The Pop Culture Rise of the Queer Witch

[@HeyRowanEllis]

🔎👒 Download June's Journey for free here: woo.ga/q6d5ygim

[@LenaVolkk]

Agatha continued killing witches after Nikki's death to prolong her life, as she herself told Billy that she was not ready to meet her son. She was afraid that he would not forgive her.

[@kat4t]

No she didn’t. Jen was centuries old, as was Lilia, and they didn’t kill other witches to prolong their lives. Agatha did it out of anger and greed for dark magic power. She bastardized the innocent song she created with Nicky AND essentially kept him from his other parent (Rio) for years. She also then forced him to use that song to be an accomplice in murder. It also doesn’t necessarily mean Agatha is gay, as death can take many forms and could have taken the form of a man to impregnate Agatha. Is she straight? No. Isn’t she completely gay? Probably not. The theory is that Rio likely is the father/mother of Nicky, hence why he was supposed to be stillborn - he was born from death. Agatha couldn’t face Nicky in the end because of that - bastardizing their song , forced him into being an accomplice to murder, instilled generational trauma onto him (from fearing ANY coven would try to kill them like her original coven did), during to dark magic, AND purposefully keeping him from his other parent.

[@CoahuiltecanCat-vu9cd]

I think the reason Agatha thinks the truth is too awful is because she thinks she let him die and she was too weak to protect him

[@ImCastielsBitch01]

yea, she also says to nick "if you want to survive get used to this", meaning stealing witches power. maybe she thought she could defend him and why death came in the night. though she also could've come during the night to not make things a big deal on Nicky.

[@dusty2366]

"The OG icon dead lesbian, killed by a stray bullet, paving the way for so many afterwords..." *cuts to an ad of Shaquille O'Neal* Could not have asked for better timing

[@ArtOfShannonLee]

I haven’t watched this video yet but I know who this line is about 😭

[@rue...whenwasthis]

ur shirt

[@MateusAntonioBittencourt]

I think the "The truth is more terrible..." should be left to interpretation. As I see it, Agatha prefers people to think she sacrificed her son, because to her, the truth his death was pointless is worst. But that's just me. Also, she's ashamed of her actions... even though she keeps making them (and I can sympathize with that as I'm current making a terrible choice I'm 100% will feel ashamed of, be can't help myself). And Agatha 100% knew she was sacrificing herself when she kissed Rio.

[@rociorivas62]

I completely agree with everything you said and also wanted to add that, yes, even the pacing and the acting choices behind the "truth is more terrible" line hint at it being open to interpretation. I don't know how to explain it but stylistically it definitely feels like a moment where the story lets the audience breathe and fill in the blanks, which is also a really important ingredient of any story that establishes parallels with queer existence.

[@colinvandenberg3446]

Yeah, the line makes sense from Agatha's point of view. It's worse for her to let people think that she couldn't protect her son.

[@nailinthefashion]

Also she trained him into being a lure for witches to drain .... she didn't even make the best of her time with him. If she had another chance, it'd be completely different, and maybe she'd be more proud and defy the rumors.

[@alexandruulesan7009]

I think that part of the horror for her is how she used Nicky's song after his death. She was already using him to lure other witches, but that song was the only thing she had left of him.

[@lucideandre]

Considering how the well-known classic depiction of a witch is basically just an antisemitic caricature, I think it’s honestly excellent, and poignant, that our good guy on AAA is not only queer, but Jewish, and also a witch, but now his witchy-ness is positive and his Jewishness and queerness are neutral, just part of who he is.

[@wildstarfish3786]

wait what?

[@lucideandre]

@ which part? When I mention the good guy in AAA, I mean Billy. But that standard depiction, with hooked nose, wild hair, curved posture, creepy smile, and even the occasional green skin, are all tropes of antisemitic caricatures.

[@wildstarfish3786]

@@lucideandre wait green skin?

[@braingirl9112]

​@@wildstarfish3786 the green skin come from the wizard of Oz. It influenced a lot of media to represent witches with green skin

[@lucideandre]

@@wildstarfish3786 well, some antisemitic propaganda, especially Nazi ones, occasionally depicted Jews with murky yellow or green skin.

[@rociorivas62]

45:59 - "the truth is too terrible" = later on, "sometimes boys just die". Agatha spent 99% of her gifted time with Nicky using him to kill other witches to gain more power, and even that couldn't save him. So NOT ONLY did she waste a time that she was never meant to have with her son (and this is something that's obviously difficult to accept for her, because this time was a gift from Death but she also hates Death for having to take Nicky anways, sooner or later), but ALSO she did it for absolutely nothing because she was never able to escape her son's fate. With a bazillion layers of supernatural metaphors and skewed morality debates on it, Agatha is like the parent who works themselves off in order to create a better life for their child, but never spending any quality time with said child, and eventually the child dying thus... all that wasted time and abscence not even alloting to anything. I think it's pretty safe to assume that Agatha prefers to be perceived as a horrible person than to be perceived as someone who once loved someone but failed spectacularly at protecting them, and she's too hard on herself because she doesn't want to acknowledge that her son's death was inevitable. This looks like an inconsistency to us because we look from the outside and have all the cards to our disposal, but for her, this inconsistency of thought vs. practice makes her human. It also bleeds into her relationship with Rio and how she's attempting to kiss her one moment, but saying she hates her the next. Which is also tbf a pretty common emotional whirlwind in a lot of romantic relationships per se.

[@ahoward84562]

Well said

[@thenaiam]

Yes, exactly this! 💜💜💜 I feel like these last two episodes, I started out liking and being affected by them, but having many similar feelings and questions as those who are disappointed. But the more I rewatch the show, and the more I listen to discussions and ruminate over them, the more I love this finale and epilogue. To me it's a testament to the writing, and the trust they have of the audience, that they don't spell things out. I do get that it can cause confusion about the messaging and the characterization, so maybe the execution wasn't perfect, but to me, on the whole, it's a net positive.

