Titanfall 2 - What is the Skill Gap?

[@terrellfair9812]

I think respawn has made it clear that they do not want a skill focused community for titan fall. This is why end game reports dont show deaths unless its pilot vs pilot. and its also why there are no real ranked modes. Respawn wants a community where everyone is accepted and not left out because they have a low K/D or something like most FPS do. And tbh it should stay that way. You more likely to play a game and keep returning to that game if it makes you feel like a badass.

[@FrothyOmen]

+terrell fair you're not wrong. I just think that they could do with raising that skill ceiling by looking hard at some of the gross parts of the game I mentioned, without at all affecting the low end of the playerbase.

[@MkThUnderwd]

terrell fair Gamesager was an original tester. The top spot on the pilot gauntlet IS gamesager. Even the devs were suprised. Watch the Respawn commentary video of the gauntlet on their channel.

[@terrellfair9812]

FrothyOmen They could and i see where your coming from its just people will drop the game if they keep getting killed by someone who they cant even attempt to defeat and to respawn if there is even a slight chance that it would cause people to drop the game they will not do it. They have experimented already with live fire and for xbox that game type is dead and even the fact that people voted Titan brawl over iron LTS ( which my pick ) shows that people like tht they can make a difference no matter how many trash bags they have on but i definitely agree that there should be a high gap at least in LTS i hate winning a duel or losing one because im getting Grenaded by someone on foot

[@hugohugohugohugo4800]

They use easy weapons and exploit the easy mechanics

[@Predalien3001]

Completely agree. I was never a good FPS player. In CoD 4 I was happy to get the K/D=1, and when PS Plus offered TF2 I was afraid the same might occur, so I focused on Frontier Defense. When I finally jumped into PvP tho (sporting a Mastiff, Grav Star, Grapple and Papa Scorch), I was pleasantly surprised to find myself wiping the floor in the first 3 matches, and enjoying myself. The next ones were a bit rougher, eventually switching the Mastiff to an Hemlok and now also learning Legion, but i still have a ton of fun with it. That fun, i believe, comes from the result screen not showing the deaths. Even when i'm being shit, I'm still on 2nd/3rd place just for the scoring and makes me feel I'm actually doing something.

[@VelcroSnake93]

I dunno, I still regularly see players who roflstomp lobbies far more than the rest of the people in the game. If TF|2 was making it so easy for okay players to keep pace with the really good players, then I wouldn't be seeing players with 20+ kills along with players that have less than 5 kills.

[@memnarch129]

Actually the skill ceiling lowering can explain that, prime example is CoD. Back in MW and WaW going on a more than 25+ kill streak was considered amazing, by Blops3 you where needing 100+ streaks to be considered amazing because the kills had become so easy, due to skill ceiling compression, that your aveage guy was getting 20-30 kill games. In TF1 someone with a 35-40 kill game, pilot kills that is, was at the top of the game. In TF2 if your not doing a 40-50+ your doing somthing wrong, because even your average pickup player can get 25 or so kills. Yes there are those 5 or even negative kill players, but they are a minority and even your average joe can get a 20+ match.

[@memnarch129]

@@Krystalmyth each game is different and must be evaluated differently.

[@benbraceletspurple9108]

@@Krystalmyth well the key in skill gap isn't that good players can't smash publics, it is that great players don't get higher scores or do better than good players, or in a broader spectrum, excellent players 1 or 2 levels below legitimate MLG players can't demonstrate any dominance over experienced gen 50+ players that are great but not that great. An MLG player using scorch can not beat an intermediate player using Northstar. And in a match where you are getting 200 attrition points then suddenly get spawn trapped and ticked and sentry turret deaths forces your team to lose despite overwhelmingly better skills, and an enemy with one good kill streak can have their core ready to kill you no matter your skill level to continue a possible snowball their team already developed.

[@weirdchamp4601]

I just started playing last week and feel as if I’m pretty decent, but I got killed 8 times in a row by one guy before I killed him. Additionally, I’ve played matches where my whole team got absolutely fried and lost by a mile, there is definitely some skill gap

[@ryandane2134]

@@weirdchamp4601 TF2 has bunch of Cheaters on the Multiplayer Versus Mode sadily, I started 2 years ago and it took me 4 months to Get Regeneration 1 for my Character.

[@alexbloke2373]

When i got to good for my own good, i just started using snipers and grenadier weapons. Problem solved.

[@TrollerzTV]

@James Marshall for me it goes lmg/ar --> smg --> granadier --> pistols

[@favdoggam]

Yea me too, however sometimes i still like to pick up an alternator or a carbine, just for fun

[@arliecoyne1218]

@@TrollerzTV what about shotguns

[@creamy_peanut_butter_111]

@@arliecoyne1218 Eva was good but the mastiff was a different story

[@Zazume_]

Got into top 3 almost every game with at least 140 points in attrition, only using the CAR, Tone or Legion. Decided to try out something else and went for the Cold War. Managed to get a 222 points game with it, my best game in my ~60 hours so far. And people say, using the easy-to-use-stuff wouldn’t teach you anything.

[@knightjs3790]

So basically make the game a bit harder so people can't master it easily enough, but keep in guns like the smart pistol that are easily to use?

[@Allakain]

Knightjs Shaw I would not consider the smart pistol a noob weapon anymore considering you have to actually unlock it through the progression system both by leveling and in-match. You have to earn the good stuff now

[@hariznonis]

Yoshiki Kishinuma yes, but with time anyone can level up enough to get the good items. Not to mention the in-game credits which can permanently unlock said items.

[@Allakain]

Hariz Nonis true but honestly the Smart Pistol is not really a problem anymore. In TF1 I would totally agree as anyone can spawn with a smart pistol. But in TF2 you have to choose between a useful boost like battery or amped weapons over a secondary that you immediately drop if you die. I don't think the SP is a problem in TF2

[@Zerschnitzler77]

smart gun always feels like a handicap against my enemies because its way too slow

[@Allakain]

Lunat!c yeah, if I was really inclined to kill someone I'd rather use my trust R101 than a gun that aims for me

[@Elbethium]

there is always a skillgap. BUT, there is also a ping gap. some people play with a ping of 20-30, against people of ping 80 and up. you basically shoot faster than the other person, and these people think its skill.

[@aronwulf1580]

"It's so easy to be good at this game that there's nearly no room at all for an extremely good player to separate themselves from regular old good players." I don't completely agree with this statement. Titanfall 2 has many different mechanics and abilities that let players who have the perception, awareness, and creativity be clearly separate from those of lower values in those skills. I do think that there is a bit more luck involved in Titanfall 2, but still. Regardless, good vid Frothy. I like it when people actually talk about shite.

