The Problem With Trapping & Why Late Bruce Lee Dismissed It

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Thomas Marx - Original Jeet Kune Do IFO

Thomas Marx - Original Jeet Kune Do IFO

4 жыл бұрын

In late Original Jeet Kune Do from Bruce Lee, there was no trapping used anymore. This may shock some people, but according to Ted Wong and Jesse Glover, late Bruce Lee dismissed trapping all together because it didnt work under pressure. Also he stated to Taki Kimura 1969 that Chi Sao was out. Even in the fighting method books, with all the pictures form 1966-67, there was practicaly zero trapping, if something than very few single pac saos. Everything was based od attacking an opening or using feints, instead of trapping.
Trapping works only if the opponents would freeze their hands up and completely stop their attacking intention, instead of snapping or punching through and continuing attacking. Trapping fails completly if the attack is unpredicted and comes from all angles and with full force. Therefore it's a very unrealistic concept. But people love it, because it looks flashy. As a initial attack it can work if its simplified, but in that case anything can work, even a punch from a completly untrained person. However, trapping always means compromising own punching structure.
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Пікірлер: 97
@ignitionfrn2223
@ignitionfrn2223 8 ай бұрын
I remember a martial proverb saying *1st the blow & 2nd the throw* or *1st the knock & 2nd the lock* : you have to make sure your opponent is unable to respond either using a feint or a preventive strike to cripple him by pain BEFORE you trap/lock/throw him. In France, there is a "lost" system called _Lutte Parisienne_ which combine French boxing kicks & punches with Fresstyle wrestling throws & single/double leg takedown.
@WingChunGungFu
@WingChunGungFu 4 жыл бұрын
Excellent video! The vast majority of the Wing Chun community misunderstood chi sau as it turns out. Chi Sau is a game and a drill to learn how to cover and to test where someone is at with their experience in the art. Chi Sau was NEVER meant to be used in an actual fight. Trying to chase the arms is where most guys go wrong. Real "trapping" is more just basically parrying and is only meant to last a millisecond to get their arms out of the way of those vital targets so we can hit them ;) Thank you for the content, looking forward to seeing more!
@arc3075
@arc3075 3 жыл бұрын
That’s an excellent answer, chi sau is a drill and it refines highly developed sensitivity of the exponent. I read somewhere that chi-sau wasn’t taught to students until after their training resulted in the student spontaneously applying different hand positions in sparring. In other words, once the principles of a WCK structure has become a natural reflex. To discount trapping as ineffective, is to reduce the 5 routes(ways) of attack, down to 4. Therefore later generations will be at a loss of 1 method of attacking. This is illustrated in the long history of the Dog Brothers history as told my Master Marc Denny. In the early years, the prevalence of the dropping knee strike was so successful. They literally looked to find ways of defending against it. Sure enough they did find a defense to it. The defense was so successful, in one generation of dog brothers stopped utilizing it as an effective method. Only to have the latest generation discover the drop step attacking knee strike. Once again, it was re-discovered as a successful attack method. Not only because it is a successful strategy. But also due to the in-between time(years) where no one was taught how to defend against it on the assumption that everyone just knew how to defend against it.
@arc3075
@arc3075 3 жыл бұрын
My answer to “The Archive” shared That’s an excellent answer, chi sau is a drill and it refines highly developed sensitivity of the exponent. I read somewhere that chi-sau wasn’t taught to students until after their training resulted in the student spontaneously applying different hand positions in sparring. In other words, once the principles of a WCK structure has become a natural reflex. To discount trapping as ineffective, is to reduce the 5 routes(ways) of attack, down to 4. Therefore later generations will be at a loss of 1 method of attacking. This is illustrated in the long history of the Dog Brothers history as told my Master Marc Denny. In the early years, the prevalence of the dropping knee strike was so successful. They literally looked to find ways of defending against it. Sure enough they did find a defense to it. The defense was so successful, in one generation of dog brothers stopped utilizing it as an effective method. Only to have the latest generation discover the drop step attacking knee strike. Once again, it was re-discovered as a successful attack method. Not only because it is a successful strategy. But also due to the in-between time(years) where no one was taught how to defend against it on the assumption that everyone just knew how to defend against it.
