This One Mistake will Cost you the IFR Flight Test!

[@Tracomaster]

Love this! Between all the weird things you see and do, the "this is my learning experience" is and has always been the core of flight chops

[@FlightChops]

Appreciated 👊 - It's been rewarding, if not humbling to share this stuff 👍

[@sledawgpilot]

@@FlightChopsI learned G3000 in a sim, without ever having flown anything more sophisticated than a GNS530, at 11:30 pm to 2 in the morning, in a new airplane. Every night of sim I became more fatigued. I Took a second try too. You could have done this no problem with familiar avionics.

[@zsoltsz2323]

He immediately went "I don't like that", disconnected AP, and stayed safe. Too many would have spiraled into the ground, fiddeling the dials. Good job.

[@FlightChops]

👊👍

[@taytayflyfly7291]

I absolutely agree it was the best course of action, but every time that happens to students I give them this. Now you are immensely increasing your workload by hand-flying, possibly in IMC, with an incorrectly set up flight plan. So I just caution this approach.

[@FlightChops]

@@taytayflyfly7291ideally I should have just dropped a level of automation and put it back into heading mode while I figured it out.

[@Pilotwisco]

These "rough" lessons that you post are of the most value to the viewer. Also props to Luke from another CFII for just letting you work through it and keeping quiet. Sometimes that's difficult, especially in actual IMC. No safety of flight issues, so he just let you work the problem. Good reminders for students and CFII's alike.

[@FlightChops]

Yup 👍😂

[@jimallen8186]

I prefer to do that sort of thing VFR as you can get violated as the CFII while allowing the student to struggle. Flying actual is good experience though I like to either help in an apprentice style or reserve it for later in training.

[@Pilotwisco]

@@jimallen8186 yes, definitely there is a line that the CFII has to not let the student cross and every instructor has their own comfort level. I think Luke did a great job on that this flight, as too did Chops for clicking off the AP when it did something unexpected to him. Fly safe!

[@IcthioVelocipede]

One thing I liked is when the autopilot didn't do what you expected, you noticed and clicked it off. There are countless accidents (with videos about them on KZbin) where even pilots with ATP ratings either didn't catch the issue at all or tried to fix it by messing around with the autopilot instead of flying the plane.

[@fernand3s]

That was a highlight for sure!

[@kohersh]

That’s interesting. During my CFI check Ride the GC 500 did not start down on the glide path when it should have. I clicked it off when it was a half deflection above and the examiner jump down my throat about giving it time. In the real world I would’ve given a time but here I wanted the guy to know that I was on top of it. Sometimes you just can’t win.

[@kristensorensen2219]

Examiners should not jump on anyone!​@@kohersh

[@Juhujalp]

I think you just perfectly illustrated why type ratings and checkouts in airplanes exist. A pilots capability does not fully transfer over to different avionics or aircraft. I've been there pressing the wrong button and thinking the button was broken when I was the one who made the mistake. Great learnings as always. I am following you since I was young and have in the meantime gotten my license and tailwheel endorsment. Thank you for the great content over the years and challenging me to keep learning.

[@FlightChops]

Thanks for sticking around for so long! And congrats on the tailwheel sign off!

[@haxi52]

Posting all your mistakes out into the world for everyone to see takes a lot of guts. I really appreciate you giving us this opportunity to learn from your mistakes!

[@FlightChops]

Happy to share!

[@clarencewiles963]

You were not ready to use the equipment for a test but you were ready for training. It’s why you have someone in the right seat who is qualified. But you learn from doing and by your mistakes. Those make the best lesson.

[@BouillaBased]

"...worth sharing my pain." That's what makes the aviation community, and specifically the KZbin aviation community, so great. Whether it's get-there-itis, accidentally going into weather, or any other common hazard, there's no embarrassment in sharing experiences, to help keep other pilots safe.

[@GlenAndFriendsCooking]

So many different flight instruments - the round 'dumb' IFR steam gauges pretty much all worked the same, and displayed info in the same manner. But now you slip into a cockpit and you see so many different ways to display the info as well as a multitude of different ways to access menus or input your info.

[@FlightChops]

Yup. I considered it a whole new rating when I transitioned to the glass in the RV-14

[@calvinnickel9995]

Except not. Steam gauges you could have a WWII surplus attitude indicator with the black line through it or a fancy one with a flight director and a rising runway. Heck it even wraps around.. first glass plane I flew my instructor cautioned me that it has a “sky pointer” where the arrow at the top always points to the sky and the bank angle scale stays the same. Well my WWII surplus’ attitude indicator had the same thing.. because there was no blue for sky.

[@08turboSS]

Steam guage is the way to learn then transition to glass. Most planes for rental are steam too.