[@samuellewis7141]

In my eyes, the terrible truth that agatha doesn't want people to know is that she wasn't strong enough to save her son OR that she doesn't want people to know that she was a kind and loving person. She would rather have people see her as an unstoppable magic killing machine than a still scary villain with a human side

[@trinaq]

Luz and Willow in the thumbnail?! You're totally reading my mind right now!

[@CaptainPeregrin]

i literally just realized that owl house willow must have been an allusion to buffy willow

[@ArtichokeHunter]

The Ursula example touches on this, but I think there's a lot to say about the queerness of witches not in terms of their attraction to/romances with women, but in a more ace- or aro-coded queerness that either centers platonic (generally homosocial) relationships in covens or a more hermit-like existence as a choice over conventional family structures. I think I connect to witches more in that way than in a wlw way (even though I do also lw).

[@ohmage_resistance]

I’ve read a few books/stories with a-spec witches, if anyone is curious. It’s kind of interesting that two of them have allo aro rep specifically, since that’s pretty rare in general. Baker Thief by Claudie Arseneault (allo aro bigender witch mc, questioning aro spec witch MC).. I really like this book as aro rep in general. KA Cook as a number of stories with aro allo witches (like "Bones of Green and Hearts of Gold", "Before Crows' Eyes" or the short story just titled "the Witch"). Honestly, the entire collection called Witches of Fruit and Forest would probably work for you, although I haven't read all of those stories. I think these stories do the best job at representing the centering platonic focused or hermit like existence over amatonormative society thing you talk about, KA Cook is really great at representing that in general. These are also free to read online (you should be able to find them on the author's website by googling), and I’d really recommend checking them out! The Witch King duology by H. E. Edgmon has a side character who is bi ace. The short story "The Witch of Festa Falls" by S. J. Taylor (aro ace witch MC) I'm reading Not Good For Maidens by Tori Bovalino (which has an ace witchling (kind of proto witch) MC) right now, and I think it would work. I could probably list a few more, but I'm not sure if these are witches specifically, but they kind of have the vibes: Sawkill Girls by Claire Legrand (one MC is biromantic? ace), Elatsoe by Darcie Little Badger (ace MC, not really a witch, but more pulling from Lipan Apache traditions), and Kaikeyi by Vaishnavi Patel (aro ace MC, she's not really a witch, but her powers feel kind of witch-y to me)

[@EJ_2091]

That's a good point. One thing that very much stands out to me is the lack of centring men in those dynamics. "Witch" in general is a woman-coded word, and covens almost never have men as part of them in literature and media surrounding witches. So I think you're right about there being an aro/ace-coded queerness because it goes against amatonormativity, which is tied in with heteronormativity, which centres men. If that makes sense XD

[@acompassrose1366]

​@ohmage_resistance You have no idea how much I love that you shared aro/ace examples. I love witchy books and the YA genre, but get so tired of everything revolving around romance when that's not something important to me

[@TimpanistMoth_AyKayEll]

@@ohmage_resistance Thank you for these!

[@pemanilnoob]

I’m surprised you didn’t mention Eda as a witch who’s a good parent Eda accepting being a parent is like her main arc in the show and it’s really cute

[@lisamborras]

I understood when Agatha said the truth of what happened to Nicky to be worse than the rumours as that the loss of a child is one of the hardest things someone can go through, even then. Especially as she makes it clear when he is born that she didn't use magic to have him. It made sense to me.

[@bellarosethorne]

it makes perfect sense, especially if we take the rumours at face value - she gained something. The reality being that she gained nothing, the reality was pure loss. The rumour is a trade, whereas the reality is.. she lost him right at the beginning. She did everything right, and yet he did not survive. And the only bargain she struck was for a little more time with him, and because of that.. she spent the entire time knowing he was going to be taken away again. The painful truth is that she knew he was doomed from the start, and she did horrible things in part to make that time last. The rumours that she traded him for power at least keep other witches from the horrors of what she's done, and the pity of the loss she experienced.

[@jazmineraymond7495]

The horror was she had no control over the situation and that she genuinely cared for her child and still lost him, and she lost the woman she loved through her own grief and anger.

[@lisamborras]

@@colinvandenberg3446 do you mean me or Rowan? I had watched the whole season before watching this video?

[@colinvandenberg3446]

@@lisamborras Sorry, I meant to delete this reply. I wrote something directed to Rowen in the main comments.

[@cairneoleander8130]

I think audience members expecting there to be some other big bad thing to replace the rumors of Agatha sacrificing Nicky for the Darkhold is simply an example of one of two things: 1. Modern audiences not grasping that, perspectively, the truth of not telling Nicky the situation and going around draining fellow witches was the thing that was too horrible. This is a question of perspective. OR 2. Marvel was setting up more mystery for the next series that will have ghost Agatha and Billy on another adventure. I’m not mad that they left some things unanswered. They absolutely STUCK the landing with Agatha All Along. And it is DO awesome to see how well the Black Sheep Aunty and little queer witchy nephew dynamic played out sooooo beautifully. That’s some queer representation in media that needed to happen, since most of us are LUCKY if we even have ONE adult in our entire childhood lives that sees us and is a safe space to be ourselves around. I’m psyched to finally get some male witch stories. It’s WAY past time. Because as so many of my fellow leftists seem to so often need reminded: queer stories are STILL queer stories EVEN IF the character has a Y chromosome.

[@rebeccabella3404]

Fine, i’ll rewatch the owl house

[@Witchy_Cheree1982]

😂😂😂 I thought this too

[@JEDonnert]

Yeah that went through my head as well

[@aithne7216]

Was thinking this about the fear street trilogy.

