CHAOS OVER NEW YORK | All Frequencies FAILED in Newark's Airspace!

[@VASAviation]

New York Tracon Real Controller's Testimony: "As you probably know the EWR sector of N90 was moved to Philadelphia, PA in the summer. It was one of the hastiest, most incompetent, unsafe moves that has ever been done in our National Airspace System. What happened is three former NATCA National figures "collaborated" with the FAA to move it. (i.e. took money as consultants and other favors). The FAA has always wanted to break up N90 as it was the power center of Labor in the East Coast and undeniably the entire National Airspace System. It has been the FAA's wet dream to do it. Once NATCA was on board, all lights were green. I will spare all of the interim details, but when the FAA finally "threw the switch" and moved the sector they did so with 20% less staffing even though they said the reason for this move was to IMPROVE staffing! Instead of using existing comm infrastructure that is already in place, is redundant and safe, the FAA and NATCA National has to "pipe" the radar feed from N90 through private sector infrastructure (Verizon). These lines often have bandwidth issues which cause frequent equipment outages. Since moving to Philly, the EWR sector has had 4 equipment failures that I know of. What is the most dangerous is they are running a sector which is supposed to be staffed with 9 or 10 radar scopes, and due to low staffing they are only running TWO at times! They have had multiple "Staffing Triggers" and have told managers to lie about the real reason for the in-trail restrictions! It is an aviation disaster, or overheated TCAS waiting to happen. The FAA knows all of this. They are operating on "hope". There was too much money spent, and too many ego's on the line to admit what a colossal failure this has been. The stakeholders (United Airlines, GA at KTEB etc) were all sold one of the biggest packaged lies you will ever see in bureaucratic history. And so we see it: the system limps along "under the radar" for the most part, but when traffic picks up, bandwidth increases, and those understaffed, overworked controllers hang on. It is a disaster waiting to happen. As of yesterday, there are four LESS controllers in EWR. They went out on trauma leave after the fourth radar/radio failure in 6 weeks. So there are 11 less controllers now than there were when EWR was at N90. I would not as a customer EVER again fly out of EWR, and if I was a pilot I sure as hell would not bid any trips through EWR. Thank you for your good work on KZbin!"

[@dukeofrodtown1705]

Not surprising. At all. Completely agree with him, well said. Thanks for directing me to this

[@FieldofDreams10]

Wow this is why I left Aviation.

[@buddycheck84]

This testimony was directly to this Channel? Major kudos for the Report and the part your channel plays in informing the public of the vulnerability the whole industry is suffering, in this day and age. We've advanced our world too fast in far too many respects, to the point that integrity takes a back seat to financial power and ignorance.

[@MrMegaMario64]

I can’t wait for these FAA liars to have to face the public. The results of this will be rough, but sometimes things have to get worse before they get better.

[@VASAviation]

@@buddycheck84 this testimony was sent directly to me and I'm in direct contact with this controller, who was actually on duty the night this happened.

[@blancolirio]

Wow! Thanks Victor!

[@ZaphodTHEBeeblebrox]

always so neat seeing two great channels communicating with each other!

[@VASAviation]

Sure Juan! Directly reported by a N90 controller that was on duty that night.

[@JHRO9000]

We need vectors, victor! Roger, Roger?

[@MikeNovember1895]

I know there are procedures for lost com on the pilots side but what when ATC lost coms? Is there any procedure to follow for pilots in particular? Maybe @blancolirio could give some insides during one of his next videos. Would be much appreciated.

[@DouglasCarnall]

​@@MikeNovember1895this is the key point. Any system that relies on reliability is by definition unreliable. The whole point of TCP/IP is that it does not depend on any particular routing, as long as there is a route. Hard to believe ATC doesn't have abundantly redundant network service from several independent providers.

[@Jayden-mt3qz]

Burner account here because I don’t want my employer to retaliate. We can’t speak to the media, they’re not taking the safety concerns serious. The BACKUPs did not work that night. GUARD did not work. FedEx nearly had a midair over LaGuardia. We need the flying public, the pilots to file reports, submit complaints. Help us. It’s not safe.

[@VASAviation]

Share it everywhere

[@mrpielover615]

Just one comment; that FedEx came nowhere near to a midair collision.

