Top 10 Great Games with Terrible Themes

Join Tom, Sam, and Zee as they discuss games they really like packaged within themes they HATE!
00:00 - Introduction
02:37 - Sam’s #10
04:25 - Tom’s #10
05:17 - Zee’s #10
06:35 - Tom’s #9
07:22 - Zee’s #9
09:21 - Sam’s #9
10:38 - Zee’s #8
12:32 - Sam’s #8
14:18 - Tom’s #8
15:32 - Zee’s #7
16:54 - Tom’s #7
18:25 - Sam’s #7
20:37 - Tom’s #6
22:01 - Sam’s #6
23:57 - Zee’s #6
25:28 - Sam’s #5
27:36 - Zee’s #5
28:54 - Tom’s #5
30:24 - Sam’s #4
32:17 - Tom’s #4
33:20 - Zee’s #4
34:52 - Tom’s #3
35:52 - Zee’s #3
37:25 - Sam’s #3
40:15 - Zee’s #2
41:50 - Sam’s #2
43:58 - Tom’s #2
46:20 - Zee’s #1
48:04 - Tom’s #1
51:02 - Sam’s #1
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BGG Link: boardgamegeek....

[@jaredbeiswenger3766]

Looking forward to the "And Then We Held Tentacles" Cthulu retheme

[@EclecticCamel]

10/10 would play

[@dearmrdw]

this year it would be And Then We Held Holmes :/

[@jgrosenblum]

"And Then We Ate Brains", the zombie re-theme.

[@Jammonstrald]

What they say: "put more unique themes in games!" What they mean: "put more unique themes IN SPAAAAAACE!"

[@GTRichardson7]

Hey the sound was on point today! too many times we as a community complain about this or that, and we do little to say thank you when a problem is addressed. So, Thank You! you guys do excellent work and i was happy that the sound was quite good on this one!

[@davidvandrunen3516]

Best line: "Making dresses for Cthulhu."

[@p4wel1sko]

Guys when it comes to Thurn und Taxis it is about the beginnings of the postal service. It (the idea of postal service) was created in Germany so it had to be placed there.

[@almsthvn]

I didn't know that - thanks for the info! Dice Tower - edutational!

[@JosefFerguson]

Zee: "Any game where you simulate work..." You mean like for instance... oh, I don't know... working at the CDC fighting pandemics? ;)

[@thirdrd0]

Josef Ferguson Technically, adventurer is a job as well;)

[@Trevin_Taylor]

Wasyl Kurek zombie hunter is a job if someone pays you to do it.

[@mrskwid1]

check and mate

[@tomwakefield1726]

Maybe they're just extreme hobbyists.

[@bertrand391]

i had the exact same thought ;)

[@Theliltsage]

I support these guys and their opinions. If they dislike a game theme because of their Christian values then so be it. They aren't secretive about being religious and this channel is definitely biased because that's just what it is. I'm an atheist yet I still value their ideas about why they don't necessarily enjoy the theme. If you think differently then buy the game that is disliked and enjoy it, I'm sure the publisher wouldn't mind that.

[@nanorider426]

Hear hear.

[@teflonravager]

I agree, though sometimes Sam goes a little over the top on some games

[@steveg7000]

Is someone somewhere actually berating them for having Christian values?

[@pixxelwizzard]

Many folks may disagree with Sam, but I identify with a lot of his views. I really wanna try Mysterium because the mechanics sound awesome, however, I won't touch that theme with a 10 foot stick.

[@andrewbellavie795]

I always get so confused when Christian gamers wont play Chaos in the Old World because of the theme, but they love playing historical wargames. Its like 'I dont want to spread evil in the world, but I'll move this unit of panzers to crush your infantry unit...'. Someone tell me how this makes sense.

[@vittoriagnecchi5783]

Oh boy, I do miss Sam in the lineup - part of the charm of these top 10s is just elevated so much by their friendship and how at ease they are together and the general vibe it creates.

[@koalabrownie]

I don't miss hearing the same games in every list.

[@grantofat6438]

I am glad he is gone.

[@NecromancerFluffy]

I want to play making dresses for Cthulhu and then we held tentacles.

[@alicemoore2036]

NecromancerFluffy Cthulhu Monopoly

[@NecromancerFluffy]

I almost bought that. I picked it up and started to walk to the cashier than realized it was monopoly, and I put it back.

