TWiV 1023: Covering science with Katherine Wu

[@lindafangiullo5378]

Wow, love your articles, Katherine, factual and easy to understand. I also love The Atlantic, great magazine.

[@LynnMile22]

I loved Katherine Wu's coverage of SARS Cov2 in The Atlantic and thank you to The Atlantic for providing those articles free during the height of the pandemic. This was fantastic to hear her talk about it. I read the whole articles!

[@lismartinez5363]

Thanks TWiV team. So enjoyed the interview and Katharine Wu’s articles. She is a terrific writer.

[@francesschaefer]

I am so glad Amy found an assistant!

[@DC-wt2vi]

Thank you TWiV. A fascinating insight into quality science journalism from a talented writer.

[@WillNewcomb]

Thank you. Like millions of others, 3 or 4 years ago I thought vaccines prevented infection. You and others have shown me that they reduce serious disease.

[@YawnGod]

Heh!

[@toms7695]

Turns out they reduced serious disease for everyone, even the unvaccinated stopped getting seriously ill from the virus. It doesn't make any sense , but science doesn't have to anymore, virology is magic. lolol

[@heizensperg]

Lol

[@gbernardwandel4174]

So great to see you back to this format I have enjoyed Vincent on tour but I prefer this format I was lucky enough to attend TWiV 1000 live in NY and I believe that might’ve been the last one with the whole gang! Looking forward to the future eps Thanks for all you do

[@francesschaefer]

Excellent guest!

[@francesschaefer]

I read the NYT articles about COVID a lot early on and I likely read her stories~

[@Fraan000]

Very interesting speaker! Engaging and passionate about her work and science.

[@patriciahoke4722]

The question on vaccination and misinformation is one that I am very interested in, as a nurse. What Katherine says about "data points," and people following their own, while true, was not always the case, as vaccine hesitancy pre-dates the internet and Big Data. This issue is of vital importance and I'm not sure asking other highly educated scientists is *necessarily* the way to arrive at an answer. What I find (and my perception/observation may change tomorrow!) is that a vaccine is in a way a question of power. Most of the time, we are asking someone with scant understanding of the disease (which is likely not rampant in the community at the time) or the mechanism by which vaccination could prevent it, to accept something into their bodies at the point of a needle. Nurses, like doctors, are often rushed and just need to get on to the next task and may or may not do a good job explaining it. We do our best, but that's often not good enough - because to be truly effective, rapport must be established in order to build a trusting moment. Most of the time, the patient accepts it with a shrug of the shoulders, kinda like yeah whatever. But there are, oftentimes, clusters of patients who are 100% sure that the flu vaccine causes the flu. At this point, it's a total power game. Their friends have told them this, and to capitulate is to go against their friends. This is a building block of their world, it's foundational in a way - or at least it looks that way to me, in that moment. So, what is needed are nurses who understand this and can communicate well with such a population. I am not saying I can - I too often get frustrated, but given sufficient time off to re-charge, I can occasionally do it, but other nurses and techs who grew up in a world with similar thinking can usually do a better job establishing rapport and trust with patients on a more regular basis.

[@toms7695]

HIghly educated people may be completely ignorant to reality. A degree does not make you more capable of understanding reality. Vaccines did nothing to prevent transmission of this "cold like " illness. All the data regarding "cases" and "hospitalisations" were completely skewed and therefore should never have been used in any type of way to determine healthcare protocol. The vaccination campaign was obviously a money grab from the big pharma people and sometimes a doctor or scientist have trouble admitting this as it puts their legitimacy and practices into question. The main takeaway that all of these doctors and virologists should be discussing is the fact that unvacinated people have not been transmitting any virus nor have they been getting hospitalised or died , this is a big juicy elephant in the room that keeps getting bigger.

[@DC-wt2vi]

​@@toms7695Whut!? Are you some sort of flerfer? 🤣

[@markrand652]

Enjoyable converstation. Thanks

[@janakingking3022]

What a great guest! You do an amazing job getting such great guests

[@spamletspamley672]

I once grew an aubergine plant that did have white egg shaped fruit and did actually have something of the flavour too. It was the only aubergine I've had that actually tasted of anything.They are attractive in both flower and fruit, but I've never really understood why anyone eats them. :/

[@francesschaefer]

Appreciate the discussion about headlines!👍ie that the "click bait" alarmist many of which have nothing to do with the podcast or article

[@christopherweston6028]

Mice to have a media person on the discussion.

[@bcase5328]

I do wish US universities would allow Journalism/Media Freshman writing courses to be substituted for Freshman English Literary writing courses. And yes, Journalism/Media Freshman writing courses should include research and fact checking. Logic Fallacies should be covered in High School and again at the Freshman level in University.

[@kazoz3520]

1:14:15 Maybe you aren't aware, but during major avian infectious pathogen outbreaks in the US (Newcastle Disease, Avian Influenza etc), not only commercial poultry are destroyed in containment / elimination zones, but also avian pets (eg parrots etc).

[@kazoz3520]

​@@gferraro8353 Yes, & viruses like Newcastle Disease are not a major health risk to people. So healthy non-commercial & pet birds in an eradication zone may be destroyed to protect the commercial poultry industry.

[@DC-wt2vi]

All the more reason for vaccination programmes in the kept bird population wherever they may be. Prevention is better by far than cure. Avian flu is not only cruel on birds, it is hard on commercial keepers to see their flocks suffer (I know more than one who has struggled with maintaining good mental health post outbreak of avian flu in their birds). It will be harder still for someone for whom their birds are companion pets.