[@toriblackwood5920]

Same here

[@ahoward84562]

😂😂😂 i said the same thing

[@greyjeth]

As someone who found her love of witchcraft through The Owl House at age 32-33, I have a strong wish to read and watch more witch media. I've kept myself away from Agatha because I'll be honest I don't trust Disney after what happened with The Owl House, and I kinda feel like I was right to be cautious from what you talked about. Still this was a fun video to watch and I'm glad you did a deep dive like this into the often meshed combination of queer culture and witchcraft. I have been writing fanfics of The Owl House and I can't stop, I don't want to stop. Also I love your little void and your outfit was very cute.

[@notahumanbeing6892]

only tangential but I’ve enjoyed What We Do In The Shadows, there are witches in the universe who show up once or twice but the whole show has similar vibes to witch media, just vampire focused

[@greyjeth]

@@notahumanbeing6892 I've seen the movie but not the show. I do want to see it.

[@starvinggamer]

I do find it interesting the way there are these conflicting interpretations of these answers to various questions posed by the show because I feel like all of them are well-answered in the subtext without needing to spell then out. The conflicting answers I’ve seen all rely on forgetting one or more bits of dialogue or characterization. I hate to be like, “media literacy huh?” but it feels like a widespread case of “media literacy huh?” to me. I’d much rather live in a world where stories gesture strongly at the answers to some elements and ask the audience to take those clues the rest of the way themselves rather than have it spelled out. Re: the power sapping, there’s a lot of subtextual portrayal of it as a sort if addiction for Agatha. We know from Wandavision that she claims she does it for power, but we can see throughout the series and especially in the finale the sort of euphoric rush it gives her. If we spin out that metaphor we know that in the scene where she kills Alice, she has been “cold turkey” for 3 years and is coming immediately out of back-to-back possessions and also the emotional distress of having her mom say the things her mom said. It makes sense that in that moment she loses herself in a trance as she steals Alice’s power and needs to invocation of her son’s name to snap her out of it. When she takes the magic from Billy she is far more lucid, has a much stronger emotional connection to him, and also he has so much more power to give that she has much more leeway to break the connection before he dies. There is some fun retroactive subtext you can read into Wandavision with Agatha pressing Wanda on her seeming ability to bring back the dead, but if we go back to the addiction subtext and the broader ideas of leaning into her “inherent evil” for survival then a long-term resurrection goal makes less sense. This feels extra true when we learn about resurrection being against the rules, Billy and potentially Tommy being “abominations” against the natural order and thus being top of Rio’s shitlist, and Agatha’s request of Rio not being anything to do with Nicky but simply to be left alone in exchange for Billy’s surrender that she isn’t looking to bring him back. Re: the killing of witches and Nicky’s life span, Agatha says herself that she cannot do anything to protect him nor does she know when Rio will return. She was a witch killer before having Nicky so it makes sense that she just used him as an easier con to continue to feed her addiction. If it really were some sort of life extension technique for Nicky it seems very out of character that she would go to bed so easily that night without fulfilling her “quota”. She’s simply delaying her fix. Re: the Agathario stuff while I would love to get more of that stuff somewhere, i think it would have felt out of place in this show because this show really is about Billy and Agatha and their relationship. The Agatha Rio relationship is a secondary plot element that often drives the narrative but the show already gives us all we need to understand it on that level. At its core it’s just the most toxic possible end result of the most tragically unfair breakup. Re: the truth being too “terrible” the actual word she uses is “awful” and I think this is a key distinction. What I feel episodes 8 and 9 show clearly is that Agatha has built up this monumental wall around her heart in the centuries since Nicky’s passing, leaning fully into the villain persona, but the instant Teen enters her life and sees past the persona she suddenly finds herself emotionally vulnerable and in episodes 8 and 9 we finally fully see just how deep that well of emotional pain that she tried to bury is. The “awful” and not “terrible” part is that in order for her to not let people believe those things about her, she would then need to be vulnerable and face her pain and that’s what is too awful for her to do. (Ninja edit here but I do find it so interesting that most everyone who seems unsatisfied by this plot point remember her as saying “terrible” and not “awful” which maybe it’s nothing but it’s an interesting coincidence) Anyways I wrote you an essay, but also this brings back my original point. I agree that central plot points like the William/Billy stuff and The Road need to be laid out plainly. But I think it’s really fun to be able to look at a show like Agatha and pick apart the text to reach my own conclusions rather than just be told for these important but secondary details to the main plot. Thanks for the great video and another excuse to keep talking about Agatha.

[@TehTeh911]

Thank you! I feel like I'm going crazy because I didn't even know people disliked the ending, even looking it up I only found praise. I did see a couple of the questions referenced, but none of them were framed in a "this is a problem" sort of way. And like, what's left to explore of her character next season if all of this is completely spelled out anyway?

[@ceciliamarianne]

​​@@TehTeh911 Yeah, like the only person I've seen complaining about it is one of my best friends, but that's because she is a hardcore comics stan and has beef with the cinematic universe.

[@edamamame4U]

The Owl House is such a wonderful show, and it has helped me navigate my own queer identity as a biromantic asexual women. I love the character of Luz as she is spunky, courageous, empathetic, intelligent, and a genuinely loving friend and girlfriend. It was so refreshing to see positive depictions of LGBTQIA+ characters in the Owl House and I'm so sad that it was canceled. Throughout history, the idea of magic has always been linked with deviance/otherness and the divine feminine. There is a genuine "queerness" to world of magic as it is often associated with the unknown or the "other." I am also reading a wonderful Japanese manga called Witch Hat Atelier that is great with its LGBTQIA+ characters and positive depictions of disabled characters.

[@TubezThe1]

I saw Luz & immediately clicked! This is gonna be good. Watch for edit. The fact that witches have taken on so many variations throughout history is really fascinating. On one hand, you have those whom the identity was forced upon and/or took into their own hands, deciding what it means for themselves. In the other hand, you have what I guess we can call "Establishment Witches" those who, like the TERFs you mentioned unfortunately, take up the label because of perceived persecution that they aren't facing. They'll even looking at both, the best represented witches are the ones that shuck authority. Your rogues like Agatha or your weirdos like Luz, neither of whom would identify with the establishment for their own reasons. Hero or villain, they're still better than the system that persecuted them in the first place.