[@KuddlyKisses]

I love it when game companies swerve away from the medieval, magic/occult, war themes. I actually like the farm, dress making, zoo/ranching etc. themes. Then again, I've always leaned more toward non-fiction than fiction.

[@williamgarcia-medina9989]

Did I hear a gamer say a board game is whitewashed? lol I never thought I would see the day. I also really appreciate Tom Vasel keeping it real around the theme behind Mombasa.

[@WWEisnotPunkrock]

Sorry Sam, I will always be drawn to a game with Cthulhu. There can never be enough.

[@IslanKleinknecht]

I love most of these themes. One of the things I love about board games is that they make seemingly boring things interesting again.

[@MichaelZipkin]

I avoided Biblios purely because it looked and sounded like it was very religious in it's theme. But after seeing countless rave reviews, I finally looked into it, and ended up buying and loving it. I'm with you, Zee.

[@evansj18]

Huh, I really thought Sam's number 1 would be Sons of Anarchy: Men of Mayhem. If I remember from the review he really liked the game a lot but was really turned off by the vicious criminal nature of what you are doing throughout the game (ie: your club 'exploting' locations like a suburban meth labs and adult video emporium to get contraband and money). That is one game I will always think could have been a big hit with a different theme.

[@villardileonardo2411]

same here !!!

[@matthewjeffery3686]

Blast from the past… love these folks then and now.

[@checkrazor76]

Never have disagreed more with any other top ten list. That's why I love this hobby and these lists. It great that there are games for everyone. I love games with real world themes. I have no interest in what most gamers like such as space and sci fi , fantasy , and super heroes. Great lists guys. Oh yeah Sam I know these lists are all about opinions but your opinion is wrong on Zooloretto. Everybody likes an animal theme. 😁

[@Haladras]

checkrazor76 Ancient World themes?

[@510tuber]

Dice Tower always gets grumpy with themes if they're dark, niche, etc. They're like grumpy old men ragging on "kids these days".

[@areallystupidguy630]

Yeah I think the niche historical themes are one of the coolest things about board games, I like that there are games that aren't the same old thing. And I think they're way off base about farming's appeal as a theme, I mean Farmville was huge right?

[@David-nl4qb]

Okay, "The opinions of Tom Vasel do not reflect the opinions of you so stop telling me they should." would be like the best meme ever!

[@shamcovys]

Great work guys as always, and I really liked the new half circle table. Made it seem like it was easier for you all to talk right to each other as well as to the audience.

[@Studio7283]

Love the new format, casual chat round the table style, totally disagree on farming being a boring theme.

[@bexarath]

For me, a good theme can raise a game I already like, but a bad one is never a deal-breaker when I love the mechanics. Right now one of my favorite games is Castles of Burgundy, even though the theme is about as exciting as dry toast.

[@davedogge2280]

27:40 my Chupa Chups lollipop dropped out of my mouth at Zee's no.5 and smashed into a thousand pieces... so I had a cigarette to calm down but then at 42:20 I saw Sam's no.3 and it dropped out of my mouth at sheer astonishment and burnt my pants.

[@raccoon0413]

LOL

[@christianhemion4204]

Tom, your description of "the others" sold my oldest son on it. I don't think I've ever seen that happen with a negative review.

[@IkeQuigleyMedia]

This one's for Sam... I guess they could re-theme Mansions of Madness to use something fresher like ghosts, or vampires maybe. Or better yet, werewolves... no one makes games with werewolves :)

[@andypandy4640]

I think Sam's #1 is interesting. In Mysterium, the séance isn't just a theme, it IS the game. Remove it and you are left with Dixit, pretty much. Not unlike saying "I love Scrabble, but it would be much better if we didn't have to keep on making all those pesky words". Just my opinion...

[@martinlarouche4418]

Andy Solts That scrabble with no words game has been made. It's called Qwirkle amd it's indeed a better game. ;)

[@QBG]

Totally agree with Zee about Arcane Academy. The mechanics are solid and the game is fun, but the theme is just so generic and done-to-death. Immediately after my first play, I suggested that the game would be better with a cyberpunk/hacker theme, where your "slate" was your computer rig and you chained together various network hacks.

[@Sanderus]

Well, around half of my twenty something "big box" games I own are thematically linked to history. One of them being "Capital" you mention. Such games can inspire to search for additional information on themes they were inspired by. And "Capital" actually provides a very nice historical overview of the buildings you build in Warsaw. I think this way this game is much richer than it would have been if you built a ficticious city. And also Warsaw is a unique city - a city which survived its own's death.

