the worst forbidden romance book

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[@WURLDSTAR]

i should have pinned this sooner (i’m sorry!) but penelope douglas uses they/them pronouns! i had no idea and wasn’t intentionally misgendering them in the video nor do i condone misgendering anyone regardless of how you feel about them as a person. thank you to everyone who let me know about this! i will address them by their proper pronouns from now on :)))

[@mothmaniel]

i checked their twitter and their bio says she/they =o

[@MxSae]

They actually go by she/they so you’re fine.

[@pngmedianews1942]

Do you accept books from authors to review?

[@base21]

Not that big a deal honestly

[@lightningstriking]

@@base21 misgendering someone is actually a huge deal, tf are you talking about?

[@Circiely]

I want a forbidden romance between two heirs of enemy kingdoms, not a forbidden romance between a 46-year-old man and his 15-year-old niece.

[@Incredumemumpulous6672]

Real asf

[@tarhumdonorstoriesforthebored]

REAL DUDE THATS WHAT I THOUGHT IT WAS.

[@maddig361]

OMG I FR WAS THINKING THAT BEFORE I SAW THIS COMMENT

[@zillynfox]

Real

[@copperredd]

This!!!!

[@IDIOTICID]

imagine getting in an argument with your boyfriend and he pulls the "i changed your diaper" card

[@Asmanidoesnotexist2]

“WELL WHO ROCKED YOU TO SLEEP WHEN YOU WERE A BABY? I DID. SO WHY CANT YOU DO THIS ONE THING?!?!?”

[@Lemoncakelover678]

This isnt dark romance, this is dark comedy

[@2bdaqueen268]

I both want to laugh and throw up at that statement lol

[@manyyoumas]

NAHHH💀💀💀💀

[@bloogoo]

Oh god this comment actually made me gag 😂

[@Its_Not_Suspicious]

"My Niece, my goddaughter, the love of my life" ... Hmmm, its giving "lolita, light of my life, fire of my loins" in a shittier way

[@standarddreamer]

exactly, except in Lolita the audience actually sees (to some extent) that the "relationship" is WRONG and harmful to Dolores. something this book completely misses

[@barakito]

​@@standarddreamer this is lolita but if all the audiences approve of and romanticize the bastard's actions and maybe also get off on it. which is like, indeed one side of the lolita readers.... genuinely gross

[@entr3_nou5]

Okay I’m glad someone else saw this I was scared I was tweakin

[@SillyLittlePookie]

Tiktok writers trying not to write about the most deplorable depraving toe curling awfully traumatically inclined creepy predator whistle blowing pyschotic topics for five seconds:

[@iimuffinsaur]

Tbh this book was around before tiktok. But I get what ur saying because yeah wtf.

[@atlas8912]

TOE CURLING????????

[@sunshineeee]

@@atlas8912I know it’s been used in other contexts but I’m assuming they mean it in the cringing way bc it’s bad, not the other way lol

[@Random.I_I]

Literally 💀 I’ve seen writers on Wattpad more sane than this

[@SillyLittlePookie]

@@atlas8912 lmfao

[@PorkSzoda]

I've noticed a big trend in the forbidden romance genre of authors not understanding that forbidden romance isn't just the most messed up relationship possible

[@user-qh1mj5zq8e]

It's so mind boggling to me when it seems like people don't get WHY certain relationships are forbidden. Like sure, on a surface level, societal boundaries preventing a romance can present similar plot points regardless of if the rule is arbitrary, i.e., homophobia, two families hate eachother, etc. Or if it's actually reasonable ie. Age gap, power imbalance, etc. But like. It's not as if people aren't ok with Age gaps or underage shit because they're judgmental. It's because those relationships have time and time again proven to be inherently abusive and are thus morally reprehensible. Do you not understand that? Do you not grasp what a power imbalance does to a relationship??? Do you not grasp what grooming is???

[@zaiinbsgems]

like forbidden romance e is supposed to be two lovers from enemy kingdoms. not this grooming shit??? 🤨

[@BooksToAshes]

Seriously though. I want to read forbidden and dark romances not ones that would put me on a list

[@aarasko]

@@zaiinbsgemsREAL. forbidden romance is like. enemies to lovers. not border line incest!

[@fart63]

Forbidden in their eyes must mean illegal

[@venusboreal1761]

missing when forbidden romance was "oh these two royal families hate each other" or "You are my security guard we cant" or like "oh im poor youre rich" and stuff like that :/

[@yamaagamingyt]

Ikr! I loved those, now it's just weird ahh incest and age gaps

[@commanderbork8637]

Truly, forbidden romance went from "Love transcends all" to "Yes, this relationship should be forbidden"

[@boredinthehouseandimintheh8184]

Or "I can't love her I'm a girl!" type forbidden romance not "I can't love her I raised her!"

[@cyra8908]

@@yamaagamingytage gaps aren’t bad so long as the younger person is a fully developed adult and they didn’t know the person growing up 💀

[@yamaagamingyt]

@@cyra8908 No crap, but most of the "age-gap" stories always happen between a middle aged dude and a 18 years old smth girl or someone he raised.

[@c0ttage]

You imprinted on my baby????

[@chocomelo454]

YOU NAMED MH DAUGHTER AFTER THR LOCH NESS MONSTER???

[@tell-me-a-story-]

I was seeing the connection. This might be another fanfic.

[@froginaclog]

@@tell-me-a-story- oh… oh no… im scared

[@oxvincentvangothxo]

@@tell-me-a-story-the pipeline continues

[@Al-aholic]

😫 AW NAW

[@char5108]

the way he’s not only her godfather, step-uncle, and 15 years older than her-that man was there when her parents weren’t. he practically RAISED her……

[@standarddreamer]

THIS. i could never imagine having "feelings" for my godchildren. that's absolutely disgusting on so many levels

[@thislycantomboy7087]

throwback to the time I was in a comment section and said “if you have to say it’s technically not incest, you’ve gone too far” and got absolutely hounded by people insisting dating a first cousin is fine and okay actually

[@JackDatDoge]

That's fucking wild 💀

[@rosyguard]

THAT'S ACTUALLY INSANE???

