Tyne and Wear Metro Class 555s delayed AGAIN

Amid mounting train failures and plummeting levels of reliability, the new Class 555 trains for the Tyne and Wear Metro are certainly needed now more than ever. But just last week, as they were due to begin their biggest phase of network testing yet, the transport operator announced their first entry into passenger service would be delayed yet again.
Join me to talk about what's going on with the Class 555s and the Metro, and just how long passengers can afford to wait.

[@user-ki2jp1cp3o]

There are many comments from people online (who know nothing about rolling stock procurement) that say they should have been tested where they were made and you wouldn’t buy a car that hasn’t been tested and we shouldn’t have accepted an untested train blah blah blah etc, but they are missing several vital points: 1) Nexus haven’t accepted them yet; the manufacturer Stadler has accepted them from their own factory in Switzerland for further testing here. 2) The network is unique so the trains have to be bespoke. You can’t just use a pre tested and certified train because it won’t work correctly on our network. 3) Newly designed trains don’t just work out the box, they have to be tested. However, the testing isn’t just “let’s see if it works and if it doesn’t, we’ll send it back”… you don’t just send back a quarter of a billion pounds of new trains. The point of the testing is to see what needs to be changed so that they DO work. This is pretty standard on any new train due to their bespoke nature. Every network has its own idiosyncrasies that need accounted for. 4) So once it’s done its basic running tests at the factory, where do you think the best place is to test the train to see if it works on its intended network?… a different network, halfway across the continent, that the trains aren’t designed for, that will be busy with its own passenger trains running? Or, would it be better to test it on the network that it’s going to be running on? The answer seems simple to me. And of course people seem to have a real hard on for it being built by Hitachi, a Japanese company who build faulty trains (in another country) and just assemble them here.

[@edificity]

All very good points

[@northernblue1093]

Agreed and there's no point in testing anything unless you're going to take time to fix (and then re-test) any issues you find.

[@firestarter1888]

Someone talking sense, no stock introduction in history has been free of problems.

[@xr6lad]

The problem with that is no one would buy a car that when delivered still needed to be tested on the roads of your town for months before you could actually use it properly. Oh and 40 years ago trains didn’t have to be tested for months or years and did work out of the box. Everything should have been more than engineered and planned before the first sheet metal was bent - not build the cross fingers ‘they work’ when placed in a a set of tracks.

[@xr6lad]

@@firestarter1888lol. Yes okay. Maybe in your part of the world.

[@ianjames9166]

Thanks for the update. I live out of the area now but when I'm back "home" I love the Metro and its current failings sadden me. Still very optimistic that a great new service will be running at some point in 2024.

[@nathanaellewis1242]

Sounds more like at least 2025 for a good service, as they are introduced piecemeal, so it will be poor for a while after 1st train goes into passenger service. Although I suppose that they don't have to test every example to the same extent, so maybe I am too pessimistic....or maybe not.

[@IamTheHolypumpkin]

Stadler has it’s market niche to build highly tailored vehicles to the precise requirements of the operator. Things high Siemens and Alstom are a broader more standardized portfolio are not really good at. Such vehicles need more testing because they are so specialized.

[@edificity]

This is why I think they'll turn out to be ideal for the network. They were just ordered a good 5 years too late

[@commuterjack]

Thank you for the information- I did not know why the class 555s were so delayed, so this video really helped. Hopefully the traction system that Nexus chose does not cause too many problems after entry into service.

[@user-xh3lz9xt4l]

And they will be extended to run to both Blyth and Ashington in due course.

[@firestarter1888]

perfectly normal, as with any infrasfructure upgrade, the complexities involved bring up inevitable unforseen problems, no big deal. Better to delay the new stock introduction than deal with in service problems, that will cause much greater issues for the public.

[@Sixty4Horses]

I’m from Liverpool & was able to try the Metro a couple of times when I was in Newcastle earlier this week. Other than a half broken door & the lack of actual ticket offices, I don’t have much else to say. Hopefully with a delayed launch & looking at the Class 777’s, they’ll have most issues sorted.

[@TWMfan]

This was one night I go on the metro network at 2 in the morning to catch a test run and they end up discovering the fault and stopping the test run leaving me knackered on the metro platform in the middle of the night without even seeing the train, very cool

[@JangoFett220]

Yeah it was a bit of a frustration with the delay being announced but it’s not too much a shock when you compare it with the Glasgow Subway and Merseyrail. Heck even with LNER, the Azumas were first built and being test ran during the VTEC days with that photo of one with a HST, a 225 and Flying Scotsman being taken in 2017, they didn’t even enter passenger service until the summer of 2019. Avanti West Coast have theirs being test run right now but it’s gonna be a while til we actually see them out on the WCML in passenger service

[@pj6641]

It's not just Stadler delays we have had our first Class 701 Adventra Arterio enter service recently they were built by Bombardier now Alstom these have started to enter service 5 Years late with issues with doors and software so it's not just Stadler that has had problems. As the video says Government funding too slow, crossrail delayed and over budget, HS2 scaled back just proves rail Privatisation hasn't worked.

