Trans Rights v Gender Critical Feminism in the Workplace - the law

  Рет қаралды 4,081

Daniel Barnett, Barrister

Daniel Barnett, Barrister

Күн бұрын

Пікірлер: 54
@FlyingSpaghettiMonster2000
@FlyingSpaghettiMonster2000 8 ай бұрын
"Unless you're a minor deity , this is above your pay grade." This should be provided to all employees on their first day of employment.
@ultrafivethousand
@ultrafivethousand 4 ай бұрын
“Manifesting of belief” is the most self-serving euphemism for bullying I’ve heard in a minute.
@itstimeforlee
@itstimeforlee 17 күн бұрын
I agree, when trans identified individuals 'manifest' their belief it is bullying. Harassing women is never ok.
@ultrafivethousand
@ultrafivethousand 17 күн бұрын
@ characterizing the thing someone was born as (i.e., BIPOC, LGBTQIA+, sex, ability status, country of origin, etc) as “harassment” is fascism 101.
@sylvievideostockpile2155
@sylvievideostockpile2155 17 күн бұрын
The Employment Appeal Tribunal decided that gender-critical views are capable of being protected as a belief under the Equality Act 2010. The tribunal further clarified that this finding does not mean that people with gender-critical beliefs can express them in a manner that discriminates against trans people.
@WiltshireHare
@WiltshireHare 8 ай бұрын
Whether the trans employee has a Gender Recognition Certificate (GRC) is a red herring in the scenario given, as I understand it.
@amritlohia8240
@amritlohia8240 3 ай бұрын
Correct - s.7(1) of the Equality Act defines the protected characteristic of gender reassignment as also including cases where the employee has undergone, is currently undergoing, or even is merely proposing to undergo, a reassignment process (whether surgical or otherwise).
@jamesupton4996
@jamesupton4996 23 күн бұрын
It's a matter of commonsense and etiquette, I think. If a transgender colleague (assigned sex at birth male,) asks to be addressed as female for instance, then just do it. More tricky perhaps is if they wish to use female toilets or changing rooms. But not insuperable. Toilets at home are unisex after all. Changing rooms - again not insuperable ; changing rooms at swimmingpools are now cubicle based and unisex, often. But a bit of adaptation in people's thinking, might be enough. It's a small minority, but if someone has actually gone and publicly transitioned, then they have shown a level of courage, given prevailing attitudes. Now whatever one's thoughts on the gender / biological sex discussion, this is a de facto situation that presents itself - namely a colleague who has chosen to live in a particular way, and is committed to certain beliefs, which do not impinge on what they are paid to do. Just thinking it through, and acting accordingly, in a practical way, should be enough. It's not as if transgenderism is a big threat to anyone, whatever they think about it. One could argue that the whole philosophy surrounding sexuality is a minefield, and full of difficulties. But that is not what having transgender colleagues at work is about. No-one is expected to solve metaphysical problems, just to find a fair modus vivendi. People frquently deal with others in ways that conflict with their beliefs - eg. deferring to someone because of their rank, even though you think they're an idiot. Having friends whose lifestyles you don't approve of and would never emulate. Just a feature of life. By making arrangements for smooth social interaction need not imply assent to someone's lifestyle or values. It is simply enabling social cohesion by extending fairness to all, where it matters, at the level of human interactions.
@coderider3022
@coderider3022 8 ай бұрын
Star Trek call this the “kobayashi Maru”.
@alanhat5252
@alanhat5252 8 ай бұрын
Re-writing the rules of the game before playing the game because you don't like its test? The Kobayashi Maru was testing how a potential officer handles unavoidable catastrophic failure.
@ewan7255
@ewan7255 8 ай бұрын
I dont think gender identify ideology is worthy of respect in a democratic society but here we are - it isnt so different from other religious beliefs.
@danielcrafter9349
@danielcrafter9349 Ай бұрын
What?
@sisterrosetta57
@sisterrosetta57 8 ай бұрын
