The rise of TTP and where PDM and the Establishment have failed - Mustafa Nawaz Khokar -

Mustafa Nawaz Khokhar is a Pakistani politician who has been a former Member of the Senate of Pakistan, from March 2018 to 10 November 2022. He parted ways with PPP in December 2022.
Mustafa Nawaz Khokar comes on TPE to discuss why TTP is rising again, why he left PPP, Reimagining Pakistan, Strategic Depth, PDM's failings, The Establishment's mistakes and the crimes of the Khokar Family.
Should PDM have taken the Government?
Are PPP/PMLN running from Elections?
How to fix Pakistan for the long run?
Find out this and more on this week's episode of The Pakistan Experience:
The Pakistan Experience is an independently produced podcast looking to tell stories about Pakistan through conversations.
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The podcast is hosted by comedian and writer, Shehzad Ghias Shaikh. Shehzad is a Fulbright scholar with a Masters in Theatre from Brooklyn College. He is also one of the foremost Stand-up comedians in Pakistan and frequently writes for numerous publications.
shehzadghiasshaikh
Facebook.com/Shehzadghias/
Twitter.com/shehzad89
Chapters:
0:00 Growing Taliban danger, policies and discussions
10:06 Flawed justice, Mustafa's family and history
21:08 Malik Riaz, tackling industries, people's trust
28:44 Political parties and injustices
37:47 Ayub Khan and EPDO, reimagining Pakistan
49:32 Economic downfall, shifting investments
56:06 Audience Questions

[@jamalansari1674]

This is where Muzamils podcast lacks. He invites important guests but doesn't confront the elephant in the room like Shehzad did here. More power to you, man. Don't let any politician bully you into submission.

[@gulistankhan8096]

​@@hashimameen8044 yes , do find out for yourself , and besides that with due respect muzamil hassan is a gullible youthia , check out his recent interview with imran khan , where he gets emotional over his father's hope being crushed , man i pity him and his father for being blind to what imran khan is.

[@Ainasyeda07]

@@gulistankhan8096 nailed it.

[@iamnotawais]

​@@ThePakistanExperience 😂

[@shameerhaider1605]

@@gulistankhan8096 I pity you if you have such lack of empathy for a man getting emotional talking about his father's illness. You can at least sympathize with someone regardless of their political beliefs. You are no better than the Youthiyas.

[@gulistankhan8096]

@@shameerhaider1605 want me to sympathise to his naivety ? sure then.

[@sabanazeer926]

Man you're so brave. Just seeing you have the guts to ask these questions gives me so much hope 😭 Thank youuuuuu, you don't know how much impact this creates!

[@habibullahkhan251]

His stance on negotiation with TTP, is very commendable, how can these Generals negotiate with those barbaric animals, who slaughtered our children, is utterly baffling to me. This is criminal, more than that this is treason.

[@haleemahsaida9772]

​@@ThePakistanExperience I think your anti-pti rethoric is deeply distributing. You've lost a platform which had great potential to critically analyse and continue discourse on Paks socioeconomic situation.

[@haleemahsaida9772]

I do sincerely believe you've sold out like many before you.

[@ghazanfarali2538]

Anti PTI rhetoric, what exactly is PTI, does it have any ideology, any road map or any damn plan even in terms of politics, it’s only a fan club where everyone has to bow to the king

[@rajamuneeb2266]

​@The Pakistan Experience if somebody doesnt believe what u believe so it is just fantasy.Eda tun renda nai

[@blacksparrow1]

No negotiating with terrorists.

[@SaifAhmed-kq4ed]

Mustufa Nawaz is a really brilliant politician thanks shehzad Bhai for bringing him. Shehzad Bhai love you. Keep it up

[@SaifAhmed-kq4ed]

@@ThePakistanExperience Ek papi idhar ek papi udhar :D

[@mustafa9201]

15:35 The balls needed to ask this. THEY'RE MADE OF STEEL!

[@khanua6073]

@@ThePakistanExperience ♥️

[@shrinidhikulkarni479]

Balls of steel.

