Voice Coils - we know what you did!

[@hinesvillebass6742]

What I like about yall is ya dont oversell the product yall make you just identify parts from a pure part perspective. Verry informative.

[@crazylarryjr]

I appreciate the lack of oversell as well, they also educate their potential customers as well. I'd rather my customers be informed, than ignorant and easily taken. These guys are a great business

[@CrimsonHelldrake]

lol 7:54 *"so to all you lyin, cheatin son's uh bitches who THINK you can pull 1 over on ME!?....no, the coil never lies. YOU...lie."*

[@mysock351C]

Also fun fact about the Brazilian amplifiers is they use _extremely_ high voltage rails to drive the bridged amplifier section, often without filtering. Im guessing the higher multi-kW ones run at about 160V from the 200V capacitors often seen. This combined with lack of filtering allows for less current to be used for the same drive power, and thus fewer switching transistors. The downside is if the voice coil suffers a broken section (and no inductance), the voltage will basically shoot straight up to the rail voltage since there's no filtering on the class-D output, and thus flash over, causing all the melted and burned sections seen.

[@negativezero3107]

if it suffers a broken section it is already dead, usually caused by low voltage supplied to the amp anyhow, they just try to overcompensate, just need an amp good enough to shut off when your volatge is shit.

[@mysock351C]

@nate0 Obviously you wouldn't, just like you wouldn't want to continue to run an engine with a rod knock, but it happens. A typical scenario would be multiple subs and you might not hear one is failing right away, so it ends up nuking itself in the process. Since the voice coil has a fair bit of inductance, if the amp has no output filtering and no proper clamping on the output, it can generate quite a lot of back-EMF if the coil opens up, thus leading to flashover. Don't know how many were/are susceptible to this, but its a distinct possibility since filterless class-D is really for undemanding things like consumer electronics, not high power car audio amplifiers. These also have the undesirable characteristic of having substantial voltage on the speaker terminals even with the amp idling since each terminal will be toggling between the two respective power rails.

[@danielbujold7262]

Your "fun fact" about Brazilian amplifiers is completely incorrect. Brazilian amps being "extremely high voltage" is an old myth/misconception. Brazilian (full bridge) amplifiers use much lower rail voltage than their half bridge counterparts.

[@mysock351C]

​@@danielbujold7262 First off, a full-bridge amplifier doesn't use "much lower voltage", it just doesn't have a bipolar power supply. Half-bridge designs have to have + and - rails to be able to provide the full swing about the ground reference. With a full-bridge design, the bridge does the polarity flipping, so only one rail is needed. That said, the rail must provide sufficient voltage to actually drive the load, and as such will use similar voltages as the half-bridge amps, but just with only one rail, and half the number of rail caps. Just doing some basic math, 2 kW RMS into a 2Ω load requires 63V RMS, or 88V peak. In a full-bridge design, this would be 90V at the rail. In a half-bridge design, this would be ±90V.

[@mysock351C]

@@danielbujold7262 And I think that may have come from a barevids video where he looked at the outputs of a full-bridge amp. That can cause some confusion since normally just one output will be swinging while the other sits at ground. Off the top of my head, the outputs on a full-bridge should be of opposite phase to add up to the full drive voltage once the drive signal has passed thru the filter networks.

[@randomtube8226]

I really hate it when the coil starts to slip or unravel without the coil itself not even burning. Mainly on cheaper subs. Just because the coil can handle 500 degrees. Doesn't mean that the glue and former can take the abuse.

[@loganmilam4065]

like when you cant even smell them and they just blow on like 100w extra?

[@abelscaliber7969]

@@loganmilam4065 literally lol

[@621ELECTRONICS]

"I love the smell of burnt voice coils in the morning"

[@jayebonia8108]

looks like CSI in car audio

[@billybullfrog]

k ebonia Grissom forgot to wear his rubber gloves

[@Supercharged1976]

The coil that had the 10k on it, how much was the sub rated for rms? 3" I'm guessing between 2500-3000? So a 10k even after decent rise would still be around 5000 minimum. I think you said it best this is the only hobby where people will push stuff 2-3x past what it's rated for then still blame the product. LOL!

[@EMFAudio]

Flexin Five Hundred 2,500 rating on that sub. It didn't last long on that amp.

[@1452-w3b]

LOL depending on the coil 1200 or so RMS+

[@mddunlap03]

Or they buy a 1k amp and crank the gain all the way up trying to get 3k out of it then blame a sub for dying not knowing it was basically being fed dc and being used as a space heater

[@Chuck_Sanders]

I remember some car audio company's, were not listing RMS ratings, and when asked about it, they would tell you that "if you have to ask, it's not the sub for you" but, that has been awhile. No voice coil is "rated for power" and that's a huge misconception, and anyone that tells you otherwise, is just trying to push a product. And on a side note, the difference in the color of the enamel, depends on how hot the coil was baked for curing, and or how the process was done.

[@volvo09]

Holy shit, such a massive coil assembly! And insane electrical destruction too... exactly like someone struck an arc across it with a welder. Big power on both sides.

[@PhiMobileSounds]

This video deserves more traffic and likes!!! Thanks for the knowledge!!!

