Thor: Love and Thunder - Spoiler Review!

[@jacklowry1914]

When I saw the pen through paper wormhole explanation I immediately thought,”Dan’s not going to like this.” And lo and behold I was correct

[@chubtoad01]

Same

[@jezziah2]

I thought it was a nice, genuine moment for Jane & that random fan in the middle of a heavy story beat. I gave it a pass on that strength.

[@ReluctantSpirit]

classic cringe cliche

[@jacklowry1914]

@@jezziah2 it was used well in this instance I’ll agree

[@kaytwo_]

Same thought lol

[@fnh123]

Korg's two dads was a recon though. He talks about his mom and her boyfriend in Thor Ragnarok

[@Oxygenep12]

Doesnt seam like a retcon. If their species has a mother figure but 2 fathers make the babies, then it stands to reason that their species has more than 2 parents. Maybe the men make the babies and the women raise them? There are even human partnerships with more than 2 people in a relationship.

[@tysondennis1016]

He’s adopted.

[@bigpapan.g3245]

Korg could simply have more than just two parents... Or is a fictional rock specimen having a troop of parental figures too much?

[@Kris_AB]

They're a one-gendered alien race in the comics, Korg's people (all male-seeming). So at least this film honoured that.

[@jove1155]

PANDERING. Simple.

[@RemyBent]

In regards to the greater MCU story I feel like we missed a beat, or an epilogue to be precise. For the first 10 years of the MCU the focal point of the MCU story was The Avengers. Yes we had one-off movies and yes we explored the cosmic side of the MCU but we kept coming back to that main focal story. And I don't know where we are at with that story. Tony died and Cap retired but is there still an Avengers team? For me I think that is why the MCU is feeling a bit rudderless. If Endgame was the final chapter of, let's call it Book 1, then there should have been a clear introduction to Book 2; The Avengers have disbanded and the world needs new heroes. At the moment it just feel like Disney needs content for its streaming platform so we are putting out all these shows with new heroes with no context to the greater story.

[@jesserodgers5625]

Underrated comment. Yes. I would even go so far as to say that Phase 4 should have been nothing but fallout, consequences, PTSD, regrouping, etc. We KINDA got some of it with Wandavision, Falcon, and Hawkeye, but all this multiverse, TVA, other dimensions stuff is REALLY muddying the waters.

[@Regitron3000]

Rudderless is exactly it's problem. Aside from your point that the Avengers were the focal point of the MCU, every phase has some sort of goal or motivating threat that is teased, as well as balancing the in-world consequences of the previous phase. Phase 4 has been mostly fallout from the Snap/Blip with no real driving force behind the MCU narratively that leads to the next Avengers film. Instead Phase 4 has been all over the place, and unfortunately the two big movies (Dr Strange 2 and Thor 4) that could have righted the ship of the MCU drop the ball in that regard leaving the MCU the most aimless and unfocused it's ever been.

[@IGoWumbo]

That has been my main problem with Phase 4, like most people. Even though most of the solo films in Phase 1 and 2 were siloed stories for the most part (except where stones were involved), they at least connected to the overarching narrative with the mid- and post-credits scenes. All those scenes in Phase IV just tease another character that impacts the story of the solo film character. I guess you could say that we’ve got the Kang stuff in Loki, mentions of incursions in MoM, but if that is where the narrative is leading we are getting there like 50% too slow. However, if in 10 years we look back on Phase IV after having gotten an amazing depiction of Secret Wars that was only possible by all this legwork, then I think we’ll view these movies in a much more sympathetic light.

[@PlatinumPaladin]

I agree that daddy-Disney is demanding too much of their studios at the minute to create quality stuff, but disagree that there needs to be a unifying arc or team. Such a strategy puts similar demands as creating lots of content and I don't feel can be maintained over time. If phase 4 just wanted to be a series of independent stories about characters in this universe dealing with their own lives after Endgame, that should be fine and would give everyone time to breathe, including Marvel Studios. Just because they did an amazing job with Book 1 doesn't mean they can repeat that magic consistently.

[@RX552VBK]

Too true.

[@LizardSpork]

Somebody should have stood over Taika's shoulder and said "No, no joke here, it will completely ruin the emotional moment." and "Don't cut this part, we need more Christian Bale."

[@DameonRaeth40]

That how I've felt about all of Taika's stuff. He's funny, but doesn't seem to know how to do anything else.

[@LizardSpork]

@@DameonRaeth40 Agreed. I prefer James Gunn who's much more adept at balancing humour and emotions.

[@SimonBuchanNz]

Do you have examples? That was a clear issue with Ragnarok, but having just seen the movie twice, looking for issues like that that people complain about the only thing that stood out was the town hall, which was a wind-down after an action scene and lore dump. I could be missing something though!

[@LizardSpork]

@@SimonBuchanNz Their entire time at God City was a 30min sketch. The screaming goats joke and the "jealous Stormbreaker" joke were repeated ad nauseam. That budget play with Matt Damon went on forever. The awful townhall scene. The whole time Thora and Jane were reconciling on the ship they keep cutting back to Korg and Valkyrie inside cracking jokes inside the cabin when the cancer reveal should have been a very emotional moment. Thor joking about Lady Sif not being able to go to Valhalla.

[@mk6rfc1]

@@LizardSpork id add peyton reed and jon watts to that list since the ant-man and spider-man movies are also good examples of how to balance humour with the serious moments

[@adamisrandom3150]

I was baffled by the fact we didn’t actually see Gorr butchering any God’s, it was referenced a lot which is nice but it would have been awesome to actually see it And so can Thor just bestow his power to other people from now on? That could have been mighty handy in previous films.

[@juandiegocuellarmazabel3701]

Maybe it only worked this time since he didn't use Stormbreaker, but Zeus' bolt. Yeah, he said "bestow the power of Thor" but, you know, a different weapon.

[@Redranger99]

@@juandiegocuellarmazabel3701 They should’ve explained it. But they didn’t so they left us confused.

[@juandiegocuellarmazabel3701]

@@Redranger99 Yeah, there are several details in the movie that are left ambiguous. For instance, the debate as to whether Jane was worthy or was it all Thor's whispering to the hammer.

[@atlien1988]

​​​@@juandiegocuellarmazabel3701 Jane was obviously worthy or she wouldn't have been able to lift it. Thor literally says that it was Jane that reminded him that he was worthy after showing him the importance of helping others. Thor placing an "enchantment" on Mjolnir only further cements her worthiness as Thor would not have casually whispered to the hammer for it protect anyone else. Lastly, at the end she confirms her worth by sacrificing her life to save Thor and defeat Gorr. She knew death was inevitable as Mjolnir was sucking away her life force.

[@riccohansen5860]

Radu did he kill... And er godt some Dead goods

[@geoffishy]

Dan, with regards to Eternity, Gorr is given a vision when he first gets the Necrosword, that shows him that he’ll need the axe in order to get there. So whilst a bit flimsy, it’s simply that Thanos & Thor didn’t know Stormbreaker was the way to get there. Thor is aware of Eternity, as evidenced by his reaction when Zeus says that’s where Gorr is heading, however unaware Stormbreaker is the key, as evidenced by his confusion when Jane throws it away.

[@garretthendricks6350]

How is stormbreaker the key when it was made like 4 years ago?

[@mr.brownstone5716]

In comics, there is an artifact called the Heart of the Universe. It is considered the most powerful artifact in Marvel, with 2nd usually going to the Infinity Gauntlet. There is a run where Thanos obtained it and restored his universe. . There is no in-movie explanation for why Thanos or no one else went to the Altar of Eternity at the Center of the Universe. Easiest answer is it didn't exist until L&T. Easiest in-movie explanation is no one knew what the key was. Gorr only knows because once he touches All-Black the Necrosword, it starts whispering in his ear, and very quick flashes show Eternity, the BiFrost, and the Gate of Eternity itself.

