants. The Christians were persecuted and killed by Ottoman Turks on a regular basis.

[@dirtyyarenblacc9985]

​@@xeimaras8Bro in Europe i didnt see any muslim merchant to not persecuted or jailed when try to make trade even he is Muslim which Merchant's religion, Mohammed is Merchant and Qur-an ve good regulations about trade and Muslims control all of the trade routes. When christians persecuted muslim merchant is mean ''Merchantalism'', When Ottoman replace christians with Jews; It's colonialism; bro dont be hypocrisy. if you look late Ottoman History Chritians especially Armenians and Greeks was able to trade due to Foreign Merchants didnt want to trade with muslims and It make Muslims more poorer due to that flow of capital. Ottoman's Modern type of Ministers, non-muslim. Sadrazams which after Sultan, second place of Empire most of non-muslim until Second Balkan War. We learned that Ottoman is Balkan Empire, Balkans live in wealth, Balkans govern that.

[@Ericwest1000]

This is a truly exciting interview, Chris, this Professor Eugene Rogan is a treasury of historical knowledge of the Middle East. I learned an enormous amount and am profoundly grateful to you both!

[@Matt-vo1ge]

My Dad's uncle was in the Navy and at Gallipoli, and the story passed down was that if there was one person he could have gotten away with killing, it would have been Winston Churchill. It had become clear to him and his shipmates that those being sent to fight were being sent to be slaughtered. Fascinating interview, thanks.

[@cardanotony1097]

👍👍👍

[@donnavorce8856]

Always the way it is. Send impressionable youth to protect the elites.

[@hitreset0291]

Only people over 40 should ever be sent to war. You would no doubt then witness alot of recently unlived politicians if they make such a stupid decision as sending them to war.

[@WestSideGorilla1980]

Churchill has a history that most people never know about, the British Donald Rumsfield of his day. He has been deified like a lot of political hacks.

[@deschutesmaple4520]

Indeed. Churchill was a horrible person. Really into eugenics, white supremacy, and british imperialism. He referred to the Palestinians as 'camel dung eaters', and fully supported the creation of Palestine-as this would have Europe's Jews move to Palestine by the thousands instead of Britain.

[@omare7475]

I could listen to him all night

[@mindbliss7764]

Man im telling yall, to get this type of information for free its truly a blessing for humanity. Fantasic interview by two true historians

[@OneVoiceVoicing]

INDEED so valuable

[@czevon]

This was an excellent interview. Thank you, Chris.

[@aneurindavies5943]

"The most powerful form of Lie is omission; it is the duty of Historians to make sure that those lies do not creep into the History books" The Orwell Foundation Archives.

[@hitreset0291]

True. True. israel continues to treat Americans as useful idiots. When will Americans wake up to this trickery and their 'in your face' disrespect? smh🤦‍♀️

[@KonstanzArrens]

Chris Hedges is a great interviewer, he asks all the pertinent questions. Very informative - both the professor and Chris.

[@hugobnyc]

Every time I listen to Chris Hedges it’s like another layer of weight is taken off my head chest and shoulders Thank you for such an enlightening interview with Professor Rogan ..

[@MrMaxLions]

I completely reject the word genocide when refering to troubles between the falling Ottoman Empire and it's Armenian citizens. The reason for this is simple: The word genocide is NOT an accurate description for the horrors of the time as it asserts a one sided evil delivered in a systematic way. This was not the case. The flames of the Armenian uprising were fanned by imperial Russia & Britain ( in reference to the nationalist movement) The seeds of ASALA were sewn at this time. The Armenian gangs were given guns and told to attack their neighbours while the men were at war. The armed gangs tried to assassinate the Sultan and carried out many terrorists acts like blowing up the Ottoman bank. Chris says "they get caught up in the game" and skips many details and spews out "Armenian genocide" The British used to quel uprisings as did the Russians and the Early Americans. None of those are accused of genocide. All the above is a matter of public record and can be cross referenced. It's a fact that the armed Armenian (not all Armenians) gangs were given guns and did terrible things. In turn the Ottoman Turks did terrible things. But this was NOT a genocide. Research Maskirovka and read about the role Imperial Russia played in this historical mess. But it's acceptable to blame the Turk for everything. Chris Hedges should know better and be better read around this subject

