'A Hope in Hell' Fight Scene | The Sandman

#TheSandman #Fight #FightScene
Based on the beloved award-winning DC comic series written by Neil Gaiman (American Gods, Coraline), THE SANDMAN is a rich, character-driven blend of myth and dark fantasy woven together over the course of ten epic chapters following Dream’s many adventures (plus a bonus episode featuring two fan-favorite stories). When THE SANDMAN, a.k.a. Dream (Tom Sturridge, Sweetbitter, Velvet Buzzsaw) - the powerful cosmic being who controls all our dreams - is unexpectedly captured and held prisoner for over a century, he must journey across different worlds and timelines to fix the chaos his absence has caused.
Developed and executive produced by Gaiman, showrunner Allan Heinberg (Wonder Woman, Grey’s Anatomy), and David S. Goyer (The Dark Knight trilogy, Man of Steel), THE SANDMAN is produced by Warner Bros. Television. The series also stars Boyd Holbrook (Narcos, In the Shadow of the Moon), Patton Oswalt (The Goldbergs, A.P. Bio), Vivienne Acheampong (The Witches).

[@hamza7033]

"What kills hope?" "Iam a minimum wage job, hope crushing, debt unfulfilling.

[@pauldon5341]

😂

[@jbradley339]

Hilarious 😂

[@solomonrorellien8634]

“Soul crushing, happiness killing, never ending”

[@jishnusagar4340]

It's lit bro😂

[@kuja5809]

Damn

[@mezmerized4lifejay654]

One of the coolest battles I’ve ever seen between deities. How else would they fight but on an unimaginable scale in the metaphysical and physical etc

[@ElSenorCarnicero]

U should see the Jibril fight in the library in no game no life

[@fishingstix610]

Wtf? You gotta be kidding this is the gayest shit ever

[@80sMoviesRule1]

Technically not deities… but still cool. If I remember correctly the comic was way different.

[@Brosky305]

It's a turn based rpg😂

[@captaincoffeecake3595]

Book battle was WAY better , worth checking out .

[@carla.n.5078]

I love how their fight is a literal fight using concepts. Especially Dream using concepts to fight concepts when he himself is a concept.

[@TheRaydiation]

But remember they also said its a game of wit so angling Lucifer to become the exact opposite of hope shakes their very foundation and hurts their resolve and their purpose of getting out of hell.

[@emotionalsupportostrich2480]

That and hope is intangible, whereas the other methods used were physical.

[@souran1321]

Because you have no taste

[@no-vt2tz]

"I am a universe, all things encompassing, all life embracing" that line hits me every time

[@luiousy7329]

And then Lucifer just casually pulls out the thing Darkseid built his entire existence seeking for 😂

[@raistlin3462]

Well, Darkseid is nowhere close to Lucifer's level.

[@TheSeldomRare]

The way he said it too Gives me chills every time Superb voice acting

[@rask004]

What power does Hell have over the damned, if they cannot dream of Heaven? One of the best Wham lines that doubles as a subtle The Reason You Suck

[@VisualEnjoyer9756]

God I loved this line so much because it's so true. How can you make someone suffer if you don't hold out the dream (and therefore HOPE) of something better over them?

[@desertsniper23]

Dead Boy Detectives actually has a character that perfectly encompasses why this works because you can actually earn your way out of Hell

[@JaviusSama]

Absolutely butchered in the show.

[@martinneiverth8401]

The Ruler of Hell was it's first prisoner.

[@zerahmot1787]

This felt like two kids saying bigger and bigger numbers till one goes “infinity” and then the other goes “infinity +1”

[@DevilMan88]

No this game takes incredible imagination. The comic fleshed it out more.

[@archmaester6594]

They're basically gods. Sure they can one-up each other but they experience everything... when Lucifer said he was a nova, Dream literally felt a star exploding in his face....

[@ecchiRhino99]

What stop them from throwing whatever is anti-life at the beginning. Do dream would insta win if he said hope? I think its a stupid way of fighting unless you assume that there are tons of rules behind that are beyond human understanding.

