We Don't Talk About Elliot Rodger: A Response to Stefan Molyneux | Big Joel

[@BigJoel]

Below are the things I said I'd respond to in the pinned comment. Thanks again for watching my video. If you liked it, consider donating to my patreon: www.patreon.com/bigjoel Okay cool please enjoy this amazing pinned comment *Is it reasonable to interpret Elliot Rodger’s crime as a hate crime against white people?* It’s hard to even argue against a position this ridiculous. Elliot Rodger did resent white people, but he resented them from the perspective of a white supremacist who looked down on non-white people. He specifically resented white women for going with black men and not him. This was a crime transparently motivated by white supremacy, and the race of his victims does nothing to change this fact. *Is it reasonable to interpret Elliot Rodger as a leftist who took “redistribution of resources” to mean “ redistribution of women”?* No, what? Where is Stefan even getting that from? For one thing, Elliot didn’t want to “redistribute” women, he wanted to muder them and erase them from society. But more importantly, Elliot never conveyed any allegiance with leftism in his writings, nor would it make sense for him to have done that. Incels reject feminism and, at least in my experience, tend to lean toward the right. Whereas leftists want to redistribute resources because they see the lives of the poor as meaningful and worthy of protection, Elliot Rodger considered women subhuman, was obsessed with his class, and saw himself as inherently superior because of his “aristocratic breeding.” I don’t know, not really seeing the leftist influence.

[@tidiarr]

party in the usa!

[@kitwhitfield7169]

The problem with the ‘redistribution of women’ thing is that, and I know this’ll shock you new leftists out there - women aren’t a resource. Women are citizens. When you’re talking about resources, you don’t talk about distributing women, you talk about distributing TO women. Same as men.

[@datfisheboi6519]

@@kitwhitfield7169 Why would that shock anyone on the left?

[@kitwhitfield7169]

Dat Fishe Boi It wouldn’t, I was joking. Text-tone strikes again, I guess. :-)

[@RemiDobbs]

Yeah what Molyneux pushes with the redistribution thing reveals the way he looks at women moreso than it is a statement which gives us some truth about leftism. As Kit said women aren't a resource, they're sentient beings and citizens and Rodgers' manifesto isn't based on some egalitarian society but on a perspective where only some human beings can/should be treated as human.

[@stilltoomanyhats]

"it would be disrespectful to the victims to politicize the holocaust by claiming nazi ideology had anything to do with it, so let's do the common-sense non-political thing and speculate wildly about how traumatic it must have been for Hitler to have his art school application rejected... "

[@oldishandwoke-ish1181]

stilltoomanyhats Quite 😏

[@OmqSparklez]

gonna be 100% honest with you, lots of people genuinely believe this to a T, people who generally align themselves in exactly the same ways as stefan molyneux.

[@TerranPersoid725]

Oh mY GOD YOU’RE RIGHT

[@Vooblebooble]

Daaaamn

[@rebbecawitt581]

Oh god, don't make me wanna die

[@bachpham6862]

Elliot Rodger: My local Subway employee forgot to remove the pickles from my order Stefan Molyneus: StRAw oN tHe CamEl's bAck.

[@mothdoc1909]

bach pham that's not something Stefan would say, because the employee wasn't explicitly said to be a woman!

[@gurusmurf5921]

@@mothdoc1909 But they were probably poor if they worked at Subway. I'm sure poor people are partly to blame.

[@MarioRossi-sh4uk]

I am glad that some people listen to the always questionable ideas of Molyneaux and virtually nobody reads the idiot jokes you write.

[@rockawayb1tch]

I mean, don’t tell me you can’t imagine Elliot Rodger writing one or two paragraphs in his manifesto about how some female Subway employee looked at him funny when he corrected her on getting his order wrong

[@maivaiva1412]

"There's this assumption in fast food, and in society at large, I think, that everybody must like pickles. And what if you don't like pickles? Well, you have to ask. (fake laugh; next part said with weirdly angry grin) You have to ask them to remove the pickles and, frankly, they should remove those pickles because not everybody likes pickles in their sandwich! (expression grows serious) And then, and then, what if they don't? Even after you ask? That local Subway that you trusted has let you down. There is this, this highly insidious undercurrent, I'd say, of alienation."