@WingChunGungFu
@WingChunGungFu 3 жыл бұрын
@@arc3075 Can you show what you mean by “the drop step knee” please?
@iammichael1094
@iammichael1094 4 жыл бұрын
Wow, thanks so much for showing the world the truth. I knew boxing would beat it, but no one ever showed it to my knowledge until now.
@Enryu_CZX
@Enryu_CZX 3 жыл бұрын
Don't believe in styles absorb what is useful and discard what is useless for self defense n street fight otherwise it's a good sport good to stay in shape
@brucehuddler7518
@brucehuddler7518 Жыл бұрын
Trapping like any tool works, if it is trained properly, it this video I can’t see if he shifts on angle enough to avoid the punch range. You do not trap head on hoping to get lucky.
@ThomasMarxJeetKuneDoIFO
@ThomasMarxJeetKuneDoIFO Жыл бұрын
So, you trap than if the opponent pauses and lets his hand forward? Who does that? If you watch all that trapping videos, you can see how thr opposite side never attacks actually realistically.
@gglendinningok
@gglendinningok Жыл бұрын
QUALITY! Keepin it REAL, thanking U
@therealawakener7
@therealawakener7 3 жыл бұрын
It's both nice and refreshing to see Sifu's in JKD who know what they are talking about and aren't afraid, to tell the truth. I got a lot of flack on youtube several years ago for doing stuff like this and now people seem to be receiving JKD's truthfulness a lot more welcoming so keep up the good work because there's so much crap out there getting passed of as JKD when we know it isn't, far from it.
@michaelloria69
@michaelloria69 4 жыл бұрын
This is one of the only venues for true jkd information. Thank you guys!! You rock. And of course Tommy thank you 🤘
@Election0747
@Election0747 4 жыл бұрын
Finally, a video of JKD people showing the danger of trapping! Great video
@ThomasMarxJeetKuneDoIFO
@ThomasMarxJeetKuneDoIFO 4 жыл бұрын
Trapping is something that Bruce stopped doing, but most JKD lineages do that, either because of misinformation, or/and it sells better. But it's not practical against unpredictable fast attacks, and when we are honest most attacks are like that.
@liferockout
@liferockout 3 жыл бұрын
Right
@LA-21KAIJU
@LA-21KAIJU 2 жыл бұрын
@@ThomasMarxJeetKuneDoIFO Yes! Ted wong JKD from the last student of bruce lee, I learned that from my Sifu. hes a lineage from sifu ted wong
@streetlethal3727
@streetlethal3727 4 жыл бұрын
Thanks for the video🙏
@pancho43
@pancho43 4 жыл бұрын
Very good video and great explained. Keep up the good work
@AndrewHaze
@AndrewHaze 4 жыл бұрын
Very applicative thanks for share🐉
@abmagnitude7596
@abmagnitude7596 4 жыл бұрын
Also when you start trapping, you always trap yourself as well. You can feel him, he can feel you. Not a good place to be in. Better disengage, change the line of attack
@BRUCEJJ66
@BRUCEJJ66 3 жыл бұрын
Isn't that a bit like saying you shouldn't grab someone to grapple/wrestle/choke/lock/takedown because then they can do the same to you?
@abmagnitude7596
@abmagnitude7596 3 жыл бұрын
@@BRUCEJJ66 When you can grab / trap / grapple / whatever someone, you could pretty much always attack one of the main targets like eyes, groin, throat. So why not end the fight faster and attack there? What I mean is that you block your limbs when you hold someone. You cannot use them to finish him quickly with an eyejab for example.