[@haydenhodson6793]

Definitely, and another way to separate yourself from the average scrub is to wipe the floor with awful guns like the grenadier weapons or snipers

[@crede333]

I feel like what he's trying to say is "it's easy to get good at playing smgs" l can't imagine anyone saying grenadier weapons have a low skill ceiling

[@dandyND]

I instantly dislike the video when he said that, while it maybe true for pilot gameplay but the main focus of this game is titan gameplay and that isn't forgiving at all. Titans are a distinc part of the franchise but it also hold back titanfall, new player have no chance whatsoever against a good titan players and it gets frustrating very quickly when you're trying to be better

[@Nagstersept109868]

I'm dedicated and I'm pretty good but I'm still playing. This argument is true as positioning, movement, and map awareness are the hardest things to master outside of aiming. The best way to tell if someone is good is if they use walls and don't do things like just sprinting at Titans that are looking right at them. Those are pretty easy things to learn so yeah I think the ceiling is pretty low. Compared to something like siege this game is very easy to be good at. However the game is still pretty fun at least for me. I don't have to take it as seriously as overwatch competitive or siege. The skill floor and ceiling may not be great at getting hardcore competitive gamers to keep playing with goals of mastery but for me, someone who just wants to have fun, Titanfall 2 is light years ahead of games like siege and overwatch. you don't have to take it so seriously because it's a relatively simple game and I think that's a great achievement by respawn rather than a failure.

[@Natanji]

I like the way the game is, it just feels nice that I can come out as a top player in many matches even when I've just got basic grips on the mechanics. I like the fact that the game is so much about positioning and movement and less about e.g. aim - that's the way it should be. Also, bunnyhopping and strafejumping isn't explained in this game either; without watching your videos and knowing a few tricks, I would still not bunnyhop at all. It is indeed rather easy to get to learn bunnyhopping, but even after knowing about it for months, I can't strafejump well at all. But I actually *like* the fact that I don't have to train to have fun in this game. I can just have fun like that.

[@seitan4943]

The skill cap in this game ends when you find the SMG list and the melee button.

[@sargentsteveEr]

I'll be honest, I'm not the best but when I get more skilled with bunny hopping and using the grapple to LITERALLY GET OVER HALF THE MAP IN A SINGLE SECOND, I'll stand out but for now I think I shine a bit more Lol jk I still get matched with skrubs for some reasons that are still gen 1 fighting a gen 4

[@ncrveteranranger2483]

SargentsteveEr Gaming! Im surprised there are still Gen 4 Scrubs, most of us are 10 or above since we were capped at Rep 10 for so long

[@zyonhenderson67]

Onyx Dragon I mean, some of us like to play overwatch

[@sargentsteveEr]

Onyx Dragon gotta love xbox live prices mate

[@ncrveteranranger2483]

SargentsteveEr Gaming! I know the feel, Im on Xbox One where you gotta pay got gold/xbox live, plus Im Australian, which means anything and everything gaming/electronic based is like 40% more expensive than other countries, rather silly

[@davidhart7205]

image sifi ww2

[@Katana314]

It seems disturbingly common that I see comments like "I tried Titanfall 2 and because X was difficult, I felt like the skill gap was too high." Then a veteran will reply "That's not true at all. With the grapple ability, the skill gap has been tightened considerably and yak yak-" NO. That is not how game testing works. That is not how perceptions work. You don't just get to tell people they're wrong about their view of a game because you played it longer. Ultimately, they're RIGHT about how they view the game, and that *perception* is what matters, especially if it's coming from a novice who *has* actually given the game a fair shake of a few hours. Getting an understanding of where that perception comes from is important, and can be an important step to working out how to fix that perception. I honestly think Frothy is not the right sort of person to make this analysis. He's too good at the game - he has the right idea, but he can't identify what feelings cause the game to seem more difficult. It could be that bunnyhopping is easier, but a really strong knowledge of the maps is still needed to figure out where to go with it; and it still doesn't feel like an intuitive to people just starting out. I'd like to see some more novices trying the game, and able to give their accurate take on what they didn't understand much, what they would like to see. And of course, being a novice, their opinion could be taken with a grain of salt, but still; it could in fact be a very different result than what we expect.

[@blank4227]

bad opinion

[@barnebyoconnell8176]

Good points

[@elliot16]

Im a novice, campaign was fun but multiplayer and the vast variety of gameplay mechanics feel overwhelming.

[@flowerthencrranger3854]

@@elliot16 It was like that for me, wish you luck.

[@zwoosh2288]

> Talking about skill gap >using Tone

[@GaiLuron578]

The funny thing is I think they don't actually have lower the skill floor that much. Is bunny hop really easier now with the slide ? Maybe the timing is more forgiving, but it adds another key to use, which is kind of a big deal for a game like this, especially for gamepads. And they are forcing you to use it, as wallrunning alone is not enough to fast now. Titans too have another ability (so another key to use). And all these things they've added, like booster, shit tons of weapons and unlocks, and stuff, it makes the game more intimidating at first. Sure, it's "fake" complexity, but the first game had a simple old school vibe to it that makes it easier to pick up I think. They've probably lowered the skill ceiling, but all in all I don't think they've lowered the skill floor that much.

[@TheSpyFromTeamFortress2]

Fair point

[@johnweslo9635]

"hard for skilled players to stand out" plays Highlights of litterally crapping on people.

[@Allakain]

I was very very good at Titanfall 1, I remembered for the longest time I always used the R101C with HCOG and extended magazines. I preferred using the Atlas with shield Regen and survivor while using cluster missiles and an arc cannon with a capacitor. I especially loved Stim as I used it to help me out in firefights to get me that little extra health boost and I used satchel charges for Titan damage. I miss Titanfall 1 but I respect the changes to the gameplay in Titanfall 2 to an extent. I do not like the camper mentality that Titanfall 2 has pushed with the A-Wall and Pilot sentry. I don't mind he A-Wall because you can be an aggressive A-Wall pilot but the pilot sentry was an awful idea. Anyway, Titanfall 1 I noticed from my own personal experience was an absolute nightmare. But once I got to Gen 10 I had put literal weeks of gameplay into that game. I was ridiculously good at Titanfall 1 to the point I could pick out minuet details of gunfire or the clanking of a pilot hopping onto my back when I was a Titan. I was easily peaking 150 attrition points and scoring over 15 pilot kills without even trying. But in Titanfall 2 I noticed I was dying much more easily than I remembered. I was being sniped out of the air by highly accurate G2 campers or guys running hemlocks absolutely annihilating me. I did not like these easy to use weapons that reward kills with one pull of the trigger. That's why I liked the arc cannon (with capacitor) so much because the game rewarded me for my careful aim and patience by using a slow charging weapon with high damage output. Not these ridiculous high rate of fire guns that kill in 2-3 bullets. It's infuriating seeing new players gravitate towards guns like the devotion or Hemlock (pre nerf) because it does not take much skill to use these weapons and rewards you with easy kills. All in all, I liked Titanfall 1's skill curve. But I don't to an extent mind TF 2's attempt at making the game more appealing to new players for the sake of getting more people to play. This is all coming from a Xbox one user btw :)

[@antvomit]

Yoshiki Kishinuma well said. Nothing triggers me more than hearing and being killed with a G2 or a Devotion. Do you still find yourself playing TF1 from time to time?