[@arthand7672]

I think it is also possible that he had heard of it, but didn't believe it was real. We've seen that a few times in the marvel universe where concepts we haven't heard of before are considered to be myths. One notable was in infinity war with the guardians expressing doubt that nidaviler was real. All 6 infinity stones have/had been floating around forever causing trouble. Thanos even had the mind stone and the power in his possession at one point. When you look at it logically... theres a myth that if you visit a being no one has ever seen then they'll grant you a single wish. There are also 6 powerful artifacts that you have seen firsthand that will grant you unlimited power to shape reality. These 6 artifacts can also be used independently to destroy worlds, reverse time, control the hearts and the minds of other beings, and even shape reality on a smaller scale. Do you go after the myth, or the stones?

[@Morinhetar]

But then again, Zeus new and also Valkarie...

[@mr.brownstone5716]

@@Morinhetar - They knew of its existence and location but didn't know what the key was. Only Gorr knew what it was because All-Black the Necrosword showed him a vision the first instance he touched the sword.

[@fnh123]

They don't know what the key but they would've gone looking for it instead of doing nothing. It doesn't work when you think about it. You just have to hand wave it away.

[@mr.brownstone5716]

Assuming their universe is old as ours, 13+ billion years is a long time for a "key" to go unfound. Reasonable to assume most thought it would never be found, and acted as such.

[@PseudoFiction]

Marvel needs to mix in some movies with smaller stakes, even in the streaming shows going up to Ms. Marvel has Earth ending stakes for the heroes, multiverse ending stakes several times.

[@MichaelWutsch]

Like the netflix daredevil show

[@ShogunZIlla]

Pseudo Agreed.

[@32fps]

The Eternity plot point for Endgame--me and my friend were discussing this too, but then I realized they may have given themselves a "get-out-of-jail" free card for anything like this that comes up because doesn't Strange basically say that there's only one outcome where they win, and it was that one? So the argument would be "sure this existed, but it would have failed ultimately" or something along those lines.

[@benzaiten933]

true and there is already another, well two actually, get-out-of-jail-free cards; friggin' time travel and the multiverse. but well, that's comic books, nobody is really ever dead and gone, a lot of ways to bring them back or have a alternate-universe version of them be around.

[@DikaWolf]

According to Zeus, it's a one time thing. Only the first person to reach Eternity gets a wish. Plus Eternity or part of him has now been reborn as Singularity (aka Love) so I don't think he will be granting any more wishes for the time being.

[@FreelancerLA]

While I liked the film as a whole and thoroughly enjoyed watching it, I do think it would have been a bit more interesting of they'd moved Jane's intro scenes to after her first appearance as Mighty Thor, incorporating it in an extended flashback or revealing it over time, maybe revealing she was ill by dropping Mjolnir by the sink. IDK, the way it was written was very upfront whereas discovering it along with Thor might have been a bit more engaging.

[@abhokie1]

Wow I love this! Imagine we get Lady Thor and it's awesome... But as she drops it by the sink, we get that extended flashback, and omg she has cancer.. Way better idea. Bravo

[@manoy96]

So Thor adopting Love is kind of an mirror to Odin adopting Loki.

[@alkirehomevideos]

Dan, I had similar thoughts - came out a little bit warmer on it than you, but my first reaction when I walked out the theater was that this felt like a first draft script that could’ve been great if it was combed through a few more times. Use the guardians more to remind Thor he doesn’t have a family, use the Jane element to remind him what he could have had, and then I think maybe you earn the daughter more at the end.

[@DrSpectrum3]

For me the filming on the volume was very noticeable because most of the shots in the movie are all just medium shots from the stomach up and there's not a lot of camera movements when characters are talking. It's just a flat shot of one character then switch to another flat shot of the other character so it never really pulled me into the movie and ultimately added to the staleness. It really did feel like basic student film levels of filmmaking.

[@Alejandro-ny9pv]

Yeah the part in new Asgard

[@Jay84844]

@@Alejandro-ny9pv if we’re thinking of the same thing, that scene was so annoying. just an exposition dump with non-captivating cinematography. we as an audience were just getting our ears talked off

[@One.Zero.One101]

Yeah it can be so boring when every shot is characters standing in front of a skybox. It's so static, you can't walk into the skybox, you can't interact with objects in the skybox, you can't place the camera above, below, or beside the skybox. It feels like a 2D side-scroller like Super Mario instead of a 3D game like GTA V.

[@YouveSeenItBefore]

So Dan, as a fellow Trekkie, I thought you’d pick up on the fact that Gore’s plan is shockingly similar to Sybok’s plan in Star Trek V. Think about it: the villain takes hostages, hero is lured into a trap, villain takes hero’s item capable of interstellar travel and unlocking barrier at center of galaxy/universe where being that gives villain heart’s desire resides… pretty similar, huh? 😀

[@Jayk129]

It also starts on an isolated desert planet with a weird bald guy.

[@the_winter_soldier477]

Spot on.. 😂

[@andrewelphick2304]

@@Jayk129 holly shit you are right. Always, much of the humour of both films serves to weaken the story not enhance it. Love and thunder’s final third is pretty good and ST5 has the killer why does god need a starship line.

[@saiyan26]

I really liked the thematic role of Love. Adopting the child of his enemy seemed like Thor's opportunity to finally truly surpass Odin.

[@sunnysied713]

His enemy asked him to take care of his child. That's not the same, and it's not adoption. Adoption is different.

[@lararys7765]

Didn't Odin adopt Loki similarly?

[@austincarlson9270]

@@sunnysied713 ur wrong

[@DamnFineCupOfCoffee]

Omg I just realized the parallel with Loki and Laufee. Between that, and Thor bestowing the power of Thor to the kids, it really does feel like the culmination or end of Thor’s arc.

[@04nbod]

@@sunnysied713 No he didn't. He said that he couldn't bring her back because no one would take care of her. Jane offers for Thor to take care of her. She offers to adopt his child. This is foreshadowed earlier in the film when Korg and Valkyrie talk about whether Jane and Thor will ever have a kid. We are meant to see the parallel between Korg and 'Dwayne The Rock' holding hands over lava and Thor and Jane holding hands over water to bring a child into the world

[@linkjag]

I think that the movie is too short and that's one of its main problems. A few things I disagree with on: I think that Gorr didn't have a sudden change of heart at the end and that's a big misinterpretation people are having. The necrosword would not let him realize that he could use his wish to bring his daughter back to life so until it was broken and Thor brought it up, he didn't even think it was an option. This is less of a big deal but I thought the wormhole thing was funny but the joke wasn't the wormhole it's that she called interstellar easy to understand. Jane is genuinely dead. Even in the comics until recently Valhalla is almost never touched. Once characters are there they stay there. I personally think that by establishing that heimdall and Jane are there (and presumably 616 loki and the warriors 3), they're setting up an exit for Thor where he gets to have his happy ending in Valhalla. Lastly, while I totally agree that the quality has been off recently, I think that people forget that it took until Guardians for the phrase "infinity stone" to even be used. I think people are forgetting what setting the groundwork was like in the MCU because they're used to everything building so obviously to Endgame when it's pretty clear that what they're doing now is essentially a new phase one that, yes, carries a bunch over, but is also setting up cosmic and multiversal threats, building towards Kang as the next Thanos level threat, and building towards young avengers and dark avengers/thunderbolts in the meantime. Overall, i totally agree with most of your thoughts on the movie and I would rank it about middle of the road mcu personally, but I just have a few things I don't 100% agree on. Keep up the great work, Dan! I've been a fan since the screen junkies days and you're genuinely the only reviewer who I ever feel I can trust 100% with a recommendation.