[@2guns908]

Yea that’s why I still have my old school fosgate equipment with all stinger pro wire been running it for years ..the coils on my power hx2’s still look new

[@EMFAudio]

John Doe A brand new high quality amp from China would give the same result. The super cheap class D and Brazilian amps are the ones that cause the most problems.

[@DobbysHobbies]

I watched this video while waiting for a delivery, every time I heard that back up alarm I started looking around IRl.

[@Martin1519]

I used to get coils where the form would start to bubble, but the coil was perfectly fine. As a result of the bubbled form, it would eventually start to rub, and the more it bubbled the more it would rub until it eventually got stuck.

[@EMFAudio]

That's a result of the former and coil expanding from heat at different rates, the coil being less and the former being more.

[@joncarolineconnors2612]

Question: So if the coil started out as a bright shiny copper & turned dark, is it still good as long as the glue hasn't melted? Or the coil hasn't come loose?

[@lm6036]

The clipping itself isn't the cause of loudspeaker failure, it's the symptom of the problem, i.e. 'not enough rig for the gig' your hitting the end stop on the amp (and speakers if powered properly) and most likely going well past them. Lost of people, especially nearer the bottom end of the game, tend to have mediocre amps (and speakers) and push them to hard to get anywhere near enough SPL (also an amp driven hard into clipping sounds louder which add's to the issue), while a system powered with an amp that is rate at the same RMS figure as the drivers sounds like a good idea, once it's driven hard it's then producing far more output (with far more distortion) and the drivers get burnt. The statement that clipping damages voice coils is probably slightly wrong (or being answered slightly wrong), as clipping itself does not damage speakers, but it usually indicates there is a problem that will result in a loudspeaker failure. A lot of Synths used in many EDM genres can produce square waves and a lot of producers use them. Especially in genres like hardstyle/hardcore. And they don't damage the speakers. Go and try it. Create a square wave and sent it BELOW rated RMS through your sub woofer. It will sound ugly but it won't damage the driver. Distortion is also not what causes damage to a speaker. But it can indicate that your are at A limit. Be it your amps output or your drivers mechanical limits. Heck, guitar amps sound the way they sound because of distortion and they last for years if used properly.

[@EMFAudio]

.....but clipping DOES damage coils, and leads. Obviously there is a problem if there is clipping, like the recording is bad, or the amp is overdriven, but neither of those things causes a problem for anything but the speaker. In the instance of using square waves in the recording, with enough output it will absolutely damage speakers. Remember the root cause is heat. 1 watt of square wave can't generate enough heat to kill the oil nor does it have the amplitude to kill a lead. Distortion from a guitar in a recording is the same way, but not nearly as aggressive. There are sharp peaks, not flat spots. The flat spots is what does the most damage.

[@lm6036]

@@EMFAudio Yeah but like you said yourself it's the heat. Clipping in and out of itself, as basically a less aggressive square wave is not something a driver by dentition cannot handle. The problem is that clipped sound (and square) generates more heat per given wat due to poor ventilation when the coil is moving less, EMF (ironic name :P) no longer provides additional resistance when the coil stops moving so your coil can get even more power too fast if the amp allows for it. If you RMS match your driver and amplifier you can certainly blow your woofer very easily when you notice clipping because for one, you are already at the limit of both your amp and driver. And now you are pushing the amp even more when you put it in clipping territory. So you are getting more stained power then the woofer can already handle and the additional heat build up of straight cut of sections. Got a car install with a subwoofer that can handle 1000 rms 2500 peak. It's supplied by a amp that can deliver 500 watts rms and 800 peak. Even when maxed out on the amp, with some minor clipping the woofer is as new. Clipping in and of itself is not bad. It's the additional heat it generates that can cause damage if the amp is powerful enough to provide enough power.

[@inov4flames623]

When i got my resilient sounds subs the coils seemed to have tiny gaps in them i didn’t know at that time but i do now and i hope that doesn’t affect my warranty..

[@cadillacdon6935]

Do an educational video talking about the performance, sound differences between, and pros & cons of 4-layer vs 8-layer coils

[@denverdan13]

Great videos man. You just gained a new subscriber

[@tonykartracer8032]

Whatever....... I still want my refund. :)

[@3a.m.284]

Tony Kart Racer well you're not getting it if your fuckwit ass purposely destroyed a subwoofer. you can't drive your car off a cliff and expect to get a new one.

[@rickeystovall7547]

@@3a.m.284 u😥

[@TheZombieSlayer1155]

@@3a.m.284 /r woooooooosh

[@1452-w3b]

Just because mama gave you your favorite Truckee every time you asked dosent mean every time you ask for a refund you're going to get one

[@AllaboutTheWoodrows]

金3 A.M. sure ya can it was stolen

[@Finejunk1]

Very educational. How do the coils look on 120v outlet vs 240v outlet?

[@tommyknight9004]

You know what we did to make the voice coil fail but do you know what you did to make your business fail

[@pospc2]

I asked the other day in a comment on another video how to tell if was caused by over power or clipping. This helps. Guess i should have watched more of your videos.