[@MrMaxLions]

Both Rogan and Hedges don't mention ASALA but @56:03 talks about the assassination of high ranking Ottoman officers but DONT mention who carried out the assassination. The Armenian gangs carried out many assassinations. They raided villages and carried out many massacres. The Ottomans carried out massacres. In this interview, no mention is made of OTHER SIDE OF THE STORY. According to these two, the Turks turn up in Asia Minor in 1070, they wait 900 years and decide to kill off one group for no reason, with no influence from other imperial forces. Both Hedges & Rogan know the truth but glaze over it. It takes 59 minutes for then to talk about oil. People aren't stupid. Carving up the Ottoman Empire was a bloody business but asserting that the Turks were the sole bas guys is incorrect

[@assurmalka173]

You get your info from the west and not from people that lived in that time in the hakari mountains like the ASSYRIANS ....ASSYRIANS DID MORE THEN TO WIN THE WAR AGIANST OTTOMANS THEN THE ENGLISH...BUT THEY DONT NOT TEACH ABOUT THAT PART . They always mention christian but they don't say what nation this Christians are ..assyrians have been manicured over and over to date and no one talks about them ..asayrians fought in ww1 ww2 as well and still no mention of that in the books but yet they talk about the kurds .and ass we speak usa toke iraq in 2003 and gave the assyrian land to be controlled by the kurds .and today we see an athnic cleansing AGIANST the ASSYRIANS but there is no human rights movement doing anything about it or even just mentioning it to the word . So the history books are all bullshut ..the zainist do not want you to know the truth of history...and as for Syria in the 1900s it was assyria when it was mandated the toke the a out and called it Syria...toros mountains all assyrians today all Arabs and kurds and still threatening the assyrians yo leave of get killed ...thinks to the west

[@farukkonuralpeser2906]

​@@MrMaxLions gerçeği konuştuğunuz için teşekkür ederim

[@hamzamalkoc8773]

First of all thank you for being objective on this topic. As a Turkish, I see that what Ottoman did is wrong but not genocide. As you mentioned, armenin get armed by russia and started mass killing on turkish villages. As a falling ottoman empire had not enough power to stop the riot and decided to deport all armenian to Syria. However, on the way ottoman soldier did not escort citiziens to the border. Then armenian attacked by thiefs, turks ( who lost their families on armenian riot ), and many of them killed for not enough medicine and food. In the end, I still can not say its a genocide, because there is any decision from empire that cover mass killing of armenians or harm them. But I also accept that many armenian died beacuse of this deportation.

[@sumayyabhorat790]

Thank you for sharing a glimpse of the 'other side'... with much respect to both gentlemen, it is sad to realise that objectivity is not ALWAYS possible regardless of the knowledge base of the interlocutors...

[@cy3689]

Thank you for the excellent interview. My great-grandfather died in the Sari Kamis Campaign in the Caucasus. Professor Rogans is the true historian who challenges the ethnocentric and racist European accounts of history.

[@francoisehembert3243]

Thank you gentlemen for this enlightening interview.

[@MB-dp1rj]

Could listen to these two gentlemen all day! Having been to Gallipoli a few years ago during a month long journey through Turkey...this is a most interesting conversation. Delighted to see Mr. Hedges has his own channel!