[@jujuthehoms5482]

Don’t beat yourself up too hard. I just passed my group 1 with Harv recently and your videos helped me a lot! It’s always good to see you recognizing your mistakes, it’s the best way to learn after all. Luke himself told me that “You can’t make every mistake, so learn from others failures”.

[@FlightChops]

Congrats! and thanks.

[@userSchlonsch]

I just did my MEP IR and CPL in a DA42 two months ago and this whole experience (especially the CDI button) was so relatable. Thank you for sharing and letting us learn from your mistakes as well. As I‘ve been going through my training from first flight to ready for ATPL over the last 1.5 years I‘ve been going back through your catalog of videos and they‘ve been a lot of help, motivation and entertainment. Wishing our all the best from Switzerland

[@FlightChops]

I really appreciate this feedback, it’s rewarding to hear you find this stuff relatable - and congrats on your achievements!

[@MickeLang]

We all learn from mistakes☝🏼But the fact, that you show your mistakes, should be the biggest learning moment for some youtube pilots out there! Love it Steve👊🏼👊🏼

[@DrJD123]

Everyones already said it but, videos like this a going to save peoples lives and produce better pilots. Great stuff.

[@LarGo-tn5ej]

Sitting here watching a - by now seasoned - trained pilot sharing the challenges and learning opportunities honestly and openly is humbling and motivating at the same time. The latter because at one point in time, you were at the same point in your training I am at right now - a PPL trainee figuring out the most basic things. Although "multi engine IFR" seems REALLY far away at the moment. Thanks for sharing those teachable moments.

[@FlightChops]

👊

[@tk27a]

I am suffering in my couch at home just watching but I will never forget it. Thank you for your honesty

[@davidcope51]

To me, this opens up a whole conversation around human factors and electronic instruments. Different UI's, different menu systems require separate muscle memory for each glass cockpit as you eluded to this in your video. Instead of automating your workload, or at least organising it, the distraction for you was enough to introduce problems. There is a reason the analogue "steam" gauges work - standards. If all glass cockpit UIs had a standard UI mode across all manufactures (standard terminology, menu navigation, graphics etc) then I wonder if this would help. Sure, the individual system's bells and whistles UI could be switched into - after all the manufactures are using software features to differentiate themselves, but IMHO I don't want corporate individuality when the pressure is on. I would want my EFMS skills to be transferable in the first instance.

[@KCLIBURN-mj9qx]

Thanks for your aviation videos and sharing the experience of learning new systems sometimes even getting humbled! There is no doubt a pilot has to be in their "A" game mode while flying and staying ahead of situational awareness. It seems SO easy to get lost and highlights to me just how involved doing it right is all about. Moreover, your humility and just being a super nice guy really are worth complimenting and appreciating.

[@erikpetersen3812]

Thank you for sharing your experience. I do have a 430W in our 172 and midway through the IFR add-on. You may have saved me $$$

[@FlightChops]

That's my goal! 👊

[@denniswagner3962]

I 100% know how you were feeling the whole time. Thanks for sharing.

[@FlightChops]

😂😅🤓🫠😬🤔🤷🤯🤡

[@vdubs1112]

As a relatively low time CFII, it was great to watch Luke work here. It would be all too easy to correct the error right away, but instead he let you "drown" a little bit and experience the stress of getting way behind the airplane. And as a result you'll probably never forget to hit that button again, where an immediate "hey check your nav source" would probably not have had nearly as much impact. Thanks for sharing Steve.

[@FlightChops]

👍

[@zoe..d]

I think this is excellent validation of the design and testing for avionics. Your ingrained experience and workflows with touchscreens and helpful / predictive sequencing is clearly intuitive. Going back to knobs and menus, this would be akin to going from windows 10 to Win 3.1. No wonder it was a struggle. Kudos for perseverance in tough conditions!

[@FlightChops]

Great point!

[@thedownwardmachine]

Great to see a video of things going wrong and providing a learning opportunity. It would be so easy to edit that out. But seeing videos of perfect progression just discourages the rest of us out there, leaving us thinking we're just not cut out for it. Thanks for giving us a reason to keep going 🙏

[@johneveridge3714]

Great honesty. Its not weakness. Its strength of character. Rare these days. Cheap lesson. You and your soul are worth much more.

[@superpilotish]

Not a big deal. I failed my initial Multi-IFR ride. Was a disaster! Years later I was sitting in the right seat as an Examiner. Still, those flights where everything goes wrong are brutal, but ya learn! Great vid, Steve!👍

[@stephenburch7410]

Thanks for posting this kind of video, hard to watch because i feel your pain in difficult/stressful situations like that but i learn the most from these videos. Hopefully if I end up in a similar situation this will still be floating in the back of my mind of what to look for.

[@FlightChops]

I appreciate that, and glad to share!