[@MK-yg7zf]

Major Kudos for showing guts and asking difficult questions. I don't think any podcaster would confront a man like Khokhar.

[@NVRMND-lg6jg]

Many podcasters get 50-100k plus views but you get 20-30k views but your audience is more educated and is more intellectual and your audience evolves and improve their thoughts opinions because you throw facts.And you are not afraid of asking questions to politicians or any other person. Best podcaster in pakistan ever seen.

[@ZAIN9858]

Very brave of you to ask such questions and very bold to him to answer those questions. Brilliant podcast. This honesty is always expected from TPE.

[@ZAIN9858]

@@ThePakistanExperience I agree and hope we can witness more nuanced conversations just like this one. The USP of TPE. Please do invite Wusat Ullah Khan sab.

[@SAMAR-1]

This guys younger brother was with me in school in Islamabad back in the 90s. I am the witness of their dadagiri and misuse of power for many years, including bringing guns to classrooms, threatening teachers when they were caught cheating, beating kids only cuz they were short. Allah will definitely do justice with them. These goons wear a mask when they’re out on camera but act completely differently in real life.

[@bi6235]

Shocking. And by that I mean not shocking.

[@Tahir_Imtiaz]

Purani sharab nai packing

[@isloooo]

In ICB he was a big badmaash or badmaash ka beta.. if I remmember he was expelled from ICB, we never knew his name.. we only knew khokar ka beta.. it's was 1994 I guess.

[@syedmuhammadraza51]

It is an amazing podcast. Loved watching it. It was mesmerising. More power to you Shahzad. Thank you for being my dope. ❤

[@alilakhany4906]

A comedian is asking better questions than journalists

[@muhammadharris4470]

In some ways comedy paves the way for difficult questions which would be hard/uncomfortable or even impossible coming from a "serious" journalist

[@ShubhamKumar-si8qs]

Vice versa Now a days Journalists r doing same level comedy as comedian Both in India🇮🇳 and Pakistan🇵🇰😀😀

[@Jeet-2023]

When journalists become comedians, it's only natural that comedians become journalists

[@arshadsaeed9854]

His shut up call on calling out individuals instead of talking about structural issues was the point he won my heart 💜

[@indigenous_clips]

Good one. Best wishes for Pakistanis from India. May youth be resilient and sincere there and aware too. I hope India Pakistan relations will be better one day. ❤️

[@arishsiddiqui3292]

Straight to the point and asking the tough questions, another great podcast.

[@veenjharmemon8097]

Great questions Shehzaad bhai !!! This is how a podcast is conducted and kudos to Mustafa Khokhar for very clear answers .. he didn't beat round the bush

[@bismacosmos]

Sir Shehzad, am doing mass communication. Completely hopeless to see Pakistani media. But you? You literally made my day with this podcast. Hats off to you for the way you confronted Mustafa Nawaz. You asked these critical counter questions with so much clarity. Loved it.

[@sam6529]

By far your best interview that I have seen. Great job and amazing questions.

[@mithsindia5150]

My salute to u bro at 15:46, questioning politicians with maintaining dignity looking at thr eyes. Proud of u mate,you are really a nationalist

[@tariqsarfraz3814]

what a watchful podcast, appreciate the effort and expecting many likewise.

[@Hamzashoaibshow]

Great grilling man. Love it that you stuck with your questions about his family. Love it.

[@Ainasyeda07]

It's not about grilling by the host only :) It's the patience and & the political upbringing of the guest that counts. Yahan Imran khan yaa Asad Umer ya Shaikh Rasheed ko grill ker kay dekhain ;)

[@videos3617]

When I saw the thumbnail you are podcasting Mustafa Nawaz khokhar, thought can anyone question him about Taji khokhar? And you did it👏👏

[@HassanAli-pr4ze]

Much much better than what we see on mainstream media. Well done Shahzad 🎉

[@ghazanfarhussain5032]

The 🔊 PM Nawaz and Gen Raheel Response had suppressed the 🔊 Movement.