[@consortiumxf]

Wait hang on - GUARD didn't work???

[@mrpielover615]

@@consortiumxf the controllers lost their transmit function. They can't use any frequency.

[@Ndub1036]

Not gonna matter in a couple months when Donnie dismantled the exec branch

[@VASAviation]

This video and the other 3 separate raw videos have taken a total of 25 hours of work for the radar scope, transcripts and production. However KZbin algorithm doesn't like this kind of videos and even less long videos. The view ratio is low on those. Your support is important and sharing/comment/liking the video would help the channel a lot! The purpose of these 4 videos about this incident is such to bring this major issue to public knowledge. The vast majority of New York Controllers are AGAINST this move and it's true and evident that safety in the Newark airspace has decreased since they moved out to Philly. Again, share and comment to support the channel. Let's counteract the algorithm to keep these videos coming! RAW UNEDITED VERSIONS ATC RADAR [N90] (EWR Final) kzbin.info/www/bejne/qpnCiYeOnqh5d5Y ATC RADAR [N90] (LGA Departure) kzbin.info/www/bejne/m2XFlWSwjLOtfZo ATC RADAR [N90] (EMPYR) kzbin.info/www/bejne/lXKmkJ-erLFqq8U

[@tiktokjourney8472]

Thank you for doing this. Your videos are always informative

[@VASAviation]

@@tiktokjourney8472 thank you for watching!

[@markchamberlin7990]

I did watch this one. It is disturbing to see such a screw-up by an essential Government service. Hopefully a comment will help support the channel. And Thank You for the information.

[@AySz88]

I would advise adopting the practice of posting anticipated less-popular (and lower watch time) videos on a "second channel". If you allow a simplified explanation: Unfortunately, the algorithm appears to be unable to anticipate when a subset of your audience might skip a single video or two, but then resume watching the following ones. So it assumes some *possibility* that your entire prior audience no longer cares to watch your channel (and/or its topic generally), which leads to other videos being recommended over yours. That's very unfortunate, because the long videos certainly deserve reward and not punishment.

[@ferdynandkiepski5026]

It seems like an awful lot of work. What goes into it? I always thought you were able to just grab the logs and import them, probably through some kind of tool you wrote and have a semi finished product, without the audio of course. For transcripts have you tried whisper? Yes it requires verification, but even the small/medium model is very good. Whisper cpp is an easy way to run it.

[@Steve-cg8ek]

It's nice to know that ATC radios have the same level of redundancy as a Walmart kid's walkie talkie.

[@qwerty112311]

Walmart walkie talkies have much higher redundancy because their range is short enough that if they go out, you can yell your message to the other person.

[@jyggalag169]

Its nice to know my Ski Slope Control room has the same level of redundancy as the ATC

[@I_Am_Your_Problem]

@Steve-cg8ek When is the last time Newark lost RF? Yeah that's what I thought. You fing alarmist losers. Bogeymen living rent free in your head, and chicken little for balls.

[@johnringoo756]

😆

[@YuzuRyougi]

@@qwerty112311and they also have pa and intercom phones

[@scpvrr]

Compliments to all the pilots. They stayed professional and leaned heavy on their training.

[@ghost2112_fpv]

That’s why we train👍

[@mrmessy7334]

"299 heading, 1560. What kind of speed?" "Whatever you want." "Warp speed engaged"

[@Live.Vibe.Lasers]

"Center..we're showing a little closer to...2000..."

[@BaldFinanceMan]

Light speed too slow?! Yes, we're gonna have to go right to ludicrous speed!

[@glynncordry5965]

Naw, Plaid is fast enough...

[@brunonikodemski2420]

Good, I caught this too.

[@josh3771]

Such a major incident handled very professionally by all those in the air

[@beenaplumber8379]

Incident... - I wonder if there's anything the NTSB can do to justify an investigation? I think they have some latitude beyond investigating individual accidents. Not sure that investigation would continue beyond January 20 though, but it's enough time to get out a preliminary report. (Edit) "The NTSB conducts research, data analysis, and reporting on emerging transportation safety problems and past accident and injury trends." I think this is an emerging transportation safety problem.