[@user-ty5kp9hi2u]

London is just overflowing on rail projects of HS2, Crossrail 2, station refurb Projects of TFL, Old Oak Common, Hyde Road(OOC) and more and now, problems with trains?! Yeah... probably stop HS2, you get to Birmingham în 90 minutes

[@mattevans4377]

It does feel like a contest though of who can have the most bumpy rollout of new trains.... By which I mean the TOCs, not the manufacturers.

[@JJLarge]

Please come to hebburn station

[@grahamhenderson5609]

if you want to know a farce in new trains look at the Southwestern Railway Arterio fleet ( BR Class 701 Alstolm/Bombardier Derby) first delivered to Eastleigh depot in 2019 they have been plagued with issues, they have been clogging up various deports, some apparently have been moved around the country to make space for SWRs current fleet and they are began to enter service from January 2024, this is the same TOC who spent £45m on a traction package and refurbishment and then SCRAPPED them without earning revenue

[@Lighting_Desk]

Given that they haven't been replaced since it opened there was always going to be issues. Thevve had to catch up with infrastructure updates, repairs and as you said testing if the new trains. Theyve been underfunded and undermaintained for years.

[@BritishProductionsYT]

its good they arnt here

[@mrnoah53]

Service times are never accurate. We in Brussels for our M7's sets also had to wait 4 years until they finally came into service. It also was delayed by a few months. At this point I never even get surprised when they delay train stuff.

[@harrytrains37]

They shouldn't have been so optimistic getting everyones hopes up for a promise that could never be achieved

[@almyle503]

Thumbnail made me think it was Merseyrail at first glance

[@mistakay9019]

I know theres clearly nexus PR going on in the comments, but knowing a driver in waiting for the new stock, theres alot of things nexus are telling you. *The material used on the seats wasnt up to UK fire saftey regs, All of it needed removing, remaking in a different fabric and all needed refitting to all the stock *drivers doors opened from the outside by two door handles (that could be bound together trapping the driver. this needed replacing with a different solution across the stock *A new repair shed was built, and it was found to have incorrect size doors so it had to be rebuilt. *The government wanted them to first focus on getting the ashington line open first (this however I dont understand as surely they can have 2 concurrent projects going at the same time) So that. Nexus at large have been quite shambolic in their management as per usual.

[@theblubbered]

If they're anything like the Glasgow Subway trains I wouldn't bet on the Tyne and Wear Metro trains being ready for the end of 2024, although the TSA drive units haven't been the biggest source of problems for the new Subway trains unlike for the new Tyne and Wear Metro trains. I couldn't possibly comment further here but... expect more issues.

[@sglenny001]

It's profound that Glasgow not expanded its system

[@user-ty5kp9hi2u]

Exactly. It might have been better to, wait for it, Tyne and Wear be operated by the Department Of Transport to finalise maitenence problems as well as help pay off its debts

[@physiocrat7143]

Systems are too darned complex and innovative.

[@JJLarge]

Just saw u in spoons mate!

[@edificity]

I'm so not used to people knowing my face

[@JJLarge]

@@edificity Btw mate was that girl you were with your gf?

[@Tez_Thorn1405]

Absolute joke isnt it, and they started scrapping the old ones prematurely if you ask me

[@user-ki2jp1cp3o]

The ones they scrapped were not ever going to be serviceable again, so they pilfered them for parts and got rid of them to make space in the depot.

[@northernblue1093]

You have a warped sense of humour if you think this is a joke.

[@ThisChannelHasNowClosed]

@@northernblue1093That’s not what they mean by ‘absolute joke’. They mean that Metro is failing & it’s a bit silly.

[@arlogeee]

i might just be stupid but surely they can split up the current metrocars into single coaches to fill in the cancelled trains, they used to do it in the 80s so why not do it now?

[@Farleigh1050]

not a single carriage but like single units are fine, DLR are doing the same with their 6-car trains being reduced to 4-car (which is only really useful on the line to lewisham)

[@andywilliams7323]

If these class 555s are anything like their sibling class 777s on Merseyside. They'll frequently break down. On Merseyside you're lucky if your class 777 service even shows up or gets you to your destination before it develops a fault and has to go out of service.

