The Tube Journey that's Cheaper Than The Bus

TfL increased their Pay As You Go fares in March 2021 after five years of no increases, and it led to a highly unusual anomaly where it's now possible to make a trip on the Tube which is cheaper than the same journey on the bus ...
Mayor's Press Release on the price increases: www.london.gov.uk/press-relea...

[@geofftech2]

Related side note that I meant to mention in the video but forgot: The ‘Bus Hopper’ time limit has now been reduced down from 70 minutes to 62 minutes. TfL did this at the same time that the fares changed in March.

[@tobiashilfiker4631]

Does the "Travel to Heathrow for just £ 1.50" still works?

[@MrBusfreakinnsbruck]

Why cut the time by eight minutes?

[@annstewart4731]

Definitely a degree course Professor Geoff

[@adammichael6988]

What about that zone 6 to 6 video you did a few years ago - Heathrow to Upminster. Is that the same thing?

[@siyuanhuo7301]

@@adammichael6988 No, because you travel through zones. It doesn't matter if you started and ended in the same zone, but rather which zones you traveled through.

[@Bandecki]

In such a divided, angry and hectic world, it's so relaxing to see you hopping through London, checking a change of fares for the sake of 5p :)

[@geofftech2]

It’s what I’m here for! ☺️👍

[@ciansworldoftrains1250]

@@geofftech2 Your here for everything I love even though I am 9 years old I am still a Mega fan i have been watching you since i was 6 years old and you Still post videos that I love Its just great watching my future job. Keep up the good work.

[@maplerice6226]

These videos are nice change of pace from wear your mask, get the jab, inflation, and on and on ...

[@andrewhead6267]

Every shilling counts

[@skyblazeeterno]

Id be more bothered by the time difference by bus or tube, but I know some people dont like tube travel so bus is almost essential

[@lostcarpark]

But surely the bus is better value, since you get to spend twice as long on it for only 5p more?

[@paulsengupta971]

And you get a better view.

[@mccobsta]

Depends on if the buss smells clean or like piss

[@firesurfer]

Yes, you get to waste twice the amount of time of your life.

[@konskift]

@@firesurfer We're all here watching videos about someone else riding buses and trains. We are not people concerned about wasting our lives.

[@firesurfer]

@@konskift When someone says something open-ended like that, I can't help myself. There is no malice intended.

[@K-o-R]

Charge your pho- I mean, charge your watch!

[@ktipuss]

Geoff, your video prompted me to find out how far you can travel on one day with Sydney's (NSW) Opal Card which is based on London's Oyster Card. And pay only the $16 (£8) fare cap. The answer is revealing: 540km! If you start from Scone around 6.30am you can get to Goulburn by around 9pm. It does require 4 different trains and a half hour wait in Newcastle and a 4 hour wait in Sydney, but it can be done. That's the equivalent of London to Edinburgh on an Oyster Card!

[@YakyPeanut]

That's awesome. You should make a video demonstrating it!

[@ktipuss]

@@YakyPeanut Yes, I'm sure it would be very interesting for U.K. people to see that. There are logistics issues right now though, not the least being the present Pandemic situation where travel to the Hunter region (where Scone is) is not permitted for residents of Greater Sydney. That is likely to change sometime in November.

[@sadmanrahman7]

Shadwell to Lewisham is within one zone. Taking the DLR is quicker and cheaper than the bus

[@huzaifasabou3265]

Is it now?

[@goatgamer001]

Ye lol

[@ElvenSpellmaker]

While the DLR is on the tube map it's technically not a tube. However Geoff mentioned the Elizabeth Line which is also technically not a tube so maybe he'd count it!

[@c0wqu3u31at3r]

I used to do Brockley to Stepney Green within one zone and it used to cost like £1.45 off peak with 16-25 railcard on my Oyster

[@Psevdonim123]

It might be cheaper, but is it quicker?

[@easternblot]

Love that you had exactly £1.55 balance left after that. Enough for the bus back!

[@hoiyinwan8233]

However , if you done your shopping and hop back on the bus within an hour of touching in. You pay zero. So, the return bus journey is free.

[@davidgibson1978]

I was just about to say the same, get your shopping in 20 mins, which is possible at times, then get a bus back, and save a bit of cash.

