This is how you should mount your CPU cooler! I think??

I don't know anymore!
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This is how you should mount your CPU cooler! I think??
• This is how you should...
Bitwit
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[@LTT.Official]

The fan was pulling cool air over the RGB lighting, that's why the temps were lower. RGB makes everything cooler.

[@TheKentanthony]

ThisIsAPrettyLongUserNameWhyTheFuckWouldHeDoThatSoThatEveryoneWouldThumbsUpIt nice

[@koelecat2755]

ThisIsAPrettyLongUserNameWhyTheFuckWouldHeDoThatSoThatEveryoneWouldThumbsUpIt lul

[@Tyfuzzle]

ThisIsAPrettyLongUserNameWhyTheFuckWouldHeDoThatSoThatEveryoneWouldThumbsUpIt top kek

[@HeatherWarner97]

I was going to like your comment, but then I read your name. Tisk, tisk, sir.

[@ReOsLP]

ThisIsAPrettyLongUserNameWhyTheFuckWouldHeDoThatSoThatEveryoneWouldThumbsUpIt ThisIsAPrettyLongUserNameWhyTheFuckWouldYouDoThat?

[@nOTpASS]

Maybe, if you could use a tempered glass side panel with some smoke, to better visualize the airflow, would make a great part 2

[@Arnozi_]

Wouldn't the moisture harm the parts

Smoke isn't the same as water vapour

[@Wineblood]

I was about to suggest this. Great minds think alike.

[@sergeantoreo8062]

kyle kyle.....KYYYLE KYYYYLE .....yea this guys has an idea tht you might want to hear ......yep, yep errr his name is nOTpASS

[@movienoob101]

nOTpASS Nice idea

[@Choice777]

5:47 you're welcome.

[@nataliegray7703]

Would have been good to see GPU temps as well, to see how much they're affected by cpu cooler placement.

[@aquacelot]

lexii miller vertical placement would probably decrease the gpu temps by ~1-2C for the open air gpu because it pulls the exhausting air from the gpu away more.

[@jakeconner2813]

see how much GPU power you need to get games to run at 144hz at different resolutions

[@-TK-]

Jake Conner four peanuts and two butters²

[@husssein5153]

wtf is the point, dumbest thing ever. just look at % usage of gpu and u can estimate power draw

[@Alexander-sy7qe]

he is talking about gpu graphical power not wattage pulled. dummy..

[@Interrobang212]

1080p? A gtx 1070 would do it for most (but not all) games. Gamersnexus just did a great video with a heavily overclocked gtx 1080 and 7700k and found that it wasn't enough to get 120 fps in most games at 1440p though. Really need to get into SLI at that point.

[@cy9nvs]

Not even my gtx 1080/i7 4790K 4.7ghz combo gives me 144 fps ultra 1080p in somewhat up to date AAA games. If you really want to have constant 144fps to profit off your 144hz monitor, and you want to play on ultra/very high, you'll need at least a gtx 1080, as I said not even that is enough.

[@husssein5153]

maybe founders edition is hotter in general so heat can transfer to cpu

[@sippe3985]

the gpu is the same. 1070 is a 1070 no dif in the gpu itself.its all from Nvidia

[@magicviper1630]

different coolers make different temperatures.... The blower style cooler is *almost* always warmer than the other types

[@IcedForce]

This is what I also think. The blower style cooled GPU gets hotter and radiates more heat and since the CPU and GPU coolers are drawing their air from the intakes it makes a still air pocket below the CPU cooler allowing the heat radiate from GPU to CPU and MB (so, there's none to little airflow between GPU and CPU cooler).

[@countbaker5595]

husssein But then that doesn't explain the vertical solutions.

[@Iwmar]

That doesn't really makes sense. GPU vrams etc. should run as hot generating same amount of heat in both tests. The reason why you see higher temps in reference cooled cards is because those stock coolers and heat sinks simply struggle with transferring the heat from the chipset. But all this released energy in form of heat still has to go somewhere, ergo if you have a better cooler capable of transferring more heat from the card, the gpu itself will have lower temps but the relocated heat should mean higher temps on other pc components that are getting blasted by all that circulating hot air. Only thing I can think off is difference in voltage and core/mem clocks which means more emancipated heat but if anything FE should produce less energy than non-ref cards with additional pins and higher boost clocks. All of this leads me to believe that it's a margin of error or some unknown law of aerodynamics or thermodynamics that I simply don't know :/

[@TechDeals]

Suggestion - Rerun the tests with the strange results, you might well find they change. Did you have enough (or too much) thermal interface material? Did you have just a poor seating of the heatsink on the CPU? Yes, I'm sure you know how to mount a cooler, I'm not doubting that, but mistakes happen, I know I've made them. Of course you might have already done this and gotten the same result, but it is the first thought that came to my mind, was to rerun the test with everything remounted fresh.

[@omdighe4732]

hi tech deals

[@Saigonas]

Hello lmao

[@FinnishArmy]

You can't have 'too' much thermal paste, it's been proven.

[@traaaaan]

it's pretty interesting to see you commenting on an airflow video but when someone mentioned you didn't have any exhaust on your son's pc (your rear fan was oriented to be intake) during a live upgrade stream a few weeks ago you said "why does it matter? worry about your own pc" to the guy. rude af.

[@neoasura]

@@traaaaan Rude people love to give advice, but don't like taking it.

[@AndrewH.]