[@milklover2830]

@@ecchiRhino99 hope wouldn't beat a direwolf

[@lhenn4721]

​@ecchiRhino99 If Lucifer starts with anti life, then Dream can just continue with the Univers, all live embracing and then beating Lucifer on move 1. And Hope can't defeat a wolf. There's more depth that it appears when you think of it, the only rule being you probably can't repeat something already said, so you need to be careful when to use some concept. Start with death, reply with life and you win since you used death already.

[@SeanWashPhoto]

Many viewers in the comments missed the major point as to why Lucifer cannot kill hope. That is because Lucifer themself HOPE to get out of hell. If they kill hope, then they kill their DREAM of getting out of hell. It's the perfect counter to anything Lucifer could throw at Dream because it would be a massive self-inflicted wound.

[@TheCursedCat1927]

There's another reason as well. In the DC Comics - which The Sandman is a part of - Lucifer is also described as the Lightbringer, which is another way to say "the bringer of hope." Lucifer can't kill hope because they were meant to bring it to all living beings - hope is just a part of their primordial nature. So Lucifer would not only have to destory their own dreams, but also a part of themself.

[@TheRaydiation]

it's not just a battle of concepts that kill each other its a battle of wits and one angle is making them use a concept they are opposed to that whittles down their resolve and thus quit the game thus losing.

[@DevilMan88]

"The curtain was blue because he was depressed." Neil Gaiman was simply saying that nothing can defeat hope. In the comic Lucifer wasn't even who Dream battled in He'll.

[@TheKueiJin]

​@@DevilMan88check the credits of the series. Check who wrote it.

[@michellepreston9799]

​@@TheCursedCat1927reminds me of that tune Lucifer son of the morning I'm gonna chase your dreams away.

[@JoshSweetvale]

Reminder: This series has some DC cosmology. Hope is an element of light. And Anti-life is the black void of all light.

[@woodrobin]

Dream is Dream. He's not the god Morpheus, or the body he's walking around in. He is every dream of everyone everywhere, and all dreams are of him and from him. His library contains every book anyone has ever conceived of writing, but never completed. Even imagination and daydreams are his domain. What he's threatening to do to Lucifer if they don't back off is remove the ability of every fallen angel, *including* Lucifer, to dream of or imagine Heaven and their former glory. That's why Lucifer flinches away at Dream's threat. He's also threatening to remove the ability of the damned in Hell to dream of Heaven, which is to say they would not be able to conceive of anything better than the Hell they're in. If they can't imagine a better world, any torment is just the status quo. It removes most of their ability to torture the damned if they think they're in the best of all possible worlds.

[@caniblmolstr452]

You don't need to be so textbook like in this interpretation... What Morpheus alkudes to is simple. All he is threatening is Lucifer's dream - of going back to Heaven one day

[@Kaisforeignadventures]

I am....student loan debt. Money consuming, poverty inducing, dream crushing.....

[@TheKueiJin]

And there shall always be hope. Hope that your account does not veer in the red. Hope that your job offers you a raise to prosper. Hope that your life has a meaningful course. Hope that everything ends as cleanly as possible.

[@Kaisforeignadventures]

@@TheKueiJin very true!

[@othellorucker8107]

😂😂😂😂😂

[@shanemitchell477]

Then you should have went into a trade like plumbing, electrician, heating and cooling. Myself I was the explosives engineer in an underground mine making 140000 a year 13 years ago, and 90000 the 10 years before that. I qualified on every job they had and could run any machine. I only had 2 years of college.

[@Kaisforeignadventures]

@@shanemitchell477 You really can't take a joke can you? I don't have student loan debt.

[@zenmetsuzogo4005]

After the bacterium, I thought Dream would say “I am an antibiotic. All deleting of microorganisms.”

[@theweedmastah2061]

Fun fact: As Lucifer is describing himself what he is. A wolf, A snake, a pestilence of life, a nova of cremation, the beast of judgement: anti - life darkness at the end of time.