Until the compelling of the use of pronouns became a thing I can't recall many employees ever talking much about their beliefs in the workplace as it wasn't relevant. The pronoun use issue has created situations where people feel compelled to disagree or agree when normally use of language, short of being rude or defamatory, would just not be a factor in the workplace. It is like a confected problem as a result of employers have brought in policies on compelled speech. So, a good point about having clear policies, but many of these policies are currently biased in favour of gender ideology (promoting one pc over another). It puts gc feminists and others at a disadvantage. Unnecessary. I note that some SNP MSPs have been using the term cisgender in replies to constituents which seems to give state sanction to using that term for women and men. So, what hope for the gc employee?
@skellious
@skellious Ай бұрын
Pronouns have always existed. I/you/he/she/they are not new. And singularly they is present in texts that are hundreds of years old, so it's not even a new use, more a revival. I dont think its the pronouns that upset people, its the connotation that by using them they are endorsing someone's beliefs. But thats not true. I am an atheist but i still address religious leaders using their preferred titles of reverend, imam, rabbi etc. that doesn't make me magically a supporter of their views. And as someone who uses they/them pronouns, i won't take action against someone who knowingly misgenders me, but i will take that into account when choosing what level of respect i pay you in return. I won't mistreat you but i also won't necessarily go out of my way to help you more than my job requires. Thats fair i believe.
@lwo7736
@lwo7736 Ай бұрын
"I'm an atheist but I still refer to people by their religious titles" is SUCH A GOOD way of explaining why there's room for gender critical people to respect trans identity
@itstimeforlee
@itstimeforlee 17 күн бұрын
Except it doesn't correlate. A priest is akin to a job title, ie a Baker is a Baker because he is employed as a Baker, a priest is a priest because he is recognised by the religious institution as a priest. A he is a he because he is a man. He does not need to be recognised by any body to be a man. 'He' is directly connected to the manifest reality of his existence. His chromosomes are xy, his body has developed around the production of sperm, he has no ovary, etc. And someone who believes this has a protected right to express this belief reasonably. If they choose to use the correct pronouns according to sex without harrassment of an individual, there is nothing you can or should do to them as an employer. It is only an issue if that person engages in other unacceptable behaviors, such as targeting a trans identified individual, following them, treating them differently, etc. But using the correct pronoun in either view is not grounds for disciplinary.
@skuko1980
@skuko1980 8 ай бұрын
We call this 'the oppression olympics'.
@gavinbissell8847
@gavinbissell8847 2 ай бұрын
You cant make demands of others speech and sex is immutable. Simple
@skellious
@skellious Ай бұрын
That's your belief yes. Other people have different beliefs.
@itstimeforlee
@itstimeforlee 17 күн бұрын
But his belief is protected thanks to Maya
@boeos
@boeos 10 күн бұрын
Everyone is entitled to their own opinions, but not their own facts. I would argue the Gender pronoun side is on the wrong side of science, since its mostly based on semantics and word games, half the arguments all contradict theirselves. Its more like a case of appeal to vocal minority. Gender dismorphia is real, however i think majority of the trans argument are Ideological driven, and aren't even representitive of the real issue. Also Compelled speech is rediculous.
@jennd9091
@jennd9091 8 ай бұрын
Gender Critical without the 'feminists' i think. You don't have to be a feminist. Plus there are people who aren't gender critical but believe in gender and the expectations in behaviour, appearance and roles that come with it and are conservative i.e women's place is in the home. Man is in charge etc. Religious types perhaps. Think matt walsh.
@hamwhacker
@hamwhacker 8 ай бұрын
Can we go back to the normal world. Truth, reality and common sense. And the lawyers EFFF OFF somewhere.
@moriarmozz
@moriarmozz Ай бұрын
Which world was that?
@jons9721
@jons9721 5 ай бұрын
