What Issue Does Your Fandom NEVER Address?

What's the "elephant in the room" in your fandom, some plotline, character trait, or fan behavior that no one wants to acknowledge? Is it that a character is worse than everyone says they are? Is it something "gross" in the story that people like to pretend never happened? Are the popular fanfiction tropes problematic? And do you think it's for the best that it's ignored, or should people finally talk about it?
Here are some answers from the folks on Reddit, and let's talk about our own in the comments!
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[@joshuasgameplays9850]

“I’m in the Miraculous Ladybug fandom” I am so sorry.

[@SnickerDoodleBug05]

I absolutely hate the timeline. In one school year they went from 10th grade to 8th grade to 9th grade

[@mcyoinet3266]

I still can't believe that soccer episode with Chloé was actually real

[@AntonioTheTurtle]

I am in the fandom as well and the show is just a slog but once you watched it once you must watch it all no matter what.

[@mcyoinet3266]

@@AntonioTheTurtle I straight up couldn't continue after episode 18 of season 5

[@averagecupofcoffee]

@@SnickerDoodleBug05 wdym?

[@joypink5599]

“The miraculous Ladybug fandom”- Me: “Stop. That’s all you had to say.”

[@Grumpy_Hedgehog97]

This show needs to be on a bingo card.

[@montserratmarroquin400]

The fact that they literally made a statue out of the TERRORIST (because he literally made people afraid of being sad or angry) will never not baffle me

[@glam4663]

​@montserratmarroquin400 yes, because LB is a 'hero' and 'heroes keep thier promises' . Even if said promise was to a bad guy, because 'it's the right thing to do'

[@abbycollins]

I legit started writing magical girl au fanfiction for the first time, because I was so done with how bad miraculous was. Akumatization is such an amazing concept, so why did it originate from a shitty show?

[@hikari_drv3]

My exact thoughts. The show sucks

[@pferinne]

not a specific fandom, but for some reason like 90% of people in fandom are just incapable of describing female characters without just... calling them a girlboss or saying they're hot. like that's cool, do you know their personality though???

[@pferinne]

also, bsd fandom specific: if you're going to put atsushi/akutagawa and atsushi and kyouka having a sibling relationship in the same fic i think it should maybe be acknowledged that he's dating his sister figures abuser?? i never see it brought up and it would be interesting to see people explore more often

[@confusedfrog294]

@pferinne No bc I was literally about to mention the BSD fandom before I read your reply the women getting ignored is such a big problem. I don’t think I have ever seen the fandom mention Yosano outside of these four contexts: - She hot - Shipping (usually with other hot women) - Mori - Her ability (sometimes) And she’s one of the main cast, like the second most relevant woman in the series after Kyouka. It’s wild. I know people would (and sadly sometimes do) act the same about Kyouka if she wasn’t literally a child.

[@maevem316]

Fandom sexism my beloathed 😭 it's fucking everywhere

[@osheridan]

There's also the third option, where any girl who isn't an absolute doormat is referred to as a MONSTER. For example Katara. She's done wrong, yes, but she's a traumatised kid under massive stress. According to some ATLA fans, she's worse than Ozai.

[@averagecupofcoffee]

Even worse is when canon goes OUT OF THEIR WAY to make a character nothing but sex appeal. One of my favorite fictional characters EVER is Momo Yaoyorozu from MHA, and she’s infamous for being a 15 year old that almost _constantly_ has a boob window. She does have an actual personality, but most people don’t remember that very often.

[@chrisi308]

Lets remember kids, every abusive relationship is toxic, not every toxic relationship is abusive. The two terms are not necessarily synonymous.

[@sabinamcdaniel7412]

Can we also add, most abusers are not narcissists?

[@travy9454]

​@@sabinamcdaniel7412 Oh yes. Just because someone is selfish doesn't make them a narrcicist. Just because they are self-centerd doesn't make them a narrcicist. NPD has a lot more traits to it. Armchair-Diagnosing every person who is somehow selfish in any way would make the entire population Narrcicists. Everyone acts selfishly. The same goes for people who are low empathy/low sympathy or have APD (like me). These traits don't automatically make people bloodthirsty monsters nor make them incapable of "being good" or acting for the greater good.

[@klaykid117]

Sort of like all squares are rectangles, not all rectangles are squares. Sometimes couples are just really bad for each other without one trying to actively harm the other

[@LesbianTill]

⁠@@sabinamcdaniel7412to add on to this, calling them any form of “insult” that’s actually just a mental disability/disorder is also wrong. no, they’re not a psychopath. no, not a sociopath either. nope, they aren’t bipolar and they don’t have did. they’re just an asshole who probably has a ton of trauma themselves. or maybe they don’t.

[@Arachnick]

@@sabinamcdaniel7412THANK YOU! the amount of people who use a literal disorder as being a synonym to ‘abuser’ and don’t realise it’s ableism is wild

[@blueotter5954]

Pink Diamond/Rose Quartz DOES NOT owe Pearl a romantic relationship. I see alot of people still say that because Pearl romantically loved Rose, Rose should have romanticized loved Pearl back. No. Please notice this elephant.

[@Cinnamonraisin_Bagel]

Especially since there's valid reasons to hate Rose/pink but this isn't one of them she can love who she likes

[@starlydonati2008]

Agreed. Rose loving who she wanted instead of the main character who loved her is nothing to get mad about. It seemed somewhat reciprocated at some point in the past, but that doesn’t mean she owed Pearl anything when her interest drifted elsewhere.

[@henrybugado593]

I totally agree with that...but I think she should have marked more boundaries with pearl so as not to give her false hope. I am especially referring to the rainbow quartz scene.

[@starlydonati2008]

@@henrybugado593 True. If she didn’t want to maintain a romantic relationship with Pearl, she should have said so instead of stringing her along. My question is if she realized that Pearl was so jealous of Greg because Rose is relatively oblivious and Pearl pretended things were fine when she wasn’t happy. It’s not exactly Rose’s fault if Pearl didn’t clearly communicate that she wasn’t ok with Greg because she had established a pattern of being fine with Rose’s human trysts so long as she was going to be the one Rose stuck with. It’s amazingly complicated even when trying to follow simple seeming rules when it comes to relationships.

[@blueotter5954]

@@starlydonati2008 I agree with that last point. Communication is hard; you think you got it right, but then it becomes too late to realize you did not get it right. It certainly lead to some some of my own past breakups at least.

[@YourWaywardDestiny]

Reducing Aang's character to "dead beat dad" is also not quite right-- he was (and I can't stress this enough) _the LAST air bender._ The relationship with _the literal only other air bender in the world_ was never going to be healthy. No matter how much he might have cared for and loved his other children, passing on Air Bender culture rested almost _exclusively_ on Tenzin. He wasn't just favoring Tenzin because they got along. He was favoring Tenzin for the fate of an ENITRE CULTURE THAT SHOULD BE EXTINCT. It wasn't good, it did damage to his other children, it did damage to Katara, and it isn't an excuse for that damage, but it's hard to see it going any better.

[@rubyr8922]

also we hear about Aang as a parent from the biased perspective of his adult children remembering their childhood, if you've ever had siblings you have exaggerated things for the sake of sibling rivalry, they seem more upset at each other than it is with Aang as a father, and at the end of the episode when Bumi, Kya and Tenzin found an old photo of them as children, they all agreed that they were a happy family. The bad times, all the childish scraps and the immature pranks, are burned into their minds as it would be with any moment of intense emotion, but there’s no doubt among them that they were loved equally.

[@appletart7262]

I just wish Katara and Aang’s relationship wasn’t so ham fisted and they were properly developed in some way instead of “ooohhhh they’re kissing” like in the original show or the disaster of the comics. It’s one thing to portray a problematic relationship but the two main show runners for atla are insistent on them being the most wholesome loving relationship possible when everything screams the exact opposite, even if they did try to say something about Aang’s treatment of his kids in tlok. Any time someone points this out it falls on deaf ears and it drives me nuts because somehow their relationship is above criticism despite how poorly fleshed out it as a romance

[@lakevalorr]

To add onto this, I feel like people forget that the entire Airbender Culture is *significantly* different from what we consider to be normal; Air Nomad children were temporarily raised in the Western and Eastern Air Temples before going to the Northern or Southern Air Temples to practice and train in Airbending techniques and Spirituality. (They were also segregated by gender, IIRC.) Aang never had parents; the closest person he had to a parental figure was Monk Gyatso. Obviously, someone who never had parents wouldn't really know how to parent as well as we think they should. (And before someone points out Zuko: yes, Ozai was an abusive and neglectful father, but Zuko still had Uncle Iroh to guide him and act as a father to him throughout his life. Aang was acquainted with Gyatso for only a couple of years.)

[@Takejiro24]

​@@appletart7262 I'm still salty over the show never having had Aang apologize for kissing Katara at the Ember Islands Play even though she said she was confused about her feelings towards Aang. That and the two having a proper, mature discussion on where they stood with each other after the kiss.

[@SirSomeguy]

Seriously, I'm sick of people saying that TLOK was a character assassination of Aang for the simple fact that he had the GALL to not deal with the near complete genocide of his entire race 100% perfectly. They made it abundantly clear that he loved all his children and Katara, but the simple fact is that the teachings, lessons, and way of life of an ENTIRE race of people could only have possibly been retained by one of his children. Of course there's going to be stress, and of course Aang can't do everything perfectly. But in the end, all the kids express how much they still love Aang and his memory. Hell, when Bumi first gains the ability to Airbend in Season 3, the very first thing he says is how proud Aang would be and how proud Katara will be.

[@selmabm3409]

There's a difference between appreciating Bakugo's development and justifying his past behavior and I can't believe so many people are still picking the latter.

[@tati-4638]

I agree and nothing justifies what he did BUT I'm tierd of people calling Mitsuki a good mother, yes she loves him, yes she cares about him but that dosen't mean it is not abuse to hit and blame your child for getting kidnapped. It isn't ok and I don't get why people think it is

[@selmabm3409]

@@tati-4638 I think it’s because she barely shows up in the story. If she had more screen time, maybe Horikoshi would’ve made her mention the bullying.

[@tati-4638]

@@selmabm3409 yeah we don't know how it was back then but we do know that bakugo never learned how to deal with emotions. Deku thinks that in the fight in ground beta and Katsuki says himself "a little violence is necessary" .. "that's how I was raised" to todoroki. (That dosen't excuse the bullying ofcourse)

[@magicalpopfish9570]

As a bkdk shipper in fics we usually never try to justify his bullying or portray it as "him being too shy to show Izuku his feelings" but as him going through his arc as "the gifted kid" we usually have him grow from his past through other characters (maybe go to therapy) and then start having feelings for Izuku after admiring and appreciating his input in some fics he straight up just rejects Izuku because he knows he isn't mentally there yet sometimes they don't even have them as childhood friends because a lot of us believe "soulmates" because the story keeps bringing up the twin stars motif and that they're complementary in the "save to win" and "win to save". We do not ship it because of the bullying we ship it inspite of the bullying as we see them as two individuals who've grown together sometimes as a result of one another for better and for worse. A lot of bkdk fics also don't make Mama Mitsuki abusive because we like her being nice to her son and Izuku.

[@MahouMell__]

you fxcking fujoshi comshiper get a life @@magicalpopfish9570

[@AkataHabo-hx9ek]

Trauma does not justify characters becoming evil and killing innocent people It just gives reason for it

[@osheridan]

I haven't got anything to base this off of, but the perspective of "it's okay that they did bad things, they're traumatised/mentally ill" has gotta hurt the perception of people who have mental illness FAR more than it helps

[@AkataHabo-hx9ek]

@@osheridan yeah Like some people will genuinely justify a characters actions entirely based off of trauma, yet there are other characters in the story with their own trauma who choose to be better

[@tonyjones5500]

Oh my God thank you it's genuinely annoying for people to justify awful characters you're supposed to hate (Bojack Horseman, Homelander, etc)

[@AzureTank776]

This is the reason I like Kamen Rider Gavv (the newest entry in Kamen Rider series). Two of the five main villains (the twins; Shiita and Jeebh) hate the main character (Shouma), their half-brother, due to the fact that Shouma was always showered with love by his human mother. Meanwhile, Shiita and Jeebh didn't even get a proper birthday party, since their older siblings only cared about works. Even worse, when those two tried to get their father to spoil them, he pushed them away instead, while also talking on a communication device about a way to make Shouma stronger (he's a half-monster due to having a human mother). The story also shows how, in the present day, Shiita and Jeebh are fired from their family's company (which is a human-trafficking and drug manufacturing company), and is going to be separated and married off to some high-class people. Yet, after knowing all this, and reminiscing about what if they could have gotten along, Shouma does not hesitate to finish them off. He even called them out on the fact that they still killed dozens of innocent people, despite having a somewhat sad backstory.

[@IDrankVinegar]

Like, no, Shigaraki destroying multiple cities isn't justifiable by "uhhhh... He has trauma"

[@starznova]

In the Animal Crossing fandom, people tend to characterize Tom Nook as this big mean loan shark with a cold heart and loves nothing but money. In reality, he's pretty chill compared to irl loan sharks. He gives you infinite time to pay off the loans, he gives you an easier way to pay off your first loan in New Horizons, and literally adopted two little Tanookies and raised them as his own.

[@Cinnamonraisin_Bagel]

he's really nice honestly he gives us a basically free house, lets us take our time. the real enemy is the fox that sells fake stuff fuck redd

[@paigeepler]

Meanwhile, Lyle was an insurance scammer in City Folk, if I remember correctly. I don't know what the fandom thinks of him, though.

[@insertobligatoryreferenceh489]

I once saw someone say that it’s “the collective proletariat urge to detest all debt collectors,” and that’s the explanation I’m sticking with.

[@blueotter5954]

@@paigeepler I think we like him. He did redeem himself my no longer teaming up with Redd the Fox, and started working at the Happy Home Academy. The NPCs did not forget he used to be a scammer, they talk about it with or without Lyle.

[@paigeepler]

@@blueotter5954 Good to know, thanks! I like Animal Crossing but I never know what the fandom is doing at any given time

[@jbleichman]

Gravity Falls: Mabel is not just there to support Dipper. She is her own person with agency of her own. It is not _wrong_ for her to want things for herself that don’t align with what Dipper wants. She has flaws, true, but so does everyone including Dipper. His own selfishness has led to disaster in the past. Remember the time he caused a zombie apocalypse to prove a point? Isn’t it odd how no one ever seems to harp on _that?_

[@SnickerDoodleBug05]

... THANK YOU!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! plus... SHE IS A FREAKING TWELVE YEAR OLD, LET HER BE SELFISH WITHOUT MAKING HER SEEM LIKE A MONSTER(I commented something similar to this.)

[@fluffystuff500]

I'm never going to forgive the way the Gravity Falls fandom treated Mabel. People go so far out of their way to demonize a 12 year old girl for being selfish and impulsive while ignoring the moments where Dipper is just as selfish and impulsive. Especially regarding Wendy. Which is because THEY'RE BOTH 12 YEARS OLD.

[@aspillust]

MY GOD THANK YOU. mabel is my favorite character from gravity falls and i HATE HATE HATE how much the fandom slanders her. she's 12 fucking years old give her a break 💀

[@Cinnamonraisin_Bagel]

She's also 12 years old like everyone was a little selfish at 12

[@LanieMae]

I don’t know why but everywhere I go it’s always the young girl characters who are treated like vile monsters for just being kids, god forbid if they’re traumatised/a victim of a abuse because then they’re utterly irredeemable!

[@nekomataglitch7204]

The general issue in a lot of fandoms have with the idea of good people doing bad things. If the favorite character does something bad then it’s always justified, but if a different character does something bad then that character is an awful person.

[@BookWyrmOnAString]

Yeah, acknowledging a character's flaws and the harm they caused without demonizing them is something Fandom is really, REALLY bad at

[@aruxani]

The Attack on Titan fandom... Eren killed 80% of humanity for "freedom" but ofc they hate on Annie for yoyo-ing someone whilst in her titan form because 1. She was a brainwashed child trained to be a killing machine and 2. she detaches herself whilst in her titan form to cope with the guilt. Now I'm just justifying killing but Annie literally never had a choice AND she killed a lot less people than Eren.

[@iliketea1427]

So basically the fandom for the phantom of the opera, (spoilers) you have no idea how much people defend him despite him threatening and murdering innocents and also was manipulating, stalking, almost murdering, attempting to force into marriage, and kidnapping the much younger girl he "loves"... But nooooo he's just a poor baby who needs love and Christine is being unreasonable and selfish when she chooses the rich and beautiful guy who loved her and makes her feel safe. Then the fandom proceeds to attack Raoul too when he does something wrong while the phantom does x100 worse. Seriously the fandom doesn't get it into their head that one isn't entitled to another's love.

