Ultimate 2021 Driver Comparison | Which driver is most forgiving? | Analyzing The Mishits

[@matts.689]

I'm shopping for a full bag this year and these reviews have been so helpful.

[@2ndswing]

Thank you for watching Matt!

[@livinaftermidnight9651]

I too am replacing all but my wedges and putter. Already selected the Sim2 Max irons 4-pw. Scheduled to do a fitting with these same 4 heads tomorrow. From the looks of it I'll be going with the Taylor Made driver and fairway metals. My natural ball flight is a draw to a snap hook so I'm worried about the Ping from what I've seen here. Thanks for the excellent review!

[@Harz77]

What are we looking at getting so far then? I want to really smash golf this year. I was a 12 handicapper at one point in probably a 24 now 😂

[@colinmorgan1025]

Hit straight titleist . Have hook of fade go sim . Have slice ping or calloway

[@cjlafleur7585]

You guys should get a 15 or 20 handicapper testing these ones out. your swing is too good for these.

[@rickhammel9541]

then you're testing the golfer, not the clubs.

[@spatt833]

@@rickhammel9541 - No, that's exactly what's happening in this video. This guy really never had a mishit.

[@rickhammel9541]

@@spatt833 he for sure did.Look at the smash factor. Plenty of mishits.

[@spatt833]

@@rickhammel9541 -So you're saying he's a high handicap player?!

[@jggolf4033]

@@rickhammel9541 how many guys buying these clubs have a 110+ mph swing? If they did they would be in the TSI3 and Sim etc versions!!! He had a problem going left, I’m sure they are designed for the average golfer to be draw biased because most high handicap golfers fade or slice it. You need to actually play some golf to understand!! +4.9 handicap here! What’s your handicap?

[@retired8123]

Great stuff! I like that you show the bias of the drivers because it can help greatly picking one that suits our game. It can also help us decide which loft to buy in some cases if we are deciding between 9 and 10.5. If you would like the driver to go more left than what you see you can get the 9 and increase the loft which will close the face a bit and if you need it to go more right you can buy the 10.5 and loft down a bit to open the face. As well if you like the Taylor made but don't like the fade bias you can buy the 9 and up it to 10.5 to close the face and if you like Callaway buy don't like the draw bias you can buy the 10.5 and loft to down to 9.5 to open the face a bit.

[@kennykoalabear]

Exactly. I knew the Epic Max is draw biased and I liked that. Best loft for me in testing suggested 11.5* and I hit it straight. I went for the 12.0* so as not to have too much draw bias.

[@descarroll2039]

You forgot to mention the new Cobra RAD Speed... it's a fantastic new driver.... I bought one last month and it's a very forgiving driver.... I would highly recommend this driver, so give it a try.....

[@erock1070]

Good video. Bummer the RAD XB was not included in this test. I hit it on the course against the g425. For me the g425 wanted to go left on me. Rad XB if it had a miss was more right.

[@7676ezra]

Good review. I've hit them all and liked the Titleist but the Epic blew everything out of the water for me. I'm debating on doing a true fitting or just buying the exact same specs I hit in a used one. I leak right but generally not a slice, just an open face with swing path that is very close to zero'd out. Sometimes I get nasty steep and yank it but no club will help that miss. My driver is from when I had a higher SS. I now am at mid 90's. With the Epic I literally just was swinging harder and the ball went further. I got up to 99 and total distance was just over 280. Which was a good 10 yards longer than the Titleist and 15past the Ping. Obviously everyone should just get fit. I'm fortunate the pro I take lessons from has let me mess around quite a bit with the launch monitor for free and was able to test out these drivers for myself. I honestly almost left without hitting the Callaway as I kind of just never cared for them brandwise with really no specific reason at all. Maybe thinking they were a club for "old guys" but clearly I'm not getting any younger...