[@zakmccarthy6703]

Yoshiki Kishinuma Extremely well put. Perhaps for TF 3 Respawn could try to implement a skill curve that is a middle ground to that of TF 1 and 2. Just so that players are rewarded more for their skill with wall-running and tactics rather than being able to aim and shoot. That's what made the original so fresh and unique from other FPS games like Cod or Battlefield.

[@Allakain]

kgosietsile sere honestly and sadly I do not play TF1 anymore. I wish I still had the game :( And +Zak I totally agree. I think TF3 needs to work back on the mobility side of things. I remember being able to absolutely throw people off using the movement system making it impossible for either of us to kill each other. Sadly now this melee Lunge crap is getting me killed all over the place when I try to bounce around a room to throw people's aim off. But *shrug* whatever. I know Respawn will take TF2's problems and turn them into strengths for the next game. That's what they did for TF1 :)

[@zakmccarthy6703]

Yoshiki Kishinuma Well said.

[@Allakain]

Zak McCarthy thank you :) I have high hopes for Respawn. And next time hopefully they'll release it around a holiday and wait for after CoD launches :p

[@Solkard]

A lot of the complaints about the lack of a "skill gap" I see expressed ingame, is worded as the game not "punishing noobs". That or complaints that a "noob" shouldn't be able to kill [so and so] while they're mid parkour or grappling through the air. I see it more as a broadening of skills you need to use to "master" the game. What I often see in the streams of better players, is that they are able to identify the location of other enemies and engagements. They use that information to identify when it's appropriate to jump out a window or slingshot across the map space, without being shot by enemies that may be perched on the roof or an adjacent ridge. Instead, you have a lot of self-proclaimed "hardcore" players that feel they should have impunity from other factors like map layout or situational awareness, because they have "mastered" the wall run and grapple hook mechanics.

[@scrooglemcdoogle]

The extremely short time to kill doesn't help at all in keeping new players feeling helpless. Most people who run around with phase shift and an R-97 instantly deleting enemy pilots isn't exactly a great way to intoduce people to the game. I'm of the opinion that Titanfall would be infinitely better if the time to kill were doubled, both raising the skill cieling and making weapons such as the grenadier lineup much more viable.

[@FrothyOmen]

+scrooglemcdoogle that would raise the skill floor and make it harder for new players to win. Low ttk means anyone can compete. Raising ttk equates to new players scoring even less.

[@scrooglemcdoogle]

FrothyOmen At the same time new players may not feel as helpless as they do currently. Dying in a split second before having any time to react to a decent player is extremely disheartening to new players. It happened when I tried bringing on new players well into the Volt/Tone meta, and I see it happening now. That said I am biased towards games with longer times to kill such as TRIBES especially since I enjoy more skill-based projectile weapons such as the EPG. I've gotten to a point where I only really enjoy Titan combat for a variety of reasons.

[@hoxton_hummingbird]

my biggest concern with the game is g10+ players running their g50 smgs. that's breaking the game by using low skill based weapons on a high level. i hate it

[@alexcrouch9]

I exclusively play Last Titan Standing for this reason. I was awful when I first started playing pilots, so I switched to LTS so I could at least be in a titan for once. I was obviously bad at that too at first, but seeing the amount of damage I had done made me feel like I was contributing even though I wasn't getting kills. That feeling of accomplishment was what made the learning process worth it for me.

[@maxman4410]

I agree wholeheartedly. the TTK need to all least be increased to the point in which 1 shot by an assault rifle from across the map from a random newbie will not instantly eradicate your character. and the servers should have a little work done on them too to prevent any other annoying pinpricks on the back of people's necks.

[@finleyrobinson9426]

The gap is somewhere between Iniquity and Jerdude.

[@rufusstanier8893]

Or Gamesager and Butterbar, for that matter.

[@Lessthanmediocre]

Finley Robinson players in the iniquity PRPL ps4 network are the legit worst to play with.

[@connorarbuckle2654]

iniquity.. isn't good. sorry.

[@Lessthanmediocre]

i wouldn't say that he's not good, but he does inspire a certain level of obnoxiousness from people that are in his network that comes out in games.

[@modernwize]

IMO the real issue for new players is when they enter a multiplayer public match playing solo, or with a single friend, and the other team has a full clan all using comms. Getting double and triple teamed by metas probably causes them to give up on the game. Respawn could fix this by creating a dedicated clan lobby. Or if 3 or more people are in a group they get moved to a clan server.

[@MrHyjac]

I honestly don't know why I've been hearing so much shut given about this game. Ttk skill gap...THIS GAME IS THE FUCKING SHIT! I'm fine with making the skill ceiling a little higher but keep everything else the game is serious unreal it's super fast paced in your face launching through the air and kneeing somebody in the back of the fucking skull then disappearing what other game can you do that where the movement is even close to that fluid. Respawn has seriously created a gem and like I said I don't mind if they make the skill ceiling higher but please for the love of all that you love please do not change anything else this game is like shit I've dreamed of or talked about with friends or seen in a cool anime and now there's something physical that exist that is all those things and more. KEEP IT UP RESPAWN. See you space cowboy...

[@FrothyOmen]

+MrHyjac Yeah I'm with you. Respawn really struck a chord in making the game accessible, look cool, and feel good. They just dumbed down a couple things a little too much and that's what I'd like to see be brought back up in the future.

[@caleb5925]

FrothyOmen All they need is a competitive mode that balanced differently, that's literally the answer to all games with wacky skill gaps. Many successful games do that...

[@parkillerness]

the ridiculous aim assist and general tone design is what drove me from this game. I would pay $100 if tf3 has a meta of cold war on stacks (I play xbox one one) because that shit was so much fun!

[@vh3hazy295]

This is mostly directed towards the competitive or high end gamers who play. For the average person, they created a phenomenal game. But for the really good players, they basically nerfed us which makes it kind of frustrating when we put in tons of hours to get as good as we are. It's still a great game, but there's still a little room for improvement on respawns behalf.