[@aromanticdisgr-ace4083]

Yeah nuance in general seems to be hard for a lot of fandom. Even in fandoms where the entirety of canon keeps beating you over the head with how multifaceted real human beings are, whaddaya know, the fandom has reduced that to the character with a hint of anxiety is an uwu bean who can't do anything by themselves and is never wrong and the pretty guy is so perfect and infallible and to suggest otherwise is bashing them. Like I'm sorry but the uwu bean has their own life and career they built themselves and has at multiple points yelled at people and in general been very non-uwu bean like. And your perfect hot guy starts the series off by being a jerk and continues to mess up again and again and learn from those mistakes. That doesn't make them bad people, it just makes them *people*. And that grand evil villain who probably skins puppies because they looked sceptically at the MC that one time? Yeah sure they're not super nice but they're not evil for not being 100% on the MCs side at all times. They're not evil for calling out the uwu bean for being disrespectful or straight up dismissive and mean. And even if they are an actual evil villain, they can still do good. You not liking them doesn't mean they're canonically as bad as you want them to be. Good people to bad thing and bad people do good things and just because you're biased for or against a character doesn't make your opinion of their actions and their forgivableness objective truth. Let characters be multifaceted, please

[@MooneyBabbler]

The stark difference between how some (usually more casual) AA fans treat Miles and Franziska… Like, canonically they’re BOTH kinda pricks determined to “win” no matter what and sometimes use questionable methods to do so, but learn to be better and healthier between their respective debut games and later appearances. But a depressing number of people are only willing to acknowledge Miles’s growth + development, while reducing Franziska to just “bitch” at best and “haha whip bad and/or kinky” (not even really acknowledging her as a person, literally just seeing her for the INANIMATE OBJECT) at worst.

[@7TS4D4NGEROUSG4M3]

The HEATHERS fandom cant grasp that the teenage girl who was kind of mean is not worse then the abusive, manipulative, murderer who tried to literally bomb a school.

[@7TS4D4NGEROUSG4M3]

Also, I'm not sure if how I'm phrasing this makes, like, any sense, but the Gyakuten Sabian/Ace Attorney fandom reaallllyyyy cannot comprehend that the cult survivor character is a cult survivor. Even though they literally call what they survived a cult in the game they're from.

[@HatsonicMiku01]

@@veevdrawz232listen. JD is a well written character, but he SUCKS as a human being. He’s manipulative, and a murderer. Sure, his childhood sucked, but that excuses nothing.

[@redscrunchie222]

Which character in AA is a cult survivor? Jeez I don’t remember any of that

[@LadyBern]

Yanderes are more appealing than the tsundere.

[@FireflyOnyx]

​@redscrunchie222 I'm not entirely sure which character it could referring to? I'm thinking something from SOJ???

[@LanieMae]

Something I’ve been noticing a lot lately is how obsessed fandom is with justifying a characters actions through making up a traumatic backstory for them, but proceeding to demonise the characters who have actually had a traumatic past because they don’t fit the “perfect docile victim” archetype Edit: to explain further because I feel some people may have missed the point is as an example I think of how messed up and depressed I am normally and think that if I was a fictional character EVERYONE would make up a traumatic backstory to “explain” why I’m like that. And especially seeing characters with the same things I start to realise how much this happens because people want to pity them and have a reason for them being “out of the ordinary”. Not even just justifying evil or bad behaviours just even behaviours that could come off as weird to the average person. For example there’s this one character I’m really interested in who’s a vigilante and even though there’s no evidence that she’s had a traumatic past almost half of the fandom tries to justify her actions from being the result of trauma, ignoring how people can become that way and don’t need a sad backstory. And she even mentions it getting angry at the idea of people wanting to pity her for that and treating her as naive. But when it comes to characters who clearly have trauma lots of the time fandom will say they’re stupid and should’ve stood up or their trauma response is making them irredeemable. And even when a media very clearly addresses these mindsets they still prevail heavily and it’s just…

[@kevintanza6968]

Depends on the actions. But traumatic past or not, some actions can't be defended. For example, Frieza blew up an entire planet in Dragon Ball. A sad backstory won't justify that.

[@peanutbutterex]

God this is a particular part of the ofmd fandom. Coming up with a traumatic backstory for izzy and demonizing ed. So annoying

[@amberspark9434]

Or turning said characters with trauma into “perfect victims” when they aren’t. Saw that a bit in dsmp with c!Tommy. C!Tommy himself was a surprisingly accurate portrayal of someone experiencing trauma and being irreparably changed by it (which is surprising for a Minecraft series), but everyone in the fandom always filed off his edges. C!Tommy was a surprisingly complex character but he did a lot of unambiguously bad things out of trauma after exile

[@girosvaldodeskate2214]

​​@@kevintanza6968 vegeta also blew up planets, he is one of the good guys now and i think some people would say that he couldn't do any other thing considering his father and is entire life before z, so no, you can write a Backstory to make a planet destroyer simpatetic if you do it in the present too

[@justasimplelemon5898]

I saw this happening in the SU fandom with Jasper and Lapis 😭😭 someone on twitter treated Jasper like "the poor victim of abuse from Lapis 🥺🥺" meanwhile they treated lapis like if she was abusive for STANDING UP against her abuser?? The worst part was seeing a lot of people agree and deffend this person?? As a victim of abuse i really think its weird, awful and it just show how media literacy is dead

[@saram9434]

People tends to forget that redemption isn't about becoming a nice/or good person or becoming a great friend to the protagonist, redemption is about someone did a terrible thing and try to amend for it's consequences. So yeah, all the terrible people deserve redemption, because its literally written for them.

[@confusedfrog294]

Agreed!

[@emiliabaran6830]

THIS, I CANNOT STRESS THIS ENOUGH

[@montserratmarroquin400]

This is literally what people don’t understand about Catra (obviously she did bad and toxic things, nobody’s saying she didn’t, but the fact that she saw that she was wrong and changed is what give’s her redemption)

[@Astraldragon0]

Actually that atonement.

[@IceFireofVoid]

@montserratmarroquin400 Catra getting so much hate made me think and realize that, if we had a version of ATLA where we saw Iroh in his youth, everyone would hate him, say he was irredeemable and bash his redemption, because the things he has done prior to the events of the cartoon are so much more horrific than anything Catra ever did and he doesn't even have a traumatic backstory to explain his actions. He just was a terrible person, and then made the decision to do better after the loss of his son. And he is one of the most beloved characters in any work of fiction.

[@Yoimiya_Lover29]

I hate PJO fandom's infantilisation of Nico. In canon, he's messed up and kind of an asshole. Yet the fandom makes him "traumatised uwu cinnamon roll baby" like... no???

[@catsinwonderland7473]

OH MY GOD FOR REAL 💀💀💀💀😭😭 I felt like I was going crazy. They always blamed every other character for Nico's actions, even vilifying Bianca. For what? What did she do??? Saying that she abandoned him is absolutely insane. All she wanted was for him to move on. God forbid the daughter of Hades tells Nico to respect that she's dead. Being depressed and traumatized doesn't make you except from being a jerkass. And Nico was a complete jerkass. Refused to talk to people that wanted the best for him, then would lament that nobody liked him. Which I understand, because he's a flawed character, but the fandom took that as "YEAH BABY NICO YOU'RE SO GODDAMN RIGHT EVERYONE HATES YOU!!!!"

[@michellekeppler982]

I know right I had seen the Fandom stuff about Nico before I read the book he appeared in and was utterly confused about what they were talking about. Granted he is one of my favorite characters in the series by the current point I'm at but that's for the exact opposite reasons that the Fandom seems to love him for.

[@lucamagic]

Yes! I have a pjo instagram account but I actively avoid anything that has to do with that. I just found it weird.

[@thegothbunny]

Absolutely agree. I actually have many issues with how the fandom handles most of the cast, too, such as their "macho-fying" of Frank, the despicable, useless power scaling debates, the Mary Sue-fication of every member of the old cast (especially Percy), the extreme flanderization of Literally Everyone But Specially Leo™, and the deep misunderstanding of characters to the point of fans thinking their unintentionally made-up version of the characters' personality = canon (this is doubly so for any characters that are part of the supporting cast, such as Will and Calypso) But, to be fair, Rick Riordan has slowly but surely become the biggest part of the problem with the passing of the years. He also started writing Nico as an OOC "uwu angsty baby", too. I remember the whiplash I got reading Blood Of Olympus, because half of the time Nico's character was written in line with both his appearances in the older PJO books and his development in Heroes of Olympus, the other half he's written as if he's some sort of hybrid between Charlie Spring from Heartstopper and the goth from Boyfriends WB, there's some really good scenes where some stuff is acknowledge and then poof! Nothing, everything solved in the most cheesy way possible, character flaws never have to be faced bc now they're non-existent! And similar goes to Piper, and Leo, and Jason, and Hazel, and Frank, and Thalia, and Annabeth, and Percy, etc etc, it's just waaay more prominent with Nico. Sigh. I still love the newer Riordan's works, Magnus Chase is one of my favorite MC's of his, after all, there's no issue with him not being a perfect writer and making mistakes and all that jazz. The problem I have is with the fandom, who are all extreme sycophants completely closed off to civil discussion, or just exchanging different opinions that don't line up with the mainstream ones within the fandom.

[@thegothbunny]

​@@michellekeppler982same fr fr, he's also one of my favorites but for completely different reasons most of the fandom likes him. Mainly, because the version of him they're obsessed with is an imaginary one they have mostly projected into the character. (And I say "mostly" bc for better or for worse, Rick Riordan _has_ indeed been woobiefying Nico)

[@MathematicalVoid]

Sometimes, it feels like the standards people hold the good guys to to be considered “a decent human being” are way stricter than the standards villains are held to to be considered “completely innocent.”

[@laytonjr6601]

The amount of fics where SNAPE is a good parent to Harry is absurd. On the other hand, Lily and James being alive and leaving Harry with the Dursleys anyway happens too. Like, wtf? In mha, the same thing happens with Momdoriya leaving her son to live in the streets and Aizawa being a cute dad (even if Aizawa is millions of times betrer than Snape it's still jarring)

[@MathematicalVoid]

@@laytonjr6601I was talking about things like one of the heroes being treated by fans like literal Satan for committing the heinous crime of being manipulated by villain, who is clearly the victim here because we can’t trust the heroes because they acted on information the villain, who isn’t responsible for any of this, gave them.

[@karaoconnoraliasraidra]

@@MathematicalVoid What I find weird too is when a heroic character is attacked (sometimes even in-universe) for something they did while being out-and-out mind-controlled. It turns into the John Mulaney routine about being over on the bench. “So-and-so got mind-controlled and gave the power crystals to the evil empress!” “He shouldn’t have done that!” “He was mind-controlled.” “That was a terrible thing he did!” “He was mind-controlled!” “He should be ashamed of himself!” “He was freaking mind-controlled!” Usually the story has the mind-control victim feel guilty, but ultimately understand they weren’t to blame, but sometimes the story treats the victim as needing to atone for what they did (not simply repairing damage, but having to do serious penance) despite the fact that they were made to do what they did without their consent or sometimes even knowledge. Bizarre.

[@sketchyskies8531]

My Little Pony- The Mane 6 aren’t robots. They don’t just learn a lesson and never do the terrible act ever again. They screw up multiple times in the show, often doing the same wrong thing that they did seasons or even episodes ago. And that should be ok. They aren’t perfect. However some of the fandom, especially in the later seasons, began to grow upset towards the characters and how they were being portrayed without understanding that, behind the cute pastel colored horses, there were actors who were doing their best with what they were given. People don’t often get a lesson the first time, so why should the mane 6? Sure it might be annoying, but their flaws are what make them interesting to watch Edit: I know this isn’t technically an “issue” but prior to “Fame and Misfortune” the complaint that they were “being annoying for having to learn the same lessons over and over again began to become increasingly common as the show went on.

[@Cinnamonraisin_Bagel]

Even the show had to call this out, as a shy person i can't just get over my shyness

[@PowerSpirit50]

They even made an episode about it.

[@vexywexypoo]

I dont think thats just a MLP specific problem. The internet kinda gave eveyone the idea of direct good or bad and that anyone who does one thing wrong is suddenly a horrible person, no matter if they try to learn or make up for their actions.

[@Kat_ashiii]

When the ponies got mad at Fluttershy re-learning the same lesson over and over again, I got so annoyed. As a shy person myself, you can't just expect someone to always feel comfortable expressing themselves when they're not with people they trust, especially since there is probably a reason why they're so shy.

[@CallMeCrazyCallMePoor]

'The Mane 6.' He he

[@perrisavallon5170]

I remember seeing someone in the DC comics fandom go "Every time I pick up a comic I get a little sad remembering that these characters aren't nearly as gay as you guys make them out to be"

[@BrunoMaricFromZagreb]

What is it with the _current year_ internet's obsession with gays (specifically,homos3xuals)? Yes,I myself go to e621,I saw the memetic femboy rat & the noseless space sheep & the 2 canine knights,& all the other famous OCs.I look up Zackary911 DAILY,as a CISHET male! I STILL have no idea why people act like pigeons seeing seeds whenever a LGBT character appears in media.Especially women.Gay men are GAY,so logically,they aren't going to be into YOU. Fcck,the "Elfslayer Chronicles" 4chan post only happened because some sl00t wanted to make her D&D party go through her p0rn without plot setting. I actually tolerate gay p0rn a lot more than gay characters or people.P0rn doesn't have rancid vibes.

[@DefintallyNotABeaver]

Just watch the lego Batman movie, the gayest Batman media in existence

[@one-onessadhalf3393]

@Anonymoustoothbrush-il1gf Or the Telltale games

[@DefintallyNotABeaver]

@@one-onessadhalf3393 true, I forgot about telltale, I’d say that their both tied for the gayest Batman thing out there.

[@Ardorstorm]

So real

[@Isitthough69420]

A lot of fandoms I’m in have an issue with nuance, just like in general. Like people are either boiling down characters to a single trait or relationship or getting mad at people for not looking deep enough into a character like they do (or, god forbid, having a different opinion on them) A lot of it are petty arguments (with exceptions ofc) and people just kind of being nasty over who’s right, and it gets tiring to see.

[@kenyaholloway-reliford8213]

Exactly. This is why fandoms just aren't fun anymore.

[@kevintanza6968]

Social media ruined it.

[@JustEvelynAndArt]

MDZS fandom frfr

[@osheridan]

The biggest example for me is Qinter in the Wings of Fire fandom. In canon, they're two intelligent, complex characters who joke around and have a fun dynamic. In fanon, they're either the subject of 2,000 page analyses that you "have to" read, or they're portrayed as a pervert and a victim.

[@ChibiMoyashis]

So... the Genshin fandom, basically

[@lockmonster05]

Just because you like a bad character/series, does not mean you're a bad person. So many people have lost media literacy and if something doesn't fit their "pure" ideals, or is something they personally don't like, then that must mean everyone who does like it is BAD. Ridiculous. Bring back "don't like, don't read".

[@josephdavis4682]

Real. A while back, a small group of people went crazy about how Warhammer 40,000 was racist because they thought the giant hyper-adaptive space bugs were an allegory for...Jewish people?

[@osheridan]

​@@josephdavis4682 There's a few cases where it's valid (like goblins are literally an anti-semetic caricature), but 9 out of 10 times when you see something like this it really seems like the "anti-anti-semitists" are the anti-semitists 💀

[@kiernanhowell-mackinley1733]

Real. There are people who can't comprehend that a person could write a villain unless they themselves are a bad person???

[@IDrankVinegar]

I love the coffin of andy and leyley and i'm so fucking tired of pretending i hate it because "uhhh... Canibalism... And that one ending that isn't even canon!"

[@Daelyah]

​@@IDrankVinegar I like Sir Anthony Hopkins' version of Dr. Hannibal Lecter, and I mean... 🤷‍♀️ There are also plenty of other villain characters I adore. I've had to deal with people giving me shit and make me feel like I have to explain myself when I state that I like villain characters. Sometimes, they don't even let me finish when I decide to be nice and attempt at an explanation. Quite frustrating, because I always have to remind those people that THESE ARE FICTIONAL CHARACTERS, and I am NOT promoting any of their behavior to be committed IRL.

[@callmesummon]

No one in the Danny Phantom fandom wants to acknowledge the finale and honestly I love it

[@plutodragon4]

The only reason to acknowledge the finale is because of a glitch in time undoing it

[@callmesummon]

@@plutodragon4 I will not acknowledge it until I get a chance to read A Glitch in Time. It simply does not exist to me

[@BrunoMaricFromZagreb]

Well,I never saw the finale.I watched the show,I have no idea why it stopped airing for me OR which episode I left on.I definetly remember sitting down & watching it,so it isn't just me going through the clips I saw on the internet.