[@CryticalAce]

Have loved your content for years mate! Everyday we learn and improve, even when we stumble its all progress! Safe flying mate!

[@chadpm11]

Your instructor is awesome, he really put you to the test, my last instructor wouldn't let me have time to look things over and try to figure out. He would correct what i was doing without saying much, Would love to find one like him around here.

[@FlightChops]

Yes, Luke is awesome.

[@uss_liberty_incident]

Thanks for being a big enough man to share your humbling moments with others so we can all learn. This was very informative!

[@stevenwolfe2279]

This sounds a lot like the RJ that I fly at work. It has green needles for the localizer/glide slope and VOR. To navigate on FMS (basically area navigation and GPS approaches) we need to switch to white needles. It can get really busy during a missed approach. It looks like your RV-14 has some sweet avionics that do a lot of that the work for you. On an unrelated topic, I guess that you can appreciate the value of two pilots in airline operations. It’s always easier to monitor how someone is doing verses actually doing it yourself. I have been helped, and helped out multiple times in the cockpit. Thanks for sharing. It helps everyone understand the pitfalls that anyone can fall into. It takes a big man in charge of his ego to do that. You are very humble and professional.

[@markserbu]

Happens to all of us! Mistakes are great learning tools...thanks for sharing yours!

[@bigironbois]

Getting one of those RealSimGear G1000s for my home sim has done wonders for muscle memory and familiarization to cut down on time trying to learn while in the air. Great video as always!

[@FlightChops]

Yes that’s great equipment and I do have some experience playing with it but I have found the software between Microsoft and XPlane still has enough little bugs that it isn’t 100% accurate so I was hesitant to really work on proper IFR workflow training with it.

[@bigironbois]

@@FlightChops Very true. There are some full pages missing in all versions i've tried, even addons. Mostly I use it to get quicker at those dang knobs when entering the FPL lol

[@HeliBoyVR]

MSFS has planes with G1000s in them and all the buttons and functionality work.... make a bunch of cards with random ATC commands/problems in them and pick them out of a hat every few minutes. I bet you would get very fast at navigating the menus....

[@brendanmcdonald306]

I'm not a pilot, just an av geek who loves to learn. I really appreciate your attitude and willingness to share what you've learned from your mistakes. Great work, fly safe!

[@barnstormingbandit2611]

Just passed my MEIR in the P2006T, one thing I would suggest to anyone doing their MEIR training is try to find a like for like version of the aircraft that you'll take the test in and fly it in the flight sims, also get very used to jeppeson plates or whatever plates your schools prefers as well as understanding planning minima and emergency drills.

[@GeorgesAdventure-LetsGO]

Great share! The green to magenta is a check in doing my IFR work. For me, being a safety pilot with others help keep the "chops" focused and up to date on IFR procedures. Of course flying a FMS you're not used to is both challenging and frustrating.

[@FlightChops]

At the time this was really demoralizing, but the experience was so visceral that I'm certain I won't make this mistake again.

[@mikecrowley4275]

This is what made your channel, thanks for sharing your painful but valuable flight lessons! Thanks again!

[@FlightChops]

My pleasure! Glad you enjoy this stuff.

[@swiftadventurer]

crazy... back in the analog days we used to get into any aircraft on the flightline, ones we hadn't even flown before, and we'd be quite comfortable knowing where things are and what things did, just by spending 5 minutes doing a familiarization exercise. NOW however, with the diversity of panels and electronics installed in this era, every aircraft is like a new girlfriend... requiring LOTS of training and familiarization. 🙃

[@mindinversions4487]

when I worked as a field service engineer, I was "upgraded" to a mercedes somethign or other at the rental agency. It supported Car Play, but some genius decided no touch: there's a dial you have to use. I admire your discipline sir, I almost shoved my fist through the dash that day. [fortunately the plastic held... my hand hurt for a few days]

[@philsal17]

Thanks so much for sharing. I learned so much more by watching the mistakes.

[@CirrusSR20Pilot]

Teachable moment....this could have happened to any of us! Do not feel bad. Thank you for sharing!! We all learn from each other's mistakes.

[@TIO540S1]

Wow! That was one of the most motivational videos I've seen. It's got me questioning my own proficiency in a major way. Time for some serious flight instruction! I fly a C441 and train in sims twice per year, and yet no sim has the panel I have. They're either steam gauges (SimCom) or G1000 and the like. I have an Avidyne panel. I'm absolutely positive that a CFII (or ATC if my luck was bad) could put me in a situation where I'd be as baffled as you were. Thanks very much for this post.

[@FlightChops]

This was a tough one to publish - Glad you found it helpful - I really appreciate this feedback!

[@LisaStJean-zy3jt]

Steve I did the same on my IPC, seems dumb and obvious but in a moment of an exam and stressed it happens. Great lesson learned.