[@ilovewillowrosenberg]

WILLOW ROSENBERG IN THE THUMBNAIL !!! CANT WAIT

[@HeyRowanEllis]

someone with TASTE

[@The_impossible_Girl_501]

Missed tara tho, rip girl 🖤🖤🏳‍🌈

[@Lucarioguild7]

Name checks out lol

[@Reed5016]

Love her.

[@ilovewillowrosenberg]

@@Lucarioguild7 I forgot what my username was when I made this comment I'm ngl 😭😭 makes it funnier though

[@sofiasoderstrand3094]

I has been in completely different circles because I have completely missed the backlash. For me, the episodes before completely makes me feel great about the finale. We get two episodes showing that the show have known exactly what it was doing. Both Lilias flashbacks and flasforwards and Billies powers are shown to be consistent and planned throughout. And then we get Agathas backstory and it leaves a lot of holes and it tells me that they knew perfectly well what questions they left unanswered, but with the previous 2 eps, I trust the creators. Even if they never answer those questions, I feel they did exactly what they wanted with the finale, the way they wanted to do it.

[@choerim]

Same here, I was surprised when Rowan said a lot of people found the finale unsatisfying. Some questions didn't require an explicit answer and could be left to the viewers' interpretation, while some, I suspect, will be expanded on in the next thing Agatha appears in, but not all of them have to. Like Rio and Agatha's relationship, for example. I don't feel the need to see their past, how they met and fell in love, because I think it's more impactful the less it appears like a human romance. I know it's not the kind of wlw representation a lot of people want, but that's precisely why I like it - there is something poetic about Agatha and Death having this larger than life connection with each other.

[@eugeniamarch]

Rio is Death and the antagonist of the show, Agatha is a powerful witch, their relationship's story was definitely worth telling. It's a different story when the love interest is just a regular person, you can skip that stuff in a superhero show. But when both characters are integral to the plot, as well as their relationship... It only makes sense to show even a tiny sequence of them meeting and starting a relationship. Even non shippers were confused we didn't get their backstory. Many people didn't understand that their kiss was Agatha genuinely kissing her out of love and forgiving her, as the creator confirmed, they thought it was literally a kiss of death. If they showed the backstory, the added context of how strong their relationship was would have been VERY helpful. Also, the episode is called "Maiden Mother Crone" but it shows Agatha as only Mother and Crone, skipping her life as "maiden". I think narratively it would have been much better if the last episode was a character study on Agatha through her life, not just Nicky as the entire focus.

[@sofiasoderstrand3094]

@eugeniamarch I'm not saying I don't get why you wanted, or expected that content. What I'm saying is they didn't fumble it. They knew what they were doing and deliberately held back on what you wanted.

[@eugeniamarch]

@@sofiasoderstrand3094 i just don't think holding back Agatha's full backstory in her own show is a smart move, considering she died and is now a ghost - a new chapter in her journey, the previous one closed, and the side character role to Billy's main character i do agree however that the finale didn't really fumble anything, it was a very solid conclusion. But expanding on Agatha's character would have added a lot

[@dieorwrite9460]

ahhhh I absolutely love this topic! I'm a Chinese author who has a sapphic witch book that's coming out in the summer of 2025 called the Witch Who Chases the Sun that investigates the concept of the witch in western culture as the story draws heavily from Chinese mythology (esp alchemy and necromancy). And in China there is no concept of an evil practitioner of the female witch? Since Daoist cultivators who are female and even magic practitioner as seen simply as knowledgeable in spiritual matters like their male counterpart. So I think intersectionality of queer identity, the concept of the witch and being BIPOC whose culture doesn't demonize the idea of witch is sth I loved to explore in my book.

[@dieorwrite9460]

The book will be published by the indie publisher Asteria Press. If you are interested I can send you a free copy ❤

[@553miu]

omg as a sapphic asian bookworm i am EXCITED OMG?

[@dieorwrite9460]

@@553miucheck asteria press!

[@dieorwrite9460]

@@553miu YT doesn't allow me to leave a link but Asteria Press has a newsletter with all the new updates and announcement for the book

[@553miu]

@@dieorwrite9460 thank you!! i will definitely be checking it out!

[@themiddleones11]

I'm a lesbian witch and I approve this message

[@TheRealHelenaDeluca]

same haha

[@dragonetafireball]

My bestie was so hyped to get to cannon gay kisses in an MCU anything

[@ArtichokeHunter]

it's kinda interesting that it wasn't even the first marvel tv show witch kissing another woman! i kinda forgot that nico in runaways is a witch but i think she's presented that way

[@legendswarble2845]

That's why Eternals is so important to me. I cried in the theater seeing that kiss on the big screen. I never thought we'd get that moment

[@marvelousTUD]

Eternals and Jessica Jones got there first, but you can never have too much gay imo lol

[@Exiled.New.Yorker]

I adore how the MCU production team is bashing at the gates by introducing everything the DudeBros cant handle through the TV outlets, where audiences are more diverse. I need more Agatha, and more little Miss Marvel because Kamala is adorable.

[@iriswontbequiet]

As much as I wanted to see Aubrey Plaza and Katherine Hahn as kissing witches, I don’t love that meant killing one of them… at least Agatha basically buries herself, no effort on our half to bury this gay.

[@laymayday]

I love everything queer and magic ✨ It’s so fun to read/watch such stories!