[@JackDatDoge]

@@rosyguard gurl fr 😭

[@deweyr_fisher]

this is warrior cats fandom discourse in a nutshell “wElL tHey’rE oNly cOusiNs oN oNe sIde Of tHeIr fAmiLy” “tHey’re jUst cAts, sTop bEing sO pUritanIcal” they’re still cousins 😭

[@JackDatDoge]

@@deweyr_fisher bruh 💀

[@miryamhoss3259]

He spawncamped his “girlfriend” 😭

[@sillygoober0]

LMFAOOO

[@wormcupworms]

NAURRR 💀

[@michaelio6548]

Bro preordered his girlfriend 😬

[@rabies_]

HELP

[@labelle1301]

☠️☠️☠️☠️

[@StargirlMonea]

bro was there when they delivered it to the post office

[@yungspaghetti]

STOP😭💀

[@Narii_editz]

WHAT LMFAOODJEGUDW

[@maiaschreiber]

Why can't we have more forbbiden romances about knights and royalty or that they are from enemy families... instead we are getting more and more insane age gap books and borderline incesty kinda stuff 😭😭😭

[@yamaagamingyt]

I have a story that has the trope you mentioned but idk if I'd ever make a book abt it :/

[@maiaschreiber]

@@yamaagamingyt If you want to you should atleast make a draft! It's good more and more people are thinking of writing books

[@yamaagamingyt]

@@maiaschreiber I've actually been trying to do that! But the thing is, I still have to find names/surnames for most of the characters, and a bunch of other details that I don't really care to add while fantasizing about the scenes, It's a story that I've had in mind for 2 and a half years now, every single day, it has progressed a lot and a lot of the things actually make sense when I put them together, even the draft is finna look like an entire book lol

[@maiaschreiber]

@@yamaagamingyt Happens to the best of us ngl

[@hanoon89]

⁠@@yamaagamingytI’ve heard a lot of authors just use placeholders for names until they find something

[@sophiemichel8045]

Sadly some do think that Lolita is a love story which is horrifying. A lot of those also think that Dolores seduced Humbert, giving the literal child fault for the p* behaviour

[@Lemoncakelover678]

People who think that shit about lolita are either apart of dead media literacy or actual creeps

[@Lemoncakelover678]

Lolita makes me so sad, I feel so bad for the author. Imagining people misunderstanding your book so badly and did the opposite of what you were aiming for.

[@wren_.]

@@Lemoncakelover678 the cover artists didn’t help at all. The author himself came out and said how much he hated all the cover artists who kept putting pictures of young girls on his book about a creepy pedophile

[@totally.not.a.vampire]

Random thing about Lolita is that the name Dolores actually means "sorrowful" and "pain" and I feel like the author knew that when picking her name

[@Vesperad0]

I like writing about and exploring the mental landscapes of characters in dark situations, mainly to show just how tragic and horrible it can be, but those kinds of people make me want to write "thing bad, no depth" because they can't seem to understand deeper meanings. Like I'm less afraid of ""being cancelled"" for writing about abusive relationships and pedos (getting murked lmao), mainly cuz cancel culture isn't real if nobody is permanently losing jobs and homes-but also because there's a bigger issue. And that issue is people who take things at surface level, and see that as a moral to follow. Even when the person is shown to be bad in an unspoken way? For some reason?? Like the joker and other purposefully shitty male characters that giys just chose to ignore the shit side of???

[@RatNationXOXO]

Actually (and very unfortunately), Nabokov's "Lolita" is very commonly misinterpreted in the media as a "forbidden romance" despite the very clearly mental instability of the narrator, and numerous statements from Nabokov himself that Dolores is a victim to Humbert's predatory and unscrupulous behavior. Even academic minds defend the actions of Humbert, and argue he is simply a man who is "in love" 🤢🤢 In fact, Adrian Lyne-- director of the 1997 "Lolita" film-- affirmed that he saw the novel as a love story. Sooo yeah, unfortunately people fawning over creepy shit like this is not new at all. :(

[@oxvincentvangothxo]

the covers don’t help either :( i’m p sure nabokov himself detested how most of the book covers were slapped with pictures of young girls when the book is about a pedophile. absolutely horrendous

[@ElsaAzevedo-qw8cl]

​@@oxvincentvangothxo Nabokov described his ideal cover for Lolita, and one of his quotes of how he wanted it was: No women. He knew it

[@oxvincentvangothxo]

@@ElsaAzevedo-qw8cl yes that was what i was thinking of. its like the people who design the covers want it to appeal to predators, just gross. i’m glad to say my copy simply has a photo of a journal as its cover

[@ElsaAzevedo-qw8cl]

@@oxvincentvangothxo i blame the movie for the majority horrible covers. The image of Dolores with the heart-shaped sunglasses became so iconic that was also used for the books and it went downhill from there. I like the first cover. The plain one with nothing more than the title. It Gives me an uneasy vibe.

[@r4.v3n]

I wanted to recommend a podcast from iHeartPodcast called "Lolita Podcast"! Here's the summary: Who is Lolita? The Nabokov literary classic has sparked infinite discussion in the 65 years since its release, but the cultural memory the book has left behind lives more in romance and fashion aesthetics than a cautionary tale about a deceptive predator and his young prey. Jamie Loftus wants to know how we got here, and this series traces Lolita -- the person, Dolores Haze -- from her literary origin to current status as a doomed icon.

[@zleepyissheep4219]

you know you fucked up when warrior cats has better forbidden romances than you

[@GnarlyTrashFire]

Atleast the authors of Warriors know the definition of forbidden romance, and Warriors is kind of known to not have the greatest writing quality as time progresses. Like, how do these "forbidden romance" authors screw up that bad!?

[@deweyr_fisher]

😭

[@Karirirum]

Not warrior cats 😭

[@thechumbucket8986]

crowfeather and leafpool had 11 yo me in a chokehold

[@deweyr_fisher]

@@thechumbucket8986 warrior cats ship discourse is so weird because people cherry-pick what’s acceptable and will crucify you if you happen to like anything to do with the list of characters the fandom hates for no reason fernsong and ivypool are first cousins and no one cares, but dovewing and tigerheart are also related and that’s the first thing everyone brings up when you say you like the ship 😭 make it make sense

[@shio5234]

this is actually just disgusting ☹️ what is with the trend of just of yeah grooming and abuse but its framed like a spicy romance idek what to say 😭 i hate it

[@arkkon2740]

Imma just comment this before the "its just fiction" "its a reclaimation of trauma" "dont like dont read" crowds come in.

