Ups & Downs From Star Trek: Discovery 5.8 - Labyrinths

[@kristhompsonfilm]

That darn down counter! Sorry.

[@jonpalange3292]

I wondered for a moment, and then I saw this. No worries, bud. Great episode as always. Thanks for all the hard work behind the scenes.

[@yetzt]

whoopsiedaisy

[@0u70fSync]

Ok, so Discovery gets a pass for their downs this episode

[@damienrosario2471]

Aww man, spoiler alert. That makes so much sense 😭

[@kristhompsonfilm]

@@yetzt There it is.

[@pastelpinkfairy]

Stereotypes aside, I am a librarian and I immediately recognized Hy'Rell as being a modern, enthusiastic, proper librarian. People who work in libraries have an enormous passion for what we do. We love to put the information in your hands. And that's what she does here. We're also committed to intellectual freedom, which is something else she demonstrates.

[@BruinPhD2009]

Thank you for all the great work you do. For all the ways the internet puts knowledge at our fingertips, it still has yet to replace interacting with a real person in real time in search of information, especially if that person is clearly passionate about what they do.

[@paulc9643]

There is this woman I've met here and there who was just recently promoted to Library Director for my local Public Library. She is so much like Hy'Rell; sarcastic, enthusiastic, and, yes, a person - if I knew her well-, I wouldn't mind hanging out with too. As a bibliophile, I think librarians are unsung heroes.

[@MaybeAnnatar]

I was really worried the librarian would be the "eccentric collector that's a bit shady" trope but was refreshed to see that she just really likes knowledge. That was lovely and very Trek.

[@adamherne2348]

I had the same concern at first

[@HermanVonPetri]

@@adamherne2348 I was suspicious that she was going to try and capture Book himself as the last remaining example of his species, a la "The Most Toys." I'm happy to have been wrong. I like her. I'm also particularly pleased about the nod to repatriating historical artifacts to those cultures to whom they belong.

[@santacruzramble83]

I agree with you… for a second I thought she might lock up Book because he’s one the last if not last member of his species…like what happened to Data in the TNG episode The Most Toys

[@marcusteach5676]

I’m pretty sure I just figured out how they’re gonna end this series. I think they’re gonna re-create books planet.

[@reggiestafford4549]

I hope you're right with all that I am.

[@raye0826]

Ooooooh, that would be flipping awesome!!

[@michaeldavis938]

That is complete shit. Just go on of the many alternate universe's if you want to go that way. If that happens there were no opportunities for people to grow.

[@ArtistryBranson]

No, a new Kwejean will be required to restore the Scion.

[@Hurbie_53]

That is maybe the big moment where in the end the tech could either restore Books homeworld from the world root or restore L'Ak. And Book having situationally the upper hand will give it to her to restore L'Ak instead of his home, showing burnham that sometimes the need of the few or the one are more important than the nees of the many. Under incredible personal sacrifice I might add. Of course the breen are mightily impressed by Books so selfless act that they immediatly join the Federation and Burnham joins the archives book-club. -ish

[@DanielleGoodchild]

Calling it now: Progenitor's technology + World Root = ♫♪ A Whole New World ♪♫

[@pranavgoel9978]

In my experience, yet to really come across librarians in that stereotypical shushing thing -- most librarians I have met have been like the one in this episode, genuinely excited by books and by archiving, loving their time at the library, smiling, welcoming...

[@HighSierra1500]

Yes! Hy"Rell had a passion for books. In the public library, where I live, there is an archive with older books that you cannot sign out. You can requisition them to read on that floor, but you cannot take them home. It's here you will find the librarians passionate about their jobs.

[@BruinPhD2009]

I agree. When I was working on my dissertation, I spent a good amount of time with the university archivist, who owned a part of the filing process. The stuff she knew, even about my topic and her curiosity about the things I found were some of the best parts of the entire process. Her suggestion for rewording the title of my work made all the members of my committee happy. Tons of respect for this brilliant woman and all the librarians who keep knowledge flowing.

[@jmarquiso]

She's every grad student in library sciences are just like Hy'rell

[@IsiahBradley]

THANKS for this!!! To answer Sean's challenge: one challenge was "Can we trust you?" This week's was, "Can you trust yourself?"

[@RogueScholarMDC]

Michael Burnham has left the library. Michael Burnham has been saved.

[@RogbodgeVideo]

Clever!