[@PatrickHarten-v7p]

For the Pilots reading the comments I recommend when this happens again is to join the 22L final on your last assigned heading 150-090 headings across the localizer takes you right into the LGA 31 departure path which they were departing this day. This whole EWR sector move to PHL is a poorly executed terrible plan and needs to reversed.

[@consortiumxf]

Patrick Harten....as in the Sully ATC controller?

[@PatrickHarten-v7p]

@@consortiumxfYes

[@consortiumxf]

@@PatrickHarten-v7p Very cool, hi! Hope you are doing well ☺

[@albmt]

Wow that video definitely took some time to assemble. Thanks for the content!

[@VASAviation]

Only importing all that traffic into the radar took hours...

[@finnboru7977]

Whoa! How deep in the FARs is the procedure for THAT? "Everyone immediate left-hand hold, obey the TCAS.."

[@EddieLeeFunn]

SOMEBODY picked the wrong day to start sniffin' glue!

[@oldRighty1]

Where did you get that radio, it's awful, and those shoes and that coat, jeeeeez!

[@lando1071]

Roger, Roger. 😂

[@alex-internetlubber]

@@lando1071 Huh?

[@cantliff9]

Watch the film 'airplane' - all will become clear, also, what's our vector Victor

[@Leavannah]

@@alex-internetlubber Whats our vector, Victor?

[@Mr_Plop1]

"Let's move N90 to Phily!" "Sir, if you do that, current controllers might not want to move" "It's ok, we got enough staff" ................................................. "Sir, the sector is 3 hours behind" "Why? don't we have like 10 radar scopes??" "Sir, we only got staff to man 2/10" "So, what kind of weather is causing this delay you say?"

[@qwerty112311]

Staffing related issues have been reduced since N90 moved south.

[@mrskutsch]

😂😂😂😂😂

[@mountianshuffle]

FAA moved an entire area of N90 from New York to Philadelphia. Ever since said move between the radar outages, radio failures, and forcing people to move has been an abject failure by the FAA.

[@Jookboks]

Pray for us controllers down here and pray for the pilots and passengers. The FAA is consistently showing they do not care about safety in EWR airspace. They wanted to beat N90 at any cost. This is the cost.

[@I_Am_Your_Problem]

@Jookboks Odd... Out of the handful controllers I've had the privilege of working with. Not a single one would ever pray. Certainly wouldn't ask for prayer. Last thing they want in their pattern are imaginary deities and their flying circuses.

[@reallyWyrd]

And it's probably not going to get any better under Trump-- Unless except of course if a colossal tragedy occurs and only if it is properly reported on. FWIW I hope no tragedy occurs.

[@JustherefortheLOLZ]

Again.. what does “beating N90” mean? You’re still in N90.

[@map04wormhole]

​@@reallyWyrdIf anything he and his cult want that to happen.

[@GlobalTossPot]

@@reallyWyrd probably not considering Trump has mentioned privatizing parts of the FAA, including ATC. Privatization of anything of this sort is bound to bring safety risks as decisions are usually driven by money/profit

[@FishBaitBlue]

This is UNACCEPTABLE in the US. What a colossal and dangerous embarrassment

[@USA-GreedyMenOfNoIntegrity]

We’ve been nothing but an embarrassment since 1607. Go get educated on our real history not the lies you’ve been told.

[@dutchman063]

Welcome to diversity hires

[@idkjames]

I'm curious how the back up TX went down. Our facility has lost main TX before and back ups immediately did their job.

[@ReservedForFutureUse]

No worries, Trump will probably dissolve the FAA and it will be a free for all

[@RS-ls7mm]

NYC is basically toast. Too many years of a clueless government.

[@parrotraiser6541]

Toronto International YYZ had a similar situation a few years ago. The traffic realized the problem, talked to each other, and sorted out their diversions.

[@hewhohasnoidentity4377]

How is this not a major news story?

[@beenaplumber8379]

How many flights were canceled? I think it has to be in the thousands before news agencies take notice.

[@hewhohasnoidentity4377]

@beenaplumber8379 I would think hundreds of flights, including dozens of airliners in all phases of flight being unable to communicate with ATC would be a bigger issue than people being stuck on the ground. I'm sure there were many pilots wishing they were on the ground. Luckily passengers were oblivious and likely still don't know.