[@darthfastball1150]

Stefan: “At one point in his life, Elliot tripped and fell. What if he tripped a lot? No one likes tripping, and I’m not saying that tripping a lot is the direct cause of his actions, but it’s definitely a straw on the camel’s back.”

[@theviewer6889]

I wonder if Stephan would take that same policy with transgender people, treat them as they want to be treated otherwise it's another straw on the camel's back.

[@The_Mighty_Fiction]

Joel: "I'm not saying it's misogyny. But it's misogyny." Two different flavors of absolute garbage. They're both picking over the ravings of a disturbed teenage boy and claiming it needs to be taken seriously because 'muh narrative.'

[@annhilator55]

@@The_Mighty_Fiction what alternative to the "narrative" would you give oh mighty centrist.

[@The_Mighty_Fiction]

@@annhilator55 Do you honestly need to be told _another_ fairytale rather than attempt to comprehend this on your own terms?

[@annhilator55]

@@The_Mighty_Fiction ah the copout route, how masterful. You know when a dude goes on about how he hates women, then attempted to murder several, then because he wasnt able to just turned his gun on anyone he wanted i'd imagine that yes misogyny is at play. The whole "mentally disturbed" thing, is a copout which puts the blame on some internal mental issue rather than the acts of a lucid individual who chose to do an act of violence.

[@sarinat3101]

"Don't use the victims as tools for your political agenda, because I'm using them for mine." -Stefan Molyneux

[@ts4gv]

Dibs

[@anybodysouthern9213]

Also annoyingly ignoring the fact that if a crime comes with a political manifesto, it is inherently political to begin with.

[@tundra4331]

Don't use the victims as a tool for politics even though that was the murderers purpose

[@sicksalt7765]

If someone insists on not bringing the politics of the shooter into the discussion, nine times out of ten it's because they share those same politics.

[@rickrolld1367]

One time out of ten is because they _are_ the shooter.

[@jessegauthier6985]

@@rickrolld1367 I don't think that's how that works lmao

[@Theo0x89]

I, too, follow the wonderful tradition of not talking about my sex drive with my mom.

[@sorryifoldcomment8596]

Well I hate to inform you of this, but there's around a 50% chance you are gonna kill a bunch of people! As long as you didn't go to summer camp...

[@cosmojenkins3020]

Clearly you wouldn't have been casted in "Back To the Future."

[@tormuse2916]

My mom gave me the "sex talk" when I was 24. It consisted of two sentences. "Use a condom. I don't care what she says." Fortunately, I didn't turn out to be a mass murderer, despite once going to camp.

[@KEvronista]

@@Odinsday are you calling theo's mom a blabbermouth? KEvron

[@Chuubii]

lol

[@squidcultist0022]

He was born Stephan: "Women are responsible for this"

[@joywolfe.]

I mean I know this is an ironic joke but the man literally said "All of the cold hearted jerks in the world came out of the vaginas of women" lmao he is beyond parody

[@stigma2936]

@Anna Dayton - His mother tried to kill him? That's explain a lot.

[@shizachan8421]

@@stigma2936 Tbh, if I was his mom, I would absolutely advocate for the right to have an abortion even after birth.

[@ifirmlydislikeeverything412]

I mean, at least one woman was responsible

[@rolfs2165]

What broke my brain was the "your dad was an asshole because your mother chose him". Like, what? So if a _nice guy_ happens to get a girlfriend, he magically transforms into an asshole that very second? Wha… how … why … Also, wouldn't that make Stefan an asshole, because some woman apparently chose him and even had a child with him?

[@mittensthemagic5519]

The problem with Stephan is that he refuses to acknowledge that it was Elliot himself who caused his own actions. Many teens face rejection, loneliness, divorce, etc. but they don't become mass murderers.