[@PhenomAnon08]

Re setting the ground work: we knew they were building toward an avengers movie from the post credit scene of iron man 1. We see Thanos in the post credit scene of the first avengers. The groundwork was laid from the beginning and while more casual fans like myself didn’t know what all that implied i knew where the end was regardless (at least in a general sense). Right now there is no clear direction. Are we doing secret wars are we doing galactus are we doing something else? Also, There has never been more than 6 movies between avengers titles yet here we are 7 movies past endgame without even a hint at building toward another avengers/ensemble movie. I don’t even think that we need to necessarily be working toward anything. The movies could just exist on their own without a greater overarching narrative but clearly that isn’t the plan because they keep devoting so much screen time to ancillary scenes that only serve to set up stuff for future movies.

[@Aaron-kj8dv]

It would make sense for Gorr to be torn between getting his final revenge against the God's (which was set up poorly, btw) and bringing his daughter back. I think they handled it in a clumsy way though.

[@gimmibox]

The only moment that made me sit up was seeing Roy Kent in the first end credit scene. He's here. He's there. He's every fucking where

[@benzaiten933]

I was soooooo excited about it! a lady sitting behind me explained to her companion "you know from Ted Lasso!". can not wait to see him in action! Brett Goldstein, Harry Styles, Charlize friggin' Theron! a good time to be alive!

[@mk6rfc1]

he was spoiled weeks ago sadly

[@WastedPo]

I wish they'd dedicated this movie entirely to the Jane storyline. (There could be a villain just for this movie to overcome so it would still feel like a somewhat complete story.) By making one movie essentially about Jane, it could've really be moving - exploring her own desperation, the allure of the hammer, the failed relationship between her and Thor. And they could've teased Gorr throughout this hypothetical movie to set him up as the big bad for the next movie. Maybe give him a couple scenes, or have gods randomly showing up dead. And then if you want to kill off Jane in the next movie in the battle with Gorr, after so much time spent with her character, it would truly be sad/memorable.

[@chazjohannsen]

Of all the “First Explicitly Gay Moments in a Disney/Pixar/Marvel/Star Wars Movie”, Korg x Dwayne is certainly the most recent.

[@heatheraggus7501]

Well said. 🤣

[@ericneils3352]

The first half felt out of sorts, for me. The second half won it over for me. I loved the second half. I agree with some others here. A little more Gore early on would have helped. Everything after the Zeus battle was great

[@ericneils3352]

@@davidmckesey7119, agreed. I saw it a second time and liked it a lot more actually.

[@andrewelphick2304]

The minute the goats crash into omnipotence city the film picks up and (mostly) redeems it’s horribly uneven first half. Ironic at Dark World does the same about the time of the funeral.

[@psy1123eu]

Agree with the possible reasons for the MCU slump... want to add one more, audience expectations were higher after the Ragnorok through Endgame, at least for me. So kinda a hangover effect when presented with these new movies that would've been just fine a few years ago.

[@alexmaverick6647]

The concept of Eternity pretty much breaks all canon in the MCU lol.

[@Reezy884]

I definitely noticed the editing problems of the movie. I found out there was so many deleted scenes. Even the scene of her getting the powers of Thor.

[@stevenhawkins3662]

I'm 64 years old. I read the very first thor comic book! I hated this movie! No action that means anything! But that's what you get when you put a foreigner, who never read a comic book in his life! When I read the comic's, I was transferred to another world! It was a world of adventure and action! Some comedy, but all the comedy in this movie. Killed it for me!

[@FlagCutie]

Reviews like this one are exactly why I really enjoy your channel. I had a blast with this movie! That being said, it was choppy and a bit discombobulated with its theme. The way you present your opinions in a measured and calm manner is refreshing and fun. I can't wait to see how this measures up in the Charts.

[@alexaschneider2481]

I agree, the tone of this movie was very confusing. At times, it seemed like the humour was centred towards younger children - but then there was a scene which dragged on for way too long where they kept talking about orgies? Then there was also the horror scenes which felt wildly out of place. Case in point the scene where Thor and Jane rekindle their relationship, then all of a sudden they are in the shadow realm and 2 minutes later Gorr is on the screen? There were also some things that confused me in this movie, I’m not sure if I just missed something and someone can help me understand? 1. In a world where Tony Stark has, you know…existed, how is there no cure or at least a more effective treatment for Cancer? 2. Zeus said that Gorr doesn’t have the key to eternity, so why not just tell Thor that the key was stormbreaker and Thor was walking into a trap? Zeus obviously knew? 3. How was the ‘key’ to Eternity depicted as being stormbreaker, considering Eternity is as old as Gods themselves and stormbreaker was created in Infinity War…? I understand it was the bifrost and not stormbreaker that was the key, but why was the image that we saw in the shadow realm of stormbreaker specifically? Thanks guys!!

[@MayorOfEarth79]

WIth this movie I couldn't tell if Taika wasn't putting his all or maybe he was stretched too thin; but I do think some of what makes this movie unsatisfactory is how lackadasical it feels? So much of the humor feels super random, a lot of the themes and plots feel poorly fleshed out and underdeveloped, the pacing and editing is really messy... I think Marvel in general is going way too fast for their own good and this movie sticks out as the biggest example of such. What with stories of the edits, the cuts, that some huge plot points were created on the fly, how badly the VFX teams had to be crunched in order to get the work done on time...it's leading me and several other fans of the MCU into some major burnout.

[@unison90]

I don't mind thor having a kid. However, Disney adding a kid sidekick is getting really tiresome.

[@Bar-Lord]

I saw it Thursday night and something was bugging me up until now. I enjoyed it alright, but it was more meh to me. A lot fell flat for me and the tone was all over the place. Tackling an emotionally complex topic like cancer is rough in any film, but in this context, especially so. It felt like more attention should have been paid to Jane’s situation rather than make it a big joke. They would touch on it, but quickly pull away. The thing I realized that bugged me is this is the first MCU film where I felt knowing even the basics of the source material helped with the digestion of the film. I think had I not known of the basics of Jane’s story, I would have been more confused.

[@jonainsworth9157]

They definitely underplayed her story arc and did not completely flesh it out.

[@bricked2343]

Usually agree with Dan. But I loved this movie. Lots of the MCU since endgame has taken itself too seriously, and this was so fun to just have a funny movie to enjoy.

[@harveyblue4108]

Seeing children take down god killing monsters made me want to tear my eyes out.

[@johnbrooks7672]

@@harveyblue4108 I'd stay away from comic movies or shows if you feel that way. It's filled with kids just like that.🤷‍♂

[@Tzgrey77]

I agree I think people going expecting Infinity War or endgame levels for every single movie for it to be amazing in itself but also to set up the next movie. Sometimes a movie can just be fun

[@rubendacostaesilva8442]

In the comics, "The Mighty Thor" and "The God Butcher", are two different stories. Two great stories, could have converted to two great movies.

[@riccohansen5860]

The mighty Thor is a boing story... The god butcher is great.. but endgame and ragnarok was need to in the story telling.. so watiti had to mix them All in a pot..