[@jonedavila5954]

Quite the opposite, that last line by dream was actually Lucifer. The "light bringer" was meant to represent hope and for Lucifer to defeat hope would be for him to admit defeat. So she just refuses to continue playing all together.

[@Belthazar1113]

@@jonedavila5954 Give him his Helmet!

[@MegaAshfire]

I think it’s more like lucifer hopes to escape gods prison, so to accept that hope is beatable means to resign to his/her fate.

[@Yaratoma]

It works on many levels, it is also the plot of Overture tbh

[@caniblmolstr452]

​@@MegaAshfirethat's the true answer

[@zaxbitterzen2178]

I love how much in abject denial Lucifer is about their situation. They're constantly and rather childishly dealing in absolutes when they know the universe doesn't run on them.

[@anxioussamurai9017]

"True hope is swift and flies with swallow wings. Of Kings it makes Gods and meaner creatures Kings." - Shakespeare.

[@TekReacts]

Lucifers one shot at taking Heaven is Hope... Even Lucifer knew that there wasn't a trump card after that

[@oklafornia3643]

There was an answer to hope but Dream cornered Lucifer into being unable to say it. What beats hope is Judgement - hope crushing, freedom ending. Lucifer couldn't say that out loud because it would mean that God's judgement of Lucifer successfully crushed all of his hope at being loved again, so he conceded the battle rather than being forced to admit that.

[@misspurpleswan]

Dream's voice is my current obsession.. Tom sturridge is stunning!!

[@toddsikes7292]

my favorite comment on hope comes from the comic fables. " never forget, hope fights for both sides."

[@Skeloric]

That last bit about Dream having no power in Hell. He concedes yet also threatens to withdraw the gift of dreams from Hell. Which would be utter disaster for Hell. Hope is the seed, and a dream is its fruit. That threat is how he leaves ... unharmed and unopposed.

[@akgonen60]

this is hands down the greatest fight scene i ever scene between too god it was soo clever and interesting it was like a battle of the minds i rewinded it twice to watch it ... that HOPE LIne that DREAM therew at her in the end was BEYOND EPIC and when lucifer decided for him not to leavae and the DREAM saying "WHAT kind of POWER would hell even have if no won can dream heaven ? wow what a line ....that got me speechless such a awesome scene mad props to the writers

[@BC-vg3zf]

Yes and Lucifer would lose any hope of over throwing god ……or dream of it

[@AsisSamsuhang]

you know if dream removes everybody of the dream and hope we would all be straight going to hell and lucifer would have to fight everybody to stay as ruler of hell. that's why Dreams threat was surreal to lucifer.

[@tonykunz5982]

This scene was mind blowing with the scale of how quickly they escalated it to best the other. Dream certainly knew he would most likely barely escape with his life, if he didn’t lead Satan on to stick with the focus of ‘force’ as their move, before jumping to the theoretical meaning of existence. Well played

[@phantomstar1248]

“Well Lightbringer, it’s your move, what is it that kills hope?” She can’t say the answer because if she becomes reality, then she loses that small hope that one day she could return to heaven.

[@LoreFriendlyMusic]

I don't get this take. If Lucifer says reality, then Lucifer becomes one with creation, is what I would take away from it. And since lucifer is the very symbol of separation from reality (the father of lies) Lucifer would quite litterally sieze to exist and return to (become one with) God. That's why Lucifer won't say it. Not because Lucifer hopes to return to heaven. Lucifer doesn't want to. Lucifer would rather reign in hell than serve in heaven.

[@phantomstar1248]

@@LoreFriendlyMusic that’s a interesting take, the reason I still believe reality is the correct answer is the face she made when Morpheus brought up what if nobody could dream about heaven? I think that version of Lucifer, despite knowing what they did, still often dreams about being up in heaven again, maybe not as a servant of God but just being there. When somebody is in jail, even if they run the jail, they will often think about home. If she became reality, that would shatter all the hope she has of returning to heaven, and even for the Devil, that’s the one thing that she has left, the only thing. That’s at least how I look at it, and I see it as something truly special. The way the battle was fought and the way the battle was won. Morpheus, went with the universe and She went with the death with the universe, only thing would to be the concept of hope. ((It’s just my opinion, I watched that fight quite a few times and that’s all I got from it. Not trying to change your mind or saying your view is wrong.))

