How to Make Your Heroes Look Even Worse by Stephenie Meyer

[@TVandManga]

Another example of why Stephanie Meyer should lean into her existential horror and darkness of her ideas, because if this was written knowing how utterly messed up it was, it would be far more interesting.

[@violetsanddragons]

I really liked the horror and existential dread in the host. Unfortunately that book is also full of pedophila

[@Crosshill]

i think psychological horror about lowkey emotional and sexual abuse is best enjoyed when you're not entirely convinced that the author themselves knows how messed up their work is, it adds a layer of authenticity to the abuser cause thats the sorta of casual attitude that they'd have about it and then it feels like they're tryna gaslight you, too, so i dont entirely agree with you, i think the same goes for existential horror as well

[@MsMissX]

I will argue that the fact that she wrote the Twilighth books like it was meant to be a romantic subplot without ever picking up on how utterly horrifying they really were makes it far more horrifying than any horror story ever written.

[@Crosshill]

@@MsMissX try reading Killing Stalking, on one hand its Stephen King degrees of well executed psychological horror but the other hand might just be down their pants and the fanatic fans add a surround sound like effect of discomfort about the whole reading experience

[@MsMissX]

@@Crosshill I do not doubt there are many very well written horrifying stories out there. I am just point out that that the fact the Mayor believe the Twilight series is romantic when she is glorifying misuse, bad relationships, horribly character portrayed as "good" without her even noticed that is the case is a true horror in my opinion.

[@theoneandonlymichaelmccormick]

Credit where it’s due, “The Short Second Life of Bree Tanner” is actually a really good title for a novella about a vampire who died suddenly and tragically.

[@sugarbaby1974]

Reminds me of the short life of Madeleine, the woman that Louis turned into a vampire companion for Claudia in Interview With a Vampire, only to be executed with her not much long after. I always felt for that poor, minor character - such a tragic life packed into a few short scenes.

[@jaimeerindy4573]

I love the title!

[@lenastorm6280]

Agree.

[@tetramorpheus]

95% sure the title is ripped from "The Short Happy Life of Baby Jenks and the Fang Gang," which is something of a side story in the middle of Anne Rice's Queen of the Damned. It serves a similar purpose in the work as a whole and features a female character whose life is cut short by the central conflict of the story. Hmmm...

[@theoneandonlymichaelmccormick]

@@tetramorpheus Well, that would explain why it’s uncharacteristically good.

[@MogamiKyoko13]

I remember feeling indignant when none of the Cullens tried to stop Bree's execution. She could have added an interesting dynamic to the Cullen family if they took her in. She even could have been a first-hand example for Bella of what newborn vampires are like and trying to get her to resist the human blood diet. That would have been a cool story. Instead we get hybrid vampire babies and newborn vampire Bella with perfect self-control.

[@cam4636]

This! Not only was this a perfect way to go into detail on the "rules" of being a vampire to get perspective on how the "good guy" vamps learned to control themselves, but also...the "good" characters promised to protect her and then let her be executed immediately, so why am I supposed to think they're "good" again?

[@manband20]

Any competent writer could have turned it from "vampire babies that eat their mother from the inside out" to "Bella and Edward adopt this poor kid who got turned into a vampire against her will and raise her as surrogate parents with the rest of the family acting as a support network" but instead we need to get the Mormon message of breed, breed, breed and you MUST be married to your white spouse or face the consequences!

[@ouijedanse]

Of course newborn vampire Bella had perfect control! She married into money, didn't she?

[@FadzaiSimango]

No, Ellen, that's not the truth. They _did_ try to stop it. Carlise tried to vouch for her. In the film version (possibly the book version) Esme said that they would take Bree in and claim responsibility for her. So the Cullens _did_ try. They just didn't *physically* get in the way of Felix because that would have lead to a fight that they could only win by killing the Volturi members who were there. They weren't going to risk going to war with the most powerful coven (who would certainly have come for them in full force if the Cullens had been able to kill Jane and co.) all for a girl who they didn't even know. Remember, Bella was still human and she didn't have the power to expand her mental shield yet. How exactly were the Cullens going to *stop* the Volturi from doing anything?

[@Kairos_Akuma]

To be fair...that what I wished after reading.... Bree could have been a super interesting Character and "Friend" for the newly turned Bella then. Like just someone to clash Ideas with and...newbie Vampiric goof offs.. And a later "older sister" to the Child.

[@Funeral_Attire]

I really think Stephanie Meyer should take a shot at writing horror novels.

[@tristanhartup4936]

She should, but she doesn't want to.

[@mentosfairy]

It’s funny because the Twilight series totally could’ve had more of a horror focus and it probably would’ve worked better that what she actually wrote.

[@yvette4948]

She won’t. She said The Lost Boys grossed her out and also there’s the whole Mormon thing.

[@jediping]

@@yvette4948 Being Mormon doesn’t mean you can’t write horror. Maybe less likely to, but it’s not against our religion. What is Twilight if not a horror story of a young woman groomed and manipulated by a bunch of vampires into joining their cult who doesn’t realize her plight because her mother (probably) suffers from borderline personality disorder and clearly prioritized the current man in her life over her own child. It’s just that Meyer doesn’t realize the horror of it. It’s ALMOST funny except for the legions of young fans who get yet another unhealthy relationship to model.

[@dustrose8101]

I don't think she's AWARE enough to write good horror. She has contact with and can conceive all these concepts we find horrifying but in order to be an effective horror writer without being ironic she'd need to realize what exactly she's envoking that makes her horror more compelling than her romance.

[@TheLastSane1]

There was a section in Eclipse where Bella is told the story of The Third Wife. And during the ending of it Billy references a bag hanging around his neck. Its implied through the story and context that this is vampire ash, this someone they killed and kept the bagged remains so that it could never reform. The implications of that are horrific honestly. Because it implies that burning the vampire does not actually kill them, just renders them unto ash and that there is still sentience there. Because its suggested throughout the books that the reason you must rip a vampire up and burn them is to prevent them from reforming. So if someone where to say snap Edward's head off his shoulders he is not dead, he is very much still alive but just disabled for a time. But this story implies that he could eventually put his head back on and be fine. So Bree narrating after she is burnt is so much darker because its entirely possible that Bree is still conscious even after being burnt to ash.

[@nocturnalizzie]

Oh dang, I never thought of it that way. Yeesh.

[@atree4627]

This is what I was looking for. Thank you for bringing it up! It always shocked me a bit how *no one* seemed to remember that they could re-form.

[@shamaamamamamaah6928]

Small details like this are what keeps me invested in this series.

[@jenisekirk980]

Would that mean that Edward could still hear the thoughts of "dead" vampires if he were close enough?

[@elif6908]

WTF?! I’ve never connected these things it’s so much grim now 🤢

[@jazzycat8917]

If Meyer had realised her true strength is in short form horror and not embarassingly edgy Mormon romance, society might be very different

[@brittanybecker170]

Meyer's only horror comes from her extreme ignorance and bigotry. That's not talent.

[@alexandresobreiramartins9461]

Meyer does not have strengths.

[@fabiocandelori9163]

Yeah, I think people are confused. I don't see her penchant for writing horrifying things as being a strenght. It just shows how disturbing her view of the world is.

[@GrimmDelightsDice]

​@@alexandresobreiramartins9461I think this is a somewhat reductive view. Things without *some* strengths, whether practiced or not, don't get popular the way that Meyer's work did. It has more appeal to me as a horror concept, but denying that there are some strengths there is rather draped in confirmation bias.

[@cafesandwednesdays]

Someone online proposed that a way to fix a lot of the issues with later series Twilight books would have been to allow Bree to join the Cullen Clan and have HER be the one Jacob imprints on. It shifts a lot of stuff around into a better, less creepy narrative.

[@1.calm.chaos1]

And funnily, she would even be closer to Jake age-wise than Bella

[@Melissa-sx9vh]

@@1.calm.chaos1 In Breaking Dawn Jacob is only 17 if I'm not mistaken so even if a 17yo dating a 15yo is slightly weird it makes waaaay more sense than him dating a freaking baby and grooming her into becoming his perfect mormon wife.

[@FadzaiSimango]

@@Melissa-sx9vh Yes, Jacob is indeed 17 years old in _Eclipse._ I have to ask though, is a 17 y/o and a 15 y/o really weird? As an actual adult in my 20s, those just sound like two high school teenagers to me 🤷🏿‍♂️ Not so weird for a junior to date a freshman, is it?