[@toniserenvert7919]

I agree. I personally match a sub with an amp from data given on sub or vice versa. 600w rms 1Ω sub needs 600w rms 1 Ω amp. That gives me great power handling. Correct amp tuning helps avoid so called" i didn't even use half power"!!!

[@apolinarponce4506]

Has manufacturers ever put a temp sensor in the coil to monitor it so you keep the coil happy

[@HashDogg06]

What is the main benefit from a aluminium coil? better cooling capabilities, power handling, less weight in the moving mass?

[@AnnaVannieuwenhuyse]

Generally less weight. Electrically, aluminium is inferior. They require more engineering to get them on a decent efficiency. Luckily, most of that is already figured out and 'public domain' knowledge.

[@COMPASBASSCHICALI]

Forensics that really sounds funny man but still serious because that knowledge rigth there👍

[@SlantedGlassProductions]

Interesting information, thanks!

[@BentonL]

I have been getting hate for blowing Kicker solo L7r 12's. Not sure what changed with kicker from 2005 to now. Long story short I destroyed my beloved l5 because I listened to it full power it with a drill on top. I replaced it with a like speaker thinking it was an upgrade. After than I kept blowing the l7's. People blame my amp settings, but I later got a Skar EVL and have not had an issue. The amp I was using was a JP8. Even clipping it I cant see how that would destroy a Solo. I am open to ideas, and sure I am gonna be called a liar. I never tried to warranty a speaker. I am was just disappointed the normal solos can't take abuse any more. I was a die hard kicker guy until 2020. I had no idea Skar was the most hated brand in the world. However I have been very pleased with it. My time to go with Sundown is finally here, but not because skar failed me. Basically Iam wondering what your thoughts are on a Solo L7r running on a D4S JP8 under the worst possible scenario. My L5 lasted all this time until I messed up.

[@davidfurney3945]

What does it mean when the coil falls off the former in one solid chunk, no burning, no holes sub had maybe 30 minutes of play time

[@edfx]

3:10 would be this coil still usable when you don't overdrive it anymore?

[@karthikeyay2988]

6:00 how many spiders are there??

[@dsmdallas2466]

GREAT VIDEO! QUESTION: I have never had a subwoofer bottom out. Alpine 8" type R dual 2 ohm rated350 watt rms per coil. being powered by alpine MVR 250 ( 250 watt at 2ohm 150 watt at 4 ohm ) wired at 1ohm. I only hear the tick of what I assume is a voice coil tap against the magnet. Would this be caused by 1ohm wiring? or Air leak in sealed box? or just over power?

[@EMFAudio]

DSM Dallas You may be hearing light clipping from running it at 1 ohm. Typically if you're tapping the coil on the backplate you don't do that too many times before it's destroyed. Now, I think it's also impossible to do that on that sub so it might also be mechanical noise from the spiders or maybe lead slap on the cone.

[@dannyfehr4689]

I've had a couple subs back in the days where spider just wasn't glued properly and the spider came loose. Luckily, in each case, all I had to do was reglue it and it fixed the problem.

[@jamest.5001]

yes I have been out of audio for a few years. that's why I have just discovered this company. from what I have seen. its an A OK #1 company. now its time to hear and feel some subs in action. I like extremely clean bass. hope they van deliver. because I love the looks!

[@EMFAudio]

Pick some up and judge for yourself, you can order any time at www.emfcaraudio.com

[@trunkbangking]

What is the difference and reasoning for different indications of clipping from Chinese Korean and Brazilian.etc?

[@EMFAudio]

The waveform is very different. Even under a normal condition they can look different, but when clipped there are often HUGE differences.

[@trunkbangking]

@@EMFAudio pretty cool

[@robv.o.1777]

Was wondering if you could build a custom voice coil if given exact dimensions. Have an 18" basket and cone, and ss audio 12" motor. A 4" 75 lb motor is silly for a 12" Building a more practical sub...lol. Using 1000-2000 wrms. Might need a few spacers and a standoff, to use the DC audio 18" medium spiders. Also have a dozen or so L7 solobarics to recone with some maxxonics cones.

[@EMFAudio]

We don't wind coils, nobody does. It takes specialized equipment to do it, when we get coils made we have to make an entire run of them.

[@SQ_Silverado]

Right now my w7 is starting to sound like a slinky on certain bass notes, had to lower my gain but now it hits nowhere near as hard … looks like I clipped it to much

[@AJ-tz6qu]

Great video. What are most of the formers made of?

[@EMFAudio]

On the things we typically deal with, aluminum.

[@14U2C]

So if a sub has 1 year warranty and it blows for whatever reason is it still covered under warranty?

[@EMFAudio]

Warranty typically states manufacturer defects are covered, not because it's broken for any reason. If you clip the hell out of it, nobody is going to warranty that. If you're using it outside of specifications, like more than rated power or the enclosure is way too big or way too small, nobody is going to warranty that.

[@Supercharged1976]

Nice explanation! I know when I used to run a competitors sub (not dropping names) that seems to have issues with coils all the time, and people would get mad because they would always say user error. After seeing this I would be curious how often they get some of those just fried or holed coils and the customer is flipping out saying that it's a crappy sub when they just committed subwoofer homicide. LOL!