[@adamhigson25]

Iv just been fitted for the sim 2 first time Iv had a fit and I’m shocked at the results from struggling to hit a driver to it being the best club in my bag

[@2ndswing]

Awesome! We have heard great things about the Sim 2!!! Thank you for watching!

[@stephendibari5010]

Notice the Spin Consistency of the SIM 2 Max is the lowest (best) for mishits and all shots combined. An important takeaway here. Thanks for this test, it confirms that the SIM 2 Max will be my first choice in my custom fit next spring !!

[@clw22580]

Sample size is too small to confirm anything. Your swing is different too. Try them all before buying

[@stephendibari5010]

@@clw22580 these are the top 4 that I’ll be testing out, maybe Mizuno ST-X also. 8 shots each isn’t a lot but it’s enough to get a fair comparison

[@theycallmekevin03]

@@stephendibari5010 depends on the golfer. I tend to hit a slight fade naturally so I sure don't want a club that has a tendency to have a fade bias to it. Also the dispersion with the sim was by far the worst. It was literally all over the place.

[@erock1070]

The g425 definitely sets more closed at address than any 2021 driver I’ve hit. You have to set it to the large minus to get it squared up.

[@cwugrad396]

flat settings

[@jimmyculp8756]

Best test I have seen on these type of drivers! Just spent 600 dollars on the Sim2 Max! Got lucky!

[@2ndswing]

Very nice! A new driver is always a great feeling! Thank you for watching!

[@jimmyculp8756]

@@2ndswing It hurt the bill fold however! $600 dollars!!!! I use to think that you could not buy a golf game but this driver is special!

[@moorcroft69]

This was one of the videos that helped be in choosing the Sim2 max. As a high handicapper, it is super forgiving and I have a consistent fade on my shots.

[@2ndswing]

Thanks for your feedback, agree SIM2 Max you can't go wrong - Thomas

[@ablazer4551]

Why did you not include the tours edge you tested it was long and very forgiven, and you crushed it !!

[@rlbjr]

Would like to know why as well. The Tour Edge 721 was the longest as well as extremely forgiving driver he tested. Also, would like to see the drivers and irons done with Jackie as the tester.

[@kickflippingintogolf4228]

+1 for this

[@jacobmccain8082]

Would love to see this in fairway. I'm not a great fairway wood player and it's very hard to find a forgiving fairway because I draw the ball and most forgiving fairways sit closed.

[@craigs19721972]

Great review Thomas. Could you miss hit shots on the club face, on the toe, heel, low and high strikes for comparison?

[@rgrpncs]

Would like to see you do this test with the Cobra Rad driver. Keep hearing such good things about this driver.

[@2ndswing]

RAD Speed is a great performer, no doubt!

[@columkenn]

And the pxg 0811x

[@artmimijames1636]

thomas in your opinion which driver is the longest and most forgiving last 5 year

[@lobbyrobby]

I want a new new driver but I really should get fitted. However the closest and just about only fitter is hours away and is always scheduled way out

[@diminishedreturn]

Thanks for putting out so many great videos-new subscriber here! It was interesting to see the differences in strike location, and also swing path/face angle. Pretty small differences to be sure and you made corresponding remarks about 'bias' during the test that are also reflected in the comments here. But I can't help but wondering how much of the bias lies in the physical build of the club head and how much relates to the visuals. Having watched a few videos on Edel's putter fitting, it's very clear that club head design can lead to "alignment issues/bias". If it's the case with putters, why not drivers? Can it be that some head designs lead to some bias when setting up to the ball? Or do you use markings on the grips to make sure you grip the clubs the same? I'd be interested in your thoughts on this. Also anecdotally, I'm very happy that my driving range has installed TopTracer Range for data and games. But holy hell, I'd give a week's worth of navel lint to have access to some of Trackman's features like Attack Angle, Club Path, Face Angle and so on....

[@davidyeo5932]

I have just been fitted for the epic max ls

[@2ndswing]

Very nice!

[@simonadcock2159]

What about the Mizuno ST -Z ?