*Theories!* *Test #1* - Blower was stealing all the cool air. Could test with a PC-safe "smoke machine". *Test #2" - The Zotac card seems to have a more restrictive "Open" design forcing the bulk of the exhaust to the back and bottom allowing for less heat to be ejected into the case compared to an ASUS Strix for example. Also it may not have been stealing all the fresh air allowing the 212 to move more air across the fins. Could test with a more open-air designed card. *Test #3* - "Direct Contact Heat-Pipes" may have lined up with the hot-spot on the IHS better where the die is mounted vertically. Could test using non-direct style cooler with each test. (Would take alot of time though...) *Test #4* - The Zotac's backplate may get hotter then the "Founder's" card due to added power deliver or design changes and the backplate may be heating up the air at the 212's intake. Could test by measuring the air temp above both backplates. (may be a bit difficult to do though...) I know there's that one person out there that's gonna have a rage-attack, but remember, they're just theories that were thought up immediately after watching the video. ^_^ (*Edit*) Went to the -Thought Chamber- restroom and thought of something else. I wonder if an anomaly caused utilizations to differ between tests. Were the frame-rates consistent and the GPU/CPU loads reported equally? Maybe a background Windows update or other process was causing CPU load to vary.

[@AndrewH.]

Absolutely, I thought about the air being hotter from the backplate but completely ignored the fact that the open-air GPU is still exhausting hot air. That and the broadside of the CPU cooler in test #4 is also making it much easier for the cooler to intake that exhaust while at the same time "tripling" the surface area that the warm air is passing though. It will be quite interesting if a follow-up is done for this video, I realize it would take a good amount of time to do but your input makes me want to know the answers even more. Heck, this type of "Guess what caused it" video conclusion could even be it's own series of videos. Even if only once a month or so I find it quite interesting and enjoy the participation side of it.

[@MrKeikari]

Yeah, the retarded amount of case fans makes these figures meaningless.

[@photonboy999]

WRONG. It would only be meaningless if all the results were identical. They are not, so obviously blower and orientation of the CPU cooler have an impact.

[@stanley3647]

I notced same thing when change my GPU from "blower style" to "open". But final results for my setup: Less fans is requied (2 removed from top) to make same temp. at CPU now. Blower style cards "stealing" air from case, makes CPU cooling less effective.

[@DerrickRG]

I noticed that as well, this is why I added a fan underneath the blower cooler of my GPU. The blower was sucking the air from the front intake fans (and was basically a wall separating top and bottom) and was radiating heat from the backplate up toward the CPU. Adding that bottom mounted fan didn't prevent the GPU from stealing the front intake airflow, but it cooled the card, which helped the CPU stay a bit cooler. Pretty interesting how that all works out.

[@Griimnak]

Did you re apply the thermal paste? Perhaps you did it better the second time over the first?

[@two_number_nines]

if you have years of experience and hundreds of builds behind you i dont think the thermal paste can be issue

[@Griimnak]

+Gothin Fuklio Yeah i figured, never know though. Could be a lazy mistake.

[@welshy4638]

lol you did see him piss coolant all over his rig.

[@dmdport745]

Linus did a test showing the way you put on the thermal paste makes no difference unless it is way to little.

[@LucasDaRonco]

this

[@Aint1S]

it could be that the horizontal CPU & open GPU are actually avoiding each other... in a sense. The GPU is pulling air straight up and the air is likely blooming away and above the the CPU intake pressure drop. Causing cooler air to collect for the CPU. Where vertical is in the direct path of hot GPU air... Great idea for a video.

[@TopThreeProducts]

Can you make a video on how to get a wife?

[@WitchVulgar]

WOPPER he needs to make a video on how to get cinnamon rolls

[@lodbldbol]

McMexicans Step #1 - Get a wife

[@Kriae]

with RGB

[@catgarcia2238]

become famous or rich

[@basshead.]

I only get girls in video games like The Witcher 3 and the Dragon Age franchise.

[@wolverinesfan9021]

The little tests that you and Jay do are really are service to the community and I appreciate all the time and effort that you put into your videos! Thanks once again for the info!

[@TwoCraZyEyes0]

6:44 case closed, pun intended?

[@NineS5]

i once commented about a similar pun like that, and got massive hate lol.

[@jefftraboulsy8631]

@@NineS5 because its fucking cringe worthy.

[@NineS5]

@@jefftraboulsy8631 ikr i sounded like a plonker

[@Britec09]

There are so many myths people claim when it comes to computers and this is one of them, I knew it would not make much difference, I got flamed in one of my builds for doing the same thing, so I rotated the heatsink for a 3 degree difference in temps. Good video Kyle.

[@leonmozambique533]

by mi mixtapo

[@HappyBeezerStudios]

Have mine with a upwards flow as well. First for the simple reason to geht the hot air away from my GPU so it doesn't reduce it's boost. MWith my new card, I'm just to lazy to reassamble all that stuff. (Heavy cooler and a delidded chip: nothing to be done in 5 mins) Besides that I have 2x 140mm in the top and 1x 120mm in the back, so clearly the case supports the vertical airflow. And there would be not nearly as much fresh air coming from the front with all my drive bays, compared to the case he used.

[@not_a_samsquamsh6777]

Same. Some foo went after me for mounting my dark rock pro 3 with a horizontal airflow pattern. Good luck fitting that vertically, let alone the mounting hardware doesn't even allow for it.

[@leonmozambique533]

Desert eagle ace

[@adamsaint2890]

I have it pointing upwards too, because otherwise my RAM won't fit

[@JoeJacksonJr]

Think this has to do with the direction the air is circulating in the chassis.. This is something you may have to test using a glass side panel case and some smoke to see where the air flow is going..

[@ninjaclan83]

Joe Jackson smoke is horrable on computer components......

[@mediamixer7564]

Jesse Dodge he mean like a fog machine. Of course it would be bad to use actual smoke on a computer. There are fog machine to test the airflow in your PC

[@aarongarza4769]

Team Ninja horrible”

[@ninjaclan83]

Aaron Garza words

[@aarongarza4769]

Team Ninja hahaha.

[@fernandoaugusto3909]

freaking 4:30 minutes to start the video!