[@arrra123]

Brilliant questions & answers, Kudos! More power to you Shehzad.

[@ghazanfarali2538]

This was an excellent program, truth when spoken by a truthful man has it’s impact, it was so hurting, so heartbreaking, literally couldn’t finish watching the program, but hats off to you both

[@Zaheer_Mohsin_Shigri]

Sir really tough questions. 💕 Shahzad Bhai . Thanks for your contribution for this country ☺️

[@ThePakistanExperience]

❤

[@MontQ]

Amazing podcast. Frank, honest and bold!

[@TheVahaj]

Bruh all these years I been listening to this on spotify. I had no idea there were videos too

[@mahnoorawan6554]

I'm loving this podcast even more.❤️

[@muhammadsauood2089]

Spot on

[@shahroz717]

He is the first pak politician whom i watched the whole podcast. Everyone should learn that you shouldn’t be a fan of any politician but to support the good things and condemn the bad’s.

[@SimranDhillon186]

The bar has been raised again🙌🏼🙌🏼🙌🏼

[@SimranDhillon186]

Uzair saab is coming i am excited for him

[@adnanshahid5961]

Shahzad I never thought anyone would ask Mustafa about Taji khokhar etc ! But you did rather than just keeping the guests happy you ask them tough questions which is great

[@aanakrukavi]

Open heart discussion.

[@doctormafia6300]

Sometimes difficult to listen to the hard questions. This is great Shezad is not being mean, not hurling accusations. Just asking questions n the guest is also answering questions without being defensive.

[@abdulbasit6450]

There is alot to learn from this podcast , Brilliant Shahzad❤️

[@khanua6073]

Thank you Shehzad bhai ♥️🙏

[@97877753]

Thank you so much for bring this interview to us - it was very enlightening for me. Like most other people I had been thinking that this guy was a bit of fresh air in this otherwise stale and putrid political scene. But I was very wrong, Mr. Khokhar reports to be a lawyer/human rights activist but his explanation for pointed questions is pretty much like: his family is land grabbing mafia but he is not - Malik Riaz may be grabbing land in Sindh but so long he does not do it in ISB then its not a problem for him - at a hotel, the guy called Noor Alam just a 'Lota' and they manhandled him and he's justifying that behavior because someone used harsh words for his delicate senses. In short, this interview has proved that under the garb of this sweet talk he's just another run of the mill political c***. We better wake up to the reality and get rid of the indoctrination of the past seven decades and realize that there is NO HOPE for Pakistan, at least for now.

[@bodhisattva6308]

Have you considered or are you already uploading your podcast on Spotify?

[@anambutt8127]

15:36 i needed to pause after that. 2nd hand anxiety ho rahi thi muje.

[@froomerce]

Same here!! :(

[@AsadAbbasSZ786]

@Shehzad! 👏 Excellent and very candid interaction. Hard hitting at times and the guest graciously handled it without showing any disgust in words or in body language. Hard to believe he left PPP, This kind of political maturity & calmness is the hallmark of PPP. Only concern so far is that if these reawakening talks and debates can have any affects on the actual real world deeply entranced interests of individuals and institutions? 😶 Thanks

[@ShubhamKumar-si8qs]

By God itta guts to yha India🇮🇳🇮🇳 me nii h kisi me ki kisi politician se aise question puche OP bhai

[@ShubhamKumar-si8qs]

Hii sehzaad bhai Hope you r reading my cmmnt Bhai Now I am preparing for government job N trust me pure din library m bitane k baad raat m bs kx podcast spcly you gyus (naeem sikandar the black hole faisal Warraich and many more) mtlb for me it's like lori bhai

[@ShubhamKumar-si8qs]

@Typk Mb blkl bhai r krne ko kx h v niii😊

[@himanshu-us4xx]

@@ShubhamKumar-si8qs dont believe in faisal warriach channel about history many manipulations there

[@ShubhamKumar-si8qs]

@@himanshu-us4xx bhai bnda Pakistan m hone k baad v itta sch bol pa rha h yhi bahut h

[@bodhisattva6308]

It’s possible to ask these questions to politicians in India but only when in opposition 😏😅. Not when they are in power lol

[@imjaveediqbal]

خوبصورت سوال, شاباش مزہ آیا

[@saimahirani3836]

Thanks

[@adeelakif6657]

Good one

[@qadeerahmed7310]

Mustafa bhai ♥️

[@roohamaqsood9562]

Such a confrontational interview...i wonder how people still buy those vanilla interviews? esp where we are standing rn.

