The Philosopher’s Stone Created Aurelius Dumbledore [Harry Potter Theory]

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Today J dives into the Wizarding World of Harry Potter and Fantastic Beasts to discuss one of its biggest active mysteries: Where did Credence aka Aurelius Dumbledore come from? How can Dumbledore have a brother he knows nothing about? Why did the Phoenix appear to him? What did it have to do with the Philosophers Stone?
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[@SuperCarlinBrothers]

This explains EVERYTHING right!??

[@naomi_falk]

It has to

[@judaheisenberger2883]

It doesn't explain why the movie is so bad

[@obiwankenobi1377]

Yes yes yes

[@KllDLn]

Yes it does

[@henriettaanneeles490]

Uhhh... gimme a sec to process.....ok

[@themoldysausage]

J.K. Rowling: Writes plot point that makes no sense Carlin brothers: Let me fix that for you.

[@MadiganinPeach]

Couldn't have said it better.

[@vicospiano]

Haha i felt the exact same. really really loved that theory, the only thing that i'm curious about is how did Grindelwald realise that Credence was Aurelius? And if he can see the future, wouldn't he have been able to tell much earlier that Aurelius had not died in the shipwreck and then wouldn't he have gone looking for him much sooner?

[@sarahglover3286]

Yep!

[@lijunyin1341]

True

[@shreyasiroy3579]

They should be paid for moping up the plot points..😂😂😂

[@kerahbundy5705]

When he said "Ariana means silver. Aurelius means gold." I lost my mind.

[@victoriabryer4710]

Me reading this comment as J says it 😆

[@geekweek9673]

I was like: “Wow. They used the stone to metaphorically turn silver into gold.”

[@ninjabluefyre3815]

Is that why Ariana from Pokemon was called that, because she was in Gold and Silver?

[@Zakofidea]

@@nadiategeneva3232 "The name Aurelius is a boy's name of Latin origin meaning "the golden one". ... In ancient Roman history, the name is associated with Marcus Aurelius, a Roman Emperor from 161 to 180 AD, the last of the so-called "Five Good Emperors." He is also considered one of the most important Stoic philosophers." And it took a minute to find on google, but the meaning of Ariana in Old English is apparently Silver. I however do appreciate your comment because it did make me look it up instead of just taking their word for it.

[@Zakofidea]

@@nadiategeneva3232 Thats probably true. I searched for the name meaning for Ariana rather than Silver in other languages, because names are usually only related to the words and not direct translations. Here is what I found. Probably not the best source, but I can see how they found it. Meaning and Origin of Ariana - FamilyEducation Girl name origins & meanings. Hebrew : Like a beautiful melody; Old English : Silver; Greek : Holy. Girl name variations. Aari · Aarie · Aariel · Aaries · Aree · Arey.

[@kg5999]

I'm cracking up though at just the thought of Flamel and Dumbledore standing there with a baby and low-key panicking.

[@goatplaysguitar]

Lol this deserves more likes

[@PR7-82]

@@goatplaysguitar it's currently at 380 and 2021 isn't over yet

[@squxde]

@@PR7-82 410

[@squxde]

@@PR7-82 411

[@jupitateo8094]

545

[@diablo595]

Love how people on the internet casually make better stories then the writers that do this for a living. There’s no way that something this smart and creative will be real.

[@Rakotino]

Yeah you are so right hahaha. I think its because if this theory was true and they put it in the movie people would complain and syaing its to complicated.

[@almostirrelevant9181]

I’ll be honest, that made a lot more sense than I thought it would.

[@lahlybird895]

that is the usual reaction to a crazy SCB theory

[@MiaNena545]

Same

[@patrickjinks]

Welcome to the channel ;)

[@Marcilla_Fae]

Aspen Hansen I know right

[@AndyHappyGuy]

credence's aunt who died during the shipwreck: am i a joke to you?

[@SeamusGorman4]

this is the best theory I’ve seen in a LONG TIME

[@naomi_falk]

Hi Seamus! I loved your last video! I don't know if this means anything to you, but I think your hair looks great.

[@LightsOnTrees]

It's the guy with short hair from the chanel about the thing! Agree v. good work on this one.

[@MEG4nerd]

I can't like this comment because it doesn't have a table

[@NatsuDragneel-nv6qm]

Oof Seamus

[@Saandy_]

It really is great. Now I feel spoiled.

[@13thGeek]

Solid theory. It’s been proven wrong after the release of Secrets of Dumbledore but it was an intriguing potential story thread that would have tied major lore elements together.

[@Stemmer94]

They can hire the brothers now 😂😂

[@becka7644]

This is the only theory I'll be accepting as in why Credence is a Dumbledore

[@americanwarrior4645]

But he ain’t a Dumbledore. Now if you are saying this is the only theory you accept that would make him a Dumbledore, sure, why not?

[@PR7-82]

He's Arianna's son

[@countluke2334]

I can actually live with him being Albus' nephew. It could have been much worse. This theory is intriguing, but probably to complicated to sell it to a mass audience.

[@haleyeakes1034]

I love that we were all wrong and he’s alberforths son

[@lydiaa9594]

It's amazing how noone guessed it! There weren't even so many options. Dumbledore's nephew is spot on though

[@lauraeisenschenk9386]

Me at the start of the video: Nah, that seems far fetched... Me at the end of the video: OMG it's true!!