[@ResayDota]

Tozixc

[@marlz99]

I use a hyper 212 evo to cool my i5 6600k @4.6ghz and the highest temp I've seen is 57°C

[@Land961]

Marley I bet you didnt use Prime or did you?

[@marlz99]

I did, that's the weird part

[@Land961]

Marley pics or didnt happen. Friend of me is using a 6600k with a beefy Dark Rock Pro 3 as cooler and doesnt even maintain 60 at 4 5 GHz.

[@marlz99]

maybe it's because my room is always 16°C

[@Cnotolamacz]

if your room temp is 16c then why bother buying cooler XD

[@xodius80]

d00d nice video, what camera are you using to record yourself?

[@Maraksot78]

I believe Kyle uses the Panasonic Lumix GH4

[@Bitwit]

correct!

[@DragonKingGaav]

Will you be upgrading to the GH5?

[@williamburgoon1834]

like a 1000$ camera Why I wish

[@DragonKingGaav]

Because the GH5 lets you do 4K at 60 FPS.

[@zues121510]

Linus: the sponsor guy Dimitry: the professional editor Jay: the graphic snob Paul: the budget friendly tech tuber Kyle: the comedian tech tuber

[@Lukiel666]

My thoughts on this are that I have a different case, different fans, different graphics card, different cpu cooler, so I should do my own damn tests if I want relevant results.

[@gattie12ben]

Did you make sure to put the case side panel on when you did these tests?

[@neonlights_12]

He always does for the tests, he leaves them off for the "glamour shots"

[@ArtisChronicles]

Neon_Lights12 the only way to do it imo. makes it look sexy

[@IndrajeetPala]

Maybe since the open shroud GPU has multiple fans resulting in relatively more air circulation and creating a higher positive pressure unlike the blower style GPU... correct me if I am wrong

[@ugotznuked]

Indrajeet Pala air circulation from internal components can't magically pull air in from outside the case and raise the internal pressure.

[@okiwiet]

horizontal mounting uses more fresh air from the front intake, vertical mounting the cooler is sucking the hot air from the gpu in = higher cpu temps with open style gpu cooler...nothing more...thus horizontal mounting the cpu cooler is better if you have an open gpu cooler...

[@2D3RP4U]

But the blower style cooler is designed to pull air out of the case, so there would be less positive pressure.

[@timserious7678]

Walt Findley .... if the case was fully sealed then yes a internal fan inside sealed cabinet will not suck air from outside .... but in a pc cabinet intenal fan can create a positive pressure "i think so" just like if you put two same fans on top of each other the total air moved will be double the air moved by single fan.

[@seba8600]

the components on the vga pcb, they also heat a little, so even with the blower style cooling, some minimal heat disipation will occur in that area

[@N.D.1984]

One thing that everyone underestimates is interaction between heatspreader and heatsink. It's better to have the heatpipes passing perpendicularly on the "die" of the Intel CPUs. In fact in the best conditions (for the CPU) with blower GPU, the temperature is lower, but open GPU has negatively influenced the results. Anyway horizontal+open GPU gives a strange result.

[@Eggsr2bcrushed]

ayy lmao, that's me!

[@maxvandervoorn1089]

Eggsr2bcrushed yes

[@3d755]

That is correct

[@joshoa90210]

I was in there too. Support group?

[@kevinsison-ksproductions4271]

@5:45 Just maybe this will explain scenario 2. CPU cooler blows Left, GPU blows upwards, with case flans blowing left and up. Heat is dissipated more evenly (maybe more efficiently) between the top and left of the case. This differs from option 4. However, this is very similar to option 3. CPU cooler blows upwards, while GPU blows Left. Heat going both directions in options 2 and 3. This is contrasted to option 1 ( Majority of air is dissipated left) and option 4 (majority of air is dissipated upwards) which results in higher CPU temps. An analogy for scenario 2 would be having 2 straws in a beer: If you had to drink the whole beer using straws, then it would be able to get the same amount of liquid out of the can using two straws compared to pushing that same amount of liquid through mostly 1 straw.

[@kevinsison-ksproductions4271]

This is also based on the concept of better cooling with a greater proportion of fresh air vs recycled air (air already cooling one component to cool another component).

[@megadashkitanedawa2776]

*The blower style GPU acts as the 3rd exhaust fan, there will be less air coming through top and back exhaust fan **---**> hotter CPU*

[@anonamouse5917]

When I saw the thumbnail I wondered why Trigglypuff was so upset about CPU cooler mounting. ...and sleeve bearing fans should be mounted vertically (horizontal air flow).

[@thebestweston8307]

I love when Kyle gets all sciencey

[@pierre_lefevre]

I usually like your videos before watching them. Just know that the content will be top notch.

[@Arek_R.]

Seriously? "VR compatible" even on CPU?! >.

[@Arek_R.]

Yeah and say me also that we need VR compatible HD ready RGB tempered side glass panel...

[@DMan-ud6bt]

+Reo! Vendredi Funny/annoying fact. My Intel 3970x from 2012 with my Gigabyte GTX 1080 Xtreme handles everything in VR, even using 2x supersampling via the Oculus debug tool, JUST FINE ....YET the stupid Oculus software has that dumb warning stating my hardware doesn't meet recommended spec that never goes away!

[@Arek_R.]

DMan 9971 I'm sure you can erase that message in registry.

[@ArtisChronicles]

Arek R. Damn right you do! but you're missing one thing. fire to make the CPU go fastet

[@WeaselLevelDesign]

It's a real thing, I even upgraded to Kaby for it. In games with higher CPU requirements (physics, terrain generation, etc) you need to account for the bottleneck. If any component in your PC is causing a lower-than-acceptable framerate, it needs to be changed. (Even the case applies, if airflow is bad you'll need to fix it)

[@TheRandomguy06]

possibly the blower style since it's worse as dispersing heat a good portion of the hot air surrounding the card stuck around, while the open air one was better at getting hot air out and away.