[@FlightChops]

Thanks for sharing that it happened to you too.

[@connorgrimmer2196]

Great video showing the reality of training some times. On the G1000 I find it easier to use the PFD to put in my flight plan, I find it less complicated, and more intuitive, especially when I’m in the left seat! Try it and see if it works better for you!

[@FlightChops]

Thanks yeah - I thought there were some limitations to editing flight plans on the PFD, but for sure yeah it is super awkward to reach across to the MFD.

[@AlphaKilo.Warrior]

I told myself I would go for my IFR when I buy my 1st airplane. Looking forward to watching more of this content. Thanks for being real brother !

[@FlightChops]

Glad it was helpful!

[@francisdrelling4060]

Great candor. Shows professionalism.

[@ridingwithbaz2736]

I'm just a flight simulator pilot for now with well over 5000 hours or more, I mostly fly twin engine turbine and piston "study level" aircraft, mostly with the G1000, 430, gtn750, in full VR. flying with full blown imc weather is probably one of my favorite things to do, it is incredibly challenging, especially in an old DC-6 with only a 430 and analog gauges. I loved watching you do this real life scenario, I couldn't help but notice you were in "NAV" mode not "GPS" mode after the ILS approach. this is something I think sim pilots and real pilots will only do once, because the realization of the problem and how quickly it can all go wrong leaves a lasting impression. I personally believe whole heartedly that simulator flying be it xplane or flight simulator, is an incredibly useful tool that ever single pilot should own and use religiously during training, specifically, IMC Navigation training, using things like VATSIM to gain confidence on the radio, using study level aircraft that have built in failures, all of that used properly will save you thousands of dollars and when you finally do get seat time you have a good basic knowledge, of how systems work, how the work flow of the glass cockpit works and so on.

[@RdClZn]

I'm getting back on civil aircraft simulators after a long time not flying (used to do IL-2 and DCS a lot). What are the best resources for studying for procedures in high fidelity aircraft? I really don't know where to start studying from in order to get the full picture necessary for IFR in a VATSIM environment

[@wayne9638]

great work that is indeed a high workload if your not current with the G1000, I know only too well that feeling of frustration when your behind in your tasks,well done

[@goatflieg]

Yep... learning can be painful, any number of ways. Watching my own flight videos has put me in the same frame of mind, often... but the learning was valuable so I'm still ultimately grateful when it happens.

[@FlightChops]

Totally!

[@alanluscombe8a553]

You are the only KZbinr I’ve followed for years and years. Your videos are great. One day you should do more with Elliot seguin that guy is incredible

[@FlightChops]

I really appreciate that - and thanks for sticking around so long!

[@ivorevans1795]

Can’t over estimate how valuable this is for us aspiring ifr pilots! Thank you so much for sharing as not many do!

[@FlightChops]

Happy to share, and I'm glad you find it helpful! 👊

[@Jonnydeerhunter]

The most interesting thing to me in this video... 3:05 A piper warrior with a constant speed prop. Thats really cool.

[@FlightChops]

Haha - if that's THE most interesting thing is this one, then I'm sad 😂 But yes, that plane was modified and it was a great trainer for many of us to get access to the blue knob for the first time.

[@Jonnydeerhunter]

@@FlightChops The Warrior was definitely up there but a reminder to fully understand your systems, even with a high workload, is very important as well! Thanks for Sharing!

[@niklaspilot]

One thing I have learned flying the XLS+ and now transitioning to the much bigger A220 is that, while it's not necessarily wrong to disconnect the AP when it's doing something it's not supposed to, it is a much better course of action to revert from the highest level of automation (in this case NAV mode) to a lower, more basic level, i.e HDG mode. You *know* the aircraft was flying fine in HDG mode so you can safely revert to that. This way, you're not increasing your workload all the way to manually flying but instead keep the workload more manageable.

[@FlightChops]

Excellent insight here! And this is another reason to always have the heading bug some where useful (the airplane I did my initial instrument rating in didn’t have an AP, and had no heading or altitude bugs, so learning to use them later was an extra curricular activity for me 😂

[@niklaspilot]

@@FlightChops Definitely! I always try to have all needles somewhere useful. I am lucky enough to have a "HDG AUTO" mode on my HDG bug... 😅

[@calvinnickel9995]