[@heatherL4834]

I'm like that with most of their theories. A lot of them seem like the most ridiculous of ideas but by the end I'm convinced that it's the absolute truth. I hope they continue to use their powers for good.

[@rosetigerlion]

EVERYTIME

[@AndyHappyGuy]

credence's aunt who died during the shipwreck: am i a joke to you?

[@jalinaroset.4906]

Imagine if Voldemort had actually used the philosophers stone and turned himself into a crying baby girl.

[@MarieGarrett.]

I feel like that would make a great fanfiction

[@Zenith_682]

Lol

[@sarahglover3286]

That would be better for Cursed Child than got Bellatrix pregnant!

[@dubbleyou248]

LOL

[@dubbleyou248]

@@MarieGarrett. oof

[@phosphoros60]

I really think there's an aspect to Magic in Harry Potter like conservation of energy. Not literally, more metaphorically: Voldermort made himself nigh-immortal by creating horcruxes, but the price he paid was to live a life of misery, devoid of meaning and true happiness. Flamel made himself nigh-immortal with the Philosopher's Stone, but by extending his life he literally stretched it thin (which kind of reminds me of Bilbo, now that I think about it)

[@ProfAzimov]

That is like alchemy from fullmetal alchemist

[@kenzgitz9884]

@@ProfAzimov I was thinking that after I watched Fullmetal alchemist and I wonder if there is alchemy/ human transmutation involved in making horecruxes.

[@colby3197]

@@kenzgitz9884 In OG FMA not brotherhood, it could be said that homunculi are essentially horcruxes of those dead being "resurrected" in less than human bodies

[@GreyPunkWolf]

@@kenzgitz9884 There is transmutation involved. Dark magic is a domain by itself for scholars, but it's essentially just a mix of the other classical domains. They're just meant to create evil things or events, hence why they're classified as "dark". But what is dark is just the end result, or a part of the creation process. The standards of magic still apply to dark magic, meaning the very act of manipulating and modificating a soul and/or a body, however the purpose of it, is actually a part of what transmutation can do. You're just not meant to do it, hence why it's forbidden magic, and its process is considered very dangerous and harmful, hence why it's called dark magic. But it's dark transmutation, with some other steps that I cant remember that come from other branches of magic.

[@Mnkeys]

The law of equivalent exchange ^_^

[@DavidJones-tp7td]

One of the other things alchemists sought was the creation of the homunculus. It's kind of the alchemical equivalent to an advanced ai or android. Some stories say it requires a philosophers stone. So your theory seems to work.

[@bianchialex]

Credence is a homunculus created by Dumbledore and therefore a Dumbledore... I'd buy it.

[@erichanastacio9695]

Philosopher's stone... Homunculus.... Full Metal Alchemist???

[@seger249]

Well... that actually made a lot of sense. Good job... The whole silver / gold name sealed the deal for me.

[@annepixiebettinger3593]

I am an absolute NERD when it comes to name meanings. Whenever I write, I try to find the meaning of names so that way there's a greater connection. I will find connections (preferably more than one) that seem like cool names on the surface, but digging deeper you'll find new meanings and sometimes these meanings may hint towards the future of the character, not just the past. I'm in love with those concepts and apply it whenever possible. When I make up a name for my characters, I apply a new meaning to them that's based around that word or it origins.

[@jasperpotter5410]

the producers of fantastic beasts: "write that down! write that down!"

[@berengustav7714]

Yeah yeah yeah!"

[@stephenbrady5220]

Beren OfNumenor Because money?

[@diyaamber1738]

Charles the French?

[@liongirl1693]

More like “Write that down! Write that down and we might be able to repair the failure of the second movie!!

[@jasperpotter5410]

@@liongirl1693 honestly 😂😂

[@cupcakesandrose]

"It's 2020, so you should be thinking about 2040!" We were so optimistic...

[@akhil29897]

Sounds like something Hermoine would find out

[@22pepperjack]

I’m really hoping this ends up being canon and that the stone gets used in the last movie as the primary plot device. Would make a perfect “I open at the close” moment for the movies.

[@akhileshgarg9660]

I open at the close.... If this turns out to be true, I'll scream it at the theater while watching the last movie.😂😂

[@5amdaman]

The resurrection stone (1 of 3 hallows) to which you are referring is not the same stone as the philosophers stone. So not sure what your plot point is aiming for.

[@22pepperjack]

Sam Da Man sorry, I didn’t make it quite clear what I meant. I’m simply refereeing to the thematic elements spread across the entire first trilogy in regards to that phrase. Take the first and last words in the movies being spoken by “albus” in one form or another most see this as a subtle “I open at the close” and that loose nod to that phrase is what I’m referring to. As it would be another great link to the story that started it all of the story that ended it all focused on the same object.

[@munjee2]

That would be more of a I close at the open

[@zaneshadow6553]

@@munjee2 Do you not realize that it works either way?

[@jonjaarsma1456]

If this isn't what Rowling is shooting for, maybe she should consider it

[@rosh9979]

Subscribe to lokoroko gaming

[@TheSongwritingCat]

I don't know. This sounds like one of those Dumbledore Horcrux theories that she would find very upsetting.

[@Pheatan]

@@TheSongwritingCat it's not a theory that makes somebody gay, so she probably wont endorse it

[@chrissonofpear1384]

I'm fine with her using it...