[@elchinothegreat4977]

Has no one heard of benchy??? look him up n tell me if ur that good....if not then theres still alot of ceiling left

[@ender_z4nd3r83]

I thought before watching this video that I had a high level at the game because being gen 5 I was destroying guys gen 40 and even 90, know I feel because of this video that everyone can do that and im just an average player

[@GMGperks]

lower the aim assit on assault rifles. ESPCIALLY THE G2

[@rameetsandhu809]

GMGperks yes PLEASE

[@chairiot]

I get paired with G10's+ who still use G2. I can safely say that I fucking hate it.

[@Gamer88334]

This is late, but I'm an R-201 user and I think the damage for the R-201 should get lowered. I think it should require at least 4 shots to kill a Pilot at close range. Grunts? I think the damage should remain the same because they're Grunts.

[@RiTides]

Man I wish I could like this video 1000 times! I was so in love with TItanfall 1 (not everyone was, I know!) and I think your comments about Respawn lowering the skill floor for Titanfall 2, and that not being a bad thing, are spot on. But I felt the exact same way on the skill ceiling - making it super easy for everyone to bunny hop across the map, removing shields from titans so that there's less ways for a skilled player to back off and keep their titan alive... I just didn't feel like this game was worth my time. In the first, I played certain map packs over and over to the point I had a crazy win ratio on some, because I had practiced every nook and cranny over and over. On this one, it just feels like anyone can be good... I mean, CTF shows it blatantly, stim + grapple (another thing you mention in the video) means almost anyone can be an amazing runner. Overall, I bought an Xbox One specifically for this game, but unfortunately just couldn't keep playing it based on the above. I hope they find the balance with an eventual Titanfall 3...

[@mallow2902]

I just started playing TF2's multiplayer this past weekend after I played the campaign a month or two ago. As someone who normally HATES PvP shooters I absolutely love this game and feel that I can swing with the big boys with a little practice. I even appreciate that some of my experience in Warframe with its crazy movement system is being rewarded in a PvP setting. Fantastic game, really hope they make a Titanfall 3.

[@xypod]

0:33 but that aint skill Frothy. That's just being a lame pilot

[@jc3636]

One thing I most liked about this game was the low skill gap. I am decent at general shooters but am quickly outleveled. Not in titanfall. I was taking out gen 20 players at level 4 and we were all enjoying it. I didn't notice different levels

[@CarterHerrigstad]

I always use different weapons to keep myself engaged and fair so I don't rely too much on one

[@domhudak3456]

Same everybody just uses R201 and spitfires and will spray and pray, I try to use a lot of grenadier weapons. I love the cold war and softball, the epg will always have a special place in my heart

[@mickael922]

I'm backing you up 100%. I really miss Titanfall 1 where you had to work for every single kill (assuming you're not using Arc Canon), and where the melee was actually a melee and not some sort of hyper lunge that is literally killing the game for me right now..

[@liamcole1769]

Miketama I thought I was the only one who liked TF1 more, preordered and played till release of TF2...gotta say, I think I don't enjoy TF2 as much.

[@lookiss8502]

Miketama And the "wallrun" on random debris on the ground kills my mojo in games. Also the lack of shotgun variety is kinda stupid too. AND RONINS 360 SWORD BLOCK.!!!!

[@nathanjamison830]

Mickael Then why do I still suck ass? Every single time I log on, my ass is thrown in a match that consists of people on fucking GAMESAGERS LEVEL, it's not fun

[@commonsense2191]

The red outline is the thing that alienates me the most in TF|2, in the first it rewarded those who learned to tell the difference between pilots and grunts, and gave them a huge advantage against the other players, and it also made the game easier for beginners, as they were mostly able to move around without drawing attention from the majority of players, as they thought they may have been another AI, the red outline instantly puts a target on your head, making pilots much easier targets, paired with lower ttk, pilots must basically end up fighting only each other, making it more difficult for every player to stay alive.

[@robotface42O]

No one will see this but i love how you need frame perfict wall kicks to gain speed past 40 without boosts. Now with crouch kicks its even easier yet you can loose all that speed if your slightly off which broadens the skill Gap

[@yez1062]

Well, I'm french, so I don't understand anything... but double jump doesn't slows you down

[@blazemaster41]

Here's my two cents on a high ceiling cap. I think that a mechanical ceiling cap, (i.e. decreasing active frames to bunny hop, etc) is not the way to go in a shooter. The purpose of the game revolves around moving shooting, positioning and fast paced reactions. Introducing complex mechanical inputs into that kind of game really doesn't align well with it's purpose. Rather, the skill gap should be expanded using gameplay that focuses on allowing players to differentiate themselves within the key elements of run and gun, instead of arbitrarily increasing the difficulty of basic movement.

[@bladewolfvii6383]

I think a lower skill gap is a good thing. Not because I am to lazy to get good, but mainly because A it allows me to compete even if i can't spend a lot of time, and B it allows me to play with friends without a need to carry them. I can experiment with positioning, I can experiment with strategies, and I can play offmeta loadouts without major drawbacks.

[@mxcascade]

As a competitive melee player looking at titanfall 2 and knowing theres lots of tech was an amazing idea for me. Main problem is unlike Melee with SSBM tutorials and Smashboards, TF2 has no scripted well made tutorials or archive for techniques (Melee Library)

[@ender_z4nd3r83]

The skill ceiling of titanfall 2 compared to titanfall 1 may seem low, but compare it to most arcade shooters and titanfall 2 has a high skill ceiling, not the highest like quake, but high

[@vorlonesque1830]

On bunny hopping...QW, CPMA, and Q3 (albeit that was strafe jumping) were very forgiving when it came to inputting your jumps but those systems still allowed for a high skill ceiling (some players could move at 1000ups or more in QW...1000ups is the speed of a Q1/QW rocket).

[@zarryc1687]

I hate the fact that two thirds of my deaths come from sources I cannot fight back against, such as melee or pilot sentries. I hate it that I get to work for my kills, while other people can just place a turret or press V once and get them for free. And I despise the fact that, with the movement system nerfed to oblivion, my ability to avoid death or fight back properly has been hampered dramatically. Titanfall 2 has become a CoD clone for me. The skill gap in the two games is very similar. Despite the fact that my k/dr is sitting at 3.5 and my win rate is over 80%, I do not enjoy playing Titanfall anymore and I get angry and annoyed whenever I try to it again. The kills I get do not feel satisfying, since they require no effort and work from me. And the all my deaths feel extra frustrating, since they are cheesy, unfair and there is nothing I can do to avoid them.