[@SK_3PT1]

i like the little soundtrack while talking about the prices

[@ianhenderson4560]

5 minutes Whitchapel to Stratford according to the Crossrail website.

[@physmanir0]

Peckham to Clapham junction is direct on the overground (20 mins) but with the 37 bus could take upto an hour! For a tube, Canada Water to North Greenwich is 5 mins by tube and 40+ mins by bus

[@mojoich2736]

or from Bermonsaey to Stratford on the Jublie line. TFL Journey planner say's 55mis to 1h 15mins for the bus only or 15 mins for the tube.

[@c0wqu3u31at3r]

I hate when they do engineering and have to get the 37 instead of the Overground, my 40ish minute journey from Battersea to Catford would take 90 mins as I'd have to get 2 buses, long.

[@RANDOMZBOSSMAN1]

You can get the 345 as well from Peckham to Clapham Junction but that journey is as long as well. Peckham to Brixton/Clapham area is really a weird journey a journey which is relatively fast by car but contrived by public transport I always tell people it's faster for me to get the Clapham Junction from Peckham than to Brixton on public transportation

[@YDysgwrAraf]

Love that cross-platform transfer between sub-surface and deep tube at Mile End.

[@faizul_thetrainspotter125]

💯💫

[@09021983]

This one could just be allowed. Epping to Loughton 6 minutes Central line. Bus (non tfl) 418 35 minutes. I can't seem to find the fare for the bus. But that is obviously more then £1.55

[@drspa44]

I have checked all 9256 £1.50 fares in my TFL fares database and the longest one is North Acton to Canning Town at 18.56km as the crow flies. It requires a few changes to stay within zone 2. Alternatively you must take 3 or 4 buses and pay £3.10. The runners up include North Acton to other places near Canning Town. Also Turnham Green to Abbey Road at 18.34km.

[@xander1052]

Hounslow Central to Boston manor on the Pic would definitely be faster than on bus edit: checked the difference, according to google that's 6 minutes on tube vs 33 minutes on bus... yeah the tube wins lol

[@Saya2009able]

Obviously, train goes direct, buses have to stop due to stops and traffic

[@xander1052]

@@Saya2009able I realise. I'm no idiot.

[@trueriver1950]

With a railcard registered on your Oyster card it always was quite common for the off-pk tube to be cheaper than the bus. That was because you got the discount on tube fares but not the bus. As far as I know that is still the case (living in Manc I don't visit London often these days)

[@Trevor_Austin]

“There’s the little train”? No. That was a little locomotive.

[@KarimElhoussami]

Imagine all the journeys that would be cheaper for those with a railcard (which only applies to off peak train journeys)

[@annabellej9429]

I'm a student in the Whitechapel-Mile End area and with my railcard it's only £1 (or at least it was) to take the tube between the two stations off peak

[@roshn.i]

@@annabellej9429 still will be because the Railcard is still 1/3 off

[@bridget7934]

@@annabellej9429 I was a student living in Mile End a few years ago. If I remember corrently I could get the one stop to Stratford for something like 60 or 80p!

[@aristodimospapafloratos4852]

Thank you Geoff for all the information and the traveling.. 🤗🤗

[@donaldseth5492]

I dont know why, but I loved that really upbeat voice that Geoff had....... Or maybe its the music

[@SamsVlogstrainsmore]

That’s interesting too know cheers Geoff.

[@cukuwaekele]

I was waiting for you to do a video on this since I noticed this back in March. Thanks Geoff.

[@orsomethingorno]

It's crazy there's still no bus-tube transfers. It should be a single mode-neutral fare system -- to maintain flat fares, bus fares could simply be absorbed into tube fares if you took both. And if that took a bit of an increase in the base fares to make it cost-neutral (or close to it) then that'd be very justifiable.

[@ZephenHD]

Just moved to London and been regularly traveling from zone 2-1 via Northern and Picadilly. Will keep on the lookout for you Geoff!

[@666Pixs]

Tips galore Thanks. luckly when i go to london i can use my Merseytravel freedom pass on the london buses sadly not the Tube

[@rebecabarbosa6313]

Thank you for the tip!

[@neilmartin1531]

As an occasional visitor to London I prefer to use the buses coz I get to see some of the sights. Another great video, keep em coming.