[@plutodragon4]

@@callmesummonit never even happened also i like your leo pfp my fellow rottmnt fan

[@callmesummon]

@@plutodragon4 eyyy rottmnt buddies

[@SnickerDoodleBug05]

Gravity falls: Anytime a character makes a mistake (small or big) they end up HATING the character.... For example, people hate Mabel because she "caused" weirdmageeddon. A) she thought bill was bledin and had no knowledge of what the rift was... B) SHE WAS A 12(almost 13) YEAR OLD GIRL WHO IS ALLOWED TO BE IMPERFECT!!! SHE DIDN'T KNOW THAT WEIRDMAGEDDON WOULD HAPPEN!!!

[@one-onessadhalf3393]

I don’t understand people hating her for that at all. Like, I have my issues with Mabel, mostly just her in season 1, but blaming her for Weirdmageddon just doesn’t make sense

[@FinallyIamAshark]

YES, I hate that. I dislike Stanford for how dumb to trust Bill so much despite being a genius and a grown man but Mabel is a child, a literal child. 😭

[@SnickerDoodleBug05]

​@@FinallyIamAshark I hate Stanford too... Not for trusting Bill, Stanford is a curious man so I can understand why he trusted Bill. But I hate him for not saying 'thank you'. Stanley ended learning to say 'please' in season 1, why can't Stanford learn to say 'thank you'?'

[@riymeep6708]

I still don’t get how people hate on her for weirdmageddon. Like, she had no idea what the thing she was holding was and had no reason to distrust blendin. Also, her feelings in that moment make perfect sense and is something that I’m quite sure nearly all children have felt at some point.

[@princeapoopoo]

She acted rashly in response to Dipper, but they literally had zero time to talk things over and make up before Bill showed up. Its wild that people blame her because of a demon taking advantage of two literal children fighting. Absolutely wild.

[@All_thegoodnamesaretaken]

Why will no Fandom ever acknowledge it when one protagonist hurts another protagonist? Like they can still both be good people, and be good together, but they have hurt each other and that adds depth to the story and their relationship and their individual characters. Usually the fandom will just pick one character to hate, then act like the other character has never done anything wrong. It’s one thing that I’m rly sick of in Fandom culture.

[@ioppisheliolisk]

It iritates me so badly when people can never see both characters’ side of a conflict, even when they both have perfectly valid arguments. The fact that they both have a solid point is what makes the story good, but people always have to choose sides 😔

[@averagecupofcoffee]

This. I’m an MHA fan and a Bakudeku shipper. You described it perfectly.

[@aliciam6145]

I feel like you could apply this to just about any fandom lol (for me right now it's Good Omens)

[@andreaseverin1346]

This is why I love the Class of 09 fandom. Everyone is aware that pretty much every character is evil

[@rosemary3029]

​@@andreaseverin1346class 09 from what i seen is breaking bad but yuri because i have only seen shipping art of the two titular girls

[@Cal-fb7we]

this applies to a lot of fandoms but BOYS AND GIRLS CAN BE FRIENDS!!! I am Sick and tired of people shipping any characters that so much as make eye contact with each other

[@green-spectre]

Ya, but I think I'm partly a problem in this 😂

[@LazyRosey-os7jy]

I hate how people irl look at a boy & girl or man & woman being friendly to each other & say that they are dating or have feelings for each other. Once at my school people thought 2 teachers have feelings for each other just cause they were seen hanging out with each other. Turns out they were cousins. Then there was this time that my friend thought these 2 teachers were dating or something just cause they held hands/touched each others hands. It frustrates me so much especially since I befriended boys in my past but now my friends thinks I like them. I don't even talk to them anymore.

[@RandomTheIdiot55]

Hello there, Pokémon anime fandom.

[@gyppygirl2021]

Applies to every sort of relationship. Male-female, male-male, female-female, they're all shipped because they looked at each other once. Friendship doesn't exist anymore.

[@glitterboxx19]

​@@gyppygirl2021 this is what's going on in the ramshackle Fandom ( if you haven't heard of it , it's an animated pilot that just had it's first official episode and people are shipping the main characters, even though the main theme of the series is found family ( do people not appreciate characters that have a family bond )

[@WhyNot-mj3hj]

Personally I think it’s annoying when a fandom takes an energetic, kind of crazy, goofball character and just portrays them as a clueless baby who has no signs or concept of intelligence. Like Luke from Street Fighter 6, Papyrus from Undertale, Bumblebee or HotRod from Transformers, the list goes on.

[@NoxietyPrime]

See also: Kel, from OMORI.

[@osheridan]

Canon: Sunny is an intelligent, resilient character. She's kind and wants to spread love, because she's a pro-peace activist. She's survived years of horrible trauma and has shown her capability to survive alone. It's not a sign of weakness but of strength that she continues to have so much empathy when she's been wronged so many times. Fanon: HAHA MANIC PIXIE DREAM GIRL EMPTY HEAD NO THOUGHTS

[@anthonycrowley2264]

Michelangelo from TMNT(most versions, but especially 2012) also gets this treatment a lot

[@-karma-2426]

Hinata from haikyuu

[@wrightcember]

yesss. papyrus is smart and people choose to ignore that

[@anyawatchesmovies]

I'm so tired of this trend of making main characters of franchises deadbeat dads. Like, we had a cool and very impactful story, and the main character learned all these valuable lessons and now let's just toss it all out in the trash!

[@FinallyIamAshark]

I met a person who thinks of Naruto as a deadbeat dad 😭 Seriously, he had a lot of responsibilities. He couldn't have just abandoned the job he wanted his entire life and he even still spends time with his family.

[@grantflippin7808]

​@@FinallyIamAshark borruto is a brat

[@osheridan]

I don't think Aang _was_ a deadbeat dad though. Yes, he had favouritism towards Tenzin, and I'm not saying favouritism is OK, but like... it's understandable. He had an entire culture to pass down. Yes, Katara ended up living at home... because she was very old!

[@chicky_chinchilla]

I remember watching redwall mattimeo and was finally happy that Matthias wasn't a dead beat dad

[@stellafanders]

Or making the parents of a main character worse than they are. Sure, Tim Drake's parents weren't perfect, they just sent him off to boarding school, classical rich kid sheltered life, but nothing suggested that they were verbally or physically abusive. Same with Willis Todd, Jason's dad. Him being abusive was a classist retcon in order to villify poor people

[@creditz_]

For the Lego Monkie Kid Fandom, it’s the fact that wukong is canonically aro-ace in the journey of the west book. I feel like a lot of people forget that lol.

[@twotruckslyrics]

Yeahh 😞its really really common for fandoms to forget a character is aro, ace, or both

[@Bunnyleadd]

​​@@twotruckslyrics Side eying the hazbin hotel fandom. But yea, especially in queer spaces, ive seen a LOT of aro/ace/aroace erasure. One of the only reasons i can assume people believe wukong is not aroace is that journey to the west has a lot of wacky and debateable translations with many things changing from translation to translation. An example would be nezha's age, which varies from being eternally a child to being an adult, or Tang having a lover in a few odd translations

[@berry_x0x0]

I used to be in the fandom, and I had no clue.

[@elalaela2694]

​@@goldie1943 I'm nowhere enough pages deep into it to have any valid opinions myself, but you're 11 centuries off

[@goldie1943]

@elalaela2694 Oops, yeah that was just from a quick google search and I misread 😅 thanks for correcting lol

[@ya3_m1k03]

I really hate when people act like Captain America is someone who always follows rules and gets pissy about others who don't. Steve Rogers is an Irish Immigrant who's whole thing is going against orders for what's right no matter who set those orders and rules.

[@karaoconnoraliasraidra]

Their heads would explode if they knew about Captain America: The Captain (the 1980s storyline in which Steve Rogers rescinded his Captain America role for an extended period rather than be forced to serve as a lackey for the Commission on Superhuman Activities) or the Nomad storyline (the 1970s storyline in which he dropped his patriotic identity for a few issues after having a loss of faith and identity crisis). As a fan of Steve Rogers/Captain America and U.S.Agent/John Walker/Jack Daniels, I always recommend the Captain America: The Captain trade paperback along with the Captain America: Scourge of the Underworld TPB.

[@ToastTheGhost1]

Unpopular opinion here: If two characters are enemies, that does not always mean that they like each other- they might just be enemies. (Sometimes they do like one another, but people need to realise that this is not always the case.)

[@jab9109]

Also, dislike doesn't mean enemy doesn't mean antagonist doesn't mean rival, all different and not exclusive things

[@green-spectre]

YES!

[@aaz.2007]

coldest take

[@Quit-c4x]

Amazing take, enemies to lovers is so overrated

[@ak1noakin0]

this!! I HATE. JOSUKE X ROHAN. LET THEM. BE ENEMIES. AND THATS A MINOR/ADULT GAP (josuke4 is 16, rohan is 20.)

[@ItzMuffinzz]

Aight helluva boss time. Since Stolas’s parenting was brought into question I think it’s time to criticize Blitzø. Now don’t get me wrong, I do think he’s trying his best, but he’s not the parent Loona needs. Loona reminds him of himself and he’s trying to give her everything he wanted but that’s the problem, he wants her to have everything HE wanted as a CHILD. She’s an adult woman and a traumatized one at that but he treats her like she’s still a child even though he adopted her at age 17 (almost 18). He didn’t come into the pound, prepared to adopt someone like Loona. He wanted a young child that he could give the childhood he never had. Instead he’s stunting Loona’s growth as a person by never criticizing or trying to help her with her issues and instead avoiding them and pretending they aren’t there. He loves her, dearly, but he adopted her not because he was prepared to help her with her issues, but out of the knee jerk reaction to seeing her crying in that cell.

[@FruitSalad253]

I do wish fandoms in general were a little more open to the messy but intricate aspects of characters. Those traits are what makes them multi-dimensional, and they leave a ton of room for further thought, interpretation, and exploration (as demonstated above)

[@ItzMuffinzz]

@@FruitSalad253 Agreed! Obviously there’s always time for treating characters like silly little guys, not everything needs to be serious. But you should try to look deeper into a character, beyond what the text states.

[@SkullQueen33]

I had this exact discussion a year or so ago on Twitter... If I remember correctly, the thing was that people was pissed that Loona was phisically aggresive towards Blitz on the beggining of the chapter Seeing Stars. I too was often bothered with how her was horrible to other characters on the show, but this time I felt different for a simple reason: It is established on that episode that she was an orphan for more than 19 years (apparently dropped by a uncaring mother onto the rain, if the drawings on her cell are anything to go by), and was being captive all those years on an obviously toxic, not at all nice type of orphanage. What is my point with all this, may you wonder? Well, people was angry at her because they expected her to 'behave more kindly' to the guy that adopted her, and, you know what? I knew people who where orphans irl, and they don't always show undying love for their tutors since the very beggining, specially not when they grow up on problematic situations or spent most of their childhoods on the orphanage. Keep in mind: Loona was not only almost a grown ass adult when she was adopted, but also was grown in a toxic enviroment and she only knew Blitz for a year or two (Age of adoption: 19; Age in the show: It was confirmed to be 22). Frankly, how Twitter expected her to 'be nice' when the literal trigger for this fight was him saying quite literally that he didn't like her attitude and 'I may as well replace you'?? Also, there's something very wrong with the idea that if you adopt someone, he/she/or them are obligued by contract to always look at you like a saviour of some kind...

[@ItzMuffinzz]

@@SkullQueen33 Actually she was 17 when Blitzø adopted her but I agree. She doesn’t have to do anything, she went through a lot of shit and she has a right to be angry about it. But Blitzø in particular is not equipped to handle that. He has a lot of his own issues he has yet to resolve let alone an entirely different person with different struggles that are completely foreign to him.

[@Dressup_Doll]

@@SkullQueen33If I remember correctly, I thought there was a scene of her helping Octavia with Stolas, then ignoring what she said and kicking Blitz. If I’m wrong, then sorry.

[@howveyouben]

The Hamilton fandom needs to stop pretending like the show paints Alexander Hamilton as some saint. He did a lot of very important things, but he was still a confrontational prick who was a terrible military leader and blatantly cheated on his wife (oh, and had slaves irl). Lin-Manuel Miranda himself said the show isn’t meant to glorify him, and he wasn’t afraid to show the negative aspects to his life.

[@lenabluejay1166]

Yeah, I love the musical (it's one of my favourites!) but the fandom is weird. Also, where did the John "turtle boy" thing come from?

[@tsifirakiehl4250]

Yeah, a lot of people tried to hate on the show for “glorifying” its title character, and I wonder if they even watched the same show I did. Yes, the show does feature good things that Hamilton did, but it also features bad things he did, and when he does bad things, he is clearly shown to be in the wrong. Alexander Hamilton wasn’t a saint, but he wasn’t a demon either. He was a person, who did a lot of both good and bad, and that is what the show portrays.

[@panizshariat7892]

​@@lenabluejay1166that came from the fact that he liked to draw a lot of turtles irl

[@lenabluejay1166]

@@panizshariat7892 That's really cute!! I guess the fandom just really exaggerates it to the point of acting like it's his only personality trait...

[@2bdaqueen268]

Yeah those that say the musical glorified Alexander and the founding fathers clearly didn’t pay attention or only saw the fandoms side of things, I think Lin made it pretty clear that despite the good things he did Alexander was a flawed human being who cheated on his wife and indirectly got his son killed in a duel and that the founding fathers were also petty assholes, it’s not his fault people horribly misinterpreted his work

[@Wintermute01001]

2:51 That's a mischaracterization of what happened in the comic. First, it gives the impression that this is adult Aang rather than kid Aang. Second, these weren't just "fangirls". They were people who had studied Aang's nearly-extinct Air Nomad culture and were working to revive it. They were basically the precursors to the Air Acolytes. Aang was reconnecting with his people after surviving genocide and just getting a little overexcited.

[@midnightartist43]

I suppose this goes for a lot of fandom but um…. Just because a person ships something doesn’t mean they think it should be cannon. Just because someone ships something doesn’t mean they expect it to be cannon Sometimes people ship characters simply for the fun of it, and there’s real no deeper meaning for it. Like I have shipped characters that are OBVIOUSLY bad for eachother ( Vox x Alastor, Iruma-kun x kirito, ect ) but I don’t ship them cuz I genuinely think they’re good for eachother. Rather, I do it because I want to explore why the ship wouldn’t work and how they could make eachother worse. And I ship a lot of characters, and I even dabble in ships that I don’t actually ship, but find fan works and fanart that makes the ship work for me. That doesn’t mean I want any of them to be cannon, or do I think anyone who doesn’t ship it “doesn’t get it” Shipping is just for fun. Sometimes we just wanna see some characters smooch, wether or not it “works in cannon” Also, to the people who attack others for not liking your ship ( or liking a ship you don’t like ) just stop it. It’s a waste of yours, and everybody elses time

[@green-spectre]

THANK YOU! Shipping has just started being SO controlled. In my first main fandoms, no one really cared what you shipped(not like now anyway) unless it was illegal or abusive, but still then, it didn't seem to be as much as a big deal. But now in the two newer fandoms I've joined(H.H one of them) they get all killy over someone Shipping slightly off cannon, and it isn't even for good reasons half the time, like: NOOOO that person is dating canoniclly!(I don't care if this isn't a real word or spelt wrong) Or, even worse(not H.H) you can't ship that BI character with a BOY! THAT'S REMOVING LES'S. And with that logic you're doing same to BI PEOPLE! Sorry I got a little worked up, but I swear it's like everyone in fandoms now are all babies have haven't learn how shipping works. I just ship what I wanna ship.

[@snartboy5000]

this is so important omg

[@adish1401]

The shipping is so tiring man. People get mad when it doesn't fit the canon, because "ooo but it's so not canon how why" But then if you ship something that has a 98% chance of being a legitimately canon dynamic off-screen, they bitch about you shoving the ship down their throats or something... No you guys, I just keep fangirling side characters who spend a lot of time off-screen in every fandom I go to, nothing personal there. They just look for excuses to hate any and all shipping, like kids who don't fully comprehend romantic and intimate relationship exist.

[@yapflipthegrunt4687]

I ship sonic and shadow, not out of any logical basis, but because it's funny.

[@TheBeastlySort02]

​@@yapflipthegrunt4687 this is the objectively funniest ship

[@Qe2egg]

I feel like some fandoms have an issue with assuming "masculine woman" and "cis-het woman" are totally incompatible traits and that if a girl is a tomboy, she must also be trans and/or a lesbian Edit: As some of you have pointed out, feminine men have this issue as well

[@friedhegg1994]

they've just reinvented the gender binary again

[@pamelavergara3771]

Agree. In the vocaloid fandom some people want to reclaim the character v-flower as non binary, and that's ok... But you have to also let other people treat the character as a woman (canon gender) and don't get mad about it. There are so freacking few masculine woman characters and it's so damn frustrating when people can't refer to the character by she/her pronouns because some people will appear to try to correct you.