[@WhiffyByName]

Amen

[@petervillent5573]

Same here. I tried to play with my own loadout for fun, but all I saw was the same loadout in enemy teams (Stim to break hit registration to their favour, arc grenade with silly radious to futher cripple enemy, alternator / epg for easy kills with a Tone or Ronin as their titan). It's was frustrating to trying to have fun, so I switched to R-201, firestar + grapple + Legion. I am winning more, but is it fun to play meta? Nah. The thing I hate the most in this game is a meta after Monarch DLC. Suddenly everybody switched into corner picking waiting game and grouping up. It's stupid, it's boring, it's irritating.

[@zakmccarthy6703]

Zar ryc Yeah TF 1 felt more satisfying in terms of skill and play-style.

[@davidhart7205]

move out fier dash or conter the flam with ur shield

[@TheSpyFromTeamFortress2]

How did the Monarch’s Reign update affect this, hm?

[@Nikolai-McGuire]

wingman elite. wingman. kraber. advanced movement. titan play. using tacs correctly. using satchels correctly. correct use of projectile weapons. correct perk use. aim. tracking. high reaction time. dodging bullets. correctly using boosts. game sense. map knowledge. those things can make you a untouchable god in Titanfall | 2.

[@tjbarke6086]

I'm not sure I really see it, even at my best scores and best matches, players like Iniquity easily double my kill counts. Easily.

[@jamesnugent6451]

thank you, I am a huge Titanfall player but I let myself get rusty at this point just so I can feel the thrill of trying to become good again. after all so many of the guns are just too easy to use and the player skills are so close that it doesn't matter if your extremly good if every good player can get the jump on you because of cheap tricks

[@hanswurst9138]

Its all down to someones determination and maturity when dealing with losing. To take quake as an example like in the video: it is hard, especially for new players. But the satisfaction to finally get good is something else compared to an easy accessible game that most people play. Because of the feeling of achievement. This is not meant to be a diss towards accessible games, but from time to time i recommend to try out a harder game to get into, it also shapes your mindset in reallife. You wont back down so easy anymore in front of challenging work/times/projects whatever.

[@christiannichols2403]

I think the skill gap is right where it should be but I'm just a good gamer as u out it so who knows the dedicated few brought me into the game so Respawn has done what they need to sell copies and make enough to produce Titanfall 3 in the future and that's what I'm happy about.

[@jompis007]

1440p 60fps

[@FrothyOmen]

+JxRaid 😎

[@Secret_Takodachi]

I can't quite put my finger on it but I think the biggest issue with a lower skill floor/ceiling comes from the inability of 1-2 players being unable to "carry" the team in many modes because the combo of lower floor/ceiling means that even with near flawless play the probability of turning around games is extremely low. The advantages gained by the competent team outweigh the performance and skill of the 1-2 high performing players on the other team in a way that makes their comeback dependent on the winning team making serious errors which means no amount of skill and effort can turn some games around because the winning team only needs to perform one action proficiently in order to counter the skilled player performing several actions flawlessly. An easy example is a lone Northstar trying to 1v1 the last enemy Titan; I've had several instances in this scenario where despite whittling down the enemy health and killing a pilot or two that are trying to finish me off; inevitably 1 of the half dozen Archer rockets fired at me connects and boom, round over. You can only dodge for so long and you can only hit 1 target at a time but auto tracking rockets are fire and forget and if you choose a Titan that doesn't have countermeasures to effectively deal with the low skill floor weapons you are likely to get punished for it. Archers aren't nearly as bad now, but they're a prime example of "hold RT to kill the player more skilled than you".

[@Secret_Takodachi]

TLDR: Lower Skill floor+Ceiling means that experienced players have to accept that winning doesn't mean you played better than the opponent it just means your team failed less often than them. Aka cumulative team skill is higher than the opponents but isn't necessarily "high" from an objective view.

[@issanagii8338]

I find it funny that the whole gameplay is Titans yet he didn't even mention how much skill it take to use Titans

[@OnionThyme]

As far as I know, I don't have fun when I get stomped by the opposing team, but I can admire their skill, and feel bad when I am the one doing the stomping. I also hate when I get carried through a match because it feels like I didn't do too well.

[@augza3472]

You basically summed up my feelings about Overwatch. I'm still enjoying Titanfall 2 and I'm hoping the rumored 3 weapon slot update increases the possible skill ceiling.

[@MrFullmetalDAN]

I've tried to learn bunnyhop and airstrafing for some time, I did pretty well, but soon I realized, that there is no point in mastering my skills in this game. I am still winning a lot and I am constantly in top3, even without using any special techniques. And I am not very good at shooters, you know, just an usual player. And considering low amount of players in the game and ping issues, I am quitting the game for now. It's getting new updates and stuff, but there is nothing to achieve, no competitive, nothing. I absolutely love titanfall 2, but it just stopped providing me with fun and new gameplay moments.

[@logicaltips4107]

It's that getting to know these things makes the game more fun/ satisfying

[@ethandonnelly1973]

Start using silly loadouts dude. Arc grenade and stim, melee only. Holopilot and saltballs, only grenade kills. All that good stuff

[@ajaxcrackmaster930]

who cares about ranking systems? lmao

[@ethandonnelly1973]

Ajax Crackmaster People that want to play against people that aren't guaranteed to stomp them. Hence, "Matchmaking"

[@patrickdsouza398]

Ethan Donnelly titanfall 2 isn't a popular enough game to introduce matchmaking. If the game was as popular as CoD, battlefield, Rainbow six or Gears; like it deserves. Then they would add matchmaking.

[@cameronsmalley5994]

good scorch mains are the ceiling, and the floor is tone mains, devotions, and smart pistols

[@TANMAN-lb7eb]

Ironic that a video about the skill gap includes gameplay of Tone..

[@ManMan-wd9zc]

Tanner Nunn lol

[@AtharvGoel]

Why? Do you still think Tone is super easy to use?

[@xypod]

indeed

[@FrothyOmen]

+Tanner Nunn it's really appropriate. It goes to show just how easy this fame has come, and how the need for good mechanics has been driven way down. It's insanely easy to kill pilots with the 40mm, compared to tf1 which was much harder especially vs airborne pilots.

[@liamhendon9804]

Z

[@whale7215]

I think increasing the ttk will help a lot because then knowing movement will help people kill faster and get an edge.

[@skeleton1765]

I totally agree. When I play call of duty games I consistently make top 1-2 on my team. When I play Battlefield I consistently stay in the middle. But, in TF2 I might join a game half way and end up on the top of the leaderboard, or play a full game and just get hit with unlucky streak after unlucky streak and end up at the bottom. I took a break from games for a while and I came back to all new maps in TF2. The first several games I couldn't hit shots or anything, but then I played a game and I was always in the right place at the right time and I ended up with like 160 point in attrition on a map I had played twice. It took me about three hours to climb the skill ladder to where I was when I left off. If I tried the same thing with Battlefield it would take me days of practice to get back to even being mediocre.