[@isaac15752]

@@LoreFriendlyMusicno, if lucifer says reality, then he is bound to hell, cus that is his current reality

[@LoreFriendlyMusic]

@@isaac15752 He is bound to hell. That is his current reality. I don't think reality really kills hope in the first place. Hope might not necessarily be at odds with it.

[@inthedeadhours]

This is one of those games of rock paper scissors that gets out of hand after some asshole calls lava.

[@EmperorMatticusII]

I am a HUMAN. Full of hope, blessed with courage. No fear to be found, all faith to be had. AND I, WILL, NOT, FAIL.

[@JaritzaFlores94]

The Sandman is my favorite hyperfixation! Dream is one of my favorites in the comic series!

[@Ravenishish]

Destruction, though you don't see much of him, is my favourite

[@JaritzaFlores94]

@@Ravenishish Cool choice!

[@Ravenishish]

Oh, also, if The Sandman is a hyperfixation, you might want to check out the game/visual novel Harmony: The Fall of Reverie. Heavy Sandman vibes.

[@JaritzaFlores94]

@@Ravenishish Ok, I'll check it out!

[@user-bs3jl5hx8k]

Their voice is so deep it can run through my bones

[@yerossyle]

Such amazing dialogue. Carefully crafted.

[@scottydawg1234567]

[Devil Went Down to Georgia plays in the distance]

[@samuelspurlock727]

hell, the hopelessness at the end of life, the enteral prison of suffering, the one place hope can never touch, and I think at some level the Lightbringer knows that but would never admit to it, less despair takes them.

[@Inna.Eroshina]

Love it! ❤️

[@leoh1191]

I actually preferred the graphic novel version...Dream is surrounded by the angry minions of hell. He utters the line about dreams in hell.. And the crowd immediately backs away and allows him safe passage

[@mathiasamoasi989]

Best battle in any movie

[@12334ttqtqt]

For even the devil still dreams of Heaven... Can't hope.

[@ohajurudillion]

Hope is sometimes just a consolation we offer ourselves

[@calgaryhockey6991]

Dream: “I am Lucifer, king of hell”. Lucifer: “Yeah, I’ll give you this one…”

[@kingegenisuobai4300]

This is just brilliant ❤

[@thomasallen7799]

A nice reference to Superman and Darkseid.

[@jpy6296]

Gaiman's a genius. Even the choice of moves are in sync with the entity...lucifer choosing rabidness/ aggression (wolf), venom (serpent), decay (bacterium), destruction (nova) and nothingness vs. Dream's nobility (huntsman), glory (eagle), nurture/ nature (world), eternity (universe) and ultimately...hope. ❤❤❤

[@carlosbukros9620]

even in the darkest days of our lives we still hope for tomorrow why you think is that

[@akki942200]

I wish I wrote this scene. So beautifully poetic and perfect! ❤ Kudos to the writer who wrote this scene ❤

[@TheFilipeAraujo]

Kudos to Neil Gaiman. Is almost 1:1 from the comics.

[@andrewpjjuuko1737]

One of the best battle of deities I've encountered since Susan Cooper's 'The Dark is Rising' novel.

[@mycatzluvme2]

I like this show, I wish they would put more episodes on! It says that they are coming but it has said that for over a year now!!

[@Anon26535]

They wanted to do the Hellfire Club scene from the comic, but they didn't want to pay Squirrel Nut Zippers royalties for the only possible soundtrack for it.

[@ShinoShaw]

Pretty damn awesome that they got Gwendoline Christie to play Lucifer. We've had two great actors (Tom Ellis) portraying the same character (albeit elsewhere versions).

[@spamuel98]

If this were released more recently, I'd be excited at maybe getting a season 2. Oh well, still an awesome scene.