[@denjidenji9162]

@pamelavergara3771 I think the vflower being nonbinary thing is also cause in the early days of vflower, everyone thought she was nb. I'm not sure why, but that's what it was, so I guess the people who still correct that simply never got the memo

[@null9014]

@@pamelavergara3771 Personally, I saw her a couple of times and really liked her, but in the contexts I saw her she appeared more masculine so I thought that she was a boy. I've decided to just run with that because I can't be bothered to change how I think of her, she's a male to me.

[@Granad784]

I never saw this, but i actually see the opposite a lot

[@shadowsight804]

The way how so many Percy Jackson fandom completely ignores canon(and real life disabilities) for extremely ableist “headcanons” of stuff like their personalities and a lot of other stuff. Don’t even get me started on the way they completely ignore Will’s severe trauma and his canon personality.

[@JaneD0e_LuckyNxmbr7]

The fandom treating characters like percy and leo like they’re toddlers who can’t do anything without their girlboss™️ gfs feels so icky to me and also the fact that they boil down will and nico’s characters to their sexuality like man

[@thesilverprincess]

Canon Will: Nico we just killed a person what am I supposed to do with this? My dad had to rely on me for emotional support and only now treats me like a son, I can’t figure out what to think about that. Sure, I’ll go to Tartarus with you, mostly so you don’t die, but you better know what you’re doing. Fandom Will: I’m Nico’s gay doctor and also a flashlight :)

[@yorkurt]

YES! And the infantilization of Nico. When you reread the books you see he's really a bit of an asshole, even if he's gone through some stuff.. But no, he's a "traumatized cinnamon roll," lmao

[@acacheofstars7]

THIS THIS THIS.

[@yorkurt]

@@ranting2damax I don't think Nico was ever really emo, he's just portrayed as overly edgy in fanworks. Besides, "emo" is more a music genre than a specific style. Also, Bianca is his *older* sister.

[@snowdroppax2726]

Here's the thing about fandom. You can like and headcanon whatever you want. You can like ships that are toxic or abusive, you can picture a character as autistic or trans or whatever. It's all fiction, and the point of fiction is to be able to imagine whatever you want. But if you're going to do that then you need to also understand that not everyone in the fandom is going to share your opinions.

[@elenasanjuan9877]

Literally, I feel like some people have genuine trouble with distinguishing canon and headcanon stuff and they end up believing their headcanons are canon

[@kalkxx]

agreed, but also the people on the other side who get SO MAD when someone has a different ship than them that isnt canon or something need to stop too lol. like ill see people attacking others and telling them not to “ruin their friendship” when two characters are shipped (most of the time its mlm or wlw couples hmmm i wonder why). everyone just needs to mind their business and not interact with someone if they have a headcanon they dont like

[@copperdink1473]

Many such cases. All these arguments have been around since fandoms have been around. All that's happening is that there is a new generation of people getting involved in fandoms, and so the same arguments and points are being repeated. Atp it's a little annoying because it's literally a rehash of what you've heard in the 2010s, and what house adults heard in the 90s. It's more apparent how flat circle it is if you involve yourself with older media, like ff7 that has acquired a new age fanbase. All the clerith/clifa arguments are the exact same now as they were in 99, and it's all online too. The same arguments about cloud/sephiroth too. It's annoying bsnjsn

[@Nai0100]

Yeah. Honestly, I never understood arguments within fandoms over head-canons because the whole thing is that it's not cannon. There are things in the fandoms I follow where I don't ship certain characters or disagree with a head cannon but it's never so deep/so personal to the point where it angers me lol. It's usually just a "oh people think this way? Interesting"

[@heroics9455]

Any fandom with a faceless army (Firefly, Star Wars, LoTR). Some of these folks were just conscripted, brainwashed, gotta make a living. They aren't out to get the protagonists, they are just trying to make their way in the world.

[@18Hongo]

I'm not sure Mordor and Isengard work on a capitalist economic system. But sure, the other ones I get.

[@BrunoMaricFromZagreb]

Ever wonder why we're here?Besides to just stand around talking,in the middle of a box canyon...

[@saturnas]

This reminds me when i read a fanfiction about a random stormtrooper whose dream was to pilot a tie fighter. She wasnt involved in any canon big conflict and was like "fuck it we ball" everyday but in the end everything exploded lol

[@bookswithike3256]

Not that I like praising the sequels, but that is the whole point of Finn.

[@JUSTxK1LL1NGxT1M3]

​@@BrunoMaricFromZagrebred vs blue reference 🥹

[@_AstaLily]

I hate to say it as I can act like one of these people, but the Miraculous fandom simps over Felix and completely ignores when he tried to kiss Ladybug without her consent or when he dates Kagami, who he barely knows and who *just dated his cousin* who looks *identical to him*

[@UltimateDespairado]

These are probably the same people who simp over Nagito Komaeda

[@Kat_ashiii]

I like Feligami and Felix (because he's smart, not because he's a good person) but I feel like since Season 5, everyone's just forgotten that he kind of sucks?? Especially since he was literally stalking Kagami and making assumptions about her before actually knowing her.

[@Grumpy_Hedgehog97]

I think part of the issue is that Felix was a character in the fandom long before he was introduced in the show. For a long time (because ML competes with SU for first place in hiatus hell), Felix was just an abandoned concept character that the fandom was free to use as they wished, creating a collective fanon-version, especially after episodes like Syren when some fans wanted an alternative to Adrien. And though canon-Felix is completely different to fanon-Felix, some of that attachment would have still been there. Plus there's the fact that he's a white dude, which makes fans more willing to excuse and make excuses. Just as they did for Draco and Kylo Ren.

[@Cinnamonraisin_Bagel]

felix also murdered all of paris

[@sapomen1352]

​@@Cinnamonraisin_Bagel based felix

[@kyolivine]

Encanto (probably will make ppl angry): Of course you're free to HC characters as you want but it gets so stereotypical.. Isa didn't want to marry a man she doesn't love? She's a lesbian. Luisa is a strong, not typically feminine girl? She's transmasc/nb. Creators fought so hard with Disney to make Luisa have actual muscles and not typical thin and petite figure. I think this problem is in most of the Fandom, not only Encanto. It's so sad to see that when people see a non feminine/masculine character they HC them as anyone but their gender even if they're completely comfortable with it.

[@IceFireofVoid]

Nobody wants to talk about the headcanons based on toxic gender stereotypes.

[@seatbelttruck]

Wait, people hc Luisa as transmasc? But she's super feminine whenever she gets the chance to be... Her imagine spot is full of fluffy pink clouds and sparkly (donkey) unicorns!

[@tsifirakiehl4250]

As a queer person myself, I hate when people just decide this or that character must secretly be queer because they don’t conform to every stereotype of their gender. First of all, gender stereotypes are stupid and constantly changing anyway, so someone who would have fit them a few decades ago might not fit them today. Likewise, a character who was breaking the gender stereotypes of their time might be gender-conforming by today’s standards. Not to mention, if someone tried to claim that an openly queer character must secretly be straight because they’re gender-conforming, they’d be laughed out of the fandom. Headcanon characters however you want, but reducing them to “iF yOu DoN’t AcT lIkE a PeRfEcT lAdY/mAnLy MaN yOu MuSt Be GaY” comes across as kind of gross.

[@IceFireofVoid]

@tsifirakiehl4250 People can headcanon characters as whatever sexuality they want but please PLEASE can they stop claiming it's some secret malicious message when the whole basis for them thinking that is toxic masculinity or other harmful stereotypes? I've seen a Fandom send hate to show creators for "queerbaiting". The queerbaiting in question: two male characters had emotions, and were friends. And not very good friends, at that. I think people in Fandom need to start accepting that your personal headcanons not becoming true isn't a personal attack.

[@headphonesaxolotl]

@@tsifirakiehl4250 Mitten from Animated Inanimate Battle said it best- "I'm free to violate any gender norms I want!"

[@Thepeopleinmybrainloveyou]

Corpse Bride fandom missed out on the entire point of the film Victor and Emily being together would’ve confirmed Emily’s idea that she needed to be bride to be happy Victor cared for Emily, yes. But he loved Victoria, and Victoria loved him. Victoria was NOT passive. Also, PJO/HOO fandom, I will NEVER forgive you for how you treated Jason Just because he wasn’t “interesting” to you doesn’t mean he didn’t have character He was a golden child who, even though all his friends thought he was great, didn’t believe he was good enough unless he was perfect. And if you can’t see the nuance in that, that’s your problem. Not his as a character’s.

[@sugarcrystal9390]

From the PJO fandom, Grover. It feels like 99% of the fandom just erases his existence in favor of Jason. And on top of that the empathy link between him and Percy was barely brought up in Hoo

[@tsifirakiehl4250]

Yeah, I don’t understand why so many people think Jason is/should be Percy’s best friend. They could barely tolerate each other, and Jason was a much less interesting character than Grover. My best guess is that these fans just want all the pretty human-looking characters to hang out, and Grover can’t sit with them because he has “ugly” goat legs and horns.

[@emerald9194]

Wasn’t the empathy link between them broken in HoO? Like, wasn’t that why Grover couldn’t immediately locate Percy when he went missing?

[@christophermitchell9739]

​@tsifirakiehl4250 They only didn't get along in one book and for only part of that book. By the time they reunite they're calling each other "my bro" and Percy keeps it up in his mythology books.

[@christophermitchell9739]

​@@emerald9194Suppressed by Hera, if memory serves

[@Dustythetransman]

Such a shame, really. Grover was my favorite character even back in the 6th grade when I first read The Lightning Thief.

[@rowan404]

Regarding the first one: I believe that to be the reason so many people hated Steven Universe Future despite loving the original series. Thematically, nothing has changed from one series to the next. I love them both!

[@perrisavallon5170]

Ooh, as someone who loved Future that's a really interesting point! The SU fandom was, as a whole, very, VERY bogged down by fanon, and honestly I blame the long hiatuses and inconsistent release schedule. By the time Lapis Lazuli became a series regular she was already an entirely different character in everyone's heads than she was in canon.

[@vexywexypoo]

I think Future couldve gone about their plot in a better way had they been given more seasons.

[@emanuelborges4458]

@@perrisavallon5170People like to blame Rebecca Sugar and her team for the esporadic releases, but it was mostly Cartoon Network's fault. There were moments where they had various episodes finished, but they had to wait until CN decided the "best time of release". They also forced the bomb format (a special of five episodes in five days), forcing the team to cram the story in five episodes and fill the rest with fillers (though i think this isn't an excuse to uninteresting stories)

[@Ssjvaca]

I don't know, Steven just suddendly being a HUMONGOUS dick to everyone, not giving a second chance to Eyeball and Aquamarine, almost killing his dead, ACTUALLY killing Jasper (then they revive her which makes the WHOLE point of shattering being a big thing pointless), and it being passed off as "oh it's trauma" even with ZERO hints of it being the case, then the WHOLE trauma being INSTANTLY RESOLVED WITH A HUG, I think it's fair to say Future is a big clusterfuck that doesn't even compare to its predecessor. I kinda like aggresive bitch Steven though, even if he's out of character for what Steven is supposed to be like.

[@aromanticdisgr-ace4083]

I never really interacted with the fandom before after the entire show including Future had aired and MAN am I glad because what in the holy hell happened. Like sure, parts were rushed, there were elements that could've been executed better but as someone who watched it all isolated, I found very few thematic inconsistencies and none that really mattered. It was a about family, trauma, and finding healthy ways to deal with your issues through connection and communication. Not once does the show stray from this. And Future is IMO the perfect epilogue for a series all about picking up the pieces after the big dramatic finish, be that the gem war or the s5 finale. Of course Steven has a Messiah complex, of course he can't rest when there's peace because that was never an option since as early as he can remember, of course he's not going to be completely a-okay after learning that the tyrant whose mistakes they've been fixing since before he was born is actually his mom and he could have inherited her terrible traits. Of course he's scared of everything falling apart around him. The entire show is Steven trying to undo the mistakes of the past he played no part in and being hunted relentlessly for things he doesn't even really understand. He's 13-14 years old. His most formative years were riddled with life or death scenarios and the threat of intergalactic war which hinged entirely on him btw, the only extremely mortal person in this. If Future isn't the logical result of all this then I have no idea what else could've happened to Steven. Child chosen ones are by design going to be traumatised adults unless there's a really good reason that the fate of the world/universe hinging on them while they're in constant mortal danger doesn't affect them and Future shows us that Steven is not unaffected. It points at the child chosen one trope and says "it doesn't always have to be you" and lets Steven get some damn closure about all the things he was never allowed to process because he had to be the one with the answers, the one to stand in front all the time. The gems tried their best to shield him but ultimately they were all in terrible positions to actually do much. Steven would always be the target and the Diamonds were going to aim for him no matter who was standing in the way. Future was going to be the result of that no matter if we'd seen it or not

[@IvyDoggins]

The "adorable ADHD gremlins" and "British Bean" are actually mass murderers. Sun had every right to shoot. Oh, and the people working on the show are actual people who do not deserve to be threatened over a fictional character's death.

[@one-onessadhalf3393]

Sometimes it feels like “Misery” was a prophetic text

[@Florceleste28]

Now I'm curious, what fandom is this?

[@IvyDoggins]

@@Florceleste28 Sun and Moon Show.

[@regionalvariantmaker]

The fact i thought this was abt bungo stray dogs cuz the fandom literally characterizes very bad people as quirky and gremlins

[@smal5504]

​@@regionalvariantmakeri know someone in the bungo stray dogs fandom, she is literally INSANE over dazai

[@Timbeon]

Literally any fandom- asexuality and aromanticism seem to mostly exist as a convenient way to deal with a character who gets in the way of your ship.

[@Kainmaster]

I lost count how often I had to explain the concept of asexuality to stupid fandoms. I'm asexual. I still experience romantic attraction, you bloody toddlers. Stop saying a character is asexual because they won't go with the ship you crave. They might be aromantic or simply see the person as a friend, with nothing more to it.

[@karaoconnoraliasraidra]

@@Kainmaster It reminds me of the people who claim, “Such-and-such a character must actually be gay because otherwise they’d get with this other character!” For instance, I once saw someone claim Mary Jane must be a lesbian because otherwise she’d be two-timing Peter Parker by hooking up with Tony Stark (No word on how they thought a lesbian would be romantically involved with Spider-Man in the first place). Even if that person were joking, it’s sad how many people do this with characters or even in real life.

[@emerald9194]

Saying that Aang abused Katara is a HUGE reach. We know very little about their relationship as adults. We don’t know that Katara was homebody throughout her adulthood. She’s a homebody now because she’s in her 90s. Aang screwed up as a dad in some aspects but calling him an abusive husband is just making shit up. And as much as I think everyone’s characterization in that comic was bad, Aang was with his fan club because they were the only people with whom he could celebrate his culture, and he actively thanked Katara for letting him stay. I also don’t think she ever voiced that she was upset until after the fact. How dare he not read her mind I guess.

[@thilsiktonix]

Given how he left his other two kids alone and brought Tenzin with him everywhere he went, it's obvious that the responsibility there had to go somewhere, and is reasonable to assume that said responsibility would go to Katara. It's understandable that it would be a bad situation with how he's literally the last surviving member of an extinct race, but it's not really something you can call a "reach". Plus, in the series, he never really took "no" for an answer, not from her, not from anyone - which works to his credit for the most part during the show, but ends up leading him to be a pretty awful father & husband.

[@IceFireofVoid]

@thilsiktonix That's not entirely correct either. We know he spent more time with Tenzin, but I believe the only somewhat clear confirmation of that is Kaya saying that Tenzin went on trips with their dad sometimes. Presumably to teach him airbending and air nomad culture. Nothing indicates how frequently he was gone. Nothing indicates that he wasn't involved with his other kids at all. The *only* thing we know for sure is that he comparatively spent more time with Tenzin. Which makes sense, because Tenzin needed to learn air bending, was the only kid who needed to learn air bending, and Aang was the only person who could teach him.

[@Miaowzi]

Op probably was a zutara shipper and the tie in comics are badly written for me to consider them canon

[@jessical4866]

Whether or not Katara was a homebody, I think it’s fair to say that her romantic relationship with Aang heavily neutralized her more aggressive qualities. I’ll give benefit of the doubt in Katara only specializing in healing due to old age, but there’s still very little mention of any other accomplishments that she hypothetically made as an adult waterbending master. So while nothing explicitly states Katara was a homebody, there’s no evidence to disprove it either.

[@AnnekeOosterink]

@@jessical4866 Okay, but if there is zero evidence to a claim, you can't then make that claim. Because you have ZERO evidence either way. OOP made the claim that Katara became a homebody based on nothing. They were wrong, there is no evidence. By the logic of "there is no evidence to disprove it" I can claim I have an invisible unicorn and because you don't have any evidence to disprove it I have one. You can't disprove it after all.