[@huzaifastriker762]

This is how a podcast should be 👍🙂

[@malikgamer63]

great great person mustafa nuwaz bhai ❤

[@rakeshbarman3486]

modi modi modi , he tried for better relationships by going directly to nawaz sharif wedding despite intelligence warning , he put his political stake on line to.imprve relations but modi met with same fate as bajpayi visit , pathankot attack happened just after that , so instead of looking outwards you pakistanis should look inwards

[@Tsuphian]

It was too short yar. What a conversation!

[@sadarbhutto5013]

An Honest Talk about realities of Pakistan.

[@majleebibi8272]

Just wowwww!!!!

[@danielsempere9507]

Kudos to Shehzad for asking tough questions!

[@anotherhumanbug]

Most of the politicians are stating the fact "Bangladesh has gone to IMF". The reason why Bangladesh has asked for money is for contingency. Their economy is in good condition but they are predicting economic slowdown due to global inflation. If Sri Lanka has asked for loans in mid 2020 foressing or preparing for the potential long term covid, they may not have defaulted. Pakistan's spectacles can only allow her to look two months into the future.

[@moizahmed8355]

More respect for mustafa,s politics after this interview

[@talalmajeed1076]

He doged Taji khokhar, Farrukh khokar and Malik Riaz question. Otherwise excellent views.

[@Waisokizindgi]

Bro nailed it ❤❤

[@gulistankhan8096]

For People saying he didnt answer some questions , he actually did in a subtle way , like the hard question why bilawal met that murderer MNA was answered beautifully .

[@imranfalak]

Ppp tout

[@gulistankhan8096]

@@imranfalak bas? Got nothing better to say?

[@Zaheer_Mohsin_Shigri]

Kodnair was Germany's post world war leader

[@ghazanfarhussain5032]

Every 🏫 activity has a motivational.resson.

[@oasisjan1]

brilliant Shehzad bhai..Kafi time se Jibran Nasir ko nahi suna unhe bulai zara..

[@MSari-ui7xe]

Why can't they just walk the talk? It all sounds very good in theory. What he is saying is not something we have not heard PMLN, PPP and PTI say. I remember the moment fall of Kabul happened, I said to myself this is bad news for everyone and Pakistan. We all saw this coming, and yet we ask what measures were taken to keep things under control? We pushed out TTP in 2014-2015, so what went wrong again? Pakistanis patience is wearing thin, and the state must not test us further. We've lost thousands of Pakistanis and we don't want to lose more lives, therefore, they must make substantial and long-term policy changes, and for once for God Sake, do something different and think about the country. Good intentions and willingness is what is lacking in this mad political chaos!

[@dugyan]

A very hard-hitting interview. Kudos to Shehzad! Khokhar was good on TTP but on Malik Riaz he couldn't bring himself to criticize his actions. Agar wo Islamabad mein zameen hadpega to dekhenge par agar Karachi mein hadpega to main kuch nhi kar sakta. Wah!

[@nazimhussain4531]

shehzad these type of shows must be on national media ..I see you soon on geo

[@mohsinmaqboolranjha]

oaye hoaye hamara host , cheetah !!!! love u yar , got angry seeing khokar but u asked the taji khokhar question

[@m.t.k.6550]

Don't know why our whole #Media never ever talk about the history of Pakistan from 1947 to 1972 always starts from Zulfiqar Ali Bhutto.. I heard just few weeks back Mufti Tariq Masood mentioned in his Sunday bayan when Ayub Khan wanted to add Few things in constitution of Pakistan #Unethically and NO ulema e karam was ready to support then Ayub Khan brought #Imported_Molvi from Egypt and got approval to add things in Pakistan Constitution for which he was not getting a #FATWA from local Ulema E Karaam and that Egyptian alim did it for Ayub Khan govt.......