[@Melissa-sx9vh]

@@FadzaiSimango I feel like it could either be normal or weird depending on the level of maturity, the life experiences, the way they met... I think a larger age gap wouldn't be appropriate since a lot of maturing happens between these years. In The short second Life of Bree Tanner, Bree is nearly written as an adult, her mind and her thoughts are all adult-like so being with Jacob who is shown to have the same level of maturity could work but some 15yo are pretty much still children who can't function in society. If Bree was like this and Jacob still basically a (mentally) 20-something man it would feel a little uncomfortable (to me at least).

[@FadzaiSimango]

@@Melissa-sx9vh I _think_ I get what you're saying 🤔 But if Jacob is 17, then he _is_ *17.* He's not "basically a (mentally) 20-something year old man". I've been a 17 y/o boy. Back then, I was an angsty, still-maturing, poor-decision-making teenager (a child) and I was in high school, surrounded by other high schoolers. I didn't think or act like an adult, and I wasn't required to. So I don't think there'd have been an uncomfortable amount of difference between myself and a 15 year old, who is also a teenager in high school. There's a reason 17 year olds are minors. I don't think a junior and a freshman dating is a huge deal (although I've listened to enough Taylor Swift to know that dating older high school boys often gets teenage girls' hearts broken 😬😅).

[@rachelranderson]

As someone who works with runaways and abused kids, I'm honestly willing to give Bree a little more leeway for not taking off when she knows she's in a shit spot She's put into a traumatic situation (even if Meyers doesn't talk about it, she was //killed// and turned into a bloodthirsty violent creature) and while she was formerly a runaway, she's now a completely different species and has someone gaslighting her about what she is or isn't capable of. Not to mention she's a combination of newborn vampire and fifteen year old girl. People are willing to take all sorts of crap for the sake of stability. Honestly, I'm desperate for Meyers to write a story about the hybrids down in South America, just so we can finally address the gaping plot whole that is the brilliant strategy that nobody thought to ponder on at the end of Breaking Dawn. The Volturi know (via Edwards memories) that Alice can't see hybrids. The Volturi know that there are a bunch of hybrids in South America that nobody except their half-brother and their Nazi vampire dad cares about. The Volturi have a vampire that can influence people to change sides. Why don't the Volturi just go south, kill Nazi Dad, convince the hybrid daughters to join them, and basically create an easy strategy to decimate Team Cullen by planning everything involving bringing the hybrids with them so Alice can't see what's happening? BAM-- dead Team Cullen.

[@MaliceAttention]

It amuses me to see more people planning the destruction of clan Cullen, despite them being just fictional characters. This plot right here, I support it. And please, do not let Meyer write it. She will manage to turn this interesting and promising idea into a mess of a story.

[@K.Marie119]

As much as this is a legitimate point, it gives Meyer way too much credit. I'm willing to bet that Bree's decisions being similar to actual trauma victims' is more coincidence than good writing.

[@SailorMya]

@@K.Marie119 Yea, it seems like her need to have Bree stay was more so she could reach the end of the battle rather then actually considering what a runaway would do...

[@kerrychristensen7204]

Or just have a male vamp breed with one of their secretaries

[@SilimSavertin]

@@K.Marie119 It doesn't have to be intentionally good writing or even intentional to be fitting/a bit realistic, though. Horrid people write the correct takes every now and then.

[@keah]

Congratulations Dom on becoming an uncle!

[@Jane155-x6d]

Where's Fred POV novella? A lone vampire with a unique gift who left his original vampire ''family'' behind and is now wandering around? The only person who hanged out with him left with the others and is now dead? I want it!

[@bethanychatman9531]

If anyone else writes it, probably.

[@snarkbotanya6557]

Another thing worth noting about that final bit where Bree thinks about how she's passed on all that knowledge of how the Volturi are bad to the mind-reader... Edward does precisely nothing with it. In fact, going by how he acts in Breaking Dawn, he didn't even HEAR it. Because when the big reveal comes that the Volturi are corrupt, he still has the nerve to be surprised. He acts like Bree never existed. Which, in the original "Forever Dawn" draft, she didn't. Meyer wrote the original draft of Breaking Dawn before New Moon, Eclipse, and Bree Tanner, and when what she ended up writing for the in-between required that she change the ending, she said, "nah, I'll just give the wolves a bit more screen time and that'll be fine."

[@keshca]

Bree's story was a favourite of mine when I read it, but it puts things in perspective when you mention this. Guess I didn't think too deeply about the loopholes when I read Twilight years back.

[@eileensnow6153]

@@keshca yeah I consumed all the books ravenously as a teenager and I can’t read them now as an adult lol. It’s kind of like Riverdale, you have to turn your brain off in order to enjoy it

[@noelbernabe8704]

Because Edward has already read the minds of the Volturi when he was Italy, and was reading the minds of the Volturi at the end of Eclipse, in all honestly Bree didn't tell him anything he couldn't figure out for himself. Edward himself was suggesting earlier in Eclipse that the Volturi were actually behind the attacks in Seattle. He was wrong in that assumption, but he wasn't far off and already clearly didn't trust them. It was an attempt by Meyers to give Bree SOMETHING, but it didn't amount to anything really and it probably shouldn't have. It would have been nice if her sacrifice meant more, but there's honestly no reason it should have. That said, I don't recall the reaction Edward had to the Volturi being corrupt in Breaking Dawn. If indeed he was surprised by this, then yes that's bad continuity. Edward already assumed they were corrupt in Eclipise, so this should not have been news to Edward.

[@NWolfsson]

Stephenie Meyer: So, anyway, the Volturi are evil and corrupt and nobody caught it when they visited Italy to suicide/save the suicidal. Me, looking at the very Ventrue-Gone-Wrong (Vampire: The Masquerade reference) Volturi: No shiiiiit? I swear everyone has the mental capacity of a comatose fly in these books.

[@TheLastSane1]

@@noelbernabe8704 Its not Edward who was surprised by it. Its Eleazar (From the Denali coven and a former member of the Volturi) who is surprised and horrified by them being so corrupt and using their power in such a way. Edward was the one leading Eleazar to that revelation and speaking with him through it. Edward knew, he was just trying to get others to that point so they might fight.

[@kristofgriffin384]

I have a bit of a funny history regarding this book. Near the end of my 10th grade graduation, our school wanted to reward those who received high scores all throughout the year with a book of their choosing. I wanted to get "Percy Jackson and The Lightning Thief", as I was interested in the Riordan-verse and wanted to get into it. However, either they couldn't get it, or because some mistake happened, I instead got "The Short Second Life of Bree Tanner". To say that I was bitter would be an understatement.

[@LunaWitcher]

This reminds me of the time a close friend of mine wanted to give me a book as a birthday gift, so she tried to convince all her friends to join in with some money (since they were all both invited to my party and broke teens) and out of like 8 people she managed to raise 30 bucks (very little to work with given the amount of people that pitched in) and used that to buy me the first book of a YA series that was utterly trash. I loved every second of reading that book. It was so incredibly badly written that I had the time of my life laughing my ass off the entire time I spent reading it.

[@morphing_erebus]

@@LunaWitcher Was it the vampire diaries by any chance?

[@thevideoofdiariesofagregin9517]

@@morphing_erebus The Vampire Diaries? The first book wasn’t that bad. A bit boring? Maybe. But not a bad book.

[@haileymullican335]

You were expecting Percy Jackson and instead got a Twilight book? Man that sucks. Did you ever get your Percy Jackson book, cause the series (and other series' by Rick Riordan) are 1,000 times better than twilight.

[@teresaellis7062]

Wow, instead of an awesome, really well written book, someone in the school gave you an example of really bad writing with toxic relationship examples? Someone really dropped the ball on that one. I hope you were able to get a copy of "Percy Jackson and The Lightning Thief". I am still working my way through "The Trials of Apollo". Rick Riordan can write!