[@supersoniq3506]

Question: Is there a number for MOI? If so, how do you find it?

[@davehurley26]

Great video could you doing this test with you hitting down on the ball say 1 or 2 deg down on attack angle?????

[@mvansb23]

Seems hard to argue against SIM2 Max as the clear winner. Unless of course you need draw bias. Music to my ears as mine is in the mail.

[@theycallmekevin03]

The sim was literally 25 yards left and right of the center line. It won in distance but definitely not forgiveness.

[@carlosl9651]

Based on your data, the Ping G425 Max is the most accurate followed by the Titleist TSi2, then the the TM SIM 2 Max and the Callaway Epic Max last.

[@coleschlauderaff8927]

How would you say the PXG 0811 4th generation drivers compare?

[@2ndswing]

We've got some PXG comparisons coming soon 👀

[@kymstock1852]

Why not include Tour Edge and Cleveland?

[@PhilConran]

I would adjust all those shot shapes to the right for amateurs. I bought SIM2 Max and it’s fade biased. I’ve tested all 2021 drivers and the straight one was Cobra RAD XB And Ping G425 went left. Buying Cobra RAD XB as soon as SIM2 gets offloaded.

[@dmoneyrepresent7024]

I gotta say, “This man is worthy of a significant raise.” He’s directly responsible for saving his clients THOUSANDS of dollars worth of golf balls.

[@Celtics20]

No Mavrik?

[@EricCartmenez1]

Which one was the most forgiving?

[@rikscichlidaddiction25]

Wish you guys were here local. I would like to upgrade my Taylormade Aeroburner that is about 14 yrs old I believe it was the first White head driver back in 2007. I really do hit it good so I don't know if the new ones would give much distance. I'm in California and I don't think you guys have a location here.

[@2ndswing]

Currently we only have 5 locations and none in California but you can always find out more info about online fittings at 2ndswing.com - Thomas

[@NoPlayJack]

Very interesting, but why would you have Thomas be the tester? His swing is flawless. Get someone who has some real misses to show how forgiving these clubs are.

[@chrisc353]

I have a serious question that I am struggling to find a good answer to online. Maybe you could do a video on this... My Driver swing speed is above 100mph (102-110) generally, but my iron swing speed is more around 78-89 with a 7 iron depending on how my body is feeling that day.. and I would like to know what is the best kind of ball that I can use for the difference from tee to green while taking advantage of my driver but making up for my iron speed.

[@2ndswing]

Interesting question, Chris! Our first recommendation would be that no matter what ball you choose, play the same one every time. Then you'll begin to know what to expect with both driver and irons. If you're looking to play a premium ball, the softer versions of the premium balls would likely be best for your situation. For example, the Pro V1, TP5, Chrome Soft, Z-Star, etc. You should probably stay away from a firmer ball.

[@chrisc353]

@@2ndswing thanks for the feedback, it seems whenever you search swing speed it only is about Driver.. I prefer the feeling of softer balls off the clubs, but was afraid I might lose out on driver distance if I go too soft.

[@davamgchanel5905]

which give the best sound at impact?

[@2ndswing]

Sound varies from player to player. What might sound great to one player, may not sound the same to another. All manufacturers spent a lot of time dialing in sound at impact thru their components and weighting. What's important is what YOU like! -Danny

[@davamgchanel5905]

so i hv to test all 5. simple just say which is the best for u. u really did not help

[@randynBroncos]

What is MOI?

[@banditbaker1675]

That has to be a first, I have never seen a Reviewer taking away the good shots before👍 It just shows how difficult it is to "measure forgiveness" with any degree of accuracy. Looking through the standard deviation numbers the SIM2 had the smallest SD in most of the measurements, so that would appear to be the most consistent. But is consistency a measure of forgiveness or just a sign of consistent strike?