[@adinglass]

North Greenwich (zone 2/3) to Leytonstone (zone 3/4), two buses (108 & 339) in 49 minutes (Google maps) and Jubilee & Central lines in 18 minutes via Stratford. Each of the buses and tube trains run to or from Stratford so the journey time and price difference also work separately

[@Chris-nq9nb]

Loughton to Epping is further, but not particularly interesting in that there are no changes. There don't appear to be TfL buses connecting them either. And if you're allowing the use of the Overground there's the mammoth Stratford to Willesden Junction section across North London all in zone 2. Another charming video as always!

[@andycooke6231]

Hi Geoff, I was looking at travelling from Stratford to Lewisham on DLR and the 108 bus both in zone 2 as another similar journey, as I no longer live in London I assume DLR fare are the same as the tube.

[@mrtulala1]

Go round the Overground, roughly shadowing the 393 bus from Chalk Farm/Kentish Town West to Highbury and Islington

[@SamuelLee-gw6wr]

There are similar cases in HK as well. For example, a journey from Tsuen Wan West to Wong Tai Sin: Bus (290): $11.3 (£1.05) MTR: $9.7 (£0.91) Another example is a journey from Ma On Shan to Admiralty. Bus (980X): $21.9 (£2.04) MTR: $19.7 (£1.84) Prince Edward to HKU Bus (970): $12.7 (£1.19) MTR: $12.5 (£1.17) Sheung Shui to Wan Chai Bus (978): $25.6 (£2.39) MTR: $21.0 (£1.96) Sha Tin Wai to Central Bus (182): $18.4 (£1.72) MTR: $16.3 (£1.52) The difference is usually bigger than that in London.

[@lepetitchat123]

I wish the bus fare would be cheaper in Hong Kong.

[@scottmdavis8483]

Love your videos, but I was twitching when you showed your Garmin thinking you need to charge it....

[@nathanwhiles5530]

Very interesting and informative

[@gtofficialuk]

Thanks for this Geoff

[@russvhill2]

The music soundtrack was a nice addition. It seemed to have the stamp of your mate in France TimTraveller 👍

[@FBExplores]

The longest single zone journey is probably Royal Oak to East Putney via Hammersmith and Earl's Court (16 stops)... although it would involve an OSI at Hammersmith between the H&C/Circle and District/Picc stations.

[@chunkyboyjames]

Earl’s Court to Turnham Green. Ever since they put the cycle lane in on Kings Road/Chiswick High Road, that’s been crazy busy. Tube takes roughly 10 mins to complete that journey, bus 190 (which requires a walk from Earl’s Court Warwick Road exit round to West Brompton - roughly 7/8mins) would take about 20 mins just to get to Hammersmith, and then you have to change to the 110/267/H91 to Turnham Green which is another 25-35mins!

[@dskadd32]

I like the way your mind works.

[@Nosregni]

You didn’t show your bus stopping at the infamous Bus Stop M

[@Radinden]

I'm glad I wasn't the only one who thought this...

[@SouthPaw1805]

How about Wood Green to Manor House on the Piccadilly Line? 5 minutes on the tube, 25 minutes by bus. If you allow changes (and London Overground, rather than limiting it to the tube): Crouch Hill to Woodgrange Park on the GOBLIN. 23 minutes by train for £1.50, and nearly 2 hours (thus £3.10) and three bus routes.

[@ricktownend9144]

Hi Geoff, another intriguing anomaly! - great video. How about visiting all the cross-platform interchange underground stations for an idea?

[@joemonks936]

Doesn't pass through every station but 70 bus from east acton to notting hill gate. takes ages due to the route but now i know i can get tube for cheaper so thanks for that!

[@ModernHistory4U]

Hi Geoff, love your videos. I set u a challenge that historically would have been easy but today is near impossible. Get a train from Plumpton to Cooksbride during the peak timetable from London (evening peak). I managed it today because they cancelled a train and made an additional stop (unscheduled). My only condition is invite me from your journey if you attempt it as I have local knowledge and a love for the area. If not I will still enjoy your videos and keep up the good work.