[@beenaplumber8379]

@@hewhohasnoidentity4377 I don't disagree at all. Those of us with an interest in aviation appreciate the seriousness of this event (which of course is not an isolated incident). But it's hard to put all that in a "breaking news" headline, and I don't think the general public, who don't understand how traffic separation normally works, have the attention span to learn why this was so dangerous, and therefore news outlets will just skip it. Maybe I'm being cynical, but I think that's what's happening. This is a long-form journalism piece, something for 60 Minutes, Frontline, or just a longer segment in the PBS Newshour (or whatever comparable program on any other network), but right now is not a great time to compete for space in programs like those. There's a lot in the news these days. Maybe my cynicism is just running amok, and I'm no journalist, but that's my best guess for what's happening.

[@Skidracer21]

Probably because it got overshadowed by election coverage.

[@mrpielover615]

@@hewhohasnoidentity4377 dozens? There were like 5 planes in the sequence at the time the communication went out. I get it was bad but no need to exaggerate.

[@JesseLikesWeather]

I am glad none of the aircraft was having any emergency at that time. Who knows what could have happened.

[@nicholashartzler2205]

They either would have done what they had to do or they would have simply followed their clearance all they way to the destination.

[@jeffmoon6230]

Why didn’t I hear anything about this. Thank goodness for the skill of the pilots to handle this situation!

[@Starliner428]

Great work to publicize this. Thanks for all the hard work!

[@nezen777]

Amazing work VAS aviation, thanks!

[@req2000]

It is so nice to be a retired controller. Watching these videos help remind me of that. Thank you.

[@TrueSight_333]

AGAIN? This is the THIRD TIME. These guys need to get this fixed!

[@dukeofrodtown1705]

1000%! And people at the very top need to be dealt with stat

[@rjhornsby]

Stuff happens, and things break. But it does make you wonder how much the FAA’s (and the larger federal gov) misplaced priorities on things not aviation-related contribute to this chaos. Thank goodness for the individual controllers who picked up the slack and kept the airplanes away from each other.

[@briandugan4054]

They will wait for an incident with loss of life followed by congressional hearings....then maybe they will put a band-aid on it. When really, the entire ATC network needs an upgrade. Hardware and software.

[@bobschuon5908]

They NEED to go back to having the controllers in place in the LOCAL area.

[@iancarisi8342]

Maybe the USA needs to put money into the USA and not Ukraine?

[@Airpaycheck]

I'm really glad I retired and don't have to mess with the NE Triangle. Everybody up there did a great job recovering.

[@consortiumxf]

Your username cracks me up.

[@KaiTakApproach]

Unacceptable from the FAA. Someone give them a number.

[@KimtheElder]

This is terrifying. God bless the controllers that took over.

[@USA-GreedyMenOfNoIntegrity]

Oh, you haven’t seen anything yet. Better stock up on your popcorn and beer.

[@KimtheElder]

@ oh boy! 😳

[@MrXtachx]

Nobody took over and it was a clusterfuck

[@I_Am_Your_Problem]

@KimtheElder Your orange jesus will do all he can to undermine the FAA. Congrats.

[@mrskutsch]

Thank you so much for putting this together... I was working this disaster and it was terrifying... But the worst part is they are incapable of fixing this issues... All they hope for is that is doesn't happen again to this extent

[@VASAviation]

Appreciate it. Please reach me at my email for some questions. Thank you.

[@mattwilliams3456]

Terrible situation, but excellent compilation of multiple sources from Victor!

[@AllAmericanGuyExpert]

Roger, Victor.

[@danerickson11]

At least we have Notice to Air Missions now.

[@maav]

😂

[@wjatube]

I am picturing a balding controller devilish-smiling while plugging the cord back in.

[@gtoger]

just kidding

[@rudiklein]

Coffee? No, thanks.

[@mikeypops73]

Like Les Grossman

[@oldRighty1]

What can you make of this video?

[@flyingardilla143]

Damn you Johnny!

[@xplayman]

This move to Philly has been a disaster, and that’s me being EXTREMELY generous

[@Rblx_Centre]

I was actually stuck with that problem at that time

[@OregonOutbackRanch5629]

WOW AMAZING work ATC and the Pilots‼At anytime in my life I could Never do these jobs! Just Incredible!!!