[@04nbod]

I'd argue that 'the Mighty Thor' story isn't a movie. Its a phase for the character of Thor. They changed the effect of Mjolnir on Jane to echo the effect of the Necrosword on Gorr and that is not how it is in the comics. Mjolnir doesn't make Jane worse, it just stops any attempt for her to get better because it IDs the chemo as poison in her blood and gets rid of it

[@rubendacostaesilva8442]

@@riccohansen5860 I liked "Mighty Thor", but it would be almost impossible to translate that to movie at this stage, because the main characters (Odin, Loki, Malekith, Freeda) were already dead. I really thought, because MCU phase 5 was showing signs that they were going to explore the multiverse (Spidey No Way Home, Loki series, Multiverse of Madness, Quantumania), we could had a more faithful story to the "God Butcher", with Thor traveling through time and finding different versions of him, and Old Thor, but that would make a more darker and serious movie, and it seems like both Chris and Taika don't want to give us that. And now, because Taika now has gained this "genius status", he's allowed to do whatever the fuck he wants.

[@rubendacostaesilva8442]

But still, as a regular movie goer, who enjoys to have some fun at the movies, I enjoyed the movie, it was fun. The theater was having a blast. The scene where he gave the powers to the kids, everybody started clapping and chanting (lot's of kids in the theater, so...), and the end, love triumphing against anger, I think it was a great message to pass to the young audience, specially in these mad days. And on the other side, if I want more dark, gritty and adult stories, from my Marvel characters, I still can have them all, in my favourite medium, the way this type of stories were made to be consumed, COMICS!

[@metallicnole4514]

@@rubendacostaesilva8442 Yes I had a great time watching it too and my audience seemed to enjoy it as well. I'm not overly critical when I have such a good time.

[@michaelmccarstle4527]

I think the handwave explanation for them not seeking out Eternity to fix the Snap comes down to Thor probably thinking it was a myth until this movie. Just my guess.

[@tshaa]

I watched the movie on Friday and I found it pretty good. The contrast between the dark scenes being quite creepy with Gorr and then the lighter scenes be bright worked for me with the theme of the movie. The only thing I found clunky was the weird shakepearean dialogue at some points with Thor. It just doesn’t fit the rest of his vernacular. I know he started as that Shakespeare esque vibe in Thor but it’s no longer him. Him adopting Love brought in the full circle with Odin adopting Loki but clearly Thor is gonna be the dad to Love that Odin never was to Loki

[@TeriyakiChx]

The eternity thing for the snap. I guess you could say Stormbreaker didn’t exist yet? I kno Mjölnir serves the same purpose but it still had Odens previous incantation from Thor 1 where you have to be “worthy” to wield its power.

[@chazjohannsen]

They only needed Stormbreaker to access the Bifrost. Thanos had Heimdal under his boot in Infinity War. He could’ve taken Heimdal’s sword to Eternity and wished away half the universe.

[@04nbod]

@@chazjohannsen Who says Thanos knows about the wish to Eternity, or believes in it?

[@joshuanaylor3416]

@@04nbod The man is called the mad Titan for a reason.

[@laramineville]

Honestly Dan, as a woman and prospect Dr, I loved that scene with Natalie Portman. Because unfortunately it is a very common reality in our lives how no matter how we're a mighty god, we're still called very patronising names. So yes, I often do go like her, "not Lady Thor, it's Dr. Jane Foster". Also, for me it makes perfect sense that it came from Gorr, not a douche like Zeus, because people don't even realise how they only see us as 'girls' no matter what we've accomplished and what a 'nice guy' he might be.

[@Flexicor]

Agree. I am a doctor myself, but have experienced a shit tonne of patients and their attenders addressing me as nurse just based on my gender, even despite us dressing differently. Its not necessarily a demeaning title as i value their importance in healthcare set up, but the misogynist reasoning does annoy me and after ignoring it for a long time have begun to correct them.

[@Blaize24]

I agree. It's interesting to me that a man had a problem with a scene that I'd be willing to bet 90% of women were cheering out loud for, because we are belittled so often by "normal" guys. ETA As for whether that moment was shoehorned into an action scene unnecessarily, and whether it was meant to address trolls, I do not care. Every single MCU movie has some kind of snappy banter during various fight scenes. If you don't have a problem with "That is America's Ass" and scenes like it, you have no business having a problem with Jane's scene here. You're just more misogynistic than you may have realized.

[@Alexandoas]

Korg’s species being completely male has been in the comics for years now, it was sprung on the general audience yes, but anyone who read planet or world war hulk knew this already

[@1WonderingApe]

I would watch the hell out of the 4 hour cut

[@Nightly0]

Just to let you know Dan I look forward to your videos every week

[@_jolie_]

I was so sure Thor and Jane would stay friends in this one because I thought we all agreed that they had very little chemistry... Also shouldn't Heimdall's son have been motherless to allow Thor to adopt him? After opening his heart?

[@jonainsworth9157]

Thor adopting Heimdall’s son would have been an excellent avenue to explore.

[@HariKrishnan-ec5mn]

Taika should not be allowed to return to the Thor series unless he has an actual script. This movie felt like a 6 year old would write on a sugar rush.

[@tristannnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnn]

i was thinking that gorr was going to use his wish to save jane before he saved his daughter and honesty i thought it would’ve been more emotional if he did

[@JohnnyWednesday]

He's just terrible at wishing. What's wrong with "I wish that my daughter and Jane were alive and perfectly healthy" - it's not two wishes to apply to more than one person. He was going to wish for the deaths of thousands and can't wish for the lives of two?

[@jezziah2]

​@@JohnnyWednesday Argh, good point - probably could have made a reason why that wouldn't have been possible, so that only Gorr's kid was able to be saved. Also, if the Center of the Universe has always been there, guess there was a backup plan for the Infinity War after all ..? Ah, it's all dumb fun and too easy to pick apart - still love it :D

[@benzaiten933]

"I wish my home world was restored and everyone who perished came back to life"

[@JohnnyWednesday]

@@benzaiten933 - "I wish for this situation to be resolved in such a way that I wouldn't regret wording my wish like this in hindsight"

[@justinealexandre2448]

To me, the ending of Valhalla felt like a way to give Chris Hemsworth a future exit - it could be his "Peggy" ending like Chris Evans. I wouldn't be surprised if this is his next arc in whatever film he's in next. That's been my problem with these recent films. They're all set up movies, or at least they all feel that way. They feel like they're just moments to get you ready for the next movie (which is just another moment). You did a really good job putting it into words, Dan, with how you described L&T felt like 3 different movies combined into 1 - we had to set up Jane Foster's death, we had to set up Zeus, and we had to set up Thor's daughter. The fact that this is yet another Marvel movie set up leads me to believe that very little of the issues of the film were Taika's fault - sounds like he was given a check list the same way Sam Raimi and Chloe Zhao were. I was going to end there, but I stated thinking about this Phase 4 specifically. I know Covid is an issue, so I want to give them some pass. But It's so frustrating how these phase 4 films feel like "get the characters from here to there" movies, as a way to start another set up. Obviously, we'll never get another End Game, but I think back to how the phase 1 and 2 films were there own films WITH tie ins. I think a good example of this is even Captain Marvel - not the strongest Marvel film in the slightest, but it felt like its own movie while also setting up Captain Marvel for End Game. All these phase 4 movies feel like they just are wasting these characters time so they can move them to where they need to be in the next one. And it feels as though there's no big plan (which I could be wrong about), when like every phase had an Avengers Film to feel like a small climatic build. What does Phase 4 have? Hopefully the new Black Panther can help. I think we need these films to be a little more challenging, too, and hopefully BP can do that. I think if that movie ends up feeling similar to the other phase 4 movies, then the MCU potentially could be in big trouble. As always, thanks for your reviews, Dan.