[@otgunz]

Finally some Westerners coming to their senses. Greetings from Çanakkale, Gelibolu (Gallipoli) Türkiye, where the Anglofrench Western power tried to pass to no avail. And unlike how the West and Israel treats Middle Easterners, the Turks erected monuments for the dead Westerner boys on Gallipoli, had let those countries to erect their own memorials and Turks declared to the world "Don't mourn sad mothers, your sons or our sons now, lying with our sons in peace under the soil of Gallipoli". And Americans among you have a great duty, DO WHATEVER IT TAKES TO PREVENT THE US REGIME FROM STARTING A NUCLEAR WORLD WAR IN A DESPERATE ATTEMPT TO SAVE ITS WORLD HEGEMONY STATUS. Let our millions of dead soldiers and civillians throughout history as the human species don't be invain by losing all our species due to a hegemon taking down the house with himself. That duty and burden is on you especially as the citizens of the world has zero say and effect on US politics. Only you can save the world FROM YOUR OWN GOVERNMENT. When all the crazy leaders of the world shouted hysterically, he made a very heavy statement that gives chill to any and all. Thus I am ending my comment with Mustafa Kemal Atatürk pasha's words since they fit this my argument dead on! PEACE AT HOME, PEACE IN THE WORLD!

[@kenharris5390]

Excellent presentation. Thank you, Mr Hedges and Professor Rogan.

[@VickiNikolaidis]

A much needed book. Thank you very much. 🙏

[@krischanlive]

Mr. Hedges is the best interviewer I've ever seen. Besides everything else ofc.

[@WestSideGorilla1980]

Thank you Chris for the integrity and truth in your work, in a better world you would be our foreign policy maker. Thank you sir.

[@MichaelHolloway]

More history please. That was great!

[@assurmalka173]

Sorry but they are not given you the full history and half tru only ...

[@judyharper288]

Brilliant thanks fascinating listening to how Ottoman Empire grew then lost its hegemony.

[@sedatpir1905]

Every empire ever existed has had the same fate. Starting with the conquering stage, then stable stage, and the fall.. But what is unique to with the Turks is, we have always created a new empire, one after another 16 times.. And we still exist unlike some 😅

[@sofukadir2454]

​@@sedatpir1905Aynen öyle. Onun için hala ağızlarından Türk'ün adını duymuyoruz.

[@ahmadrizasiddiqi]

For me, it’s an excellent way to listen to a podcast about history rather than reading. Narration is very good for non English speakers like myself. Fascinating stuff and I will have to rush through it once again

[@juttagalbory6659]

This interview is very appropriately timed; I'm sure that I'm not the only one who is asking "What did I know about the history of the Ottoman Empire." I'll be ordering that book. I've been asking about Russia too..what happened in the time between Russia becoming Christian, and toda?. There's a lot there...from Czar Peters' travels in Germany to Stalin to Putin & today.

[@oscarindiago4645]

If you want to learn about ottomans then I suggest you listen to it from the people themselves the Turks , you can always read subtitles if you don't understand Turkish 👍

[@batlash1]

It's a 1000 year history??? Russia was the third Rome and the protector of Christians in the Ottoman Empire.

[@cardanotony1097]

@@batlash1😲😲😲 Ur worse than a Pinnochio’S mate!!!

[@fredflinstone6601]

@@oscarindiago4645any suggestions where

[@JanissaryAustin]

You will quickly realize that you can't learn about the Ottomans without learning about Russia and vice versa. The pre-empire histories of both polities is just as fascinating as well.

[@Free-g8r]

Superb interview and guest. Wonderful to learn about this seldom discussed history of the Ottomans

[@amargamentedoce]

Huge respect for your work and global perspective that is always deliver

[@sameer4937]

Rare voice of sanity & reason!

[@Dan-DJCc]

Glad to be taught the truth. Thank you both.

[@ferdinandthinker2400]

Memluk was also Turkish

[@williamdavis9562]

Actually no. Memluk was Turkic. And yes there is a huge difference between Turkish and Turkic.

[@TahanaWhite]

Thank you Chris from New Zealand

[@Buf-g6m]

Great informative discussion and congratulations on your independence chris!

