The WORST Realm Yet | Horrible Level Design Ep. 12

[@flagzombie]

My mistake, the Endless Challenge ends at level 149, not 120.

[@АллаПрокофьева-ц2ч]

Richard PVZ experienced this realm

[@farizr.batarai8271]

Ok

[@thepotassiumgamer2137]

That's, like, even worse

[@thanhminh691]

why did you never upgrade the level up skill of the hero?

[@dnddude9652]

The imps are LVL 7 because: - The barrel roller spawns at LVL 1, +2 because of the level modifier to make them LVL 3 - The barrel roller spawns the barrel at its level, LVL 3, +2 because of the level modifier to make them LVL 5 - The barrel spawns imps at its level, LVL 5, +2 because of the level modifier to make them LVL 7 Parrots and the imps that the gargs throw are also both LVL 5 with similar logic

[@whiteninji352]

So it’s a coding oversight. We love Talkweb

[@nappeywappey]

talkweb is the vest geeme deebelopah of the thayem

[@slorpyslurperYT]

simply: barrel roller is lvl 3 because of modifier, barrel is also lvl 3 because same level. It get 2 more level because modifier, imp spawn = 2 more levels so 7 levels

[@phet1211]

What’s worse is that an idea of “limited plants” could have been so cool, making you have to pick different plants each time and encouraging experimenting But they ruin it with the plants lasting 4 levels and the rng system

[@M1rFortune]

Not everything has to be easy

[@phet1211]

@@M1rFortune yeah no shot But usually they…SHOULD be fun-

[@Awe-Tistic]

Since the translator sucked here's the real dialog (for the beginning) : Penny: Finally, Spring is here. Some of my parts are already rotting, come let's go outside and bask in the sunlight. Crazy Dave: I love Spring so much! But it is already Sping, so why are my lawns still freezing? Penny: My radar shows that the Zombies are still outside ready to make an attack. Crazy Dave: Don't even try to ruin my spring!

[@Amosus2]

Rotting? You sure it's not thawing?

[@Awe-Tistic]

rotting@@Amosus2

[@Awe-Tistic]

im chinese@@Amosus2

[@Trails3rdFanboy]

​@@Amosus2the literal translation is rusting so no, it's not thawing.

[@thebestgreattusk1996]

Thank you Artist Cat

[@TheSmallManDownstairs]

45:40 I can’t explain why, but the way that’s worded cracks me up for no good reason, it makes it sound like he’s calling in a strategic military asset or some long retired commando.

[@someguy3267]

One might even call her Captain Toad in the military.

[@Alt-q8r]

Pvz2c: honey, it's time for your another realm walkthrough! Flag zombie (in pain): yes, honey...

[@rish2612]

I like how with the recent realms, they expected everyone to be flooded with good level 4s and beyond, but with this one, they also expected everyone to have insane luck while also being conformed with the rewards this hell offers, overall an unfun experience

[@PvZ2Findings]

I think a "Two Path" realm would be interesting and could deal with this problem very well. With this, I mean: -left path, easy/medium, less levels, less rewards -right path, hard/nightmare, more levels, more rewards The left path should give game progression things, that aren't directly involved to play right path but rather indirectly. The right path should give good plants pieces, like primal peashooter and others, as well as coins, gems and maybe costumes?

[@CoralReaper707]

Man, pvz3. I am so sorry for calling you the embodiment of level design disaster. You are NOT the embodiment of that. Pvz2c is.

[@rizkidary837]

Nah it's still but in different ways

[@JoseViktor4099]

I might argue that PvZ3 isn't really that bad level design wise, It just everything around It is so stupid, specially Wave pacing. PvZ3 does not have bad level design, It has bad Game design. So it gives the same result or even worse.

[@TwilightChomperEnthusiast]

They both suck in their own unique way

[@danielfletcher706]

pvz2c is beatable if you sink enough money into it, and the transactions are much more varied than pvz3. plus the game does give you many strong upgraded plants for free; infamously, the primal rares.