[@maja2526]

We definitely need more witches on screen! I'd love to see Tales of Earthsea, books 4 and 5 are great in exploring how different "male" and "female" magic are viewed; I think it's fascinating how witch and wizard aren't equivalents for women and men wilding magic, you can be a witch of any gender or wizard of any gender, the difference is how you use your power/from where your power comes; lots of interesting ideas to explore there I really liked Agatha All Along, it was especially refreshing after Mayfair Witches let me down recently, I hope it'll give momentum to more witch-center media

[@PhotonBeast]

To clarify a bit on Rio, the kiss of death, and what not - Rio is literally Death. As in, Death has/had taken a human form and called herself Rio in that form. In the comic books, Death is a cosmic entity - a literal cosmic concept. It's a little different from many other literary forms of Death as Marvel Death isn't a 'person', isn't some independent avatar, isn't something empowered by death. But literally Death - the concept - as a cosmic force. How the MCU version differs, whose to say at this point.

[@thatmessy132]

The finale of Agatha All Along, for me as a comic book follower, was already taken by the reveal of how they were doing Billy. I knew they were going to do the boring mother angle from the first time they mentioned her son, I predicted that was her gripe with Rio (I didn't know she was death, but possibly the person who tried to save her and inadvertently killed her son). Knowing who the Teen was going to be, meant understanding the whole story (more or less). It really took from the imagination of the story. Still love the show.

[@lnt305]

I don’t think anyone of them is explicitly queer (though one of them is pretty aroace coded), but I love Pratchett‘s witches

[@thing_under_the_stairs]

I'd agree that Granny Weatherwax seems pretty aroace. She had a brief summer fling with a young wizard when she was a novice witch, but even then, she seemed to care far more about witchcraft than romance. And I wouldn't put Nanny Ogg past some pansexual exploration in her youth, if she'd ever had the chance!

[@ruthbennett7563]

GNU Sir Terry❤ I have nothing but love for his witches. I want to be Granny Weatherwax when I finally grow up.

[@isobelb]

I love the cornucopia of colours of the set dressing of this video. This shade of dark blue truly is the warmest colour for me but that lipstick complimenting the colour of your chair sends me. Tara being taken from us was such a traumatic wake-up for me. I still want to be Willow.

[@DrDanielDelish]

The truth being too terrible was a reference to the pain of the reality that “sometimes boys die” as in there nothing she could’ve done to stop his death.

[@Cl30l]

The Witch Boy trilogy by Molly Knox Ostertag is a fantastic graphic novel series. It is not stated as queer BUT it is the story of a 13 year old boy named Aster whose family is magic. The boys become shapeshifters, and the girls become witches. He has trouble shifting is only interested in doing as the girls do. The books are packed with trans metaphors. It is such a good series with beautiful art. Highly suggest it!

[@WhyseWytch]

I submitted a short story about a trans-femme Necromancer for a writing competition. It didn't win, but what you said about trans witches very much resonated with me.

[@brittanycatherine4947]

47:20 One of the things I like about Agatha All Along is how early they give us the set-up to various pay-offs with characters like Lillia, Rio, Billie, and Agatha. In the case of the Kiss of Death: e1: Rio says, "Why don't you just take my power?" And Agatha replies."You know that would kill me." In the finally Agatha says she took a calculated risk. She made a deal with Rio that if Billy turned himself in, Rio wouldn't come for Agatha after death (letting Agatha become a ghost). However, she also died before Rio officially took Billy's soul, so it might not have counted.

[@Quartermistress]

I'm surprised you didn't mention Juno Dawson's Her Majesty's Royal Coven, which is just one of my favourite series right now and I don't want to spoil anything.

[@bubuzuke1]

For me the most interesting queer coven in recent media is Imogen, Laudna, and Fearne from Critical Role, and I love witches. "Our weirdness is what makes us right". The dynamics of power and it's source and autonomy and loneliness and fear. So many delicious hours of character story to chew on and digest. And they're all sapphic.

[@brittanycatherine4947]

44:00 Given that Agatha planned to kill Alice in episode 2 (something she explicitly says to Billy in episode 9), I think any regret or confusion might have come from Nicky's presence at Alice's death (remember he wanted her to stop killing witches and then she turned their song into bait that let her kill a bunch of witches).

[@dmoraldi]

Oh my god, I just came here because KZbin suggested this video but you got my heart and my subscription with "those of you who have ADHD like me continue to do whatever important tasks you're doing while listening to this video". I was cleaning the bathroom and doing laundry. I'm crying.

[@Robynnnvm]

I think witch hat atelier can also be a good addition recommendation for not only having queer witches but also amazing art and worldbuilding

[@divineeye147]

YES!!! (a bit late for Halloween) but *YES!!!*

[@HeyRowanEllis]

i am anything but timely

[@divineeye147]

@@HeyRowanEllis fashionably late, you might say ;)

[@CallMeJellybaby]

Your mini monologue about the Agatha All Along finale is what my brain has been repeating since is finished! :S

[@Windthroughcedars]

Haven’t watched the video but was just thinking about this and had a great conversation with a friend! Our conscience was that Witches were the one archetype that both are both empowering, quite literally they have power. They aren’t tied to virginity, or youth like princesses, or motherhood like queens or fairy godmothers. They are still human. They can be any size or age. They can be any age. They can be good or evil, competent or dizzy. They also have power in that they are both feared, but can be sought out for help. I think women and fem leaning people in general are being more and more drawn to witches, both straight and queer. But what makes them so awesome for the queer community is that the actual history of witches so clearly parallels the history of queer history. So seeing these witchy characters be powerful, loved, and so varied it just so…. ❤

[@abbacadaver]

FEAR STREET!?! OMG _Thank you_ for talking about these movies, gotta be some of my favorite queer representation

[@samuellewis7141]

also, does it count as bury your gays if you die and come back as a ghost?