[@EMFAudio]

I know of one brand we do a lot of recones for locally that have coil problems because they're just crap coils, or should be rated for less power. But, I also know people think a power rating means run double that on it and if it fails it's the products fault.

[@jasonpierce6507]

Does that company's name start with a "S" and end in qubed?

[@Supercharged1976]

I can't confirm nor deny...but yes it was soundqubed. LOL!

[@jasonpierce6507]

Lol...yeah thats what I have heard. But don't get me wrong I have 2 HDC3 15's on 2k each with no issues yet....but they do get warm and I dont full tilt for long. But I have some ZV4 motors coming my way for me build that can handle some abuse and get windy.

[@TimpBizkit]

Clipping is known to send disproportionate amounts of power to tweeters in full range speakers, but does it really make much difference on a sub, other than just extra power going to the coil in general? Running continuous bass tones near tuning or higher bass frequencies will generate lower impedance and also cause less coil movement that would evict heat from a vented pole piece. Excessive burst power could damage suspensions and spiders, yank coils away from cones or cause coil turns to come unglued if they aren't up to snuff. Bottoming out can dent coils, causing permanent rub.

[@EMFAudio]

Yes, it does matter on a sub. You CAN hear it, and it also just dumps heat. Less coil movement would INCREASE heat at that coil, pole venting isn't doing much of anything, and pole air isn't where the bulk of the heat is. Excessive burst power (within reason) only damages the sub if it's designed and built poorly. A good design won't bottom out and dent the coil, and breaking glue joints is just poor assembly. None of those are things our subs experience. We intentionally put over 7x rated power on them for a burst without failure.

[@brettaylor2661]

Thanks for the video. I'm about to cut open my sub that quit working and see what it looks like in there.

[@richardr5888]

I had an Alpine Type R that started sounding horrible. At low volume, you could hear the dreaded scratching. Checked the impedence on both coils and it was fine. Opened her up and all I see is what looks like copper rubbed off (aluminum showing?). It's only in one tiny spot about 4mm wide and only 2 strands tall. It's about 1/2 down on the coil. What would be the cause of that? The only other thing I saw was the former isn't completely closed. There's like a 2-3mm gap. Not sure if it's supposed to be like that.

[@EMFAudio]

That sounds like something was in the gap. That was the rubbing sound, and the marks left from it. The former not being closed, at least what you were seeing, is normal.

[@iamlegend81gaming]

Great video.good bass knowledge.keep bringing that bass.

[@patk2225]

why can't the voice coil be a solid piece of metal ?

[@EMFAudio]

patk2 The short answer is it would do nothing. Coils work, in it's simplest form, by reacting to a magnetic field and the windings are how that happens. The number of windings, size of the wire, and how it's wound all change things.

[@mysock351C]

The simple answer is that a solid section of metal would act as a single turn voice coil. It would have a very low impedance, and very little motive force since the magnetic field is proportional to the current x number of windings. The solid section would also suffer from large eddy currents since its not slender like a wire is, resulting in very high losses and basically it would act like a brake in a magnetic field. By using a large number of windings, the magnetic force generated is greatly increased with little eddy currents since the wire is slender, so the losses are much less. Its a bit more complicated due to things like back-EMF from the voice coil also acting as a generator as it moves, but generally there usually at least has to be many dozens of turns of wire to be effective as a voice coil.

[@SchClean]

Great video.. Very informative. What does colirub sound like? Would it cause metal fragments to be in the speaker box? I recently blew one Sub. Had More power than it can handle .I'm curious what the coil looks like. I will be my 1st time

[@EMFAudio]

It sounds like a light grinding. There is no scenario where you should have metal fragments in the box. If it's from the coil, it had a hole blown through it. Even then it shouldn't be very big pieces.

[@SchClean]

The speaker was frozen in place. I push it all the way down to look at the coil. As I was moving around I saw a piece of the coil that was definitely scratched about 2" exposing bare copper. There is also what looks like a coating of metal dust inside the magnet hole

[@SchClean]

They were not big pieces. They were silver in color and I know they weren't there when I put this sub in. 600 rms running and 800-900

[@generalporfirioggonz]

So the dust on the last coil was cause by current arching, do this is related to Brazilian amps having a really high voltage power rail?

[@EMFAudio]

The dust is smoke residue.

[@davidclark6247]

So what do you do when some immoral person sends in his burned coil for undeserved warranty work? Cheaters tend to get nasty when they get caught! I hope that fact doesn't deter you from doing what's right.

[@negativezero3107]

they do have a high power rail, a lot like the HCCA amps and others, but the cause is lack of supplied voltage to the amp i would think and possible poor filtering or boosts from the caps inside, it is not a steady voltage and is usually because people try to overpower with cheaper amps without extra batts better alts ect ect, and well cheap amps just are what they are, they are cheap for a reason.

[@ChadLetourneaurhavoc]

wgars better copper or Aluminum coils

[@christopherparis6841]

And what type of amp would you prefer to use? The Korean? The Brazilian? Or why?

[@EMFAudio]

I prefer Korean. They're stable and reliable, much cleaner too.