[@justasimplehuman2099]

Mustafa Nawaz Khokar is a gem ❤

[@BHUPENDRAMONDAL]

Rising star of sane voices in Pakistan

[@atiqurrehman4040]

❤️❤️

[@sydzainraza]

I don't think anyone has the courage to ask the questions you asked here. Malik Riaz, Taji Khokar - no one was off limits. This is why your podcast is definitely of the best. If only more hosts were brave enough to ask such questions. Nonetheless, his clarity was very impressive and it was good to see a young politician with a leftist slant.

[@rizwanbalti4487]

" Aur border par Japan tha", was the most hilarious phrase of the whole podcast.

[@mazahirali6418]

Mustafa bai ..,

[@muhammadnoorahmed9752]

I like that he is talking about public interest but it all comes down to actions.

[@atiqurrehman4040]

Can you please invite Shaikh waqas Akram Formal federal minister from Jhang Punjab...

[@anambutt8127]

This should be aired on PTV at 8:00 pm.

[@frumzafarms1569]

@@ThePakistanExperience We need a leader to resign live on tv in front of the nation while addressing all these issues, if it gets shut down - stream it online too, bombarding all social media platforms.. We have to do this together

[@frumzafarms1569]

How hard would it be for pakistani white hat hackers to take control of PTV/other news channels and just expose them for their crimes

[@adeem.]

I was looking forward to this but it turned out to be mildly disappointing, and I’m glad that you politely pushed him with his family ties and how all of that corresponds to the reimagining Pakistan effort. He also glossed over the fact that his father Haji Nawaz Khokhar was elected as a PML candidate in the 1990 election on the only NA seat in Islamabad (the famous IJI days). It was under the NS govt that he got elected as a deputy speaker, but then switched sides to PPP, so a little bit of history rewriting attempt there. 🙂

[@farhadahmed1860]

shehzad bhai maza kara diya

[@Sfren5336]

Shehzad you will become the game changer in Pakistan. Soon you will be the one setting the narratives! Hoping you always do your research and have these balls always.

[@hamzasohail5435]

🙌🏼🙌🏼🙌🏼🙌🏼

[@jkarchitects5442]

Shahzad Bhai Podcasts to ache chal rahe hain to usme se kuch kama bhi rahe ho Ya Abhi Tak Kharcha jaib se chal raha hai 🤔

[@BigAngelLove77]

We need more politicians in podcast and ask them serious questions like this more

[@71espn]

pakistan has given strategic depth to taliban. As long as TTa exist so will TTP and vice versa. You might call it alarmist but it is not far fetched to believe that the intrests of TLP, PTI and TTP can align in future and it will be truly dangerous

[@Thelateblaze]

♥️

[@Ainasyeda07]

✌Best

[@junaidarif9932]

Mustafa seems like a better politician. We hope, he doesn't carry baggage of his gangster family (Khokhar brothers of Lahore, Gogi etc)

[@AbdulSamad-by6et]

15:35 bhetreen question hai bhai love you❤❤❤❤ But jis time his father was MNA that time his cousin was landmafia criminal phir chudary nisar ny sahi keya in logon k sath as a interior minister

[@media-rn6zc]

Pappistan has survived on doles for 75 years. Pappistan has milked 150 billion dallars from US, UK, NATO, Japan, Saudi and later China. Pappistan had no sustainable economy and now that the free doles have stopped coming in, Pappistan doesn't know what to do.

[@hassanmasood8355]

Just WOW, haven't seen a politician talking with so much clarity, naming and shaming the institutions responsible for this mess!

[@Sfren5336]

Lol sab ko pata hai bolna kia hai or phir power me aa k karna kia hai.