[@kyarumomochi5146]

Pvz3 is ALWAYS worse as levels has zero soul at all

[@benram9545]

I like how because you’re limited to only having a certain amount of plants during the entire realm, this makes for one of the only circumstances in which Intensive Carrot is actually somewhat useful

[@Brinkmoove]

The music you chose in this video is just great. The nice and calm music in the beginning and then the active and heavy music for the harder levels. It is just so good, great video as always.

[@jamielayne3916]

I love watching the divergence of a nearly 11 year old game. It's so bizarre to see what both versions do both so well and so awful, do you want less worlds that almost never get changed, or more, unfinished, more unique levels? It's a very "deep well versus shallow pool" scenario, with the chinese version being so much more mechanically diverse yet janky while the international version ,just keeps power-creeping it's old plants out of the meta while adding virtually not actual or permanent content to the game.

[@sakura368]

and then there's the reflourished mod, which tries to perform both

[@PvZ2Findings]

​@@sakura368if people are going to talk about official things, please, don't bring mods, they may be cool and all but they aren't for to this comment.

[@moonstruck6591]

Well, rather than "Deep well and shallow pool," I'd say it's more of a shallow pool vs shallower pond. Same dichotomy, I suppose, but I don't like the idea of calling PVZ2 post-leveling "deep".

[@PvZ2Findings]

@@moonstruck6591 post leveling wasn't that bad, it just the lack of ideas the team had after, deleting expansions for being "too hard", simplifying everything, adding life expander modes, the new team (or the remanents of one) aren't exploiting the good part of pvz2, atleast they could rework the leveling system to something similar as PvZ2C, since it much more simple and less overpowered. But yeah, both pvz2 versions are going downhill with their trash centered updates.

[@moonstruck6591]

@@PvZ2Findings The reason I say post-leveling is because, all of the content that PVZ2 had was ruined (regardless of whether you think it was good before) in post by the introduction of a Level of player power that was not previously intended for the original content.

[@buttercat1331]

“it's spring but it's so cold, what the hell is going on?” is the whole plot of touhou 7, which indicates that plants versus zombies and touhou happen in the same universe

[@nawalelqasemy587]

OH TOUHOU REFERENCE

[@B00M_The_Sucukmen]

Oh, i know Touhou! Its a pretty cool game. I wish the this realm would be actually great as that game tough...

[@jetistheswampert9166]

Oh PCB

[@weedlakas9419]

@sirderpymister4883 OK now I need a bad apple animation but with pvz plants instead of the touhou characters

[@JohantheFunnyguy]

​@@weedlakas9419now *I* need this

[@realpvzdamemes]

Correction: Endless Challenge goes up to level 149, though most players only do up to level 120 for one specific task in battle passes.

[@hendog2208]

Ok so i was wracking my brain trying to figure out a way to fix this, because it’s a cool idea with awful execution, and came up with two ideas. 1:make the plant selection at the end of each level a draft instead of completely random. You’d get 5 sets of three cards, each with three different plants, and you’d choose one to restore. It would still be somewhat rng, but this would at least curb that problem. 2:give the player like, 30 of each plant at the start of the game, but you cannot regain cards anymore. This makes it so at every seed selection opportunity, you basically have to switch. This encourages different strategies and completely removes the rng. Give me yall’s opinion on this if you want, or any other ideas you have.

[@RandomBloonStuff]

You get +3 of every plant every time

[@Neon_Here09]

i absolutely hate this realm just cuz they added plant limits

[@wwatesse]

omor

[@Neon_Here09]

@@wwatesse yez

[@monngo838]

Auby

[@rizkidary837]

They should fix the difficulty. Im alright with plant limit, but the fact that the game reset the lawn (removing the plant) force you to keep the plant slot and not showing next zombie (or entire list from start )not to mention RNG plant that they give you. That's too much

[@randomprotag9329]

its an interesting idea. they should at least give the seeds back for non-carrot plants at the end.

