Trying to Fix my Prototype Electric Arrival Van - So over Complicated no Wonder they went BUST

Chris has stumbled upon a rare gem-a prototype of the Arrival electric van from the now-defunct company that's ignited a firestorm of interest in the automotive world! Discover the incredible tale of how he secured this unlikely treasure, filled with unexpected twists and turns.
Chris reveals the stunning potential of the Arrival van to transform the delivery sector and manufacturing at large, showcasing its revolutionary features that outshine conventional delivery vehicles. As he delves into the van's cutting-edge design and pioneering technology,
Chris does a deep dive into the battery technology and take apart the complete front end of the Van to reveal hidden secrets.
The burning question remains-can he even get it to run in its current state with the challenges ahead? Join Chris on this exhilarating adventure as he unlocks the potential of this incredible prototype and envisions a future that could redefine electric vehicles!

[@QALibrary]

I am surprised UPS has not asked you if you can debrand the van

[@Hazell_Nutz]

They have 😂 I can do my videos but can never put on the road with there branding

[@barryamorris]

It’s free advertising for UPS.

[@LouisSubearth]

​@barryamorris UPS is very particular about their branding. They used to scrap their delivery vans when they decommissioned them, but now they're just debranding them and sending them to auctions.

[@QALibrary]

@@Hazell_Nutz If you did not know Domino's got into PR issues over their pizza van branding and another KZbinr

[@handle_user_unknown]

@@Hazell_Nutzjust rebrand it to the OOPS or call it the Not a UPS Van 😂

[@BS25999]

I'm looking at this as a lesson in how not to design anything. It's all so over complicated. The cost involved in designing and manufacturing these vans must have been horrific, it looks like they were just pissing away the cash with no cost control. The upside of that is they went bust before any purchaser of these vehicles had to face the resultant unreliability and opperating costs.

[@Hazell_Nutz]

Yep exactly so over complicated just luck there is not lots out on the road

[@rcjbvermilion]

It really is disappointing. I'm sure there were a few engineering decisions that were made for a reason, and yes, it was a development platform, but still...

[@JoeKyser]

Should have taken a page from Edison. Motors book. KISS Keep it simple stupid

[@tomsproston5837]

This is what happens when you leave engineers to their own devices without cost / programme oversight! 😂

[@troyboy4345]

Very intriguing ... But i cannot shake the feeling you have stuck your arm into a dark hole, only to find a snake pit then jumped back and fallen into a skip full of coat hangers ?!?! ... I am up for this series for sure.

[@Hazell_Nutz]

😂 the van will be stripped and will start from scratch. Already sorted 2 x 400kw drive units.

[@AdyWalter]

Be great if some of the ex employees could help out.

[@Hazell_Nutz]

I am sure they will

[@JoeKyser]

Techs with the books would be a good pop

[@Scuba72Chris]

Such a shame they never managed to bring these vans to market.

[@Hazell_Nutz]

There is a load road registered ones somewhere hidden away

[@posko76]

Invested. Such an exciting series. I'm a hairdresser who likes electric things. Bikes. Go-carts, foil boards... Plus i love Vans.. I have no advice to offer. Just here for the ride.

[@Hazell_Nutz]

We are also about to start building an electric go kart. Along side these builds we will be doing some petrol stuff but will alternate every week.

[@JoeKyser]

What electric clippers should I buy? I want a one time buy good set. I am so tired of buying crap clippers that last for a year or so.

[@posko76]

​@@JoeKyser"Wahl super taper". Cheap but bullet proof. I have a set I use daily that are 18 years old and never had a blade replacement.

[@brianb-p6586]

While conventional light EVs parallel only at the cell level, it is common for heavier commercial vehicles to have parallel packs each at full system voltage, to allow easy configuration to the desired energy capacity simply by installing the desired number of packs (as well as perhaps for redundancy). For instance, the Isuzu medium-duty forward-control truck has 5 to 9 packs. 16 units in parallel, though, is just stupid.

[@Hazell_Nutz]

Yep it is a common thing with larger vehicles and larger packs but with a 3.7kwh module makes no sense

[@karlgt9989]

You do get the impression they were trying to re invent the wheel, i get the need for R&D but you have defo used the word complicated, a lot 🤣

[@Hazell_Nutz]

Yes definitely, I think the people working on it where non automotive as there is so many parts that already existed but where remade.