[@DukeSkylocker]

Funny thing is you get the impression Meyer wrote this novella partly to justify the Cullens letting the Volturi kill Bree by retconing things so that Bree actually wanted to die because she would rather face death than have to live near Bella but never be able to drink her blood. Problem is that only Edward can hear her thoughts. The others have no idea she wants death. Also, Meyer went out of her way to establish that Newborns are more bloodlust and that eventually fades away. And given how rich the Cullens are you would think they could easily have her live far away from Bella until Bella herself turns (I mean they own a freaking island). Heck, the fact that she has dirt on the Volturi just makes things worse because you would think Edward could use that as leverage against them to let her live. But nope, he and the rest of the Cullens let them get away with it because who cares what the Volturi do as long as doesn't hurt them? This novella did nothing to expand the Twilight verse and it only introduced more unresolved plot threads (did Edward try and contact Fred as Bree wanted? What's the point of Bree giving Edward the information that the Volturi were encouraging this if he did nothing with it?) But hey, at least it had one of the most unintentionally funny moments in the entire series (Meyer describing the sound of Vampires kissing)

[@TheLastSane1]

I mean there is literally nothing they could have done for Bree. You say leverage but there is nothing to leverage. If they reveal that they know the Volturi are pulling this there is no reason for the Volturi not to kill them on the spot. Simply put the later reveal that Alec can 100% take out an army on his own means that Edward and Carlisle knew there was nothing they could do for Bree beyond saying she had surrendered to them. Which normally would mean they get to decide her fate, but the Volturi knew that she had seen them and so she had to go. A loose end being tied up. The Cullens have a lot of useful gifts, but the Volturi have offensive gifts selected for battle. Reading Minds and Seeing the Future is good in combat sure but neither are combat specialist like Jasper who can make them more effective and even slow the opponent. But none of that matters if they lose all of their senses and cannot risk moving without hurting their own side. Bella was also there and very at risk of being killed so they choose to protect their own and Bella than a stranger which is entirely understandable. Edward does bring up that the Volturi intentionally arrived late which is all he really learns from Bree who I remind you he does not know and could have been lying (all he hears is her thoughts not what happened)

[@shayla106]

@@TheLastSane1 So many excuses for bad writing. He would know if she was lying, but okay. Because she would think about lying 1st but okay….

[@TheLastSane1]

@@shayla106 not how they describe it. Hence the whole reason Bella had to go with Alice in New Moon because as she said she could just think that Bella was alive and make up something to keep him from killing himself. He only hears the thoughts going through your mind in the moment and he says he can see someone’s day dream not just hear that they are daydreaming so someone making up something or misunderstanding something would not sing as “lying” which is why you have vampires like Maggie who can tell if ur lying or even just not saying something which we see in midnight sun

[@thestoryfactory8429]

The best thing about the Bree novella is that its proceeds funneled a dollar-per-sale into the Red Cross for emergency aid. Something like $1.5 million from the initial sales.

[@theoneandonlymichaelmccormick]

The Red Cross are a glorified money-laundering scheme that pretend to be a humanitarian relief fund organization.

[@brittanybecker170]

The series is funding hate crimes against LBTG people around the world as well as promoting IPV and fundamentalist bigotry. This does not erase or excuse that.

[@PS-dm1dq]

Unfortunately the Red Cross is pretty bad as charities go :(

[@ilincabogza]

That's great! OMG!

[@theoneandonlymichaelmccormick]

@@ilincabogza Y’know what’s not great? The fact that 10% of all the proceeds for the Twilight novels were also donated to the Mormon church, which were then used to fund the Prop 8 bill that fought gay marriage.

[@SolStJohn]

Hang on, isn't the logic behind Meyer's extra vampire powers that it's a supernatural augmentation of a trait they had as a human? And Fred's power is to make himself repellent??? The poor guy.

[@DeborahGoldenflower]

Right? And to me, this also really drives home the classist implications that Dominic mentioned. The "dregs" of society don't get reborn with special powers as vampires because they were already below-average as humans, and the only one who DOES get a special power is just able to make himself "repellent" ? Hmmm....

[@alex_bee_kind]

It’s possible since Victoria turned runaways (because nobody would miss them) that Fredy grew up in an abusive home, and he was very good at doing things that made him seem so repulsive, his abusive family, member, or members left him alone. Maybe his other siblings got Bean and she was able to avoid it by acting like some kind of psychopath or perv I don’t know. And so this repulsion ability is a physical manifestation of that desire to be able to repel people he had in his life.

[@cpm9747]

"Yes, this is something I could have planned around. . .but I didn't." Love the honesty Dom.

[@ArielVHarloff]

I honestly thought this book was the best out of all the twilight universe books. Stephanie Meyer's writing is at its best when she just goes ham on the horror and tragedy aspects XD

[@petrosinella]

Agreed. In the first book, I was cringing with the romance part of the story. However, the writing got way better when Bella was dealing with the local coven.

[@Liam_Phoenix]

@@petrosinella If you were "cringing at the romance" then why did you read a ROMANCE novel???

[@whiteraven181]

@@Liam_Phoenix I think the implication was that OP was cringing at the _badly written_ romance.

[@petrosinella]

@@whiteraven181 Exactly! I read a romance novel because I thought it would be a well-written one, but I cringed because it wasn't.

[@Liam_Phoenix]

@@whiteraven181 No no they clearly wrote romance in general, you can't imply shit like that over text when you can't hear tones of voice, and honestly twilight isn't thay badly written, its on the same level as Harry Potter, they're written for teens

[@DJtheBlack-RibbonedRose]

I tried reading Bree Tanner in middle school because I was genuinely interested in reading another side of the Twilight story. But its lack of chapters, being one long story without any sections to break it up, bothered the hell out of me so I quickly gave up on it. Needless to say, the concept of novellas just wasn't for me. 😆😅

[@Eldyra]

That’s not the concept of novellas, that’s the concept of this specific novella 😉 A novella is just a book that is shorter than a novel and longer than a short story, but most of them have chapters. There are also full length novels with this concept.

[@DJtheBlack-RibbonedRose]

@@Eldyra Oh, okay. I've wondered about that sometimes but never took the time to actually look so thanks. Makes sense though; I've read Submergence by J.M. Ledgard and that's a novel with no chapters, instead broken-up by paragraphs of interlacing storylines and meditations by the author.

[@merrittanimation7721]

@@Eldyra Like most Discworld novels have no chapters

[@theotherghostgirl337]

Honestly it was better as a audiobook

[@profezzordarke4362]

@@merrittanimation7721 Yes, and no chapters are an underused option. Chapters destroy the story flow, imho

[@turtle4llama]

There are a lot of VERY Mormon themes in Meyer's work. Basically everything that squicked you out. Like, I don't think an understanding of Mormon heaven would transform the bad writing, but it turns all those "WTF is happening?!" moments into "I understood that reference" moments.

[@richardbourton4523]

Could you elaborate on how it relates? I have a very vague understanding of Mormonism, but it’s not really much of a thing in the UK, so not really very familiar.

[@rottworks]

@@richardbourton4523 Stoney321 on Livejournal wrote about the Mormon connection and I remember it being really good. That was so many years ago at this point but I think it can still be found.

[@tatsudragneel4761]

What layer of heaven do vampires go to? Do they get their own planet?

[@DeborahGoldenflower]

@@tatsudragneel4761 Well, if you asked Carlisle, vampires are doomed to damnation, but if you asked Edward, vampires don't even have an immortal soul, so...I guess the short answer to your is no?

[@tatsudragneel4761]

@@DeborahGoldenflower So it could be a Little Mermaid thing where they become air spirits and have to do good deeds in order to get an immortal soul?

[@gaaraxnaru]

Back when Twilight was huge, I was really into it. And when I read this novel I quickly found myself furious with The Cullens. I was always more Team Jacob anyway, but this book solidified my disdain for those sanctimonious, cold pricks. I knew what Bree's fate was from before I even picked up the novel, but until the very end, I kept wishing somehow, someway she survived. To this day, I'll never forget the last lines of the book, where Edward told her to close her eyes. So sad. Poor Bree. So young. So innocent. They could've took her in and guided her easily. But no. Can't have another single girl in Bella's orbit, I guess.

[@TheLastSane1]

I mean, there is not much they could do. We don't know it at the time because we only know Felix is a skilled fighter probably on par with Jasper. Demitri can track and is a skilled fighter, and Jane could do her torture. We had no idea that Alec was the most dangerous one there. Without Bella as a vampire and having her shield active there was no way for the Cullens to trigger a fight there for Bree and win. Thats kinda the point the cullens know that even though they outnumber the Volturi, their gifts are just not suitable. The only two who could bypass the complete removal of senses was Edward and Alice and only so long as Alice stays alive because Edward needs her visions. And nither are skilled enough in combat to take on Felix and Dimitri with those handicaps.