[@MARYWTHER]

We'll see. It's clear she has a plan since she talked about it with Jude Law right after he was casted as Dumbledore.

[@MeatSim9]

Philosopher's Stone, Human Transmutation... He tried to bring back his sister, but the body he transmuted wasn't his sister...

[@ryanward5770]

And what did Dumbledore teach at Hogwarts? Transfiguration

[@unknownerror9551]

@@ryanward5770 he was the teacher DADA and trafigartion teacher

[@ryanward5770]

@@unknownerror9551 he didnt teach DADA he must have been substituting or something

[@shikharsrivastava4922]

@@ryanward5770 he taught DADA until Travers banned it (this is in FBAWTFT, TCOG)

[@dustyn4970]

This comment has no equivalent exchange.

[@gabbodelaparrawrites]

Revisiting this. It would make sense now why Grindelwald was looking for a girl thinking it was coming from Ariana even if the age difference should be a conflict.

[@davef4755]

Also one of the largest goals of alchemy was creating homunculii (artificial life) so it would fit very well that the man who created the stone also created one 👍

[@richardhicks5031]

What if they created a homunculus and then bound Ariana's obscuris to it to see what happened? And then they sent this homunculus to America where one of their contacts could better study it's development

[@davef4755]

Makes scence in my book ^^

[@ChathuriManjula9]

Strange magic is in work here... under normal circumstances, Ariana‘s homonculus should be her age and be a version of herself. Instead, it‘s, in this case, a baby boy. May be its the obscurus...

[@unknownfantasyalchemist]

@@ChathuriManjula9 Listen People: Fullmetal Alchemist Brotherhood! I tell ya!

[@Riwillion]

@@unknownfantasyalchemist Or you can have taste and prefer the original series :P

[@Glargamesh]

I can totally see J.K. watching this in her den. At the end she snaps a pencil in half with one hand and shouts, "Blasted brothers!"

[@phosphoros60]

"The moment he arrived at Starwarts, he was a Hog pupil"

[@LtBasil]

Well, it makes more sense than him being Albus' "regular" brother.

[@lotteceulemans7453]

I pick this theory over the Dark Twin one 😄 seems more plausible

[@robertofontiglia4148]

I think they go hand in hand. Like, Aurelius is Ariana's dark twin -- without a body until Albus gives him one accidentally.

[@althealligator1467]

@@robertofontiglia4148 Dumbledore in CoG: "Crednece is _a_ dark twin." Ariana's dark twin

[@isaiahcaston4539]

Me: *stuck in traffic* *alert goes off* *sees topic* Alright, why not. Convince me

[@sethkeown5965]

Were you convinced?

[@nickpavluk6319]

Pretty much had the same thing happen to me.... and yeah, I am convinced. Its probably the best explanation I could imagine

[@isaiahcaston4539]

@@sethkeown5965 it's a good theory and def a better theory than their "creedence is Dumbledores dark twin" theory. I can see Dumbledore thinking that his brilliance could save Arianna from death, maybe by extracting her "essence" (a crucial part in alchemy)

[@sethkeown5965]

@@isaiahcaston4539 my only fear is that JK will rush the explanation in the next movie and make this plausible idea feel cheap and unfufilling.

[@juska4235]

I am so convinced that I'm afraid that 1) he spoiled the next movie 2)if that's not what is going to happen then what they said is canon and the next movie isn't.😂😂idc it seems so fitting

[@thebuddercweeper]

The Dumbledore children’s names read like a poem: gold, silver, white, from the river.

[@TimothyWhiteowl]

Dumbledore and Flamel used the stone trying to remove the Obscurus from Ariana - which made Aurelius. (a dark twin)

[@tillmartens5770]

funnily: there is that book series about nicolas flamel. and in the story there is a prophecy of twins, one is silver the other gold...

[@MarieGarrett.]

Really! What's the book called?

[@tillmartens5770]

the secrets of nicolas flamel

[@MsMumuku]

The Secrets of the Immortal Nicholas Flamel - That was a tedious book series for me to read. but I'm the only one I've talked to who didn't like it, so give it a try 😁

[@kingpotato1683]

Personally I really liked the middle books in that series. In my opinion the first book took awhile to find what it wanted to be which made it a little weird and even boring at times however it definitely gets better as you read farther into the book. However, the middle books in that series know what they are and what they’re doing and they’re really interesting and fun to read. The story gets a little confusing near the end but you can always do what I did and search up a summary explaining what happened to help you understand the last book better. Definitely give it a read and make sure not to give up on it just because of the first book like I almost did. I think my favorite book in the series is The Sorceress but it’s been awhile since I’ve read them so I’m not sure what my favorite book would be now.

[@Zenith_682]

Oh yeah... I read that, it I don’t remember it.

[@Shotanat]

Dude, that's perfect ! It can even fit the timeline, Credence is supposed to be born in 1901, and the duel was in 1899. It's really possible, that's awesome !

[@theegyptiangamer2530]

This is a great comment

[@thathsaraamarasinghe6774]

If u mean by Duel, the epic one between Dumbledore and Grindewald, it happened in 1945 :-)

[@Shotanat]

@@thathsaraamarasinghe6774 It took me a few minutes to remember what that comment was about ^^' No, I'm talking about the smaller one that caused the death of Ariana,in August 1899, 2 years before the birth of Credence.