[@jamarmckay5514]

Which type of wire is at very best to use Like for example : aluminum, copper, gold etc

[@EMFAudio]

Copper is the best cost to performance wire. Gold would be better but outrageously expensive. Silver wire would be the absolute best, but again, outrageously expensive.

[@jkstdstang]

Great info!

[@brick2077]

Can you put some new glue on coils that are starting to burn the old off?

[@EMFAudio]

The "glue" is epoxy or lacquer. The outgassing from it is normal, it's not effecting it's ability to adhere just causing a smell or sometimes a light smoke. If it's burning off, the coil will unravel and it won't matter after that. Additionally, you'd have to cut the sub open to do anything to the coil which means you're reconing it at that point anyway.

[@brick2077]

@@EMFAudio thanks for explaining that so well.

[@MrRevocutus]

Hi, very nice. For the advice which wire material is more better for voice coil ( pure copper vs CCAW)?. Thank you please reply

[@EMFAudio]

"better" is relative. Both have their place in design.

[@MrRevocutus]

for Bass speaker (Sub-woofer)

[@EMFAudio]

@@MrRevocutus Like I said, they both have their place in design. Generally speaking, once you get into larger coils, being pure copper can have big side effects that aren't desirable because of the mass of the coil.

[@docstruthers]

Im building a sub and notice there are options for coils. obviously size but also round or flat wire, aluminum or copper, etc. It will be a 15" sub, just under 200oz magnet and i'm thinking 2.5" or 3" voice coil. Any suggestions on coil type?? How would I calculate power handling? Great, informative video btw!

[@EMFAudio]

The weight of the magnet means nothing. The coil diameter is determined by the motor, that isn't an option. There are benefits and drawbacks of various coil selections which are dependent on other factors of the motor and soft parts. Power handling you can only have starting points based on the coil diameter and length but you can't simply calculate anything because of considerations with the motor and suspension.

[@jason4547]

Is it the voice coils conductivity that sets an individual speakers impedance from the factory ?

[@EMFAudio]

Yes, the coil determines the impedance 100% of the time.

[@jason4547]

@@EMFAudio Ty... I finally found someone who's smart enough to answer that question for me.

[@EMFAudio]

@@jason4547 If you ever get the opportunity, you can see it for yourself by checking impedance of a coil that isn't installed in a speaker.

[@cheri758]

Uhh ive had pride st12 5k rms on taramps hd3k, clipped the hell put of it (clip monitor worked as vu meter lmfao) didn't even smell, no smoke, nothing, sub still fine besides being clipped like hell, now its on md8k

[@AllaboutTheWoodrows]

What’s your price on fixing a 13w7 was told $200 locally

[@EMFAudio]

I won't touch any W7's.

[@AllaboutTheWoodrows]

EMF Audio why is that jus curious and hey is what it is

[@EMFAudio]

@@AllaboutTheWoodrows They're very time consuming to do, a total pain, in addition to a lack of parts availability.

[@AllaboutTheWoodrows]

EMF Audio I feel you I’m more of a don’t care for original ect plus I’ve been curious how different one sounds on say dual 2ohms or dual 4 instead of the dual 1.5s just one them things I’ve been pondering since I got stuck with a burn coil in a sub my amp wasn’t hooked up when I bought it and it didn’t seem like it had issues everything checked fine but even though I know it can get fixed I’ve just been curious how different things would be. Switching the ohms like that

[@EMFAudio]

@@AllaboutTheWoodrows The thing is, you don't really have coil options without winding a custom coil (and even then limited) because of how the motor is. You also have to use their soft parts unless you change the basket. If you change the basket, it has to be very specific because you have to drill out a new pattern in it.

[@Jlaudiomustangs10]

I have 2 EMF ermagerd 18s from a guy in canada that had 6... he had clean power on them and the coil went on him at his first show....they all got PSI recones and I have 2 playing in my car now. It makes me wonder how the original coils went so fast. He had crossfire 8ks on them 6 of them. It would have been a beast if he didnt give up on it.

[@johnhildebrand1991]

That's why I'm a firm believer in testing what the actual power ur getting from the amp before you hook speakers up sum amp are higher or lower than thier rating

[@gcorley8938]

Yeah the image dynamics are designed for being able to take apart with having to tear the spider or surround apart. Thanks for your help

[@ganon420]

What is better the copper or aluminum coils? I know the copper should be better just based on the amps and heat it can take. But maybe there is something I am over looking with the aluminum coils.

[@EMFAudio]

Both have their place in design. Our Lowballer and Banhammer line use copper coils, the YOLO and Ermagerd line use aluminum coils. There are benefits and drawbacks of both that can be used for advantages in design.

[@ganon420]

@@EMFAudio Thanks for the fast reply but could you give a little detail on the benefit and drawbacks? Sorry to ask so much. I just find it all very interesting in the design choices.

[@EMFAudio]

@@ganon420 That is literally an entire Tech Stuff Tuesday video I have planned.

[@MadDragon75]

I need to pull my EVL from its enclosure. I've been running this 12 on that 1000.1 for a few months now and it started making a coil noise and the clip light flashes bright red at bass peaks. I don't understand. I've been monitoring the heat with an inferred thermometer and 150° occasionally is the hottest it ever got. 😐... Oh boy!