[@tsifirakiehl4250]

So many fandoms immediately jump to demonizing any character who makes the slightest mistake as a parent or parental figure. Scold a kid for something that wasn’t really their fault? The fandom has decided that you’re an evil, abusive monster, even if you had no way of knowing this wasn’t the kid’s fault at the time and apologized to them once you found out what really happened. Heck, fandoms even get on characters’ cases for doing things any real-life parent would do! Try to calm a kid down when they’re having a fit? How dare you try to suppress their emotions, you evil, abusive monster! Praise a kid for being well-behaved? Why are you putting so much pressure on them to be your perfect golden child, you evil, abusive monster? Ask a kid to help out around the house? You evil, abusive monster; you’re treating your child like a slave! There’s no such thing as a perfect parent, and a lot of the characters getting demonized for not living up to this impossible standard are actually really good parents. (Not to mention that it’s usually mothers who get this treatment, while fathers get a free pass for almost anything up to and including full-on felony neglect, but this rant is long enough already.)

[@juliawidmaier5334]

Bluey fandom is what comes to my mind

[@a.w.4708]

I feel like this about Encanto fandom. Like ok, Abuela made more than slight mistakes, but not nearly as bad as some fans claim she did. It is combined by claiming every single character has "severe trauma and anxiety" while there is nothing indicating that for most of them. Especially Camillo and Antonio. While, at the same time, completely ignoring the trauma Abuela had, from losing her home and seeing her husband killed in front of her, which in my opinion is a valid reason for making mistake of wanting your children to be overpowered. I feel like people just project their own trauma and the behaviour of their own parents on Abuela.

[@rainpooper7088]

The Owl House with Camilla. And that show had *actual* abusive parents in it. And yeah, it is pretty much always the mothers who get hate. That should make us think.

[@grantflippin7808]

​@@rainpooper7088 luz would have been happier if she just went to summer camp.

[@grantflippin7808]

​@@juliawidmaier5334 bad parents? no. Bad neighbors? Absolutely.

[@yoyohan9]

3:41 This is an issue I have in fandom sometimes. When people criticize the fandom for how they portray a character because it's stereotyping, when said portrayal is established by the source material. While fandom isn't immune to caricaturizing, sometimes the source is where the main problem lies. The fandom portrayal is just the symptom. Also, not saying I'm super versed in how the fandom treats Damien. But most of the time I see him, he's still a bit emotionally constipated and bad at expressing himself, but fairly chill and adores Dick. He's not portrayed as super aggressive (except with Tim maybe) because the whole idea is that he's unlearning/unlearned those things.

[@X0.LA_BRAVA.X0]

No because I'm not even a fan and I found it weird how they thought a kid who probably has problems, is violent, and eastern Asian as racist? Like, the bat kids are adopted from crappy lives, ofc they'd have a few emotional issues.

[@yoyohan9]

@@X0.LA_BRAVA.X0 *middle eastern. And to be fair, most of the racism discourse I've seen is because of how that side of his family is portrayed, and the fact that they intentionally raised him to have violent tendencies. Even as a Robin, Damian was uniquely bloodthirsty as a child because he was raised to kill.

[@plantainsame2049]

​@@yoyohan9Also, most of that aggression has nothing to do with their race.It's It has a lot more to do with the fact that ras al goul Is a millennia old Nutcase who regularly takes baths in evil mountain dew

[@X0.LA_BRAVA.X0]

@@yoyohan9 In a stereotypical sense tho? Maybe they just wanted a robin with a troubled homelife that just so happened to be middle eastern. I can understand why they might think it's a stereotype, but it seems stereotypical to assume a family of color is aggressive because of their race. Like only white people couldve been a good fit for abusive parents

[@BJGvideos]

​@@yoyohan9Yeah. And his family isn't even the typical "violent middle eastern" stereotype either. They're effectively ecoterrorists who predate any modern belief system.

[@ThatGreyGentleman]

The adoration for Bakugo is what stopped me from watching MHA. Not only did I experience bullying like that first hand (obviously not on the superhero level), but y’all do realize that in their world, he’s effectively bullying Deku for being disabled, right?!? His whole backstory is that he harasses Deku because ONE TIME the ‘Kid who is limited by a physical condition’ tried to help him up, and he felt insulted. Then he gets even MORE angry when it turns out Deku does have powers. That’s like being mad that the kid in a wheelchair tried to help you stand, bullying him for years, and then being EXTRA MAD when that kid has a life-altering opportunity to walk because ‘ONLY YOU SHOULD BE THE WALKING ONE IN THIS DYNAMIC’ Bakugo can die in a hole.

[@kazy.2936]

Vocaloid: MIKU (and other vocaloids by extension) DONT HAVE TO BE THEIR OFFICIAL AGE!!!! FANMADE MIKUS CAN BE ANY AGE!!! THIS INCLUDES AGING UP AND DOWN (However, aging up probably still needs to be explicitly stated) (Mainly saying this because of the rabbit hole animation)

[@odditycat2716]

I am of the belief that vocaloid canon ages are extremely stupid unless the voice provider is underage. they're VOICES. you should be able to project whatever you want onto them. it's fine if you find miku hot or ship her with Luka or Kaito or whatever. she's a voice and a drawing. she doesn't even have a personality

[@adhdfuelorwhatever]

So real,, the amount of vocaloid fans policing others over the vocaloids' "ages" and shit is so tiring

[@kokoro7996]

To add to this. No, Rin and Len are not siblings. Their relationship can be whatever the song needs it to be.

[@OffBrandLNFan]

I once saw someone ship Len x Kaito, Miku x Kaito, Len x Rin and Miku x Luka were all "pro-ships"...@@odditycat2716

[@ranting2damax]

This! The only way that it should be considered a problem is if the voice providers for the Vocaloids were children at the time of recording, such as Kaai Yuki, voiced by like a 7-year old, hasn’t had an update to her voicebank since due to the provider aging! (Also this isn’t a hypothetical either btw.. there’s ACTUALLY a gross song out there that uses Kaai Yuki for this sort of stuff… ew)

[@MascotHorrorFan]

FNaF: The lore is actively made up of theory fanfiction with most pieces not fitting together quite as nicely anymore but people still hold on to those peaces because they like the fanfiction that was collectively created.

[@BrunoMaricFromZagreb]

Much like Kingdom Hearts,the story would be better if it never existed at all,& if we ignored the lore.

[@tinaherr3856]

Yeah, I'm a part of the fandom (more specifically the theorist side) and it's honestly just a mess. Mainly because the actual story is a mess, never confirming things and giving only vague interpretations on what's going on. Because seriously, what thd hell were those endings for Help Wanted 2!? And why is there Dream Theory 2: Electric Boogaloo implied with the "oh, these games were in-universe video games" in the 1st Help Wanted and the Tales books!?!? The creators expect fans to get into the mystery, without giving all of the pieces for them to find and put together.

[@saturnas]

I was never that much into FNaF but when they made the movie I feel they lost a big opportunity to create some kind of tied up lore that wasnt just a bunch of headcanon theories. Even if this canon was some kind of "movieverse" thing (like marvel got different canonical facts for comics and movies) and didnt affect the games at all, it would give the fans and the movie-only enjoyers a more consistent lore to embrace

[@Dressup_Doll]

I used to like a different series that’s been running for over 14 years, and it makes way more sense than FNAF. NGL, it’s almost a bit sad.

[@Myfavcolorsnotevenindigo]

thank you for saying this-Everyone seemed to immediately jump on the “Abby and Mike Schmidt” are Afton’s” thing before the movie even came out. Hell, even after the movie was released, a ton of people are trying to find some explanation for them to be Afton’s and it’s a little annoying 🥲

[@IDKwhyimhere675]

ADHD i swear all a character has to do is show slight happiness towards an interest and people will try and convince others there adhd coded. As if adhd is simply being hyper or having an interest. As if adhd doesn’t have anything else around them. Its fine headcanoning but jesus not every happy character has to have damn bro

[@gothica553]

Definitely agree. So sick of fandom deciding that ADHD is Excited-Distracted Disorder. I have ADHD and I personally love ADHD headcanons for characters who aren't the stereotypical "omg squirrel!!!!" character type and instead lean into other ways ADHD presents itself.

[@clonnie-cloo]

i honestly agree from the other side of this pov. it seems like a lot of extroverted, loud, over the top characters get adhd headcanons even if there's nothing really pointing to it, but not someone who doesn't fit the stereotypes even if they have a lot of traits that real people with it do. as someone who went under the radar for years, that mindset pisses me off. i also think there's the fact that adhd, or any neurodivergence, tends to get ignored if the character belongs to other marginalized groups. like, in the six of crows fandom, people will talk about the representation in the series and mention that kaz and wylan are disabled, and that jesper is black and bisexual, but not the fact that jesper is really clearly coded as having adhd. like, it's not subtle at all, i think leigh bardugo has said she did it on purpose, and honestly? he's some of the better adhd rep i've ever seen, but somehow it just gets brushed over?

[@Batbitesthesecond]

Dude, a character will be hyper or something and that makes them have adhd apparently and its so annoying like ???

[@tsifirakiehl4250]

@ellianar4151 I also have ADHD, and some of my favorite characters that I headcanon as ADHD are the characters from “Noises Off,” none of whom fit the “lOoK aT mE i’M sO hYpEr” stereotype. They’re characters in a farce, so their traits are exaggerated for the sake of comedy, but they feel like real neurodivergent people: Brooke has issues with auditory processing, Garry talks faster than he thinks and often forgets the words for things, Dotty struggles to keep track of which props she’s supposed to be carrying when, Freddie overthinks everything and worries that he’s stupid, and so on. They may not have deliberately been written as neurodivergent, but I honestly find them better representation than some canonically neurodivergent characters.

[@gothica553]

@@tsifirakiehl4250 I feel that, with the unintentional representation being better than actual representation! I'm always wary of canonically ADHD characters since people will often default to a very generic portrayal of the disorder, whereas headcanons made by actual ADHD people will be more varied and represent genuine personal experiences. Same goes for autism in my experience as well. Also love the mention of auditory issues, since it feels like barely no one talks about it! One of my favorite characters I headcanon as ADHD for having a lot of anger and struggling with rejection sensitivity. Another character that I have an ADHD headcanon for struggles with time blindness and is often late to things. None of them are a quirky, hyperactive "omg shiny!!!! wait umm what was I saying??" type of character. Not that those people don't exist, but it feels so overdone.

[@ahuman7882]

From what I remember of the PJO books (and I could be forgetting something), it was clear Annabeth had a crush on Luke but not that he liked her back. He seemed to view her solely as a sister

[@nedhunter4444]

6:21 I actually do talk about this! I'm currently writing a fanfic whose lead protagonist is a nameless side character from canon who had exactly four lines of dialogue and then died off-screen. The whole reason this fanfic exists is because I misread the part where the protagonist finds out that he's dead, in such a way that I thought he was still alive. When I realized what had actually happened in canon, I ended up coming up with a story based on the premise of my misinterpretation being correct.

[@ZoeHerron-hf7zt]

Oh! That's so fun!

[@nedhunter4444]

@@ZoeHerron-hf7zt The book is called *Silver, Sand, and Silken Wings* btw. I'd definitely recommend it!

[@Crafty_boy70]

The ATLA one sounded very over-exaggerated, the part about Katara being a stay at one mom might as well be a lie since we hardly have any information about what happened between ATLA and LOK, plus wasn’t it stated that Aang did actually spend time with all of his kids, yet did more with Tenzin for the sake of the Air Nation? That one moment in the comics is pretty fucked though.

[@areeba7045]

wait which moment??

[@EF-kk3vh]

@@areeba7045i think they meant the one mentioned in the video about Katara being jealous, though I haven’t read the comics so I don’t know much about it beyond how it was described in the video

[@areeba7045]

@@EF-kk3vh ah i see, thanks for the explanation

[@kaurahime]

do u know what comis its in??

[@Crafty_boy70]

@@kaurahime no I’m not sure

[@thesetwofloofs5397]

This one guy. There’s this one guy that gets ignored so hard.

[@LazyRosey-os7jy]

From the PJO fandom: Grover

[@WINION-p8j]

Grover?

[@WINION-p8j]

@@LazyRosey-os7jy it so sad how we had the same though

[@LazyRosey-os7jy]

@@WINION-p8j Yeah 😔

[@osheridan]

Shuichi Aizawa my beloved 😭

[@Wolf_Blob]

For all fandoms: When the are two rival/ enemy male characters who are/ you think they are in love, and one is a little bit weaker than the other, DON'T MAKE HIM A TWINK. I'm so tired of the submissive-dominant trope, THEY'RE BOTH STRONG. Please stop making the "stronger" a literal abusive partner and the "weaker" one getting abused/ sexually harassed. *STOP.*

[@Aesos3429]

And also to add on to this a bit, just because one of the characters is shorter, doesn’t always mean they’re an overly submissive uwu baby. I’ve seen so many male characters that are physically badass, great at combat and pretty domineering in personality…but if they’re shorter than the guy they paired with, who is canonically much worse with combat, weak, etc, the fandom tends to just go “well short= feminine and submissive and tall= masculine and dominant regardless of your personalities” and it’s just…so annoying lmao

[@Wolf_Blob]

@Aesos3429 THANK YOU.

[@LanieMae]

In my fandom there’s this huge ironic thing where there’s this one character who has a whole thing about not treating himself as a human that he only exists to fill a certain role, only for the fandom to completely water him down, not treat him like a human and basically only exists to be a ship tool. Yet no one talks about the very blatant irony there

[@blueheart-mb8uj]

are you talking about nagito komaeda by any chance?

[@LanieMae]

@@blueheart-mb8ujno I’m talking about John from Milgram but yeah Nagito can definitely fit this description as well

[@BrunoMaricFromZagreb]

@@LanieMae I've NEVER heard of EITHER of these 2 shows...

[@ur4niumsnail]

@@BrunoMaricFromZagreb Nagito Komaeda is a character from the second danganronpa game (the game series is about some 16 teenagers being trapped in a place and forced to kill eachother to escape, it's fucked up at times and not in the good way, more in the sexualising teenagers way so personally wouldnt reccomend but the concept had potential imo) and Milgram is a primarily youtube series where 10 people, ages ranging from 12 - 39 are placed in a prison for commiting murder, and the audience can go on a website to vote whether they should be forgiven or not forgiven for their crimes based of music videos that show their point of view of their murder. Unfortunately it is true that John gets bastardised lots, and from what ive seen the fandom is pretty weird about selfcest shipping him with Mikoto which will never sit anywhere near right with me

[@LanieMae]

@@ur4niumsnail I mean it’s really not selfcest since they’re different minds and from what I’ve heard dating within systems isn’t uncommon. And this is pushing to the side how John said “snuggle together and say good night” when referring to mikoto that one time, but the fandom basically uses the ship to flanderise them and it’s ugh

[@Urmumlel7025]

For Sonic, Amy Rose was created before Tails, Knuckles, Metal Sonic, etc. And, she deserves more respect.

[@Orange_Swirl]

Damn, I should have included this in my comment.

[@grunkleg.2934]

Was she? Both Amy and Metal Sonic came on the scene in the same game, and Sonic 2 and CD were in development at the same time

[@rainpooper7088]

@@grunkleg.2934Amy was technically created for a manga way before Sonic CD, actually. That same manga is also where Charmy Bee came from and he's probably the most disrespected reoccurring character in the series(he literally lost the Knuckles Chaotix popularity polls to the one-off robot characters with zero personality by a landslide), so I'm on board with respecting these characters.

[@asrieldreemurr1647]

@@rainpooper7088 Funnily enough, Sonic CD was actually confirmed to take place before Sonic 2, meaning that Sonic and Amy's relationship started before he befriended Tails

[@krilc]

Meh...by that logic Vector the Crocodile is more important than Amy since hes from the OG concept art of Sonics band

[@moonbeamsun9066]

There’s so many elephants in the Miraculous Ladybug fandom it’s no longer a room but a full blown zoo.

[@kervinsantos5808]

More like an Elephant Sancuary

[@ChibiMoyashis]

Fandom in general: Acting like their headcanons are canon, and full-on expecting everyone else to agree and flipping out when they don't. This also applies to ships, which... don't get me started on that. I've actually begun to avidly avoid anything to do with the concept of shipping, even if it's author-confirmed canon or a pair that I like. ...speaking of the above: Erasing one or both individual personalities for the sake of the pairing (why do you ship them to begin with, then??), and the "my issues have been solved because I'm in a relationship now" crap.

[@ChibiMoyashis]

Oh and the erasure of found family as a concept, ace and/or aro erasure, etc. But that's been said already.