[@johndzchambers]

My friend & I saw it a few nights ago. We both gave it 7.5 out of 10. I bumped mine up to 8 simply because of the many times I laughed throughout. Marvel seems to be going through a very familiar arc with villains. They're relatable as something bad has happened to them & they're just dealing with it in the wrong way. So they're creating a lot of villains that you empathise with to some degree.

[@Liamsynclair1]

Waititi and Hemsworths kids appreciate ur love of their shadow monster designs

[@Mallymile]

Thor accepting Love as his own child mirrors Odin’s decision to take Loki.

[@funkrobot9762]

No shit.

[@StephanVayda]

I agree storytelling was pretty sporadic. Weird how Jane, person with cancer and never fought before mjolnir, magically becomes an insane fighter as good if not better than Thor? On top of that just takes his name? Would totally be believable if it was Valkyrie who got mjolnir but the outcome just doesn’t make sense for Jane being an ultimate fighter simply for getting a weapon. This setup for movies now seems to be the norm, doesn’t make sense

[@JS-og8oj]

I blame the editors the most. The number of scenes the cast have discussed that weren't cut makes me think they were really worried about run time.

[@Mr.rbfitz]

I wonder if that's a reaction from Eternals, which is their 2nd longest movie behind Endgame, and was ripped apart by critics

[@32fps]

Hi, editor here--do not blame editors for poor cuts of big Hollywood films like this. I can promise you this was not the editors' fault. With a movie like this, the director and producers have the ultimate say, so it's not like the editors cut all that stuff out on a whim and no one said anything, that's just not how post production works.

[@nataliajimenez1870]

@@Mr.rbfitz We know Dr Strange 2 also underwent major cuts and multiple reshoots after the Marvel higher ups disliked Raimi's final cut. We have to remember that directors don't have final cut with Marvel, so we have to be careful when blaming directors for the end results

[@NonaPrince]

@@32fps true that

[@dericplummer9272]

I disagree. This seems like an overall story script issue. If you shoot 4 hours worth of movie and not know what is going to be in the movie that means the screenplay needs serious work.

[@danemlive]

I agree so much with Dan. The setup of Mighty Thor and Gorr was so rushed, there seemed to be so much more there to get us where the movie wanted. Rather than creating Disney+ shows noone asked for these arcs would have made for great material.

[@myeung6666]

Very thoughtful analysis. Thank you. You touched on a lot of points I was not quite liking, but I couldn't quite put my finger on it.

[@Jogwheel]

100% spot-on with everything - I thought you articulated the first act issues (it being very rushed) particularly well. Skipping over Jane's "origin story" as it were felt like a cheat.

[@RedMarvelX]

I never understood how Stormbreaker which was recently made somehow had access to Eternity and if they had this knowledge why did they not use it pre endgame?

[@StardustWarrior16]

They didn't have that knowledge. Jane only figured it out when she saw Gorr's murals in the shadow realm.

[@RedMarvelX]

@@StardustWarrior16 yeah but for a being so ancient it doesn't make much sense to refer to something created so recently.

[@StardustWarrior16]

@@RedMarvelX Yeah but I think the idea is that the Bifrost is the key, which is older.

[@RedMarvelX]

@@StardustWarrior16 If thats true then why not Mjnoir? Why did Gorr threaten to kill Jane, when he could have just taken her hammer (which is older then stormbreaker and can summon the by frost).

[@StardustWarrior16]

@@RedMarvelX I don't think Mjnoir can summon the Bifrost. In the other Thor movies he had to ask Heimdal to summon it from Asgard.

[@emotaurus6026]

No comment, you nailed it

[@Bhavesh-Bhimani]

I agree, Dan. Watched this movie yesterday, and while I didn't dislike it, I wasn't exactly charmed by it either. And I adore Chris Hemsworth as Thor. The film was very eh for me and felt so rushed. Thor suddenly agreeing to adopt Gorr's daughter was just so out of the blue. Jane as Thor was good, but we needed more setup for her, I agree. She saying "I am Mighty Thor" didn't feel earned. I was like, okay, she is Mighty Thor in the comics, but here, in the MCU, why is she suddenly calling herself that, and why would people who have never read a comic connect to that? That felt kinda random. Also, if Thor can give his powers to kids, why didn't he do so earlier? You know, when he was in battle so many times. He could have easily given his powers to his teammates and they would defeat anyone. So, why didn't he? So, I am left feeling unsatisfied. And I think I will now take a break from the MCU. I am not really feeling it at the moment with them.

[@thetrib1]

Thats cool. See you when you get back

[@_Amit_Sunil]

Taika likes his scenes with child soldiers

[@Bhavesh-Bhimani]

@@_Amit_Sunil I didn't mind the scene, really. It was cool. But, again, it did make me wonder like "Wait, Thor can do that?". It just kinda came out of the blue. Still enjoyable though.

[@benzaiten933]

I would have liked it better if Jane went like "I might wield Thor's powers but I'm Doctor Jane Foster!". she's awesome as she is, no need to borrow another's name.

[@Bhavesh-Bhimani]

@@benzaiten933 EXACTLY!!! Her identity should be Jane Foster. She is awesome as Jane Foster. She doesn't need to be called Mighty Thor. That just felt odd, even if that's what she's called in the comics. In this movie, she deserved to be celebrated as Jane Foster and not as Mighty Thor. I agree with your dialogue completely. That would have been so much better.

[@MINI_JasperJunior]

I don't really go to watch Marvel movies in the cinema anymore because they're all very samey, but once in a while it's nice to switch your brain off for 2 hours and enjoy the 'bad guys do bad stuff -> chase macguffins -> beat the bad guys' story. ⚡🔨

[@XenFayed]

I liked this movie more than you did (same with Dr. Strange) while still recognizing its problems. The second half was definitely better than the first. I thought it was (somewhat?) better than Ragnarok with respect to letting the big emotional beats hit without immediately following them with a joke (like the scene at Eternity vs Korg after the destruction of Asgard). I didn't see the ending coming and I really liked it - I thought it fit despite nothing really setting it up. Surprise endings can be good too! I take issue with critics (not necessarily Dan) complaining on one hand that there are no standalone MCU movies and they're always just setting up the next one, but when there is one that is more standalone then the complaint is they don't know what they're doing/where they're going. Not sure how to "fix" that...

[@JohnVaz52]

Also talking about inconsistencies across the 4 Thor movies, I think we need to talk about Mjolnir. In the first movie, Odin establishes it as the object that grants the power of Thor to a person who is worthy. Fair enough. Remains the same through to Age of Ultron iirc. Then in Ragnarok, Odin says that Thor already had this power and Mjolnir helps him direct this power, which makes it come across as the hammer itself doesn't have the power. Then in Endgame, the Mjolnir logic reverts to what was established in Phases 1 and 2 (Cap has the power of Thor). And now in Phase 4, Mjolnir and Stormbreaker are kind of sentient?

[@atlien1988]

Thor is a god so all his power doesn't come from Mjolnir. However, these weapons are embued with their own power that not only amplifies the power of Thor, but it gives the weilder who it deems worthy, the power of the Asgardian. Remember, in the comics and in Norse mythology, Odin is the first to wield the hammer. He eventually passes it down to Thor after he prove he is worthy. Also, pay attention to the enchantment that Odin places on Mjolnir: "Whosoever holds this hammer, if he be worthy, shall possess the power of Thor." This enchantment is a double or multiple entendre. As I wrote earlier, Thor is Asgardian and son of Odin so, he is obviously powerful. However, the person who wields Mjolnir is granted power that is generally only known to Thor, god of Thunder/Strength.