[@FaizKhan-nq7xe]

The question still remains if not Imran Khan then who

[@ghazanfarhussain5032]

Terrorism is the sorrow anger frustration at Pakistan parliament does serious about Enforcement of shariat in Pakistani society

[@blacksparrow1]

"School py bhi qabza krny ka irada tha" 😂😂😂man you got some sense of humour, as a pindi boy I cant stop laughing at this one

[@agentleworld6374]

Shahzad always tries to hit the bull's eye. I'm curious to know what responses he gets behind the scene by guests. Deep down my inner voice telling me they have grievance like ** Bhai tu to dhoti khol rha hy** 😂

[@agentleworld6374]

@@ThePakistanExperience Glad to hear that. Keep roaring boi 👍🏻

[@vitzcar6219]

Bro Ali Zaidi me ye interview sun k bhag Jana hai kasm se. Amazing convo. Next should be Maryam Nawaz. Youthia zindabad

[@anambutt8127]

Wesay guest ka bhi hosla hai jis nain sawal sunay aur bghair offend huay jawab diay. Or... guest is like beta akhri raat hai teri puch lai jo puchna hai.

[@haxx90]

For a moment I thought you got Trent Crimm from Ted Lasso

[@amangurjar9714]

love from india plz bring more indians on show'

[@affanmanzoor3295]

@@ThePakistanExperience Tanmay

[@munmunhazarika5247]

1. Shyam meera singh (political KZbinr) 2. Science is dope, pranav radhakrishnan (anti pseudoscience KZbinr) 3. Akash Banerjee ( desh bhakt) ( left KZbinr) 4. Ajit anjum ( journalists /KZbinr) 5. Nitesh rajput(KZbinr) 6. Nara Shetty, Swaddle KZbin channel /website, feminism, colonialism 7. Liver doc (liver specialist)( Twitter handle on anti- alternative medicine) 9. Kunal kamra ( comedian) 10. Jamie alter ( son of Tom alter, KZbinr)

[@shrinidhikulkarni479]

There is an journalist just like you Samdish Bhatia. Unfiltered by Samdish. Please bring him. It will be a great podcast.

[@SamirMishra6174]

​@@ThePakistanExperience Chavaka Kushal , J Sai Deepak,

[@Striker-jg9kv]

@@ThePakistanExperience anyone who can tell you all what a farce religion islam is and how you madrassa chap ghazis and namazis were raped and converted to 72 hijabi musalminas wala islam by Arab Turk Irani Afghans qasim ghori ghazni Babar Aurangzeb abdali nadir Shah 😂😂😂

[@bbhusari]

Initially I was very dismissive about listening to this podcast, never thought that this gentleman had anything to tell or any plans for future of pakistan . Out and out a member of elite political family performing a run of mill jobs and being in public eyes for obvious reasons ! But staying in podcast payed nicely in the last leg of interview ! Khokar guy referred to book of Henry Kissinger ! He spoke about first German Chancellor Konrad Adenaueur. Yes finally he was on the right track ! Today pakistan's destruction by troika of Military , Judiciary and Ashrafiya ( includes political class, beauracracy, police and dual citizenship holders ) is of same magnitude , that by done by 2nd world war ! Yes exactly , Pakistan requires a leader of Konrad Adenaueur type , who can trust people's power, abilities and capabilities in building their own country ! Its now over 50 years that no leader has ever talked about being self sufficient or had any viable alternatives to international aid or IMF bail out ...... Lets hope he lives up to what he said

[@ajaythombare9196]

shehzad.. i have seen your 80% podcasts.. and i really appreciate you work.. but i really want to you to ask each and every guest about land reforms.. i think this is the main issue with pakistan's situation.. at the end you are agriculture country for god sake.. you have to focus on that..

[@Sfren5336]

Yes. You are right

[@wqr494]

my mamo was a topb beurocrat in islamabad he said once the benzir when she came back could have been the best leader for Pakistan, he was no a PPP supporter etc just was sad that she died.