[@nailadr]

Absolutely wonderful interview CH👍👏👏👏

[@georgekoedel247]

I read it 8 years ago. Definitely worth a re read.

[@magdaelnokaly7538]

Chris Hedge you must be the most honest man in the World!!! I love your bringing the oil point!! The British knew of the oil

[@WestSideGorilla1980]

His integrity made legacy media try to bury him, that's when you know Chris is a humanitarian. Not many real journalists left.

[@walkingoff22]

Thank you both for the discussion on this valuable context indeed. Chris, how can I assist with translating your video transcriptions into Turkish, as this option is not directly available on KZbin? I'd be happy to contribute in this way to help reach a Turkish audience.

[@NV_Out-of-Place]

Thanks for this wonderful informative interview. Always grateful to Chris Hedges Reports, and looking forward to reading this book.

[@birsenyazici7360]

BTW majority of Armenians forced to march were killed by Kurdish tribes; but being the darling of West, this is never acknowledged.

[@dominationstatepodcast]

Thank you Chris & team.

[@jacobyahiayan9039]

Outstanding historical perspective

[@hongkongischeaper]

Why didn't you invite a Turkish historian to talk about the fall of the Ottomans? You are reproducing the colonial narrative by introducing a Western historian's work "from the Turkish perspective" as unique... It is not unique at all, Turkish historians have been writing about this for decades but for those in the US/Europe his perspective only "matters" and counts as unique because he is a white Western man.

[@ahmadrizasiddiqi]

A good point to consider. Do we have a Turkish version narrated like this. Or please recommend a good by a Turkish writer

[@basmakhan6938]

Chris Hedges most honest analyst 👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻

[@thairk]

So great program, always!

[@lindarushton6502]

Ver clever man. I wish your messages could be packaged as 15 min cartoons, and fed to the masses like the tv show called the Simpson's!

[@donnavorce8856]

That's actually an awesome idea. If I were Warren Buffett I would do it as a service to humanity. ❤

[@cheri238]

Thank you, Chris Hedges & Professor Eugene Morgan. I have not read his book, " The Fall of the Ottomans," another book I will have to obtain. Thoroughly, an interesting discussion about this particular history of the Ottoman Empire with all its complexities and who was in charge of making decisions who were in power. There was one name that grabbed my attention, and that was Henry Morganthal was the ambassador from the United States and writing about this horror to the NYT. Who was Henry Morganthal?

[@fredflinstone6601]

Juiw who….,

[@lah6739]

Really interesting and enlightening. Thanks so much Chris. I learned a lot.

[@JeffM---]

Very interesting, thank you. Eugene's knowledge of this subject is amazing.

[@JuliusGalacki]

Terrific interview

[@enkeka2557]

Very informative! Thank you!

[@catherinemorrow6596]

Great discussion - I learnt so much. History is a huge part of context - usually the major part. Thank you.

[@hitreset0291]

Thank you Chris for bringing us this interview.

[@CommandG0]

Thank you for bringing this literature to video format

[@theswordofkings7549]

Excellent, with so much information that I will watch this again 👍

[@marciasandberg4513]

That was so helpful to understand as to where the world is today. Thank you. Wish I more intrigued with history in my younger life as much as I do in my 50’s

[@mariemills-ff8qy]

Very informative. I need to read this book. Thank you for this discussion. So few people know anything about this.

[@charleskesner1302]

Excellent discussion. Thanks.

[@Acode7940]

If I h ad a better mind for grasping geopolitical history, the interview woulld have launched me into such study---ir it is much more interesting than the history considered fit for mass consumption. Thanks.

[@faizaambah]

Exactly. Excellent interview ❤

[@hayatraja7360]

Great interview , thank you

[@donnavorce8856]

Thank you from another person interested in truth.

[@mznxbcv12345]

36:00 this was true and the primary reason why Woodrow Wilson joined the effort, Bernard Baruch was the funding source for Wilson's presidential campaign.