[@danielyeatts491]

Having not played it yet I am surprised to hear Puerto Rico is essentially about being a SLAVE DRIVER. WOW. I mean...it has sold a lot of copies from what I understand. And the Others is more balanced than Sam may believe: heroes can also get lots of dice but you have to work at it and upgrade and be in the right spaces and such. I took down an Avatar with 9 dice once, and another time with 11 dice. The Sin player gets less turns and more weight behind them...it is balanced. Timing and technique are key. Digging the Others.

[@dodec8449]

It are colonists. They can also go to university in the game. But it's still a bit strange, I have to agree.

[@marcussousa1308]

This video was kind of hard to watch, I disagree with half the entries (and with 8 of 10 games on Sam's list) haha. I hadn't noticed before, but Zee made me realize my favorite themes are games that simulate work lol. And games with uncommon themes llike And Then We Held Hands, Rococo and Prêt-à-Porter always catch my attention. As a video game player, I like that board games can be very good with themes that would never work at video games.

[@PostcastFromFiretopMountain]

Sam's #1, Mysterium. I'm the exact opposite. I love the theme of it, speaking to the ghost and trying to solve a mystery... but the game itself? The system just boils down to "Guess what this player is thinking". That's no fun for me, it doesn't give me the kind of strategy or demand the type of skill I look for in a game. It's like trying to answer a quiz where there are three correct answers and you only win by guessing which one the person who's asking the question has chosen. That just doesn't work for me. But the theme, I like the theme of it. Dramatic, mysterious, spooky, all of that. Yes.

[@christopherchild4022]

Tom, thank you for having the courage to say what I think many people, myself especially, feel about the zombie genre. Well spoken, and totally on point. Couldn't agree more.

[@BBPrism]

To be completely fair, I have never played Ascension, but after they continually insult the artwork for the early versions of the game, I had to look it up. And with that art, I believe they are doing the exact thing they are criticizing other people of doing to them (when they say that them not liking a game doesn't mean it is a bad game): confusing preference for quality. The artwork is actually quite good - it doesn't surprise me that many don't LIKE it, but it was crafted very well. Much of it seems to be done in a style called scratch board or other line-based ink styles which offer a really unique look and effect. I looked at the art and was so glad to see something more like book illustrations than typical fantasy-game art. I love the stylized look, and unless I was looking at the wrong pieces of art, the lines they consistently complain about when talking about this art are part of the actual art style -- it wasn't poorly produced or low budget. It's like saying a watercolor painting looks washed out. It reminds me of the numbers of people who hated Rebecca Guay's art on Magic cards and called it "bad" because it wasn't the style they were used to or wanted. The artist was going for a particular look, achieved it, and that particular look is not to some people's tastes. There is a big difference between "bad" art and "art I don't like". I would argue, at least for the pieces I have seen, most of the art ranged from pretty good to great, though I could see why people might not like it. Good art, at the very least, achieves the artist's intention through a certain level of skill. This art has that. It doesn't ave to be life-like, epic, shaded, realistic, or "clean" to be good art. It is clear that the artist was intending a very particular style, and it is well executed. I will say that the graphic design of the cards doesn't help the art much at all, and it may even hurt it quite a bit in some situations because there seems to be a big disconnect in the fonts used and the borders with the actual art itself. For instance, a lot of the UI is very sharp and clean with a distinct digital-art feel which contrasts drastically with the art itself. And since we are used to that type of look with digital art and graphic design, it makes the art look out of place, which emphasizes the differences, and since it isn't presented in the best way, it can be jarring. But that is from what arguably are poor design choices, such as not taking any elements of the scratch-board/cross-hatching style into the frame or text boxes, rather than bad art. Personally, I would rather have a game that has this sort of unique art style than yet another game done with a fairly standard style. The reason is that I feel like that particular art design and style(for instance with modern Magic the Gathering cards, and I could probably dig up a lot more examples if I took the time to, but that isn't my point right now) are over used. I appreciate different styles, and I personally enjoy seeing the marks of the art, such as lines and brush strokes in paintings, and sketchy cross-hatchings, etc. I know that isn't everyone's cup of tea, but for me it is nice to have art that is much more unique. For me it gives the experience a lot more flavor. I respect the artist for these early Ascension pieces and when I compare it to what seem to be the newer cards, I feel like the game had lost a lot its unique feel visually because the other artists worked in more typical styles. (Saying I like it less is by no way saying the new art is bad -- I simply believe it has become more generic). I am not saying they have to like the art at all, but they are really misrepresenting it from what I can tell. I can't find an example of "letting the notebook paper showing through" and I think they are mistaking cross-hatching (such as "Cackling Jackal") and other techniques, such as actually really very well done scratch board pieces (card art like "Constricting Horror" for example), for sloppy or poor work. It isn't. The reason this bothers me so much is because I don't appreciate the homogeneous nature of so many fantasy games (or computer games), and I really appreciate when someone tries a unique style and effect. I totally understand when people don't like a particular style, but to call it bad art isn't right and rather demeaning to the artist who has clear skill, as with the art I have seen in Ascension. It is certainly polarizing as a style, but it is executed quite well. Anyway, I'm done ranting about it. It just bothers me because I hate to see unique art styles misrepresented. They are hard enough to find as it is.