[@ettaetta439]

Hey, survivor of CSA trauma here. "Reclamation of trauma" doesn't exist, because you cannot "reclaim" your trauma as a hot thing. Trauma is trauma, pretending you enjoyed it after the fact is a maladaptive coping mechanism. Instead, these types of books are simply ways of coping with trauma. My problem with this "it's a coping mechanism" argument is that first of all: how many of the dark romance readers are actually CSA survivors? In my experience when I call this bs out, these readers normally say "well, OTHERS do it to cope with trauma so how dare you judge them." It's important to say that yes, CSA and SA survivors may have their own ways of coping. It's also important to say that the authors and communities surrounding these books glorify and romanticize it. In these books, the ENTIRE theme is trying to redeem the love interest. When you try to redeem the love interest, you pretend like SA and CSA is something that is forgivable. These books end up being tonally dissonant because even if the author says they do not support any of this irl, their entire book is them trying to show how the love interest is a good person and that this relationship is totally okay.

[@sazabidi3856]

@@ettaetta439youd be right about it not being most of dark romance readers’ trauma. Since most of them are basically non-con or dub-con fantasies via extremely possessive or taboo romanticized behavior (what else do you do in a ROMANCE novel if not ROMANTICIZE certain behaviors?). If I remember correctly, a study found that the majority of people in a relatively small sample of BDSM practitioners who engaged in a CNC (consenting non-consent) fantasy actually had no history of SA or rape. I think it might be safe to say thats also the case for most dark romance readers, especially since reading books would be a much more accessible/less extreme expression of these fantasies. Also interesting when you consider that the average online readerbase for these books (on booktok) have already been proven to have a tenuous grip on the separation of fiction and reality when they started recommending these books to a literal sixteen your old whose account got popular with booktok for his biking posts in relation to a specific book about a biker…

[@arkkon2740]

​@@ettaetta439i just wanna say, thank you. I've had a gripe about this genre and its defenders for such a long time and I always wanted someone who understood these issues the way I did. I don't like talking over people because I dont want to assume, but the people who go "People can write what they want" as a gotcha to people consistently saying "Yeah bro, what trauma makes you write porn of it to release to the world?" is absolutely weird and I'm glad you share the sentiment with me. Also by the way, I've seen stuff that's *sooooo* much worse than this and I *STILL* see people defend it. I just dont get how. Genuinely. Its disgusting and these people should be ashamed like goddamn.

[@ettaetta439]

@@sazabidi3856 I'm not certain how many people read dark romance as a way of coping with their own trauma, and how many view it as a particularly taboo kink. To me, especially since the communities are majorly women and women have such a high rate of having experienced SA trauma, it's not unlikely that a decent portion are reading it as a coping mechanism. But given that most of my interactions with dark romance defenders is them saying others have trauma and not themselves, I thought it was interesting to note.

[@ettaetta439]

@@arkkon2740 Yep. And I think it's important to mention that I do not speak for all CSA survivors. Although it is obvious that trying to read romanticized versions of your trauma nonstop isn't a super healthy coping mechanism (dark romance readers tend to have that be the only type of romance they read, which is unhealthy for us survivors to be constantly reliving our trauma somehow), I can't say that there is no merit or no interesting conversations to be had around dark romance. The problems I have with it is that the community can be so un-self-aware and so defensive that they end up condoning such awful scenarios.

[@jupiterlantern2601]

"W-Well, there are books where the MC murders a bunch of people! If anyone read those types of books, does that mean they're ok with murderers?" In some exceptional circumstances, you can be justified in murdering someone. Gr00ming is a highly intentional act, there is almost no situation imaginable where it's necessary to groom someone.

[@Lemoncakelover678]

Yeah you can't groom someone in self defence, that's is always a perpetrator move

[@rosyguard]

FR!!!

[@poe8910]

i think what is also the case is that even if the character doesn't murder people in self defense or other justifiable circumstances, i think most of the readers still know that murder is just wrong. i don't think the same can be said for grooming and these types of "forbidden" relationships. i mean, the effects of murder are clear as day - the person is dead. but with grooming it's not so clear to some people, because sometimes there could be no "physical" effect on the groomed person, only mental. people seem to know that these types of relationship are considered wrong but they can shrug it off more easily, especially if an author presents said relationship in an overall good light, without thinking too much about the very real psychological effects it can (and will) have on the victim. it's just easier to think of it as a fantasy, which it undeniably is for some people as we can see. i personally don't have anything against a book depicting a grooming relationship on just one condition - it isn't depicted as a love story. as long as it is presented as something that is wrong, immoral and damaging to a victim (just as it is in real life) and the real life consequences are shown, i would gladly read it and maybe even like it. i don't know if that's the case with the book reviewed in this video, i haven't finished watching it yet, but just by looking through the comments i think i can assume that no.

[@frxst3d477]

we don't even have to say all that. murder>preying on children. like morally its so obviously worse.

[@bigmacwhooper]

“almost no” nah you can say NO situation period. there will never be a situation (not one i can think of) that gr00ming will be justifiable.

[@scliffbartoni9771]

" and I hope you don't live anywhere near a school"💀💀💀

[@colourfulDefuser]

JOHN EGBERT PFP PERHAPS??????

[@azure-mist]

“People who know the law a little TOO closely. You know a little too much about the Romeo and Juliet clause… Oh you REALLY love the number 18” I SCREAMED

[@Vesperad0]

anime fans who know the age of consent in almost every (asian) country, and claim Japan's is real young even though that's in very select and small regions. For people who base their morality on something as flimsy as the law, and people who'd definitely go lower if legal, they sure don't seem to realize most of Japan's aoc is actually 16 now. In fact, just looked it up, in 2023 the aoc was raised from 13 to 16, i think nationally.

[@azure-mist]

@@Vesperad0 Yup yup yup! Law doesn’t always equal morality!

[@ranchintime2207]

​@Vesperad0 Age of consent and predators is like minimum wage and corporations. It's there for a reason, but you know if they could lower the number, they would

[@TheAlishaPictureShow]

id take cheating over whatever this version of forbidden romance because this is diabolical age-gap stuff 😭😭

[@yoshitheorbit1118]

Yeah, like if you want to make a straight forbidden romance so bad, there's that option with some context added to why. Maybe the cheater is doing so because their marriage with whoever is their spouse is to maintain images as there was never a spark or they're in a situation where divorce can lead to a fatal situation. Just proposing ideas, maybe these aren't the best ones.