[@osheridan]

>read a silly bromance between two male characters >they balance each other's flaws and have cute dialogue >open fanon >dehumanising 🌽 >the most disturbing comic I've ever seen >dozens of s.a jokes >noncon art marked as sfw >close fandom >cry

[@ChibiMoyashis]

@@osheridan The lack of proper tags bugs me to no end too, omg. Fic sites and tumblr *especially* are torture anymore even just trying to avoid traumatic subjects, let alone trying to stay away from that stuff...

[@montserratmarroquin400]

@@ChibiMoyashis Especially if it’s SA or grape, like I get there are "Explicit content" or "Mature stuff" or "Creator refused to put tags" but I feel like it’s not enough to warn people since those tags can pretty much mean anything explicit This happened with a fic I was reading where there was assault and grape that was not tagged, it did say the whole warning at the top and the creator put it in the notes but it was still such a surprise Also people could just skip the notes too so I don’t understand why they didn’t put that since it really doesn’t spoil anything

[@ZeothTheHedgehog-c8o]

To answer the "why do you even ship them then?": Because they look cute together, that's basically the main reason anyone is shipped. Now I don't like ignoring character personalities entirely because of that, I'm just saying that's the main reason for liking any ship. Stuff like chemistry between the characters, that exists or not, is simply more fuel for the fire.

[@jkid1134]

Iroh was a successful general for his whole life, and that means he is personally responsible for countless deaths. The entire fandom has forgiven him for spending decades of his adult life being happily engaged in killing and conquering... which would be fine, except most of them will tell you Azula is "irredeemable" for much less.

[@exilestudios9546]

Which is even more hilarious when iroh himself doesn't believe she is beyond healing and redemption, he just thought she needed to be removed from power before more people got hurt.

[@elaineb7065]

They forget that her nation being at war is all Azula has ever known. About the only real career option for a member of the Fire Nation is either warrior, or directly related to that. And as a master firebender from seemingly the word go, Azula is training to be a warrior as all firebenders are expected to be. Iroh is a person who needed his son to die to see the personal cost of war; until then, it was a job he did, & he was good at it. Once his son died & put things into perspective for him, he was hit hard, not just by grief, but also by guilt & remorse for all the sons & daughters who died at his hand whose parents now grieve them just as he grieves his son. And then we have Ozai aka the WORST father in the whole show. Favouritism, strictness, coldness, high expectations, physical abuse... At least Zuko had Iroh watching his back, & before him, his mother. Azula only had Ozai, & he wasn't good to her either. He drove her to be who she is, & almost nobody can counter that effect on her. Especially not as the war backs him up.

[@emerald9194]

Yeah, if Iroh can change, so can Azula. They’re just at different points in their lives and journeys. Iroh had many years to turn himself around. Azula is still grappling with everything and her own relationship to herself. She could very well get there someday.

[@omnia-amo]

Yeah, I love Iroh as a character, but Azula was a victim herself. She was mentally unstable during the final Agni Kai and was a child used as a weapon to further Ozai’s agenda.

[@kevinbell5674]

There is literally nothing to indicate that Iroh was doing anything "happily" during that time.

[@weebofthedecade1663]

One of my fandoms has a problem where all the girls are badasses who can take care of themselves but 80% of the time if you read a shipfic for it, they are suddenly much weaker than the guys in the show even though the girls are canonically stronger. It irritates me to no end.

[@Cinnamonraisin_Bagel]

what fandom? i'm guessing maybe demon slayer

[@purrowell]

YES. I use fiction to escape the patriarchy not partake in it

[@johngellare3507]

@@purrowell Funnily enough, we don't live in a patriarchy. We live, in most places, in a democratic oligarchy that happens to have male leaders. An actual patriarchy would be something like ancient rome, where the *fathers* would have special legal and judicial powers. Compare that to the U.S, where fathers can barely get custody of their children, it's not a patriarchy.

[@sparkyblue7016]

​@@johngellare3507Again, the male leaders don't just happen to leaders. It's a product of patriarchy. Patriarchy doesn't simply mean no women rights, it's more nuanced than that. Otherwise usa would have women leaders but they don't. Why do you think that is?

[@j.j.juggernaut9709]

@@johngellare3507awww your delululand seems to be a very cute place to live in 💀

[@cac_deadlyrang]

Infertility doesn’t automatically mean sterility and adoption is a MF’er in Australia, with it being somewhat frowned upon because of Stolen Generations and forced adoptions. Yes, this is all about Brandy Cattle from Bluey.

[@BrunoMaricFromZagreb]

I haven't watched the show.It doesn't air on my TV,& not sure where to watch it online & don't have the time do download pirated versions,but I'm aware of the plot point & have NO IDEA what the fandom has done with it.

[@Sireington]

Explain?

[@bjam89]

@@Sireington without knowing anything about bluey, white folks have this thing where they try to destroy indigenous cultures using a wide range of tactics like literally stealing kids and adopting them away so they are raised away from their culture, or forced schools that twist history, and does not teach people about their past. it is really tragic and there is most likely a reason you do not know about it.

[@thetaria]

@@SireingtonI'm pretty sure OP is talking about a character from Bluey who's really struggling with infertility, the fact leading her to isolate herself from the rest of her family (her sister is the mother of Bluey, and Bluey's sister looks really simmilar to the character in question). Many people are like "why doesn't she just adopt" failing to see the implications of her feeling as if the child will never truly be hers or in general her feeling too destroyed by her infertility to even consider it an option. That's what I think at least, and it's only based on my knowledge from a video on it. The video is by Pugly here on youtube, I really reccomend it

[@cac_deadlyrang]

@@thetariaAnd also, the aforementioned societal roadblocks, too, because Australia basically wouldn’t allow anyone who wasn’t a white nuclear family to have familial cohesion until the 70s-80s.

[@alittleofsomething]

Not in the fandom anymore, but. Papyrys from Undertale loves puns and he puns more than Sans. The blue hoodie brother is a prankster. The fandom used to think Papy hates puns alltogether. I dunno about now.

[@British_bagel]

I think (as someone who was in the fandom not to long ago) people see it a lot more now

[@goldenstarcat9964]

7:45 It honestly makes me really sad how a lot of the Stardew fandom portrays Demetrius. He’s not the best step father and definitely has some favoritism, but he’s not abusive. I was confused when I got the the infamous scene where he ‘argues’ with Robin over apples. People forget that he didn’t say anything super rude and he even apologized quickly afterwards and explained that he has trouble with technicalities. Something similar happened with Jodi and Kent when Kent had a disagreement with his wife but quickly resolved it and no one talks about it. My man Demetrius does not deserve this slander

[@firelordoregano5632]

sdv fans when obviously autistic man is obviously autistic

[@buriedinthegarden]

I barely ever hear anything nice about Demetrius and it makes me so sad. And people get so heated about that tomato/fruit thing but like…it felt like an honest mistake to me, and if you agree with him in that argument, the resolution for it is so sweet. He gets so unnecessarily demonized in the fandom spaces I’m in 😭

[@kitkatkk2]

allistics when autistic character has flaws (they weren't a perfect little baby who just likes something a lot)

[@pageturner2958]

@@buriedinthegarden My only hang up with that cutscene is that I have to chose one or the other when fruit is a botany term and vegetable is a culinary one so are not mutually exclusive and so I should be allowed to say both are correct in their ways of thinking... but that is likely just me

[@ebonydarknessdementiaraven4610]

REAL Demetrius is so misconstrued and over hated by basically everyone in the fandom :((

[@shadowsight804]

The Magnus Archives: Tim Stoker is not dead he is just on a reallllly long kayaking trip. (We also refuse to acknowledge a lot of other deaths, but that one is the big meme)

[@sparkriver8173]

Wasn't another joke Peter Lukas doing the Kayaking trip with him? I think I remember something like that and it was hilarious. XD

[@thetaria]

I still don't know where that came from even though I just finished s4. I did skip s3 QnA though so... also good to see TMA fans in random places :D

[@lilalino]

@@thetariawait are you telling me Tim has nothing to do with kayaks in canon? I'm only at the beginning of season 3 but i've heard of the kayak thing and i just assumed it was based on a canon thing...

[@dragonfly5835]

@@lilalinoIf I remember correctly he did go kayaking once when he was on vacation. Not entirely sure and can’t point to an episode off the top of my head so this could be a mandela effect haha

[@thetaria]

@@lilalinome too but well... things go wild in the bad way...

[@howveyouben]

I cannot believe no one acknowledged my massive issue with the Harry Potter fandom: Snape was *never* a good guy. Ever. “Always” doesn’t redeem him. It actually showed that he was a creepy simp who was mean to Harry solely because he wanted to get with his mom. Sure, he had allegiance to Dumbledore, but he also had allegiance to freaking Voldemort. I’m so sick of people acting like he was actually a good guy in disguise, or that the last book redeems him. So, it shed some light on things, but it didn’t do any favors for his character.

[@Cinnamonraisin_Bagel]

tbh i don't give a flying hoot what Jk rowling says (she's obviously not the brightest tool in the shed) snape wasn't good and harry son should've been Remus Arthur or something like that

[@pallydan893]

In a similar vein, I don't get how anyone would fawn over Draco Malfoy at all. Especially when they romantically pair him with either Harry or Hermione. The little sh*t is the fantasy equivalent of that one kid who wore confederate flag t-shirts and drew certain WWII symbols on the Jewish kid's notebook

[@Cinnamonraisin_Bagel]

​@@pallydan893 yeah draco is literally a blood racist and called Hermione the wizard version of a slur, i don't even believe he got development i just think him and harry just kinda avoid each other

[@chelonianmobile]

... No, he didn't "want to get with" Lily. The point was that he LOVED Lily. He showed that in some terrible ways but he LOVED her, truly, as a friend as well as romantically.

[@xxyzxxyz690]

​@@pallydan893I mean I never shipped it in canon but I used to read Drarry fanfiction because it just makes for the perfect enemies to lovers setup. And the last two books did make me feel sorry for Draco even though he was awful for the majority of the series, and in the end it seemed like he turned out to be a somewhat decent person. I still think Rowling should've written a proper redemption arc for him instead of "Slytherin = evil, except for Snape because he fell in love once" and having none of the Slytherins stand up against Voldy at all. A lot of fanfiction gives the Slytherins in general way more depth and nuance which I always appreciated. But yeah a lot of people tend to forget just how nasty both Draco and Snape were in most of the books and imo Rowling definitely overdid it with the cartoonishly mean bullying

[@yeetthebeatout6906]

Trauma isn't an excuse to be an *ss. Yes, abuse can mess someone up and make them lash out, but that doesn't mean they should be forgiven for abhorrent behaviors and/or actions.

[@stormrider24]

The HP fandom basically choosing to ignore like... everything? In the series? Like why was Cho Chang made out to be the villain for being emotionally unavailable to Harry after her fucking boyfriend got MURDERED?

[@starcre9338]

Honestly, I get and agree with what you’re saying, as a lot of it comes off as really victim-blamed,,, but like… they didn’t get it from nowhere. the books do it too - i mean, there’s tons of scenes in their relationship where Cho Chang is looked down upon for crying and it’s heavily implied she’s just ‘acting sad for the attention’ and ‘didn’t really know cedric anyway’ so yeah, they shouldn’t do that, but the books shouldn’t, either

[@stormrider24]

@@starcre9338 Oh that's what I meant. If it wasn't in the books my problem would be different, but no, she actually wrote that. That's my problem.

[@starcre9338]

@@stormrider24 oh whoops! i just misread it, sorry

[@chesspiece4257]

i feel like the HP fandom ignoring the problematic aspects in JKR’s writing is fine as long as they don’t replicate it. confronting it is cool too

[@LAZERAK47V2]

To be honest, I think the book nailed how a bunch of teenagers would react to someone who was going through the ringer. Teens are assholes (WE ALL WERE, DON'T EVEN TRY TO DENY IT) and are very self-absorbed. Cho was a popular girl before the events of Order of the Phoenix, meaning that it was pretty likely that most of her "friends" were just hanging with the popular girl and didn't actually care. So when she starts getting all sad and depressed, they drop her like a dress they've worn one time. I always thought it was a realistic portrayal of cliques in High School and how they would react. Harry being totally confused and frustrated by her makes sense too, it's not like he had emotional support growing up, so his emotional growth is likely extremely stunted and because we follow the story through his eyes, we get his interpretation. The story would've likely been written very differently if we had read it through Cho's eyes. How she lost her crush, lost her popularity, is trying to move on with her life despite not being in a good place and then not being supported by her boyfriend (let's be real, Harry didn't really make the time for her, nor did ever actually have a full on deep conversation with her). Remember, the story may be written in 3rd person, but it's being conveyed through Harry's eyes. We never get to see what other characters are thinking.

[@junipest9291]

Good LORDDDDD I have a lot about the Steven Universe fandom, but my number one biggest gripe is how the fandom treats Lapis. I'm like almost 100% sure people only hate Lapis because for one episode she was mean to Peri, who's a huge fan favorite, so Lapis not liking her at first was a huge no-no, even though Lapis' REASON to hate Peridot was TOTALLY valid. Peridot literally kidnapped and tortured her for information on the Crystal Gems and Steven, which then lead to her being trapped in a fusion underneath the ocean for multiple months, so yea, it makes sense why Lapis was so hesitant to be nice to her. There's also an argument made against her that she was selfish for taking the barn with her and running away to the moon, but the reason she did that was because she didn't want to be caught in the middle of a war again. Last time, Lapis had no choice or way to run away from the war the first time, and it caused her over 5000 years of torment being trapped in that mirror and all, so it makes total sense why she decided to dip. And she even came around in the end and murked Blue Diamond, so that's not even a good reason anymore. Sorry for the long rant, I just had to get this off my chest.

[@Engardian]

Naw I don’t like Lapis much because by her own admission, she “almost drowned a lot of people”. Like she had every right to not want to be around Peridot, who hurt her. But she hurt a lot of people herself, but is only ever portrayed as a victim. She gets better towards the end of the show though.

[@raccoonenjoyer01]

SAY IT LOUDER

[@RaphaelHamato659]

An issue I had with some fandoms I'm in is that they always treat the youngest siblings of a family like whiny crying babies that cannot stand for themselves at all without the older sibling's help, even thought the canon material proves that they are more than capable of standing up for themselves on their own. The characters that I think about regarding this topic are Luigi (from Super Mario Bros.) and Michelangelo (from Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles).

[@azr3ii]

OH MY GODD i just got reminded of the fanon interpretations of 2012 michelangelo... like, 2012 tmnt wasn't my favourite but mikey isn't a sweet uwu crybaby .... and to add on, raph is so often characterized as an abusive brother to mikey especially, when mikey is the one instigating him a lot of the time. i love tmnt but the fandom......

[@kanemorsillo5501]

I'm annoyed by this as well, and when it comes to Luigi, the Mario movie really didn't help in this regard by making him stay stuck in a cage throughout most of the movie until Mario saves him, that just made peoples perception of his capabilities even worse than it was.

[@thediscodevil0949]

I didn’t realise that this was the case with Luigi, lol. There are times in the Mario & Luigi series where he has to continue for a while alone to save his brother. Don’t get me started on the Luigi’s Mansion trilogy.

[@BJGvideos]

​@@kanemorsillo5501You may like how Luigi was portrayed in the live action movie then. It predates the "Luigi is a coward" characterization from the games, so he's a reckless guy with a penchant for science fiction stories.

[@HenryGray-sy4pu]

And Ruby in RWBY. Despite the fact that she's the team leader and reguarly gives orders to her older sister. I mean yeah, Yang does support her sometimes, but it's not like Ruby without Yang.

[@LangkeeLongkee]

About the Damian Wayne thing, I somewhat disagree with the last person. I don’t read Cassandra Cain comics, but Damian is usually portrayed as having been that way as a child due to trauma, but when he started living with his father he mellows way out. Was he a middle eastern stereotype of being blood thirsty? Sure when he was 10. But he’s like 17 in canon now. He actually has a very firm sense of justice and is very anti-killing like his father, and this manifested before he was even 13.