[@mvansb23]

Yeah. I declared the SIM2 Max the winner. But that was before the end of the video when Thomas showed the strikes. I think if strike was that good on any of the others the standard deviations would have been smaller. So maybe the conclusion is Callaway define joy seemed like a loser. Out of the other three, it probably just comes down to how much spin and what shot shape you want. If you want a little more neutral/fade bias and lower spin you lean towards SIM2 Max. If you want neutral and mid spin you go TSi2. If you want draw bias go PING G425 max. I always feel like Ping should be tested with a different shaft though. They really are designed for counterbalanced shafts. Playing it with higher swing weight and more total weight than the other three when using the same shaft across the board. The balance point on that XC I believe is fairly low. So a low balance point in a G425 is probably all sorts of wrong. Probably creates some more droop at impact and can account for that toe strike pattern. So maybe the G425 Max isn’t actually draw biased - it’s just too heavy a head for that shaft.

[@stephendibari5010]

@@mvansb23 excellent point on needing a counter balanced shaft on the G425 Max. No question that’s the heaviest head and could lead to lower strikes on the face.

[@banditbaker1675]

@@mvansb23 Yep, totally agree, testing 4 different drivers and assuming that one particular shaft will suit all of them equally is flawed. Particularly as you say the PING is best suited to a counterbalanced shaft because of its extra head weight. What was really being tested here was which of the Driver heads best matched the shaft.

[@2ndswing]

Some excellent points being made by all! There's no way to make a test truly objective and unbiased. We have received questions when we have done tests with different shafts about why we don't use the same shaft to make it unbiased. The point of using the same shaft isn't to show that it suits all of the drivers equally, but rather to compare the clubheads with as many controlled variables as possible.

[@mvansb23]

@@2ndswing makes sense. There are always trade offs. And I think it works for almost all heads except the Ping. They are just such an outlier in head weight...everyone else is within a couple of grams. Thanks for the response and putting out the content. Enjoying it a lot this season!

[@FKNSENDIT]

Is there a strait bias driver seems like every driver has a direction it goes

[@facenocase4370]

Sim Max D or Ping G25 SFT

[@mikegable9317]

@@facenocase4370 The SIM Max D is draw biased because the D literally stands for draw

[@debrajohnson4689]

also, why do you keep hitting everything off the toe?

[@gilbertsoto8701]

Good to know BEFORE purchase!

[@2ndswing]

Thank you for watching! Glad we could help!

[@larswlarsen]

Would these results be the same for a hcp 20-25 golfer?

[@outofoffice3119]

No, our Mishits are much worse than what he is showing 🤣

[@PabloEscobar-ob7ww]

Good video here. I like the format.

[@2ndswing]

Thank you for watching! Feel free to check out our new videos!

[@alysgolfstudio567]

Interesting. Of them all the one I most like the look of at address is the tsi2. Still prefers my gamer M2. Not seen the mizuno or cobra to compare at address and looks.

[@chrisc353]

shouldn't you use a shaft that's fitted to you for each individual head? they all have characteristics that could affect the shaft... wouldn't that really make it more of an objective test?

[@2ndswing]

Thank you for watching! We've had this both ways...when we've used different shafts, we've had comments suggesting we use the same shaft to make it unbiased. There's no way to make this a completely objective, unbiased test. We just feel like with the same swinger and the same shaft, it's more of an apples to apples test with regards to the clubhead.

[@dmoneyrepresent7024]

What a great insight into your processes, skills, and knowledge…very enjoyable presentation!

[@2ndswing]

Thanks for the kind words and thanks for watching - Thomas

[@Huub1e]

Great concept but next time you try this format how about testing actual mishits?

[@golfish8589]

The circles surrounding the shots were way to large for at least 3 of the heads. Why ? ? ?

[@jeaniewolfe6693]

That's the way the Simulator produces the circles... He doesn't create the circles... It's a completely impartial coincidence that in no way represents a bias created by the golfer using the Simulator... It is computer generated...

[@doggies_tale]

Nice contents!!!!

[@2ndswing]

Thank you for watching!