[@spennyb89]

Many men grow up in toxic environments but don't become rapists or harassers. Yet, I don't think it's unreasonable to suppose how we raise boys has an impact on their choices regarding women. The personal responsibility element can be present while also acknowledging the causal influence of social factors. Now, Molyneux is just plain wrong in what he identifies as causal factors, but wouldn't there still be causal factors worth investigating?

[@hermionestranger4964]

@@spennyb89 Yes it's worth investigating, but by actual psychiatrists, psychologists and detectives, and not by political demagogues, professional misogynists and single-digit IQ Internet comments.

[@ottojarvonnen2455]

Because they have something to lose.

[@ravedubin3983]

@@ottojarvonnen2455 No they are just sane

[@ottojarvonnen2455]

@@ravedubin3983 Keep telling that to yourself if it lets you sleep better.

[@BREADSWORD]

[OWNED] Alpha Big Joel Absolutely Destroys Stefan Molyneux With Nice Audio Quality And Cozy Sweater

[@MissMoontree]

It is a nice sweater.

[@kalehead0075]

Indeed...a very cozy sweater and A+ audio!

[@suburbanweekend]

Big Joel always is wearing a sweet ass sweater.

[@mikexstad1121]

Lol'd so hard at this

[@Darth_Bateman]

Absolutely destroys virgin Eggman.

[@DanCicala]

"It's really repulsive how people use this sort of atrocity as a way to score cheap political points. That's why, out of respect for the victims' families, I'm going to relay the killer's manifesto without a single grain of salt, vindicating his worldview at every step of the way." - Stefan Molyneux

[@joshuahitchins1897]

And making him relatable and imitatable by every lonely kid out there, as 95% of his complaints are just normal kid things.

[@timothymclean]

Hey, that's apolitical. His ideology could be anything, repeating it isn't a political act. It's a factual statement about a news event, and things can only be one thing, not two. That's why the people on the left are only making political statements and not reporting facts about the news event.

[@MidTierVillain]

Timothy McLean *-Smoothest Brain on the Internet* I truly hope you’re just being satirical, though. I hope.

[@timothymclean]

@@MidTierVillain I hoped I exaggerated and self-retorted enough to make that clear.

[@MidTierVillain]

Timothy McLean Lol touché

[@ActuallyAnanya]

He really focused on the school uniform aspect, when I just looked at the points on that slide and realised Rodger spent his early childhood here in England, where... everyone wears a school uniform. And we have a very low number of mass shootings. Now that might be because of our gun laws, but to Stefan I'm sure saying that is way too political.

[@nerdychocobo]

Well to be fair high school blazers are pretty enraging /s ((as in no blazers don't actually give me murderous intent, they were horrible tho))

[@Julianakun]

Stefan is definitely someone who says things like "You can't even say hello to women anymore" and "Well what was she wearing?"

[@Sarah-re7cg]

This is so true

[@astralseaslug546]

No he says things that are MUCH worse lol

[@cryo311]

He called a can of pasta “feminist virtue signaling” because it had supergirl on it

[@xafilmbyx]

@@cryo311what a dork

[@heinzguderian9980]

Molyneux: Women screwing bad men is the reason for all problems!! Also Molyneux: Why didn't you women screw this bad man?!?!?!?

[@piranha5506]

Heinz Guderian that’s the thing. He doesn’t think he did anything wrong.

[@PFADderERKENNTNIS]

But... but Elliot was a NICE GUY!

[@Darth_Bateman]

Now sir I do declare that this is a straw man, buT WE ARE TALKING ABOUT THE EGG MAN!!!

[@ragalyiakos]

See, the reason he says this is because to Stephan, the distinction the between a 'good' and a 'bad' man comes down to skin colour...

[@coaxill4059]

Clearly this mass murderer was only bad because no supermodels fucked him.

[@emmawachowski2587]

Molyneux has such a ridiculous amount of compassion for one person who did terrible things, and yet Molyneux has...like...no compassion for anybody else ever

[@rxbenzo3302]

That's pretty crazy huh

[@caesarspeaks]

It’s because he wants to do what Elliot did so badly. He thinks women are going to destroy the entirety of western civilisation, the same western civilisation that gives him so much privilege and income.