[@Donnagata1409]

Was she reawakened with a cuppa? That's infallible.

[@robslide3466]

Yep I had that feeling too

[@gorillazzilla]

It's even funnier when David Adjala played a Smiler in The Beast Bellow.

[@robslide3466]

@@gorillazzilla he gets everywhere, and that's no bad thing.

[@jennifercarlin-goldberg1125]

That “Whoopsie Daisy” just killed me. 🤣

[@garrettbodwell61]

It's a little disappointing that when Burnham was reading up on the Dominion war, that Jake Sisco wasn't one of the authors.

[@Cdr2002]

I don’t think it was a complete account anyway, since it was a mindscape and the books would only have been able to tell her things she already knows about the Dominion War

[@CaptainKwame1773]

Burnham’s passing the test through dealing with failure was so impactful! Favorite scenes were seeing Rhys captain Discovery! I love those little glimpse we get to how others would command, and he seems so prepared!

[@santacruzramble83]

I really felt for her in this episode,she is afraid everyone will leave her if she fails. The test was to get her to get out of her own way. She said that fear makes her feel small and not good enough. She said this out loud, and fake book says that sounds like a hard way to live. The change in her character is incredible. When she first gives up and thinks shes goin my to die, she asks fake to tell her what the test was. That was old Burnham, all mission mission mission. Then she sits back and says she doesn’t want to die, not from fear of death but the fear of her legacy being synonymous with failure. Then she realizes how delusional that is and can see how to fix by stop pushing everyone away. The test ends because she dropped her defense mechanisms. It was such a beautiful scene.

[@CaptainKwame1773]

@@santacruzramble83 Yes it was, as is your analysis to its meaning. Thanks for sharing!

[@Cdr2002]

Yeah her self-analysis really impacted me emotionally, especially since I find her to be the Trek Captain I most closely identify with, for good and for ill

[@StevenHouse1980]

You missed the one Labyrinth Film conection directly to Trek being that Gates McFadden was the Director of Choreography and Puppet Movement (as Cheryl McFadden) she was mainly involved with the ballroom sequance in the film.

[@Aezetyr]

Really quite pleased with their take on the Test of the Spirit (Jinaal), Body (Whistlespeak) and Mind (Labyrinths) they have going on. Even at the end Burnham needed a bit of deconstruction.

[@darkfantasy6220]

My take on the test is: She was trying to take the test logically like a Vulcan, but she is human and once she becomes true to who she is, is when she passes the test by recognizing she is a flawed human and remembers who she is. By accepting herself with all the imperfections she would be more likely be able to understand life more.

[@lcflngn]

Nice!

[@MishraArtificer]

*"How do you feel?"*

[@TheMightyFlea-0]

Yep. Sounds even more trite explained like that.

[@maxrander0101]

she is not recognizing herself as a flawed human per say but seeing that simple living by the way you were raised and doing things that always put the mission first is in the end not the best way t0 live life we see with past captains that they truly loved the whole job of exploring space protecting others and their ships they saw their roles as the ones to expand the understanding of the races of the federation and their allies we see the same thing in other races captains in older shows we see they love what they do to the point they are just happy to be doing it they dont always put the mission first

[@dennyzavada407]

Am I the only one who was hoping, when Burnham opened her eyes in the archive to hear, "She is corporeal; linear; aggressive; adversarial." ?!?!

[@treballz000]

YES! I thought the same. Give me Sisko!

[@lfrands]

Hahahahaha awesome

[@medleystudios72]

Yes. Part of me truly expected some tie-in.

[@kadriaof-inviolate5133]

The Burnham faced the Burn to save her people, but can she face herself?

[@honestiago4738]

Got to admit when it was said she'd need the information to get through it my first thought was the Bajoran wormhole. Also the Badlands are described as being 6 hours from the final co-ordinates at maximum warp which could be the Bajoran system. I'm almost certainly wrong but it'd be awesome if it did end up being the Prophets and the Sisko.

[@austinvieira8720]

How did you not UP the opening sequence as the camera glides through the Breen ship! It was beautiful and very impressive!

[@michaelmiller3012]

I was sorely disappointed in how defenseless the library turned out to be. It was built-up that the library knew how to deal with disruptions. They even mention the oubliette as a veiled threat, and then when the crap hit the fan... they were actually completely helpless. That was a major down for me. They could still have had the Breen dreadnought emerge victorious but it should not have been so overwhelmingly one-sided.