[@BinayaKhatri]

You have the metropolitan/Piccadilly line from Uxbridge to Rusilip then you got 3 buses u1, u10 and 331 starting and finishing at the same place

[@kieanh4]

With a railcard as well most of the fares are cheaper than bus

[@isaiahrennalls1000]

I think Clapham Junction to Stratford takes the cake, being listed on the TFL Single Fares Finder as £1.50 off peak, but you may be charged £1.55 on the bus(possibly £3.10 if you fail to make a hopper connection at St Mary Axe). Bus route would be 344 to Gracechurch Street Monument Station, and a short walk up the road to St Mary Axe for the 25.

[@ampersand.]

Very interesting Isaiah

[@lepetitchat123]

I am still waiting for an app that helps us navigate trips that exclude Zone 1.

[@CoppinAFeel11]

This works on the Overground too - a lot of places on there within zone 2 you can travel just £1.50

[@eddieleslie694]

this also happens on northern Rail Trains where it is both cheaper and quicker to use Northern over a Transdev bus from Darwen to Blackburn especially as the station is on my street.

[@EdwardMason9000]

Clapham Junction to Stratford on the Overground is Zone 2 throughout if you go via Willesden. I do wonder if they've kept the thing where you only get charged the Zone 2 fare even if you go via Shoreditch High Street, although you could avoid that by changing at Whitechapel. I know there isn't a direct bus between Clapham and Stratford but you could probably do it for £1.55 with the hopper fare and a change.

[@masquette2025]

Yay! Another cracking bus video 👏 I believe the 18 (Sudbury to Euston) is now London's busiest bus route - like a road train when you don't need it but never there when you do! 🤷‍♂️👀

[@bowlerstuff9589]

And it doesnt even go near the west end,its only logical reason for being busiest is Euston-Baker Street (Marylebone)

[@FPL_Bottler]

It must be because it's often the only bus on Harrow Road. The 30 and 205 also go between Baker Street and Euston

[@masquette2025]

Its a popular one down Harrow Road through Wembley & Harlesden

[@jtsholtod.79]

Only in London can you travel back and forth between cloudy rain and bright sunshine, but still within one zone and only minutes away. Maybe there's a cloudbuster located at Whitechapel. *Exits to read Peter Reich while listening to Kate Bush*.

[@chrisflint828]

Mile End was my station when I lived in London!

[@michaelhall4626]

It's quite common for rail to be cheaper than bus in Japan. For example, in Tokyo, the buses are a flat fare of ¥210 to ¥230 (equivalent to about £1.39 to £1.52), depending on operator, while a rail journey, which are fare by distance, can be as little as ¥126 (83p) on the Tōkyū or Keiō Corporations' lines. Other operators' minimum fares are higher, but still cheaper than the bus. Even the maximum Tokyo Metro fare of ¥320 (£2.12) is probably cheaper than you could make the trip by bus for, because there's no transfer discount or daily cap on the buses. Every boarding costs you ¥210-230.

[@greenisnotacreativecolour]

Do overground lines still count for the tube fare? If so, you could do Clapham Junction to Hackney Wick, all zone 2. I would be too scared to do it by bus for comparison though, it can't be less than nightmarish.

[@TimFirmager]

Could you add to this route by taking the overground (staying within zone 2) e.g. to Clapham Junction, or would this boost the price beyond £1.50?

[@JacobOhlssonBudinger]

Anything in the NLL and WLL would probably have this, so from Stratford to Clapham junction is the longest I can think of

[@siyuanhuo7301]

Earls Court to Turnham Green/East Putney. Royal Oak to Hammersmith (both zone 2 only journeys)

[@ABMW-tech]

Great info. Thanks.

[@sixtysecondvlog]

I'm going to try this when i get to London next. Not been in over a year.

[@johnsheard2269]

Not sure if the Overground is included in this fare, but Whitechapel over to Clapham Junction is entirely within zone 2. If changing of trains is also allowed, you could carry on from Clapham Junction over to Highbury & Islington via Willesden Junction, and then change at H&I down to Hoxton to stay entirely within zone 2. Would make the journey between Whitechapel and Hoxton a lot longer than it needs to be, but if the Overground and changing trains is allowed then it should work!

[@ChingfordBuses97-CB97]

Stratford to Clapham Junction on the Overground is also £1.50.

[@kapuchinoification]

East Putney to Royal Oak via Hammersmith would be quite a long journey entirety within zone 2!