@3nduser
@3nduser Жыл бұрын
Very new information. Thank you
@alcosmic
@alcosmic 3 жыл бұрын
This is an important video for anyone interested in martial arts (especially JKD!)
@tonyjkd8010
@tonyjkd8010 5 ай бұрын
Very true. Thats why Bruce threw it away. IFO
@Simon2k17
@Simon2k17 3 жыл бұрын
Trapping does work. Actually necessary, right after a successful finger jab to the eyes, follow by the chain punch. When the opponent is blinded and feels alot of pressure and oncoming strikes, they tend to stick their arms out to create distance. That's when you trap to move their defences out of the way to create openings. Other then that, trapping is taught for historical purposes and it pays the bills because it looks cool. LOL. Took me 3 years to get out of the "trapping fetish". Some people never make it out.
@claud1961
@claud1961 3 жыл бұрын
Thanks for this insight! I was shocked to find out a few years ago that trapping was pretty much abandoned by Lee. I have thought about it, and I think the problem lies with conditioning. We know that he didn't let any system or style dictate his movements but he still had loyalty to his heritage and that made it hard to totally discard it, even after he had doubts about it. I am sure it was kept in training for a while until he stopped teaching and began to make movies- that would have been the perfect time for such a big change. And since he had nobody to teach, he let others come to the same conclusion- or not. I don't ever recall him attempting to force his opinion on anybody. He demonstrated, and if you wanted to learn he would be happy to but his chipping away at the mystique the arts liked to shroud themselves in was slow and methodical.
@ThomasMarxJeetKuneDoIFO
@ThomasMarxJeetKuneDoIFO 3 жыл бұрын
The problem with trapping is, you can only use in an a very specific situation. Bruce looked for stuff that you can use in most situation. So there where you could trap, you still could actually attack openings instead to trap. This is what you always do in any situation. It's more direct quicker.
@bhughes9518
@bhughes9518 3 жыл бұрын
Awesome 😎👍
@kenwin916
@kenwin916 3 жыл бұрын
Trapping works mate, only when the guy blocks, your trapping don't work because it doesn't throw the guy off balance or locks him...
@ThomasMarxJeetKuneDoIFO
@ThomasMarxJeetKuneDoIFO 3 жыл бұрын
Listen, when the gy blocks, hit him else where. Still wait to see, trapping working against resistant opponent. BS. Won't work, only against idiots, who don't know what they do.
@shukocarl79
@shukocarl79 3 жыл бұрын
I find that I can use lop sao and pak sao in sparring if the attacker over extends. Jut sao is sometimes useful in very close (almost grappling) distance.
@ThomasMarxJeetKuneDoIFO
@ThomasMarxJeetKuneDoIFO 3 жыл бұрын
Grappling distance...That's braking down the distance to styles. I this distance I do this style, at that distance I do that style...
@kenshinfight
@kenshinfight 2 жыл бұрын
I think the first trap has potential. Without a parry(opponent side), the lead punch will definitely connect, which will negate a punch coming from their left hand if they tried to counter. The premise that this won't work is predicting a response of a parry from a boxer. Which will not happen unless he's mayweather. If he doesn't parry or block, again, the lead will connect. Bruce trained a lot in trapping up to the 3rd hand. But according to Dan Inosanto, Bruce Lee would only need to use the first hand, meaning he floors you with his first trap. And that for me has merit and real life application.
@therealawakener7
@therealawakener7 3 жыл бұрын
I always tell my students, "DO YOU KNOW WHAT IS THE DEATH OF TRAPPING???" Very few know the answer... The answer is simple.
@arc3075
@arc3075 3 жыл бұрын
It is good that he formulated a video of the dangers of trapping without complete mastery of the subject. I look forward to his video on how to successfully implement trapping in an attacking structure. Or else, the next generation of jkd practitioners will only have 4 ways of attack in JKD. Not the 5 routes of attack as described by its founder in his lifetime.