[@anymoose6685]

Early on the pandemic there was a billboard put up in my area with a cute puppy that declared that pets do not transmit Covid. My dog had been extremely sick with Covid not long before, vomiting, when our family got Covid. I can’t imagine that vomit was sterile, and it seemed no one had tested it. I understand the desire to protect pets from culling, but the misinformation really angered me. It was the same time when health officials would angrily snarl when one talked about airborne precautions for SARS 2, and say it was droplet transmission, not airborne. All the agendas, and lies (or more favorably wrong assumptions in the face of limited evidence) that flowed from the agendas, rubbed me raw.

[@DC-wt2vi]

​@gferraro8353 Here in the UK, vaccination of commercial flocks is being considered fairly seriously. I am not well enough informed about vaccinology to know what challenges there are to tailor avian flu vaccines, but there is now precedent for widespread vaccination of commercial flocks in China against their prevalent strains. Also, wildlife protection groups have vaccinated vulnerable populations in wild birds elsewhere in the world. Condors are one species.

[@kazoz3520]

1:09:30 As was commented in an old Q&A with A&V, HPV testing is now occurring with routine cervical cancer screening. Ie testing for viral infections, not cytology (pap smear). The latter are being phased out. Plus there has been research on HPV vaccine efficacy against infection depending on dose regimes (one, two or three doses). Therefore there are extensive datasets becoming available on the effectiveness of HPV vaccines against infection, and the efficacy duration. Eg: Smith et al 2022, "National Experience in the First Two Years of Primary Human Papillomavirus (HPV) Cervical Cancer Screening in an HPV Vaccinated Population in Australia: Observational Study." Kreimer et al 2020, "Evaluation of Durability of a Single Dose of the Bivalent HPV Vaccine: The CVT Trial." - note, HPV vaccines are one example where the vaccine produces much more antibodies against the pathogen than occurs after an infection, & persists for 11 years. Plus rates of HPV infection after vaccination remain low for at least 10 years (at least 80% VE against infection).

[@ghaclord]

Love Katherine Wu!

[@johnvtram]

Can we update the science about stopping mosquitoes and other vector sources from migrating globally?

[@methanial73]

Wow! I love her in so many ways.

[@fangmiinsheen686]

Please interview experts to ask “Are we ready for the next pandemic?”

[@christopherrobinson7541]

No.

[@alexdevcamp]

Tbh I found much of Wu's writing during the pandemic a bit over-alarmist, but it's great to listen to her speak in person here

[@Logotic]

My feelings exactly. Reading her covid articles has me picturing her breathing into a paper bag to stave off panic.

[@amiesparkle00]

Alarmist how?

[@ot9er]

What was there to be alarmist about in USA? Only about a million people died, right?

[@valmardon1183]

Have any program about hpv virus? Or terapeutic?

[@WauwieF]

Interviewing a science communicator and not having Alan on, that must have bugged him.

[@aanderson2880]

I just found out that Dr. Watcher, Fell and has head gashes with stitches. See his before and after shots. Poor Dr. Watchter . Cards sent to him at ucsf will be forwarded to him if he is at home. He looks so bad that I didn’t even recognize him at first. adrienne I need an email address. Thats all I have now.

[@mark303murphy]

Maybe episode 2025 in year 2025, near the end of the year, for christmas, thats my guess.

[@MrKaidman]

Thank you for keep doing these, as always from Sweden

[@tomaridance]

Length of the your quest’s introduction to long.

[@CraigCounterman]

1:22:40 several of the papers above also address all kinds of cute things such as cute in 1:22:46 Jen's sense of cute retroviroid satellites vyrophages all kinds of 1:22:51 pozons Etc to eliminate to to assimilate all this vast new knowledge that has been .... "pozons?. Is a pozon the fundamental unit of hypotheses? (I expect though that it's "transposon", or that plus retrotransposon and other *posons, but I'd rather it be what I thought first).

[@toms7695]

Oh Puke, this is just awful. This woman is a misinformation specialist. Invite RFK on to the podcast, prove him wrong if you think he is such a problem.

[@amiesparkle00]

Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha

[@heizensperg]

He could take on every single one of these liars by himself and they know it!

[@amiesparkle00]

@@heizensperg lol 🤡

[@toms7695]

@@amiesparkle00 0.09 CMR... and you want to jab yourself 3 times a year, and the chance of getting "covid19" is greater amongst those that have been poked... Using MATH and LOGIC you can deduct that every time you jab yourself have a greater risk of an adverse event happening... In contrast, if you get the disease you will acquire greater immiunity, this has been proven by STATISTICS and VIROLOGY .... Please for the love of science, try to catch up with the smart kids.

[@Sceince007]

Why I vote a proven liar ?

[@tonaruch8623]

Eloquent guest

[@jpenneymrcoin6851]

articles are mental masturbation, a complete waste of time. constantly reading tiny variants on a rewording of the same 10 pieces of information on "what's happening right now" is pure pointless fluff. If you take all that time you're wasting reading articles and web garbage and instead use it to understand a few subjects deeply you'll find that there isn't very much to understand. A science is one thing - virology takes years, so does chemistry, physics, etc. - but everyday topics like politics, very very simple easy to understand the system with about 1 year of focused reading. Stop wasting your time writing - everything has been written. Here's an example from my general template for history: Some rich and powerful people wanted some resources so they took them and killed the people who previously lived near the resources and falsely imagined those resources belonged to them. Those rich and powerful people then spent the rest of their lives building up multiple propaganda organizations to justify their taking of those resources, inserting the tentacles of that propaganda organziation into all the nooks and crannies of the culture of their civilization and ruthlessly destroying any people who disagreed with their interpretation of history. In the meantime the rich and powerful proceeded to destroy their civilization to the point of collapse. See? You can apply that to the Mongols, the Mayans, Rome, Germany, even the US. That's YEARS of reading articles, just not necessary. Now you can go outside and enjoy the fresh air.

[@YawnGod]

I believe co-education destroyed Academia. Fun times ahead.