[@kepukepu3093]

The fact that some people enjoy this book is even scarier when you think about how often situations like the one presented in the story happen 😖 TWO SEPARATE TIMES in my (somewhat sheltered) life I witnessed “family friends” tryna get with the young daughters of the family. Books that normalize/romanticize relationships like this are actively putting young people in danger.

[@Vesperad0]

Nah man, but it's fictional. And as we all know, fiction has no affect on reality, because all fictional media was created completely separate from reality. ...is an argument I've heard far too often. FPS games may not make shooters, but they can spread propaganda. Just like how ""justified"" pedophilia in books doesn't always make pedos, but it sure as hell will make a person more likely to excuse and explain it away.

[@ssweet_teaa]

also, isnt the whole part of a forbidden romance that no one else in the story is okay with the romance? i feel like it loses the "forbidden" aspect if everyones encouraging it 😭

[@BIBBLESWIFEY2]

There are so many things to write about. So many love tropes . So WHY THE FU-

[@viscountrainbows2857]

There are some things that should stay in one's own mental spankbank and NEVER see the light of day. A lot of people gottem and, quite frankly society is better off without anyone knowing about or dealing with it. 💁🏿‍♀️ It's one thing to portray these unfortunate excuses for relationships that are entirely predation, but exploring these avenues themselves is best left to the conceit of... this is a grimdark story that hopefully has some kind of voidborn Aesop of sorts but... "twisted love"?! Oh. Nah. shadow. REALM.

[@BIBBLESWIFEY2]

@@viscountrainbows2857 exactly. Sone people really think every thought thye have are OUTSIDE thoughts, when they are really INSIDE thoughts

[@rosalindalaboy7111]

Ok I’m sorry, but “Lightning Mcgroomer” punched me in the gut

[@gothamthisisyouronlywarning]

I'm still in middle school and I wish I was kidding when I say that one girl in old my school "shipped" me with my P.E teacher because I sucked at P.E and also have extreme anxiety and he was very understanding so he tried to help me but he also got a shit humor so he would joke with me alot, and this girl had the audacity to tell me she "noticed" how we were getting "close and closer" and then told me he probably fantasizes about me. Then the bullies heard of the false rumors she was spreading and everything went down. After that I refused to do P.E and now I'm homeschooled. She readed a book about a forbidden(illegal) romance between a middle schooler and her teacher and she just had to project it on me. And oh my god all those teen girls on tiktok romanticizing stuff and then getting themselves in trouble. The normalization of these kind of books are the reason I am terrified of this world and menkind in general. Plus, how can you fall in love with somebody you raised!? I completely agree that all these authors are making the younger character "only" 18 so that It is technically legal. If they could I bet they'd just love to make that character 14 or younger without getting backlashed.

[@eatingmygrandmasbed]

THAT'S ACTUALLY F**KING INSANE, WTF

[@crackheadradar7803]

and some weird ass girl in my SOPHOMORE year who likes watches incest animes went to two siblings in class and kept telling them she ships them.

[@gothamthisisyouronlywarning]

@@crackheadradar7803 people are straight-up crazy. Don't get me started on anime industry and the very concept of what's legal according to their book. Which is also sad because it gives the worst ideas about casual nice anime enjoyers. Media tries not to normalize / sexualize / fetishize / romanticize the worst taboo topics challenge go (I am also infinitely sorry for the siblings)

[@gothamthisisyouronlywarning]

@@eatingmygrandmasbed I know right? I'm honestly convinced this is a predatory system, the writers ABSOLUTELY know that their audience will end up being mostly guillable people, like teens, and in that way they "corrupt" their mind with the most illegal and immoral shit ever, so that they get money, fame, popularity out of young people, the creeps go out of their way to defend the insane immoral stuff, the world becomes a worse place and then when you try and open the eyes of these kind of people, the heroes of the day come in and crucify you saying that you are trying to bring back puritanism, you are the one too delicate, you are the one that's taking it too seriously and it is all just fiction so it's not real therefore it doesn't affect reality. (dumbest shit ever especially because we are talking about teens, and hell if the glorification of mental illness and abuse isn't an actual thing among us, heavy on young girls, then I really am lost. I mean, do they just choose not to see all those girls who romanticize movies and series like Thirteen, Skins, Jennifer's Body, Vampire Diaries, Lolita etc?? Am I just Imagining all the Cassie Skins thinspo, the lana del rey sugar baby girls, and the oversexualization literally everywhere?) This world is too much istg

[@tell-me-a-story-]

People really need to be paying attention to what their kids read.

[@PokePony64]

you screaming, "he rescues puppies, I DON"T GIVE A FUCK" just gave me SO much validation. I am so convinced these authors know what they're writing is bad when they added "redeeming" qualities like this into their stories. Just cause he was nice to some puppies doesn't stop him from being a groomer??? hello??? (the vice versa can also be said, but that's a different convo)

[@Lemoncakelover678]

Yeah, if they had just let the character be messed up in what he does, that be one thing. However, its clear that these authors want to justify the characters actions to make them seem not as bad.

[@Vesperad0]

Isnt there a photo of literal hitler having a tea party with a little girl? Despite being (presumably) human themselves, what is it with people not understanding that people aren't supervillains?? At least, not all the time? Sometimes bad people do good things, and sometimes good people do bad things. With and without good reason. A man can love animals and cry freely while also being a serial killer. Literal millennias of characters and story arcs in human history around the goddamn globe, and we're still stuck on flat characters and "well she likes kids so she must be a good person!" bs

[@milkyphone269]

this is literally how colleen hover writes, in her books she makes the male characters go through something bad and then horrible people and somehow people defend it??? 🤷‍♀️

[@mikomiko.]

i LOVE watching rant reviews like this because i spend a lot of time in online fandom, and this kinda shit is SOOO NORMALIZED it pisses me off. these pull me out of that bubble and remind me what normal people are like outside of all that 😭

[@Andy-cg7il]

REAL

[@11more40]

For real, I'm not into these fandoms but I can relate to this about other reasons, i love remembering normal people still exist on KZbin

[@Vesperad0]

Same, but for the lolicons and stuff i see (ex; fandom for pfp) like you will have grown ass adults on twitter and online in general explaining why the child they're attracted to isn't actually a child cuz they're eight million years old, then I'll see a normal person who takes one look and says "yeah thats a baby with boobs. why." They don't even realize how terminally online they are. They are not convincing anyone, especially not a ""normie"" who isn't constantly fetishizing asian women and infantilizing women in general.