[@c342thedroid2]

It’s funny how Lucifer says Dream has no power when just a minute earlier he’s called light bringer, and yet there’s no light he can bring, give or perceive but that which Dream let’s him dream of. It’s even more powerful when and because the skies lit just before and illuminated hell.

[@RobertLedes]

When he says Hope, he’s referring to God. At the beginning of the episode, Dreams states to his crow that “saving only the Creator, Lucifer is perhaps the most powerful being there is” So in fact, the entire fight is a conceptualization in different shapes of what we have assimilate as good and evil. Since at last, it was Lucifer who lost the battle against God, Dream says hope because he knows God is Hope, which is also, the only entity that has won before against Lucifer. Lucifer knows that God/Hope cannot be killed, that’s why he stops fighting and gives Dream his helmet. Now you know.

[@archmaester6594]

Not really... in this game they experience everything the other said. Dream had to be strong enough to survive a nova exploding in his face. However, Lucifer experience hope perhaps for the first time in centuries... and he cannot get destroy that hope because its all he has to escaping Hell

[@opondecordelia8707]

You're wrong terribly wrong

[@wrangchops]

Lucifer hopes to defeat god and gain entry to heaven. All demons hope to leave ever lasting torment and to also make it to heaven. What power does hell have if they cannot dream of hope?

[@Literarydilettante]

Forget everything else. This show had the best representation of a male friendship ever.

[@user-bs3jl5hx8k]

Hope can be beaten with despair but if lucifer decided to use that that's means he agreed he will never beat God and never obtained heaven So, magnificent

[@egortasa240]

I am a failure, squashing all hope. - I am the dot at the end of the sentence. - I am the ignorance, that forgets the dot - I am the truth, that perserveres the ignorance - I am the observer, who missess the truth etc, etc, etc - then I am etc

[@samiadjifalahanifranggagan449]

feels like toddlers fighting, shouting out characters.

[@VictorHugo-ql1fj]

"Qual poder o inferno teria se aqueles que estão aqui presos não pudessem sonhar com o céu?"

[@azziedan3031]

People see a great movie scene here but as for me I see something much more deeper and subliminal. They both use the power of “I AM” and as shown here in the scene. So anything they say after saying “I AM” they become it. Is t that true for the spiritual too because whatever we cast out in the universe same is sure to manifest itself in this realm as reality. I am aware that most won’t see what I’m saying and probably make fun of what I say or even say I’m looking too deep but idc. What we know as reality is only a fabricated narrative intentionally created to make us docile and stop us from evolving understanding who we are.

[@squee-el168]

Love the DC connection by dropping that Anti Life

[@shanecovey8680]

This looks pretty cool. Maybe I'll watch it some day.

[@kennymackie3191]

This was sl weiiirdd . First watching it , am like ' come on dream ! Put them hands up '

[@Ezees23]

As a stand-in for hope, he could have said: "I am fuckit - b/c we're doin' it anyway"... LOL.....

[@givine]

Made it sound like Star Wars with “Hope”

[@uryuu7758]

Imagine if allll the humans only dream of heaven. I'm thinking it could make hell a forgotten realm.

[@mariomacpui4416]

The writers didn't know how to use metaphors in this scene. It could've been a battle of wits instead of "im bigger than you"

[@gavinburke2572]

Knew nothing about this show going into it v pleasantly surprised though I see loads saying its not accurate to the source material, not my dream etc. Still all works IMO this was a standout scene

[@grandtheftaudio6386]

which is all moot when you consider the guy who created the comics also had a VERY heavy hand in the creation of this show. From the people cast in their respective roles, to certain scenes such as this one written specifically by Gaiman himself. People just like to piss and moan about everything on the internet.

[@christopheraustin5915]

I forgot that this was so engrossed in DC lore that Antilife was referenced

[@adandavila5153]

I am cobra kai... Because..cobra kai never dies...