[@thathsaraamarasinghe6774]

@@Shotanat Ohh ok sorry, my bad

[@vivekanand9944]

Most likely this is what the story of the next FB&WTFT will be

[@seungjoonkin8970]

I love the fact that the new movie’s title is Fantatic beast and The secret of Dumbledore. This could mean that Dumbledore’s secret is almost identical to this theory (he tried to resurrect Ariana and failed etc) and it will be revealed in this movie

[@JustJoe10]

To bad they went for the most boring explanation

[@leonardofaber5823]

The theory is quite good. Just a few things to consider: The Obscurus dissipates forever after the host's death, for it is the unstable Magic force of the Obscurial. Newt was only able to preserve that Obscurus because he found the 8-year-old witch before she died, having time to extract it from her before total dissipation. With all that being said, let's think: would a young adult wizard overwhelmed with pain, sorrow, grief and anger have the cold thought of extracting the Obscurus of his sister's corpse right after her death? I know it's Dumbledore, but still... I think that, by the time he had time to think about asking Flamel's help, there would be no Obscurus to extract... but he still had her corpse

[@anne5756]

thats an interesting point! But wasn't Dumbledore in touch with flamel while at Hogwarts (before Ariana's death)? Maybe the reason he was in touch with flamel was to discuss if an obscurious could be extracted from a child (his sister)- that would definitely catch Flamel's interest, no?

[@NicholsKT]

@@anne5756good point! like he was searching for a cure before he even graduated

[@ZiggyGamma]

Me: How could Dumbledore think unaccompanying the baby is a good idea. "Certainly I can see how a very famous wizard, showing up in America with an unexplained baby, he created with unexplained magic, shortly after the death of two of his family members would look a little bit sketchy" Me:... Well when you put it like that It just makes sense.

[@MARYWTHER]

You're talking about the dude who dumped a one year old on a doorstep and left him there for hours tho lol

[@MauriceGucci]

Credence wasn't unaccompanied. We know that he was accompanied by his aunt. Funnily enough, despite having lost so many family members, one of the last Dumbledores left is Albus' aunt.

[@shikharsrivastava4922]

Also Dumbledore may have realized that grindelwald knew of Aurelius and might try to trace him through Dumbledore to probably kill him (and he was right, as always)

[@seraphina985]

@@shikharsrivastava4922 Also Aurelius, interesting name considering that Aurum is the Latin name for gold thus the chemical symbol Au. Anyone want to guess what the Latin name Aurelius actually translates to? Yup that would be Golden now it could be coincidence that English speaking early 20th century wizards picked this name at random but in light of its connection to the famed transmutative properties of the stone it seems an interesting coincidence. If anything it seems that this is made less likely by the fact that even among the more Latin exposed magical communities use of Latin inspired names was already becoming archaic. Even in muggle cultures forced to rapidly adopt a new language naming traditions lag behind by several centuries at least. Also lets face it wizard culture seems to be much more conservative in general which somewhat makes sense they don't seem to have experienced the rapid improvements in quality of life due to innovation muggle cultures have. Muggles have had a lot of incentive to become adaptable to new ideas as this as adaptability to new ideas has been rather useful at remaining not dead a while longer in recent centuries. In a weird sense this view of things resonates with me as it plays into an idea I derived from the concept of clarktech etc in modelling a fantasy themed modern era world I created. Basically the fae the world initially consisted of humans and fae but later expanded but in the lore the fae considered humans to be in possession of crude arcane magic that the humans termed electromagnetism. Essentially the idea was that humans were rather late to the party on this as their magical abilities were not innate but they had discovered magic through study and build artefacts to harness it. A method the innately magical creatures considered crude at best especially as it was tinkering with but one small part of the fundamental energy of all things. Kinda bizarre to explain in a brief summary but it was somewhat like a hard scifi meets fantasy sort of universe based entirely on a magical force somewhat along the lines of the quantum field that could be manipulated innately or through arcane means.

[@owenkrings8463]

Aurelius also starts with A just like Albus, Aberforth, and Ariana who are all Dumbledores

[@sugondese5497]

Some sound proof there my friend.👍

[@melue895]

Illuminati comfirmed

[@rebeccaschwartz5477]

And Argus. As in Argus Filch.

[@dovelyy]

Also Armando Dippet

[@owenkrings8463]

@@rebeccaschwartz5477 yes but the point I was going at was the Dumbledores

[@aaronrowe4129]

I will point out, Gellert Grindelwald was the one who told him his name. Gellert Grindelwald also used Percival Graves as his alias. Percival is both one of Albus's middle names as well as the name of his late father. Albus Percival Wilfric Brian Dumbledore. How much are you willing to bet that Albus's father had a multitude of middle names and one of them was Aurelius? It might be Grindelwald's way of carrying a torch for his old flame.

[@aletcher89]

I need clarification on two things. First, do we have to assume that Grindelwald learned about Credence's true identity through a vision? If so, wouldn't he have known it was Credence all along, since we was already aware of and racking the obscures by that point? Unless we are to assume it was a big coincidence that Grindelwald was already looking for an obscures for some other reason, then sometime between the two films had the vision revealing Credence's identity? Second, wouldn't a phoenix have appeared to Credence earlier? He was almost killed at the end of the first film. I'd think that situation would be as "in need of help" as any could be.