[@Basiliskkk]

Late reply but I wanted to touch up on this. (Dami is my fav) DC does have a few moments with Damian where it can get pretty bad with the stereotype. For example, in his fight with Jason, he pulls out a bomb strapped to his chest. I don't think I need to explain this one- Damian would never do that? Especially over a petty fight with Jason???? Tyeres also the pride issue written by devin grayson (The. Worst.), where Damian has gas bombs to bring to a pride parade and he's seen as "ignorant" and "uneducated" about queer pride, which is like?? No?? Damian has fucking common sense and wouldn't bring TEAR GAS to a parade. Not to mention the constant white washing and Grant Morrisons take on Talia. Overall, I'd mostly agree with you. Damian is one of the most violent batfam members, but that's because he was raised as an assassin. He's 15 now and has definitely mellowed out, he doesn't kill. I think hid last conformed kill was Ducard in B&R born to kill? Anyways sorry for the rant😭

[@LangkeeLongkee]

@@Basiliskkk interesting. I mean that's fair, I should have clarified that I do know I have heard complaints about a lot of authors ignoring his character development and things. I remember thinking it, including when I came back to this notification, but I guess I didn't mention it. The last time I read a lot of DC comics was in high school, Rebirth was popping off and Super Sons had just died. Since then I've seen some covers and skimmed some Damian stuff, other than that, only read the comic for the HBO Harley Quinn show. Also that's rather ironic he was ignorant at a pride thing cause I was definitely a queer-Damian truther 😭😭 Comic authors piss me off sometimes, but back in the day is was usually white washing him that got me so upset. And don't apologise. I love a good fictional character yap session haha. Comic were definitely a hyperfixation for me back then, I'd be a hypocrite to judge you now lol (Also love your profile pic, pretty sure I redrew that exact image in my sketchbook when I was like 15)

[@ebonydarknessdementiaraven4610]

I love how in the creepypasta fandom half of the fandom is so angry trying to explain how the hot versions of them aren't canon and none of the characters would never act the way they do in the fanfics and would kill you in 2 seconds flat while the other half of the fandom collectively ignores them

[@rushingwater2.0]

I’ve been in the creepypasta fandom since 2015 and it’s still one of my favourite things to see like, these are literal killers and cryptid monsters, but it’s so fun to make them found family as well I like both interpretations of the characters depending on what I’m reading or in the mood for, and I find the arguments between the different sides of the fandom to be really funny and some good quality entertainment

[@pikacrafter2903]

As someone who was really into it in middle school and has had a couple visits back from time to time, I think it's a really interesting fandom! You can go either super dark and heavy on the murder or you can just not and you'll have people there with you either way.

[@naolucillerandom5280]

I haven't been in that fandom since 2015, but I remember this. It's an odd memory.

[@BlindStarLily]

The duality of man- Psssst I totally agree. I’ve been here for a good handful of years now, and I love indulging in both the more realistic takes on the characters and the off the wall bonkers fanon versions of them. My only concrete rule is that the Jeff the Killer reboot is the only canon Jeffry Woods to me-

[@Ardorstorm]

I'm not even in the creepypasta fandom and I love that there are "hot versions" of the characters to self-indulgently fantasize about even if the canon is usually just a badly written horror story about a guy who kills you while you're sleeping

[@sansthecomic767]

Undertale: everyone blames chara for the genocide route even though the story is meta and openly blames you for it the game is supposed to call out how WE are comfortable with committing acts of violence in video games what's funnier is how the same people who blam chara for the genocide route take responsibility for the pacifist route in Mha people just don't acknowledged the fact that Enji went through a redemption arc and in deltarune everyone seemed to collectively forget that spamton helped you kill darkners in the snowgrave route (i know that he didn't directly kill anyone but he gave you the thorn ring) and I hate how the Fandom dumbed down papyrus most fan works just turned him into a dumb child

[@Konpekikaminari]

I feel like Chara going "when were you ever in control?" in the end of a genocide route contributed alot to that part

[@sansthecomic767]

You're probably right

[@wittyreviewer]

See for me, there's two sides to the Chara argument. While it's true the game is very obviously addressing *you*, the player, it changes a bit when you consider Frisk is also a character themselves. So I can see arguments there, but mostly you're right imo.

[@LazyRosey-os7jy]

I'm sorta new to the UT fandom but from what I've seen people are acknowledging chara wasn't actually the villian & that papyrus is an adult. I don't know how much of the fandom actually acknowledge this. It could be that I'm in a specific corner of the fandom plus I've been into more of the aus lately so idk if the fandom is growing out of that

[@sansthecomic767]

@@LazyRosey-os7jy I know but I'm talking about the old UT fandom I should have clarified that though

[@g.r.4459]

In the Harry Potter Fandom, there are many fans that deny Remus and Tonk's marriage to ship Remus and Sirius. But they still have Teddy, Tonk's son, as a character they like. So they reduce Tonk's character to surgogate mother, IF they even acknowledge her existence or name at all. So there are fans that don't like Remus's marriage to Tonks and deny its existence, but they keep the child that was born from that marriage... It's one thing to ship Remus and Sirius, but it's another to ship them and have them keep a kid from the cannon marriage that they DENY existing for that ship.... I mean, Teddy's even named after Tonk's father, Edward.

[@meridaskywalker7816]

Tonks is generally underrated

[@LAZERAK47V2]

Facts and logic typically don't matter to shippers.

[@mistertwister2000]

Or people who ship their head canon version of James with Sirius . . . gang, the events of the book can’t even fucking happen without James and Lily having Harry

[@mayochupenjoyer]

the jegulus ship makes NO sense to me bc james loved lily with every fibre of his being

[@maxdickens2347]

i think thats because they subconsiously see tonks is toxic (to a piont) like..she forced remus to marry/love her and even when 'in love' hes clearly uncomfortable and dislikes her verbally.

[@mrs.doctor1241]

I appreciate that the undertale fandom is finally acknowledging that papyrus is a grown adult and not this “innocent baby that must be protected at all costs” But i also feel like this is leading people to mischaracterize him Papyrus is a very positive and optimistic person with occasional child-like hobbies and interests He sleeps in a race car bed, believes in santa, and gets read bed time stories every night And even in the face of death, he still manages to remain kind and optimistic towards his literal murderer This doesn’t make him ignorant or incapable, and liking childlike things doesn’t make you a child It just feels a little wrong to see people now start to portray him as this swear-slinging nagger who’s always done with everybody’s crap. He’s a troublemaker and very particular about things, but usually only gets frustrated from his brother taking nothing seriously or from pesky dogs messing with his things otherwise he’s very chipper and positive in most situations and with most people. He even tends to miss red flags sometimes due to his relentless hope and optimism. He can be both a capable adult who shouldn’t be infantilized and also a cheerful person with interests in “kid” things. You don’t have to make him edgy to prove a point

[@doritodorito492]

FINALLY SOMEONE ELSE BRINGS IT UP and as someone who deeply relates to Papyrus it almost makes me feel like there's something wrong with me sometimes.

[@small_and_dangerous2068]

The whole “Aang is a deadbeat dad thing” is… complicated. Firstly, the scene in the comic mentioned isn’t Aang ignoring Katara’s feelings. It’s not her ignoring his either. They both don’t understand what’s happening for each of them in that scenario. It’s a miscommunication. Aang is rightfully a little tunnel visioned on this group of girls who have tried to pay homage to his DEAD CULTURE. He does pick up on Katara’s weariness in the beginning and makes sure to establish and introduce her as his girlfriend. She later realizes that she was jealous for no reason. She didn’t realize that Aang wasn’t focused on Avatar fame, but on the touching and exciting idea that people are invested in breathing life back into his culture. So she’s happy for him. As for him as a parent: Bumi and Kya would have a lot more to say if they felt like Aang was truly a bad father. There are scenes that show that they loved him and hope they’re doing him proud. They look back on a family photo fondly, not with the contempt the way you would think children who were the victim of an abusive father would be. Now I’m not saying Aang wasn’t tunnel visioned again at times. He’s the Avatar, a husband, a father, and the last person alive to teach the only other Airbender alive about the Air Nomad culture. The man is going to be busy and have his attention split. It doesn’t mean he never tried. It just meant he failed in some areas, areas that some of his children resent him for a little. Guess what? My dad will die some day. And I’ll likely still have resentments, even if they aren’t as poignant. Aang had a character flaw as a father and wasn’t perfect and made mistakes, boo hoo. That doesn’t make him a bad parent.

[@Falllll]

I hate that people seem to be incapable of seeing it as "he was flawed as a person, much in the way that people are." He wasn't a terrible father and a deadbeat and he wasn't a perfect person who never would have made those mistakes either. It's not a character assassination to have your character who's generally a great person be a less than ideal parent, particularly if the weight of an entire culture rests on said character's shoulders passing it down to a kid.

[@babyblouie]

The undertale fandom seems to never figure out that ALL THE CHARACTERS are morally gray, so much that we have discourse every two weeks on whether a character was hitler or is an innocent lil baby. Like I don’t get it can’t we have nuance?

[@bodieswhatbodies]

....except maybe Papyrus

[@Cinnamonraisin_Bagel]

Except monster kid they did nothing wrong

[@smileyhappyface5864]

As much as I like Undertale and I don't want to sound like I'm trying to disrespect Toby fox, I _strongly_ disagree. Papyrus, nearly all of the non-fighting characters, Alphys, and arguably Toriel are all unwaveringly good people. Making a mistake does not equate to doing something bad and accidents aren't moral failures, so outside of lying about the true lab, none of those characters are even remotely outside of the good area at any point in the story. Things get a bit complicated when discussing Asgore and Undyne (and especially Flowey), but they are blatant exceptions to that. And in that case, nuance is literally never shot down by the fandom unless you imply that you actually *dislike* the characters, which is a separate thing. I have no doubt that Chara has helped Asriel get medicine or something, or that Papyrus might've slapped Sans at some point, but that isn't something we see or hear about in the game because it's irrelevant information that isn't supposed to matter to the story or our perception of it. Acting like Chara isn't a bad person because they made a shirt for Asgore is a refusal to acknowledge nuance, and so is acting like Toriel _is_ a bad person because she left the kingdom.

[@Missingno_Miner]

@@smileyhappyface5864 Toriel and Alphys are very much morally grey. It is important to note that morally greyness does not make a character a bad person, and in fact most morally grey characters are good people, just in general. - Toriel did abandon her duties as Queen and ultimately attempted to imprison Frisk, and allowed a total of seven children walk to what she believed would be their death when she could have accompanied them to confront Asgore. She's also shown to not really be a great parent: Between Undertale and Deltarune, her track record is at least three out of four(and that's only since we haven't seen DR!Asriel at all) children with crippling mental health issues which Toriel seems to be completely oblivious to. In particular, Chara is known to have been suicidal and Kris' SOUL-removal stunts are clearly framed as an analogy for self-harm. She's shown expressing concern about Kris' recent well-being, but she doesn't really investigate much, she doesn't try to speak to Kris about it, instead stopping when Alphys told her "they're normal". - Alphys, as you point out, actively and dishonestly hid her mistakes. She also lied her way into her job, and engaged in some big-time medical malpractice by injecting people with significant amounts of a substance she had literally just discovered without further study. That part wasn't an accident, and the fact that she couldn't have predicted the results is part of the problem. - "Nearly all of the non-fighting characters" Mf, nearly all the non-fighting characters are, at minimum, not actively opposed to Asgore wiping out humanity(Which is omnicide.), and some, like Catty and Bratty, are disturbingly enthusiastic about the idea. - Even Papyrus, the morally whitest character in the game, still has his issues. In context, the whole "dating a child" thing isn't as bad as it sounds, but he still did attempt to imprison an innocent child so that they could be sent off to die. - There's... literally no indication Chara was a bad person, at least in life. The worst things we hear about them are Asriel, who previously had a very warped perception of them that was incredibly unhealthy for both of them, admitting that they weren't as infallible as he believed them to be, and that they were willing to kill their attackers(which may have included their implied abusers), in order to protect Asriel.(Notably, we know from Asriel that they had absolutely no desire to harm any of the humans until after their shared body was attacked, otherwise Asriel would have detected it and taken back control sooner.)

[@Missingno_Miner]

The fact that anyone even vaguely into the UTDR fandom will know exactly which specific character you're referring to is amusing, made more amusing by the fact that said character is, in reality, a beautiful example of grey morality. Though eventually you get to the fact that there are not one, not two, but *three* entire subreddits dedicated entirely to stripping said character of any kind of nuance and leaving a flanderized mess that is for all intents and purposes an OC wearing their skin, all of which are still active over eight freaking years after the game released, and it stops being as amusing and starts just being pathetic and a perfect example of the damage that a lack of basic media literacy can do to perception of a fictional character or work.

[@arceusinsanity301]

One thing I notice is a lot of people use "you(character A) can't control others(character B) actions" or other similar messages, to ignore how 1. Character A directly enabled or contributed to Character B's actions (ignoring their direct part), or 2. Ignores Character A's issues and guilt cause Character B's issues and guiltiness is more obvious/ present

[@paigemosher8697]

I don't even have fandom experiences like that, people have pulled that shit on me IRL. Like I'm somehow able to choose how I feel but other people have no choice but to act in a way where it's blatantly obvious I would get upset. If you act in a way that causes an emotional response, that is the consequence of your actions and you made that person feel that way. End of.

[@amazinggrapes3045]

Yeah this isn't a fandom problem, this is a therapy problem 😭

[@reneemoralesmoguel]

0:58 YESS!! The difference in the portrayal of Steve in his movies, the avengers movies and fandom is huge. They treat my guy as he wasn’t an Irish-American, disabled, poor and rebellious man in 1920-30’s Brooklyn before the serum, and a 2WW veteran after. He falsified legal documents in the first 5 minutes of the CA:FA movie and they still make him this perfect goodie two shoes that never swears and sticks to the rules…. I just can’t

[@SqualorOpera]

In the Bungou stray dogs fandom Not one character, not a single person in this entire cast, is intended to be morally pure. They’re all fucked up and violent and they’re supposed to be. You can like any characters you want, but the incessant woobification is intolerable. Just accept that their acts of terror and violence were hot like respectable villain fuckers for Christ’s sake.

[@yorkurt]

That's why I don't understand fans who make Mori to be this horrible horrible guy, and the chosen ignorance toward a backstory not completely fleshed out in canon. He's not worse or better than most other characters

[@SqualorOpera]

No to be fair I do understand that. You know, with the whole pedo thing. That being said, I do think people should be able to like him while acknowledging his flaws. I can’t stand when tiktok tries to woobify him, they’re even claiming he’s not actually a pedo. The writing could not be more on the wall about that.

[@yorkurt]

@@SqualorOpera I'd say the "comedic lolicon" is still a trope in Japan, although the actual thing isn't at all a joke. But like with the Tanizaki siblings I think yes, you can still like the characters and admit their flaws. I suppose I'm just touchy because a vast majority of fans coddle characters like Dazai and Fyodor, who have done atrocities that should be taken into account.. Like you say, "woobify" and I agree. I think it's unfair to support one character's actions over another because it is "attractive" or something (Sorry if very long)

[@tempestpbkh]

Honestly, when I think about Dazai and a few of his actions I think of "The ends justify the means." And yeah, the fandom does really woobify the characters like Dazai and Fyodor.

[@FoxTales-b8n]

I hear you and I raise you: Aya

[@tundraanderson9068]

Most of the fandoms i have been in should understand Women wearing skimpy or sexy clothing doesnt mean they always want sex, are sinful or otherwise evil or bad in someway Women can have traditionally masculine traits or take over traditionally masculine roles in a straight relationship without it being a problem Relationships are something you progress through WITH someone Not an instant fix it tool or something Being a victim doesnt change their actions consequences or make them better,only explaining their thought process and reasoning You can be an abuse victim and still also be a horrible abuser

[@disco.ball0]

that kast one(i’m pretty sure) was the topic of a study and it turns out that people who were in abusive situations, take domestic abuse, often become highly abusive.

[@PalisadePeryton]

For undertale... The main character is heavily implied to be a young child. They go on dates with several adult characters throughout the game. The characters both clarify that they feel no actual attraction to the MC, but it still comrs off as really weird when you think about it for too long.

[@rosykindbunny1313]

I choose to believe that Papyrus has no idea what a date actually is, and Alphys is just humoring you. I think that's what's implied anyway.

[@purplepedantry]

​@@rosykindbunny1313 Yeah, it always sounds more like 'Okay, kid. Sure. I can play along with that. Want a tea party?', than 'I'll just take this seriously despite not having any incentive to, pure or not'.

[@odditycat2716]

yeah, and also how their design kind of resembles a racist Asian stereotype what with the eyes and skin tone. I wholeheartedly believe it was completely unintentional but it still feels weird that no one talks about it.

[@firelordoregano5632]

@@odditycat2716 she's literally a lizard T_T

[@purplepedantry]

@@odditycat2716 It's sometimes talked about, but during the heyday, it was mostly played for half-heartedly stereotypical jokes, so it's at least a bit better that it's not being talked about in the same manner. I'd say we could definitely be doing better, though.

[@pisces2569]

Frozen: Elsa is the only one without a love interest. That does not make her a lesbian. She spent most of her life in isolation and now she’s thrusted into being head of state. She does not have the emotional capacity for a relationship at the moment and she hasn’t met anyone yet. Her only choice was a stranger who plotted to overthrow her. Just because a person sees their struggles to come out of the closet in Elsa’s anxiety and fear, doesn’t mean Elsa is actually in the closet. Also Naruto’s implausible graduation numbers is the least of its problems. How is Naruto the same age as his peers when he failed 3 times. And most importantly why are they recruiting children?