@ThomasMarxJeetKuneDoIFO
@ThomasMarxJeetKuneDoIFO 3 жыл бұрын
Trapping is hopeless. 5 ways of attack, another misconception. Its not 5 ways of JKD attacks, its a scientific analysis, Bruce made how to categorise any possible attack of any martial art.
@arc3075
@arc3075 3 жыл бұрын
My answer to “The Archive” shared That’s an excellent answer, chi sau is a drill and it refines highly developed sensitivity of the exponent. I read somewhere that chi-sau wasn’t taught to students until after their training resulted in the student spontaneously applying different hand positions in sparring. In other words, once the principles of a WCK structure has become a natural reflex. To discount trapping as ineffective, is to reduce the 5 routes(ways) of attack, down to 4. Therefore later generations will be at a loss of 1 method of attacking. This is illustrated in the long history of the Dog Brothers history as told my Master Marc Denny. In the early years, the prevalence of the dropping knee strike was so successful. They literally looked to find ways of defending against it. Sure enough they did find a defense to it. The defense was so successful, in one generation of dog brothers stopped utilizing it as an effective method. Only to have the latest generation discover the drop step attacking knee strike. Once again, it was re-discovered as a successful attack method. Not only because it is a successful strategy. But also due to the in-between time(years) where no one was taught how to defend against it on the assumption that everyone just knew how to defend against it.
@user-kp3hd9wr4w
@user-kp3hd9wr4w Жыл бұрын
actually, after I learn more about trapping, there are some trappings that is good to be used in long range fight. it is just, most of them arent chi sao
@avmiritav83
@avmiritav83 4 жыл бұрын
All this guy is saying is 100% right that trapping hand shit doesn’t work
@crandallexpo0648
@crandallexpo0648 4 жыл бұрын
you're not supposed to chase the hand ( the reference point) you move in like a fencer , simultaneously and or after you've intercepted him with like a kick and Bam! Simplified trapping regular Pak Sao or lop sao, jao Sao.. Bruce definitely did use it Just not in a manner that you're putting out as, which is why most ppl say it don't work... But they're usually just the ones who don't understand and do it the way you're showing it.
@ThomasMarxJeetKuneDoIFO
@ThomasMarxJeetKuneDoIFO 4 жыл бұрын
Im putting in a manner how most people use it in jkd scene. Also Bruce moved away from it, because as I explained its still indirect and gives the opponent extra time.
@crandallexpo0648
@crandallexpo0648 4 жыл бұрын
@@ThomasMarxJeetKuneDoIFO yeah I feel ya, I never finished typing what I was saying fell asleep #ArmyLife, 😅... But you're one of the most legit KZbin channels...
@ThomasMarxJeetKuneDoIFO
@ThomasMarxJeetKuneDoIFO 4 жыл бұрын
Cheers, you are maybe over using smartphone, don't take it to the bed, haha.
@crandallexpo0648
@crandallexpo0648 4 жыл бұрын
@@ThomasMarxJeetKuneDoIFO hahaha
@seppetoni7874
@seppetoni7874 3 жыл бұрын
yet you don't see any of it in the long beach video
@BANIASU-abandoned
@BANIASU-abandoned 3 жыл бұрын
good video Get reference
@edwardlee8653
@edwardlee8653 4 жыл бұрын
Hi, may i know what is the difference between your teachings and Dan Inosanto's?
@ThomasMarxJeetKuneDoIFO
@ThomasMarxJeetKuneDoIFO 4 жыл бұрын
We teach to win the fight as quick and early as possible using rather less than more.
@liferockout
@liferockout 3 жыл бұрын
Thats what i want in fighting no flashy moves end the fight quickly
@JeNye9000
@JeNye9000 3 жыл бұрын
Trapping works but it is difficult to master. The problem is that most people can’t make it work. In a video Dan Inosanto is seen talking about the ineffectiveness of trapping. He said Bruce Lee could use trapping in sparring and fighting and we - meaning BL’s students in Inosanto’s group - could not do it. Most Wing Chun practitioners can’t do it either. From what I heard, Jesse Glover was very good at trapping. Glover was a black belt in Judo and used some Judo principles in his trapping. Ultimately it is a self-discovery process.