[@sydneyg007]

That does look like a challenging project - pretty interesting though! Think I counded ~206 cells at 2p that would be about 433v full. So fairly high voltage for a 400v pack.

[@Hazell_Nutz]

Yep the bms is capped at 428v

[@paulcoinc]

I'm guessing there's some people who know these things that could use a job even if a temporary job.

[@Wolfanshtain]

@Hazell_Nutz, just a bit of advice. If you know somebody ex from the arvl drivetrain team who is in the UK, it's the best way to ask them for help. This type of fault you see requires special diagnostic equipment and software. It can't be solved by just randomly pressing buttons.

[@Hazell_Nutz]

Yep have been speaking to a few of them. Have worked with them for a number of years with Fellten

[@TheWinstn60]

Would make a great stealth camper

[@juanmacias5922]

That was my first thought when I saw those vans lol

[@Hazell_Nutz]

The perfect camper van

[@alcapone4242]

Would give you a super thanks but there is nothing left after beeing invested 😅

[@Hazell_Nutz]

Fair enough! 😂

[@rjung_ch]

How hard is it to remove the immobilizer?

[@Hazell_Nutz]

Not sure, thinking of swapping over some modules from a van without

[@rjung_ch]

@@Hazell_Nutz good luck, if it then works, then the immobilizer is in the battery pack somewhere. Can't wait for the next episode. Thanks!

[@jaakkoiswatching6437]

@@rjung_ch The immobilizer could also be in the ceiling. Or inside the spare tire. Nothing about these vans can surprise me anymore.

[@markwellington1254]

Righty tighty- Lefty loosey! Most of the time.

[@Hazell_Nutz]

Yep but not on towing eyes I have checked

[@brianb-p6586]

@@Hazell_Nutz the towing eye on my Mazda car is right-hand (conventional) thread. You must be referring to some specific brand.

[@grahamguest142]

Mechanics in future are going to need to be a hell of a lot better educated, no bad thing.

[@Hazell_Nutz]

Yep they are, being a mechanic in the future might finally become a well paid job

[@patreekotime4578]

Wild. This is an interesting series. Probably some huge headaches to come! I wonder if a cable to the motor was cut like the one for the rad? Also, does the coolant system need to be pressurized and bled to make sure there are no air bubbles?

[@Hazell_Nutz]

Yes it probably does but if I can sort the software there is a bled process.

[@macjim]

Do you know what happened to the bus they had?

[@Hazell_Nutz]

Yep they also got sold off

[@Joseph0M]

I wondered the same thing. It would’ve been sick to drive around an electric bus.

[@LouisSubearth]

Someone else must've bought it

[@pearse500]

Just a rough guess but looks like 220 cells, i assume LifePo4, so if 2P looks like 110 cells giving 400v full charge

[@Hazell_Nutz]

The spec sheet says 428v fully charged but they are capped at 420v in the bms software

[@pearse500]

@@Hazell_Nutz I guess my cell count is wrong or you have Lithium Ion cells!

[@brianb-p6586]

@@pearse500 LiFePO4 is just one of the many lithium-ion electrode chemistries; it is not different from lithium-ion.

[@pearse500]

@@brianb-p6586 Please do not confuse matters! Lithium Ion will have either lithium manganese oxide or lithium cobalt dioxide for Cathode, it has a higher specific energy than LifePo4 with a nominal voltage of 3.6V. In comparison LifePo4 (Lithium Iron Phosphate) will have iron phosphate for Cathode, it will have a lower specific energy than Lithium Ion with a nominal voltage of 3.20V or 3.30V

[@brianb-p6586]

@pearse500 you're the one who is confused. LiFePO4 is literally a lithium-ion cell type. Every lithium-ion electrode chemistry has a different characteristic voltage; LiFePO4 is significantly lower than most of the alternatives.

[@jeromeandre4915]

Fun and games but this is going to be a beast once it run (and get your "upgrade') (y)

[@Hazell_Nutz]

Once it’s at 1200hp will be great

[@isaacmiletic]

Somebody sabotaged every single one of those vehicles when they went out of business whoever lost their jobs if I can't have it nobody will cut the wires like that disconnected cables I don't know that doesn't seem right could have been some malicious stuff and that ups van you look like there was nothing wrong with it and the mobilizer doesn't work come on foul play

[@Hazell_Nutz]

It’s very odd, I am thinking I can take parts from another van to remove the mobiliser

[@skater1191]

I’m only subscribed to watch this build. So feed me the EV goodness

[@Hazell_Nutz]

Plan is to release episodes about this build at least every month target is every3 week

[@metalhead2550]

Great video, really looking forward to this driving! Do the vans have an ODB port you can plug into to see if there's any diagnostics you can get out?