[@antoniao7439]

Yeeeeeaaah they’ve got all that knowledge I wish they had put it to use

[@jocelynbaker6718]

I've only had the pleasure of visiting Toronto a few times, and just one of those times I was lucky enough to find myself exploring the University of Toronto libraries. Despite that, being in the Thomas Fisher Rare Book Library one time for a few minutes was enough to make it one of my favourite places in the world and stick with me over half a decade later. When the interior of the archives showed up on screen, I nearly jumped out of my seat in excitement. This DISCO reminder already has me planning another trip!

[@richardajoy79]

This would've been a great episode for Doug Jones to be in, taking the form of the interactive program in the mindscape. As for the Badlands, I can see how it could look different after several hundred years, gas clouds disperse so why wouldn't the plasma storms get more violent. I could tell that things were brewing on the Breen ship, whenever the Primarch ever did anything to Moll, the one Breen beside her was unlike the others and when he changed allegiances, it wasn't unexpected but damn the coup was quick.

[@user-Wolf3593]

Oh so I'm not the only one who notices that discoveries walls turn into flamethrowers every time they get hit

[@stevk5181]

Absolutely hate them. I'd rather see rocks blown across the bridge.

[@HebrooHammer]

It’s better than Enterprise rock slides :)

[@IMDARKFIRE007]

@@HebrooHammer Not really. He has a point, walls don't just turn into flamethrowers. Sparks and rocks were more realistic....while the rocks seem silly, it represented shrapnel, and likely just being painted foam, was easy to chuck at the actors. The worst offender for rocks was also a great scene visually, Riker's death in Yesterday's Enterprise.

[@c.a.nixiii4650]

Yes. The Disco bridge is the Ford Pinto of Trek Bridges!

[@c.a.nixiii4650]

And how many centuries more advanced is this upgraded Disco Ball?

[@Astro-Markus]

Just because of the exchange between Burnham and mindscape Book, I think, this is probably the best episode of that season. It was refreshing to experience a lack of rushing and over-the-top excitement. Simply a deep talk between two people. An introspective while being inside your own mind. How fitting. Apart from that, the locations didn't change very much. That never-emptying bucket was funny.

[@QuaziInc]

I love how Hyrel wasn't just delightful, but also so empathetic to Book about the cuttings. I feel like that was also a message about how cultural items are foremost still of the culture, and the culture has the right to it, even if the Curators are prepared to honor. it and the people. British Museums could learn a few things. But seriously how do we get more Hyrel...

[@tlouiseallen9302]

Definitely need More Hyrell🙌🏼🖖🏼

[@treyabraham515]

Agreed. That scene hit the hardest and felt the trekkiest of the episode.

[@pranavgoel9978]

It's not about being sure of oneself, but being honest with oneself to pass the test. If you cannot at least be honest with yourself about even the hardest parts of you that engender emotions like guilt, embarrassment, if you cannot be truthful to yourself about who you are, flaws and everything, the scientists think you cannot be trusted with that kind of power...

[@justthinking5091]

But bad guys can also be honest to themselves. That would not be enough to make sure the clue stays safe.

[@TheMightyFlea-0]

No one is worthy of gaining the Progenitors tech. That goes double for Burhnam.

[@emr263]

Speaking as a librarian, a lot of us are more like Hy´Rell than the stereotype.

[@kar4tube]

Ahhh, Sean your Ups & Downs are, as always, a genuine treat. God, I mean, Barnum is, often as naught, over the top, but I just love the story and visuals of Discovery. I mean, the CGI totally pushes the envelope. Excellent analysis. Lovely commentary. And, please make “whoopsadaise” a permanent meme! Love it!

[@Bargle5]

High five on the Trilithium down. I spent the whole episode wondering where those 2 bridge crew were.

[@mteacher9811]

Hey, not everything is gonna happen on alpha shift. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[@DanielleGoodchild]

I have a theory. The new bridge crew were given so much screen time because they're being set up to go with Tilly to Starfleet Academy. Not knowing that it was going to be the final season, the writers may have thought they'd have time to set them, send them on their way and bring back our usual mains.

[@adamherne2348]

I almost totally forgot about them

[@scottyncc]

It's a massive stretch to call owo and detmer characters tbh

[@123ricardo210]

That was explained in a previous episode tho?

[@dellytancyl524]

I fully support that down because I miss the hell out of Owo and Detmer. they were the two characters I fell in love with immediately on the very first episode and it's sad that they're not there.