[@billuraral1870]

It doesn't help that it was commanded to BELLA! He doesn't care a manipulated, tortured child is getting killed to save face, just that his girlfriend might get upset by watching like they came across a dead pigeon or something. And Bella never once spares a thought to Bree after that, she's just offput by her newborn hunger. Fucking monsters, every single one of them.

[@TheLastSane1]

@@billuraral1870 I mean Bella is human and he presumes (at least from Midnight Sun) to be super fragile. He is 100% certain she is gonna run screaming at every little thing. But as I said the cullens could not actually do anything. Alec was there and that meant they had no options. IF it was just Jane and the boys maybe, but the guy who can just strike everyone so they cannot sense anything is just too strong.

[@gaaraxnaru]

@@TheLastSane1 Still the fact that there wasn't any further arguing. They could've st least tried to save her. If not physically, then with Carlisle trying to use some pull. I don't know. I just feel like tyeu didn't even try, especially when one if their won, Jasper was in a very similar position once upon a time.

[@TheLastSane1]

@@gaaraxnaru Thats the thing, he has no pull with Jane, Alex, Felix, and Dimitri he has pull with Aro and honestly not sure how I feel about the volturi with cellphones because it seems really weird. I mean was there a way to write this to keep her alive? Oh 100% there was.

[@kieranmahon4382]

Honestly Carlisle adopting Bree into the Cullen family would make for a much more interesting story. How does Bree adjust to the Cullen coven lifestyle? What is the cover story for Bree going into high school? Where does Bree end up going to high school? Etc.

[@TheLastSane1]

From reading Midnight Sun the cullens would have just moved to Alaska for about ten or so years to let Bree adjust, and since Bella would be getting turned soon it would be easier than not with two newborns running around. I agree I have seen so many fanfics and RP boards were they handwave Bree surviving. I actually liked the reasoning behind one board I played on where Jane orders Felix to stand down and let the little newborn live, because she knows Bella is always around the cullens and she wants Bella dead because Aro favors her so she hopes keeping a newborn among them will lead to a happy accident of a dead bella.

[@richardbourton4523]

Adding to the family would seem much less like strange arranged marriages and more like an actual family. And since the Cullens act very tortured a lot of the time it would be an interesting counterpoint to see how Bree adjusts to unbelievable wealth after a life of poverty.

[@TheLastSane1]

@@richardbourton4523 Oh for sure I mean we see it with Bella to a degree because she she is not wealthy and feels awkward about the expensive things that they buy for her.

[@brittanybecker170]

@@TheLastSane1 , its called Prosperity Gospel. Its is the disgusting idea that a Xian god loves wealthy people and that riches make you a better person.

[@thomasraines1396]

@@TheLastSane1that’s actually a pretty interesting idea and works well at how Jane is a sadist, the Volturi won’t have to lift a finger for Bella to die and the situation will resolve itself.

[@Faucetofstone]

Yet again with Meyer, Fred, the Vampire who's power is overwhelming repulsion is a much more interesting character that I actually would want to be the focus. Edit: Dom may joke but I'm #TeamFred to the death

[@marocat4749]

#teamfred

[@Jenifer_R_]

I guess he was homeless and shunned, and that was the most prominent thing that he brought into his next life. I was glad he escaped.

[@danielmclellan1522]

@@Jenifer_R_ nah, he just got chewed on by about unsupervised Nosferatu while their whole branch of the Ventrue/Brujah (Camarilla/Anarch) conflict shook itself out. (Alice was CLEARLY Embraced by a Malkavian just before Carlisle got to her...).

[@Jenifer_R_]

@@danielmclellan1522 That sounds like an epic book. I have no idea what it is, though.

[@danielmclellan1522]

@@Jenifer_R_ Vampire: the Masquerade (or Vampire: the Requiem), part of the World of Darkness

[@lizryan7451]

That ending song was probably the best thing to come out of this book's existence, so silver linings and all that

[@halierlockehart]

What song is it parodying?

[@singingstar999]

@@halierlockehart Yes, I want to know this too! what a catchy song!

[@ellietischler]

Right? It’s so good!

[@faithlessone423]

So proud of you, Dom, for keeping at the saga. Congratulations to your sister and her family!! ♥

[@RealLukeWilson]

Re: the book being written in first person past tense, it’s hard for many writers (especially weaker ones), to write outside of their POV comfort zone. When I was studying creative writing in undergrad, it was excruciatingly hard for me to write in anything other than first person present tense, to the extent that trying to do otherwise made the quality of my writing substantially worse. And it’s not a simple matter of changing the POV or tense after the fact, either, because the narration becomes clunky when inorganically forced into different perimeters.

[@cinthiagoch]

I feel you. I write mostly third-person past tense, and it's hard to even think of writing in any different way. I've tried first-person past tense on some very short stories. The result was interesting, but I don't know if could ever write a full novel like this.

[@searchingfororion]

Mildly unrelated I suppose, but this is one of the things that continues to impress me about Stephen King's work. Even with his debut novel, he has the ability to write first person present tense, third person past tense and omnisciently (sometimes all at once in the same novel and it works). He can even write an entire novel in dialect (such as Dolores Claiborne - an approach that had me internally screaming). Obviously I'm not saying he's the best author in the world, but he is (and always has been) *very* talented at his use of POV in his works that I have yet to see replicated or duplicated. - Especially multiple and varied in the same piece. --- I apologise for the ramble. I used to be very passionate about writing until "adulting" and then becoming disabled slowed down my ability to absorb and express language properly. What genre/types do you write?

[@Jenifer_R_]

@@searchingfororion I like first person present tense, as I find it has a more natural access to the POV character's thoughts, and is more conducive to humour.

[@haku8135]

I think a supposedly PROFESSIONAL writer should be at BASE capable of writing a COUPLE PAGES in a different POV. Being completely incapable of going from "I said" to "She said" when you claim to be a pro writer, as a full career, is just kinda pathetic. (I KNOW changing one word isn't all that's involved in writing povs, it's not a fucking essay, but changing POVs also isn't that hard if you're a practiced writer doing it for at most a few pages.)

[@okgibberish6771]

I don’t know if it’s just me but once I get into the flow of the story I find myself reverting back to first person past tense. Makes for some really nonsensical sounding bits to read back. In the past I have tried rewording but mostly I just have to scrap it & begin again from where I lost it.

[@timothymclean]

3:35: "Love comes in all forms" is a perfectly valid theme to include in a romance series, but it's somewhat telling if you keep writing one sort of questionable romance over and over...

[@Toberumono]

I’ve read Twilight (and the 3 subsequent books) and yeah, to this day I am baffled that Meyers didn’t just write horror or some sort of thriller - they’re the only parts of the book that are unequivocally good (mind you, she appears to be set on retroactively destroying them, but…). It’s actually kinda fascinating - she seems to have no problem writing super violent stuff and she actually uses her character supernatural abilities surprisingly deftly (I cannot express how rare that is, and the powers that Meyers was working with weren’t exactly easy ones). Yeah, other authors have done all of those better, but if Twilight shows how good she is at that stuff while actively trying to not do it, I’d genuinely love to read the result of her going all in on it. Edit: I have now been reminded of the stuff that I blocked from my memory of Twilight. Maybe move it down to, “I’d be interested”. Meyers is good at horror from a multitude of very concerning angles…

[@whiteraven181]

I think we can put Meyers in the bin of authors labeled, "At least they're venting it through writing, not action."

[@YouTubeSupportSucks]

I actually really like the sci-fi (romance also, of course for her) book she wrong called The Host. Do NOT watch the horrible movie adaptation

[@LoganBluth]

Well, I mean she ends the series by having the "heroes" make peace with the fucking vampire fascists. Not opposing them, not planning to overthrow them, just calling a truce. So it seems like the final lesson of the series is that you shouldn't seek to actually *_stop_* a totalitarian, mass-murdering bunch of lunatics, you should just make a deal with them so that they continue killing untold thousands of people, just as long as they leave *_you_* alone. Such a heroic bunch, the Cullens!

[@iantaakalla8180]

At least the actions are consistent so that it very clear the Cullen are the protagonists and not the heroes.