[@kkav4586]

I love that to escape bacteria, Dream seems to understand Lucifer's stradegy. And decides to become something bigger. Something you can't turn ill or kill. But what you can destroy- he is just seeing if Lucifer would be willing to do it. And Lucifer is. But at the end, when Dream says hope- something you can destroy or take away. But only if you youself don't believe in it or don't need it. To kill it is to say that the game has ended for both of them- that there is no hope for anyone. And Lucifer can't do that for himself.

[@jacquesmassard9226]

Some under rated use of dcu cosmology all over this series.

[@peterlang777]

i am despair . hope crushing. the promises left unfulfilled. eternal malaise (windows 11)

[@kelvinbrancalhao652]

if he says depression, figth is over

[@osvaldokim9768]

Sandman: im hope, what kills hope? Lucifer: im the people of venezuela

[@MB_Gaminggg]

Hoping for season 2

[@abelingaw5070]

Dream: Greetings Lucifer, and to you Mazikeen of the Lillim. Lucifer: So Dream, tell me. What is it that you desire? Dream: Sorry, but I think I'm in the wrong hell. Mazikeen: You meant club right? You're in the wrong club.

[@samrubenabraham6979]

And I am Lord Vader, the undefeatable Sith Lord... The ultimate weilder of the Force, the terror of the Jedi...

[@lagomorphcavy6132]

Obviously they never met the Philippine Government. Certianly kills all hope.

[@christopherchuauhang4829]

Dream destroyed Satan at the end lmao

[@FLAMETHROWER299]

Lucifer could have said i am doubt

[@akgonen60]

thats a good one ...... ddoubt ? i would have never thought of that

[@LoreFriendlyMusic]

Then Dream could have said "I am certainty, sound, proven, beyond all doubt."

[@JeMangeLaPoubelle]

@@LoreFriendlyMusic "I am despair. Certain only of darkness & the inevitable fall."

[@LoreFriendlyMusic]

@@JeMangeLaPoubelle"I am dark humor, despair releaving, gladness inducing."

[@oceanberserker]

​@@JeMangeLaPoubelle"I am Love. All - Enduring. Truth - Exalting. Ever - Patient. Slow to Anger. Kindness - Embracing. Disdaining of Envy. Uncaring of Boast. Greatest of the Three."

[@thomas00129]

what a jawline

[@darkvampx]

Can they re-challenge each other? Or do they have to use different moves or what if they have the same?

[@Belthazar1113]

You can play the game again, but no one would use the same moves again, because the winner would just follow the same counters to win.

[@abelingaw5070]

@@Belthazar1113 No they won't, Dream already won and got his item back. He has no more to fight for in there.

[@gek1915]

Hope

[@DavidGonzalez-zl3dz]

This makes me wonder if Darkseid is doomed to fail. According to the Endless, Antilife can be surpassed by hope

[@numbers93]

Kinda reminds me of the word duel in No Game No Life ahahaha

[@musashim86]

Il Giuoco delle Perle di Vetro -

[@danielanguiano4635]

1:54 I am The Anti-Life Equation

[@enviritas9498]

Lucifer: I am Anti-Life Darkseid:

[@nandhumahendran330]

Ep ??

[@Youarenotme01374]

Darkside : someone said anti life ?

[@jamesshiflett1618]

Did it occur to either of them to say, "I am... rubber. And you are... glue."?

[@hihi2229]

What can survive the anti-life? The anti-anti- life

[@Tomey33]

I'm going

[@Saul_Goodman_Criminal_Lawyer]

I'm wolverine, Jean Simping, third wheeling 5 feet 3 inches shorting

[@drewskerdu6336]

So what's to stop every game from escalating straight to anti-life and hope?

[@greghort3929]

Only God can kill hope, so Lucifer cannot say, "I am God."

[@gek1915]

No God can kill hope

[@teamvlcn6820]

Honestly, while God and Lucifer are more conventionally powerful than the Endless, even they can't destroy them entirely. God had a 'Dream' and a 'Desire' to create the universe, which led to 'Death', 'Destiny', and 'Destruction'. And Destruction will lead to 'Despair'.