[@sao-me1lt]

SAME they've made such a bubble of themselves online

[@user-qh1mj5zq8e]

It shouldn't have to be said but even if you ignore the sexual aspects, wanting to date someone 15 years years younger than you, ESPECIALLY if they're a teen, is really fucking weird. Huge age gaps (especially when one person is in their teens or early 20s) mean that one person is way less mentally developed than the other. Its weird to want a partner thats way less mature than you, unless you're seeking someone easy to manipulate and push around. I dont hate all age gaps, but if one person is real young or the gap is huge it feels like a big red flag.

[@smoxthybweh]

Right a 15 yesr gap is different when its two adults meeting as adult's theres a whole other gross aspect knowing that the characters met while one was a fucking BABY

[@elizabethm8982]

It is insane to me how anyone would ever find someone FIFTEEN years younger than you sexually and romantically attractive... I'm turning 22 this year and I just started college, most of my classmates are 17-18 year olds and I can't see them as anything else than kids, cause even if 4 years might not seem a lot to some, I have done a LOT of growing up since I graduated HS, so I personally can't imagine dating someone who still has so much to learn and grow and just can't relate to you in many ways (especially when they're a teenager and you're a GROWN ADULT IN YOUR 30'S!!!)

[@weirddd469]

Hear me out y'all but we should also call out the "smaller" gaps too. By 20 people should not be tryin to date people under 18. Surprisingly enough this is not agreed on enough

[@Vesperad0]

I aint all that interested in dating, and especially so when I think from that kind of perspective. What weirdo that isn't a pedo and/or an abusive mfer would want someone so mentally young?? I have a sibling barely a year younger and it's like we live in different worlds 😭

[@sao-me1lt]

@@weirddd469 Truth. There is almost never a good reason why someone in college wants to get with a high schooler. (Like, is there no one in your classes who likes you so you have to go younger? How do you even meet? Those are 2 different times in life and schedules.) And seniors in HS who date freshmen are almost always creeps.

[@StrawberryCocoaPowder]

Tbh my biggest issue is that these people write dark stuff except they pretend it's all sweet and romantic and I'm like "if you're gonna write about dark content at least admit it's dark and messed up lol". Like i don't think you have to make your characters look directly at the camera and go "this is bad" but the narrative shouldn't be in support of it if that makes sense

[@PaperLoser-gv4wb]

Even in Lolita the author himself calls Lolita a poor girl (like in an affectionate way) and that she’s going through something bad and the man who wants her is a bad man, if I’m right. I’ve heard this before by mouth.lolita has sadly been romanticized by so many people and taken away the horrible part of what Lolita went through

[@PaperLoser-gv4wb]

A lot of these books feel like a strange shock value and fetish and romanticization of pseudo incest and grooming

[@TeeHeeTwinkleToes]

Girl... I have heard of this book before, my friend found a copy in our LOCAL LIBRARY. 💀💀💀

[@bellAa_akaPlusheen]

put it on the horror section so people get a scarier book 😇

[@TeeHeeTwinkleToes]

​@@bellAa_akaPlusheen the ironic part was that the librarian put the book in the preteen section, the poor kid who checks it out 💀

[@chloskyskies4399]

@@TeeHeeTwinkleToesmaybe you should warn them?

[@TeeHeeTwinkleToes]

​@@chloskyskies4399(Update) Too late, we don't go to the library anymore since school's gonna be out soon and I'm going to highschool next year.. too late to warn them 😭

[@mikip282]

i cannot imagine practically raising someone and then 18 years later looking at them and thinking “smash”.

[@hatchetheart]

i dunno bout yall but i feel like the people who liked this book may be weird asf, like, why is a book about a freshly 18 year old girl getting with a man 15 years her senior (33….) a turn on to you?…disturbing af 😭😭😭😭

[@CakeofWisdom]

Seventy years older, he'd be Edward Cullen.

[@zaiinbsgems]

so true. like ig i can kinda understand liking dark romance to an extent.. having a hot guy who is obsessed with you is cool n all, sure, but THIS SHIT is not attractive or fun in any way. the goodreads reviews on this book make me lose faith in humanity

[@hatchetheart]

@@zaiinbsgems fr 😭😭😭😭 honestly the reviews to me are just proof that they really aren’t like, consuming the content “responsibly” and are just using it for fetish material, which is soooooo yuck

[@BooksToAshes]

I’ve seen people try to defend these books and it’s SO creepy to me. I get dark romances but how can someone defend grooming and other messed up stuff like this?? I’m side eyeing them

[@iwouldgiveyouthemoon_]

i feel like it’s mostly teens who defend it bc it’s some kind of fucked up fantasy

[@gilgaws]

Having known nothing abt this book I hear “I hope you don’t live anywhere near a school” and knew, immediately, the extent of the crimes in this novel.

[@TiniestHippo]

i saw this book in my local target and was DISGUSTEDDDD 💀💀💀 it is literal textbook grooming, even if he wasn't doing it intentionally her feelings for him are not organic- they come from the way he raised her. it's genuinely concerning and so dangerous for stuff like this to be romanticized and normalized, as someone who was groomed as a teen shit like this kept me from realizing that what was happening to me was wrong.

[@shaikhie]

Toren isn't a bad man because he rescue puppies but then he went to the jail for assault? Are we overlooking that?

[@electricpants57]

this is just lolita but instead of her hating him, she's fully okay with it and it's WEIRD

[@ataridrive7482]

That microphone looks like a big-ahh AirPod

[@LovelyBettaFish-11]

it does lol

[@mrspreminger]

Is this Jacob/Renesmee fanfiction LMAO

[@PinoccThePiccolo]

I thought forbidden romance was two people from rival families falling in love.😭

[@aethrnet]

really miss when forbidden romance was “oh we’re the same gender we can’t be together” “no we’re enemy kingdoms” not fucking incest

[@starxvssv]

The way tumblr would attack you and call you puritanical 😭

[@Lemoncakelover678]

Twitter too

[@yoshitheorbit1118]

*[Instert an unnecessarily long time waste of a speech about purity culture or something here]*

[@Lemoncakelover678]

​@@yoshitheorbit1118[insert the argument of fiction not affecting reality]

[@deweyr_fisher]

@@Lemoncakelover678 [insert the”it’s not hurting anyone” argument]

[@breadthealien]

Nah it'd be twitter

[@autumn9353]

honestly refreshing to see a booktuber who isn't just like "you can like what you like" and constantly reassuring anyone in their audience who may partake in "forbidden romance" of this nature

[@gadgettop23]

yes i love their honesty.