[@HobbsMachtVideos]

Wow reale impressive how close You are to your Community! Big respect!

[@caitlinV3]

Ohhh let me take a stab. The blower gpu is taking air from within the case and pushing the air laterally across the gpu and out the back, so it never hits the cpu cooler. You'd think that's good for avoiding hot air circulating in the case and hitting the cpu cooler, but maybe that's bad for total airflow in the case overall. The less air circulating in the case, the less usable air there is for the cpu cooler. The open air gpu has air all around it, which in turn creates more airflow within the case with the same air. More airflow near the cpu cooler provides more air to cool the cpu. Just a theory.

[@zero0101]

LOL no the case would have to be operating at a negative pressure vacuum in order for that to be the cause. There is no side panel which makes this whole thing pointless anyway. Its likely the cause was either the difference in mounting (remember he's is unmounting and remounting everytime) position, pressure or some other aerodynamic factor.

[@LeagueCritic]

Zero One yep plus the shitty 212 evo is shit, nobody cares about it

[@AdityaSingh97]

I'm gonna like her comment only cause bewbs. 😌

[@Yxnder]

@@AdityaSingh97 wtf is wrong with you?

[@BarryAllen..]

I see people have the cpu fan facing the rear fan, explain that people. 😫

[@NovaTurtlez]

Is it just me or does his mic quality sound a little worse in this video?

[@abutahamid9464]

its you

[@peantud12]

Nova its just you

[@NovaTurtlez]

I have a hyperx cloud 2 and it sounds better on almost any other video.

[@Doctahhh]

He seems to have some bad processing going on compared to normal.

[@WeaselLevelDesign]

It's like, really compressed this timed around.

[@gonzo3915]

The blower style backplate gets hotter than aftermarket.

[@freshevo]

I believe its as simple as just good airflow, because as soon as you turn the cpu cooler towards the gpu and away from the front fans temps rose up, and since in-closed gpus are mainly always more hotter than open gpus the front fans werent really helping the in-closed gpu dissipate its radiating heat , but the open gpu even though its was dissipating warm air in the case the airflow was pushing it out

[@marc4008]

I really like these experiment videos, keep it up

[@chriscallas5680]

I think you changed air flow characteristics by using the lower style fan. The blower style fan would effect the pressure of the case. The blower style has a larger negative pressure zone an then pulls more fresh air away from the CPU cooler? You could check this by using a smoke machine.

[@TruFalco]

I was really tired building my PC and accidentally installed the Cooler facing up and didn't fully realize until I put it in the case. Glad to see it doesn't make too much difference and need to waste the paste to fix it.

[@williamake4783]

Kyle, Blower style cards don't have direct airflow on their backplates, making the surrounding air hotter. With the open shroud design, the cooler had direct airflow access to the backplate allowing the backplate to cool down resulting in cooler temperatures surrounding the tower, and therefore reducing CPU temperatures. Not only that but if you have mismatching fan speeds on the tower and top case fans you may actually blow heat back into that pocket. Also, I believe positive pressure, while being dust friendly, actually helps create small circulating pockets of heat in certain parts of some cases. Here with your choices, the bottom front case fan would feed the blower, and the top two would gravitate more towards the top of the case, NOT towards the backside of the gfx card (the majority of the air would be flowing towards the path of least resistance, and there is less resistance where the exhaust fans are flowing due to less pressure being there). With the open shroud, the gfx fans could push the surrounding air around back of the backplate and disrupt the pocket to allow for better case fan operation. But hey, that's just a theory, a possibly complete BS theory. Thanks for reading. AND if you do happen to read this, Kyle, test the statement, "positive pressure, while being dust friendly, actually helps create small circulating pockets of heat" because the flipside to it is that with negative pressure you have no other choice but to bring in cooler air into the case.

[@EliteWaffle35]

Funny how when he said horizontal the fan was in the vertical Position and vice versa.

[@nwheatcraft]

The answer is buy a FLIR one.

[@daiphelion7002]

I'd actually expect there to be a slight (perhaps not as much as 5 degrees C) difference based on where the exhaust fans are. Having both of them might mean they're pulling the airflow path slightly differently. If that's the situation, then the rear mounted fan may be expelling more GPU heat without it going through the vertically amounted (horizontal air flow path) CPU cooler. You may want to consider adding some more tests to this idea, specifically air flow pathing by way of adjusting the exhausting case fans.

[@Winium]

hypothesis: blower fan reduces pressure that the cooler can generate. open air fan rebounding air actually helps push cool air into the cooler. the reason it doesnt help in the vertical scenario is because the vertical fan takes in the warm air instead of the cool.

[@leekeller935]

Very informative video. Thanks although I could have definitely lived without the after breakfast sound effects.

[@mattfarrar5472]

******[QUESTION] CPU TEMP WITH SAME LENGTH RADIATOR AT DIFFERENT THICKNESS'S******

[@kocaio]

What I believe is happening is that when the CPU cooler is placed so airflow is horizontal it is creating a pressure difference directly above the GPU. The faster moving air made by the CPU fan effectively creates a negative pressure zone above the GPU which sucks in the hot air because there is no barrier between the two. The blower style cooler traps the heat on the GPU which causes the back to be hotter as well. Put those two together and you get a hotter CPU.

[@TheDude50447]

there are a lot of factors that could influence this test. Somebody opened a window or a door which sucked warm air out of the case. The thermal paste was applied differently between the cooler changes. The cpu and gpu always have a margin of error when working which could affect the temperature. Somebody walking by the case could affect the pressure within it. Like I said lots of different factors working together. Such a test has to be run in a closed up room under monitored conditions with different cases, different cpus and gpus to be meaningful.

[@retro1reactive]

Is it me or is the volume lower on this video.