[@hartthorn]

On the Agatha discussion: You're not wrong, and I do feel like some people are confusing theorycrafting with narrative. Like, for a lot of these I might have IDEAS on what's going on, but it is just a fact that I don't *know* what's going on. And as you said, they put all these sub-mysteries in and then paid them off, then doing the "big reveal" with Billy, but it DOES feel like we're missing the "Rio's side of the story" episode. And this is going to be some theorycrafting! But I hope the implication, with Agatha as a ghost now, Billy still a fugitive from death, and now also Tommy out there somewhere in the world, we WILL get to Rio's side as she becomes a sort of collective nemesis for all three. That was the seed left for future stories. Still fully understand how that can be frustrating, but it is also the best plotline that can thread all three characters. And just as an aside, I also specifically love Aubrey's rendition of Death with Rio. She's not inherently cruel (for the most part), but she's also not kind like Pratchett's Death. She enjoys what she does, and even apparently is willing to pull strings SOME times. It just comes off as something more complex than your typical "Grim Reaper" villainous death but also not the "Old Friend" that gets used. Instead, she's random, scary, inscrutable, but also not directly malevolent. Which can put her in the camp with some of the MCU's best baddies like Loki, Killmonger, and Thanos (and quite a few more).

[@lemcy1256]

46:49 gotta love a good black cat cameo...

[@bymeerabrowngothicroyal]

Elphaba in the novel (Wicked) is pretty overtly bisexual-biromantic and intersex, it is implied on page 1. 💚

[@CaraRowen]

I'd argue it's not overt tho I agree with u. it's covert because overt implies it's thinly veiled and it's unfortunately just not by any standard.

[@bymeerabrowngothicroyal]

@ seemed pretty obvious to me but fair.

[@CaraRowen]

​@@bymeerabrowngothicroyalI think you might just have good media analysis which is an unfortunately dying skill at this point in society

[@strawberryskates]

It's interesting to see your thoughts on AAA, cause normally I have similar reactions as you when it comes to shows, but here I disagree. I won't write an essay in the comments, but I always saw Agatha & Billy's relationship as the most important one in the show, so her deciding to die had more to do with him (and Nicky of course) than Rio. The kiss was her way of absorbing some of Rio's power which, as she said in episode one, she knew would kill her. Love the rest of the video though, I'm gonna go watch fear street asap!

[@BasicandBizarre]

FANTASTIC video!!! Just wanted to drop a couple other queer witch novels: -The Scapegracers by HA Clark is like The Craft but without the intra-coven toxicity. Very "girl gang of queer high school witches do revenge". It's part of a trilogy which goes to some wild, painful, and intense places, from fighting modern day witch hunters to navigating inter-coven politics, gender identity in conservative families, and reparative vs punitive justice. Highly recommend. -When We Were Magic by Sarah Gailey follows another teen coven of queer witches who have to deal with the aftermath of the main character accidentally killing a boy at prom. -The Bone Spindle by Leslie Vedder is a fantasy retelling of several fairy tales. Two treasure hunters team up with a witch in order to stop the rise of theocratic witch hunters and revive a fallen, cursed kingdom of witches by waking their sleeping prince, Briar Rose. It features queer witches, butch huntswomen, cunning plots, and an evil witch queen with a mysteriouspast. Its part of a trilogy. -This Poison Heart by Kaylynn Bayron is about a young Black girl in New York City who can talk to plants who inherits an estate full of magic and secrets from her deceased aunt. Moving up there with her moms, she falls for a local girl and unravels her family's historical connections to figures of Greek mythology and the heavy burden given to them by the goddess Hecate. Is part of a duology.

[@dreamgirlfriendevil]

CEMETERY BOYS MENTION!! that book is so beyond great, i read it in one sitting because i couldnt put it down. highly recommend! i will definitely check out the others. ❤

[@stephishraga]

Wow you always know how to put my thoughts about tv shows/media into words while also teaching me new stuff

[@yasmincoonjah5332]

Your witches hat is so cute!

[@diego777cas]

26:03 I would consider The Substance a modern retelling of a vanity witch

[@KingApeiron]

Nodding along to Rowan as I crochet hats for my nephews...

[@ruthbennett7563]

Hook on, sister stitcher! I’m working on my 3rd 6-Day Star Blanket for family holiday gifting. ❤

[@Zvane100]

About Agatha, the story of her and neither Death's ain't over. Apparently, there is a Death mini seires coming up, and also a season 2.....but at the same time I think that is quite a good idea to leave certainly stuff unanswered. At the same time, I think that after Nicky's death, Agatha just snapped

[@Bonjoursir]

Lex Croucher’s books are so good!! I’m actually currently reading Not For the Faint of Heart ♥️ it’s so cool that one of my favourite KZbinrs and one of my favourite authors are friends!! I love your videos, you’re so insightful and fun to listen to

[@ArtichokeHunter]

i like how you could take "one of my favourite youtubers and one of my favourite authors" both ways, because lex is also a youtuber and rowan has also written a book

[@Kagomai15]

The Witch of the Wastes in Howl's Moving Castle looked better as an old woman, like she'd given up her evilness and became old and small and less mean, instead of this big scary middle aged meanie.

[@brittanycatherine4947]

48:00 Agatha Harkness is often a ghost in the comics, and in this particular case, she planned to become a ghost. So I understand how she would be happy when next we see her. Edit: I actually find this interesting, bc it's a death where a witch tricks and escapes from Death herself. Edit 2: I think this is a much cooler way for Agatha to gain ghost status rather than the comic version where her coven burned her at the stake. Plus we still get her ghost stories.

[@camillenaudin1967]

Thanks for the video! I wasn't sure what to watch after finishing the Handmaid's tale (very good but hard) and you helped me settle on Buffy! The universe has been shouting at me to finally watch this one

[@SistersTape]

I feel the same haha, it's been on my watch list for a while!

[@Witchy_Cheree1982]

Buffy is interesting - it’s very interesting to see it through different lenses through the years - I was in high school when buffy was on and each re watch I notice things I hate and wish were different and things I will always love and appreciate. Enjoy!

[@brittanycatherine4947]

45:00 Yes, Lilia's story was neatly tied up. Because her story is finished. Agatha's story is not. I don't know if Agatha spends more time as a ghost than a living person in the comics, but it does seem significant. So her dying doesn't really have the same lack of possibility and finality that you normally get for a character death.