[@lacha608]

A review of all the successive empires that have ruled the middle East and adjacent areas would be informative. No doubt each has left its marks.

[@deansawich6250]

Thanks to you both for a very interesting discussion. ❤❤❤

[@basharabuali5514]

Wonderful interview Chris and professor Rogan

[@hokulealinda]

EXCELLENT !!

[@newjerseydevil6115]

Thank you, sir. ❤

[@kirstenebsen1726]

Thank you for this education.

[@Marius_vanderLubbe]

An excellent guest. I would question only his use of the term northern Ireland rather than the north of Ireland.

[@davidwright8432]

Listen more carefully! He does say Harland and Wolf in 'Northern Ireland', quite distinctly. Being an historian, he's very aware of that distinction.

[@Marius_vanderLubbe]

@@davidwright8432 Twaddle.

[@johndavis2399]

Hugely informative.

[@ahsayboy2498]

Most interesting

[@nizal9388]

Ottomans were a part of the Islamic world long before the 1500s. The Mamelukes did have cannons. It was a tactic by the ottomans to pull the Mamelukes cavalry away and out of supporting range from the Mamelukes cannons. Mameluke Egypt and it's administration was incorporated into the ottomans just as middle eastern Iraqi administrative systems of Baghdad were incorporated by the ottomans. "Ottomans" were part of the Muslim world mix long before 1500s

[@macanoodough]

Gotta say I'm loving the new format where the conversation can take its natural time. But never apologize for your dog. Alistair Crooke's dog sounded like he was murdering the mailman while he explained the media blackout in Israel over Hezbollah's hitting two targets near Tel Aviv. Nobody complains about dogs on KZbin. It makes them feel like they're in your living room having a conversation. It's all part of the experience. And if you believe in animal rights, you should have at least shared its name. On a more relevant note: I was fascinated to recently learn that the Young Turks fought into the 1920's to establish the state of Turkey. The west may have picked the bones of the empire, but Turkey got the city center, so to speak. But they had no imperial intentions so we say the war ended in 1918, though they fought on for their cause completely ignored by the west. And Palestine was around 10% Jewish by WWI. They had grown from 2 or 3% in 1905 with the first call to return to the homeland. The Arabs wanted to support them, but feared the Zionists would call for their expulsion and revolt. By the start of WWI there was already organized military action springing up. Skirmishes would be off and on until after WWII when the influx of Ashkenazi saw their numbers rival the Arabs and then were able to successfully revolt.

[@MD-bu3xc]

I think you must mean Alastair CRooke, not Cooke. He passed away 20 years ago.

[@sofukadir2454]

Arabs stabbed the Ottoman Army in the back and collaborated with British Emperialists. Now they pay for it.

[@Fran-2023]

great history talk. thank you Chris

[@SimonBell-r5s]

Thanks. Excellent interview.

[@MrJamshedakhtar]

great history lessons in this clip

[@ThePsypsy1]

Why Armanians dont agree on openning and reviewing historical documents to get to the bottom of this so called geneocide?

[@birsenyazici7360]

Like Ottoman Arabs who were supported by British against Turks; Armenians were supported by Czarist Russia. They took arms against the Muslims (Balkan and Turk) of Ottomans before and during the WW I.

[@carenkurdjinian5413]

This Is Very Important Question - Information - To Analyze ….🌞

[@elizabethcabal1741]

Thank you so much - a treat!

[@satchyan]

Thank you for dedicating a portion of the program to the genocide of the Armenians

[@ThePsypsy1]

Mr. Hedges, we are tired of hearing colonial arguments and historians talking about other countries history. We would like to hear the Turkish perspective with actual historic documentations.

[@peterlovett5841]

May I suggest that your guest contacts the military historians at the Australian War Memorial in Canberra regarding the initial Turkish defences at Gallipoli, at least against the ANZAC landings. Nothing in depth, no machine guns and rudimentary defences. It was an Australian officer who had no confidence in the plan who halted his troops short of their objectives. This allowed the Turkish defences time to regroup and bring up the necessary hardware to permanently halt the allied advance.