[@mgustafson2010]

Trying to overcome the skill gap is hard for me cuz I consistently switch between smg's, assault rifles, sniper rifles, and grenadiers at least a million times a match.

[@mgustafson2010]

@Eli Whitesell thats true I guess im still trying to find out which load outs guns boosts ect work best for me

[@italy8535]

You could argue that forcing players to switch weapons and throughout a match could be a way for players to experience different styles and actually enjoy a variety a encounters during the 15 minutes playtime, as the developers wanted people to actually have fun with the game and not make players stick to the one weapon the entire time. However, staying to one gun the entire match means that you are proficient in the weapon and implies that you don't need to compensate for other players tactics or weapons. So its really up to you how you play, do you want to have fun or do you want a killing montage with a alternator and still have fun?

[@mgustafson2010]

@@italy8535 yeah! I like that I appreciated that about the campaign too. It kinda forced you to keep picking up random weapons and get better at all of them. I def think it's fantastic the developers are trying to dissuade campers and toxic mains. I def play more for fun and not competitively so ill usually switch from sniper to grenadier to LMG then SMG in one match

[@hydra66]

I got very good at quake 3. However the need to practice to get halfway good at the game made it more difficult to introduce new players to it esp if they got destroyed in deathmatch modes. That said a 'difficult to master' game is what keeps people interested and coming back to a game. Games like quake 3 and tribes ascend are memorable to me for that reason. That fist pump when you achieve something challenging is a must haven't started on titan fall 2 yet due to playing other games but looking forward to it.

[@TheFrenchFryFiend]

Yes. I think they went too far with trying to make the game easier. Titanfall 3 needs to end up in the middle between the two games even though I would prefer Titanfall 1.5 personally. Playing on console most of the time you get punished for using the movement and wallrunning across the map because of the combination of lower TTK and the very high aim assist with some weapons. The difficulty is what made me want to continually get better at Titanfall 1 and that difficulty isnt present at all in Titanfall 2. As much as I hated the smart pistol in Titanfall 1 I would take that over the abilities that are available in Titanfall 2 to reduce the skill gap. If they level and hour capped it, the smart pistol could be used as a primary again instead of the A-wall and pilot sentries.

[@zakmccarthy6703]

TheFrenchFryFiend Yeah you can be really punished for trying to wallrun in Titanfall 2. With the 3 lane design in these maps, opposing players can pick you off really easily due to the smaller TTK, powerful long-ranged weapons and with there being limited cover options. It feels really different from the original, where you were rewarded for your parkour skills and ability to get up close and personal with enemy pilots. In TF 2 though, I find it more common for players to just simply stay far away and pick off other players. And if they got attacked, they could use stim, phaseshift or grapple to simply escape and to find a new camping spot. It just dissapoints me.

[@HNGamingOfficial]

TheFrenchFryFiend there will be no titanfall 3. this game didn't make enough money. they made two mobile games instead, and even cancelled one of them.

[@TheLunarFX]

Bet the skill floor will be really low, but you can pay to raise it. ;) thanks EA.

[@pipboy3000PS3]

2 other games with amazing jobs on the skill gap that don't get enough credit, Crysis (2/3) And COD Advanced Warfare. These games nailed it by making you feel like a god once you acclimatized to the controls and the meta, but didn't feel unfair, as EVERYONE had access to the same base abilities by default. Everyone could use ALL the tools at their disposal, and the game meta was about HOW WELL you could use them, Essentially offering a skill ceiling that was only limited by a players fearlessness (or recklessness). I really wish that game devs would take a look at the meta of these games. Things like strafe dashing, air stomp, and a toggle shield/cloak function were not only game changers, but really fun additions to the FPS genre. Games like Titanfall could really benefit from their addition, and it would give more space in the skill gap for players to mess around in and master. If all you are doing is using the same skills over and over again, then there is an artificial skill ceiling that will always limit players' ability to have fun and improve, it's only by changing and challenging them that the true skill gap and ceiling can emerge. Basically long story short, these games need to add more things to challenge the player. They need to put more tools in your toolbox.

[@SkeletonMan226]

honestly I think balancing the tactical abilities better could help end your concerns with the skillgap Froth-Lord. but I wholeheartedly agree that it's hard to play the way you truly want when everyone's chasing the meta.

[@tgmwright]

This happened between MW2 multiplayer and MW3 multiplayer. Skill ceiling came crashing down.

[@Paul_Ivanish]

Which is why I've noticed some rather prompt (albeit perhaps short-term) return to Titanfall by some player friends of mine. Personally I'm occupied with other games atm, but I'm thinking of re-installing Titanfall to my regular line-up of mid-week night-time videogame menu just because of the sheer fun of it.

[@onlyicedgarrett7791]

I at a level where I'm getting high on the leaderboard often, like very often (on console so keep in mind), but I don't know if it's more attributed to my actual skill level, my opponent's lack thereof, or my skill level being 'good enough' then the game taking it from there. I still have a load of fun a lot of the time in Titanfall 2, sure it gets frustrating too, but for me, I never play games that aren't frustrating at all. Hearing about this, it makes me feel like a decent player carried to the top of the leaderboard by mechanics abuse, because I'm no legend or god at FPS games, I've just played them casually for a long time. But even given that, I can't quite feel out for sure whether or not I'm getting carried, or by how much. Maybe that's the point where I think I, as casual of an FPS player as you can find, would get fed up with skill gap compression. Getting kills that aren't entirely or even mostly attributed to me is just silly.

[@gusnordic]

Being an average player at best I feel there are still some very profound things in TF2 that separate players with high levels of skill from myself. Chief among them being the Kraber, the grapple and the EPG. All three of these things are incredibly powerful tools that I can't get a single kill with.

[@EingefrorenesEisen]

Easiest way to fix this: - Add all the HTTK playlist changes (except maybe for the TTK itself) - remove that dumb mechanic where your aim is worse while airborne than on the ground.

[@ItsCioffi]

The skill ceiling for LTS is definitely higher than you think, at least in my opinion. Titan fights are so extremely nuanced.

[@coldcoffeegaming2798]

Frothy when talking about the flow I though that you meant that the tools for lesser skilled players took less skill yet the ones for highly skilled players took more skill but were more rewarding when mastered.