[@RedMartianSkylight]

I love the introspective episodes, and when Burnham mentions she's more afraid of failing than she is of death, that hit HARD.

[@TheMightyFlea-0]

Proving she is no where near worthy. Death should scare her more than failure. That just shows how immature and self involved she is.

[@RedMartianSkylight]

@@TheMightyFlea-0 You do not understand.

[@antoniao7439]

@@TheMightyFlea-0 living a life you don’t want to live, to me, is waaay scarier than death. Death is the easiest part of life. Grief on the other hand…

[@samfisher6606]

Im okay with the bucket having endless sand. It's metaphorical

[@frankandstein8618]

I guess since it's all in her mind, she can Tardis the shit out of it.

[@jasonwalker9471]

Yeah, it was a mindscape projection. As soon as I saw it I figured it would be a never ending bucket, because that just makes sense under the circumstances. I'm glad they didn't feel it necessary to explain that it was a neverending bucket with tedious extra dialogue, because that's just something the audience should intuitively understand. Dreamscape=weird physics.

[@tinavannatter3399]

Also, it's in her mind... not a real bucket! How many times are things illogical in our dreams, fer gosh sakes!

[@jsstephens6995]

Loved this episode, and HyRell's enthusiasm reminded me of actual librarian colleagues. And that library is AWESOME!

[@PheeFab]

Your reviews are just spot on. I love how you explain everything I was actually thinking and seeing and loving and finding challenging I live to wait for your reviews xx

[@seansteinbacher6449]

I was disappointed that Deep Space Nine was not mentioned in this episode considering Discovery was very close to the station in this episode would of been cool to know if the station was still there or not in the 32nd century.

[@QBCPerdition]

Kind of implies it isn't, doesn't it? After 800 years, and with the Dominion no longer a threat, Bajor in the Federation, and Cardassia at least friendly, the station has served its purpose...and you can't expect O'Brien to keep the station working forever, and without him, it would be hopeless.

[@HighSierra1500]

@@QBCPerdition O'Brien would be Leprechaun after 800 years and have brought potatoes to Bajor sometime earlier.

[@wesleyehowell]

complete with Morn's.

[@kanaric]

I doubt after like 800 years anyone even cares if it exists or not, the crew don't they aren't even from the era that it exists.

[@rebelliousbynature99]

Downs at 9:26 - primarch one note - missing characters Total downs: 1 Me thinks your math ain't mathing

[@aaronbourque5494]

Whoopsie daisy.

[@ravensplat]

It’s been bugging me the whole rest of the episode (only at 17:54 right now but it’s still bugging me lol) least we know what it should be.

[@Lewis5020]

Maths was never Sean's cuppa!

[@GlenRN64]

Slightly off topic, but I love the Arrakis tourist t-shirt!

[@jamesallred460]

I miss Owo, Detmer, and Saru, too. Completely agree with you about the trilithium down.

[@PratabAli]

I absolutely love the librarian lady, shame she's introduced so late. She's a joy to watch.

[@mikeetee]

I really enjoyed this episode. I loved Hy'Rell's interaction with the Breen, denying them access to the archive. Just the right amount of librarian sass :)

[@storm9c1]

I was hoping for a throwback "whoopsiedaisy" and you did not disappoint! 3 ups for that.

[@pollymccall5938]

I'm thrilled that you mentioned the "Labyrinth" movie call back!!!

[@santacruzramble83]

I totally agree w your trilithium down. I was literally thinking during this episode “where’s Owosekun???” It is a bummer without them. Burnham is definitely shouldering the season masterfully, but I miss the core group. I love that Leoben was added (Rayner) but miss my peeps. Thx for all you do Sean.

[@Programmerman]

Raynor gets a pass. We got his backstory, his family was killed for, more or less, not being Breen; he can call them whatever he wants. Especially if they're trying to kill him

[@cl5946]

Love the tee-shirt Enjoying your channel. It's where I go for Star Trek news.

[@KenjiWardenclyffe]

Couldn't help but laugh when the flame throwers went off. And boy did I love the new badlands. It makes sense it could have worse there there after nearly a thousand years. Also I loved how the bridge crew worked together, and I wish we could have a show where Rhys is in command of a ship. He did so well!

[@kingboy76]

The piece of Kweijan world root conveniently gifted to Book is 100% going to be combined with the progenitors' tech to resurrect Kweijan isn't it?