[@akiriith]

Tbh in regards to Bree's hyperfixation with Diego, that seems to be the norm when it comes to Meyer's vampires' biology. They mostly mate for life (even if Victoria took Riley as a "mate", she never really saw him as one and it was part of her way of using him... in general they seem to allow themselves to have relationships with different partners but once they find that compatible mate it's them and just them), and fall in love quickly and become a pair. Once they do, they don't really wanna stay apart from each other and loosing the other is exceedingly painful. So I could see Bree staying for Diego if they were on their way to become a mated pair. I mean, this IS a rule set by Meyer so ofc everyone falls hard and fast and etc, and imo is more of a part of the whole "excusing Edward's obsession with Bella via lore" but at *least* it's actually consistent through the series, which is not something I get to say a lot in regards to this franchise. Like. "instinct" is a thing that happens in these vampires. The Cullens wanted to protect their territory so. yea. Even Carlisle agrees even if he aint happy about it. Heck, vampires in general are selfish, arrogant, solitary beings who fight over prey and territory. The Cullens are WRITTEN to be better than that, but they 100% fit into it lmao. Selfless kind Carlisle straight up admits he changed Edward bc HE was lonely, knowing he was dooming the kid to a life he himself hated. He changed Rosalie without care for HER wants OR Edward's, since he changed her to be a mate for him without even asking lmao. In the guidebook some characters are changed just bc the creator was curious, that girl Meg (Maggie? idk, the one who knows truth and lies) being an example. Vampires dont care lmao. I think its funny that the Cullens are written as superior but in the end their selfishness tends to stem from character and not instinct :'D Anyway, on the mate thing, It was true for when Alice met Jasper, for when Rosalie found Emmet (she was drawn to him even if he was dying, to the point of not killing him even if she was still a newborn herself), technically with Edward in regards to Bella, etc. You also see it with uhhhh Garret and that Denali sister whose name I forget. They have a small period of attraction and if it's mutual they become a bonded pair. Still almost instantaneous, but at least it isnt imprinting :') Seems like vampires ACTUALLY have a choice in the matter, tho they usually dont bother choosing anyone else. Tanya being interested in Edward but him not reciprocating comes to mind. As for why Bree didn't leave before, imo that's bc she's a broken traumatized child. I will say back when I read this (which was around if not more than 10y ago at this point), I didnt notice the age gap, yikes. I guess bc to me it felt like a very innocent kinda crush. But, yea, yikes. Ofc there's some weird stuff like this going on. I remember actually enjoying this one and thinking it was better written than the main series, though the fact that Edward did NOTHING with the knowledge that Bree gave him on the Volturi annoyed me :') He was even surprised that they were not the saints he believed them to be. As a side note for another thing you said, imo I dont necessarily think add-ons and extra content in franchises NEEDS to have a purpose. I enjoy reading stories for the fun of it (not that Twilight counts but still), and sometimes I just wanna see stuff written from a different perspective. Its for fun :'D

[@TheLastSane1]

I think that is brought up in New Moon really. Sure Edward could hear her, and see what she was thinking and trying to show him. But the fact is, he has no reason to believe those are true. She could be 100% lying to try and save herself. It just means Edward is flawed and honestly... did anyone read that full scene? After the Volturi leave they discuss that the Volturi "Waited" on purpose which is what Bree is saying more or less. So they do immediately discuss it but its just not something they take as being anything more than Jane being a vindictive bitch.

[@akiriith]

@@TheLastSane1 ohhh you're right, I forgot about that detail. True! It'd also fit in with Edward not liking the Volturi much personally but also refusing to believe they really are corrupt a--holes

[@Jenifer_R_]

Fred was the true love. She could see through his defences, even found him handsome. He learned to manipulate his gift by accommodating her into his 'shield of disgust'. #TeamFred

[@AnnekeOosterink]

RE: vampires being selfish and arrogant seems to be a great reason to not overthrow the Volturi. Like, the Volturi have ONE SINGLE rule. No exposing to the humans. That's it. And still soooo many vampires fail that. What would happen without the Volturi? Vampires would go ham, they'd have massive slaughters for food, giant vampire wars, no reason to keep newborn armies inconspicuous, just turn a whole city, and let them fight. Before you know it, humanity is dead and gone. And then all the vampires will have to survive on stinky deer and mountain lions. Also, Rose can't be the only vampire who wants kids desperately. In canon, there were many immortal children because they were so cute. Finding out vampires and humans can make babies together means there'll be a lot of r@pes, and presumably a lot of them will end in the victim dying either from the act itself, or the resulting pregnancy. Like, there is no good ending here.

[@inferiorinferno8859]

​@@AnnekeOosterink You do have a point.The previous leaders didn't care for hiding and basically had humans to worship them. Without the Volturi, their 2 remaining members will just go back to their old ways. That is already something we could count on. I'm pretty sure after the Twilight saga, mass r*pe did happen to create hybrid babies. I can see the Volturi themselves be interested in having kids, just for the powers they'll have. Renesmee's gift was kind of Edward in reverse. We can speculate hybrid children of the Volturi would also have their gifts in reverse.

[@sarahnour5561]

Has Meyer's Mormon community been investigated for child brides? Because her romanticization of adult/child relationships makes me wonder how she was raised.

[@tristanhartup4936]

I think I heard somewhere that she did marry young but I can't be sure.

[@Shadowfate93]

the mainstream church doesn't do child brides, but smaller break away sects sure as hell do but the church does try to marry off women as young as possible. from the moment you turn 18 the pressure to get hitched is insane. basically if you're a women your purpose in life is to be a baby maker for your husband

[@empressfreya9872]

@@Shadowfate93 there are a lot of exmormons on tiktok and it´s fascinating how they talk about getting married in college because church but also because them being hormonal youngsters meant it was the only way they could finally have sex

[@Shadowfate93]

@@empressfreya9872 I'm exmo myself. I was the ripe old age of 25 when I got married. My grandparents would call me an old maid 💀 Most women I know got married between the ages of 18-20

[@matthewkoch6937]

@@empressfreya9872 Sounds like all the conservative Baptists I grew up around. They get married very young, view dating as the freeway to marriage, and have a phobia of pre-marital sex that makes the Catholic Church look permissive by comparison.

[@JamesTobiasStewart]

This is just making me think of much better content, namely the Shovelheads from Vampire The Masquerade, which are 'recruited' in similar manner, usually by being kidnapped (often by being hit over the head with a shovel, hence the name, and then turned while unconscious) and because the Sabbat (a faction of vampiric supremacists who reject human morality entirely) uses them as mass cannon fodder, they gather them from people society will not notice or care have vanished; the homeless, gangbangers/hoodlum/petty criminals & low ranking gangsters, sex workers, runaways, etc. The difference is, rather than using weak lies to scare them into line, the Sabbat force their new pawns to drink the blood of senior vampires, which leaves the shovelheads enthralled to them and unable to disobey, even if they recognise they are being sent to their deaths (any who show resistance to this are slaughtered by their much more powerful progenitors). This means that instead of having a chance to flee and simply not taking it, Sabbat Shovelheads generally don't get a choice, as their sires can simply override their free will. Also Honor Harrington is MUCH better series than this (but would also be a nightmare to adapt due to the way so much is conveyed through the narrators voice).

[@robertoleary5470]

I love the world of darkness. Love all the different concepts and faction across the various games. Love the story of Clan Tremeree and how they transformed from mages to vampires from the Order of Hermes though they are not my favourite clan

[@JamesTobiasStewart]

@@robertoleary5470 Oh yes that is a fascinating history, I mean I find it telling how despite long since ceasing to be mages, the Tremere cling to old traditions and ceremonies from when they were part of the Order of Hermes. Chantries, Houses, using Magus as a title, Certamen duels and of course using hermetic style rituals to fuel their Thaumaturgy. Even centuries later Tremere unwittingly follow a modified version of House Tremere's practices back when Tremere himself was still a mage.

[@petrosinella]

Are Shovelheads strictly an NPC clan? I can't picture any player wanting to portray one.

[@testosteronic]

When you say gangbangers, is that members of gangs? Bc "gangbanger" means something very non-PG in the UK 👀

[@robertoleary5470]

@@petrosinella shoveheads can be any clan of the the thirteen. It’s basically the lowest ranking slave soldier that the sabbath use.

[@atlas956]

i remember that my mother, who adored the books, got me all of them including this one for like, under $20 from the library, which was doing a ‘spring clean’. I was thirteen, read all of the books and now, years later, i remembered the fact that i still have this book hidden away in my shelf. Remembered how terrible it was even from my 13yo memory, and my standards were low. I now understand why he library would have been ‘spring-cleaning’ these insanely popular good-condition books out…

[@AzraelThanatos]

Twilight is something relatively cheap and easy to get now from used book stores...so many people bought them and aren't likely to want to read them again so try to sell them off for their next book, so there are piles of just about every book that sells big. You still see several places like Half-Price Books with a lot of the cheaper versions of Harry Potter as well and don't accept them for more then a few pennies...hardcovers and similar are ones they still sell, but the paperback ones are ones they're overloaded with.