I actually wonder why more operators and flight schools don’t teach levels of automation (I got it from FlightSafety.. but others embody it). Like Level 4 is fully coupled to LNAV and VNAV.. Level 3 is things like Heading and Flightlevel Change or Vertical Speed. But.. those lower levels of automation need expose as well. Like heading mode.. lots of new pilots don’t know how much to adjust a heading for an intercept or to avoid a buildup visually. The MFD helps.. but everyone should know what a five or ten degree heading change looks like out the window. Same with Vertical Speed. Choosing a correct vertical speed for either an appropriate Flight Path Angle (if you can’t select it directly) or one to intercept a VNAV Path or Glideslope/Glidepath. Flightlevel Change (which even exists on the humble G1000) is a very complex mode but if you understand it you can use it to your advantage. It’s a “climb (or descend if you’re careful or need to get down in a hurry) at a certain speed mode… but it prioritizes a bunch of things. First, it’s a gentle mode. It’s called FLC because it’s designed to keep drink service going. If you need to expedite a climb or descent: FLC is a poor mode. Second, it never moves further away from a selected altitude. Even if you dial in a huge speed that the plane would have to dive to get.. it won’t it the altitude selector is above it. Because of this.. you can use FLC to “pause” a climb by dialing a fast speed rather than hitting Altitude Hold. Then just dial the speed back when you want to climb again. Third, it does prioritize speed before altitude. It will accelerate to the speed you select before climbing. Finally.. it heads at selected speed towards selected altitude. Most people don’t know this.. and even in a lower automation mode will still struggle.

[@niklaspilot]

@@calvinnickel9995 this is an excellent summary!! And should be taught exactly like this to all pilots that have access to an autopilot!

[@calvinnickel9995]

@@niklaspilot And just to clarify because I think I contradicted myself. FLC is very slow to START climbing or descending because of the G limitation.. but once it does... there is no limit. It will peg the VSI in either direction if you had a high airspeed that it converts to altitude while climbing, or if you select a high speed and go to idle when descending.. FLC on an unrestricted STAR where you expect a short base to final is really fun at 3000+ FPM.

[@karaayers2867]

It's good to see the mistakes. I have no qualms telling people I failed my first PPL checkride because I pulled up the g3x screen where the timer is before my takeoff for my navigation/pilotage when we were at the hold short line. I briefed the DPE, waited for approaching traffic to clear and we departed. It wasn't until I pulled out my flight plan I realized the screen times out on the g3x and returns to the PFD. So I just kind of froze up. Passed everything else, just had to do a 15 minute retest the next week. Simple mistakes are the ones you remember vividly and don't repeat.

[@khanaviation7202]

I remember having a very similar issue during my Multi IFR flight test. But thankfully I realized my mistake before the examiner caught on.

[@FlightChops]

Well done!

[@MayhemCanuck]

Always learning, that's whats important.

[@DavesHangar1958]

I'll be honest with you, I've only a PPL. I've had maybe 60 hrs of IFR home SIM time. Some under the direction of a King Air 200 pilot who is also CFI II. Not in a real airplane. I didn't catch the problem with the CDI earlier. I did notice that we were off course but wasn't sure why. I have several times experienced the plane turning in the wrong direction not knowing what the problem was and then like him cut the AP. Very puzzling challenge until you learn this lesson. Slap me in the face...LOL. Even in a SIM, there's alot going on in single pilot IFR. Can't wait to one day try this in a real plane with a CFI. Very exciting stuff! We're always learning.

[@dzurisintube]

It's as simple as being unprepared. It's the equivalent of trying to run a marathon at altitude when you've not left the couch in months. While I know you think that it's the "outdated" G1000 but I feel like that's just rationalizing being unfamiliar with a different avionics system and aircraft. Can't wait to see the comeback tour! Thanks as always for sharing your experience and letting us all learn such valuable lessons.

[@FlightChops]

For sure yes. I tried to make it clear in this video that that’s ultimately what happened - I just really didn’t understand how unprepared I was. So, it was a great lesson to remind myself to take it seriously if I jump into something else with significantly different avionics, I have to make sure my work flow is standardized enough to switch over.

[@briangilchrist3910]

This is a pretty timely video. I’m finishing up my SIFR with Harv’s in CYAV. My CDI problem isn’t forgetting to switch from CDI to GPS, but moving the CDI needle on the HSI as I am heading to the hold.Whoops! Won’t make that mistake again!

[@Mahgar]

Loved this video! Thank you for posting it. It always reminds how important is to fly with low ego and look for improvement 👍👍👍

[@skyepilotte11]

Thx Steve for posting the pain in IFR procedures with an unfamiliar panel. You hung in...

[@akarandompilot]

I’ll always say this this instrument students…learn in a 6-pack, you can always go up from there but the 6 offers so much better raw data. Also useful when your G1000 or G3000 goes offline

[@Dr_Kenneth_Noisewater]

“Yyyyyyyep.” ooof. been there, have that scar. 😂 Same button got me too…before the check ride thankfully. I will say this video reminds me of exactly why i chose to drop $26k in 2015 dollars (iirc) on a GTN 750 and GPSS coupling switching from a legacy knobber. I hated the knobber! They released custom holds programming for the GTN sometime after i got it and i’m telling you i never feared random holds again. The GTN is a safety multiplier imho and that was in a steam gauge panel too.