[@sofukadir2454]

The victory of Gallipoli is the victory of strategy and vision of Mustafa Kemal Atatürk- founder of modern Türkiye. European Emperialist Army was defeated and buried in Gallipoli!😅

[@Paul-ox4oi]

This is as good as it gets

[@devinderstrongheart]

Excellent video!…Chris Hedges suggests that the Armenian genocide was the first of the 20th century…Actually Germany takes that distinction with the genocide it carried out in Namibia.

[@williamdavis9562]

I’m still not fully convinced of the official narrative we’re fed about the genocide of Armenians

[@MrJamshedakhtar]

history repeats itself

[@dwightmcfee9521]

Excellent! Thank you.

[@littlesigh]

Fascinating!

[@huseyincan5516]

Actually we are still here Larger then before

[@juliacheetham6854]

Amazing!!

[@patrickholt2270]

David Lloyd George wasn't a socialist. He was the last Liberal Party Prime Minister. As a Welshman he was influenced by the Labour movement, but he wasn't from it. His primary political influence was Nonconformism, Welsh Evangelicalism, which was strongly identified with the Liberal Party, which of course promoted social conscience and a redistributive agenda as Christian Democrats tend to do, as well as religious liberty. Before WW1 the Liberal Party had begun to split into the Liberal Imperialist and Social Liberal factions which ultimately split into different parties in the 1920s, enabling the newly formed Labour Party to become the chief alternative party of government to the Conservative Party. Lloyd George was identified with the Social Liberals ever since the Liberal Party 1906 General Election Manifesto which had promised all the reforms the Unions were demanding, and which was excoriated in the press as base Populism (Populism as villified in the USA in the 1890s as the autonomous labouring masses' proto-Socialist movement it was and is). But he was solidly a pro-capitalist who relied on private donations to fund his career and the Liberal Party's election campaigns.

[@davidwright8432]

Many thanks to you both! I've long wondered how the present 'Middle East' would have looked had the Ottomans allied themselves with the British, rather than the Germans, when they had the opportunity to make that choice. No Sykes-Picot, no Balfour Declaration. But Zionism, yes. How the post-WW1 Ottomans would have continued to dealt with that, as they had been since the late 19th century, would be the basis for epic movies or novels!

[@kussemeinkont]

Britain refused their offer of alliance in 1913

[@sofukadir2454]

British Emperialists want everything for themselves! 😅

[@didemakpinar1154]

I remember watching the live news when 9/11 happened. I was at my math tutor's home. We all gasped in horror, and he said "They are gonna make our lives hell in the Middle East."

[@birsenyazici7360]

How about the Turkish/Muslim genocide committed in Balkans and Anatolia? It is ignored in the great tradition of Orientalism!

[@sebwah]

Excellent thank you

[@scritthekid5943]

Brilliant. Thank you.

[@Froghole-gw6xq]

Excellent discussion, with only one minor gripe: were there not the khilafat/Moplah movements in India (especially in the Deccan) which were a really big, if a largely a local, problem for the Raj for nearly a decade after 1915, and which only really ended when Ataturk abolished the caliphate?

[@clubbinraver]

Mr What a beautiful, righteous, objective and trustworthy man you are... May Allah be your protector...

[@magdaelnokaly7538]

Only Egypt’s frontiers were not affected! They sprang their own Khedive out of the Ottoman Empire

[@அவானிஉயர்ந்தது]

Yeah . That’s another interesting story with that Albanian Pasha who took over Egypt

[@johngeren1053]

That was Muhammed Ali. His son, Ibrahim, in the 1840s made an attempt to form an Arab nation that included all of the Levant, Mesopotamia and much of the Arabian peninsula in a relatively peaceful separation from Istanbul. The British FM, Lord Palmerston, organized the "European Concert" to thwart Ibrahim Pasha's effort and to prop up the Ottoman Empire which Palmerston depicted as Europe's "sick man" who needed to be rehabilitated as a n opponent of Russia. This the Arab world was brought into "the Great Game" against Russia as pawns. That's a recurring theme for Western imperialism.