[@ToniHinton]

Congratulations, Uncle Dom! I hope your sister and her baby are doing well. It would have been so simple for Meyer to use that old framing device of, "This is her story as she told it to me," to have, say, Edward introduce it and continue on from the first person POV. She wouldn't even need to tell him, he could have just gotten it from her telepathically. Then he and Bella could have looked better by being sympathetic to Bree, based on how she related her life to him.

[@manband20]

The way Meyer could have solved the issue of 1st Person Past Tense could have been a tie-in to the movie. The whole movie is her recounting events and giving commentary on what happened right up until she gets killed by the Vampire Mafia, at which point it switches to 1st Person Present and she is killed. THEN switch to Edward's POV for one page only where we learn he was reading her mind the whole time and knows what really happened and have it be a transition to the next main Twilight book. Edward knows the Vampire Sopranos were in on it and now the good vampires plot their revenge. We realize the little kid's second life had meaning despite the circumstances and she went out doing something heroic besides "Surrendering while her brothers in arms get slaughtered around her by the actual heroes of the story" that actually helps our main characters and progresses the main book series' plot. I'm a writer btw. These are the things I brainstorm daily. Meyer made more money than I could ever dream of. I just want someone to read my book one day lol

[@manband20]

@@emilytan3185 Uhhhh thank you?

[@emilytan3185]

@@manband20 I'm very sorry, I accidentally wrote this comment as I was watching this video when I was very sleep deprived. Pls just ignore it

[@manband20]

@@emilytan3185 hahahaha no worries, friend. i thought that was some kinda spam message at first lol

[@stuffwithsoph8264]

drop one of your books!

[@KyleRayner12]

"Yes, this is something I could've planned around, but... I didn't." There's something comforting about following content creators who are also ND.

[@ameliadavidson360]

Well, at least this was short, right Mr. Noble? Congrats on being an uncle! Hope the delivery went well for your sister and you have a safe travel there/back! P.S. Thank you for the Sir Terry cameo. Always love seeing Sir Terry.

[@calebleland8390]

This honestly feels like she read the chapter on Baby Jenks in Queen of the Damned and said, "Hey, there's an idea I can steal and rewrite but in a less compelling and creative way, because I'll never be an eighth of the author that Anne Rice is". And people who wouldn't know good literature if it but then on the ass eat that shit up, because it's "tragic" and "meaningful".

[@starmaker75]

I first read that the title of the book as “the short second life of a bee trainer”.

[@dandoll4405]

Now that's a book I'd read.

[@coffeewolfproductions9113]

Imagine Victoria did transform a bee trainer and when she attacks the Cullens an army of bees comes to their aid. I'd read that book.

[@pyrosianheir]

On the "dead first person past-tense POV" subject, there's an ongoing comic called "Seven Secrets" where the primary character and narrator died at the end of the last issue after it being teased for a while. Due to the way the world is set-up, I'm not expecting him to stay dead, but it's still been an interesting decision since he's been talking about "the day that I died," for the last couple issues before this one. Tangentially related, to anyone reading this far, find and read Seven Secrets if you can. It's a wild ride with a lot of fun stuff, like the Queen of England being a bad-ass Indian woman... that EXCALIBUR recognizes as the true ruler. It's amazing.

[@ErinPrimette]

Nice to see a new vid from you. By the way, I recently learned of a worse romance novel that was published before Twilight but has the same vibes...called Redeeming Love.

[@asexualtrickster]

OOOOH yeah they just made a film adaptation of that I think! We need a Lost In Adaptation episode of it.

[@Barbayat79]

There are tons of them, my worst find yet is A deal with the Devil by Liz Carlyle - thankfully no film adapation ...

[@maia_gaia]

Yes! Redeeming Love is traaaasssshhh. Also, fun fact, it's biblical fan fiction! It's based off the story of Hosea 😒

[@ErinPrimette]

@@asexualtrickster Yeah, I also want a Lost in Adaptation of that book!

[@DJtheBlack-RibbonedRose]

I felt so bad for the lead actress Abigail Cowen when I learned what that movie was...like jeez girl you're already a bad-ass fire fairy you didn't need endure this...that is, unless she liked the book. 😆

[@patmullarkey7659]

Suggestion: Jonathan Strange & Mr Norrell by Susanna Clarke. There was a TV adaption. Very curious what you think of the adaptation. (I loved the book.) And I love your edgy humor.

[@diamondelves]

seconded! it's a great series and to be honest i enjoyed the adaptation

[@whatalsaid]

I do like that they mentioned the whole "Vampires burning in the sun" thing when Bree and co. hide in a cave because they think the sun will kill them.

[@meganshaw1949]

I heard that Myer wanted to explore the character of Bree more and thought that Bella's rebirth as a vampire didn't explore the world from a vampire's perspective enough. So she decided to try seeing the vampire world through Bree's eyes instead.

[@oneinathousand2156]

This is the first time I’ve ever heard of this spinoff. I was never into Twilight so that’s why, but I thought Midnight Sun was the only one.

[@Justafox305]

I also recently found out about the spin-offs. There is also a gender swap version. Where the guy beau moved to town and meets a girl vampire named edwina or something. I didn’t read it.

[@tristanhartup4936]

@@Justafox305 *Edythe

[@Justafox305]

@@tristanhartup4936 thanks!

[@taylorgayhart9497]

The ending in this series still blows my mind, because it’s not an ending! It’s a pause! Literally they say “we will have to deal with them later” but later never comes… wtf? I seriously thought for YEARS that she was gonna come out with another sequel and finish the story, where the Cullens finally take out the vulturi… but no.

[@TheLastSane1]

To be fair Midnight Sun being leaked apparently killed her muse for Twilight for years. And only really her mother and a few of her real life friends pushing for it got her to finish it. So I can't blame a creative of feeling hurt over someone leaking their work early and them losing their muse for it. It was a shitty thing for that person to do.

[@GriffinPilgrim]

Seems to me that people who are used to looking out for themselves in a tough life and who've been given a lot of reasons to distrust authority figures would have the opposite effect with regards to controlling them.

[@Angi3_6]

I remember around the time this book was coming out, I was reading an issue of Astro Girl and on those magazines they have a small section for fortune telling. Stephanie Meyers asked if her book was going to do well. They said that the book will sell well, although not as well as Twilight. My brain just dug up that memory as soon as I saw the book. Lol

[@ariellakahan-harth8831]

A vampire named Fred sounds like he could be Jim the Vampire's cousin on WHAT WE DO IN THE SHADOWS. Also, congratulations to your sister!

[@earthiswatching]

I have read a book where the first person narrator died well before the end, which continued in first person without it seeming strange. It accomplished this by simply switching narrators.

[@Oonagh72]

Racist, misogynist, and now a classist! You go Stephanie. And I still believe she has an editor who is responsible for the good parts.

[@marvinp90]

I love the Honorverse too! Gotta respect an author who come up with ways for advanced spaceships to have to fire broadsides like in the olden days. He was also really good at humanizing the military antagonists. No matter how bad they were they actually felt like complicated people (His political antagonists are another story)

[@andurilcuivie]

David Weber is great! His witting quirks do become a little annoying on the 10th re-listen (Prince Rodger quartet). Out of the Dark is a trip. I think his Safehold series is his next best at complex antagonists.

[@vanessar.6085]

Congratulations to your sister and your family! I hope she has a good recovery and that both she and baby are healthy and doing well.

[@Starmadien2019]

I read this book, I thought it completely heartless that Carlisle didn't do anything to help her. If a remember right, Edward tried to speak up but was silence without a fight. . I keep forgetting that Michael Sheen usally plays a bad guy, he's really good at it. And I try to see him and David as separate from their Good Omens roles. But Michael as Aziraphale is so cute, sweet and fluffy!!! Like I'm literally in love with this acegendered male body ray of sunshine! And it's mostly Sheen's fault. . Damn you! How dare you make me love a character so much I can't stop thinking about them!!! . Michael is a really good actor, much like David they have excellent range. Not to mention they're absolutely perfect on screen together. God damn if the leads from 50 shades had even a smidgen of the chemistry Sheen and Tennant have, I wouldn't see the series as the absolute dumpster fire it is.