[@FlightChops]

I love my GTN 750!

[@jeffhiner]

@@FlightChops Me too! I have a GTN 750 and a G5 pair (attitude+HSI) with the remaining 4 steam gauges as backups. No problems with random hold entries, auto-sequencing of missed approaches (into the correct mode), and great situational awareness of both the planned and as-executed flight route. Even without an autopilot it's relatively straightforward to stay ahead of the airplane. The local flight school's sim has a 430W and I hate it. Same problems: entering waypoints is an absolute chore, and if you turn the inner instead of the outer (or is it the other way around?) it forgets everything.

[@gogilgau]

Thanks for being so humble to show your mistakes because we ALL make them but very, very, very few pilots with videos online will keep that in the final edit, let alone publish it. Being up for my first IPC since my IFR, I will take your lessons and add them to my watch list. Thanks for this video. P.S. was neat to say hi to you and luke over the air while we were both flying when you were out in MB.

[@FlightChops]

I appreciate that!

[@ianriley9031]

Here's the flow I do for setup of automation on each approach: Activate....Activate the approach in the GPS Flip............Flip the CDI to the appropriate NAV source (what you missed) Flop...........Flop the NAV frequencies to the correct active frequency Set.............Set the final approach course ID...............ID the NAVAID Arm...........Arm the autopilot in approach mode This sets up the barebones basics in almost any airplane I've flown. Everything from an ILS on an old king HSI to an RNAV(GPS) approach on a 430W to a RNAV(GPS) approach on a G1000.

[@FlightChops]

Thanks for sharing! I’m definitely adjusting my approach briefing checklist to apply some of this sort of standardization, even though I don’t necessarily need to do all of these steps in my specific set up.

[@nealhere]

Yep this is a great lesson. Wish there was a a nemonic to use at the right point. Final approach fix, missed approach . etc. like 5 T's , or Gumps.

[@GreatLakesAviator]

Yep, did that too. Flashbacks to some of the not so enjoyable IFR lessons.

[@FlightChops]

Yeah, it is not surprising that this is a common mistake.

[@bmingo2828]

Luke: “I’m enjoying my Netflix.” Steve: “Why?! This seems like a pretty good show!”💀 LOL! 😂

[@FlightChops]

I had to laugh at myself 😂

[@baloobear70]

Dart Wader: Luke, I'm your father. ..

[@jeffreyhughes7107]

@@FlightChops That was the best line ever to break the ice and it felt frigid in the right seat. I understand the best way to "learn someone" is to let them flounder A LITTLE BIT; but geesh, letting someone just suffer like that is not helpful either. Thank you for your humility. All my instruments are circa 1978 with no GPS - I'm not a luddite either, just too poor to drop $30k. I'd be right there with you.

[@PilotlifePOV]

Remember green is ground based (localizer/ILS) and Magenta is space based (GPS approach/GPS navigation); per the AIM you are allowed to GPS to waypoints like the IAF and just make sure prior to the Final Approach Fix; that CDI changes from magenta to green (localizer) if you're doing an ILS. If it doesn't just hit default Nav then CDI. Also verify you're on the right frequency on your NAV frequencies, and ensure the proper approach is loaded on your procedures button with the right airport.

[@I_Evo]

The G1000 came out when most of us were still familiar with using the T9 text entry system on our cell/mobile phones, a lost art for many and it must be even harder for young people who've only ever used touchscreen virtual keyboards.

[@a320nick]

What a cool Chief!!

[@kennethjohnson4280]

Watching you struggle with the avionics and completely loose your situational awareness made me realize what was likely going on in the cockpit of so many incident aircraft. You had Luke there to back you up while you struggled but now I can see why so many low IFR hour pilots get into bad situations trying to make the autopilot or GPS fly the plain for them and fail to realize that they are in a 8,000 ft/min left hand spiraling descent. I watch videos like Pilot Debrief, Allec Joshua Ibay, or blancolirio and find my self asking how could they possibly not notice. Now I know.

[@FlightChops]

Yup... 👍😬🤷‍♂️🤓😔

[@megadavis5377]

Mistakes now reinforce positive actions later on. There is no shame in doing something wrong, messing up as long as we learn from those mistakes and remember them as reinforcements in the making of future decisions or actions. Many, many people learn best when they first make mistakes. It's part of, "...having skin in the game."