[@windalfalatar333]

Gallipoli was very much Churchill’s (as First Lord of the Admiralty) brainchild. It was thought that by knocking out the Dardanelles, thereby knocking out the props from under Ottoman Empire. The problem is that Turkey and the Ottomans are a land power, not a naval power. A recruiting sergeant can just walk into a village and sound a gong and you’ll have 20-30 men volunteering to sign up. Tactically, the idea was to take out the Dardanelles using a Royal Navy operation using naval guns from the ships. The problem was that these naval guns were adapted to firing on other ships and to sear shipboard armour, not concrete bulwarks. The naval bombardment failed to clear the gun emplacements and their guns. Consequently, you had tremendous opposition from Ottoman guns. David Lloyd George (‘the Goat‘ for his love of the ladies) was a Liberal. There were different factions of the British establishment. I’m sure the leaders, such as Lloyd George, Churchill, Curzon and others, were probably imperialists first and anything else second, but there were heavily pro-Zionist British at the F.O. There were also pro-Arabs at the Arab Bureau and pro-Arabs like Col. Lawrence. President Wilson was an ardent racist. Just as one example he was the one to re-segrefate the White House. He was in truth an imperialist just like Lloyd George and Foch etc. He was just a neo-colonialist rather than a classic imperialist, so that colonies would not fly the Stars and Stripes the way India flew the Union Jack, but entirely economic, the way Latin America was carved up between different U.S. companies like United Fruit. It is wrong to portray Wilson as an idealist, at least not an idealist favoring the poor and the opressed. The characterization of W.W.1 as cavalry charging into machine gun fire is wrong. Cavalry was actually effectively used, especially in the Middle East (the Battle of Megiddo counting as the last cavalry battle in history). Also remember that horses were MUCH more important to the waging of war at the end of the war than tanks, trucks or other motor vehicles on land. Even i W.W.2, horsedrawn artillery was much more preponderent in the German Army than motor-propelled artillery. The horse was as late as W.W.2 for most belligerents s much more important locomotive force than the internal combustion engine.

[@sofukadir2454]

Dardanelle's victory is the victory of Mustafa Kemal Atatürk- founder of modern Türkiye ! Victory of his strategy and vision! European Emperialists were defeated and buried in GALLIPOLI! 😅

[@windalfalatar333]

@@sofukadir2454 The Young Turks Movement and Atatürk were hardly good people considering not only the Armenian genocide but also decades of oppressive governance following their takeover. I agree that the British Empire and Commonwealth of Nations were imperialistic, but so were, and are, the Turks, because all capitalistic powers are inherently imperialistic. They are not equals on the imperialist ladder of power but even though countries like Norway or Sweden may seem harmless when compared to the United States, they too seek to favor their own capitalists in the export of capital at the expense of poor people the world over. This too was true of both the Ottoman Empire and modern day Turkey. The defense by the Turks of the Dardanelles and Gallipoli was not a Che Guevara moment. Socialism and nationalism are not the same.