[@АллаПрокофьева-ц2ч]

Richard PVZ experinced that realm and boy it's really hard this realm was with 3:03 returning mechanic - planting plant limit & after level complete you get plant seeds back

[@giftedphotonbee5220]

Why did they think making an entire realm based off of RNG was a good idea?

[@Crazyreplay26]

It's funny that you think they had a thought in their head about this.

[@Lilliana1]

Missile toe is absolutely bonkers in this game. Her 3*3 Aoe makes her similar to a primal potato mine. But there is also the fact that you get her at level 4 right at the start

[@tree1594]

erm achsually its not a mod its pvz2 but ported to china and made worse ☝️🤓

[@randomprotag9329]

PV2C does show its lack of polish with not factoring in sun producers, even just having a sunflower refilling to at the start of each level would help

[@Somerandomperson-hl1kt]

*Flag says they'd rather have any other good plant than Sap-Fling* Also Flag: *Picks Sap-Fling in the next menu*

[@Bonusduck-s9q]

I literally came across this dude and was like "oh cool pvz content" then i went to "THERES A WHOLE OTHER PVZ?"

[@DrFlagShipKingBeard]

Am I the only one who notices the Gargantuars spawn in the bottom 3 lanes at the end of every level.

[@flagzombie]

We love recycling!

[@Sixitboy]

Missle toe is somehow even more ridiculous in China? Wow

[@CapOb314]

I love your realm videos. And your dedication, because I'm sure I could never have the patience for these things.

[@rjrhevscdhhfbfbdh]

I dont think sarcasm is a great idea considering talkweb probably take it as compliment.

[@brinefilopolski33]

This is the only time when sunflowers are better than Primal sunflower

[@larrymantic2635]

Oh that’s cold. That plant limit is so dumb.

[@Nbdyatall]

I really don’t know if the awful level design choices really lie within a lack of talent, which may be it, but if you asked me? It’s probably them prioritizing quantity over quality in development, I don’t really play the Chinese version and all of my info comes from you, so I probably am wrong, but based on your uploads I’d say that the development team is just straight up getting rushed, they do seem to have a basic grasp at where problems lie, but more often than not they just put a band-aid fix and pray it lasts long so they can ignore it, some design choices are awfully lazy and well… you know what I’m getting at, but again, I’m probably wrong since I don’t play the game. Anyways, cool video mate! Thanks for giving me something to watch while on break.

[@dnr-vs1lk]

I actually like the idea of limited plants. The problem is the rng.

[@drisp7707]

horrible level design my beloved

[@Bunz_McGee12]

14:19 I'm toad tally not thinking about it

[@edwynlamb]

22:15 my 10kg rabbit:

[@snezor2783]

What sucks is I think the plant limit can be interesting. They just combined typical PVZ2C's ridiculous levels of zombie density, health, and abilities with said plant limit and it makes it kinda suck. If we had stronger plant limits or maybe a similar thing to Bloons TD6's Odyssey mode, it would be a bit better, especially if it isn't combined with massive amounts of enemies.

[@undefind3426]

Haven’t don’t this realm yet, probably never will

[@GinoDevs]

Honestly, buff the starting amout, remove the rng refills and make it so the seeds reset every third or so level, and this could've been a great side mode. Wich only makes me more frustrated with the way they decided to implement it, since this idea is basically a better version of the "don't have more than X plants" objective

[@tanooki64thegameracoon60]

I feel like if this plant limit gimmick was modified more it could've been an actual fun mechanic. Have it so that the plants that survive after the level is over get added back into your seed slots (Keeping a plant alive to the end will give +1 to the limit). Only when that plant dies should it be taken away for good, thus it encourages more strategic planning for the future instead of just surviving from the scraps. Maybe also have it so when you finish a level tou would also get +2 or more to each plant. Then I feel the rng bit of adding more plants back would feel more balanced. Oh yeah and if they previewed all the zombies before hand and made the leveling and stuff benless bull.