[@theflyingfool]

Oh! I SOOO identify with your pain Steve and I'm a VFR only pilot LOL

[@6yjjk]

I remember a dejected student sitting in our crew room, £1000 poorer, having used the avionics in one of our 310s to "move" a VOR and subsequently forgotten that he'd done it. Examiner took pity on him and had him remove the hood when they were 30 miles out over the Atlantic, still tracking towards a beacon that was 40 miles behind.

[@FlightChops]

Haha - yup... the struggle is real.

[@braincraven]

When I was teaching, I think it's important to allow the student walk themselves into their own mistakes. They need to see the almost consequences of their actions. Of course as the instructor, it's finding the balance of how far into the mistake you allow the student to go before it becomes a killing mistake. Your instructor in this case, gave you a great learning opportunity.

[@FlightChops]

He sure did 😂

[@ChrisB257]

Not so easy! Props for your honesty showing us this - quite a learning experience. :(

[@FlightChops]

Yeah man. It’s a tough rating to get and then maintain!

[@08turboSS]

That button your cfi pushed at 8:13 looked like CI something 🤔 What was that button? I zoomed in and dont see a letter D.

[@fernand3s]

What was the circunstances of this last flight?! to try you out before checkride??? Because as a CFI what was dificult for me was watching the instructor there, just not helping you, when I think he should have used the moment to teach you. As soon as he realized you were strugling with FMS, and trying to do something for too long. I`d say on the 2nd, or 3rd try, he could have halped you instead of just standing there looking bored. would have been much more beneficial to you.

[@FlightChops]

Honestly, Luke was doing what he needed to for us to be at the pace I had set for this trip - I just wasn’t able to keep up - the rainy day flight there was essentially a pre test - it was supposed to be the last opportunity to spot weak points after several days of working through the syllabus - I just ended up melting down on that one 😬🫠😅

[@craigb5017]

Thanks for having the courage to share a mistake, hopefully it will help someone else not make the same one.

[@tymark1]

Ah watching the cfi just sitting there watching you mess up brings back memories lol. Definitely made that mistake on the G430 during my training. After the first or second time, I memorized that missed approach =cdi button to sequence the approach.

[@FlightChops]

Yes, confirming the nav source is now a check list item for me before every approach.

[@tunnelrat6809]

I really think CFIs should take this as a lesson of what not to do. When a student knows they are screwing up, the worst thing you can do is shake your head/have an attitude/told you so attitude. You only add to the panic, and make the student more reactive.

[@mekowgli]

I assumed this was an exam. The examiner is not supposed to intervene, except if it's required for safety reasons.

[@filipesiegrist]

it was a lesson from what I understood. If they are good friends (from their talk it seems so), I don't see much problem here.

[@CryticalAce]

These guys are well known to eachother and Luke was using these lessons to really get a gauge on Steve's thought processes and find those little deficiencies as found in this video and the CDI button. This wasn't Luke being arrogant or having an attitude, he gave Steve the opportunity to catch his mistake and when he didn't, rectified the mistake. Being in controlled airspace leaves little time to debrief the issue on the fly and that's what the debrief time is for after a flight, to delve into what went right and what went wrong, in depth.

[@tfarris7113]

I agree 100% I don't know why the head drop/shake is so prevalent. Just coach, don't be a dick. Unless it's specifically "mock checkride" this achieves nothing. Not everyone is a good trainer.

[@tfarris7113]

Striking the balance between letting a student work through and coaching is not easy, but seems like there's a lot of err to this side.

[@hyret12]

I wouldn’t beat yourself up. Having to learn the flow of keystrokes on that G1000, AND learn a new airplane at the same time is incredibly difficult on an accelerated timeline. You took on an incredibly high work load and got smacked. On the positive side you now have a better understanding of your personal limits, and you’ve learned a new mistake you’ll never make again !

[@laurentsamson8927]

ich, it's a great example on how the mess can add up very quickly and can end up in a tragedy. I can't imagine what would happen if in the mean time a system failure appears. Single IFR is a real thing

[@ronboe6325]

So lucky to catch these things in training vs a real life situation where the results could be a very bad day.

[@FlightChops]

Agreed!

[@jokerace8227]

With X-Plane 12, multiple included models are set up with that dual panel G1000. The way the bottom right dual knobs works the menus does take some getting used to. On the plus side the G430 and G530 knobs in that same corner work through menus about the same way. Maybe that's worth using just to practice that G1000 system?

[@mrsaskriders]

Thx for being willing to show your mistakes for others to learn. Sim guy who flies a lot of IFR who has made this mistake. And the faces made, PRICELESS 😅

[@FlightChops]

Haha - yes... the faces...

[@CyberSystemOverload]

Excellent video, really enjoyed it. Coming from an IT background this G1000 UI does not seem well designed with all that knob twisting, tiny menu fonts, drill down submenus etc. All while flying and being bounced around. I'm sure it works once one has been trained on it and its a powerful system. But the avionics you have in your small plane is a billion times nicer!