[@sofukadir2454]

@@windalfalatar333 Ottoman Empire was emperialist, i agree with you. The founder of Ottoman was Turk, after him his son took became sultan, who was pure Turk . The rest started getting married to different nationalists, at the end sultans were not even Turk. And Turks became ethnics in the Empire and were seen as deplorable and they became deplorable. Favorite ethnics for Sultas were Armenians and Jews. Atatürk liberated Turks from Ottomans. He was nationalist and he didn't have emperialist ideas, he'd never had. In Dardanelle and Gallipoli Atatürk did fight against European Emperialists. Been nationalist doesn't mean been rasist and emperialist. At that time Ottoman was not only Empire, there were few in Europe, plus British Empire. Those were not innocent, either. And today's emperialists are constantly agresif and globally agresif of the name of democracy. Arabs stabbed Ottoman in the back, collaborated with British and French and since then they've never seen peace. And they continue to pay very heavy price. Turks fought alone against emperialists for their independence, but not Arabs, unfortunately, Arabs didn't have leader like Atatürk. Atatürk is a kind of leader, born once in a hundred years! Therefore European Emperialists still hate him, but they never be able to erase him from the history.

[@windalfalatar333]

@@sofukadir2454 I agree with what you say on all or most of the issues of which I have knowledge. I think that nationalism is not intrinsically racist. Where we disagree on imperialism I think is an issue of semantics. I am a Communist and therefore I consider all capitalist countries to be somewhere on the imperialist power ladder, but if you don’t want to call less powerful countries imperialist that’s fine. Some Arabs allied with the British and French Empires because they saw independence from the Ottomans as beneficial to them. The Vietnamese allied with the Soviets to get rid of the Americans, because without the Soviets that would have been impossible, in exactly the same way that the Bolsheviks allied with the German Empire to get rid of the Tsar, or the colonists in North America allied with the French and Spanish Empires to get rid of the British Crown in what became the United States. Having a powerful patron is generally necessary to achieve your political and military goals. Isn’t Prince Feysal of Mecca an equally idealist “freedom fighter” to Kemal Atatürk? Maybe not. But my understanding of Atatürk is that he committed atrocities while in power. That he was not a Che Guevara or Fidel Castro.

[@sofukadir2454]

@@windalfalatar333 I agree with you. I understand what you mean. Communism is a idealism , communist is a idealist. I am a idealist , too. I am a Turk, born in Bulgaria. Thanks to Red Army I had wonderful childhood and adolescence in Bulgaria. When I migrated to Türkiye, I had the shock of life. Learning capitalism in a theory and living capitalism in practice. Since Atatürk passed away in 1938 Türkiye is capitalist country. During the of Atatürk rejim's name wasn't socialism, but in practice was very close. If you mean Kurd's problem, it is another story. The medal has always two sides. Kurds are living in tribe culture even today, imagine in 1920's and 1930's. They have never accepted Republic of Türkiye. Then they were in British lapse, today in American lapse, nothing changed for Türkiye, only their master changed. Several uprising were organized by British, today they are organized as a terrorist against Republic of Türkiye. I agree, there is no democracy today, but not only for Kurds, for Turks either. Imagine the bully boy- provokes, provokes, provokes, at the end is killed by his victims. Same thing for nations. This is the law of Nature. If parasites got in your body, you can not survive if you don't get rid of them. In socialist system is the same thing- you don't attack, but if you're attacked, you defend yourself. Defendness is not the agresivness. I am 65 years old and in my life time I understood that good people don't have to close eyes to bad people. Tough times make tough people, tough people make good times, good times make soft people, soft people make tough times- quot of the wise person. I remember in high school, our teacher in history course said- communisme can be built only by high conscious people, but were are not there yet. According to Edward Bernays 95% of people have tendency to be manipulated, 1% is ruling, the voice of 4% is not even heart in the chaos. With all my respect for Fidel Castro and Che Guevara. Fidel had to kill the parasites to get rid of them. Right? Otherwise it's impossible .I congratulate you for your idealism, at same time I am suggesting you to seek the absolute truth! Sociologie is not mathématique- 2+2=4, in sociologie 2+2 makes 5. I wish you all the best in your life.

[@Mt-hw7oo]

It's been weird to hear that "Ottoman Empire was the most terrifying state in the mediterranean basin." For a modern Turk, the empire was an unsuccesful, feodal islamic state only.

[@BarbarraBay]

wonderful video. thank you

[@conchitaharper4723]

God bless you both.