[@ravendefinitelyover188]

Keep making longer videos like this I love binging them

[@camwoodstock]

what sucks to me is that using the "you can only use X amount of plants" in an ordinary level isn't like, an inherently awful idea. the problem is that they just Literally Didn't Put Any Sanity Checks Whatever in the mechanism that randomly gives you more plants. like, if they had this in a series of Locked n' Loadeds and the counter was just FOR the level, and it was effectively a more specific "can't have more than X amount of plants", with no RNG for what gets restocked, that objective would be killer? but alas...

[@BC_Battle_Cat]

I think it'd be more fair/interesting if you only got 5 of each plant for the entire set of levels but you'd be allowed to change your plants at the end of each level, you'd have to really think about what plants you're gonna use and when to use them. i think it'd be a nice way to encourage some actual strategy and make people use plants they normally wouldn't instead of just spamming all of the meta plants.

[@thanhhuynguyen80]

My first gameplay in Normal Mode and I got to the End. I think the Strategy here is picking 3 or 4 plants because the Limit gimmick is just like Endless mode. You definitely can pick 4 plants instead of full slots. So you wont worry about the number. Imitator and Missie Toe are the good pick on first run cuz you can target multi-lane and Imitator can help you save plant despite it’s rarity. But i still not have lv 5 Primal Peashooter or Dragon so i cant still get to Hard mode

[@Daryl-2009]

10:04 Tough gravestones you say? Tomb Tangler would be so happy! If they actually existed in this version :P

[@JcCrazy135]

Man How did you even get so many lvl 5 plants? I dont even have a single one 💀

[@EmperorofMankindStuckOnAThrone]

At this point I think Monkey Fruit is the only option for anything in this game

[@sharktheguy3265]

How did they think this was a good idea? It was one thing to restrict the player to one strategy for multiple levels in a row until they can repick their plants, but adding a limit to how many times you can put down a plant is ridiculous. And that green button is a band-aid fix to a broken system that punishes the player for stuff out of their control This is not horrible level design, this is baffling level design

[@miimiiandco]

When you think about it, PVZ2C does have Doom Shroom - they just named it "Bonk Choy" for some reason.

[@starlightrainfall]

Isn't there a game mechanic in Plants vs. Zombies Adventures where you can only use about 5 of each Plant you bring?

[@antoineschemel8564]

but the game are not like pvz2C and you don't have need rng for having more

[@thepencilcunts]

The later levels remind me of a lot of custom ULTRAKILL levels. They spawn almost exclusively mini-bosses, treating them like fodder enemies and making levels feel completely ridiculous. Nothing but swordsmachines and mindflayers, nothing but gargs and gliders

[@defaultio3354]

Wait theres a level editor in ultrakill?

[@thepencilcunts]

@@defaultio3354 sorta, it's modded, not vanilla. Idrk how *making* the levels work but I know that the AngryLevelLoader lets you download custom levels made by others and play them.

[@cybersnake16]

@@defaultio3354 it's modded but it exists, called angry and rude.

[@justablimdumbraforfun]

Thank goodness I stopped playing chinese version since Jan 2023

[@placeholderhere]

One must imagine Flag Zombie happy in these troubled bad level design times... I really hope you get better levels to play at some point in the future.

[@Snow--]

Why pvz2 international doesn't make those mods like Chinese version?

[@PvZ2Findings]

Simply because they don't, tbh I would love they bring back veteran levels, because they feel fresh, or atleast make something like this. Oh yeah, we got thymed events and penny thing.

[@RaisinHook]

I think it has something to do with the climate, the most popular games in china are gotcha games and whatever you are rolling for has too look good for you too want it, ignoreing the gameplay all together

[@mridotprobably]

i think a nice thing to do was that you could choose which of the plants you would get, though i think primal pea would just make this a joke unfortunately

[@Rocketguy201]

That one weasel hoarder was amazing foreshadowing for the Elite in the next level

[@necronixgravedigger7455]

1:00:49 what in the actual hell happened to the top lane football zombie!? Did it just have a stroke and die?