@brusli1732
@brusli1732 3 жыл бұрын
I was once friendly sparring with my friend in a park (no gloves) and, at one point, he started using a more defensive approach with his guard always up. I tried to trap one of his hands so I could lower his guard, but as soon as I pushed my rear open hand forward to catch his arm, he raised his arm to block and I hit his elbow with my thumb and sprained it. For 2 weeks I couldn't use my hand because any slight movement caused me a lot of pain. I never tried to actively trap someone's arm again. The only "trapping" that works is by hitting and intercepting the opponent's punch with a parry, thus "trapping" his attack mid way. Interception, which is basically the key word in the name of JKD, is a superior modification of trapping.
@grizztough4091
@grizztough4091 Жыл бұрын
Well in the first place you are not following proper body position for trapping or hand positions. While you make some good points you are closing in far to close when trapping jamming up your own arms , to trap you need both hips square so both hands have essentially equal reach. Yes I know jkd prefers a fencing stance, however lees earlier students did not, such as James demile, Jesse glover. When you lop sao your thumb should not be wrapped around the wrist, you also stop the attack after a trap and weak back fist? Why stop. A trap is a momentary disruption and redirection. Or containment of incoming energy. If you trap hit the counter punch can be nullified and when you disrupt his energy flow the counter punch can also be shut down.
@aquiredskill
@aquiredskill 3 жыл бұрын
Any move has holes
@CBHDK59
@CBHDK59 2 жыл бұрын
for what i understand he didn't dismissed it, all he had was doubts, especially that bruce had other things in mind and things to do like film work and didn't had time to dwell on it. he never adding anything to it, if he did, dan inosanto, jerry poteet, Richard bustillo or any other first generation of students would had showing an advanced in trapping.
@sasoriko
@sasoriko Жыл бұрын
Bruce never abandoned trapping he just finally understood that chisao isn't about trapping. Look at his early students. They achieved a level where they were able to shut down their opponents without chasing hands by seeking center. The reason your trapping doesn't work and you get countered with the rear hand is that you have no connection to your opponents center. That's the real skill. You're chasing hands and not center. You haven't moved your opponents mass. You haven't controlled the center line. You have no touch skill. Gongfu isn't about technique it's about skill. Skill defines the technique.
@Polentaccio
@Polentaccio 2 жыл бұрын
Lol trapping fetish. I'd agree. I think its uses are in standing grappling and even some areas of ground fighting. But that said, I usually ride or follow/control the elbows so as to know where the arms are vs slap , trap, smack sort of deal. I think we can all agree it looks awesome though !
@pjtheory
@pjtheory 3 жыл бұрын
Bruce Lee did NOT abandon or dismiss trapping from JKD. First of all, the core of JKD is the 5 Ways Of Attack with HIA or Hand Immobilization Attack being 1 of the 5 WOA. What Bruce did was to simplify the trapping techniques in JKD and that involved getting rid of the compound trapping in favor of the single trap and hit. The evidence seems to indicate that in the latter stages of JKD, he focused on the Lop Sao and Pak Sao. The Little Dragon spent years building up his Popeye-like forearms in order to turn his Lop Sao into a major weapon. According to witnesses who saw Lee take apart a challenger on the set of Enter The Dragon, one of the techniques he used in the brief fight was the Lop Sao. In terms of the Pak Sao, he told his childhood friend/Wing Chun brother Hawkins Cheung that the Pak Sao was one of the tools he used to intercept an opponent's attack. Bruce explained that once he bridged the gap, he would Pak at the elbow joint and put forth maximum forward pressure by using the bow action of the hip. Lee's goal was to destroy his opponent's structure and once that occurred, he could dip further into his tool box to quickly end the fight.