[@DARKWRXITH]

I agree, however, I think a talented pilot that can utilize their wall runs and movement can easily dispatch a meta user (G2, R2, R1 and Tone). I also believe a talented titan who knows the mechanics of their main titan can take care of tones and monarchs

[@marcobarrientos4953]

Thats exactly why I only use the Grenadier weapons, its so much more challenging to get kills with them and good movement skills really help your chances of staying alive, sure these weapons do high damage but at a slow rate and good luck trying to get direct hits with these weapons while your moid air and your target is either in the air or moving really fast aswell. Also I could be wrong but these weapons have no aimasisst, so its all on your aiming and timing if you get kills with them

[@Kimahri01]

Frothy this is so true. I'm not a speed pilots, I only wall run and know some routes to go quick to when I want, but I'm not quick, don't do bunny hop, use stim or grappling. But I'm very good reading the radar, and this give me the upper hand, I play high damage medium range weapon, plus cloak and arc grenade, and this is all I need for a pilot, I play extra battery, I'm not the best pilot, but I'm very good with the six titans. Right now I was 1 and a half mont without internet and I return to see the Monarch DLC, and god, my score drops from always too top 3 to to many games with less of 80 point. Fight a lvl Monarch is to difficult, and i having problem using Monarch, I don't see the flow. But hey, I hope with some practice learn how to defeat Monarch with each titan, learn how to use Monarch and return to the good score in Attrition

[@cplcraw5417]

The thing is bhopping isn't good but slide hopping has a few seconds before you lose all ypur momentum meaning that as long as you learn to air starfe slightly you can keep speed even with bad timing

[@Eibon308]

When I first got Titanfall 2, I thought since I'm new I'd play with other new players.. I was facing G 10's(at the time that was the max gen). I was like jeez can I enjoy the game before I have to sweat just to get a few kills. Since the game was unforgiving to me, I am unforgiving to new players and many like me. Who make the game hard to enjoy for new people.

[@AquaGaming1607]

I would argue that playing against pros as a new player makes you better. I always played against G5-10s, and I got way better because the ass kicking I took made me more aware, and more skillful.

[@crede333]

There is a high skill ceiling if you don't only play smgs and overpowered titans. Getting good with weapons like the wingman elite and the softball for example is very hard but very rewarding

[@RazgrizRaptor]

I honestly hadn't thought about this issue since I've only just recently learned how to bunny hop in Titanfall 2 (still can't turn tho). still it's an interesting problem that I would have never even thought of.

[@acezero8132]

For me in the first Titanfall game I would rip up the enemy team singlehandedly whether I'm a pilot (which I mostly am), or in a Titan, but my team would still lose the game for me since I always get the worst players on my side. So my KDR is a 4.2 which is good, but my win rates for some maps would be close to 50%. In my opinion, they needed to fix the team balance instead of handing players like me the lower half of both teams from previous matches. Not sure how it is in Titanfall 2 though. Anyone else had a similar problem?

[@Tobascodagama]

I'm not sure I agree that Titanfall 2 has a low skill floor. A huge amount of the feedback I see from people who try Titanfall and walk away is that they don't feel like they can keep up with vets. So while I agree with you that the skill gap is too compressed, I think it's too compressed in *both* directions.

[@belchicola]

I think he's saying it's a high skill floor. Either way, I get what you mean. There's a strange barrier to entry since the movement is unlike any other FPS for the most part (except TF1) but once you get even a small grasp on the flow of the game and movement, it becomes possible to utilize a lot of the game's mechanics as "crutches," so to speak.

[@pestyoverlord]

High aim assist, melee teleportation and the way tone is designed all make the game less fun for me. Not to mention the 3 Lane map design that encourages players to hardscope without moving.

[@logicaltips4107]

Have you ever tried to use the Kraber? That gun "sucks" so bad. P.S. Tone is actually one of the weakest titans due to her predictability, at least in my opinion

[@pestyoverlord]

Syntax ERROR I guess I was wrong then. that settles that. tone is a high skill Titan. I learned something new.

[@LordStarbeard]

you play today syntax?

[@TylerAndToast]

pestyoverlord melee teleportation for real! That should not be a 1 hit kill. If I had to choose one thing to change it would be melee

[@jesseclark7105]

The game moves too fast to NOT have 1HK melee. Good players don't spend enough time on the ground to get hit twice by the same person. Most of the people I kill with melee (besides Grunts) are standing on a rooftop or hiding in a doorway, and that's not how you play this game if you want to win. Most of the people that kill me with melee are kicking me in the face because they're in midair, and if it wasn't 1HK, they'd never actually kill someone with it.

[@theonlycharmander7025]

2:46 did anyone else notice the perfect sync with tones reload an the guys voice?

[@kevink.2435]

Maybe that's why they put guns like Hemlok, Devotion, G2 in the game? Those guns where made strong so player with no experience and skill could have fun. Same with Tone and Ion. The problem is that they not move on to other weapons. Those weapons are turning to crutches.

[@cdz3210]

The skill gap is an angle that goes in on itself

[@ikai640]

I got 2 steps for you guys: Step 1: git Step 2: gud

[@araybritosantana2815]

I have 3 steps too: Step 1:Don't Step 2:Rage Step 3:Quit

[@zarryc1687]

Point is, you can't get good in Titanfall 2.

[@zyonhenderson67]

Zar ryc U dont win, you just get better each time

[@ebo38]

Check the leaderboards.

[@MrdotKstar]

I don't own the game but played a trial. I always thought TF|2 had a high skill celling. I found the original to be easier

[@austinparks7428]

In public matches you can usually tell the difference between decent players and really good ones, but public games probably aren't a good view to judge the skill ceiling off of.

[@gorpo2766]

While I know titanfall 2 is a more well rounded game with a fantastic story and loads of content, I can never stop myself from going back to titanfall 1 and having so much more fun with it. I found it to be so much easier yet required mastery compared to tf2. Tf1 was skill in map knowledge and weapon usage whereas tf2 was gimmicky weapons at 6mph in the air.

[@WethDeath]

in fact, last round I played and I was continuously found by one person for 5 times, I am sure that I just reborn and haven't done anything yet..... but in the kill record, I found the player suddenly go straight through me while the time that I reborn.... I don't know what happen if it is some sticks or a cheat and the player seems to be a Japan player

[@DARKWRXITH]

And also, I don't usually see basic players flying across the map or bunny hopping, yeah there's a lot of grapple users but they don't know how to properly integrate on their movement and suffer from lack of understanding the full potential of their pilot abulities

[@zeptier1172]

So would easy to use weapons like the devotion and easy to use titans like Tone, legion, and Ion be part of this problem? I'm not saying that it's bad that they're accessible and appeal to those (like me) who don't have bunny hopping down (or aren't the best in general), I'm saying that because these items are so easy to use they make the game feel a lot easier then I would expect it to be not that it isn't because Titanfall 2 is a difficult game in some sections. So point being is that I'm not sure if some easy to use weapons and titans (Tone, Legion, and Ion) are part of this problem (weapons being Devotion, Car, Hemlock, G2, R-97, did I miss anything?).