[@philounours2952]

Mizuno ST Z/X are not worth the challenge ? Your comparisson would have been even better. Nice job anyway

[@2ndswing]

Thanks for watching! For this test we included the most popular ones requested by customers in fittings. The ST-Z and ST-X are both very forgiving in their own right!

[@디노의하루]

I love my TSI2 driver-! ❤️

[@2ndswing]

Thanks for watching, It is a great option! - Thomas

[@HistoryNerd66]

I enjoy your videos, but you should really consider getting average golfers (i.e. those who make a lot of mishits) for these type videos...

[@davamgchanel5905]

agree. like chip n pitch. problem for high hcpets is to put the iron correct to avoid topping etc

[@davamgchanel5905]

for them they r teacher so rasyfor them they should teach n see the problem.hcpers facing

[@rl6210]

Need 90-100 mph swing player to make this a more valid test for these type drivers

[@2ndswing]

Thanks for watching we are always working on including contributors if different speeds - Thomas

[@mikeanderson9478]

It ain't a complete test w/o the Cobra Rad Speed. Why would you go to great lengths of a great test to come up only short by leaving cobra out. Come on now. Still a very informative test keep up the good work.

[@2ndswing]

Thank you for watching!! We've got some more tests coming up here with Cobra !

[@legend9018]

Really interesting information

[@2ndswing]

Thank you for watching!

[@json216]

So most forgiving for the year only includes three... seems fair...o and the most expensive

[@zerotohero5286]

Great review but Thomas is too good a player for testing. It would be great to have a similar test with slower and more average player. Informative info though.

[@2ndswing]

Thank you for the feedback and thanks for watching!!

[@dinaashton5110]

Taylormade!

[@clw22580]

1.48 = mishit? In my dreams

[@xMrJanuaryx]

There's really just not enough data here to draw out any conclusions. A test like this would take so much more to give you results worth looking at. It would actually be ridiculous. You would need about 50 guys hitting 10 balls with each driver over 10 different days and a very rigorous and agreed upon standard of determination for what exactly "forgiveness" means in this context but non-the-less at least this guy tried.

[@12345Itsme]

No Cobra…. Seems to be missing a key player in the driver game.

[@rayb12]

I don't know why you never actually pick one! So frustrating!!

[@kevinwood1722]

Cobra should have been in there too

[@WPD.razor41]

you forgot the radspeed

[@Golf_Hack]

2nd Swing needs one of those robots for these tests.

[@2ndswing]

That would be very cool! Although my job might be at stake.. - Thomas

[@Denim0920]

Sim2 all day.

[@debrajohnson4689]

you can tell you are getting tired from taking so many swings so not really an accurate test kind of pointless you really need to use a robot or something that tests under the same conditions otherwise what's the point?

[@jeaniewolfe6693]

A robot would not allow you to calculate forgiveness as it will place each shot in the exact same place on the club face, every time... I don't know where you got the notion that he was getting tired towards the end, considering his distance, shot dispersion and strike location were the best for the last club he tested, meaning he was just coming into form at the end, not a symptom of fatigue, but more a symptom of just getting warmed up... To make it more fair he should have done 2 rounds of 5 shots with each club, leaving all shots in, to eliminate the issue of not being warmed up for the first two clubs. I can hit a large bucket of balls (100 balls) all with driver, and I can assure you my second 50 are ALWAYS better than my first half of the bucket... If you're fit, fatigue doesn't come into play until much later, a golf swing isn't exactly a high impact movement, not if you've come from full contact sports that involve sustained, high output physical exertion for extended periods of time... His major stuff up was to not get each club fitted to his specs before creating this video. That would have made the data more relevant and allow people to have some idea of what each club can do, with his swing type anyway... If you're really in the market for a new driver, try everything you can get your hands on, and make sure you get fit by a professional who knows their stuff... I would not personally go to someone who is willing to make a video about drivers that weren't fit to his specs, it's like taking a sports car off the showroom floor, NOT putting decent tyres on it and expecting it to perform with cars that have been tuned from the ground up. This was a case of simply not comparing like for like. If you'd like to see decent videos that involve fitted drivers, watch Matt and Ian at TXG Golf, those boys know what they're about, and rarely mess with clubs they haven't fitted to 'Matty Boy'...