[@eldancer2]

Maybe he had a vision but couldn't see the baby's gender. Then he just assumed it was a girl. He says to Credence, in Fantastic Beast 1 that he was looking for a girl because he had this vision. But he actually just assumed it was a girl. He might thought that they were able to make Ariana born again.

[@steakismeat177]

@@eldancer2 however because ariana is based on the name for silver and the stone turned her obscurus into a different body he is Aurelius. Since it turned Silver Dumbledore into Gold Dumbledore.

[@jorilysmatos69]

Isn't the phoenix at the end the little bird he rescued earlier in the movie?

[@larawho3906]

@@eldancer2 he might have assumed it was a girl because Ariana herself was a girl too, he couldn't have guested that they changed by accident the gender of the baby.

[@Kalli315]

*the producers of fantastic beasts three watching this video* “write that down”

[@thed4rkestrose]

We can only hope

[@chyawanprash]

If the actually story in the upcoming movies isn't this, then it'll just be a disappointment

[@sarahglover3286]

Imagine if they'd written the script see this and rip it up and rewrite it!

[@mickeyolds7383]

I’m prepared to be disappointed as this is too good to be the actual story

[@janetuss6496]

@@mickeyolds7383 it most likely is what Rowling is going for. Rowling has said she researched an insane amount of alchemy to write the harry potter books, way more info than she could ever use. Besides the obvious philospher's stone and Flamel storyline, a lot of people don't realize the amount of alchemic symbolism and references she put into the HP books, and she's carrying it over to the FB series. If you look up Alchemy and Harry Potter, there is a ton of analysis you can find. Just look up Magnum Opus Alchemy. It talks about the 4 alchemic stages to create the philosopher's stone: Rubedo = red phase Nigredo = black phase Albedo = white phase Citrinitas = yellow phase Rubeus Hagrid - rubeus means red, so Hagrid represents the red phase Sirius Black - represents the black phase Albus Dumbledore - albus means white, so Dumbledore represents the white phase Lupin could represent the yellow stage. Even though his name doesn't mean yellow, his nickname is Moony because of the werewolf thing. Moon = yellow. Alchemy includes spiritual alchemy, which is basically the process of spiritual/psychological/personal transformation. The real philosopher's stone or the real gold is the transformation of one's spirit/mind. The transmutation of non-precious metals (like lead) into gold is a metaphor for one transforming one's mind or spirit from a lead-like state into a gold state - bright, shining and pure/good. This is basically the "hero's journey" of Harry Potter. Harry goes through his alchemic personal transformation firstly with the help of the different father-figures listed above, they guide him through the different stages or phases. And then, as they leave Harry or die one-by-one, Harry has to come onto his own and complete his transformation alone. Hence why he goes into the forest alone to face Voldemort and his final duel against Voldemort is done alone, 1 v 1. There's a ton more alchemic symbolism in harry potter, this is just one example. It's actually insane how many things Rowling wove together, she really created a genius piece of modern literature. So I'm not surprised she is taking the alchemy route to craft the FB series, she has enough knowledge of alchemy to do so. If you look up alchemy, you'll see that one of the ingredients used to make the philosopher's stone is something called prima materia. Prima materia is said to be mercury sulfide, which is sometimes known as Dragon's Blood. Dumbledore's chocolate frog card mentions that he's notable for discovering the 12 uses of Dragon's Blood. This is more than likely a reference and a result of his alchemy work with Flamel.

[@JustJoe10]

God I wish this theory was true! It’s so great (and so much better than the one we got)

[@user-hh3ty4vw2f]

Ikr

[@leysflower]

Excellent theory! In Germany in Alchemy it was believed that you could create a living being with the philosopher's stone. The romantic poets wrote about it a lot. This being was called a Homunkulus. A Homunkulus is basically a either a tiny human or a very, very crinkled, tiny human. So Credence was then that tiny human.

[@davidusher4304]

This is similar to the anime full metal alchemist where philosopher stones are used to create many homunculi

[@nickibolton2630]

I love how when explaining why Credence can live so long you guys go with "because its the opposite" not "because the elixir of life created him" lol love you guys so much!

[@insaincaldo]

Seems reasonable that using the stone like this would take allot of power and maybe leave the resulting life mortal. I mean he is going to be dealt with in some capacity, be it t death, put away somewhere, or separated from the obscurus.

[@ExtremerZocker284076]

@@insaincaldo You're only immortal when you keep drinking the elixir. Once Flamel had no longer access to the elixir when the stone was destroyed, he died. So I guess you could say that applies to Credence as well?

[@insaincaldo]

@@ExtremerZocker284076 Presumably, or it's like an Obelix situation. Kinda hard to grasp at anything when we barely know anything about the making of the elixir and how it works.

[@amossmith6215]

Well you have to keep on drinking the elixir to live.

[@walnuthead]

This isn't even a theory, this is just canon..

[@lijunyin1341]

WalnutHead ????????????

[@lijunyin1341]

Sorry I accidentally put ?’s

[@walnuthead]

@@lijunyin1341 what

[@SLOTHSRIDEUNICORNS]

Do a video on the Unforgivable Curses. The Avada Kedvra curse moreover. If Avada Kedavra is a Killing CURSE...stands to reason that the CURSE could be LIFTED.

[@lauralos9973]

To add to this theory... what if the reason Credence has been able to survive this long as an obscurus is because he has received immortal abilities from the stone just like Flammel has!

[@Z_pixel]

i like this!