[@MystiaBird]

This list felt more like "games with themes we dislike" instead of being more say "games with themes that don't really fit" or "games that would be better suited for other themes". That could be an interesting list for another time if it's not been done actually. Top 10 games we wish had a different theme.

[@dabearz27]

MystiaBird Yeah, I agree. Not liking a theme is such a subjective thing, but a game where the theme needs to be different could spark some interesting discussion.

[@krusomore]

MystiaBird agree the topic is more like they dislike rather than the game itself that should retheme, is totally different matter, this will really misleading players the thought about the game

[@EclecticCamel]

All depends on how you infer the title of the video, I guess. This was precisely what I expected it to be, and I honestly think "themes that don't fit" is a much messier list to make than "games we like with themes we don't like".

[@dabearz27]

TheGreatHamEl Messy? More like full of interesting discussion. Here it's just like...yeah, I don't like this theme...okay...moving on...

[@paulgower4594]

MystiaBird that sounds like a bit like their top 10 games with pasted on themes that they did a while back.

[@apanapane]

Making dresses for Cthulu? Are you kidding me, I would totally play that game! Sounds awesome.

[@jd5iron]

I find it sort of hilarious that many of these are very unique themes, and Tom is a champion for unique themes. And yet...

[@GrandElemental]

I've always loved farming themes, because I just like the idea of self-sufficiency and making an efficient engine.

[@Fanofou82]

@44:50 So considering the present circumstances....Yeah, I think if zombies showed up it'd go exactly how it's always portrayed.

[@samh62695]

Flubacca is my new favourite word!

[@chrisschrader4004]

Flubacca is Chewie's foul-mouthed little sister.

[@Hieronymus-Pseudonymous]

I'm pretty sure that was a callback to some other Top 10 video.

[@OGDweeb]

It's pretty sad that at the beginning of every Top 10 you have to remind grown adults that it's ok to have a differing opinion. Your lists are always enjoyable! - Lover of Food and Traditional Fantasy Themes

[@bgambin7039]

Have to agree with Sam on zooloretto. For me, rearranging caged animals isn't as fun as I might've thought. Maybe if I was building a habitat for them it would be cooler

[@stephanberger3476]

Maybe it should have been Noahs Ark to appeal to him.

[@mechashadow]

I kinda miss Zee's antics when they faced towards the Camera for these. He's like the Deadpool of the group.

[@gamera2351]

mechashadow Ugh don't insult Zee like that. Deadpool? You might as well call him the Jar Jar Binks of the group. Zee is actually funny! ;)

[@EamonBurke]

the zombie rant slayed me

[@CapBeefjpcg]

I think you guys underestimate the popularity of the farming theme. You only have to think of how successful videogames like Farmville, Harvest Moon and Stardew Valley have been. Also, I wouldn't say that Agricola attempts to simulate farm work. Rather, it caters to a desire that many citydwellers have to experience the life of the countryside (without any of the inconveniences). It feels more like a pastoral game, if you will, than a work simulator. Plus, it has tiny animals :) PS: On the issue of work vs fun in gaming, check out Jane McGonigal's Reality is Broken as well as Ian Bogost's lecture on the topic (available on youtube). According to them, a lot of gamers actually want their games to feel like purposeful/meaningful work. How else do you explain things like achievements, leaderboards, quests and so on?

[@jonathanmcanulty5142]

I am definitely not a city person, and I like the farming theme. I really like the idea of growing stuff, I guess, and building a home and family. Great theme in my estimation.