[@benzaiten933]

I suppose Cap and Jane just channeled Thor's powers through Mjolnir. the hammer didn't store lightning but drew it from Thor for them to use. or at least that's a so-so believable theory to explain it away.

[@Cotsos88]

I haven't read recent Thor comics, but I belive the "sentient" Mjonir is part of the current storylines. I agree though the rules are all over the place as usual, but that happened on the comics too. :)

[@JohnVaz52]

@@atlien1988 I see what you say and probably it is true. However, my point is more towards this being an inconsistency in-universe. This should work on its own without requiring me to have inherent knowledge of comics or Norse mythology.

[@JohnVaz52]

@@Cotsos88 It may have happened in the comics, so maybe movies ought to establish that from the start then. (like choosing to go with organic web shooters or mechanical ones in the Spider-man movies but not doing both). This is something that needs to be consistent across the MCU without requiring the crutch of having prior knowledge of comics or mythology.

[@kenobiaaron]

Gotta agree, it’s starting to feel like Marvel is starting to burn out a bit and they need to get going in some unified direction rather than the scattershot it’s felt lately

[@mscooldeadly]

They need to slow down. NWH is the only good movie out of phase 4 but that's really Sony movie. Shangi Chi was good til the 3rd act.

[@andypandy3949]

Christian Bale- not enough screen time!

[@jddtron]

@DanMurrell the answer to the question of why no one tried reaching Eternity, is that no one could quite figure out the key to unlocking Eternity. Before Stormbreaker, no weapon could harness the power of the bifrost. You needed to summon a gatekeeper like Himdall to get you the right place. It was a Zeus line “he doesn’t have have the key” Stormbreaker is the key to unlocking eternity. So if anything it makes Zeus seem more reasonable.

[@CBrown]

That was just a storytelling device. It was Stormbreaker because the director wanted it to be. It makes no sense for it to be. That basically means that Fate exists in the MCU as Stormbreaker only exists because Hela came along and destroyed Mjolnir, Thanos assembled the gauntlet, Thor needed a new weapon to kill Thanos, and for whatever reason that weapon can channel the Bifrost. Even if you subscribe to that, why is Eternity locked behind a gate that requires a key only the Asgardians could ever possibly wield?

[@Daniel145D]

I actually liked it a LOT more upon rewatch. Going in knowing what to expect helped a lot. You definitely have to be a fan of Taika’s brand of humor though.

[@realkylekatarn]

I completely agree! I’ve seen it three times now and it worked better on my rewatch too! Taika’s humor can be too much at times but I’ve become used to it after Thor: Ragnorak.

[@dj_matanzaa]

I had a feeling this might be the case. Sometimes that first watch (or listen, when it comes to albums) suffers from the comparison with your own expectations.

[@theherooffire007]

I thought Thor's cape + boombox armor were just personal fashion choices of the character. Didn't realize they were the uniform of a "being" called "The Thor". Same for his name.

[@Spideyfan1985]

Good review Dan, I enjoyed it for what it was. But man I wish we would get that four hour cut of this film. I think Gorr knowing he needed Stormbreaker was something that had to do with Jeff Goldblum and Peter Dinklage. All and all I had a fun time with this. I would have made some changes to the story for sure. By no means is this a perfect Marvel film.

[@JudgementNutter]

I was kinda confused about Jane actually using Mjonir, we see a seal glow when Thor asks it to always protect her, so does that mean he gives her permission to use it and she wasn't actually worthy like Steve Rogers? At the end Thor gives god power to the kids to all be mini Thors with super strength and thunder (which btw when/how did he know he could do that?) So we know he can give Thor god power to anyone anytime for however long with (apparently) no downsides. So to me it takes away how cool it was for Jane to be her own Thor and lessenes how cool she is by her needing "permission" to be a hero. That and Zeus' bolt just being able to teleport anywhere in the galaxy. I feel they could have set that up very easily with Zeus teleporting when they went to OmnipotenCity. Make it another joke where he goofs on Thor and his friends, why not, there's so many jokes already, what's one more?

[@ShellsGhost1]

He was king for a bit and it also appears that the kids all have Zeus lightning instead of Thor Lightning. And as for the Hammer I feel she's worthy but it is also specifically supposed to protect her. And the kids are Asgardian so they're already much stronger than normal people. They're God children.

[@jokersson21]

I always like watching your reviews and appreciate your perspective. I happened to enjoy this Thor but I agreed with the points you mentioned. It did feel a bit rushed, I didn’t even realize the time when I was watching it. Part of me, in regards of the fan base, thinks that a lot of the discourse was unwarranted. Some of what I seen was bad VFX (from ppl who obviously don’t do vfx). A pic was going around from a scene of L&T and it made upset as it was a grainy, bad pic and was used as fodder. Of course that will look bad to anyone (it’s almost like no one remembers watching bootlegged, cam movies). Ppl are excited for the FF4 movie and I argue if anything is gonna have choppy VFX it’s that because Mr Fantastic powers are bad for live action. No amount of CGI will make stretchy appendages looks good and I confirmed that with Krasinski’s part. The other issue I’m having with the fans is something I heard elsewhere. I think, while still tryna to keep the marvel beats and formula, these latest string of movies all have some sort of creative freedom in their own right and it’s not sitting well with audiences. But it baffles me because it’s the same audience that lamented about marvel movies looking the same. So which is it? Do ppl want the movies to be different or look the same? I like the creative freedom, as little as it is, that the directors have. Sure, L&T could’ve been more structured and laid out differently but I appreciate Taika’s weird humor. I love Sam Raimi’s horror element in Dr. Strange 2. Some just don’t and that okay but that doesn’t make it a bad movie. Least not to me. The last thing I have a real issue with is the end credit scene, another point you made. I have no idea where this all leads. Phase 1-3 all had morsels to let you know what’s the result (phase 1 led to avengers, phase 2 led to infinity stones, phase 3 led to thanos). Where’s phase 4 heading?? The end credit scenes, imo, were made to show that. To tease the bigger picture and all of them, from Shang Chi to L&T all fall flat. Its one of introducing or teasing a character to come despite having a full enough roster with Moon Knight, Ms Marvel, new Hawkeye etc. like cool, Hercules (which I hope they correctly say his name and say it wrong) is coming but like why? Sorry this was so long, I just wanted to share my opinion as I’m a big fan of yours and, though there might differences, I prefer that we do have them than just always like the same thing.

[@mrbean3470]

Having had a day to process it, my conclusion is that the most similar comic book film I've seen compared to love and thunder is... Shazam.

[@CPaulCourtney]

As much as I think there are too many serial shows on the streaming channels, especially from Marvel, I think Thor: Love and Thunder would have adapted well to that format. There were several converging story lines that could have been fleshed out. Jane Foster/Mighty Thor, the rebuilding of New Asgard, Gor's god hunting, Omnipotent City, each could have been explored over a 8 - 10 series show. I liked the movie by the way. I just wanted to know more about certain aspects of it.

[@matthewbertram4312]

I think one of the missteps that this movie, and Doctor Strange 2, had was that they were both wildly absurd films. They were absurd at the sacrifice of story. And maybe where Dan leans more towards the positive side on this one is because it was absurd with lighthearted entertainment, whereas Doctor Strange was very bleakly absurd. Unless you're determined to hate it, it's harder to be negative towards things that make you laugh as opposed to cool Easter eggs in a film that doesn't make you smile.