[@petershaw8237]

But isn't Flammel tied to a potion he has to drink like always to keep him alife?

[@Ismail-kv3ex]

Well they did mention that Credence being such a rarity among Obscurials is that rather then being a boy who developed an Obscurus, he was an Obscurus (a Dumbledore's Obscurus no less) who gained a body So although I like your thinking, I don't think it would work since Credence is almost certainly not alive by the time Harry shows up (both narratively and world building wise, he just can't survive to the end of this series) And he can't die with immortal abilities (Flamel also had to make a Elixer to keep immortal, but it would be funny if Credence has a gift for potion making)

[@syerrg9969]

When Albus referred an Obscurus to a 'dark twin' in CoG, i thought we're onto something because that was a interesting choice of words.

[@Vampyresdontdodishes]

I was actually ready to give up on these films (and literally had stopped thinking about them). But this...this gave me hope.

[@mattias2576]

everytime i hear creedence i half expect them to begin singing: "some folks are born, made to wave the flag, oooh that red white and blue"

[@yamahakid450f]

Thats a better credence... CCR.

[@carsivus4866]

"And the name Aurelius means..." Me, someone who is semi interested in science and remembered that the the period symbol for gold is Au which comes from latin which probably translates to Aurelius: GOLD Also, what if Albus and Aberforth knew that Aurelius was their sister/brother? Do you think that, with the right cues, Aurelius would be able to remember his memories from when he was Ariana? And in a way it would be like Ariana was still alive? And if so, this would probably mean that Aberforth wouldn't hold a grudge against Albus for that long and the three brothers would be able to live at Hogwarts. We dont know that much about Aberforth but I feel that he would take up the role of DADA post and Aurelius would be able to attend Hogwarts as a student, depending on when the other brothers managed to find him. So in the end, Albus would teach Transfiguration, Aberforth would teach DADA, and Aurelius would be in either Ravenclaw or Slytherin, most likely Slytherin seeing as he is so deceptive and cunning and never really trusts anyone too much. However there might be a stigma surrounding the fact that Aurelius is an Obscurial, similar to Lupin being a werewolf. But in the end Aurelius would be able to control this power and become an even better wizard because of it. When the time came for the Battle of Hogwarts (if they were all alive by then) I think it would be cool to see a Dumbledore trio fighting alongside each other and casting protection spells around the castle and grounds. Also how funny would it be to have two professors named Dumbledore?

[@aardvarkdoom7234]

"Gentlemen, you had my curiosity, but now you have my attention."

[@thebeardedchad]

You guys are responsible for like 90% of my headcanon concerning Harry Potter. at this point I'm willing to accept your theories as fact and JK Rowling's stories and opinion as one alternate possibility.

[@Lee-pj5vf]

Haha that's so true

[@BeastiesRUs]

Well, she can't even keep her own cannon so they are as much cannon as JK's stories at this point

[@elineeugenie5224]

Your canon became a cannon lol

[@lionproud1287]

*cough cough!* Cursed Child *cough*

[@thebeardedchad]

@@lionproud1287 I know of no such thing. You must be misinformed.

[@AcousticKitty]

My thing is, just because a Phoenix is known to appear to a Dumbledore in need, that doesn't mean they ONLY appear to Dumbledores... However, yea that silver into gold thing just seals this theory as fact.

[@ryanward5770]

Not to mention that what Dumbledore would go on to teach at Hogwarts was none other than transfiguration. The process of turning one thing into another, something Dumbledore would have already got real world experience of from creating creedence

[@TiBunCosplay]

I have a sudden need to attend Starwarts school of witchcraft and forcery.

[@Jasminiumusic]

Yesyesyes!!!!👌🏻

[@m.nileigh8081]

hehe

[@ThatNutmegGirl]

I believe it's affectionately called Pigfarts and it's on Mars. You need a rocketship to get there.

[@emeraldemperor2601]

🤣

[@Zenith_682]

YES

[@jayteedub322]

"The dark side of the force is a pathway to many abilities, some considered to be unnatural" Wait, wrong prequel series... Sorry, this whole "creating life through mysterious dark forces" concept had me mixed up for a brief moment, there.

[@storymaster21]

voldemort: dumbledor never told you what happened to your father harry. harry: he told me you KILLED him! voldemort: no harry, I AM your FATHER!! harry: nooooo! THAT'S IMPOSSIBLE!!

[@volleyballDave]

Or... Gellert is trying to use an out of control Credence against Dumbledore. Ariana was an innocent obscurial so Gellert knows Dumbledore won't harm an innocent obscurial, so Gellert is doing everything he can to turn Credence loose on Dumbledore. Even if Credence doesn't weaken or kill Albus there's a good chance he'll distract him enough that Gellert can get the upper hand. And the phoenix only appearing to Credence in the presence of Gellert suggests that Gellert somehow conjured the image of the phoenix to help "prove" to Credence that what Gellert was telling him was the truth. All in the effort to turn this innocent obscurial loose on Dumbledore. That's the simplest answer based on what we've been shown so far. Remember that once Gellert found the girl that he thought was the obscurial, Gellert told Credence to get lost, he had no more use for the boy scwib anymore. He just wanted an obscrurial he could aim at Dumbledore. But then Gellert realized that the boy Credence was in fact the obscurial and Gellert's story changed again and he once again became the "kind friend" that just wanted to help Credence... the whole story is a ploy.