[@josipjosipovic1432]

Uiriamu Busujima i think it is lower,also.

[@ziljin]

I heard Cryorig H7 is a great budget CPU cooler.

[@leonmozambique533]

yes it is

[@Doctahhh]

Better than the 212 for a bit more. The H7 is less available around the world than the 212 though.

[@HappyBeezerStudios]

There are actually alot of great coolers in the same range of the 212 EVO. Starting with the Hyper T4, going over the Hyper 212X, H7, Brocken ECO, Matterhorn Pure Gammaxx S40, and all the way to the Macho 90 and True Spirit 120. The thing ist just, that the 212 EVO has been established as a cooler fitting to all recent sockets,, relatively easy to mount for a tower cooler, and with a good price to peformance ratio. In the end it all depends on availability and space inside the case.

[@justinf1997]

ziljin harder to get your hands on, a couple bucks more pricy, but significantly better. Mounting is easy, it has much better clearance in every way, and it performs a lot better. I've used both and I always advise people to spend the extra $5-10 to get the H7

[@aaronwilliams2417]

ziljin get the h5 i got it and under 55° on i5 6600k at 4.5ghz

[@sinnison23]

One thought as to why the shroud + horizontal was hotter, perhaps is because the video card's radiant heat was rising and directly warming the heat sink. Being that the CPU heat sink fan was directing air horizontally and not drawing air upward directly, less thermal dissipation was occurring in that area resulting in higher temperatures. One thing you can do if you revisit this, is get your hands on a FLIR camera so you can visibly observe any heat pooling.

[@Loc-Nar58]

I know this is four years after the original post, but thank you. It helped me decide which orientation I would use. Also, I just have to ask. "...case closed..." Was the pun intended?

[@TheWildgirl95]

Try mounting the power supply's fan down vs Up !

[@Omiiee]

Alternative results, yo'.

[@ariantaheri4638]

Amun 'Omii' Omar lmao

[@veeveri]

That thumbnail scared me, because my CPU Cooler is just set like that.

[@truegamer_007]

Hot air rises, a vertical config with open gpu pulls air directly into the case. Also, I noticed if the cpu, gpu airflow direction matches, temps are lower. Open gpu has vertical airflow, closed has horizontal.

[@Thrashman138]

I can confirm that moving my h115i water cooler's radiator from the top of my Corsair 750D case to the front dropped my CPU temperatures from a max of 98C on full load using Aida64 to 68C. Absolutely incredible.

[@babylon4953]

What about pulling cold air from the top of the case. And let the cpu cooler blow air down on the gpu?

[@jacekwodecki8248]

I actually use almost that same config right now (with open shroud GPU). I have SilentiumPC Pax M70 case with the config: 2x120 intake fronts, 120+140 intake tops and only one 120 exhaust on the back. It gives me a lot of positive pressure (good dust control) and I achieve the lowest temperatures from amongst any other config (but with horizontal CPU airflow).

[@Roland-Henry]

Heat rises so it may be a wise choice to find a flow with that in mind.

[@grugamerZi]

Hey Kyle, just one note from a *fan* here: *-(jokz)-* *Horizontal Airflow* i guess the first test didn't makes much sense because the 1070 founders edition have a little apperture what blows a bit of hot air in the case (directly inside, and it circulates to CPU since the exahust fans are right in back of him). so with the VGA card with aftermarket cooler the air goes to the sides, so the CPU are taking cold air anyway. *Vertical Airflow* since the fan are taking air from the bottom, the hot air of founders edition do not affect the CPU temps, (because he goes in direction of hard drives and goes up to the exahust fans, do not running thru the CPU) and with aftermarket cooler the CPU are recieving almost in the face the hot air from GPU. so in my opinion you should do a part 2 video, doing the same test with the case *closed* *Keep up yor great work Kyle :D*

[@jesseconnell1422]

It is possible that the blower style GPU was pulling more air than the other fans, creating a bias of more fresh air flowing towards the bottom of the case. You would have to look at the speed of each fan while running the test, take those numbers and figure out what volume of air each is moving at that RPM. Given that we know that those blower style GPUs tend you run up the fan to a pretty high RPM while under heavy load, and assuming that you kept the rest of the case fans at a reasonably low RPM then this might be the cause. Try running the test again with the case fans at their highest RPM. Thank you for continuing to have a great channel!

[@billclinton5556]

kyle do you like the dot or line method for thermal paste

[@Phank]

Now I don't know everything about PC building, or how this heat physics stuff work. But would the Backplate on the Zotac affect the temps? Even by a bit?

[@damo5701]

It's all about airflow. CPU cooler in horizontal position is taking in cooler air as the open air video card is disrupting the cool airflow from the front fans; instead of going under the video card (as it is with blower card) more cool air (from front fans) is travelling over the top of open air video card and through CPU cooler.

[@Dracossaint]

Heat rises, adding the extra airflow from the fans allowed it to circulated more vs the blower fan., hence the increased dispassion from the extra fans allowed the heat to redistribute throughout the case more rather then it being concentrated. Also it has more resistance to suck the hot air out. pushing it out the back,its due to having a exhaust fan in the top of the case really in the end and the heat is less concentrated..

[@christianv32]

Push or Pull?

[@claydog6422]

I blame Obama...Global warming

[@kwedog2373]

I think the horizontal position cpu cooler lowered the temp because the air flow is in a more consistent direction from to the intake fans airflow. Thus creating a more positive air pressure effect.

[@chadscott8284]

The blower fan was catching cool air from the front fans which made the temperature the lowest. The other config had the cpu blower pumping in warm air from the cpu shroud and exhausting warm air, not to mention the case air flow was obstructed by the side of the fan shroud rather than pushing cool air through while immediately exhausting it out the back.