[@kimberly_36]

why are people normalizing + romanticizing (? i’m not sure if that’s the right term) things like this ??? actually disgusting

[@subekyuuke]

UNRELATED BUT OMG AN PFP

[@kimberly_36]

@@subekyuuke :3

[@user-nn3qr5tn2h]

Jacob and bella's daughter

[@ann6878]

SCREE OFF WITH THAT 😭😭😭

[@Rnamaji462]

Oh na

[@carmenquintana5151]

At least Jacob had some supernatural element outside of his control

[@chickpea]

This video visually smells like 2014, the lighting, the fashion, the background, so nostalgic

[@never.miinex]

what is a visual smell???

[@chickpea]

@@never.miinex The visuals reminds me of 2014

[@siobhanflanagan4339]

It somehow kept getting worse like being the father figure in all her core memories ??? I wish I go back to who I was before I found out about this book

[@polygawn]

“Age is just a number!!” and prison is just a place 😊

[@fates-reward]

😭😭😭😭 Underrated comment

[@polygawn]

@@fates-reward no it’s completely rated, I stole that joke lol

[@bee3644]

There is 100% the argument of people should be able to make fucked up stuff, I agree, I won't read it but go off. The thing that gets me is people JUSTIFYING IT! Like imagine watching a slasher and going 'weelll the killer actually really cared and adopted puppies so it's OK!' Like no. Enjoy your messed up media but please stop with the "Well actually, it's ok" like what??? Also so tired at how common these types of bad books are like riiiippp can the defenders of these books please give this energy to a book that is at least well written lol

[@wannabehistorian371]

Also, what are the _names_ in this book? Torin? Asher? Ember? Is this a high fantasy book? And that dad had a best friend who was 15? That in itself is odd.

[@WURLDSTAR]

asher, ember, and torin were all 15 when kenzie was born

[@WURLDSTAR]

but yes, the names were… a choice… and then there’s kenzie LMAO

[@ambermillerrr]

penelope rlly went to the colleen hoover school of naming characters

[@Ishouldnthavebeensopublic]

I’m gonna assume people having weird ass unique names for their characters is a red flag in a book and put it right back on the shelf

[@wannabehistorian371]

@@WURLDSTAR Aerith and Bob indeed.

[@JaycieSLove]

Forbidden romance is meant to be socially forbidden, not legally forbidden💀

[@RejectedBoi]

Another reason this isn’t like Lolita is the narration is taking place from death row. This was wrong and it’s shown in Lolita by Hubert being incarcerated for it.

[@gabbyfringette7250]

Humbert was actually in jail for murder, he killed a different pedo who was after Lo.

[@samanthaburns6956]

The disappointing part is that if you took this from forbidden romance (18y/o falls in love with uncel/godfather) and turned it into a taboo romance (late 20's, potentially divorcey, falls in love with 40 something friend of day/maybe godfather) like it would still be weird but also could have some interesting themes and stuff. Kind of like in morning glory milking farm where there is a big power imabalacne but everyone is an adult and it is more about social capital and resource management than life experience. The fact that romanceses frequently focus on little teens and baby 20 somethings is so weird

[@RiaxaraCo]

I saw that blurb on twitter and when I started reading it I was like ‘oh it’s childhood friends to lovers, they’re probably the same age.’ Safe to say my jaw was on the floor when I was done.

[@len3861]

i just wanna know how these people get their books published like how the fuck does that go through,, and the way absolutely nobody listened to lolita's author when asking people NOT to put pictures of real little girls in the cover of his book is so,,,, idek who to blame, the authors, the consumer or the people who allowed the publishing.

[@cy3118]

It’s honestly so disturbing seeing books that romanticize the aspect of ALMOST dating a child . Like they really like to dwell on the fact that they are on the cusp of adulthood.

[@kay-ls6ec]

you did this for me because this shit has had me going for days. the author blocked me for calling her a weirdo 😭

[@Pipkiablo]

Age gaps don't actually bother me with certain limits (I usually put the younger partner as 25 or older, because under that it starts to get creepy for me since they're still basically just kids and are still mentally developing). Having said that, I really, _really_ don't understand why all of these kinds of romance novels have the female lead at 18. 18 is literally a kid in my eyes. I don't want to read about a teenager hooking up with an adult. I don't even like reading about teenage protagonists in sfw settings. I prefer novels where the protagonists lean older, typically late twenties and up. Why can't we ever get like a forbidden romance between a centuries old immortal vampire and an elderly woman or something? Why is it always 18 year old girls and their creepy older relatives?

[@smoxthybweh]

Honestly i blame the porn/ movie industries

[@lenemoyn5675]

No wait the immortal vampire × elderly woman is such an amazing idea. The angst potential???? Wow.

[@tivthetat7067]

OMG! It might not be forbidden but there’s a webtoon like that!

[@sylvie_on]

Somehow, howls moving castle manages to be both (NOT THE RELATIVE PART NOT THE RELATIVE PART)

[@spaghettisheepdog]

25:35 "It's an easier life to live than stand by your morals" girl you hit the nail on the head. waaaaaay too many horrible relationships are being romanticized, and glad people like you are expressing distaste for them

[@rollingjuniper6821]

Okay, I know there is everything wrong with this book. But as a nitpick: NO WAY THE PARENTS NAME IS ASHER AND EMBER??? What's with these authors and their horrible naming conventions???

[@ssweet_teaa]

i feel like there should be a new dark/forbidden romance category that's "morally wrong" romance. because a lot of these types of books are like that. (credence, haunting adeline, this one, colleen hoover books lol)

[@nataliyanabakova7419]

i appreciate you saying "YOU'RE WEIRD! THIS IS WEIRD!" with your whole chest because so many people kinda... tiptoe around it

[@saeriiss]

Here in Brazil the age of consent is 14, so basic legalized grooming, law sucks

[@yourmamandi]

Is there no statutory r@pe?