[@marcussousa1308]

You're right. Stardey Valley is an indie game that was avaiable with no marketing at all and sold more than 2 million copies on Steam.

[@frospel]

Hilarious list, very well done, very nice presentation, had to crack up into laughter several times. Especially since Sam made me drop my jaw with MANY of the games he mentioned and I feel totally fine with their themes. Then Zees picks; I actually put several of those on my wishlist because I didnt know them and their themes looked so positively intriguing. Finally Tom - hell I agree with most of his picks. Funny. Really. My number one for this list would be: Before the wind. Its theme looks SO boring and dark, but the game has the most interesting bidding mechanism I ever came across, so I hope he will be redoing the game soon.

[@AgentKuo]

i think the fashion theme is quite cool! i wish there were more fashion-themed games.

[@LettersofVerax]

Rococo is fantastic. And so is the theme.

[@bgambin7039]

Farm games might be for people who, for instance, would enjoy growing and planting a garden. For me it's more of a chore but I can understand people who would enjoy it. Tom enjoys stock market games, Sam might prefer amerithrash and zee would prefer something a little more esoteric :)

[@hawkeye137137]

No Chaos in the Old World? I am surprised, since you gave it a very low score solely because of its' theme. Other than that I agree with a good amount of the list. Fashion, daily labor and plantation themes are a turn off for me too. Things I myself don't like as a theme are sports, trading, religious and real world politics.

[@pixxelwizzard]

2 things. 1st of all, putting people in stressful situations and seeing how they react and interact is why I like the zombie theme sooo much. Every emotion is strained and everyone is on edge and that's why relationships go south. 2nd, I rethemed Biblios using my own Pokemon cards and everybody loves it. You're collecting Pokemon instead of books. Brilliant!

[@McBehrer]

39:30 "the arm side's tight, the middy collar doesn't go with the shawl lapel, the hems are clearly machine stitched, the pleats are uneven, the fabric looks like TOILE, you used a back stitch here when it clearly calls for a top stitch, or maybe a traditional blanket stitch, and the overall design is reminiscent of Pret-a-porter and NOT true French Haute Couture. ...umm... But whatever you want to do is fine..."

[@thediceodyssey4690]

For some reason this list appealed to me a lot more than some of the others. Good job on this one guys. I have to admit, I miss the old arguments you guys had about Agricola and all the hilarious fights that broke out over it. Looking back over the older Top tens, that was one of the best parts, the Agricola fights!

[@almsthvn]

Oh gosh yall make me laugh! "Gimme some tentacles!" "Mansions of loveness! .. and then we held hands"...

[@xbumble]

Ticket To Ride is an awful game for me. It's so random and punishes you just for having bad luck picking up the wrong cards. Need green and others are hoarding them? -tough luck. Not picking up the colours you want for turn after turn? - tough luck. oh and by the way, at the end of the game you are going to be smacked around and lose points just because you didn't get the cards you needed. Poor design and I have never understood why such a flawed game has been so well received. Mind you, saying that all my family love it! The things you were saying about The Queen's Necklace reminded me of some films a few years back, like Suckerpunch. The advertising offered Cyberpunk/Steampunk battles and action. Pan's Labyrinth offered Fantasy battles and excitement. However, watch those films and you are in a for a horrible realisation. I can't say I'm ever bothered about theme when playing the game. Theme does influence my buying choices, but when it gets to actually playing it, I don't really ever consider it = it's about the game and if it's fun to play.

[@andrewhazlewood4569]

For Sale - you are a real estate agent, Suburbia - you are a town planner, all my other ones were cross overs.

[@KnightOwl23]

Mansion of madness is a weird theme for me only because it is as far away from the Cthulhu Mythos as you can get. I love the game but running round shooting and fighting mythos creatures is about as far away from the Cthulhu theme as you can get.

[@theo6525]

Have you played Arkham/Eldritch Horror? Couldn’t be less lovecraftian if it tried

[@joshuaschulz3897]

I want a GIF of Sam going, "It's too elusive."

[@bertrand391]

mixed feelings about this vid... is 'not being connected to Warsaw' a reason to find the theme 'terrible' ? i'm not connected at all to Warsaw (nor to, let's say, Miami btw), but i would still enjoy a (good) boardgame offering some insights about the city. then hooray for mentioning the Cthulhu overdose.

[@jeffersonlam2969]

100% with Zee on Clank, but more because the theme is confusing. The game's title and box art give the impression that it'd be about sci-fi robot battles or something, but instead it's about... sneaking around a castle, and you're NOT supposed to make noise? The theme works better with Clank in Space though.