[@mia-il7tp]

And now I'm thinking: if this is true, Rowling would have planned FB over twenty years ago... which would be really, really insane :D

[@iRazenrak]

If this is true, she didn't know about it back then. Otherwise, Dumbledore would've told Harry.

[@seraphinaedan1033]

“Very close friendship” what are you, a historian speaking about two Ancient Greece guys being bros?

[@Mirro18]

Heterosexual life partners. Just like Achilles and Patroclus. Very Manly (especially Achilles), very straight, very much... why do I hear Whisper in the Wind?

[@cortneymaitland4429]

@@Mirro18 I'm Jay and this is my heterosexual life partner, Silent Bob.

[@Mirro18]

@@cortneymaitland4429 Very heterosexual. Very not... why does Whisper in The Wind Keep playing!?

[@almas5713]

In addition to this, the names Aurelius and Arianna both come from the Mediterranean region, Arianna being Greek, and Arelius being Roman. We all know JK Rowling chooses her names very carefully. My idea is that since historically Greek Mythology was changed by the Romans, this may be a mirrored event between Arianna changing into Arelius.

[@fleetskipper1810]

Alma S Bery clever-I like it.

[@almas5713]

@@fleetskipper1810 Thanks haha

[@Zzmora]

Also, some antic Roman mythology (the Eneida) said that Romans descend from Greece, that would make it fit even more!

[@chingizzhylkybayev8575]

To be fair, it is extremely common for a European to bear a Greek or a Roman name

[@almas5713]

@@chingizzhylkybayev8575 I think it still says something that Arianna is the greek name and Arelius is the roman one.

[@CritterKeeper01]

If Dumbledore's sister's Obscurus plus the Philosopher's Stone leads to a male baby, then could Voldemort have ended up with a female body, had things gone as planned in Year One?

[@laurar1816]

I like way more this theory than what they tell us in Secrets of Dumbledore

[@TimiSterr]

Imagine if it turns out they were wrong. That would mean that they're better writers than Rowling. That would be AWESOME! Because this theory is BOMB!

[@Lifes1BeautifulRide]

Timi Sterr Exactly!!!

[@jacquig1939]

There's several amazing fan theories that the texts totally support that JK said aren't real. Don't care, if it sounds credible I'm going with it.

[@aichitoshiki1321]

Heck yeah

[@1800owch]

Turns out they’re better writers than Rowling-

[@BryanCarthell]

Ever since I saw “Crimes” in the theater, I’ve been looking for ANY possible explanation for the Aurelius Dumbledore twist that still fit into established cannon. This is the first time I’ve seen something that makes sense. I really hope this is true and the that the real reason is not some lame ret-con.

[@9LivesDeepDives]

Still one of the best theories I’ve seen on KZbin in a long time. It just works so perfectly.

[@ivyangle6179]

Can I also say, everyone hates on Fantastic Beasts but I love them...

[@robinhorst706]

This is probably my favorite theory you have ever come up with. There were quite a bunch of problems with the Crimes of Grindelwald and this would explain almost everything and make that movie not only relevant but crucial to the overall story of Fantastic Beasts.

[@murderofcrows5089]

Honestly that would make sense given Grinderwald said Creedence is Albus’s “brother” it would technically make him a Dumbledore

[@chrisk_nfl4120]

I know i'm nearly a full year behind on this, but I have a couple of issues with this theory: 1) The timelines are very iffy. Ariana is meant to have died in 1900 and Credence, at the very most, is meant to be 18, since he still lives with his mother. His birth year would be around 1908, maybe this could work to some degree, however, I don't know if the 8 year gap is necessarily feasible if the Philosopher's Stone is already a thing. Credence also being 26 seems a little bit of a stretch too especially since the Barebones clearly didn't want him there, so why would he stay for so long? 2) Why didn't the Phoenix appear in it's true form earlier on? What makes the start of the film in the circus or when Grimmson attacks him any different to when he's in one of the most secure buildings in the wizarding world. My take is that Grindelwald, one of the best transfiguration wizards in the world, simply turned the chick into one to sell his point. 3) Surely Albus creating a brand new Dumbledore, and subsequently losing that baby + the woman who he would entrust this baby too, would have deep regret/guilt if he ever found out. Instead he only has regret from his sister's death. Unless he knew of Credence being a Dumbledore way before anyone else, I just don't see how this works unless Albus is a lot colder than we realise, or somehow he knew all along that the baby that died was Corvus rather than Aurelius. Not to mention Dumbledore would be 28 at the time of that baby's creation. My take? We just have nothing to really go off. I don't think it's a coincidence that J.K showed the Raven chick in that scene with Newt and Leta right before/after we see Credence's

[@anabellik]

Wow, this theory is SO GOOD and explains pretty much EVERYTHING. This is officially my canon from now on.

[@marzizzo]

"can turn any other metal..." Me: NO "into gold" Me: SJHGFDSJHG

[@rosh9979]

Subscribe to lokoroko gaming

[@ihopeicanchangethisnamelat7108]

*Thor’s Avengers Endgame battle cry*

[@harleydavidepps7487]

So I've had a theory for a couple days now that no one seems to have touched on. What if the obscuris Newt has is Ariana Dumbledore?

[@larawho3906]

didn't he said on the film that it was from a 8 year old girl in Africa???