[@saeriiss]

@@yourmamandi if you're 13 or under, yes. Still, people don't take it as seriously as they should in some states.

[@Just.stargirl]

BRASIL????

[@Just.stargirl]

Mas tipo, apesar de ser legalizado aqui no Brasil, ainda é moralmente meio ???????

[@kyessee]

forbidden romance is just scary in general 😭

[@rubylee9566]

I thought forbidden romances was just falling in love with someone of a different religion, social status, nationality, etc. NOT INCEST like why-

[@StargirlMonea]

im literally only fine with it if its like vamps and werewolves or like a religious ppl not letting ppl be together thing you know?

[@lumityviktuuristanartist4100]

there is Forbidden romance and illegal Forbidden romance is not allowing a poor person and a rich person to date , two gay men to date and People From different Kingdoms Illegal is this......💀

[@HamsterHotline]

5mins in and I already hate this book 3:47 I don't care who you are, there is absolutely NO way anyone can defend this and not have issues

[@ohheyiexist737]

same, makes me regret having the ability to comprehend

[@autumn-yb9xb]

wurld i love the big ass microphone

[@Leo-rp1cw]

I don't even necessarily have a problem with people enjoying this stuff i just wish they'd stop trying to pretend it's okay in real life because THAT is harmful to victims

[@viscountrainbows2857]

Yeah like, I don't advocate for erasure of this media. if anything it's just gonna be someone telling on themselves or, maybe a tad too edgy for their own good. who knows. But yeah, these things need a content warning that can be seen from fucking Alpha Centauri because I understand the darkness of imagination. It's just, a whole other dynamic where did it NEED to be THAT effed up? And why? Is there a narrative purpose? Because if not this is just basically walking that illegal/immoral tightrope

[@oswaldfriedman7116]

I swear these authors read Romeo and Juliet and instead of taking away the drama of people kept apart by petty family feuds and politics, they took away Juliet being 13 and Romeo being 18…AND DECIDED THAT WASNT CONTROVERSIAL ENOUGH

[@xslvw_]

wasn't Juliet 14 and Romeo 17? (still as bad), I mean there's a law on this too right?

[@abbysnofun]

based on what i know about this book, i wouldn’t be shocked if it started out as twilight jacob x renesmee fanfic

[@Tail_sez]

I remember when I first read Twilight in middle school, I didn't know that he was attracted to her that way. I thought it was just a family soul-bond thing, and found it sweet. I remember I really loved Twilight in middle school, but a lot of the gross aspects went right over my head. A big part of me doesn't want to reread them, now that I know what I know now, and just keep it the way it was in my head...

[@WhatAmIDoingHere12]

This book is weirder than half the fics in the “age gap” tag on Ao3

[@silverscythe4557]

It's not, trust me.

[@saladinhadefruta]

18:10 "he rescues puppies?" and he's into people the same age as the puppies dawg

[@darbycrash4741]

dude my bf is like 4 months younger than me and i still get embarrassed saying he’s 19 and im 20 😭😭 i can’t even imagine

[@samuelline9573]

4 months is too much for you?!?!

[@Vesperad0]

​@@samuelline9573lol better that than 4 years and being unbothered, plus I'm sure people assume a whole year of age difference rather than four months. If i knew someone and turned 18 while they were still 17 or vice versa, I'd be embarrassed/nervous too

[@Sylvestor_.]

The real ones know that real forbidden love is between Gods and Ghost kings

[@-NoraaroN-]

IS THIS A TGCF REFRENCE OMG

[@Sylvestor_.]

@@-NoraaroN- YESYES IT IS!!!!!!11!!!111!1

[@bigfish_]

…book name?

[@Sylvestor_.]

@@bigfish_ Heaven Official's Blessing, it's a finished 8 book series 😋

[@bigfish_]

@@Sylvestor_. thank you!!

[@nataliyanabakova7419]

glad you made the point about lolita!! it's one of my favorite books tbh, and the most important thing is that it is NOT a love story or a romance. it is so clearly the story of a pedophile abusing a young girl. people cannot point to lolita and say "well this forbidden romance is a classic!!" because it is NOT SUPPOSED TO BE A FORBIDDEN ROMANCE

[@cur1ouscatf1sh]

I was in a fandom for a while where one of the main ships was between adopted siblings and I felt like I was the weirdo for not wanting to touch that ship with a ten foot pole. If you have to fall back on technicalities to explain why a relationship is ok, there’s a problem, and I stand by that. It’s not that I think you can’t read or write about messed up things or toxic relationships, because there are certainly plenty of compelling stories that can be told about bad people and unhealthy relationships, but people have got to stop jumping through hoops to justify it all

[@hybridizedhere]

What happened to the forbidden romance genre that's not forbidden, that's illegal forbidden romance would be two kids from rival families or opposing factions, its about class, money, politics

[@merriberri845]

Forbidden romance is built on the back of the very aesthetic good girl tomboy who don't need no man + likes knives and brooding effete prince adjacent fluffy hair who dresses moody really wanting to kiss and everyone disapproving. They don't necessarily have to be divided by class or factions but their outfits MUST be in contrast at all times.

[@Ruvelle_]

Honestly goodreads reviewers are insane with the things they support. I remember reading a historical romance book where the ML at like 29 SAs the female lead at 14 because he assumed he got tricked into marriage by her and her crazy dad. She ends up pregnant and keeps the son. And the whole book everyone is trying to gaslight her into forgiving him for assaulting her because he's a good man and he's obviously tortured by what he did. And she does. And they get married. And towards the end she's like she forgave him because he must be a good person if he gave her such a good son. 🤮 But all the Goodreads reviews were raving over how good a book it was and NOBODY questioned the SA at all. Most were annoyed the FL didn't forgive the ML sooner. Like HUH???

[@sylvie_on]

I hate goodreads bro those ppl have the worst taste… saw someone who didn’t like the Martian by Andy weir bc it didn’t have aliens and was too scientific. As if that wasn’t the point.

[@meow.4972]

THIS IS ALL WATTPADS FAULT.

[@meow.4972]

The "sold to one direction" trope opened the door to damaging our minds cuz we shouldn't glorify shit like this???? 😭😭

[@meow.4972]

8:03 HOLD ON .... bro is the author ok what the fuck

[@OOoKarmaoOO]

​@meow.4972 the whole "sold to" trope always blew my mind, I never read it and I'm just scratching my head like...a boys band is buying girls???