[@docbogus6128]

Just like everybody else in the gaming 'community', you are not taking into account a well-known phenomenon in the field of physics: turbulence. The quantity of pressure, either positive or negative, does not guarantee efficiency. Forget the number of fans. How are they positioned and balanced? How well-directioned and unobstructed is the flow? That's what counts. Sometimes, a small cable with the wrong shape and in the wrong position can have an enormous effect on the flow. You may well have a better flow with 2 or 3 well-positioned fans and clear paths for the flow than with 5 or 6 randomly positioned and unbalanced fans, inside a case with irregular paths for the flow. Even the shape and relative size of the case (to the components) should be taken into account. The very mass of the cooler can be counter-productive, etc. This is not rocket science, but it's also not that easy. It's almost funny how so many gaming people 'in the know' ignore this. Taking turbulence into account can give an enormous boost to any air cooling option, especially when one wants to avoid the hassle of the liquid-cooling gizmos. You could use a heat-sensitive camera to 'see' where the heated flow or flows have bottlenecks and refluxes. A smoke test would also speak volumes: the nasty whirlwinds inside the case would then be visible. Those work like small closed-circuits, where the heat dances and stays.

[@Splatcake]

How much is a heat sensitive camera

[@hashemmi24]

I sensed that the exhaust fans are creating turbulence since they're are negating each other

[@jesusalfonso3726]

you forgot the size of the case, the material of the case, some are made of aluminium others from aleations, the height of the case relative to the ground, the sorrounding enviroment the region where you live, the weather, the quality of the fans the speed of the fans, the form of the fans, bla bla bla, also if a fan is virtual ready or gaming fan, you know its not rocket science

[@Emmyxf]

THIS. I've been banging my head on the table for years, as people came to me with 'overheating with all these fans!?' complaints... Despite their expectations of 'more fans = better cooling' I often got cooler results by removing one or two fans from their '10 fans are better' setup

[@allupro]

Can you test with the CPU cooler horizontal, but in reverse so it draws air from the back of the case?

[@jacekwodecki8248]

@allupro I actually did that config some time ago. I had a terrible case (a little bit old) with very stupid fan placement, so I reversed the air flow in the whole case as you described (with open shroud GPU). With no other changes (only reversing cpu airflow and reversing intake and exhaust case fans) i dropped down about 15 degrees on CPU and about 10 degrees on GPU. Keep in mind that it was unusual situation (stupid case fan placements) so you may not get any positive effect.

[@tjrooger1092]

Have a potential solution for you. Consider total air flow. surface area of 3X120s = 33912 (π•r•r). total surface area of 2x140s = 30722. Then you multiply the area by the speed of the air to get cubic meter per second (or CFM if you want to do the conversion). With the blower style fan, you're exhausting more air out of the case, SO... you could be dipping into a negative pressure, which would mean there isn't enough air for the CPU fan to move across the fins to cool with. By going with the open shroud, you're (in effect) returning the positive pressure which would mean more air across the fins of the cooler.

[@jonathanwessner3456]

The reason is actually more about flow paths. In the horizontal stream, the CPU is pulling the heat up and off the vid, but, not into the cpu cooler. It is channeling it out the back by creating a negative pressure area that sucks the heat out the back. With the enclosed vid card, it is not adding to the "streams" of air in the system the same way (open cards blow air into the card, then around it, so it can slip stream if you have enough pull /push from the front and rear fans) Since the enclosed card is pushing it's heat out the back, you get the radiant heat from the back of the card that eddies and flows boack into the cpu cooler When it is facing the other way, you pull the heated air from the open gpu into the heatsink for the cpu, increasing temps, but, since more of the heat from the closed gpu goes out the back in this configuration(and the cpu fan blows the radiant heat out faster) the enclosed will be cooler. You should have checked GPU temps in both configs too.

[@paulbutcher7006]

It could be that since blower-style coolers are less effective, the gpu was warmer and then the air AROUND the GPU heated as a result. This air then rose up into the cpu cooler, increasing temps. Or it could just be within margin of error. :P

[@paulbutcher7006]

But that doesn't really explain the 2nd test

[@jamesthomson8659]

Kim Jong-Un yes it does. With the vertical blower the heat from the back plate does not get to the cooler fan intake. Real question is what is happening to GPU temperature in the four cases. Case 3 is best for CPU, but Case 2 is probably much better for GPU.

[@shabutir1820]

Blower style coolers are MOST effective. They extract the heat DIRECTLY outside the case. Which keeps the ambient temp inside the case lower, which benefits all devices inside the computer.

[@shantfack]

Wrong! Literally every review of blower style coolers- like Nvidia Founders Edition and AMD Vega models- have proven that those cards run MUCH hotter that AIB cards (even though the fans exhaust into the case). That's why the FE cards are horrible for overclocking without liquid cooling; they get to 85°C in no time and then throttle down performance to keep temps in check. There are tons of examples of this on the internet. It's not even debatable. With a decent case with good airflow, it's not an issue. There's no way a single 80mm (?) blower cooler is keeping up the THREE 100mm fans on my Aorus 1080 Ti.

[@shabutir1820]

shantfack Wrong. Change the fan speed curve and the cards wont even reach 60c under most circumstances. Your personal experience, and poor unexperienced reviews dont equal facts. As I said, the advantage of a blower style cooler is having the heat extracted directly out of the case. Your 3 100mm fans do not do that. They extract the heat into the case. Which in turn, keeps all of the heat inside the case and raises your entire case temps which increases card temps in return. A single blower fan can move around 50 cfm of air, or about the same as your average 120mm case fan

[@LucasDaRonco]

TEST THIS !!!!! RX 480 crossfire 8gb vs GTX 1070 FPS, Frame Times, Microstuttering. Which is more bang for buck? Benefits/cons of crossfire and DX12 performance! Thanks!