[@garykellogg2758]

"you go mix the cement" haha

[@siyano]

I, for myself, I mainly am a player who would be hooked 90% on mechanics, and almost 95% of the time the theme of the game become abstract because it all about either counting up number, actions or whatnot. The game could be about anything I don't think it will actually change if I like the game or not, althought there some game I haven't like even more because of the astetic/theme but there were not the norm. I think its the "problem" of most euro, the theme is a lot of the time "dry" or just past-on, like the medieval, space or zombies with no "real" connection. My opinion :)

[@TheRealScience86]

Tom seems to not get it that the point of Divinare's theme IS that the "telling the future" people are BSing. Really - they're just playing the odds.

[@theblart4196]

The instant I saw the theme of this list, I called Tom's #1 but also expected it on Sam's list as well. I was also expecting Chaos in the Old World to make an appearance. While I love Eric Lang's games, they are extremely theme heavy and you will always find people not interested in some of them.I agree with Sam 100% on Mansions of Madness, while I am not completely tired of Cthulu I think it would have been incredible with more of a haunted house/horror theme instead of just a reskin of the original.

[@apalesch1]

Surprised Chaos in the Old World wasn't on your list - I know Tom and Sam don't like the theme, but man what a good game!!

[@falconwind00]

I love Dead of Winter, but I agree with Tom. The zombie theme is so cliche now. But it's really no different from any other apocalyptic setting, where society has been destroyed and everyone is a two-faced opportunistic psychopath.

[@dodec8449]

They should have done a Top 10 about how the theme DOES NOT FIT THE MECHANIC ... not if someone personally likes or dislikes a theme.

[@FMD-FullMetalDragon]

This is a Top Ten list that needs to be redone.

[@WarIsNoMoreCold]

Sam's list is "Themes I don't like" with a bunch of examples on it.

[@andresm377]

This one is for Zee. While I understand how the theme of Biblos sounds boring, and this probably won't change your mind, I highly recommend watching the movie "The Secret of Kells." It is an excellent (not Dinsey) animated movie that deals, in a visually stunning manner, with the whole monks illuminating manuscripts theme (plus some vikings and magical creatures).

[@brandonj84]

How Tom described the Queen's Necklace is how I feel about The Sheriff of Nottingham. Why whet my appetite for the Robin Hood story when it's not relevant to the game at all? I enjoy the game though.

[@tomatodamashi]

The Others is a perfect case to display the flaw in 1 vs all games (which I love despite the flaws). As the person on your own team, you NEED to play more as a Game Master than as an opposing team. I watched the game to which he was referring and I could see how it soured his experience. The rolls were just too good, and the guy didn't hold back leading to a very unsatisfying experience. I understand that that is the concept of The Others, but you can see the consequences of it - Sam won't touch it again. And that is a shame, because the game is so good. IN MY OPINION, it's okay for you to win, but you shouldn't go all out until the Sin appears. Let the Heroes team get close to winning, and then go full force. If you win then, fine. But everyone got a full experience. I own the games in my game group so I'm ALWAYS the person on their own team (because I know the games the best -it's just easier this way). Fury of Dracula was soured because I was too good at avoiding the hunters. Eventually 1 of the gamers in my group just begged me to start attacking them because she was sick of failing, and around 2 hours in, I could definitely understand that. We love playing HeroQuest, because I'm very good at giving them an experience where they think all hope is lost, and yet they manage to barely squeak out a victory with everyone on their last hit point. If I just killed them off because "I want to win", they probably wouldn't request that game again.

[@undersci]

Got to agree with Sam on Power Grid. The ultimate 'doing a boring job' game.

[@MikeCallicotte]

Not a fan of the framing on the video. Too much table.

[@redfive3277]

Whether or not a theme feels overdone is such a personal thing. For example, I'd buy 50 games with a dungeon crawling theme and enjoy every one of them, and I don't think I could get tired of farming games either. Those two themes appeal to me strongly enough that I don't mind at all how often they're used. But like these guys, I'm so tired of the zombie and Cthulhu things I could happily never see another game with those themes again. Yet I’m sure there are some people out there who love zombies or Cthulhu so much they’d strongly disagree with me. Everyone has themes that draw them in and themes that make them hesitate. The only thing on this list that seemed odd to me was Mysterium, because I feel like that theme and game fit quite well. The guy makes a passing remark that he 'doesn't like the theme' but doesn't really explain why, which seemed odd given their comprehensive explanations for every other game. Maybe again it's just a personal dislike he can't really explain.