[@LaurieWhite-or4uk]

I bet burnham retires to kwejian I the finale and hands discovery to rayner

[@c.a.nixiii4650]

Yep. And restoring Lok. Like the rest of this mess totally predictable!

[@TheMightyFlea-0]

But what would be the point. It would resurrect the planet, not the people. If it resurrected the people, that's as dumb as dishwater.

[@marvelboy74]

Discovery has been such a revolving door with cast and supporting characters. Not saying that some characters shouldn't have been moved on (Georgiou) but that we don't quite have the found family aspect that we had in other shows (Picard kinda the same). Having seen Owo and Detmer get some spotlights in Season 3 and 4 made me want to see them even more.

[@JustMe99999]

The bridge crew and minor characters like Owo and Detmer aren't the focus of the show.

[@samchereskin418]

I think you missed a minor citation observation: the transmission buoy giving directions to the archive looked like the satellite from “The Inner Light” as well. This in the same episode with a nucleonic beam that our captain couldn’t be disconnected from. I think it was also part of the homage.

[@braxtaplock3337]

9:10 I got that impression about Detmer and Owyo when it was stated they would be piloting the ISS Enterprise back. The view from the Discovery bridge made it seem like a last hurrah for those 2 as the ship flew off. Similar to Kirks final order on the A.

[@DjDavidElix]

absolutely 10,000% agree with whats said about Detmer, Owo, and Saru...however, needed more of them throughout the whole series

[@kurobara9001]

"Check in the Brandon Sanderson section"? Was that a Wheel of Time joke? Very nice 😂

[@adventuresincascadia7985]

People have already decided he'll have to finish Martin's series, and probably Rothfuss's too, but since WoT he's built himself a much larger universe of obligation. By sheer word count, the cosmere is going to crush them all put together.

[@santacruzramble83]

I think she passed the test by overcoming her own personal delusions. She said she’s afraid of not being good enough, captain, partner, friend, etc. Fake Book says that sounds like a hard way to live. Burnham’s whole body language changes, she softens her stealy eyed tough guy look. I took that as the test was to know thy self. Even hearing Burnham say those emotions make her feel small and scared reminded me of the Klingon attack when she was a kid, she was small and afraid. If she would have been unable to know herself, her fears, insecurities, inadequacies, regrets etc, then she would eventually fail to protect the progenitors tech. Basically the test taught her to get out her own way… in my opinion

[@MKRex]

The archive was giving Empress's glass sky castle in Never Ending Story. Loved it.

[@littleshopofrandom685]

Please dont all take a visit to the library all at the same time. traffic is already at 2kph on spadina. :P

[@HighSierra1500]

Come to Hamilton instead! Check out the archive on the third floor of Central Library!

[@davery07]

Agree completely on your trilithium down. Been asking myself those same questions for a while now.

[@davideddy5877]

Glad you thought Book was a little camp. I thought it was just moi!

[@sergioaccioly5219]

I'm kinda hoping that at the final episode, when everything goesto Hell, the refitted USS Enterprise (former ISS Enterprise) will come to the rescue, cammanded by Detmer and Owo. One can hope.

[@capturedsoulsphotos]

The scream of absolute joy I would scream if that happened......

[@ArtistryBranson]

Ok, now THAT would be kickass.

[@Gwynhwfer]

Oh, I do hope so !! Wouldn’t that be so awesome !!

[@davidjames1389]

Awesome idea, and would be cool to see the ship with a few 32nd century upgrades as well.

[@Cdr2002]

So uhhh, assuming it wasn’t ripped out or anything 32nd century Tantalus Field? How OP would THAT be

[@historybuff7491]

I had a problem that more Breen did NOT object when the Primarch threaten to fire on the Archive the first time. It had already been established that thoe Archive held several secred Breen objects. If they had, then we could have a scene with the Primarch stating, "if we do not get the Imperium, than those objects will become meaningless." That would also have intensified all that followed with him, and also Moll's speech would have made even more scense.

[@kevinm1332]

OMG I would love that model. My oldest daughter's name is Kira, and yes, her character on DS9 was a big reason. One of my favorite series and feel grossly underrated.