@ThomasMarxJeetKuneDoIFO
@ThomasMarxJeetKuneDoIFO 3 жыл бұрын
People love trapping, right... Cause it looks pretty. I'm going to quote Ted Wong, his words standing 2 meters away from me, him explaining at his jkd seminar: "Bruce throw trapping away, because of the footwork. You don't need that when you move". At the same time he showed and explained. Jesse Glover confirmed as well, that Bruce moved away from it. Now swallow it, accept it and move on.
@pjtheory
@pjtheory 3 жыл бұрын
@@ThomasMarxJeetKuneDoIFO According to those who watched him spar at the Chinatown kwoon or saw him destroy a challenger on the set of Enter The Dragon, Lee's trapping techniques were not pretty, but ugly and brutal. You're certainly entitled to ignore the documented record, but the last time that Jesse Glover saw Bruce Lee was shortly after Brandon's birth. Brandon was born in February 1965, and Bruce didn't coin his new fighting method (e.g., Jeet Kune Do) until the Fall of 1965, so Glover had no first-hand experience with Lee's new martial art. Unlike Glover, Seattle Era student Patrick Strong trained with Bruce in BOTH Jun Fan Gung Fu and Jeet Kune Do. In regards to JKD trapping or HIA, Strong stated, "Interception is much, much more than the Five Ways Of Attack. When used in a trapping context, the objective is to disrupt your opponent's entire body structure. In this respect, it should not be called "trap," better, "trap and destroy." Ted Wong is certainly entitled to his opinion, but the reality is that he knew very little about what Lee was teaching his best students (e.g., Bob Bremer, Dan Lee, Larry Hartsell) at the L.A. Chinatown kwoon. For example, Bob Bremer was the only Bruce Lee student to be taught the Hammer Principle and the lead leg obstruction. It's important to note that Ted Wong was the only Bruce Lee student to be taught the full pendulum.
@ThomasMarxJeetKuneDoIFO
@ThomasMarxJeetKuneDoIFO 3 жыл бұрын
In Bruce own words about wing chun and trapping, this shit doesn't work. Don't come me with enter the dragon nonsense. There is no footage of any fights. Even inosanto admitted that what Bruce practiced in La, was purely kicking and boxing, I inosanto he called it kickboxing. And you know what, Bruce was right, that shit doesn't work. I know it's hard to accept, after being misinformed for years. Only few can grasp jkd anyway, one out of ten thousand, in Bruces own words. BTW, most of these guys you mentioned trained only a handful of times with Bruce. There is a record, but not published. After Bruce died, suddenly everyone became a student of his and a "original" source.
@seppetoni7874
@seppetoni7874 3 жыл бұрын
every stand up martial arts uses the 5 ways of attack, it's not exceptional for jkd so don't get hung up on that. it was just a conclusion that there are 5 ways to attack. On his long beach sparring video you don't see him trap at all, just hit and disengage and that was at a time when he taught his class with a wing chun approach. jesse said that bruce would never teach what he was doing at the present moment. bruce was allready fed up with teaching his students in seattle and fed them what they wanted and not what they needed.
@pjtheory
@pjtheory 3 жыл бұрын
@@seppetoni7874 The 5 Ways of Attack were created by Bruce Lee, so "every" other stand up martial art is simply copying Lee's genius. As I mentioned in my initial post, the core of JKD is the 5 Ways Of Attack and to think that Bruce would simply throw out 1 of the 5 Ways Of Attack ignores how Bruce was applying his fighting art in the early 70's. Jesse Glover last saw Bruce in 1966, so he had no idea of what his sifu did or didn't do with his art in the last 7 years of his short life. As I mentioned in my initial post, Bruce spent years building up his Popeye-like forearms in order to turn his Lop Sao into a major weapon. According to 18 witnesses (e.g., film director Robert Clouse, karate champion Bob Wall) who saw Lee take apart a challenger on the set of Enter The Dragon, one of the techniques he used in the brief fight was the Lop Sao. In terms of Lee's sparring demonstration at the 1967 Long Beach Internationals, his lone focus was on the Fencing aspects of JKD whereas in his other demonstrations that day, he demonstrated the Wing Chun aspects (e.g., Chi Sao, 1 inch power) of JKD. For whatever reason, Bruce decided not to demonstrate the Boxing aspects of JKD.