[@fitzsimmons6064]

Spoiler for those looking at the comments before watching the video: Agatha doesn't die from kissing Rio. She dies from taking her power, which they set up in ep 2. The kiss was just a goodbye.

[@bootalophosaurus2378]

Every single time you make that ADHD shoutout, you catch me in the middle of some chore. Every single time.

[@Sableagle]

Look at that void!

[@HeyRowanEllis]

🐈‍⬛

[@SynergistN7]

2:46 I have never felt more called out in my life

[@centreoftheselights]

For some more adult-oriented queer witch books, I'd recommend the Scholomance trilogy by Naomi Novak or Ninth House by Leigh Bardugo.

[@ArtichokeHunter]

I was thinking about the Scholomance books! Definitely in terms of a replacement for the terf books. And Ninth House is great too. There are so many queer fantasy books but fewer I've read that are witches per se. (Like, are necromancers witches basically? Locked Tomb = close enough to queer witches? Or like, the Wayward Children books have so many queer people doing magical things)

[@thing_under_the_stairs]

Here's a shout out to The Once And Future Witches by Alix E Harrow! It's an amazing bit of alternate his(her?)story filled with folktales, fierce feminism, the blessings and curses of family, and a queer interracial love story, too. Most of all, it's full of a tone of hope and possibility, no matter how dark the current circumstances, something that we all need in our lives!

[@ShinobiPhoenix-YT0]

You had me for a while and then your last section about the Agatha finale completely lost me and I disagree so vehemently I started the question the previous. Rio is Death. Dying means she would be joining her but she took the risk of ABSORBING Rio's powers (which is literally said in Episode 1 what would happen if Agatha did that) and used them to become a ghost. She won't (have to) see Rio or see Nicky until she's ready to confront what she's been running from: forgiving herself enough to accept Nicky won't hate her for using their symbol of love for a murder/mad vengeance (she's going after witches still after the blonde one interrupts her burial mourning to pester her with petty desires and wish-hunting made from a legend people constructed from her love symbol). Even without deleted line from Episode 9, you never needed to see how Agatha and Rio met because it's not important to the story how, people just want to see it just because. Agatha is giving birth, if the baby is stillborn, it goes Mommy #2 Rio anyway but Agatha will never see her child unless she dies too. That's why Agatha hates her. She was always going to lose her child to her ex. She got a few years and tried to keep him alive and gain power to "protect him, heal him, and divine when Rio might come for him), but Rio came while she was sleeping. You never needed the backstory to them meeting. And being mad about them dying is pointless because A: she's not truly dead, only a ghost and B: she's not staying a ghost. It was a calculated risk to use Rio's power. (which Jac herself confirmed even if I hadn't understood it). The one thing that Agatha doesn't get that everyone else did is what's holding her back: Self-forgiveness.

[@clairejeter8274]

Not the call out of people with adhd listening to this in the background! Your voice is just so nice to have going while I’m doing work

[@felixheitzer2262]

OK, I have to disagree with you on one thing: You said, that for you there was no pay off for Agatha's line "the truth would be too awful". To me there is a very obvious answer, actually two/three: 1) she refers to Nikky actually being stillborn. That's pretty awful in itself, but it happened to HER, the legendary evil Agatha Harkness, survivor of uncounted battles with witch covens and who knows what else. 2) Her lover, Death itself had to take her baby. Pretty awful I'd say. + She Begged Rio to not go through, Rio gives her some time with Nikky in an unprecedented act of grace. And she has some years with him, but knows all this time, that it's not for long and has no idea, when Rio will finally take him. + When she loses him, she also loses her lover, because she can't let this go, even if it's the natural order. 3) She used Nikky and his song to lure witches to their death, made him basically accomplice in her serial killing. Pretty awful I'd say. So I think her being shrouded in mystery and Nikky's vanishing adding to her nimbus of grand unknowable evil is way more palatable for her, that the rather tragic truth, that also reveals her shortcomings as a mother. Because basically, Agatha is like an addict to me, who roped her very young child into her criminal acts in order to get her drugs.

[@onernoa]

The alternate reading options is an incredibly positive note to end on. Thank you!

[@SistersTape]

great video! I've long felt the connection between witches and queerness but couldn't really explain it - now you did it perfectly! I can also recommend the book "Transmogrify! 14 fantastical tales of queer magic" ✨

[@PJ23hunny13]

Some other queer witchy books are the Raven Cycle trilogy by Maggie Stiefvater. (has gay, bi, pan, poly teens, stars a woman of color, and has a mystery vibe) or the Flowers of Prophecy series by Natalia Hernandez ( stars a queer woman of color who is at the center of a mystery. Has magic warrior women and a Latin American inspired setting)

[@fRkOdCmK]

Another great recommendation for fans of sapphic witches is Campaign 3 of Critical Role. SPOILERS I guess but the relationship between Imogen and Laudna is so special to me. Their love slowly manifests naturally and it's so beautiful and complex at the same time. Even though the world of Exandria has plenty of magic and homophobia is not a real issue, there's some interesting analysis one can make about the marginalization that both Imogen and Laudna have suffered due to the nature and origin of their powers. Imogen's powers are particularly weird even for Exandria bc her powers come from a powerful alien identity that even gods fear. Her mind reading abilities cause her a lot pain bc most people have awful minds. The only mind that has ever brought her comfort is Laudna's. Meanwhile, Laudna... there's so much going on with Laudna that is so interesting and juicy. If I start talking about her I'll never stop. It'd be easier to just watch Critical Role or wait till that campaign gets animated. I also recommend reading What Doesn't Break by Cassandra Khaw. It tells Laudna's story before she met Imogen and it made me cry so much.