[@bwydro]

I always enormously enjoy these episodes and Your way of going over the episodes. Probably because you have a great way of speaking the obvious in way that always make me think - oh yeah - this is exactly what I thought when this happened. Love the work. BUT the absolute highlight was THE PRIMARCH IS PRIMARCHING 😜❤️this made my week. Live long and continue doing these videos (which goes with the assumption there will be new star trek episodes for the next 50 years at least 😜)

[@hewiy33]

Reno in renfair clothes is all I can think about.

[@Emanon...]

I have to say that I've really enjoyed this season so far, despite the "downs" and the usual style of Discovery focusing too much on Burnham. Rayner is well written and relevant to the story.

[@aef6259]

My latinum up for the episode is Rhys taking the chair!

[@howardrichardson1321]

You are so awesome I truly enjoy your up a downs I look forward to seeing them every week

[@philopharynx7910]

I so hope that Saru will join Star Trek Academy. He would be an amazing professor!

[@oldoneeye7516]

Thank you for this last 10 Seconds. Peace to the world

[@arab3k]

That DUNE t-shirt. Kudos Seán!

[@john_carter_of_earth]

Just here to say the "whoopsie-daisies" are making me LOL!

[@veggiet2009]

I will never not smile at the "whoopsie daisy" 😊

[@lcflngn]

I loved all the great bits, they kept this ep going! The (real!) library & Hy’rel were standouts for sure. Agree Breen mustache twirling commander so annoying, but his team had to get to hate him a lot in order to support Moll, so. Big dumb boring baby though, & hard to watch. Can’t think of anyone to compare him to… Great review of a very decent ep, nicely done!

[@markatect]

The reason the actors are missing is because the budget was downsized. They put more Canadian people on the bridge in order to get tax credits from Canada while filming.

[@derianardor]

I believe what the program was getting at was the need for clear self reflection. The concept of morality and the lens we see ot through is most tied to our ability to be honest to ourselves and the mirror we hold up to ourselves. If you cant admit your failings, or strive to be better, the question stands how can you be trusted to at least try to safeguard and protect against horrors of such power? A clear moral lens and ability to see yourself within the context of life is the one of the Hallmarks of sentience.. without it qe consume, control and destroy..so thus the test.. To GREATLY simplify a philosophical concept lol

[@petertrudelljr]

Book was dressed as a Time Lord! Just needs the headpiece!

[@Valandhir]

About Burnham knowing about the Breen - she spent just a lot of time ina library, reading about the Dominion war and other things, she would have picked up something.

[@Cdr2002]

Every time the Disco crew knows something about the state of the Galaxy they’d don’t before I just assume Starfleet filled them in or crew members did research in their own time

[@ITGuy1970]

If we don't get a "whoopsie daisies" we riot.

[@hammerman199374]

As soon as I saw the thing in the book I knew what was about to happen. I've played Myst enough to know a Linking Book when I see it!

[@michaelayala7247]

She passed the test by understanding her weaknesses. Without being able to identify her weaknesses, she might fall victim to them when having the kind of power the tech gives you. You need to know how your weaknesses affect your decision-making so you can factor them in and make the best decision possible.

[@thebagnechannel3183]

I think you missed an observation. When Michael was trying to pass the test and the lights were dimming representing her demise, it paralleled when Dr. Bashir entered into the mind of the Section 31 agent and his mind world was similarly dying.

[@oathgroved]

12:12 there's no way that photo wasn't deliberate and I'm here for it🍉❤️

[@user-Wolf3593]

And not to mention the bridge is made of explodium

[@richtheobald4390]

Is that what those weird chunks of whatever are?

[@jobe616]

​@@richtheobald4390Rocks. Starfleet bridge consoles are made of rocks.

[@Blasted2Oblivion]

Starfleet actually ran out of explodium some time after the burn so they had to replace it with flamethrowers.

[@wesleyehowell]

​@@jobe616Rocks from Vaal's planet?

[@DanielTrezza-hh2td]

Burnham's own selection of her tests immediately brought me back to Captain Janeway's tests in the episode "Sacred Ground". The guide simply fulfilled Janeway's own expectations of what the test should be in order to save Kes, but in the end had to accept the unknown.

[@reggiestafford4549]

That oubliette comment was my favorite of the episode. The only way in or out is in the ceiling.

[@medleystudios72]

I kept expecting to see a Breen put in it

[@petertrudelljr]

I have an oubliette joke, but I keep forgetting it... (ba-dum tssssh)

[@l.j.krumenacker9802]

I loved Hy'Rell too, such a fun character.