[@fumo7887]

5:55 "Anybody on frequency, please advise." 🤣

[@consortiumxf]

"Can you hear me now?"

[@markhugg]

Amazing work! Appreciate it very much!

[@HoldTheLine1990]

Remember, this is the same FAA that is here to help and keep us all safe. 😳 Good reason to always have 121.5 active on the radio ya not using as primary.

[@jpilot64]

I think I saw somewhere guard wasn’t working either during the outage.

[@peterk2455]

This is criminal negligence. Only through the training and professional conduct of the pilots and aircrew, this did not end in loss of an aircraft and lives. There needs to be an immediate and open investigation of this by an independent body. Those responsible must be identified and never again allowed in a position to repeat this.

[@I_Am_Your_Problem]

@peterk2455 Der da amiwitard... Cwiminal evwyting. Awest dem awl.

[@GammaJK]

And they are talking about getting rid of controllers and automating things more... Yeah right!

[@KazKimura]

Good job Victor!

[@Xanthopteryx]

Glad to hear that John McClane sorted his out too.

[@amylynncreaney2245]

FAA learned nothing from the disaster that resulted from the fire at Chicago TRACON back in 2014. Extremely disappointing and completely unacceptable! These centers need proper staffing to handle daily flight volumes. You can’t expect overworked understaffed centers to deal with failing infrastructure systems and still meet the operational mission. If the FAA knows Verizon infrastructure is failing (which it is across the country causing large 9-1-1 outages) then why hasn’t the FAA developed their contingency plans and Continuity of Operations plans? They claimed they had plans in 2014, yet no one could find them when they needed it and the ones that thought they knew the plans couldn’t execute them. Plans that are not trained or exercised regularly are called hopes, dreams, or memories. FAA which version are you going to sell the aviation community a hope, a dream, or a memory? Get your act together! You’ve already had a decade of borrowed time. 😡

[@TheProPilot]

WHAT IS GOING ON WITH NYC/EWR APP? This is the 5th event inside a quarter.

[@fhowland]

This explains why my fight into EWR was delayed...

[@BeCoShooter]

This is criminal.

[@TheRealPlato]

Thank you for the hard work!

[@chrisgirgis4154]

The Transportation Secretary (Buttigieg) needs to be sitting in front of Congress explaining why this happened.

[@nealrasmussen4832]

It happened due to lack of funding with an ancillary benefit of making privatization look good? Sadly.

[@Scottyboy88]

When we thought EWR couldn’t get any worse…….

[@UNITED38Heavy]

This was an interesting night for sure. We received three United 767’s here at SWF that night.

[@nickv4073]

That scenario is the most frightening of all scenarios.

[@jacksonkuster3805]

My parents were in the ground at Newark during all of this, luckily they were one of the first flights allowed to depart out of EWR, and got to their destination only about 45 minutes late.

[@brmam1385]

Good to know about this! I have friends who occasionally to NY & I’ll be sure & warn them about the FAA’s cluster EF in Newark & NOT to fly American!

[@Raptor747]

This looks like an utter safety nightmare. And as a result of anti-labor practices and corruption, which is just blood-boiling. That the FAA knows all of this and just covers it up is galling.

[@phillee2814]

The FAA caused it. Of course they want to cover it up.

[@major__kong]

So we're to accept the pro-labor corruption instead?

[@stevenfromer3816]

That’s a bit more exciting than needed

[@lastdance2099]

The intern was dispatched to buy an entire case of glue for the TRACON controllers.

[@burdman516]

Not in the this kind of thing, but as a frequent flyer, I’m just here to comment and “Like” for the cause!

[@shanemooon]

Very interested to know what the actual technical issues were. Fiber issues from the ARTCC to the RCAG? Or equipment issues at the RCAG itself? I would have to imagine that there are both terrestrial and satellite backups. But also the ability to switch transmission from an RCAG to another site?

[@jpilot64]

@@rackets001great insight. Sounds like a tagging error could have been a likely cause. Dropping power to the wrong circuit and killing something they didn’t plan on will def do it.