[@thathsaraamarasinghe6774]

I watched this sometime back, but I forgot the points, I watched it again and got the frkin' chills going up my body at the end... you guys are so frikin dramatic

[@MariaT-95]

Before watching: this makes no sense After watching: this makes perfect sense

[@leviadiane4411]

I'm sold on this theory so much that i will be disappointed if this isn't canon

[@cmck17]

That Robin Hood shoutout didn’t age well lol

[@kushalyadav4773]

The fact that it makes sense is even more mind blowing than the theory itself

[@pinkcowjl]

Okay this is the theory to end all theories

[@bregje_juggling]

Makers of Fantastic Beasts: how are we going to explain this in the 3rd movie? Also makers of FB: **watch this video** There you have our story!

[@leowiebe2023]

Harry after he wakes up in the hospital: Where is the stone? Dumbledore: Gone. Reduced to atoms.

[@samurexatlas7373]

I think the stone in particular is a Magnum Opus, taking four stages, including a Red one, to come to full. Giving life to Credence/Aureilius, that sounds like a Homunculus.

When Dumbledore created Aurelius, he was already away from Grindelwald. However, Grindelwald may have found out about Aurelius' creation through his clairvoyant skills.

[@DeeSnow97]

Could explain why it took Grindelwald so long to find Aurelius

[@flamingpi2245]

Aurelius=Aurum=Gold

[@CaitLumos]

And why he assumed that Aurelius was a girl

[@merdanogut9286]

He is a pretty good seer.

[@DeeFig66]

@@CaitLumos Oh yeah, if he's Ariana's obscurus, he would have been looking for a girl which was why he targeted his "little sister" so quickly.

[@brandonnobach3388]

I wasn't on board until the Silver into Gold moment. Then I was like yeah, yeah, yeah that makes sense. That works. Got it!

[@brettwilson359]

Aurelius even is similar to the Greek name for gold used on the periodic chart. The stone turns things into gold NEVER thought of that. I TYPED THAT BEFORE I WATCHED IT. That's the second time I had an epiphany and while typing they went on to say exactly what I was thinking while I was watching this channel. It's a super cool pat on the back and then that feeling is just smashed by one of the guys.

[@artislifelivetheart7013]

Very good! Can't wait for the other movies to unfold!

[@morganjohnson8202]

Soo J.K Rowling is going to be mad when she figures out y’all have her next movie away lolol

[@heididavison816]

Morgan Johnson if we are lucky, her next movíe will make this much sense lol

[@shrutiw.6904]

Totally agree. Now I want books of fantastic beast. I wish I had them 😍

[@CaitLumos]

I cackled when the Starwarts music started playing 😂

[@dianemendiola5394]

Lol a year later, Robinhood is now in hot waters 🤣

[@jliberation9003]

That silver to gold thing really sold this for me. First theory ive truely, truely believed. Thanks chaps

[@docmike8601]

This has got to be the most well thought out and supported fan theory I have ever heard in any IP. Well done.

[@captainwatercress]

“Closer than brothers.” THEY’RE GAY, STEVE

[@katiekoo-koohead2551]

O.o who's steve?

[@akitchenchaire338]

@Paige Jasmine THATS WHAT I THOUGHT!!!!!

[@christinalaughton-rust2753]

Only Dumbledore, sadly

[@graemetang4173]

1:22 ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)

[@FatmanRico2011]

thanks frisky bits :P

[@ashleycox8480]

This has been my thought since the movie except the stone, that part I never factored in, but it fits so well

[@aishwaryajoshi]

I literally had goosebumps throughout this video. Everything, every single missing piece fits perfectly.

[@tanmaybarve3502]

Imagine if JKR had exactly this very idea in her mind and now you've given everyone spoiler 😂

[@teaotspp]

I remember a few years back when JK was still working on Half-Blood Prince but someone wrote a theory on Veritaserum.com about how Snape might have been in love with Lily and he's doing everything to protect Harry, and that must be the ultimate secret that makes Dumbledore trust him. I read it and thought: "that kinda makes sense", few years later, it was true! I hope this theory with Aurelius is true as well. I wouldn't like to find out that we waited for 3 years (?) on a cliffhanger that will be dismissed in the next 5 seconds by Gellert going like: "nah, just messing up with you!"

[@Karin_Allen]

They sort of did it before when they figured out the identity of Claudia Kim's character before it was announced.

[@birddcandle]

When he said “to turn any metal into gold” I got actual chills

[@raettchen1988]

"A son cruelly banished Despair of the daughter. Return, great avenger, with wings from the water" Still fits

[@baddiemoyd]

My favourite Harry Potter Theory from you guys by far!!

[@im_living_dead]

Well, you called the Nagini reveal, so I’m gonna go ahead and count this theory as canon 👏🏻

[@indigopines]

Are you telling me Dumbledore attempted *human transmutation*? FMA fans: * shivers *

[@erikburzinski8248]

FMA: Remembers how a philosophers stone is made (shivers more)

[@dancasey7]

What’s fma?

[@9kar7etyr]

Fullmetal Alchemist

[@ddm1912]

FMA Brotherhood

[@ewilliams4410]

"Al-bus? Big...bro-ther."

[@thedarkone1420]

It's always fun to go back to disproven theories and see all the evidence.

[@logansadlier403]

Wow wow wow wow. This is the most concrete theory I’ve heard in a long time! You guys are always so awesome, but J!!! This is crazy spot on!