[@flagzombie]

Blover with bounce pads does that to zombies.

[@MrStephx0]

2:13 Reminds me of the Labyrinth in The Battle Cats, after completing a level, a couple of your units will be trapped and you can only save one, the rest of them can no longer be used.

[@sawekpiniuzk2007]

Speaking of labyrinth... WHERE IS IT

[@MrStephx0]

It will come in the next 10 decades idk

[@sawekpiniuzk2007]

@@MrStephx0 labyrinth is coming back in the year 4822

[@ЕлисеевИван-х7я]

That feels kinda balanced, when you use your op plants versus op zombies, but on practice, that's not

[@Dwayne_LaFontant]

Wow. They are so good at bad level design I’m starting to think they are trying to make it bad.

[@DonavenO-i2p]

Something to mention: intensive carrot is an essential sometimes

[@PedroGraca-cu7hk]

Pvz2 china edition is just the official pvz2 hard mode

[@buffete3753]

I wasnt expecting another snow event in the pvz china version but oh well I guess , lazy as always. And also jeezus , who thought it was a good idea to make rng the decider of your run ?

[@danielhonradomoreno369]

This looks and IS VERY Unfair... I also have a Question about this Game, How do you get more Dna Thingies? Like, The ones you use to Upgrade Cactus and Make him shoot Electrical Spikes?

[@hazimazfar6916]

im always waiting for you to upload, love your vids🔥

[@flagzombie]

Thanks!

[@Leozao_21]

​@@flagzombiepls make more over analizing plant from the international version!!🥺

[@Mr.ChaosPollensAllAround]

Not it being 1:11:12 long, like why couldn't you just minus 1 second from the video 😢, anyways, the real reason for making this comment is because it's usually a bit short when it comes to these horrible designs videos. Edit 1 minute later: Nevermind, I'm stupid, cause it's usally an hour long, I don't know why I thought it was a short video... dementia strikes again Edit 2: It's both sometimes a long video or a short one, most likely why I thought it was usually a short video, cause I watch those more often I would delete this part but I thought it would be funny wasting someone's time 😂

[@dominikaandglebshchemenok1384]

At least its a new level design... pvz2 international version doesnt have anything new for quite a while...

[@Yammatti]

Flag zombie my beloved Thank you for posting

[@heathtv1066]

The beast's level with Tusk's theme was perfect

[@chexgex2834]

Hey Flag, I understand you're not exactly a lets play channel, but do ya think you'd ever make videos playing the worlds and all that, akin to your plants and zombie showcases?

[@clementchuah6706]

The Elites are probably an excuse for the devs to make kaizo difficulty levels

[@איתיפיטרוקובסקי]

1:10:18 the music speeding up is really funny (⁠ ͡⁠°⁠ ͜⁠ʖ⁠ ͡⁠°⁠)

[@_demonhunter]

Does sun work different in this game? Or is it normal to have 11k sun also why is there a + next to the sun? Does that mean you can buy sun while playing? (I usually only watch your overananlyzing videos so im confused)

[@rextanglr4056]

22:14 you do realize this is the springening event, right?

[@Amosus2]

Its like they watched you cheese the last realm with primal pea and did everything they could to stop it

[@moony_otter]

Holy shit, they tried turning PVZ2 into a roguelike, complete with resource management. What were they thinking?

[@saufiapriyandi]

Woahhh never clicked video this fast

[@hanyuee1160]

Did you have to grind a lot for level 5 plants?

[@flagzombie]

Depends on which one. Most yes.

[@MaxBenns-t1g]

@@flagzombie How do you grind for them though is what I want to know.