[@isaac15752]

lucifer, cannot kill hope because, killing hope is a hope in itself, therefore its a self afflicting move it cannot do. the last sentence in the video explains, when said if dream has any power in hell

[@oceanberserker]

How can that be? When Hope is one third of God?

[@mahaffer71]

@@isaac15752 What kills hope? Answer is Determination. Determination in being firm in your purpose and resoluteness regardless of the outcome. Determination erases the reason to even have hope. When you have that you dont need hope. Not needing something means it is nothing. You know what the worst thing in Pandora's box was? It wasn't the sorrows, destruction, wars, or plagues. It was hope itself. Hope's a gamble, Hope lacks certainty, Hope drive people to madness, because you gave up. You have nothing else, no way to fight, or lean on and so hope is the cruelest one of all. We can look in our history and it was determination that made the outcomes. Be it good or bad. Destroying the others person's hope.

[@HERO-hx7ny]

"I am ................. Superman" "shit"

[@BC-vg3zf]

I am god ……your move my son

[@nhyirakev5296]

I am hope

[@mahaffer71]

@@nhyirakev5296 I am Determination. Determination in being firm in my purpose and resoluteness regardless of the outcome. Determination erases the reason to even have hope. When you have that you do not need hope. Not needing something means it is nothing.

[@Rnzzy]

I love this scene and this game but what's funny is how every game can just start with "Hope" and they automatically win 😂

[@garcia207]

Sandman: “I am Chuck Norris.” Lucifer: “You win.”

[@Humbledandelion]

He could have said justice i would believed that...

[@dougyoung4790]

Is Darkseid the Beast of Judgment?

[@WallySoto-yi8fz]

Doubt can destroy hope. She missed that which means writers did too. What can destroy doubt? SKEPTICISM! UNBREAKABLE POWER!

[@matthewweinstein9655]

I would say doubt destroys faith but not hope. Doubt destroys the expectation of action without evidence, but hope is something more. Hope is the soil from which faith blooms. But your thought does start to just scratch the surface of a really interesting meta discussion on the meanings of hope and faith and where the bright line between them lies. Though at the end of the day, that is mostly a personal question of oppinion rather than objective fact.

[@WallySoto-yi8fz]

U just answered it! Back to hope...the straight jacket in the story of life! Hopelessness arrives. Despair is in the house!

[@matthewweinstein9655]

@WallySoto-yi8fz, So let's look at that response from both inside and outside the work. On a diagetic level, I feel that wouldn't work because you'd be embodying one of the 6 eternals, which I don't believe is something that can be done. If it were possible to invoke one of the eternals, one or the other would have simply said "I am death" and it likely would have been Dream and it would have really pissed off his sister. On a meta-textual level, what does that response from Lucifer illustrate? Does it inform us that even Morningstar, the one that rebelled, the one that hoped to change things, believes redemption, forgiveness, or change is impossible? Does it mean that Lucifers' greatest tool, the manipulating the hopes of others, becomes fully useless. Or does that response "I am hopelessness" simply ensure mutual annihilation for both Lucifer and Dream?

[@Soto-]

Lucifer most likely knew the answer to counter Dream's "Hope" but, in doing that they would destroy their own hopes of one day returning to Heaven.

[@matthewweinstein9655]

@Soto- I agree with your statement, and I think you need to look beyond the personal, to a systemic level also. That same statement is applicable to any system that Lucifer uses to keep the devils of hell marching under their banner. Without hope, Lucifer loses not only their personal motivation for war against heaven but also the power structure Lucifer uses to maintain control over their subordinates. Why should any devil in hell believe anything Lucifer says if they don't have hope that rallying under the Morningstar will get them the thing the devil wants or feels they deserve.

[@zephe199]

Brienne of Tarth is a direwolf? The Starks have rubbed off on her.

[@gideonemberson3350]

Despair kills hope

[@89Hargy]

Pointless fight. As it will allways end with hope

[@marcelnunez3231]

Name of the movie ❤