[@boommasterkc-135____8]

Man, those dudes hitting wake turbies is frightening. The thought of TCAS being your main defense and not knowing the dudes stacked above or well in front is heebee jeebee territory as well.

[@nimashafiee6845]

Some say FedEx 743 Heavy is still being vectored til this day

[@thatguy7085]

This happened at the Atlanta tower once… someone cut the wrong cables knocking out every radio frequency.

[@benjijustice739]

Amazing work.

[@MrHarjas21]

Very interesting, thanks for making this

[@AdminAirGuys]

Hey there, I haven’t said hi in a while, but this was very well done. Hope you’re doing well.

[@davee8113]

great video, circles around the actual plane that is being called and given info on the radio would be great so we can see the real picture

[@ronparrish6666]

Hopefully not everyone was eating the fish

[@andyburk4825]

Reminds me of the FAA atc upgrade in the 1980's - over a billion dollars declared lost and only parts of the upgrade program salvageable into the 90's - and nobody got fired.

[@cDUB111]

Freq issues are not just in NY. Having all sorts of probs at ZHU as well….

[@rackets001]

Uh oh. I think we've kept the boat afloat at Houston TRACON. I can't speak for the ARTCC folks. Planned outages for upgrades are occasionally necessary for future usability.

[@gundam7286]

It happened to me in early October. Delayed for 7 hours

[@VASAviation]

Was that a radio failure or a radar failure? Or power outage?

[@JFirn86Q]

FAA is too worried about what the NOTAM acronym is instead of fixing actual problems

[@Garythefireman66]

I live on Long Island and I don't recall hearing anything about this on traditional news media 🤔

[@JR-gc9wy]

Imagine that…doesn’t fit the narrative. And this is more NJ news than LI news. But the FAA’s move of the ewr sector was definitely on news 12 for a whole day 🙄

[@ghostrunner2138]

The U.S needs to get their ATC shit together is it really gonna take a major accident before this can get fixed

[@christerry1773]

Everybody’s so professional, given their in the busiest airspace in the word. But they’re all on vectors

[@prorobo]

Oh good, another near disastrous event thanks to the geniuses who decided to move EWR approach from N90 TRACON down to Philly!

[@LantanaLiz]

We've had so many more plane crashes in Australia since they closed down a lot of the towers, moved what they do have over to Melbourne and there being more and more unmanned airports. It's a bad, baaaad idea to move tower controllers away from the planes.

[@leongutknecht-stohr9552]

Damn, that's a scary Situtaion to be in.

[@markg7963]

With all this going on, and the pure volume of traffic all waiting for vectors (basically a ticking time bomb for failures like this). One would think that there would be better RNAV arrival procedures are are linked already to the approach, so that the pilots can just continue on in the case of radio failure. The current practice is rather to pull them off the arrival and vector and sequence them all over New Jersey. These controllers are simply amazing, it when the radios die, it’s a shit show, and it’s dangerous. Really dangerous!

[@TheLikeys]

Wasn’t there just recently an issue with a radio backup system also in the New York area resulting in an similar situation.. I can’t remember if that was also at EWR.

[@mavdadog]

Great research!

[@Rusoatrincherado047]

Ok, that's scary, very very scary...

[@culdeus9559]

Did they try powering the tower off and on?

[@VASAviation]

Tower didn't have any problem

[@Toupac1029]

To be fair, I have many hours avoiding that airspace.

[@consortiumxf]

Underrated comment (and username!)

[@HuckThis1971]

I am sure there is a procedure in accordance to surrounding airports to take over and put aircraft into a pattern no? If not, such a plan should be considered. Example. CYUL controllers guide aircraft into CYMX. There isn't always a controller in CYMX tower.

[@wickras]

Well, time for me to review the lost comm procedures again when flying into New york....

[@kevinmalloy2180]

Thanks for bringing this important info to pilots and the flying public.

[@LJ-gn2un]

This is the reason I decided to be an aircraft mechanic and not an air traffic controller. 😂

[@USA-GreedyMenOfNoIntegrity]

It’s all right we’re all gonna be out of work before long.

[@jpilot64]

Mechanic is about as ai proof as you can get. Wise choice!

[@ThePulmentinum]

Say you experience a frequency failure like this, what do you do? What if you have to call a mayday? Who will listen?