[@pixxelwizzard]

Agreed. I will never, Never, NEVER grow tired of the medieval fantasy theme, or zombie themes for that matter, but if you don't like something you don't like it.

[@geektome4781]

I suggest smaller clipboards.

[@cthulwho8197]

I love the game Shakespeare, but I only got it to the table once because one of our players has no interest in the theme at all. He said it was an ok game, but he has no desire to play it again because the theme just doesn't interest him.

[@ZakiJeppe]

I agree with Rococo, Ticket to Ride and Pillars of the Earth. I agree with Zee. I'm so tired of designers slapping on a fantasy theme cause it sells. I have fantasy fatigue. I am surprised that none of you mentioned Viticulture. Wuu we're making wine!

[@simonmillar4844]

I have watched heaps of these guys video's but this one has to be the funniest one yet.

[@wroot_lt]

I suggest finding a few Top 10's that they did live during shows. Top 10 overrated games and Top 10 games that the other two don't like. These were hilarious.

[@wmendozer]

Everyone talking about the color correction in the video, but for some reason I like how it looks. Could be a tad brighter... the video quality is really great though!

[@TheMacius99]

For me, number one is definitely "Deception: Murder in Hong Kong". Awesome mechanics, very high engagement level in-game and good length would make it a perfect secret identlty/social deduction game for me... if not for the theme. I find the game about murders pretty atrocius and I am really disgusted by the fact it forces me to think about various ways to murder people just to solve it's puzzle. I had the same problem with "The Walking Dead" movie: solid idea, good cast, nice setting... but the zombies were too gross for me to watch it comfortably.

[@pixxelwizzard]

Yeah, I really want to try "Deception" but that's the reason I'm staying away.

[@Steve-L]

There are themes that bother me and no matter how good the game is I won't play them. I remember when I went to one meetup and someone had heard about me and how much I loved strong themed games and he was looking for another Amerithrash gamer. He wanted me to play Eldritch Horror with him. I had to tell him I do not play any Cthulhu games. In fact, at the cusp of me being a board game hobbyist, I was with friends gaming and we were being introduced to new games, we were invited to play Arkham Horror. As soon as the theme was explained to me I firmly but politely declined. This was before I was a hobbyist (but at the cusp of becoming one). Cthulhu games are off the list for me no matter what. But any game which centers and surrounds itself around demons I won't play. Now if they are demons mixed with other beasties, I will play it. But if the whole game is dark like The Others I won't play it either. That is dark gross looking monsters that are not necessarily demons, would be too much for me. I also am grossed out by strong medical science, as well as viruses and germs and such. So I won't play Pandemic. The theme isn't offensive to me, it just gives me a grossed out feeling. But close to this category is any game that centers around resuscitating someone to life would hit close to home for me as I had a child in real life that was dead for 8 minutes and was brought back. It's too personal for me, and won't play such games. When Tom mentioned Divinare, which I never heard of, it reminded me of Mysterium which Sam listed later. These kinds of games I will not play either. Talking to the dead, using other means to "divine" information is a theme I will not entertain. When I used to play Magic the Gathering I never played any black cards, it was a line I drew in the sand. In fact, when I played in tournaments I would rip a black card up ceremoniously before each game.

[@Steve-L]

I forgot to say, Tom's example of Amun-Re reminded me of it, that there are games based on pagan gods that have human sacrifices, or other sacrifices in the game. I was about to play such a game once and did not know it had such in it. But playing a game with pagan gods in of itself is okay with me, as long as I am not worshiping or sacrificing to it in some strong mechanic, but this 1 game did. I don't remember teh name. Fortunately for me one of the other players was falling asleep so we ended it before it began. This is one those themes that sits right on the line for me. Some I won't play others I will. Thanks to Tom's description, I now won't play Amun-Re, but do play Ra and Tzolkien.

[@andymesa3307]

I knew Pret-a-Porter would get mentioned by someone. It's an amazing game, and the theme only adds to it.

[@thelonebricker662]

It's funny that a large portion of the video is talking about games with themes that are cool but the actual gameplay takes place "in the back room" of that theme. Sheriff of Nottingham is a game like that for me. I LOVE Robin Hood but playing a game in the Robin Hood universe where I am just a tradesperson doesn't do it for me. It looks like their new expansion will improve upon this quite a bit but you're still not playing the role of Merry Men doing their part to take down the evil Sheriff, which is what I would want out of that theme.