[@SEOwithErik]

Imo, if Respawn were to add ranked game modes for a potential upcoming Titanfall title, the skill gap could be tweaked to the way a lot of players feel it should be, trying to do anything that changes the fundamentals of Titanfall 2 such as increased ttk or reducing aim assist makes the game play completely different than what players were used to and that is a very big risk to do especially with the population that we currently have on all platforms. Addressing these fundamentals on a newer title would start everyone out on the same playing field and based on the way they play, the game will level them to where they belong skill wise with any changes they did to the title.

[@AdmiralCabbage]

strongly disagree. the main idea of this video was all over the place and all i took away was "not enough mechanics for dedicated players to master." while i think it's a fair analysis when compared to the frame-perfect button presses of titanfall 1, i believe that titanfall 2 is the most mechanically deep and engaging shooter on the market right now; we're still exploring all of the uses of the grappling hook tbh

[@themostaverageofjoes989]

The skill ceiling was high with this game to begin with, and still is. I think Frothy only speaks for a minute amount of players who have spent such an excessive amount of time on Titanfall 2 that it couldn't be the players boring them, but the game itself.

[@anthonytedesco4720]

I can definitely agree that the skill floor is a lot lower because of how many casual and exploitable things exist in this game. And yes I agree that the ceiling is a lot lower and it is easier to play skillfully than tf1 but I personally don't think it matters because most players are too busy playing at the lowest possible skill level to even bother getting better in terms of game sense and movement because they can perform so well with the easy to use tools given to them.

[@ENDIEKID]

in titanfall, the only reason why i'm no Speed-sus, is due to the fact that whenever i want to go fast, i get caught on the smallest prop, get caught on it, and my piolet tries to climb the damn obstacle, but get caught short by a smart pistol up the ass. These props can be from the pipes attatched on the wall, to a pole in the middle of the street

[@FrothyOmen]

+Depressing dot Co. It's super hard. I still get stuck on stuff constantly too.

[@ENDIEKID]

Glad i'm not the only one. I thought i was just an ignorant dipshit XD

[@NateofDrake]

Last time I played online, most matches weren't very close. One team always seemed to get a 'pro' who would just roll face and rack up absurd number of kills. Maybe things are different at the competitive end, but sure felt like there was a big skill gap then.

[@grren1782]

I feel like PC got the better deal here with our lack of aim assist and insanely high-skill ceiling simply created by the control system, along with the unpopularity of the G2 and the much more active and friendly community, even though it's smaller. extremely high school cap weapons like the EPG actually have use on PC. although making slide hopping / bunny hopping easier was a mistake I still think that the PC Community is a bit more competitive.

[@christopherkeselburg8160]

I thought they made bunny hopping harder. in TF1 you just had to hit A at the right time, now you have to jump, crouch in mid-air, and aim at the same time. I'm on console so you either have to use weird control schemes, get carpal tunnel by using the claw, or buy a scuf controller if you want to bunnyhop and airstrafe smoothly.

[@grren1782]

Christopher Keselburg On PC you can rebind and have a ton of options so

[@AcceptGamingDKD]

On consoles you can do the same thing now. Bunny hopping got much easier when I mapped my left trigger to crouch and left bumper to jump. I never ADS in this game, I like to hipfire everything even at longer ranges like a madman while maxing my fov. Then again this titanfall 2 is diffrent then it was 4 months ago when your comment was posted morte

[@melind82]

I think the only real problem is the things in the game that help lower the bottom of the skill ceiling and make the game accessible to new players is also the optimal way to play the game at the higher end of the skill ceiling (mostly). A very hard problem to solve - our lord and savior, GameSager, has done some good videos about the problem of competitive play with TF2 which tie in nicely with this video.

[@PrinterStand]

I think the lack of high end competition and low skill ceiling is basically the reason I play TF2. I play other games very competitively like rainbow six siege, COD and CS:GO. While playing MLG ladder matches is great. Sometimes I want something much more casual yet not something totally braindead. That where Titanfall 2 comes in beautifully. It's not super competitive and I don't have to dump hours of study and mental focus to get some kills. Yet it's not totally brain dead so it still has just enough skill requirement to keep my competitive mind interested. In short it's the chill but not brainless casual shooter I've been looking for. When I've become stressed out from losing an MLG COD Tourney, I love how I can get in my Titan and squash grunts. If Titanfall 2 was more serious about high-end competitive game play I don't think I would play it honestly.

[@astrealbrizbee9815]

All it takes is practice for everything, what we need is people actually there to help like the old days of Xbox Live

[@dontquestionmyname5490]

In titanfall 1, it took months to die less in a normal attrition match. In titanfall 2, it took day to learn with the a-wall and devotion to get 20 kills and 0 death. There should be a forum of shame for people to put the name of all the campers in titanfall 2

[@Nawor1996]

i honestly really liked the arc cannon. yeah it was cheese weapon, but lightning weapons are so cool

[@demotroniczz6943]

Hey frothy idk if you’ll see this because I’m literally years late but you totally remind me of a before-your-time IceManIsaac. You two are the only KZbinrs I’ve ever seen who talk about mindset and mentality and how it affects your gameplay and opponents while also speaking very clearly, at a decent speed (I have ADHD I hate slow talkers) and you guys both use a wide range of vocabulary I could listen to you talk for hours man. Maybe you could hop on the next COD game? I would watch every single vid man I love your stuff. Making 2020 bearable for me. How’s your 2020?

[@Multiverse8264]

'lunging through space and time itself to land attacks' Oh man do I feel that acutely.

[@sus_ape_society8833]

Well I think they should keep all of the fun stuff like slide hopping and wall running but they can do without smart pistols and Titans that are just putting a paper weight on left mouse button and winning. I like the accessible movement but not legion.

[@Mokey]

i didnt play titanfall 1. i had to put 350hours into titanfall2 on PC to consistenly get 35-40 kills every round no matter the weapon and always feel like im on top of my game. So there certainly is a bit of a skillgap

[@EdTowel-ww7yh]

Great assessment, but I disagree on at least three points. The first, melee attacks are ridiculous. A guy will punch from 5-10 feet away. My next point is a lot of the weapons have been nerved. For example, Tone's cannon, essentially a tank cannon, takes two shots to kill a simple Grunt or robot? Come on. Finally, they got rid of the suppressors and the pistols. That was a bad move as well.