[@Hazell_Nutz]

No obd but there is a usb and some Ethernet

[@Damicske]

@@Hazell_Nutz it has probably a few can-busses so maybe just hi-jack it :D

[@lukebarnett1048]

I did some work for the seats on these. They where a lot more complicated than they needed to be. The volumes these were meant to be built in was huge. Its a shame it died

[@JeroenReumkens]

I still can't grasp they died. All of they stuff seems to be so well thought out. But yeah, perhaps some of those things weren't the best decisions business-wise. Would've loved to see their products all around the world. They felt like the Apple of transportation to me.

[@Hazell_Nutz]

Things were definitely over complicated

[@Hazell_Nutz]

I do see the Apple approach but the visual design effected the engineering which is not a good thing. For example the motor is a square shape yet motors are round not square.

[@Wannes_]

@@JeroenReumkens The way they all go: Stir up excitement with nothing to sell No product on the road, yet already "diversifying" their product range. Never getting the product on the road that created the excitement in the first place, yet already starting on a new & improved version Loremo, Sono Motors, X-bus, Arrival ... they all followed the above road to disaster Forever changing their designs, delaying market introduction But never putting anything up for sale and bring in cash to pay for further progress, despite folks lining the road money in hand to buy one if they could For a start-up, it's silly to start building your own over-complicated, expensive battery pack and BMS Go shopping and find something proven, wedge it in

[@lukebarnett1048]

@@Wannes_ All very true. Once you have a product rolling out the door and the cash coming in then you can go crazy with the engineering.

[@oldk4tz]

i am surprised you can not just disable to immobilizer.

[@Hazell_Nutz]

Unfortunately there software is quite advanced

[@tommeaden8219]

Sad to see them dissappear 😢

[@Hazell_Nutz]

It is

[@stickynorth]

Arrival really was the one that got away... A lower cost to build, more flexible eco-minded construction and the ability to roll out factories around the world in a short amount of time with minimal labor... Seemed too good to be true and in the end I guess it was... SMH...

[@Swwils]

It was obvious they never made anything, factories super clean.

[@Hazell_Nutz]

There is flaws in the plan. Cost to build was only lower in very very large volumes, small factories around the world was a good idea but also a very bad idea. From a QC point of view controlling one large location is way easier than lots of small ones, plus the factories where all robotic to the labour that was needed has to be highly trained.

[@Wannes_]

@@Hazell_Nutz There's logic behind Tesla's Gigafactories Good luck with the race van You'll need it 😁

[@silverghini2629]

Anyway of getting to speak to the people that designed these vans? Might explain why they went with this parallel design and multiple contacts.

[@Ghost_Recon_404]

There use these vans Iver in a the USA 🇺🇸

[@Hazell_Nutz]

Do they?

[@UpsideDownFork]

Toweye is normally conventional thread on MB, BMW and VAG cars.

[@Hazell_Nutz]

Not all of them 😂 there is a list of VAG with LH tread as well.

[@bernel2.0]

If you are struggling for help, I can be available on weekends.

[@Hazell_Nutz]

Thank you for the offer

[@alanhillyard1639]

Dunno what towing eye would be LH thread, you want them to be conventional so people know how to use them. Bet many people would think there was an issue with the female thread in the car if it wouldn’t go in winding conventional direction without even bothering to look at the thread direction

[@Hazell_Nutz]

You would be surprised most vehicles are LH thread this is what Google says. “One other thing which I bet throws technically minded people ("ordinary" people don't know the difference anyway) is that towing eye bolts are normally left hand threaded.”

[@matthewspry4217]

I invested 40k

[@Hazell_Nutz]

Ouch

[@michaelronchristopher]

now I am invested. you better post the next episode soon

[@Hazell_Nutz]

Next one will be 7th October where the race truck build will start.

[@fultonius]

Arrival are due me £1k so if you could just send some batteries my way..... ;-) Kinda feel like I've indirectly supported this series haha!

[@Hazell_Nutz]

😂 you would not want them they are over complicated

[@fultonius]

@@Hazell_Nutz it least we're getting some entertainment and a "fun" project, if nothing else...

[@El-Hombre-Random]

can you make a lambo tesla?