[@pixxelwizzard]

I suppose with a game that could literally have any theme, like SoN, choosing a recognizable universe might help sell copies. :shrug:

[@gavincramblet3675]

Yeah, the two themes I can never get excited about are trains and "gathering resources in a historical location." Despite enjoying strategy, I often feel meh about euro-games for precisely that reason: because a lot of them fit into one of those two categories. I'll play such games once, and potentially even enjoy them, but never feel enthused about playing them again.

[@Sanderus]

We - board games fans - would like to eat a cookie and have a cookie at the same time. We complain about generic themes and when somebody dares to do something original - we complain again.

[@dabearz27]

I think my #1 would probably be Asara for its tower building theme. Yay...I'm building towers and one is red and one is green. Whoop-dee-do. Definitely agree with you guys on the train games though. Trains are such a boring, overused theme...

[@fledge31]

Love these types of videos guys! Very entertaining. And I appreciate the comments about not getting on other people's case for disliking a theme. I agree that it's ok for each of us to have our own opinions :)

[@arekkrolak6320]

I would say themes in Reiner Knizia games are totally interchangeable, but they are still fine games! :)

[@brodizajn]

Those three gentlemen always forget about building, breeding and setting of Agricola, where you are trying to survive after black plaque epidemies. There is so much more than farming in this game ;-). Anyway, very amusing top 10, a lot of fun.

[@RuneLar]

So we need to make a game called "Train Commute to the Library of Occult Cthulhu Dresses in Colonial Africa: Full Time Job"? I'd play it.

[@CptBumFlufff]

Zee is spot on with his number 1, Biblios' theme is soooooooo incredibly drab.

[@jonathanmcanulty5142]

Mysterium, Power Grid and Viticulture were three that immediatelly came to my mind as contenders for this list... followed close by Ticket to Ride. They were four I would have chosen if pressed. I was very suprised none of those were on Tom's list; apparently when it comes to theme I have more in common with Sam then I thought I did. Though when Sam was talking about Power Grid, Tom's face really made me think it was going to be somewhere on his list.

[@johna6108]

Great list guys. Definitely have these games in my collection (Cthulhu Wars, Kingdom Death Monster, Ticket to Ride, Finca, Patchwork, Village).

[@pardontherob2082]

great video guys. I agree that some of these games just lost me on box cover and then reading reviews couldn't sell me. power grid especially. love your videos keep up the good work.

[@talesofcardboard3986]

Fun video. Have to agree with Tom on his argument about society and zombies.

[@andreat.7514]

I almost bought Pillars of the Earth today to teach my family about worker placement games (most of the ones I own are in pEnglish and they don't understand half of it). I had to return it to the shop because despite the seal, the box was in terrible condition (colour degradation due to the sun, corners bruised and a weird decoloration on a corner as if a pricetag had been removed from the cover). All in all, I am a little disapointed considering I was looking forward to trying it.

[@olivierprevot8082]

Dear Dice Tower, did any of you try Lobotomy ? A game about escaping a psychiatric hospital. And you do not even know if the monsters are real or if you are mad. ^^ Really perturbed me but great game. I agree with most of your list like depressing games or insipid/dry themes. I was surprised by Mansions of Madness because it is a FFG game and they have been doing Lovecreft games for a long time, it's more the games from other companies that I dislike. However if they made a MoM with general horror or maybe Indiana Jones theme I would love it! :D Many thanks for another great video. :)

[@johnkennedysmith]

Tom needs to watch Train to Busan. Probably my favorite zombie film because it depicts people cooperating with each other, and generally being competent and proactive.

[@pixxelwizzard]

I am a HUUUUGE fan of the zombie genre but Train to Busan bored me. Didn't make it through the whole movie.

[@LEGnewTube]

Honestly, 7 Wonders doesn't have much theme at all. The only theme is the text on the cards. I basically never notice the theme when I play it. Surprised Tom doesn't like the theme of Agricola considering how much he enjoys it/Caverna. Personally I love the theme. Doesn't remind me of work at all :P

[@feekygucker2678]

Tom's rant about the zombie genre... Quality! :)

[@CraigS-]

I don't like Prehistoric history either. But that's only because I dislike oxymorons, not because of the Stone Age theme. :)