[@debrajohnson4689]

@@jeaniewolfe6693 lol the guys that think the autoshaft is gods gift to golfers they get paid to sell that shit.

[@jeaniewolfe6693]

@@debrajohnson4689 They have over 80 videos on shaft fitting alone, of which only 8 are based solely on Autoflex shafts, that's less than 10%. I'm beginning to see a trend here, think you might be an armchair warrior who chooses to focus on one aspect of any KZbinrs content that doesn't sit well with you, and that's all you choose to see. Shame, as there's literally hundreds of hours of great content that has been created that you clearly lack the impartiality to genuinely enjoy without critique or unwarranted negative comments that are clearly held by someone who is hard to please.

[@debrajohnson4689]

@@jeaniewolfe6693 why are they using elevated tees for the auto shaft?

[@jeaniewolfe6693]

@@debrajohnson4689 Have you considered politely asking them what their reasoning was to use a higher tee? They're pretty good at responding to questions... I personally don't think shaft type dictates tee height, as the whole idea of teeing higher is to lower spin by hitting the top part of the face, whilst hitting up on the ball, giving a high swing speed player less spin and more distance... All players looking for more distance should be teeing atleast half a ball above the crown of their driver...

[@lindsaynewell6319]

Having watched tens of hours of KZbin testing and fitting, the only conclusion I’m going to draw from this test is that the TSi2 was the closest fit for Thomas on that day. The epic and g425 were less forgiving in the specs used for the test but properly fitted would probably produce similar results to the TSi2. So would the SIM2. That’s the whole point of fitting and anyone using this test to justify their own choice is just using confirmation bias.

[@theycallmekevin03]

How did you take away that the epic and g425 were less forgiving? They are draw biased clubs that did exactly that. They had by far the best dispersion for the test meaning they were extremely forgiving. He hit the Titleist the sttaightest but it was also the only club the wasn't a max draw biased club. A forgiveness test is for distance and dispersion. So the smaller the dispersion the better.

[@lindsaynewell6319]

@@theycallmekevin03 maybe I'm wrongly assuming that the center line is the target? Epic had the biggest dispersion ring (12:01) and it was centered on the left bunker, 40 yards offline.

[@LordFarquaad007]

My ears are bleeding sine I can barely hear your speaking but when you hitting its blasting through my headphones Please Sound correct this 😡

[@2ndswing]

Thank you for the feedback!

[@saintpatrick6681]

when I say forgiveness..... I mean to my wallet

[@donsmnc5319]

Thomas says "mishits" and still carries it 280-290 plus smh! All shots with the exception of the 1 shot (Epic 40 yds left) would still be both long and playable, so hence the "forgiveness"!?!

[@CommentingTheTruth]

Cobra Rad Speed

[@2ndswing]

Thanks for watching. The RAD Speed has been sneaky good this year! - Thomas

[@wesboothe6507]

TM Sim2 Max 💪🏼🏌🏼‍♂️gamer

[@raydillon3277]

Me

[@outofoffice3119]

Those are not mishits for the average golfer 😂

[@ryants1]

Take out that awful Callaway shot that’s almost out of bounds. It’s 1 single shot

[@michelgendron3549]

J

[@vancekeith5642]

And furthermore it’s hard to trust a reviewer that doesn’t even go to range and hit it for real

[@vancekeith5642]

This is all hog wash. Numerous reviewers with different Golf swings and different results. Do NOT purchase a club based on someone u don’t know with a swing completely different than your own. Go hit each one yourself.

[@garysimons1608]

Who tf cares about 2021 drivers? Get this crap off KZbin.