[@WolframiteWraith]

Elsa doesn't have to be a lesbian or against marriage or asexual. Her just not currently wanting to look for anybody due to her current life circumstances is infinitely reasonable. I am not a massive Frozen fan but I heavily appreciate that she's one of the only female characters I've ever heard of that is allowed to just exist without having to be attached to anyone or miserable about not being so.

[@rayray_017]

I always get annoyed when people speculate that Elsa is aro/ace or a lesbian because her entire story is focused on herself and her powers. Like its such a strong character beat to just have a woman who is independent and focusing on herself but noooo she has to not be interested in men or anyone for that to happen.

[@AzureTank776]

And throw in the fact that she is revealed to be a spirit in Frozen 2, and now has a duty to be a bridge between nature and humanity. Yeah, she's not even gonna think about any romantic partner anytime soon.

[@Hellopeople-b7g]

I headcanon Elsa as aroace

[@_JustAnotherGhost_]

9:31 This. This is EXACTLY what i see in a majority of the fandoms im in. You can try to find REASON for the things they do (i.e. Revenge, traumatic backstory, personality, etc.), but defending that is a WHOLE different story.

[@awhimsyreader9015]

The Winx Club fandom constantly hating on Bloom because she became a Mary Sue in later seasons nevermind that those seasons in general were pretty badly written and everyone's characters were ruined yet everyone still loves those characters for their portrayal in the first 3 seasons and ignore their portrayal in later seasons yet for aome reason they don't give that same courtesy to Bloom

[@elalaela2694]

There's a winx club fandom? Let me innnn

[@medea__witchhh]

​@@elalaela2694bestie get in here with us loll

[@naolucillerandom5280]

Yes, Bloom became a Mary Sue, but look at what they did to my girl Stella 😭 She's not even my favorite but that was just disrespectful!

[@ed-edd-n-eddiee]

oh i used to be really into that show where can i find this community please help??? i want it??

[@awhimsyreader9015]

@@ed-edd-n-eddiee It's mostly on Tumblr though you can find some KZbin channels that make edits of the characters aswell as KZbinrs who do redesigns of the characters and maybe on Tiktok too

[@ThoughtsOfaDyingNihilist]

Moon Knight: Jake Lockley isn’t a "violent psychopath", he’s a protector, an alter who is trying to save Marc and Steven from dangerous situations

[@LanieMae]

In a fandom with a similar character like John is not evil he’s just extremely frightened for Mikoto’s sake. Like why is it always with these types of characters

[@justincampbell3891]

That's actually an interesting observation. I hadn't thought of that before but the evidence backs it up. With the exception of Frenchy & Marlene (who are both as f(y0v)ck3d up in the head as he is. Understandably in all three cases, but still) all his personal relationships, everything really human about him, stems from Jake Lockley. Moon Knight is the avatar & earthly champion of a horrifically bloodthirsty God, Marc Spector was never anything but a contract k!113r in a hit squad that operated with (dubious) legal sanction, and Steven Grant was never anything but a name, a tuxedo, & a good natured taking of the piss on one crime fiction writer from another crime fiction writer.

[@Cyyruzz]

I'm not surprised that fandoms are ableist to systems in the slightest.

[@ShadeMeadows]

I really don't care what a fandom thinks, or what they think of my opinions.

[@stxrberrywcue]

7:06 YES OMG. I have BAD social anxiety, like bad to the point if I'm in a crowd for too long I'll have a panic attack, and yet I BARELY stutter, only when I try to talk as fast as my mind runs.

[@aikoaikoaikoaikoaikoaiko]

i also have severe social anxiety and i stutter alot- but yeah just because someone has social anxiety doesnt mean they stutter in their every sentence-

[@stxrberrywcue]

@@aikoaikoaikoaikoaikoaiko yeah, plus everyone is different, I know someone who doesn’t have social anxiety and still stutters, some people stutter, and some people don’t. I guess everyone just collectively thinks people with social anxiety stutter ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[@pressedrose1]

and i have a stutter but im very outgoing. in general i dislike when people mischaracterize stutters and overuse them to be cute

[@disco.ball0]

@@pressedrose1 yess and when people make like a flinch to scared like bro i flinch at loud noises and when i’m in a zone it doesn’t mean im terrified of my door opening

[@TheOverlordPepper]

I also have bad social anxiety and while I tend to stutter sometimes when I jumble all the words in my mind together(though, it’s less stuttering and more of me cutting myself off to say smth else. Even then, I just take a deep breath so I’m coherent when I speak), I end up saying a lot less then intended so it makes me accidentally seem very curt and uninterested. Point is, social anxiety is not just stuttering, there’s a lot of other things that go into it as well. Like if I’m presenting something in front of a crowd, my voice gets shaky from speaking a bit fast, and I don’t pay much attention to what I’m saying and instead focus on reading out loud or saying whatever I rehearsed in my head

[@DTylerFultzVA]

Ganondorf from "The Legend of Zelda" is not misunderstood. Even in his more nuanced moments like Wind Waker, he has done horrific things. He is more than willing to kill people, destroy/disrupt entire cultures, ravage islands and kingdoms, cause disasters through forbidden arts, and torture, threaten, and brainwash his own people to further his goals. In Tears of the Kingdom, he breaks a woman's spine, watches her die, and the moment he witnesses someone bawling and panicking at her death, he starts LAUGHING. I don't care what his tragic backstory is or what his motivations are. Ganondorf is not some incompetent idiot, not the hero of some untold story, and not your bisexual heartthrob. He is PURE EVIL, plain and simple. But the fans aren't ready to have that conversation.

[@Celestia282]

This is 100% pretty privilege. I've been a Zelda fan forever, and I never once saw anyone claim Ganondorf as "misunderstood" or a "tragic hero" until Tears of the Kingdom, exactly. Nintendo gave us a hot Dorf, and now thirsty people want to justify their attraction.

[@NapaCat]

I like WW ganondorf the best, because of the lengths he goes with his more nuanced goals. I like evil antagonists with nuance, that aren't necessarily redeemable or antiheroes.

[@Cyyruzz]

Exactly!

[@SteampunkMasquerade]

@@Celestia282people have like been like that over WW’s final monologue before we even knew what Totk Ganondorf would look like

[@ilDSttaro]

I admit that WW had done something, despite Ganondorf being just only in it and OoT at the time, that I thought was impossible, feel pity for him, but it never happened again, every other of his appearances and every other new playthrough made clear that Ganondorf is evil incarnate and all pity is wasted on him.

[@amakichou]

People hating happy endings. Not because they prefer other ships or something. No. They just hate happy endings. I understand that someone can prefer angst, but literally being angry at the author that some story ended well for most characters is a little childish. If you don't like the final, just write/read a fanfiction, don't make drama. Don't make fun of people, who are happy, because their favourite characters are finally safe and in good health. Amount of these edgy emo warriors is just sad.

[@eleonorepb4565]

The opposite hapened with the ending of the Mirror Visitor series; the ending is not happy for all characters and is open for to the reader's interpretation. People hated it because they wanted a perfect explicite happy ending for all the characters.

[@omnia-amo]

Yeah, I feel like happy endings are really nice, esp after a dark story. I really like endings that are bittersweet where the characters are happy, but didn’t forget about what they went through. I think these endings are happy enough to keep you content and angsty enough to satisfy. I also enjoy open-ended endings where we don’t see all the details bc theories are fun lol. Tho a good and happy ending is almost never a bad idea!

[@ak1noakin0]

I personally like happy endings where the villain wins

[@bugcatcherjacky1334]

I have a sort of love-hate relationship with non-happy endings. Like, I really love bittersweet endings. I love writing them too. At the same time, being a people pleaser, I have this deeply rooted desire for everyone to just be happy so when I imagine a bittersweet story in my head, I always end up "fixing" it 😂

[@kiernanhowell-mackinley1733]

Misery enjoys company.

[@LaydiNite]

Years back I ran into a fanfic that was poking fun at the tendency of the Kingdom Hearts fandom to not only ship them with each other, but make the members of Organization XIII into helpless woobie blobs. The fic was written as though this drastic personality shift was a contagious disease, spreading through the characters, and the others were reacting with horror and confusion. It was actually really funny. For anyone interested, it was called "Those Lacking Spines".

[@WolframiteWraith]

That sounds hilarious. Thanks for the rec.

[@pizzahutz_inthegarage]

As someone who used to be in the South Park fandom until I lost interest, none of the south park kids are innocent little babies.

[@TheGoldfishArmy]

Butters especially gets treated like this being of pure innocence. He's naïve maybe, but definitely not innocent.

[@WhiteWolf-lm7gj]

Ah yes, home of the "he would not fucking say that"

[@Melosketch426]

A problem i suffered from in a lot of my previous fandoms is not being able to accept that a media i was obsessing over wasnt perfect. Recently, ive been accepting the flaws in media i like, because face it, theres no 'perfect' media.

[@MarsoftheStars01]

Fandom in general: aromantic and/or asexual erasure, or claiming the typical aphobic things like their lack of attraction makes the character boring. I might be biased, but I think if romance is the only thing that interests you, you're shallow and stubborn. Get creative. Edit: Yeah this was about Alastor lmao. But just in general aspec people don't get a lot of canonical rep. Let us cope with what we have please.

[@hannahmetzger4880]

I agree, but we also have to acknowledge the fact that not _all_ asexual people are sex repulsed, and thus _can_ have sex, and we also need to acknowledge the fact that aro people _can_ have relationships. Because asexuality and aromanticsm _IS A SPECTRUM, FIRST AND FOREMOST,_ and I feel like hardly _anyone,_ even self-proclaimed and out ace/aro/aroace people, acknowledges that!!!!

[@eclipsemoon01]

I completely agree. I have a particular fandom in mind and it might not be what you were thinking of , but Hazbin Hotel has an aro/ace character that is quite literally shipped with EVERYONE in the main cast. The fandom does everything to justify it but are essentially erasing aro/ace representation. It's made worse with the fact that the character is explicitly stated to be aro/ace. Why cant people just leave certain characters alone? I'm not aro/ace but I would hate for representation to be constantly erased and then justified

[@MarsoftheStars01]

@hannahmetzger4880 this is very true, but it can also be used to erase aro and ace people who are sex repulsed or do not want a relationship beyond platonic. We need a balance of both in our representation. Again, I am fully agreeing with you, just saying that we need representation for both ends of the aroace spectrum.

[@MarsoftheStars01]

@eclipsemoon01 yeah... it's almost just funny seeing him be put in situations he would canonically avoid like the plague, but it's insane how common it is

[@ArixOdragc]

@@hannahmetzger4880 As a sex-positive ace person myself, I absolutely agree with this. The problem is that it's so easy to run into the same issue as claiming that a character is bi, but only ever showing them being attracted to the opposite gender - it feels like just paying lip service without actually committing to the representation.

[@benjaminjara7312]

PB from Adventure Time having a massive redemption arc in the later seasons Saying on screen how sorry she feels for all of her past actions And yet the fandom acts like she's a heartless dictator that never changed (Frickin Chainsaw Man fans)

[@fabianzimmermann5495]

Luke in the Percy Jackson books was very much a villain and did some awful things. In the second book he ordered a monster to kill/eat Annabeth and had Chiron and the centaurs not shown up at that instant, she would have died because of that. He helps to brainwash young demigods, children, to fight in a war. He manipulates Silena and gets her boyfriend killed, because of that. He sides with Kronos, do I even need to explain further? Sure, Luke has his motives, but that doesn't excuse siding with someone he should know will throw him aside the moment he isn't useful anymore. But Luke ends up sacrificing himself to kill Kronos and save everyone, so every bad thing he did is instantly forgiven by the fandom. I'll admit, I'm one of those guys. But he still was a major antagonist for the five book series and did some seriously messed up things.

[@J0j0_Flip]

And every one has the audacity to villainize Silena.

[@ishapratap5224]

EXACTLY. Just because I think Luke had a point about the gods DOES NOT mean that any of his actions weren't wrong.

[@eaglefan2569]

People wanna victimize Luke by saying Kronos did all the heavy lifting, but that's definitely not the case. Luke knew pretty well about what he was doing (the only thing I think he was genuinely unsure of was the fact that he was going to be used as Kronos' host if a Big Three kid couldn't be convinced) and stuck to his guns numerous times. Yes, Kronos was the ultimate mastermind behind the plot, but Luke isn't blameless, wasn’t possessed, and wasn’t brainwashed. Pretty much all his actions in TLO, TSOM, and TTC were his own, and shouldn't be ignored just because Luke was a Greek tragedy. He's a well written character BECAUSE of his flaws, and that falls apart if you try and ignore them.

[@Engardian]

Yeah it kinda pissed me off at the end when they’re like ‘you’re a hero Luke! You’ll go to elysium!’ Like, no. Living a life of hurting others is not erased by one good deed at the end(that deed being killing himself/and Kronos). Wow, you solved a problem that YOU were partially responsible for! Too bad you had to murder all those kids to get to that point, huh?

[@LittleMezzoBird]

@@eaglefan2569 I actually think he might have known. Now, I've only read the series once, but I remember being absolutely horrified by the ending of Battle of the Labyrinth. I spent so much time asking myself, "Did he know? Did he know that was the plan?" Then I started skim-rereading Titan's Curse because I still had it out of the library, and somewhere there's a scene where the general (Atlas) makes some reference to Luke's part in the plan, and Luke visibly pales in response. So, I could very much be recalling that wrong, but I think Luke actually may have known.

[@Wolfspirat]

The miraculous ladybug made me so angry when i discovered it bc how couldnt neither marinette nor adrian figure out who their respective other superherosona was despite them having the same eyecolor, haircolor, hairstyle, voice and the same very unusual allergy as some kid in their school that they see almost every day? Especially marinette, who is so obsessed with adrian that she even stalks him and wants to marry him one day more than everything?

[@eleonorepb4565]

I think it's implied that there is a kind of magic that make them unrecognizable and even if in the show Paris seem to be like a village it has many people and Marinette and Adrien have no ideas that the other is someone they know

[@arishachoudhury_]

magic bro, im pretty sure in the nyc special the robot is the only one who recognises them because the magic only works on humans so yeah magic. also it kinda just makes sense

[@ilDSttaro]

Especially in the Reflecta episode, Cat Noir become a Reflecta copy and Ladybug recognize him by his voice. Could be explained away that the transformation change their voices (ex Ladybug voices isn't the same as Marinette) but if this was the case could have been mentioned directly at least once. Plus in one early episode Alya take a pic of Adrien and draws Black Cat costume on it and show it to Marinette that dismiss it (cause she's in denial, about a lot of things I add), so is not out of chance that someone else could reach the same conclusion, IIRC Gabriel himself has this doubt at least once, heck both LB and CN have suspicion that Gabriel could be Hawk Moth in one, and only one episode, maybe more, I don't remember, till the finale. So yeah, the authors fumbled on this aspect.

[@AliceLoverdrive]

It made you angry because they... Didn't obliterate the whole premise of the show? The whole point is two idiots being stuck in a lovesquare with themselves. If there will be a reveal they might as well just close the show then and there.

[@mondenkindqueen]

Harley Quinn and Jokers relationship are not relationship goals. It’s abusive.

[@jab9109]

Also, it's supposed to be abusive, Jokes shouldn't get "fixed" because of love. He will not love you, he is LITERALLY as in a literal manner or sense, whiteout exaggeration the worst person ever.

[@WolframiteWraith]

But also related to this, Harley isn't a poor little thing who just needs out of the relationship to turn her life around. She chose to do some pretty horrific things quite gleefully in canon. I'm not vibing with this 'feminist icon' who laughs like one of her hyenas over a joke about murdering a baby.

[@elishafollet5347]

Her old outfit also looked cooler and had more personality to it tbh

[@No-longer1]

Which iteration of Joker and Harley?

[@thatrandomgeekabbi]

Okay, I'm in the Ninjago fandom, and the elephant they never mention is that Nya is kinda sexist toward the ninja in the early seasons. She always "boys never listen" this and "I hate boys" that, but when the boys say anything even slightly sexist, she gets all offended and storms off as if she doesn't say sexist things about them fairly often. It just drives me crazy. Tbh, I kinda hate Nya.

[@eleonorepb4565]

I think that in general when the writters want to do something they think is feminist with Nya it's ridiculous. Like when Nya is fighting Kryptor in season 3 and for no reason say that she isn't a damsel in distress.

[@mariechantal6168]

They made nya character sexist to try and push the feminine agenda and it did not work at all and honestly did the opposite. It honestly also makes no sense because her brother raised her for years literally years and she’s like oh boys are stupid. Boys don’t listen. Her brother raised her for years, I say it again and she saying these things it pisses me off.