[@Hazell_Nutz]

Yes I could

[@El-Hombre-Random]

@@Hazell_Nutz NICE I want to see that project!

[@groeacht8525]

The way he says immobiliser is just so Somerset

[@Hazell_Nutz]

😂

[@lejamesmelton3823]

The way that you do this is so much fun! ❤

[@Hazell_Nutz]

Glad you enjoy it! Thank you

[@peterlever1403]

👍

[@Hazell_Nutz]

👍

[@smellysam]

The packaging of the parts is totally random...

[@Hazell_Nutz]

Yep as since this video I have also found another dcdc in the rear and more 12v battery’s

[@smellysam]

@@Hazell_Nutz seems you have found why they failed - they made things too complicated… A electric van is a milkfloat with umphf than needs to be serviced in hours before the next shift... Good job, your videos are brilliant for dirty nailed engineers.

[@AMen-yw9cr]

Were the WeMos on sale?

[@Hazell_Nutz]

That I know of

[@mavek1274]

is there are still chance to buy one of those? EV components non needed, I would put diesel inside.

[@Hazell_Nutz]

I will be selling the UPS van very soon

[@mavek1274]

@@Hazell_Nutz how to contact you?

[@Hazell_Nutz]

@@mavek1274 if you add Hazell nuts on instagram can dm

[@mavek1274]

Did ​@@Hazell_Nutz

[@sp3lllz]

If I where you those spare parts I’d make moulds of them so you can make more if needed.

[@MattOGormanSmith]

A 3d scanner is probably easier and more useful these days, with 3D printing and CNC services available.

[@Hazell_Nutz]

Will 3d scan and then make out of carbon have lots of support in that space.

[@mrr8697]

Try putting on the seat belt to put in drive

[@Hazell_Nutz]

Tried that I have now left them all plugged in

[@Nerd_Bird]

Nice work, fingers crossed for the next ep!

[@Hazell_Nutz]

Will get something working

[@paulsim7589]

Wow. Small brake discs

[@Hazell_Nutz]

😂

[@brianb-p6586]

Why were you surprised by the negative contactor inside the module/pack? EV batteries float - neither positive nor negative side is connected to chassis ground, so both must be disconnected for safety.

[@Hazell_Nutz]

Yes you are correct but you never have a set of contactor in a module it’s normally for the over all pack only.

[@brianb-p6586]

@@Hazell_Nutz You always have a set of contactors for each parallel string in each enclosure. In most EVs, especially light vehicles, that's just one set in total (because there is only one enclosure and all modules within it are in series); for many conversions that's one set per enclosure with enclosures in series. These modules in parallel require the set per module. Within an enclosure, you could get away with just one contactor (e.g. positive only) per parallel module plus one on the other polarity for the whole enclosure), but the single contactor would be a much larger so there wouldn't be much benefit.

[@Hazell_Nutz]

@@brianb-p6586 yep you are correct you do always have contactors in each parallel set but you would not normally have each parallel set being only 3.7kwh it’s a stupid design. If it only had one contactor per parallel set it would be the same size no reason for it to be larger as the inrush current would not change just because there is not a contactor on the other side.

[@brianb-p6586]

@@Hazell_Nutz the operating current of the entire set is the total of the current in all of the parallel packs, so yes, a whole-battery contactor requires a much higher rating that one for a single pack. A single contactor for the negative side would need to much larger than individual contactors on each pack.

[@Hazell_Nutz]

@@brianb-p6586 your earlier response was not very clear. The single contractor per parallel module would not be any larger but the single contactor on the overall pack would be larger but a single 400amp contactor compared to the 20amp ones used inside the modules is only about 4 x the size. Ether way the arrival module is a stupid idea and over complicated.

[@andrewbourke2696]

Idea for your race van, Quad motor setup, find a crashed Rivian and get it's motors. They were up to 800hp ISH at 400V class so might play well with what you have, also I think you could probably tease a bit more power out of them if you dont care about absolute longevity. Putting motors inboard would help with unsprung mass. Plenty of aftermarket Carbon ceramic big brake kits for stuff like VAG MQB platform. And TrActive semi-active coilovers, not sure if they could handle weight but they are used for race applications. Porsche Cayenne is around this weight so wheels and performance tires shouldn't be a problem for it.

[@Hazell_Nutz]

Have just done a deal with iNetic for a pair of 400kw 800v motors. 1200hp 😬

[@MattOGormanSmith]

You'd have a job finding even an uncrashed Rivian here.