No one should using a pronoun to discuss anyone while that person is present, so that person can only complain about a conversation that they were not present in. Surely that must weaken their case
@hamwhacker
@hamwhacker 8 ай бұрын
It is the LEGAL SYSTEM that supports this conflict which is all nonsense. The problem is caused by the EXISTENCE of lawyers and judges who are looking after THEIR INTERESTS financially by getting involved. WE DO NOT NEED THE LEGAL SYSTEM. Instead we need common sense to prevail which ones not involve debate. There are only two sexes.
@colonelcrackerz2320
@colonelcrackerz2320 8 ай бұрын
Bro read any biology textbook and you’ll find sex and gender are two completely different things. It is a literal fact. Why you care so much about other people’s genitals is arguably much more concerning
@littlemy6340
@littlemy6340 8 ай бұрын
@@colonelcrackerz2320the majority of the British public do not believe that a male person with a penis should have the right to undress and change alongside women and girls in women’s changing rooms. Regardless of identity.
@hamwhacker
@hamwhacker 8 ай бұрын
@@colonelcrackerz2320 Biological sex and the male/female gender are the same thing. They are not a social construct but a physical fact. Identity is where the debate lies and anyone can identify or dress up as anything. It doesn’t change their gender or sex which is determined by birth. If you think the issue that people are simply obsessed with genitals then you are the one with mental problem and cannot face reality.
@roxee57
@roxee57 8 ай бұрын
@@colonelcrackerz2320Then why do trans people change the sex on their state issued documents like birth certificates?
@MM-nb7oe
@MM-nb7oe 8 ай бұрын
​@@colonelcrackerz2320idiot, you or the law can't even define 'gender' without sounding like a moron. It's made up, incoherent laughable nonsense.
@PotterSpurn1
@PotterSpurn1 8 ай бұрын
It's called free speech without the right to give or feel offence, which is like mixing oil with water.
@Chris-im3ys
@Chris-im3ys 8 ай бұрын
Go home old man
@danielcrafter9349
@danielcrafter9349 Ай бұрын
Dressing as the gender you identify with is ALSO free speech You get that, right?
@itstimeforlee
@itstimeforlee 17 күн бұрын
Nobody at any point has said anything against anyone's right to dress up? What point did you think you were making?
@PotterSpurn1
@PotterSpurn1 17 күн бұрын
@@danielcrafter9349 No it isn't. Fundamentally you are wrong. Why? Freedom of Speech works for everyone not just protected minorities. If we were to openly criticise anyone's 'right' to dress this way, we would not be viewed as a free person expressing an opinion; we would be questioned, possibly sacked or else the police could become involved and say we incited a hate crime. That is why it isn't free speech. Furthermore, the gender ideology movement is not based on fact, just delusion. It would be fine if trans-gender people were to say they were, say, a man but preferred to become a woman and dress like one accordingly. But they don't. They say there were born in the wrong body and that they are actually female. That is a factual untruth.
@Chris-im3ys
@Chris-im3ys 8 ай бұрын
One side of the debate is about giving people control of their own bodies. The other wants to control other people's bodies. It's not hard to see what side is being nasty.
@littlemy6340
@littlemy6340 8 ай бұрын
Most GC feminists aren’t super interested in what adults do with their own bodies. The issues for us are women only spaces, sports, and the chemical castration of children. And apparently the NHS agrees, as they won’t be doing it any more.
@MM-nb7oe
@MM-nb7oe 8 ай бұрын
​@Letsthinkaboutit-mb7nn 'cis'.😅
@itstimeforlee
@itstimeforlee 17 күн бұрын
I agree, control of one's own body to say words that they believe is a fundamental human right. Forcing an individual to use a pronoun against reality is clearly harassment of that individual. That's why Maya won.
@boeos
@boeos 10 күн бұрын
It's Ironic the Trans allies want to demand, what their pronouns are, which quite frankly is crazy, you don't control adjectives or other's speech. Compelled speech is some Orwellian nightmare. However they want to dictate what other people's pronouns are eg CIS. its all word games and semantics. Tbh the whole pronoun thing is a joke, because it only ever becomes an issue in the 3rd person.
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