[@user-ty5kp9hi2u]

No wonder the 777s took 4 years only to realise they brake down half the time

[@sjokomelk]

@@user-ty5kp9hi2u I would hope they brake all the time. I don't want to be on a train without brakes. That seems a bit unsafe. Trains breaking down on the other hand, is something I don't want. 😁

[@user-ty5kp9hi2u]

If it carrys on like this, one more delays of the 555s and Tyne and Wear Metro are extremley done, no wonder the 777s went the same way

[@EpicThe112]

Like it but for Hitachi rail they have experience in building Metro trains because the Italian division made Metro trains for Italy when they used to be called Ansaldo Breda. Basically resembled an Italian Metro train made by Hitachi rail Italy using the past name AnsaldoBreda with Main line Network safety for the Sunderland route

[@edificity]

Yes that's true, they make very high quality trains for Copenhagen and Brescia. But I still think the Stadler train is a better suited product for our regional light metro

[@MercenaryPen]

that being said, Ansaldo Breda did have some fairly high profile cases of delivering trains that were stunningly bad, so perhaps we shouldn't make too much of their previous experience

[@danielsellers8707]

They look like the Merseytravel 777s, also built by Stadler. Maybe because they're yellow!

[@sjokomelk]

They are both based on the narrow trams running on the Berlin U-bahn network.

[@petitkruger2175]

At least it’s a good train (staler made).

[@camhalls9366]

Name one brand new (not subclass) class of unit that was introduced on time in the uk

[@metropod]

There is a video Reece Martin did a while back where he did discuss the danger or replacing your entire fleet all at once. And this situation is basically what you seem to be in right now. the 559s are on their last legs and 555's are late. This is... unfortunately, life when it comes to buying trains new trains. you set a timetable for them to be ready, only to have to throw it all out the window. I work for New York City Transit. Our first batch of R179 class cars had to be scrapped in the factory before they were even finished, and they had to start over due to a poor welding job. the order was such a fiasco, that Bombardier was banned from bidding for the next order, the R211 class... which Kawasaki is having their own problems with. The traction motor gearing assembly on those was leaking lubricant... on multiple trains.

[@edificity]

I agree, that's sometimes life with new trains. Ideally the new fleet of 46 would have been phased in over a matter of years replacing old ones like-for-like one at a time. But the old ones just aren't holding up well enough to make that possible

[@tomjardine100]

@@edificityWhy are the current metro trains so unreliable? Yet the 1972 and 1973 london underground stocks are very reliable

[@michaelpoole587]

The real problem is that new spares have not been bought or manufactured for the old trains but instead cannibalisation has be used .This has resulted in a far smaller fleet. The cost of new spare parts manufactured based on current no of failures but be far less despite small production runs than the mess they are in.

[@pj6641]

the fact is Metro Cammell who built the original metro cars no longer exists, these trains are the same age as the HST's and they are running on 1970's technology you can't keep patching up old things, mind you some new trains are not much cop either look at CAF's MK5 coaches being withdrawn from TPE with cracks in the subframe and these cracks are now being found in Caledonian Sleeper MK5's.

[@tomjardine100]

1970s trains are probably more reliable overall. Modern trains are laden with issues too.

[@michaelpoole587]

@@pj6641 Metro C put them together, but a lot of the running parts were made by many manufacturers. Also of note due to the 1500 voltage the new trains have certain parts bespoke for them .Having been involved in a manufacturing environment for 25 plus years , They really need to decide what they really want, maybe have taken a bigger step to a more standardised voltage or seen what the main parts that were needed to run the old cars longer, and would cost to manufacturer and look at batch sizes.

[@SuperMorgan1980]

Like class 777 on Merseyrail - dreadful

[@lewisyork1999]

It’s an absolute shocking I don’t think we see them until 2026 we could see them earlier if all the all the metros breakdown And, the making the price for your tickets more expensive

[@ethans2ndchannel272]

I love to, But It still Delayed on End of 2024 and Early 2025. What the on Earth going on here.

[@TC-qd1zw]

Get rid of Nexus as it is not fit for purpose. Costing too much money for a failure.

[@tomjardine100]

The current fleet is probably more reliable than these new trains overall, surely far less electronics in the current fleet? 1972 stocks in london keep going. Maybe nexus and stadler just don't maintain the trains as well?

[@godlydestroyer8658]

Stadler need to sort themselves out, all 3 of their new trains are diabolicaly unreliable, needs to be an invitation

[@edificity]

To be fair, look at the Alstom 750s. The cracks in the Hitachi IET and CAF fleets. Seems like it's just a wider modern train problem

[@samscragg5956]

I’m sorry the 777 reliability is nothing short of a disgrace. The worst in the UK by a long way. I like the interior and exterior product but using them everyday is a nightmare

[@tomjardine100]

@@samscragg5956Not good for the Tyne and Wear metro then, doubt there will ever be a good service if the new trains are not reliable

[@g4viscon]

​@@samscragg5956Worst in the UK. You obviously don't get around much then.

[@Farleigh1050]

might as well say, its coming st the end of 6066

[@TransportGeekery]

555 is internet slag for laughing in the Thai language (because “5” is “ha”) which seems quite appropriate for this frankly comical farce