War of the Rohirrim | Review & Lore Breakdown

[@honkhonk1715]

I didnt really take this movie as a Mary Sue one. The large majority of the time Hera gets into trouble she requires the help of someone else to sort it out. These events often happen directly because of the mistakes she makes. These mistake also come with heavy, direct or potential consequences. Some of these force her to admit that she was wrong. This doesn't come across to me as having "a PHD in being right all the time". She ends up defeating like 1 person on screen. The only thing Hera is objectionably better at than everyone else is riding. Helm made less mistakes. Yes, One being not listening to Hera's call to rally Gondor. The only reason Hera was right here was because she had insight into the situation that Helm did not. Ironically, this was a direct result from a flurry of her own previous mistakes putting many other people and herself in danger. It wasn't due to her character traits. Either way, It really wasn't the wrong decision that Helm made. The real mistake, that both characters make, was trusting Lorde Thorne who betrayed them. Again not much of a mistake as he was a trusted advisor. This is what really led to the destruction of Rohan. Every "mistake" that Helm makes was one that I find being very thought out and calculated. Not something a "absolute imbecile" does. I find most of the males in Hera's family dont make mistakes, at least dubious and idiotic ones. Would love to hear examples contrary to these ideas.

[@Swappin.Thoughts]

First of all, you keep saying Freya when I think you mean Hera. Also she wasn’t just a better rider. She’s portrayed to be a better strategist and a better fighter as well since she bested Wulf in the final battle, and she was never wrong. She never learned anything, and she’s kind of a pointless character. The story focuses on Helm Hammerhand, and yet the movie insists on turning our attention to Hera who doesn’t have much to do. It’s just not very good writing.

[@honkhonk1715]

@@Swappin.Thoughts You are correct I was typing too fast. If the main character is a woman, and defeats literally a single person in the entire film. She is a mary sue? Hera has a sword and shield compared to Wulf's dagger. This puts him at a huge disadvantage already. This also isn't a stranger but rather someone she personally and intimately knows. Contrast this with Helms absolute insane spree/montage of him soloing an entire army with his bare hands in the middle of winter with no clothes on. Heras duel is extremely mild and pales in comparison. I pointed out several times when she was wrong, and even a time where she admitted so. There are plenty more in the film. Im not sure why you wouldnt address these. I think the main reason they wouldn't put Helm as the main character is because within the entirety of his source material (two and half pages) he dies.

[@Swappin.Thoughts]

@@honkhonk1715Main characters are allowed to die in their own stories, in fact that would have improved the ending quite a bit. Helm does go on a killing spree, but most of it is off screen because the movie focuses on things that aren’t important (Hera). She didn’t have much of an advantage against Wulf considering he’s a much stronger opponent, and plays dirty. Also, Hera felt the need to put on an old dress for the battle which should give her a pretty big disadvantage. The only advantage that she would have against him is that he’s too emotional and hot-headed.

[@honkhonk1715]

@@Swappin.Thoughts Lets look at Helms achievement that happens right before Heras'. Helm was shot with10+ arrows and got sick. Then Killed 100+ armed men with his bare hands in the middle of a winter blizzard with no clothes on. He did all of this while going undetected by every person inside the castle and the enemy camp for weeks. Constantly saving the entire keep as he is single handedly stalling the entire enemy army. After being discovered by Hera, he saved her from the orcs and a troll with his bare hands. The noises alert the enemy. Helm then has to save her again from Wulf as he finds them. Helm proceeds to use his bare hands to open and close AT WILL, a CASTLE'S METAL DEFENSIVE LOCKED GATE. This is to save Hera AGAIN by helping her to escape the approaching army. Helm then proceeds (still in a blizzard with no clothes) to defeat countless other armed men. The remains of Helm are then then used to call reinforcements and save the entire keep. Contrast this with Heras following achievement, (this makes her a Mary Sue) Hera duels her childhood friend while she is equipped with a sword and shield and he has a dagger. Her opponent has also mentally deteriorated. Hera and Helm are both descendants of the Edain, or Ancient Men, who are physically stronger than the lower men of middle earth. Even compared to Aoewyn and Merry defeating the Great Witch King of Angmar (The deadliest servant of one of the most powerful beings in all of the lore). Hera's fight is really nothing special at all. Im not even sure why its worth the debate over it being Mary sue. Remember that the point of her fight wasnt to win, but to stall and by time for the people escaping the keep, and allowing reinforcements to arrive.

[@Ronydoo-yv2hs]

Mary sues is the worst in movies

[@Swappin.Thoughts]

Yeah, it was so unnecessary