[@petrosinella]

Now I definitely have to watch Good Omens. The friendship between the two of them was my favorite part of the book.

[@Starmadien2019]

@@petrosinella It's so fucking good! The actors are really good, and despite Dom's trepidation. The child actors aren't bad in it. Especially the girl who plays Pepper. She freaking nails her lines. Sure the kid who plays 11 Warlock is stilted but considering that the conflict revolves around the kids they did a decent job finding kid actors.

[@stareyedwitch]

​@@petrosinella Tennant and Sheen have both said on record that they were playing their characters as being in love with each other, but that neither would admit it. They get it across through looks, behavior and tone of voice. And, I believe, neither Tennant nor Sheen informed the other that was how they were going to play their character.

[@brubs2556]

I mean, there wasn't anything that Carlisle could do. The Volturi would kill her anyway, no matter what Carlisle said, because they were specifically looking for a reason to pick a fight with the Cullens. In breaking dawn, the Cullens have to rely on Bella's shield plus a small army to be evenly matched. In Eclipse, the Volturi would've wiped the floor with them and killed Bree as a bonus afterwards.

[@Mhidraum]

There's a book series called "Fred, the vampire accountant". It's written by Drew Hayes, and I often listen to it as a palate cleanser between longer/heavier fantasy.

[@andurilcuivie]

Yes! II think it’s a delightful series.

[@DrewDesign]

Casino has that classic scene where Joe Pesci is narrating his story in the past tense right up to the point where he's killed - and the voice over literally ends in mid-sentence. Meyer probably thought that what was good for Scorsese was good for her, but I'm willing to bet she doesn't handle it quite as deftly.

[@hexreviews]

There is a book series about an accountant who became a vampire and continued to work as an accountant who's name is Fred. In my heart, this is what happened to Twilight Fred.

[@BellaFalk95]

I have to disagre on the age thing. It is 3 years between 15 and 18. They are both teenagers. It’s not that creepy.

[@sawanna508]

I was surprised by that conserne too. I'm not American but in the movie "What women want" Nick's 15 year old daugher is in a realtionship with an 18 year old. He is not to fond of it of course and the daughter ends up hurt (emotionally) but no one in the movie states the relationship is illegal. Infact Nick's exwife/ the girl's mother knows about the realtionship and has no consernse abou it.

[@starfire-wd1uk]

i think it would've been really interesting to see bree being added up to the cullen's as a parallel to bella as a newborn. she could've been an example of someone who unintentionally do bad things for the sake of being a newborn, compelling bella to rethink her decision. damn she could've been the plot for breaking down: SHE could've accidentally turned bella and the entire showdown with the volturi was all about that. plus: jacob (being 16 in the books) could imprint on her, making it so much more dramatic for the werewolves to fight against the volturi!!!

[@PFiction24]

As a man who went from not being an uncle to being an uncle of 3 in just over two years, I understand the delay. Congratulations to you family Dom!

[@lilmissiamsodonehere_2399]

Awesome as always Dom! Thank you for doing a great analysis of the series that my Cringe middle school self loved. Congratulations on become an Uncle!

[@jediping]

I appreciate that you acknowledge that she has some skill at writing. There’s definitely some talent and ability there. Which is what makes me more annoyed at the stories she’s choosing to tell.

[@nocturnalizzie]

Did the Cullens really have a choice in letting Bree get killed by the Volturi, though? If they defied the Volturi and said they were going to keep her around, they basically would've had to just fight to the death right there and that probably wouldn't have gone well.

[@Author.Noelle.Alexandria]

The defied the Volturi when it came to Bella. They at least could have made a real effort with Bree.

[@giu.]

I agree! What else could the Cullens have done? They said they would take responsibility over Bree but it was not enough. Even when I first read that book as a kid I knew that the Vulturi killing Bree was not about her, it was about them sending a message to the Cullens: we do not give second chances. It was obviously about punishing them. The Cullen Clan was already walking a tightrope with the Vulturi, with them wanting the family gone so they could have Edward and Alice for themselves and with the whole Bella situation. Picking that fight for a stranger would have been suicide, and Bree would have ended up dead all the same. They tried pleading and they got their answer, doing anything else in that situation would not have been possible.

[@TheLastSane1]

@@Author.Noelle.Alexandria That was different. One she is the mate of their coven/family member not a rando. In this fight it would be Alec and Jane just destroying the cullens ability to defend themselves as Demetri and Felix finished them off. Alec can steal all of your senses and leave you utterly in the dark and unable to feel anything. So until they got Bella as a shield they really stood no chance. Carlisle didn't even want a fight over Nessie thats why they got witnesses to prove she had grown and was not an immortal child

[@Aurelius-bf3yx]

@@TheLastSane1 Saying Bella is different because she’s part of the family does not make them better, the Cullen’s are basically like “Fuck you, got mine”. But the real problem is the situation is completely contrived by Meyer to waste a perfectly good character, she could have easily written it to have Carlisle have had enough pull to actually get Volturi to back off but she didn’t and so regardless of in universe reasons it comes off as a really bad look for every character involved

[@TheLastSane1]

@@Aurelius-bf3yx You didn't read the book did you? The Short Second Life one I mean right? They did killed Bree because she was an eyewitness to the Volturi meeting with Victoria. They where going to kill her regardless because she was proof that the volturi were acting directly against the cullens. And as we later find out ther are vampires out there who can confirm your story simply by hearing it. (In fact we meet two of them in Breaking Dawn, one is Maggie from Irish Coven and the other is a witness for the Volturi who confirms what the cullens said is true and then bails) Your argument is however very stupid, of course its contrived by the author, all storylines are. The whole premise is imply how corrupt and evil the volturi. Basically she wrote them kicking a puppy to show you how evil they are. If they went out of their way to silence this one witness who had no concept of what she actually saw then when you get to Breaking Dawn you then understand that its not just Bella and them being worriers, the volturi actually would hunt down everyone connected to them and kill them off. Its to imply the greater threat.

[@majinally3527]

no but this story was just really sad. i felt so bad for bree she honestly didn’t deserve an ending like this

[@oomflem]

I'm sorry, I can't get past the sheer shitpost energy of "A Vampire named Fred whose magic power is making people so repulsed by his presence that no one can look at him."

[@Xehanort10]

At this point I just assume Mormonism is why Meyer thinks scummy protagonists are great romantic heroes.

[@Eriennexton]

why. does. this. keep. happening.

[@Eriennexton]

i know you know what i mean.

[@Arianddu]

I love the look of increasing glee as you say "a sentient cat who can tear your head off - if he wants to!"

[@kazza6078]

I've really enjoyed your twilight content. When the Lost in Adaptation for Twilight came out I got so excited because I realized you were gonna go through the series again from that perspective. Yay content! Take your time but as soon as it hits fall and starts raining, I'm gonna binge them constantly.

[@jdatlas4668]

Oh, you’re actually going to finish this? You’re a stronger man than I am.

[@isadoracostahamsi163]

"This is something I could have worked around, buuuut I didn't " This is a mood

[@NeroCM]

I think Meyer intended for Carlisle to be seen as a victim of circumstances. He wanted to help Bree, but if he went against the Volturi it would mean Bree dying anyway and dragging his family with her, so he's "forced" to take the path that would lead to the least deaths. Of course, if this book is written as horribly as the rest of Twilight, I doubt she actually managed to show that.

[@Shadow1Yaz]

Watching with my friend Diego and he perked up and was like "?!" when Dominic was like "DIEGO -_-" XD

[@moonprincesst.s.h.4ever115]

Congratulations on being a new uncle, Dominic! 👶🏼🎀👶🏻💙

[@AlchemicalGod13]

Safe travels, and congratulations on the growing of your family!

[@ghostfox657]

Will have to use that description for the Honorverse in the future.

[@margaretswanson5365]

Congratulations to your sister and your whole family!!! I’m really enjoying these moral/social reviews of old pop culture

[@LRCh_]

The music makes the ad read very dramatic, I love it

[@katherinealvarez9216]

8:01 yeah, I'm not caring for it either. Or how the story is saying how sex workers, homeless people and people struggling with addiction are categorized as "weak-minded." Just wow. Also, I kept hearing people complaining about sparkling vamps but not this? And no one talked about how indigenous people or other minorities were portrayed.