[@EMFAudio]

All of that makes sense.

[@epsoncharles4512]

What gives rms power, the coil or the magnet

[@TheXxPSYCHO]

I'm wondering how the diameter of the voice coil wire affects the sound? And if all speakers are made to the same standard Ω why do different speakers sound different?

[@ceciljones1248]

Thats a good question might have to do with xmax and the motor

[@bobinasdeparlantes..6001]

friend, what is the name of that black glue with which they make those coils.?

[@EMFAudio]

Epoxy?

[@bobinasdeparlantes..6001]

@@EMFAudio What kind of epoxy I have already tried several and nothing. I recently bought the hernon but still haven't used it. Please can you help me with that information, thank you ..

[@travisgulley2652]

If the subwoofer cone were to move in and out too far by too many inches will the coil smack the back plate of the subwoofer

[@EMFAudio]

If the design allows for it, yes. In many design cases (like when I design one) that isn't possible.

[@dsb1409]

Does a high temperature paint with the epoxy help to keep the voice coil cool? Or do coils not work well with a high temperature paint applied to them?

[@EMFAudio]

Coils aren't painted at all.

[@brianwinter1453]

One was not centered you can see the rubbing on pole. One with chunk missing. I have done that on to much excursion an losing control in full tilt. It rubs an short out

[@EMFAudio]

Rubbing on the pole doesn't mean it's not centered unless the rub goes the entire length down the former. If it's just on the bottom that's from instability at high throw, often a loading issue. You get a chunk missing from Brazilian amps like in this video.

[@brianwinter1453]

@@EMFAudio not as to off center just to much excursion. 3 inch wind height an 10 in spider with a pole piece that lost control at full excursion. Why sundown zv4 could have long excursion was due to the pyramid type pole the had.. unlike my build mine was flat an over time (and to stress no clip land beside in comp) rub the coil from no control.. but the build was 3 inch coil with a 3 inch wind height sundown zv4 cones 6 pack 10 inch stiff spiders on a tc basket. Had in a ported box tuned in 20s peaked at 29hz did a 152.7 at 29 hz on 2 dc 5k to each one wire to .5.. in all i fucking miss it.. but i always had problems with high excursion an coil rub.. when i recone a sundown I then seen my fault.... there motor peak which in term help control coil at high xmax.

[@EMFAudio]

@@brianwinter1453 It sounds like you just made it have less throw, a little more BL too.

[@brianwinter1453]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/gKvJY42YasdjmaM Here's one of the designs

[@brianwinter1453]

This was 12 hz lol kzbin.info/www/bejne/mHXVgX2XfJ2Vrqc

[@Vanillabean315]

If it plays well on one song and another song burns it up is it our fault?

[@EMFAudio]

Coils don't burn on their own just sitting there.

[@Vanillabean315]

EMF Audio You dont buy subs to let them sit there

[@EMFAudio]

Some people do, but my statement should answer your question.

[@Vanillabean315]

EMF Audio Ye no chance for manufacturing error😂

[@EMFAudio]

@@Vanillabean315 Coils burning are literally a 1 in a million manufacturing error if that's the case, and it would show itself quickly.

[@jasonlee6392]

So what’s dirty power is that under powered and clipped

[@EMFAudio]

No such thing as under powered. By the logic of what that's considered, if you don't have rated power on it, it's under powered. Turn the volume down, under powered.

[@nickolasvaughn667]

So I had a cheap SDR 15 but I have a good audio Dynamics amp with the bass knob I was playing it and I turn on one song and all of a sudden the sub started to sound like s*** sounded like the coil was coming undone but so when I went back to the box I could smell it so I took it out anyways I'm looking at the coil right now it has the regular copper coil but like you showed on the black one that has gaps it has a whole bunch of gaps like that but it's not black at all but it really don't play anymore because I had it hooked up in the house and it got worse and worse sounds like s*** basically you're saying I was overpowering it but isn't overpowering basically clipping because if you're overpowering it it's going to burn the voice coil

[@kswis]

Good stuff, I do my best to watch one of your info vids a daySo would you say copper handles heat better or worse than the aluminum?

[@EMFAudio]

Copper does handle heat better, but sometimes what it contributes to design aspects can CAUSE more heat so it ends up being a wash.

[@jefffalk8484]

How would you describe an unwound coil that is 95% still copper colored?

[@EMFAudio]

I bet I can guess the manufacturer of the sub! That's a poorly constructed coil, the adhesive used isn't sufficient for the temperatures.

[@jefffalk8484]

@@EMFAudio Unfortunately, not covered by warranty. I overpowered it but the gain was tuned with a DD-1. 1500 rms rating on the sub. Dual 1 coils wired to 2 ohm and amp is good for about 2200 rms @ 2. Had the 12s wired to 1 amp at 1 ohm previously for a little over a year. No issues. Voltage was over 13v, played for under 10 minutes (not continuously) and blew smoke. Shut it off immediately, didn't want to risk shorting out the amp. Probably not worth mentioning an actual brand name here... But I can say their one line of amps are known for overheating..... Smh. Do you offer recones?