[@j3ojos]

Not tube but Stratford International to Lewisham - £1.55 on the very long winded 108 bus, but only £1.50 on the DLR.

[@MichaelEhling]

I love that--may the pandemic keep subsiding-- we are back to these lovely, on-site, practical tips...and smart transport geekery.

[@michaelz.7140]

subsiding???? In england??? You have 7-day-incidences of around 200. Delta is spreading like a wildfire. Johnson is at it again. Like before he got ill... Keep Britain open... It may cost lives but that's a sacrifice I am willing to make...

[@neilbain8736]

That was some varied localised weather in a short spaced of time!

[@exploringlondon8616]

Amazing information 💖💖💖

[@rgpeters]

Clapham South to Elephant & Castle is most likely longer both by miles and time even as Stratford is actually halfway inside zone 3 ;)

[@bencoatesworth7731]

Bus 25 and bow road is also know for being the service and road in the opening titles of The Bill in the earlier series

[@maxlit2]

Clapham junction to Stratford would probably be the longest single journey you could take all within zone 2 on a TFL service for £1.50.

[@thearab59]

My local commute, Broughty Ferry to Dundee City Centre, 4.4 miles, is cheaper by train (Scotrail) than by bus. Takes 8 minutes, cf about 25 minutes by bus (car is 15 mins). Only problem, no ticket issuing at the Ferry, so you need to buy the ticket on the Scotrail App, or try to pay on the train (quite legal, but near impossible).

[@gavgav9450]

Much more scenic along the coast too!

[@tomirvin5555]

Or pay on arrival at Dundee if the guard doesn't collect the fare.

[@cjayos7654]

I'd imagine when the Elizabeth line opens, it'll still cost the same £1.50 as the tube, as you'd be using the same gateline. Unless some sort of special purple card reader will be installed to determine which mode was used...maybe?

[@xander1052]

From quick perusing on the TFL single fare finder, all fares are cheaper as long as you 1) are going within 1 non Zone 1 zone, and 2) on a TfL run service. It works for Underground, overground and DLR, but not Tramlink or the mighty cablecar.

[@michaelkalman4903]

Am thinking Brixton to Stockwell or Vauxhall? I wouldn't normally go by bus on that journey anyway though!

[@misteravid]

How about Turnham Green to Northfields, round the houses of Acton and South Ealing via bus E3 - and all in Zone 3?

[@dannyking9445]

Hi Geoff, I don't suppose you'll read this before I go, but I'm going into London on Tuesday next week the 23rd going into London bridge. On to Euston for my train back up to Manchester. An I've watched loads of your videos, do you have any advice of what is the best way you can get from London bridge to Euston where its step free, also will you be in London at that time? Thank you

[@het_gele_teken]

OMG, I miss the sounds and smell of the Tube.

[@panderjitsinghvv8199]

Started watching then paused and spent five minutes drooling over the Whitechapel gallery restaurant menu.

[@charliegrpdixon5944]

I heard TFL cross eliza purp Rail from Paddington to Heathrow would no longer be £10 or so, but it would drop to march tube prices. Is this true?? Would love to see a video on the only price drop when the rest are rising

[@davidoliver1169]

Geoff I love these quirky videos - well done!

[@MPsNewswatch]

Forest Hill to Sydenham I suspect is marginally quicker by train than waiting for the 122, 176 or 197 while also being £1.50 using London Overground or Southern than £1.55 on the bus. (Same for New Cross Gate to Brockley instead of using the 171).

[@stevieinselby]

The longest tube journey I can see in a single zone (except z1) is Royal Oak to East Putney, changing at Hammersmith and Earls Court, which is all in zone 2. The TfL journey planner, when I eventually managed to bully it into giving me this route, reckons a point-to-point journey time of 50 minutes. The same journey by bus would require a change at Hammersmith and would take 65 minutes.

[@RoyalFlushFan]

What about North Acton -> White City -> OSI -> Wood Lane -> Hammersmith (H&C & Circle) -> OSI -> Hammersmith (District & Piccadilly) -> Earl's Court -> East Putney?

[@DavePerkins]

If the DLR counts, Beckton to Stratford is all in the one zone. And the 262 bus runs between both stations as well.

[@CallingAllStations]

All the loop is in Z4.. not sure there’s an equivalent bus that would get you across it though

[@mojoich2736]

The Hainault loop ??