[@Ontasia2]

We already knew about vampire Fred. He's an accountant in Denver. Friends with a zombie and were-pony named Bubba

[@dragonquill3182]

After being reminded of all of the horror scenes in this series, I can honestly say that I'd read a horror book by Meyer. Also, congratulations on your new Uncle status!

[@FrancesW-]

I've recently been revisiting David Weber through Audible too. I forget how much exposition he front loaded so many of his books with! I started In Fury Born, not realizing it was a re-release of Path of the Fury which I had loved decades ago, but with a novel-length prologue. I loved that Path of the Fury started more or less in the action with a veteran character, but In Fury Born starts when she's about 14 years old and fully justifies why she's a veteran before the original story starts. 🙄 Also, I remembered that in the first chapter of Mutineer's Moon, the main character was kidnapped by the moon (so awesome), and I was forced to realize that didn't happen as quickly as I remembered, either. Still, fun to be back in his work for a while. I still haven't decided whether I'm up for trekking through the whole Honorverse series again. I got distracted in book two and will swing back around eventually.

[@rukbat3]

I love David Weber's books a Lot, but I've discovered that I can't listen to them in audio because of that very issue with exposition. When I am reading the books in print, I can skim through some of the stuff that I already know, but in audio, it just takes forever to get through. The Safehold books are especially bad in this regard, even though I love the concept of the series. (At some point I really do need to catch up with both Honorverse and Safehold, though!)

[@Roger_Smith]

I did not enjoy the other books I enjoyed the novella I suspect Meyers base talent on concept creation ie her unique take on vampires as a species or a pacifist alien invasion is better suited to short story format

[@shikuthetempest]

Congrats to your sister! I hope you all have a lovely time meeting the newest addition to the family!

[@harmonicajay91]

My reaction to this story: We hope you've enjoyed "No Moral Theater", Ladies and Gentlemen.

[@Cedrickr]

the dollar sign T-Shirt while doing the ad read, genius!

[@abbiebagnell1398]

Congratulations on getting through this and thank you Dom for reading and reviewing these pieces of crap so we don't have to 👏🏻👏🏻

[@OkamiDesuGa]

I remember reading an interview with Meyer and she commented she wished she could have changed the ending of Eclipse and have Bree live. If she was writing this while EDITING ECLIPSE, why didn't she?! That was the perfect chance!

[@noneyobusiness7701]

Am I the only one who thinks that a 15 year old & an 18 year old isn’t that weird? At least Diego isn’t 80 years older than Bree.

[@JohnnyElRed]

Yeah, I agree. I don't know how the cultural standards are in America. But with some exceptions, I don't think anyone in my country would bat an eyelid to it.

[@agentspaniel4428]

The minimum legal age isn't the same in all 50 states, but it doesn't get any lower than 16, so the relationship between Bree and Diego would be statutory regardless of where in the US they are

[@noneyobusiness7701]

@@agentspaniel4428 they’re vampires, I think they’re above human law at this point

[@agentspaniel4428]

@noneyobusiness7701 except both of them were turned recently and weren't around long enough to start thinking that

[@nobodycares5050]

At that age, 3 years is a lot bigger of a difference, that's an extra sixth of life

[@jeannecaelum5167]

I sadly read this when it released in hopes for something good, but for a reason my brain decided to forget this. Also hoping the best for you and your sisters family!

[@jasonblalock4429]

I totally agree about the first-person thing. If the narrator dies, it needs to be justified somehow. (Really tho, I dislike unjustified first-person narration in general. Give the narrator motivation, dammit!)

[@lahlybird895]

One time I read a 1st pov book where the narrator lost her memory at near the end And her diary was taken away before that too But she was still narrating after that I was like 7 and I remember thinking "If she lost her memory, how did she tell the story?" Like you can't say it's the diary bc the amnisia seen is in past tense AFTER she gave up the diary, and written right up to her drinking the potion or whatever... So how is that even possible.!? I think after THAT brainmelt Bree slipped right past me... I just stopped questioning it by the time I found that book. Maybe thats why I tend to prefer 3rd pov books now why I think about it.

[@BlackMageJawa]

One of my favourite books has a first-person narrator who dies with several chapters still to go, and the perspective switches to another character for the ending. On the one hand, they do apparently write (type?) their death-throes in-universe, which is... odd. But on the other, I definitely didn't see that twist coming.

[@LilZombieFooFoo]

Strong agree. I rarely write fiction in the first person. I've never been one to accept it as a construct -- I need to be told who's the audience of an account and why it's being given. I'm kind of a poopypants.

[@lahlybird895]

@@BlackMageJawa the divergent series

[@onbearfeet]

And there are some great examples of people doing just that! One that comes to mind was a really creepy SF novel I read years ago that was narrated in two alternating points of view: third-person and first-person, with the first-person narrator trying to reconstruct what had happened to the protagonist of the third-person chapters, who had vanished years earlier. It basically made the whole book a thriller/mystery in addition to the SF plot. The twist? At the end of the third-person chapters, the protagonist suffered an ego-destroying event and lost all memory of his former self. After he more or less put himself back together, he was effectively a different person...namely, the first-person narrator. Turned out it was one guy narrating the whole book, just using two different points of view to cope with the fact that he no longer understood what it was like to live in Original Him's head. Their narrative voices were so different that I was genuinely surprised by the twist, particularly because the difference in POV heavily implied that the third-person protagonist would die at the end. That book lives in my head rent-free. And that's what you can do if you have range!

[@thedopdeity]

Til there's a guidebook. This series does keep surprising me in ways that I wish it would not.

[@TheOverArchiver]

I’ve been reading the Honorverse for the first time recently!!! It’s really good!

[@JadziaCheshire]

I never read this one, but I remember thinking while reading about her death in Eclipse "Why didn't they just tell Bree to run since Alice KNEW when they were coming and from which direction?!" I get they had to all be there or it would've been suspicious, but they could've told her where their house was and had Bree hide there while they "dealt with" the Volturi members that came. I honestly feel that they used this innocent and scared child as sneaky leverage against the Volturi in some way. Like they knew she would die and used that as a way to steer their attention away from Bella and onto Bree.

[@TheLastSane1]

Demetri could find her honestly. Its shown she got close enough to see them and she never gave a range for his tracking power. But his ability allows him to sample a persons mind and then track that mind across the world. So if he got close enough to her to sample her mind he would know she had just run and followed after her to destroy her.

[@ajrjvincent4088]

you're awesome i love your content congrats on being an uncle nieces and nephews are awesome to have you can become a wizard so easily in the eyes of them.

[@nancyjay790]

Okay, when I saw the text, " Cloudy with a chance of vampires," I had to stop the video so I could finish laughing. 😸😸😸😸

[@FadzaiSimango]

I know 18 is a legal adult, but would it be so terrible if a 15 y/o (a 9th Grader in the US) and an 18 y/o (a 12th Grader in the US) were dating? They're both teenagers, both in high school and both in the same developmental bracket (as a opposed to, say, a 2nd Grader and a 5th Grader, who are both in elementary school and also 3 years apart, but are in *distinctly different* stages of their childhood development). I only ask because this, to me, doesn't seem as egregious as the men in Stephanie Meyer's _The Host_ who are pushing 30 and are involved with girls who are teens at the start of their respective relationships 🥴 I dunno ... Maybe it's because I'm in my 20s now, and an 18 year old seems like just as much of a kid to me as a 15 year old does (high schoolers 🙄).

[@clarehidalgo]

Depends on your state, some States have "romeo and Juliet" laws where the 3 years age gaps of a 15 and 18 couple is allowed. EDIT: Washington does not have any close in age excpetions

[@frostfang1]

Damn YT is on point advertising me The Time Travelers Wife on a Dominic Noble video. I'm looking forward to seeing the HBO show and see if it keeps with the best parts of the book

[@alexandredesbiens-brassard9109]

I really wouldn't call 18 and 15 "child/adult" romance. They arr both teenagers. I mean, yes it is legally dicey and can lead to a power imbalance, but psychologically 15 and 18 are pretty close. I'm not saying it is ideal, but it is not as yikes inducing as it would be if the guy was in early twenties.

[@katherinealvarez9216]

0:16 Congratulations! I hope all is well with you and your sister's family!

[@Rhialia]

Seeing you cover this book makes me wonder if you'll do midnight sun and that gender swapped one, life and death. I would love to hear your thoughts on them!