[@stephon7577]

DOWNS: The Breen speaking english when not speaking to Mal. After telling the Breen of the anciet technology, what purpose does Mal serve. She has no clues, so all she can advise is follow Discovery. How are the Breen able to track Discovery? I thought that was one of the benefits of the spore drive.

[@DavidPruitt]

If we can down one dimensional characters can we down the one dimensional "puzzles". Everyone of them has been exactly the same, only the scenery and characters have changed; go to location, meet locals, start challenge, get trapped, be on extreme danger, start dying, figure out clue, deus ex machina save.

[@PassivesAbseits]

I am absolutly fine with the Primach being this comic super villain. Because well... we have 1 1/2 episode to establish this meta villain, not for Discovey, but for Maul to overcome. He basically just exist to give her more power, while also make us sympathize with her more. So from a narrative perspective, he does his job. If we still had 15-20 episodes per season, you could have fleshed him out more, but using this simlistic character to elevate Maul is fine.

[@gregorybergman7452]

The Primark had to be simplistic and blatantly unredeemable for it to make sense that the Breen soldiers would take Mols side over his at the end. If it was ambiguous at all, The end would have made no sense.

[@Lewis5020]

Those flamethrowers on the bridge drive me nuts! It's like the bridge is a ride in an amusement park.

[@PassivesAbseits]

Called the trilitium down last week, so I'm all on board with it. Detmer should have navigated the ship through the Badlands.

[@benfunk4725]

"Whoopsie Daisy" needs to stick around in perpetuity

[@warhawk3972]

7:49 I agree with the down, but if I'm not mistaken, there was a one-liner about Detmer and Owo flying the ISS Enterprise to FedHQ and storing it. Still stupid and worth a down, but we at least know where they are. It would be nice if we knew what Saru was up to.

[@tlouiseallen9302]

Saru is off being an Ambassador for the Federation

[@Tuskin38]

Hysperia isn't the first lower decks reference in Discovery. Season 4 referenced the Spider cow from the series premier.

[@brendanm720]

So, that one Breen that was backing up Moll this whole time... It occurred to my wife and I that perhaps this could be someone we know already somehow.

[@LarryGarfieldCrell]

It was vert conspicuous. I even recognized the voice from somewhere, I'm just not sure where. It will definitely come up sometime later...

[@jobe616]

The thermal detonator was a dead giveaway

[@jgkloosterman]

Is “Pyrian” a reference to DS9 writer Robert Hewitt Wolfe’s other series Andromeda? They had aliens called Pyrians.

[@kmotion123]

Don’t mind the one dimensional villainy of the Primarch; cause I think the goal was to mold Mull into the main villain from the go. And obviously she has more layers.

[@grahamvaneck8906]

I love Hyrell so unbelievably much and I'd gladly die for her ❤

[@alveolate]

how fun to have a Book visit me in the library for a change

[@michelrondeau9872]

Re: cetacean observations, I wonder if the first name “Marina” is also a nod to Marina Sirtis

[@UriYacobiKeller]

Huge up for you for putting the picture with the demos

[@tronicman1]

I was glad it wasn't a labyrinth where she had to hop around singing "Alamaraine!" 😅

[@cmoser22]

I'm also totally ok with the infinite bucket of sand. It's a weird mind puzzle. Why not

[@stewartbugler]

For the giggles.... My interpretation of the Test is that the program actively scans the participants brain to learn who the person is and decide whether or not to tell them where the last piece is hidden. There's no test... if she chooses the place where she wants to be then the area she finds herself in is from her memories. Meaning they are being scanned... you are absolutely right about the Character of anyone is essentially built up and contained by walls. There's places we would never go in ourselves and thats essentially the trick... the program can't see anything you don't show yourself... you couldn't lie to it more than you could yourself. It however isn't you so it is aware how open you are actually being. The book that is being read when she awakens is carried throughout the journey and shown at the end of the path when it explains that her barriers prevented her from finding the answer... the program isn't for guiding someone to the piece its to tell them how to actually use the object to enter into the final resting place for this technology. I imagine it could tie to a Voyager episode where Janeway must save Kes from a psychic door. Its never revealed what exactly the door was about but the rituals and tests Janeway went through were equally meaningless not to say they didn't serve Janeway or Burnham in the purpose of understanding the whole thing. But to know yourself and to believe in anything takes a certain mindset that few actually accomplish. Both episodes are super similar in these regards and its linked at least in the narrative behind the Progenitors mission.