[@Soundog_Babylon]

Barkingside to Woodford 275 Gants hill to Mulberry way, South Woodford 123

[@wtfispolkajuice]

yes, bayswater to Knightsbridge

[@MrTransportAddict]

What!

[@zsl11913]

if includes other transport means, DLR works quite well - Stratford to Lewisham, DLR change at Canary Wharf or route 108...

[@particleonazock2246]

Thanks, don't even live in London, but this was entertaining.

[@jude1293]

With my Railcard it was £1 for the zone 2 only tube fare, £1.50 bus! Now gone up a tiny bit

[@alimcmurray3428]

North Acton to Notting Hill Gate must be longer by bus, especially if there's traffic on the Westway, but it's just a simple ~15 min journey on the Central Line using the tube.

[@Systemicyco01]

Royal Oak > Turnham Green. It is a hour long journey on the bus with multiple transfers versus Hammersmith&City > District which is about 30 minutes.

[@gamereric2189]

This is a fun one: JLE: Stratford - Canada Water Overground Canada Water - (Clapham Junction?) Not familiar with the big orange lol Overground: Clapham Junction - Hackney Wick Bus to complete the loop. The bus one stop would cost more than circling London for fun :D I think I got the zones right? Not sure if any of the trips are long enough for the system to assume you went through zone 1 and charge you £8.50 (max fare)

[@rickycunningham6368]

If ya tap on one of them pink readers it classes it as a one zone its sorta a intermediate oystser pad, seen them at Canada water , surrey quays, clapham andd possibly higgbury, itll know that you went nowhsre near zone 1 due to that pad, it does a fancy algorythm and then charges you a zone 2 only fare zone

[@gamereric2189]

@@rickycunningham6368 yeah, one of the trips on the Overgrond seems to be pushing it for length as a continuous route.

[@DarrenJCalvert]

Geoff have you any idea how much per passenger the tube v the bus is to run annually? Would be an interesting study to fully compare pricing

[@DarrenJCalvert]

@Capt Shiny thankyou! I think it would be really interesting, and maybe surprising as I’m guessing some zones/lines could indeed cost more, or for example other lines/services may run at a complete loss just to provide a service as such

[@Andy_001_]

How about East Putney to Stoke Newington (via West Brompton, Willesden Junction and Hackney Central)- entirely within Z2...

[@yeahno....]

White city to Putney Bridge? Central/district lines vs 220 bus? Or does passing through High Street Kensington even though the change stations are in 1/2 zones?

[@NickDude555]

Passing through High Street Kensington counts as Zone 1. I used to work at Shepherds Bush and had several people ask why they were charged so much coming that way.

[@Sigira0]

Sorry to be the pedantic one Geoff… but out of Whitechapel on the bus its Mile End Road… doesn’t become Bow Road until you’re over the crossroads near Mile End station 😌

[@finsat]

I lived FT in London from 1988 until 1999 - can you do a segment on how the bus service has changed since then, and what was better then vs now? Kinda like "yesteryear". Not sure if you have the bandwidth timewise. Also, as a side note, I watch your channel "religiously" not only for the content but also to see how the weather is in the Big Smoke. Here in the American MidWest our weather is either way too cold or way too hot (with a dash of thunder, like right now). Ugh!

[@AlonsoRules]

I can't decide which one is more geeky - saving 5p over the bus or the crazy £1.50 ride from Heathrow

[@lasmaa0220]

I know that this year is big changes to prices and cap's. Could you please check and let us know what is the cheapest travel in London?

[@gilesjones1230]

I think you could do from Bermondsey to Stratford on the jubilee line

[@Batman343miguel]

Are fare zones useful or confusing for everyone in London? In the New York subway the fare is $2.75 and once you get in you can take any line and transfer as much as you want

[@seprishere]

Some sort of fare zones are needed otherwise Amersham (in Buckinghamshire) to Epping (in Essex) would cost the same as a short journey in the suburbs.

[@seprishere]

@Capt Shiny The UK, and particularly London, does not subsidise such long journeys (especially journeys outside Greater London) to this extent at the expense of shorter journeys like Whitechapel to Stratford. On tube or on conventional rail. Also, this particular journey is 71 km (44 miles).