[@EMFAudio]

@@jefffalk8484 In reality you probably had rated power or less. Not knowing what model sub it is I couldn't tell you if I could recone it but anything that isn't ours I can't build a recone for unless it's in front of me.

[@whoismarkjones9283]

Can you refurbish a coil like the one in 3:20? I have an American Bass HD that ohms out fine but I pulled the drop in and seen a coil just like this but about half as bad. No rub before I pulled it. I was originally fixing cone vibration lol

[@Bigislandguy]

Why would the spider come off the former? I have 3 subs with dual spider an inch apart. All 3 subs, the inner spider came unglued from the coil and its been playing like this for some time. I only found out because I modified my port, would this be something Covered by warranty?

[@jasonneal]

I would think with 5 or more spiders would make the sub’s efficiency very low and require way more power than what the coil can withstand.

[@EMFAudio]

Not every spider is the same stiffness so you can't go off of how many there are. 3 spiders could be as stiff as 6, but you are correct in that there is a point where you don't have enough motor force to overcome the suspension which in turn makes it so you have to apply a ton of power to make it move, to cool it. The motor and coil are factors in that together. It's a downward spiral in efficiency, from being too stiff to added heat, and repeat the cycle. There are instances where a less efficient sub can be louder because it's more efficient in the installation, which is why you'd use a bunch of spiders.

[@river86012]

How do you determine how far the voice coil should be put down in the ring at the bottom of the basket? Is there a measurement from top of coil to the spider or does the coil just pushed down where it won't go any further into the basket? TIA

[@EMFAudio]

The middle of the coil windings go in the middle of the top plate.

[@river86012]

@@EMFAudio thank you!!

[@bigvell02]

Not pissing on any brands because I see cool features etc in a bunch of quality car audio equipment. But I had friends that were trying to get me to go Brazilian - Nice products but nope (personal choice) I will stick with Korean for now. Nice video

[@Exodia]

Bigvell02 don’t you rock Brazilian now?

[@chanceanderson3085]

On a dual Coil . Would the inner Have a diagonal line all the way top to bottom about ..075 wide

[@jeroenschuuring6060]

Really. So how do the coils only rub on one end? Have you got any logica explanation for that except for the coil hanging down? What does this have to do with clipping, please explain. There's logic and there's logic, Just trying to learn here.

[@EMFAudio]

How do you mean rubbing on one end? As in top vs bottom or side vs side? Rubbing has nothing to do with clipping.

[@4strength]

Do you have an example of a defective coil?????? Or in your mind are all coils not defective??

[@EMFAudio]

A coil might be defective if it has a break in the wire as a result of fatigue with added stress from heat. There could also be a premature glue failure. I've seen it very few times, never from our own equipment.

[@JuanGabriel-nz9rq]

Can the coil still get burnt

[@christopherparis6841]

Does the thickness of the wire indicate power handling?

[@EMFAudio]

To some degree it can have some effect, but only in the sense of low impedance because of current.

[@frankrivera9083]

DO YOU GUYS STILL MAKE THE EMF AUDIO ERMAGERD'S WITH THE MAGNET SLUGS OR JUST THE SQUARE MOTORS I LOVE BOTH OF THEM AND I'M SORRY IF YOU SAID SO ALREADY BUT COULD YOU PLEASE LET ME KNOW THE PRICE OF THE MOTOR WITH THE MAGNETS AND THE SQUARE MOTORS ALSO THANK YOU FOR YOUR TIME.

[@EMFAudio]

We haven't made the v1 in 4-5 years, the v2 we aren't producing right now but may again in the future.

[@danielmoraes9637]

thanks for the vídeo, have a brand of woofer in brazil that the trail of the copper coil brakes, like a dot,only one turn of the coil, the color is like the original color, what do you think about? is a material problem? thanks in regard

[@EMFAudio]

If I understand how you are describing it is probably a material problem.

[@danielmoraes9637]

thanks! i shared a photo in google photo for you photos.app.goo.gl/0cyB3dsNP4tgwlJu2

[@EMFAudio]

That looks like it was near it's power limits and found a weak spot in the wire.

[@danielmoraes9637]

thanks for the attention my friend!

[@andydugan1911]

Nice video! I get sad when I smell burnt voicecoils.

[@jharris212]

I have been watching many videos trying to get a technical answer of what makes a speaker/subwoofer 2, 4, 8 ohm?

[@EMFAudio]

I replied to your email.

[@lilsnowycaraudio]

Is it too much when I smell the coils but only if I'm standing near the port?

[@EMFAudio]

Ideally you shouldn't be smelling them at all.

[@lilsnowycaraudio]

@@EMFAudio But is it bad for my subs If I go more then I step back from the port I stop smelling it. I hope this isn't bad for my sub.

[@lilsnowycaraudio]

@@EMFAudio And it's not clipping or distorting I got the sub yesterday

[@EMFAudio]

@@lilsnowycaraudio If it's brand new you may smell it for a little bit during the first few heat cycles, that's normal.

[@lilsnowycaraudio]

@@EMFAudio So it's not damaging the sub?