[@DerrickRG]

1070. Crossfire/SLI is NOT the way to go.

[@jingyu97]

1070 hands down.

[@jdefen]

A theory about the horizontal air flow with open GPU. You have three front fans pushing air into the case without any drive cages obstructing the flow. Therefore your main air flow in the case is already horizontal. The CPU fan gets all its fresh air directly from the top front fan, pushes it through the fins and the rear fan pulls the air outside. If there is any heat rising up from the GPU, it's basically blown horizontally by the other two front fans and it wouldn't really get in front of the CPU fan to heat up its intake air. Also, the only heat from the GPU that should affect the CPU cooler in that configuration rises up at the very end of the card. And since we know the blower style cards get hotter, that may explain the increased temp for that type of card. The horizontal case flow doesn't help, because only the GPU cooler's ability to move air is relevant here for ejecting heat out of the case. It might be interesting to repeat that test with what I'd consider a more real-life scenario (at least more relevant to me, because I don't want to do without a DVD Drive): Mount a 5.25" drive bay and remove the top front cooler and put another 3.5" drive bay (even empty) in front the bottom front fan. That gives less air flow and the air coming in must rise up to get to the CPU cooler, possibly taking more hot air from the GPU along with it. Or: What happens if you mount the top fan as intake and as far to the front of the case as possible. It would pull in cool air from above the case and blow it right in front of the CPU fan intake (kind of what the PSU does)

[@Vydonis]

In a closed case you have air pocket "voids" best explained by the Truck Bed airflow question, tailgate down or up. Tailgate down causes airflow to drag on the back of the truck, while tailgate up causes an air pocket that circulates opposite like two rolling pins against each other. To be blunt, the size of the video cards cause air flow issues within the case and you need air blowing inward from UNDER the card to cause that air stagnant at the bottom to start flowing upward instead of being chipped away at when heat causes it to rise. A optimal setting would be three intake fans at the bottom on all three sides of the short ends (short ends means thin sides). This causes pressure, hot or not to rise up. This heated air, by the video card will want to expand and cause extra airflow up and out the exhaust ports. The "Stack Effect" of hot air shooting upwards will need VERTICAL exits with no fans in the way so that INTAKE fans above the video card can do their job. A fan will cause the warm air to cool a bit when used as an exhaust port, and will weight back down above the tower setup. You want it to remain hot and hit the ceiling for ROOM airflow, so the similar "truck beds tailgate down" issue doesn't happen near your computer. Please allow 12" between all surfaces and angle the computer 25 degrees from any walls exhaust ports so air flows in a predicted manner away as well.

[@DmkaOz]

Hint: measure the temp of the back of the GPU.

[@TechDeals]

Random thought... Anyone who has a $400 GPU, a $200 motherboard, and a $350 CPU who wants to use a $30 CPU cooler needs to reexamine their PC part choices... Nice idea for a test, but not very real world in my opinion, try this again with a NH-D15 or other high end air cooler... Or... you know, just liquid cool it and be done with it. :)

[@WyattZirb]

Is there something wrong with that cooler?

[@juwuu]

Cooper Zirbel nothing wrong with the cooler, but it's just highly unbalanced for the build. More power = more heat, and cheaping out on the cooling makes no sense

[@ZxChrono]

You couldn’t be more wrong there because its very real world. You don’t need anything more than a H212 when it comes to air cooling because the next thing you should be looking at is an AIO cooler. Just like a stock cpu doesn’t need more than its factory cooler but people still buy aftermarket air coolers for them lol. Back when the 4790k was still new, the rig I built was at these similar price points and it has been running @4.8ghz with a hyper 212 and its still going strong. The temps stay in the high 60’s currently even with this heat wave. Sure I *could* have gone with an AIO and most likely clocked over 5ghz but I saw no point the rig was plenty fast and still handles everything I throw at it with no thermal issues. Just because you like to throw in an expensive cooler on every rig you make doesn’t mean it needs it lol.

[@yashwinning]

I have a core i5 6600k OC'ed at 4.6ghz super stable on a hyper 212 turbo that stays around 55c even on full load. People have time and again talked about their core i7 overclocking like a beast and achieving stable core clocks on a Hyper 212 and never needing anything more. So please, explain to me again how one would have to reexamine their PC part choices if they use a $30 cooler on a $350 CPU?

[@factsoverfeelings1776]

Wrong! Hyper 212 is a very capable cooler

[@jberry1979]

Blower style card is creating an airflow dead zone and trapping heat between the the cpu cooler and the gpu. With vertical orientation of the CPU cooler eliminates the dead zone...you could probably illustrate it with some smoke

[@cherryy199]

For the first test, as there are 3 intake fans and 2 exhaust, blower card reduces amount of air pulled through those 2 exhaust fans, therefore less is being pushed through the horizontally opposed CPU cooler.

[@edvardsmekss5224]

Test how much coke you can snort verticaly and horizontali, and using metal and copper snorting tube. Compare the results

[@skyhop]

Makes perfect sense to me. The blower card is changing the air flow path in the case and robbing the CPU cooler of clean cool air, where as the open air card isn't disrupting airflow in the case and is allowing the CPU cooler to get clean cool air.

[@theMrFouldsy]

>How consistent is the CPU load profile of the benchmark between runs? >What's GPU load like? >Side panel on/off? >Are the fans PWM controlled by temps? or are they running at fixed speeds? >Are you using the same thermal compound applied in the same way? >Are you reusing thermal compound? >How many runs did you do for each config? >What is the uncertainty in the temperature that the CPU reports? >Are the GPUs running at the same voltages and clockspeeds? On the assumption that your methods are sound, a possible explanation could be that the extra airflow over the heatsink caused by the open GPU is dominant over the slight air temperature increase. Although that would indicate a significant airflow bottleneck and that doesn't look to be the case.