[@Dyslexicrat]

Nah this girl is actually dedicated like reading A 400 PAGE BOOK AND IT BEING A FORBIDDEN ROMANCE, kudos to you girlie def deserved my sub

[@user-mh7db7ei1s]

I hate that my first thought when she was reading the synopsis of Torn was "Renesmee coded"

[@ohheyiexist737]

You could find shit on par with this for FREE on any online writing site (probably better written too) and this is PUBLISHED? I know this isn’t the only thing like this but oh god.

[@pastabird2078]

My problem isn’t with these kinds of relationships being written about inherently-it’s when the author seems to push that this is a perfectly fine romance to engage in. Like. It would be so different if this book was just about the grooming and didn’t put this whole layer of ‘Oooh everybody’s fine with it! It’s fine guys it’s fine! Even the people who disagree end up saying it’s fine!’ on it. Like. That’s just skeevy.

[@koiiyaz]

4:44 HE can certainly find his happily ever after in alcatraz 😭

[@sunflowii9420]

I dont know how authors can deliberately sit down and write something like this. Either they’ve experienced something like this themselves and can’t differentiate right from wrong STILL, OR they’re just sick in their heads thinking people would praise the hell out of something like this. It disgusting.

[@tell-me-a-story-]

People are incapable of writing a relationship these days that isn’t sexual or at least romantic. Like you didn’t have to make this guy in love with his NEICE for goodness sake!! He could just you know…Be her UNCLE?? Humanity is sick what the heck.

[@eldritchmonsters]

THIS. Like it seems that people have forgotten that you can make interesting dynamics without making it sexual and/or romantic ???? Fucking gross I swear.

[@Lemoncakelover678]

It wouldve been really cute if it was about them seeing each other as family egardless of bloodline. The only reason why books like these exist is because they wanna chicken out making bio incest. If they could they would.

[@Vesperad0]

Kind of like in fandom, as well. I dont hate gay ships or most ships at all, I'm not a homophobic loser who'd cry at someone shipping two shounen male leads together. But I do want to see more friendship dynamics, between two boys or two girls or a boy and girl or two girls and a boy instead of the usual two boys and girl. Give me sibling anguish. Dont give me another dead parent and edgelord backstories, give me strife between a parent and child, both of them reasonabky wanting something or both of them being absolutely horrible people! There's so much we can do outside romance, like with aroace-spec characters too, and nobody does!! This sucks! I dont mind those two guy friends being shipped, but have we ever considered a pure and lovely friendship, that is just as precious and treasured as a romance or loving familial relationship??

[@eldritchmonsters]

@@Vesperad0 I honestly feel the same way. I really love platonic dynamics, too! As someone who is aroace, it's smth we rlly need. I'm not a romance hater by all means, but friendship needs to breathe sometimes yk?

[@ashleighcalvert8937]

Oh my god when you said “he was there for her in many big life events” i thought “don’t be her period don’t be her period” and what do you know…. I dont mind large age gaps personally but that is pretty bad

[@Iyannah15]

7:50 ‘s quote is actually the SICKEST, MOST DISGUSTING, CRAZIEST thing to say…AND IT GOT PRODUCED??? …TWICE⁉️⁉️

[@Squishy876]

I loved hearing you get mad because it doesn't happen enough. Too many people are like "Oh well, different strokes" but no, this isn't good art just because it's taboo

[@Vesperad0]

People are passive and unjudgemental when it's most important. Defensive and judgy when it doesn't matter. "Different opinions 😊" when it's immoral and illegal and mentally/physically abusive, but "you're undoubtedly wrong" when someone simply says they dont like a character or author.

[@sao-me1lt]

@@Vesperad0 Preach!

[@Care.lina.campbell]

This isn’t forbidden romance, it’s illegal romance

[@Ace-ace-baby]

Fr

[@iphoneasmr4610]

@@Ace-ace-babyjnjnjnj omg your username

[@sir.phrogingtonthelll8968]

I saw a book about a girl and her DAD HER ABUSIVE FATHER, I think it was called "the wild" by K. Webster. I was absolutely flabbergasted...

[@Lemoncakelover678]

How someone could write a book like that is beyond me, especially if they themselves have a father or/and mother. Like how can you not feel the seven depths of shame when even writing that?

[@camryns.4693]

I think the film industry and society as a whole failed young girls. I mean when I was growing up I watched “Pretty Little Liars” and at that young age I was like “why wont people just be happy for Aria and Mr. Fitz?” She was 16 dating her 26 year old English teacher… and the fandoms and the creator of the show condoned the relationship and made it seem normal!!! Practically every high school character in the show dated an adult because it was “hot”…To this day that woman who wrote the show (she was like 40 when the show aired) STILL says she ships and loves Aria/Mr. Fitz because they’re “soulmates” give me a fucking break. But with my little mind back then I saw no issue? Now being 20 I’m like… wtf. I can’t even look at someone a year younger than me let alone FIFTEEN YEARS AND RELATED. People just need therapy and watch some deconstruction videos on where their beliefs lie with age gaps and incest.

[@jasminegoldstein5677]

“‘He rescues puppies so he’s okay’ I DONT GIVE A F*CK!“

[@shaffayeroberts305]

Like you don't know how capable these predators are just saying

[@JoJo-fan-right-here]

I really hate the Colleen Hoover style books everyone is making these days 😭

[@inkchip7351]

Wife husbandry is a gross yes sadly defended trope, for context wife husbandry is rearing your future partner raising them for the purpose of marriage and in so doing bed relations, a common trope but evidence that people suck

[@i_am_very_vexed]

You can idolize someone in your life who isn’t your family and they love you LIKE A CHILD my dads best friend loved me like a daughter as he didn’t have any of his own I DONT THIRST AFTER HIM WTF IS WRONG WITH PEOPLE 😭

[@grace-zz8zh]

I miss the time when we used to write knight princess romances.

[@basiak.5711]

i love that you dont do the shit that everyone everyone else is doing where they go "enjoy what you enjoy i'm not judging" I am. We are all judging. YOU"RE WEIRD'!!!

[@grafomaniaco333]

this is the first video of yours i am watching, it got recommended to me, and honestly i am really enjoying the way you talk and express yourself, it makes digesting this book more easier.