[@oliverbleuyoutube]

Korg & Dwayne was such a solid & hilarious scene

[@clrae4882]

I’m in the minority, I loved this movie. I liked the lightness, I thought Natalie Portman did an amazing job, enjoyed every scene, got emotional when I needed to, laughed a lot! I LOVeD when the movie turned to black and white, all of the actors looked so stunning. And I was starting to get cynical at the end part with the kids, but boy was I cheesing during that whole scene, it was done so well. I bought it. Overall, great movie for me.

[@yeskev]

Loved it for all the same reasons. I don't think you're in the minority at all. It was such a fun movie!

[@markelliott32]

Are you a woman?

[@dyezmordz6390]

😂movie was rubbish

[@betterlatethannever4529]

Imagine if the film was a detective film, similar to Cold Case) where we follow Thor going around and finding gods dead, while also flashbacks show what happened, then at the end we get Gorr's backstory. I mean Thor is literally thousands of years old, surely he's picked up a few things when it comes to identifying how one might have been butchered

[@marianne5055]

There was definitely some jokes that I thought were too corny and eye roll inducing, but I enjoyed the humour for the most part. Yes, I think it could have been toned down somewhat and let serious moments be serious. But that’s a problem in a lot of Marvel movies. Even No Way Home had that issue. But I think why I liked the film as much as I did was the overarching theme of choosing love.

[@marcochen9117]

the choosing love theme was very very on the nose. I feel like maybe the youngest of audiences would connect with it, but people starting from high school would already see the movie being ridiculous. SPOILER Gorr just handing over his daughter to Hemsworth just because he saw him cradling a loved one is utterly bonkers

[@dmfuerte]

I thought this movie is entirely consistent with Taika's filmography. He takes extremely dramatic circumstances and romps through them with uncynical, cheeky irony. Thor 4 is not flawless; however, I think It's unfair to add the MCU's baggage to the movie. The MCU has earned criticism for being rudderless and oversaturating with content. But that expectations realignment should have begun post Infinity War. I really want to see the missing half of the 4hr movie. Marvel should release it for Disney+ much like WB did the Snyder cut. Taika's Thor movies are a vibe that you can either enjoy immersing in or not.

[@acewingate6993]

I think End Game was just a good stopping point for me with the MCU

[@MrBoodabelly]

End Game is such a good stopping point it seems like my brain has blown a fuse regarding superhero movies. I don't hate the genre but I'm not that enthusiastic anymore.

[@JohnnyWednesday]

I feel that way too - with all the new characters and the focus on teen angst? it would appear that Phase 4 is "reset to a younger demographic"

[@DralenDragonfox]

Totally agree with what you said about how much the movie seemed to swerve wildly between storylines. It felt rushed from the very beginning, and I think you're right that there's at least two movies mashed together in this one, both tonally and story-wise. We start out with the cold open to rapidly establish Gorr and his motivation and his first kill. Title card, and then we establish Thor and the Guardians, then immediately dismiss the Guardians to establish Thor's emotional state. Quick cut and now we establish everything that's going on with Jane, and as you said, she goes from "whoops, suddenly I'm dying" to "whoops, suddenly I'm Thor" extremely quickly. Korg's storytelling framing was kinda cute, but felt a bit too info-dumpy for a big screen release. Felt like it would have made more sense in a Disney+ series than a theatre release. The mood whiplash between the lightly comedic Thor/Valkyrie/Jane/Korg scenes and the incredibly dark Gorr scenes didn't bother me per se. They both sort of made each other more impactful to counter viewer fatigue of the same sort of visual storytelling we keep seeing. Though I do agree that Gorr felt like he comes from a different movie. I really enjoyed the sub-sub-subplot of Stormbreaker getting jealous of Thor getting back together with Mjolnir. Watching Stormbreaker just sort of slide into frame every so often in quiet jealousy was very funny, and they didn't use it so much that it overstayed its welcome (like they did with the goats). The overall impression was just that it was so rushed. We have X units of story to tell here, and we have Y amount of time to do it in, so we've got to hurry up to get through it all. At times it felt like the last half of Revenge of the Sith when they realized they had a bunch of story they needed to get through and they spent a whole half an hour on the pod race in the first movie, so they had to rush to get to those final story beats, and they were coming so fast it was like Happy Hardcore.

[@partycrusher]

The Thor and the kid storyline mirrors Loki being adopted by Odin in battle. Its like poetry, it rhymes.

[@jamesthecancer5006]

I think what happened in this film was that Ragnarok was such a smash hit that they gave Takika Waititi as much creative freedom that he wanted. Which was obviously a bad idea. I also think that the box office that Love & Thunder has accumulated so far is based on the success of Ragnarok as well because people think there coming to see, more or less, Ragnarok 2. Sadly, Love and Thunder is an hour and a half super hero version of Dumb and Dumber.

[@justinw1563]

Dan, I completly agree with you. Thor is my favorite MCU character and I enjoyed this movie, but it wasn't amazing. Toneally it was all over the place, a little too much of the typical MCU, "Oh, it's been 5 mins without a joke?...better throw one in there." but then suddenly, BAM, Gor being dark and spooky. Christen was great as Gor, but I feel like at times he was in a totally different Thor movie (a more interesting one haha). Also, I'm disappointed with how with each Thor/MCU movie with Thor, they seem to remove a few IQ points from him. Why does he need to be so dumb all the time? I get that in the comics he's basically like the 'muscle' but that doesn't mean he needs to be an idiot. I'm getting kind of burnt out by the MCU, they are just starting to be carbon copies, not bad but not interestinly different.

[@sunnysied713]

He's not an idiot in the comics, only in the MCU. Thor 1 and 2 are more comic book accurate (ignoring the jokes). Thor isn't a comedian or a himbo. Blame that on Kevin Feige, Taika Waititi and Chris Hemsworth.

[@iang8169]

Thor ragnorok had the perfect balance between drama and silly comedy . This movie went too far into silly comedy

[@atlien1988]

bro use autocorrect lol

[@sizanix]

Actually he was pretty smart in Thor 3 when he didn't fall for Loki's trick for once.

[@TheMightyZack]

They wanted Wanda EVIL and Jane as THOR as soon as possible and that’s why it all feels so rushed and unsatisfactory

[@Firensid]

I love and thunder this movie. But I can see your points. Many of the movies feel fractured, both this thor movie and the dr. Strange one feels a little roughly put together. I did like both of them but I can see the problems with the movies as a whole. I don’t care what anyone says about Eternals though, that movie is awesome, I agree that it could be a cool tv series and probably even better but I love it as it is.

[@danemlive]

Agree with you Eternals is very underrated. I had such low expectations going in and in hindsight feel its one of the better Phase 4 movies.

[@johnelahad721]

Agreed, I really loved Eternals and have been kind of surprised about how many of my friends etc take a shit on it.

[@joseaguilar3323]

From what you're describing it sounds like the opposite problem of the Disney Plus TV Shows. Those feel like TV shows that should've been movies, while this sounds like a movie that should've been a 4 hour TV Show.

[@ShogunZIlla]

Exactly

[@Elviolli]

I agree with most of this except the goats. I laughed every damn time. I went back and saw it a 2nd time today just to see the goats again hahaha. It's so silly but I guess that's my kind of humour. XD

[@Bemused247]

I thought it would get old. Then the ship crashed, they screamed, and I laughed out loud again.

[@BrianMakesFilms]

I've personally really lost interest in Marvel by and large after Endgame. I did enjoy Wandavision and Falcon and the Winter Soldier and No Way Home, but a lot of the new heroes haven't piqued my interest, or even revisiting characters like Thor. I feel like most of them had really complete arcs and coming back to them they're forced to regress. Same sort of vibe as the sequel trilogy with Star Wars. The originals ended perfectly but the only way to bring it back was to undo everything they did. They won't ever stop, but I wish they'd wrap up a lot of storylines and let the MCU be done.