[@dhiea289]

So even if the coil turns black but no bubbles or rubbing sound, its still good?? Or still needed to re-cone???... Or i can still use the sub and supply it with the rated power it has.... Or underpower it for safety?? Because my uncle gave me a 12inch sub 1K rms 16kg heavy, and I noticed that the coil is black like charcoal, not like the brand new one that copper color, but when i test it, it's still good sounding no coil rub or what so ever...

[@andypruett5153]

I really need help here I have a skar svr 15 800 rms 1600 watt max it’s a 2 ohm sub so it’s wired to 4 ohms on a 1500 watt ssl amp the sub gets hot on the magnet but it dosent smell burnt and the amp is all the way down

[@sabarlow80]

Is there anything to the myth about black high temp epoxy being better than clear

[@EMFAudio]

Nope, it's a marketing myth.

[@iNeedDrums]

Great video! Can you tell me anything about the coil in a JL 12W3v3-4? I can see some minor black bubbling on the coil through the gaps in the basket and am thinking about trying to repair it. Is it possible to make my own coil and replace it? I am down for a challenge. Any info would be awesome!

[@EMFAudio]

No, you can not wind your own coil. I've never reconed one to know much about that coil used but JL's general design philosophy is 2 layer coils that aren't particularly long (except W7), wound on plastic formers.

[@anthonyakloo8794]

What happens the coil if my 14 volts drops below 12volts .my mtx 9500 15" smoked a lil bit but stills plays.

[@marcmathes41]

will it ruin the motor in basket ever?

[@EMFAudio]

Marc Mathes No

[@Joe-gt3ll]

My coils on my G2 Genesys 15s are starting to look a little bubbly in spots. I have smelled them a few times as well as clipped them. Is this a sign of reaching coil failure?

[@audioelectronics542]

can you tell me what is the size of wire used in these voice coils.Please

[@slantedperspective]

18 to 24 to 28 he said

[@bainmccartney685]

What is that fiberglass tape called above the coil winding that holds the glue on the spider? The stuff all over the top of the form? I remember it just as fiberglass tape but i cant find the right stuff to buy

[@mysock351C]

To me the use of the polyamide film on the "500 degree" coils is more to make up for the deficiencies of cheaper aluminum, rather than provide a better, more robust voice coil. A true high temp coil would have both polyamide insulation film and copper wire, which would equate to a much more rugged voice coil.

[@EMFAudio]

Copper wire doesn't necessarily make it more rugged. It will handle more current but it also weighs a lot more and generates more inductance, which means efficiency would suffer which in turn handles LESS power.

[@mysock351C]

@@EMFAudio The weight is a fair enough point. But the cross-sectional area must be increased to provide the same current handling capabilities, so the weight savings wont be as dramatic, but still can save about 40% over copper, maybe 50% if you decide to push it. But it has one draw back in that its much more sensitive than copper to heat, so it will blow open easier under overload. It may be easier to work, which could aid in fabrication, and also allow the use of non-circular cross-sections for different voice-coil designs to allow for the cross-section needed while still staying in the same gap width. This would be almost a necessity due to the higher eddy current losses in aluminum. This combined with the dynamic resistance will dictate how much heat it dissipates. At normal audio frequencies the series resistance will pretty much dictate that (I^2*R losses), but for some class-D amps this can be very much higher if they are sending the actual switching waveform to the coil without filtering. I will backpedal a bit and say the real advantage would be the use of a non-circular cross-section (e.g. a ribbon as shown) as this would allow for more flexibility in the form-factor (and possibly a lower overall inductance) for a given number of turns in the solenoid coil. But for a circular cross-section, the eddy current losses (and heating) are higher. With that said, there would be advantages if its done properly. Regarding the inductance wont affect efficiency at all. What it will do is make the sub harder to drive since it will be more reactive, and thus lower power outputs are achievable with a given voltage.

[@IndAudio]

Does coil wire awg effects Bl motor strength?

[@EMFAudio]

It does not, presuming the overall amount of wire is the same.

[@AnnaVannieuwenhuyse]

Your motor's strength is determines by the "flux", or the strength of the magnetic field it's creating. That rating is relatively static, and only minorly changes over time, heat or field from the coil.

[@negativezero3107]

what does make the coil better is that it is OFC not aluminum.....and the coil is not darkening the glue is

[@EMFAudio]

What happens when you burn things? It turns black. How do you burn things? Excessive heat. How do you get excessive heat? Excessive power. The glue makes it start dark, too much power makes it darker. Copper nor aluminum is a better coil, which application it's used makes it a better coil.

[@negativezero3107]

@@EMFAudio yes burning makes it darker, i thought the thing when you were talking about the black super glue Rockville claimed was funny, but i would disagree on coil material, imo aluminum is inferior to OFC due to the resistance of the material, price point of course plays a part, anyhow love your vids.

[@terik555]

what are the best coils?

[@jesse75]

JBL flat wire, not round wire.

[@chris.o]

Should you worry about a brand new subwoofer smelling?

[@EMFAudio]

"new sub smell" happens when it heats up for a few cycles. If it smells, turn it down, it should eventually stop unless you're doing something wrong.