[@tadihotado3518]

It in fact *CAN* get worse when it comes to PvZ2C, holy hell this is like torture

[@mulitpower8827]

You know how they say that these Chinese pvz 1 mods are basically Kiazo levels of BS? Well guess what they were wrong! THIS IS ACTUAL TRUE KIAZO LEVELS OF BS!!!! I just have no words to express on how bad this realm is actually, if they actually allowed you to change your plants every level or they made it so that everytime you lost a plant you get a card back then maybe this wouldn’t be so bullshit but NO! APPARENTLY INSTEAD THE DEVS WANT TO MAKE YOU SUFFER FOR JUST TRYING TO PLAY!!!! You know you fucked up even if the Chinese players are complaining on the forums And in fact to further illustrate how bad this realm is, once I got into a certain part of the video, I literally had to put it up by 2x speed because of how unbearable this was becoming to watch, and this isn’t a criticism towards Flag Zombie and his videos because he is really a great KZbinr but my point is that even me, someone who can’t even begin to understand Chinese and who doesn’t play PVZ2C understand that this is not how you make a good game and that I couldn’t bear to actually watch the footage shown here. TLDR: PVZ2C really actually messed up big time here

[@skiller745]

24:11 - Hold up, Missle Toe can remove the smoke or it's just a visual bug? (Take closer look at top one)

[@averagegamer8850]

22:15 game be like “NO, you need to see that we are a bad company

[@zanderandrus7074]

Now I don't play this game but I feel like this would go from absolutely abhorrent to 98% absolutely abhorrent If they made sun producers infinite because then the hero would be used more often making it more manageable.

[@aidanhammans9337]

No wonder no one else ever brings up this game.

[@Karma-Rv]

I was thinking, couldn't you stall last zombie at the end of the level to get as much sun as possible (or even unlimited)?

[@spirelfoz1815]

Thank you for your wonderful content. I’ve learned so much because of you keep up the great work PS when is the next over analyzation of Chinese plants😊

[@afradeity4782]

Les goo top 1k

[@mmmmelemon2999]

are there mods that translate the chinese version? cause ngl i think chinese version is way better than the international atleast for my perspective

[@LuisRivera-xz6iy]

I’d say they are intentionally making very bad designed levels because of the most broken plants in the game so instead of making broken ass levels that require us common people to level up plants in order to get past them but instead balance the game by nerfing the best plants in the game and buffing the plants that are under preforming or rework them to make them better at something that is intended but nerf what could be the problem or tone a stat or few down in compensation

[@thenohacksandmoneyspending2210]

This could have been cool. The plant limit idea is actually a good concept, but they scew it up by making it RNG. Also stupid Elites ruin this realm as well.

[@ЕлисеевИван-х7я]

Name me the person, who was harmed more than Infi-nut in this realm (well, except Flag Zombie). I'll wait

[@Lazekillerwhale]

22:36 Im pretty sure you also use a song that sounds similar to this one but more upbeat and intense in another video of yours. If you do remember it then I'd like to know its name, thanks.

[@flagzombie]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/f6XNf4BshdCjia8

[@Lazekillerwhale]

@@flagzombie Thank you so much man.

[@flagzombie]

@@Lazekillerwhale No problem.

[@eduardpeeterlemming]

"This will be fun to watch" 138 sun Torchwood:

[@Rocketguy201]

Caulipower should just change the hypnotized zombie to its own level

[@Manahina1]

You like the "Don't lose more than x plants" objective? No? Here, have an entire event based on it!

[@TheIdiothimself969]

Holy hell, man, level 13 of normal mode is like some impossible pvz mod, and that's normal mode

[@whiteninji352]

Wow as bad as PvZ3 is at least it isn’t dumb enough to limit how much of a plant they give you and then *not reset it on later levels*

[@WhynotTheTheory]

Why you don't use Missile Toe Costume is it bad and how do you have so much plants on lvl 5 are you p2w or did you farm much, my unique lvl 5 plant is a Costumed Chomper :(

[@ednorthon]

The more I look at PvZ2, the more I wish a simple, offline sequel to PvZ1

[@GroundedAura]

I can see this limited plants mechanic work if it was more like standard BTD6's Odysseys.

[@SnekkOfficial]

Wait do you speak mandarin or is most of this knowledge just memory from continuous research/attempts

[@c5h87]

12:40 you can see a hypnotized imp tho nvm it was from the garg