[@Modleyjjm]

Just My Opinion (Of Course), but the overall comedy aspect of this movie kept it from being an Epic classic movie…man the elements where all in place for this to be one of the greatest superhero movies of all time yet the director chose to make a mini parody movie 😂

[@georgeloeffler6036]

The Eternity snap thing didn’t really bother me. Unless I missed something I feel like the movie explained that the bifrost was the key to unlocking it and that was destroyed in the first Thor movie. At that point the key no longer exists unless someone has a way to remake the bifrost. Even if Thanos could get there he had no way to unlock it. As far as Valkyrie goes maybe she didn’t believe it actually existed until Zeus mentions it? I could see it easily being a tall tale among the gods. When it comes to Gorr I imagine the sword told him the location since it’s been around since the beginning of time and together they figured out the key. Definitely could have used more screen time exploring that process though. Along with more screen time on what Zeus lightning bolt can do or how Thor and Mighty Thor arrived at the center so quickly. The movie definitely had its flaws and the humor doesn’t land as well as Ragnarok. But unlike it’s predecessor I think it nails the emotional scenes. I also think Natalie knocked it out of the park. Overall I really enjoyed it. The kid part was also a little off putting at first but I thought it was interesting watching Thor distribute power similar to what Odin did with the hammer. Along with adopting Gorrs kid like Odin did with Loki. Thor has always seemed like a lonely character to me so wanting a family makes sense especially after he lost everyone.

[@OrionInSpace]

Dan I completely respect that it wasn't really your thing this time around with this movie everyone is going to think differently. What I really appreciate from you as someone who was disappointed about it is that you have legit gripes with the movie. As someone who just got done watching a hilarious and completely unintelligent review where you got a guy throwing politics at the movie and political buzzwords I just had to turn it off because I knew immediately that he just wanted to say what he said for the views and wasn't taking it seriously. Like lets be real here, THIS MOVIE IS NOT POLITICAL OR "WOKE" or whatever the hell that word means! Seriously man this is getting ridiculous.🙄 I get your gripes and criticisms with the movie. I myself really enjoyed the film and had a fun time. I do have criticisms of my own. -I think the movie needed 10-15 more minutes to flush some things out and give scenes time to breath -The first act is a bit out of pace and felt rushed -Some of the CGI and affects were a bit wonky (first 10 minutes specifically) -And yes I do agree that could've used a few less jokes especially in scenes that didn't need them But with positives: -I love all the actors, great job from everyone -Action is awesome and really cool to look at -70% of the jokes do land and are really funny -Taika did an alright job directing, not his best but did ok -I liked the overall story and what the idea behind it was -Post credit scenes were alright -Music was also fine

[@BattleDamageProps]

How did Thor teleport back to Gorr once he last stormbreaker? I know he used the Thunderbolt, but there was nothing that showed the thing could teleport people. They had this long journey in a viking ship pulled by space goats using a portable rainbow bridge, but then Thor magically teleports there. Ontop of that, Jane magically teleports there on a flying horse. Why not use that Horse to begin with? It was a weird Deus ex machina that I didn't think was set up well or at all.

[@Quanic2000]

I thought the film was fun and cute! I especially loved Jane, who lost her battle with cancer, was welcomed into Valhalla 👏

[@dinnerwithgeorge]

Dude, so we’ll said. Your points are so right

[@TheVileOne]

Even when I don’t agree I always appreciate Dan’s criticism and perspective.

[@_Meriwether]

They did not concern themselves with pesky details like "story" or "character development", it was a medium to cram as many jokes down your throat in as short a space of time - everything else was secondary.

[@jezziah2]

Watched this last night & agree that there needed to be *much* less humour - more so than Ragnarok, which didn't bother me, as it was used appropriately in the majority of cases ('splodey Asgard being #1 exception). Worst of all, a lot of the jokes didn't land for me, and when there are so, so many of them distracting from the genuine drama.. yikes. Overall I only liked the movie - the Dr. Jane Foster/Thor & Thor drama was my highlight. The 'Asgardian kids' stuff was mostly eye-rolling & time-wasting. Thor has had a mountain of tragedy heaped on him across these movies, and so it was great to have some levity in Ragnarok - but this is far too much - Jane Foster's character deserved better treatment, as did Thor. Bale's Gorr was great - but undercut, underused & under-served by the script. Thanks for the great review, Dan!

[@iang8169]

I thought thor ragnarok had the perfect balance between drama and silly comedy but this movie went too far into silly conedy

[@funtechu]

The reason that Eternity wasn't considered for dealing with Thanos is explained in the movie because only the council of the gods knows how to get to Eternity, so Thor had no idea how to get there. Then it is revealed that the only way to get to Eternity is using a bifrost because it is contained in a fold of space that you would pass over if you are travelling through normal space, hence the use of stormbreaker during the final scene to unfold the spacetime fabric and bring them to Eternity.

[@kidunderabridge]

I have your exact feelings about the movie! I keep telling everyone. It feels like multiple movies were put together, and as a result, those spliced movies suffered, so Thor overall suffered. I would have loved if they took their time with Gorr and stretched his threat over two movies. Movie 1 dealing with gods being slain, GoTG and Thor and Omnipotence, and then movie 2, introduce Mighty Thor, really dig deep on Gorr, and deal with the fallout, and have the penultimate showdown in that. edit should have commented at the end! Even Dan's feelings towards Marvel matches mine! They are doing too much. Agreed! They are treating Marvel like Star Wars, and I got burnt out of Star Wars very fast

[@Robinripley]

Love the reviews

[@hellothere8271]

I’m 100% feeling the “fatigue”. I love Thor Love and Thunder. It was fun and heart warming, but it did feel by the numbers. Out of all the projects that have come out since Phase 4 started, only Spider-Man NWH, Shang Chi, Ms Marvel, and Moon Knight really felt like memorable experiences. Everything else is either average (Thor, Doctor Strange,) or below (Eternals) and not as memorable. I hope to god they lighten up on the release schedule. In my ideal world, I could handle 3 movies and two shows a year. That’s perfect IMO

[@greggpirazzini2536]

The 4 hour cut probably would have made more sense and they could fit 2-3 movies worth of storyline in one. Too bad Disney doesn’t really do director’s cuts. Still really liked the movie but could’ve been longer.

[@TheLobster99]

This film was so disappointing and yes - I did like Ragnarok.

[@Quanic2000]

I found it interesting how Thor wasn't taken seriously amongst the other Gods because they resent him for being a super hero, who have replaced the Gods.

[@MZ99698]

I’ve seen IW and Endgame numerous times each and I’m 99% sure Eternity isn’t mentioned. It’s definitely just a plot hole due to lazy writing, the bigger this universe gets the more of these seem to appear (but this is a pretty major one).

[@mk6rfc1]

they slightly refer to the name in gotg 2 but dont really expand what it is

[@denniscarpenter6241]

I get everyone who has an issue with how things don't appear to be connected but if you think of this as phase 1 instead of phase 4 then I don't think it's too different than the actual phase 1. Those movies were only tangentially related until Avengers came out and really brought it together. They are also considered some of the weaker entries in the series. Then things picked up in phase 2 and 3. For this reason I'm giving Marvel a little more of a benefit of the doubt until we get confirmation on where they are heading.

[@dericplummer9272]

The problem is that this is not phase 1. This is phase 4 with an already established continuity and history. I get the idea of setting up new characters but it just feels so disjointed. They are doing too much too quickly.