[@chrnnk]

Man this was a great GREAT video, this is what i want to see in videos. PLEASE DO MORE, DO A MILLION MORE

[@Cypeq]

More effient cooling drops temps in entire case, because heated air can leave quickly and doesn't heat up as much. This is why blower, which heats up much more leads to worse thermals overall. Doesn't matter that it throws air outside. It still radiates more heat into insides through it's body.

[@SHiFTDI3S3L]

Try it with negative pressure only, meaning only fans blowing outward. Two up top, and one in the back. That's what I still run, as I never changed anything since I bought my case. Also make sure your room is closed. Sure your house might be temperature controlled, but different areas of the house are still relatively warmer or cooler depending on what's in them.

[@matthewmathis2412]

best assumption.... the low ambient temp, combined with the decent amount of positive pressure, kept everything generally cooler because u had much cooler air inhabiting the case... which means that the open air cooler was able to efficiently cool the gpu while keeping the air around it at a much cooler temp.... basically kept all the incoming cool air circulated...

[@arantisdavis1623]

My theory is that the blower style cooler retained the heat, and RADIATED that heat to the cpu, whereas when you used an open one, the intake fans cooled the air before it was put through the cpu heat sink. As for the second one, it might be because the "layering" of the GPU and CPU cooler formed a pocket of air that was able to be circulated well, when introducing the open GPU, everything got turbulent and the CPU cooler was starved of cool air. It's a theory, do a smoke test and look at the airflow, could be a cool follow up.

[@ChaironDeCeleste]

That is science like it should be more often again: "I can't explain the results and want to find out what happened!" We all wouldn't still be here on this planet without this

[@tenminutetech8239]

When it was horizontal it was pulling all the fresh air from the front of the case, that's why it was cooler. Vertical only had 1 to pull from and it was moving against it with flow.

[@Nolonar]

I think Horizontal + Blower is an anomaly. Blower style GPUs can't affect the CPU temps, since they blow the hot air out of the case. Maybe it was an issue with seating or thermal paste. The rest of the results make sense. Horizontal + Open: The CPU fan draws cool air from the front. Most of the hot air coming from the GPU is pulled by the rear fan and pushed by the CPU fan away from the radiator. Very little hot air will get to the front of the CPU fan and get dragged through the radiator. And since the CPU fan is closer to the radiator than the top fan, it exerts more pressure, so the hot air can't go through the radiator vertically. Vertical + Open: The CPU fan draws most of the hot air coming from the GPU. Some of it gets pulled by the rear and top fan instead. The majority of the cool air (which didn't go through the GPU), goes straight out of the case, pushed by the CPU fan and pulled by the top fan. Hot air obviously doesn't cool as well as cool air. Vertical + Blower: The CPU fan draws air from the bottom. While the GPU blows hot air out of the case, its back plate is most likely quite hot as well, so it slowly warms up the air that comes in contact with it. That air gets pulled through the CPU radiator. It's still much cooler than the air coming from open GPUs, so it performs much better than Vertical + Open. Horizontal + Blower: This should perform the best, since there is absolutely no hot air from the GPU interfering with the CPU cooling. The very little not-so-cool air coming from the back of the GPU is pulled by the rear fan instead.

[@synfirefly]

It all has to do with air turbulence when changing video cards. It can change the direction of the cool air flowing through the case. Remember that air does not flow straight from the entry point to the exit. Its air displacement and the slightest turbulence can affect that.

[@francisplante4379]

so nobody said anything about it,i think you got higher temp on the cpu cuz the backplate was releasing heat right on the heatsink,while the other gpu back plate would not get as hot and increase airflow and in the second test the result were different cus the cpu cooler was cooling the backplate of the blower gpu(that was heating up the cpu in the first test)

[@mikelikeike100]

Because the founders edition is a closed blower gpu then possibly the hot air being pushed through the enclosure to the end increases the overall temp of the backplate. The open blower gpu is taking heat from all over the gpu and sending it to the whole system, not just predominantly the backplate. The horizontal heatsink being closer to the backplate could explain the higher temp for the closed blower as its backplate is probably a bit hotter than the open blower.

[@seba8600]

i think the air flow from the frontal fans is pushing more air faster than the CPU cooler can absorb, like if the evo 212 where taking the cooler air thats coming from the front while the air from the unrefrigerated backplate is being push back and up by the air coming from the front and out by the fan in the back, also the third party vga could be running cooler so there is less heat coming out from it

[@thematrixian8710]

A few things that are missing and would help to find out the reason behind the odd temperature changes: - What were the GPU temps in all 4 tests? - The open fan design could actually be keeping the GPU's PCB cooler since the heat is better exhausted out of the GPU and since there is enough airflow in the case, the case temperatures might not be affecting the CPU temps.

[@subytech85]

did not read through the comments but if that case has a clear side panel install it and run the system with smoke flowing through. you may be able to see the air flow and how each card and positioning of the CPU cooler affects the overall flow. it is possible that there are different pressures based on which way the fans are blowing.

[@darreng8583]

I know this is a year old but when you have 3 intake fans blowing in and you face the CPU in the same direction this helps the air continue out the back and keeps the air going in one direction from front intake to rear output . If you mount the CPU fan vertically blowing up , it works against the 3 fans blowing in horizontally therefore lowering the cooling effect. 08-11-2018

[@HYDRAdude]

The cool air from the front intake is being dragged across the fins by the rear exhaust fan, where as when the HSF is oriented to the front, the normal way, the front fan really isn't doing that much. It's like you have fans on all four faces of the heatsink instead of just the normal two. Turn the fans on the front off and you will see.

[@NickMatz]

I believe that when the CPU Cooler is mounted vertically, you should use ONLY the upper mounted fan and when it's mounted horizontally you should only use the fan in the back. That way the stream of air doesn't split in two directions.