@DareToWonder
@DareToWonder 3 жыл бұрын
oh i get it, you need to block and attack same time
@ThomasMarxJeetKuneDoIFO
@ThomasMarxJeetKuneDoIFO 3 жыл бұрын
Not really
@DareToWonder
@DareToWonder 3 жыл бұрын
@@ThomasMarxJeetKuneDoIFO ah... so i dont get it
@ThomasMarxJeetKuneDoIFO
@ThomasMarxJeetKuneDoIFO 3 жыл бұрын
Blocking is last resort.
@DareToWonder
@DareToWonder 3 жыл бұрын
@@ThomasMarxJeetKuneDoIFO right, its always better to move to a superior angle and if not that to parry.
@LA-21KAIJU
@LA-21KAIJU 2 жыл бұрын
And that's why it called intercepting fist. Trapping 8s a waste of time and energy. Just hit !
@bekabel310
@bekabel310 3 жыл бұрын
As much as I like JKD,I personally wouldn't use trapping in a close range fighting,because of my Judo background I would rather stick to grappling (take-downs,Pick ups,throws,trips,slams.they are more practical for my experience,and Bruce Lee wouldn't disagree with me if he was alive because he didn't invent a fixed style but rather an adaptable style that suits everyone,so everyone's Jkd is different.
@ThomasMarxJeetKuneDoIFO
@ThomasMarxJeetKuneDoIFO 3 жыл бұрын
Bruce went away from trapping...Take down and grappling isn't a good idea in a real world application, because you can get attacked by a second person while you are down, or even stabbed by the guy you try to grapple. Using punches and eye attacks is far more efficient and safe.
@Polentaccio
@Polentaccio 2 жыл бұрын
@@ThomasMarxJeetKuneDoIFO yes and no. If you know balance and how to take it, you can throw with very minimal effort and do a ton of damage. It takes no more time to jab and kick/punch then it does to sweep someone or do one of the easier judo throws. Hell a properly timed sutemi sacrifice throw and your opponent's chin and face hits the pavement hard. If you have ukemi you also have the advantage of level changes. Against multiple opponents, if you are there longer than 40-60 second, you are screwed either way.
@ThomasMarxJeetKuneDoIFO
@ThomasMarxJeetKuneDoIFO 2 жыл бұрын
@@Polentaccio throwing and sweeping isn't grappling rolling around on the ground, trying taking position, to submission or joint lock.
@CBHDK59
@CBHDK59 Ай бұрын
no matter how we slice it, is not up to you. remember that to hits a man one must come to a stop with the exact range to make that hit. there the possibility he takes you down. plus an opponent who can take punishment continue to move forward and the range present itself, there he got the upper hand. groundwork should not be ignored. get backed against a wall with no place to go and find oneself pin on the ground.
@user-go2sp4fr4r
@user-go2sp4fr4r 3 жыл бұрын
Boxing only hits with a fist. Wing Chun is premised on grasping. Grab and hit. If you don't grab it with Wing Chun's offense and defense, it's completely meaningless. Everyone isn't grabbed by Wing Chun. That's why it can't be used.
@wailofoshan
@wailofoshan 3 жыл бұрын
As is often the case, the human factor is unknown in any technique you perform. It is very simple my friend. Sometimes the cat beats the mouse, and sometimes the mouse beats the cat. Is its nature determining? No. Only personal ability will give your last word. Without developed skill and without talent, whatever you do, it will go wrong. The way you train, that way you will fight. Holding hands is one more action, possible or impossible, it will depend on your skill over your opponent's. Regards.