[@SgfGustafsson]

91.185

[@lyaneris]

121.5 Guard freq

[@hossra2013]

@@lyaneris Check the comments. Guard was ALSO down.

[@lyaneris]

@@hossra2013 Was guard in general down, or could it be received by other stations - JFK ATC for example?

[@davestevens4193]

What a CF!

[@WilliamParmley]

Thanks.

[@fangs_out8879]

In Canada, if you experience Radio Failure while on vectors you are to squawk 7600 and proceed direction to the IAF and execute the straight in and carry out your approach while broadcasting in the blind. In VMC conditions we are to squawk 7600 and continue VFR to land as soon as practical. I would assume that would be the case in the US too.

[@daveluttinen2547]

I am noticing less "Expect ILS 22R" radio communications. The redundancy of "expect" clearances has diminished since I took IFR training. The last action to take was always what the flight plan stated, as filed. (Or am I missing hearing these?)

[@kevinrusch3627]

I'm just guessing here, but the complexity of the NYC airspace may be too chaotic for that to be safe, and so there are different rules for there? Again, just a guess.

[@DaWolf805]

Supposedly they are limiting the planes on one frequency at any one time now, and giving direct to a fix on the approach ASAP so that they don't recreate what they did to FedEx 743.

[@fangs_out8879]

@@daveluttinen2547 In the absence of an "expect " during a comm fail you would fly the published approach in the most current atis if you picked it up prior to the comm fail. Otherwise, using sound judgement for the simplest approach to the active runway, generally an ILS or LPV.

[@fangs_out8879]

@@kevinrusch3627 Definitely plausible. You could never fault the pilot for adhering to the FAR's too, I think.

[@CoolStuff108]

Imagine managing thousands of tons of flying steel and jet fuel through a cell phone network that can’t even provide reliable phone calls….. Boeing doesn’t seem to be the only one cutting costs these days

[@captainnathan1164]

Crazy days

[@janwitts2688]

I'm not American but I am well aware that the FAA is responsible for most of the failing over there... its about time that it was replaced with something a bit more modern and competent for the scale and scope of current and future requirements

[@demondoggy1825]

What did you say? We shouldn't work on LL replacements?

[@cibularas3485]

FAA is responsibl? China is

[@danh6720]

I work with the FAA regularly. I have little to no respect for the organization.

[@mason9483]

@@danh6720they aren’t happy until you’re not happy

[@gshingles]

I'm not sure how these systems work exactly, but it sounds like the equipment that remotes the radio calls needs to be able to fail in way that periodically alerts that the data link has been lost and to follow SOP for no comms.

[@codykimmel]

Can some kind person explain to me how this can happen, and even summarize basically what did happen? I understand all the frequencies failed aboard the flights and they were unable to reach the tower, and obviously I understand the implications of that. But it's the how of it I don't understand, especially as the comments indicate this is a result of bad decisions by those in charge. The pilots could hear each other but not the tower? What makes all frequencies fail? How common is this in other airports?

[@mark12.31]

Perhaps it's normal lingo in the aviation world but you can't lose frequencies. You can lose radios, which is I assume what happened, but to say someone lost frequencies is technically not possible. Unless I'm misunderstanding what happened. Is it normal to call a radio "frequencies" in aviation? Anyway, quite a moment to capture for sure!

[@lyaneris]

Well, every station has one (or more) assigned and published frequencies. So if a controller's radio doesn't work, you also "lose" the stations frequency. If 118.305 is Tower and their equipment fails, you'd say we lost Tower, but if it's one of the approach sector frequencies, you can't really say we lost approach, but rather we lost an approach frequency (or sector if they are in a normal split, which apparently wasn't the case, since they were understaffed). Idk if that makes sense Apparently guard frequency (or the connection to it) was also not working, which is really bad.

[@williamloh9018]

YGBSM...! So we can't even do this right anymore...

[@jman1121]

I don't know what kind of system they use, but I'm guessing it's more of a VoIP based system and less of a traditional radio system.

[@Anne_Onymous]

CEOs are busy pocketing money to worry about silly things like maintaining high quality communication services.

[@sarahalbers5555]

This is terrifying.

[@davidbeck4559]

Thanks. You spend a lot of time. Great job!