[@chaseneufeld3406]

I know that heart ache oh too well, switching from Garmin 430, 530 and 750xi to a Rockwell Collins ProLine Fusion. Like going from Apple to Linux. Super frustrating at first making silly errors that haunt your day. But your drive to keep learning will keep you sharp.

[@FlightChops]

Right on. Thanks for the encouragement!

[@FT-64]

Thank you for sharing this. This gives me nightmares thinking about my upcoming checkride…LOL…

[@tombrazier6172]

Really feel for you. I know the what its like sitting there thinking you must like you look like an idiot to the person in the other seat. On a recent skills test I spent about 10 minutes trying to switch the transponder on, despite having approaching 200 hours of flying with transponders. But this one had a complicated start up sequence that I had not got under my belt. Having someone watching adds so much stress that you can end up being less able than if you were by yourself. In addition to the lessons learnt that you mention, here's another I need: fly the plane, don't try to fly the instructor/examiner. Still find that hard to do though.

[@pursueadventure]

The honesty and openness of these debriefs are awesome!! Thank you for sharing FlightChops. It will probably be a while before I'm working on my IFR but when I do I'll know something else to watch out for.

[@FlightChops]

Thanks man!

[@LoudPxckk]

thanks for this video

[@waynewilliams8554]

The FI looks like he wants to step out and end it all!!

[@crooked-halo]

This is a problem with current IFR training, the mixture of equipment from one airplane to the next. Many flight schools are doing IFR training in aircraft with _steam gauges!_ When I got my instrument rating in the early 90s that was OK, there were _no_ glass panels or, at most, only the most ancient of GPS or digital nav aids being introduced. I would be lost in front of a G-1000, just like a glass panel pilot would be lost given a stack of paper charts & a panel full of dials, knobs & switches.

[@blue123111]

Luke 😂😂😂. Great video Steve!

[@CaptSugman]

It’s easy to remember VLOC when you’re doing all those ILS bits and bobs. 9/10 times you catch it in the brief and on top of that tuning and positively identifying the localizer is a good reminder. But you gloss over all that GPS mumbo jumbo when you brief an RNAV and it becomes a sneaky item that can obviously totally wreck your approach.

[@FlightChops]

For sure. And I’m spoiled with my set up in the RV-14 that auto switches back to magenta needles when I press the TOGA button during the missed approach after an ILS.

[@jimallen8186]

Rather than viewing this as failure to toggle CDI, is it better more broadly covered as a “Children of the Magenta” error? When having trouble with high end automation, step down a level or even hand fly. If you can’t get the system set for what you want, seek to do something else instead. Question, was the named point, didn’t catch the name, defined in other places by VORs? Could you have quickly made reference in the green? Better, with a Pointer? Alternately, why bother with trying to find the point and its hold in the approach? Just type the point into the FMS as an enroute point. You can create a hold on the enroute point based on a quick glance at your plate via Menu option. Now let “Hal” hold while you struggle with what I call “going fishing” for how to get the approach loaded. If ATC clears you for the approach while still fishing, ask for a few more laps in the hold to get situated. Having the more simplified setup on the MFD would likely cue you to the PFD and CDI. Note, if you create the enroute, don’t Direct Enter Enter to the IAF till you’re on the inbound leg of the hold as you don’t know which way Hal will turn for it. Similarly, delete the hold from the approach if you’re already cleared so you won’t do an errant lap. If not cleared, ok to step to the IAF for that hold. Despite being the same point, the system will treat your manually entered enroute point as a different point than the subsequent IAF when you get the approach loaded. Separately, remember to read the scoreboard. This will also catch the CDI lack of toggle. If you try to do a Direct Enter Enter NAV on your named point, you should expect GPS in the scoreboard not VOR, LOC, or BC or HDG with such in standby. The habit to read the scoreboard after any mode change will really help. Separate note, with Pointers properly set up, and if hand flying, you can use the Pointers for VOR work while never stepping out of Magenta. Can’t say the same for LOC and BC. Arcing with Pointers is much easier than with CDIs too. And there is a thing called Point-to-Point (or Fix-to-Fix) if you have DME with Pointers.

[@FlightChops]

Lots of great insights here. This particular case though was navigating to a GPS waypoint to hold and then do an RNAV, so there was no other way to get to (or verify the location of) that fix.

[@Bob-j5o3b]

I think when a person sees something and says "I don't know why it's doing that", it's often intuitive - it's doing it because that's what it's set up for, which would mean, it's set up wrong

[@TundeEszlari]

King video.

[@taytayflyfly7291]

What I would've told a student there is, how do we navigate to -insert fix or waypoint-? You were anticipating a left turn so you were watching the moving map and not flying primarily by your HSI.