@ThomasMarxJeetKuneDoIFO
@ThomasMarxJeetKuneDoIFO 3 жыл бұрын
Thats true, the way you trian, is the way you fight. You can train a lots of shit and fail because of that.
@wailofoshan
@wailofoshan 3 жыл бұрын
​@@ThomasMarxJeetKuneDoIFO , of course my friend, if you choose shit, you use shit.
@CBHDK59
@CBHDK59 2 жыл бұрын
Bruce mistake was to had quickly thrown his ideas on to others. if give time for a style to blossom that well give the founder time to add and remove ideas.
@FrankLeChau
@FrankLeChau 4 жыл бұрын
Come on Thomas! You’re showing some "Jun Fan Style Trapping" stuff here and generalize that Trapping won’t work and that’s why late Bruce Lee dismissed it. Sorry, but it’s like to say that JKD "XY" won’t work because the IFO guys are doing the only "Original" JKD. That’s the real big dilemma of JKD. Too many preachers of the truth in combination with low comprehension of the real "art".
@ThomasMarxJeetKuneDoIFO
@ThomasMarxJeetKuneDoIFO 4 жыл бұрын
You can always out punch the trapper. Any decent boxer will tell you that. Also in order to make trapping work the attacker would have to freeze his attacking hand up and stop his attack completely. Totally unrelistic behaviour would that be because people either snap their punches or punch through instead of freezing the hands up and stop attacking. That's why trapping is a completely unnatural and artificial scenario.
@FrankLeChau
@FrankLeChau 4 жыл бұрын
Original Jeet Kune Do - Frankfurt IFO Original Jeet Kune Do - Frankfurt IFO Don’t get me wrong. In this context I agree with you guys that Trapping won’t work. But what you guys are showing is such a Trapping drill. But what I want to say is that you can’t reduce Trapping in general to that stuff. For sure in real life people snap their punches back. But even Boxers use principles of Trapping. Trapping is such a way to get control over your opponents attacking tools in general e.g. if you parry and hit at the same time that can also be a kind of Trapping.
@ThomasMarxJeetKuneDoIFO
@ThomasMarxJeetKuneDoIFO 4 жыл бұрын
Have you watched the whole video? I mentioned that. But anyway this is what usually is referred to trapping.
@FrankLeChau
@FrankLeChau 4 жыл бұрын
Original Jeet Kune Do - Frankfurt IFO Yes, I watched it until the end. Anyway, my conclusion is that Trapping was never dismissed by Bruce Lee in the Art of Jeet Kune Do. Just the way you use it or when you use it is different. But the principles of Trapping works!
@ThomasMarxJeetKuneDoIFO
@ThomasMarxJeetKuneDoIFO 4 жыл бұрын
According to Ted Wong and Jesse Glover he did. That's not a matter of opinion.
@Mortredas
@Mortredas 4 жыл бұрын
Trapping was originally taken from wing chun, the trapping you do are static and from medium range, without outbalancing your opponent. Trapping work in specific situations and conditions. The demos you showed are total bullshit...
@ThomasMarxJeetKuneDoIFO
@ThomasMarxJeetKuneDoIFO 4 жыл бұрын
You haven't watched the whole video.
@ThomasMarxJeetKuneDoIFO
@ThomasMarxJeetKuneDoIFO 4 жыл бұрын
Also try to outbalance a boxer with trapping.
@Mortredas
@Mortredas 4 жыл бұрын
@@ThomasMarxJeetKuneDoIFO easy
@mikeneidlinger8857
@mikeneidlinger8857 2 жыл бұрын
If you give me $300 I will give you one martial art lesson.
@dannydevito4899
@dannydevito4899 Жыл бұрын
Trapping wingchun stuff useless boxing is better they would destroy trappers oh and all the kali trapping hubud stuff all useless
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