[@darkestlight660]

Imoda is SO GOOD. I love beau yasha, but nothing has topped Imogen and laudna for me. Their relationship evolves so organically, and I love how they have so much conflict but work through it together regardless. Lot of mutual support there

[@hello_its_jo9951]

Well isn’t it funny that Agatha let everybody believe she was a horrible mother, only to show that her motherly love and grief are her defining characteristics. That and being a raging lesbian lol 😂 I too am disappointed in the storytelling in the last two episodes but also understand that they only had so much time. I really would have liked to see their relationship before Nicky, that would really have made a lot more sense. Having read more context Agatha chose her own death by siphoning Rio’s power (which was hinted in episode 1) makes sense but I did not get that on first watching. At least it gives her agency in her death so not like Villanelle. The show runner actually said since the show ended that she has regrets and would like to tell their story retrospectively.

[@dragonforce627]

Raelle and Scylla from Motherland Fort Salem will always be my favorite queer witches.

[@morgiana-esdeath]

i looooved the ending ! so mmany answers and circlu fully completed with yet so many brilliant questions that open a whole world for a season 2 ! i don't think we should have all of the answers of a show in one season or there are no places for a gooooood season 2 :)

[@tudibelle]

Loved the video, and thank you for keeping this ADHDer company while I attempt to finish the blanket I am weaving in time for Christmas. I started it in September, had plenty of time, yet here I am, with 2/3 to do and 48 h to go... Cemetery Boys is a great book. I have put The Spirit Bares Its Teeth on the TBR.

[@linxalexander8554]

Loved the mention about the covenless witches element of agatha all along and how it can be read through a queer lense about the queer community. I think one of the hardest aspects of queerness to explore narratively is intercommunity conflict. It is such a huge part of our lives as queer people yet exploring it explicitly in text risks stepping into the very muddy waters of "homophobes are actually just repressed queers" and other such narratives that ultimately blame marginalized groups for their own marginalization. Your comments about the layering of metaphorical and canonical queerness really helped me understand how this two layers can be used as a way to explore those avenues safely. I will probably be writing a class essay on the different versions of covenless witches in AAA and how they speak to different forms of queer marginalization. I am especially fascinated by the generational aspect. Lilia explicitly talking about the pain of losing her coven to plague being part of the reason she avoided a new coven, Agatha playing out the villain role and weaponizing cruelty against other witches, and Billys admiration/manipulation/disappointment/naiveness in his relationship to the other witches all really resonate with things I have seen and lived within queer communities. Also Jen as alienated by the trauma inflicted on her by another witch, and Alices negotiation of the protector/cursed self identification specifically make me think about the dynamics within queer activism

[@lalamyne]

I haven't even started the video yet, but THANK YOU SO MUCH ROWAN!!!! I love, LOVE witches, YOU HAVE NO IDEA!!!! And being queer myself I love queer witches EVEN MORE!!!! Thank you so so much for this video, you made my day!!!!! AAAAAAAAAAA 💖

[@karinadarjuan5418]

It’s awesome seeing you pop up in my recommended feed. Congrats on your success on KZbin!

[@tikamajere316]

I am so happy to see you mention In The Flesh! I feel like nobody remembers that show!!

[@OMEGA-362]

Hmm, i have thoughts about the agatha stuff, mostly it seems that the thing she is not talking about because it's too horrible is grief, like normal grief, also she believes she's keeping her son alive and when he dies she is simply doing what she did when he was dead to remember him, I don't want or need more answers because her character and motivations seem very clean and well thought out here, but the relationship with death could've used less implication and more on screen time though

[@asas.2038]

the kiss isn't what killed her, agatha was absorbing rio's powers at the end

[@lynn858]

Thank you for speaking at the pace I actually want to process things at.

[@camillenaudin1967]

Why did you have to call me out on my ADHDesque doing something lmao

[@camillenaudin1967]

No one needs to know but I am crocheting a flower lamp using wire to give them a pointy end and I recommend it's awesome

[@ancient_void]

I feel called out, currently making worksheets for my classes. Will continue and listen.

[@kuriosastoryteller]

If you all are crazy about more witch lore in pop culture I highly recommend the KZbinr Witch Way. Her videos are really, really good! You learn so much! 💚🖤

[@elleycloud4228]

A witchy read I’ve been loving is her majesty’s royal coven

[@maddummel]

literally binging all of yor latest content while working from home, thanks for the callout haha! great video as usual!

[@brittanycatherine4947]

42:30 With regards to the unanswered questions at the end of Agatha All Along, I think there's a difference between ending on the detective saying, "I don't know who did it?" And the 2 main characters saying we've established Y and we need to find X. Leaving things open for a season 2 or the next series.

[@camadams9149]

2:53 Me minding my own business playing with hardware security keys... suddenly getting snapped back into reality when the background voice calls me out

[@marielamus94]

Here to add to the queer books list! I loved The Honey Witch, a cottagecore, beekeeping, cursed not be loved magical wlw romance with an emphasis on intergenerational relationships within the family women. Obsessed

[@kalika424]

Look at that void

[@HeyRowanEllis]

🐈‍⬛

[@hallopino]

Agatha directly said she could have stopped draining Alice, but chose not to.

[@SeanLigman-yo6yc]

As a Queer male Witch.....oh my yes, im very subversive....

[@wendyheatherwood]

"...continue to do whatever important task you are doing whilst listening to this video." - Thanks I really need to get this kitchen looking borderline presentable before my new washing machine arrives.

[@grodriguez7225]

I myself read Moon-Cakes this autumn and it was delightful!

[@morganakanan8204]

Love the hair! The color looks great on you

[@janmelantu7490]

The single-digit episode length of TV shows these days is the big problem here. Hard to tell the full story with such a short time frame

[@Shendie]

Desperately need to know what all those book series with beautifully painted edges are!

[@sagea307]

I love Andrew Joseph White's writing so much. Hell Followed With Us made me feel a lot of things as a queer person who was raised religious and has weird body gender feelings. While they aren't directly queer, Terry Pratchett's witches and wizards and the way he uses them to play with gender roles is amazing

[@darkestlight660]

Me waiting for you to bring up owl house in every section: wait...no, not everyone is as obssessed with this spell as i am, lmao