[@wooogie672]

Caesar Speaks don’t forget “western civilization” is a dog whistle for the whites which he considers superior

[@itsspaceboi]

@@wooogie672 Oh so there's no such thing as "western civilization" now? Is it just a dog whistle?

[@fangsabre]

@@itsspaceboi I mean.... kindof? For the vast majority of history western europe has been far from homogeneous enough to consider one single civilization. And if you consider all of europe western then it becomes even less so. It's like saying Russia and Japan are both part of Eastern Civilization. Like, fucking how? Other than them both being to the east of europe how are they anything alike.

[@BewegteBilderrahmen]

Stefan: I talk to my children about sex since before they were born. Also Stefan: Ewww, don't allow your wife/mother to have sexuality.

[@jdprettynails]

I'm surprised he even managed to create any children considering how disgusted he is by women....and their VAGINAS!

[@BewegteBilderrahmen]

@@jdprettynails his racial imperative to procreate is too strong, or whatever. But yeah, dude's a huge misogynist by even the most forgiving definitions.

[@TheMorganVEVO]

@@BewegteBilderrahmen It makes me wonder how or why some people accept their partners' extreme sentiments, even at their own expense. Maybe his wife was just desperate to be married and she doesn't really care what he thinks about anything. Who knows?

[@hexx2211]

@@TheMorganVEVO Some people internalize bigotry directed towards them. It's possible that she feels the same way about herself as her husband does about her.

[@maschaorsomething]

@@TheMorganVEVO Hm, I may be able to answer it, as I am in a similar situation. I've been in a relationship for a few months now, and he only recently told me about his sympathy for incels and their hatred for women, since he apparently used to think the exact same way as them before meeting me. I still choose to be with him, because I fell for his personality and the experiences we've been through, not his views. (It's much more complicated, but that stuff's personal and no one cares.) But! His views have been progressing and are taking a turn for the better. He even loves to watch the occasional Contrapoints video with me.

[@heavenly2k]

The fact that Stephen thinks that anti-misogyny is a political stance to take, says a lot.

[@A_C_E_R...]

He doesn't like women like at all i think he might be a virgin

[@thynErro]

I just find it ironic that Stefan says others will exploit Elliot for their own purposes and then literally exploits Elliot for his own purposes.

[@jonchilders7363]

To Stefan, it's only a bad thing if liberals do it.

[@FenixIzyuze]

Thats because Stefan isnt exploiting Elliot, he is with him. Stefan is defending Elliot, that whole video is a essay about how is not Elliot fault, but of the people around him (mostly his parents)

[@thynErro]

@@FenixIzyuze That's even worse, but I'll accept the criticism.

[@slamacat9866]

@@FenixIzyuze murder for something that isn't self-defense is always the murderers' fault, nothing from mental health to bad childhoods is a cause for murder. It can be a explantation for why they thought/acted a certain way but no one pulls the trigger but themselves. Defending or blaming others them doesn't do any good cause it takes away the blame.

[@TheRedRaccoonDog]

The one problem with your approach is that I'm like 90% sure that Stefan Molyneux doesn't view women as people.

[@iannordin5250]

He actually doesn't. His philosophy is based around the idea that all evil in the world is tied down to bad mothers who have sex with "bad men" and make bad children. He has gone onto Taylor Swift and other famous women's twitters to admonish them about having careers while begging them to settle down to produce more offspring before their "uterus' become unviable." To Molynaux women are a means of producing men. All women can be divided into good categories: women that make good mothers vs women that make bad mothers. The most important thing a woman can do is marry a good man and produce good sons.

[@TheRedRaccoonDog]

@@iannordin5250 Thank you for the summary.

[@theclubvids]

@@TheRedRaccoonDog ​ Ian Nordin You're both stupid and I don't even like Stephan.

[@oddacity5883]

@theclubvids “You’re stupid, why? No reason. Good day” What a great retort, biggest brain ever

[@mc-ps-playa5569]

Od dacity Bro look at his videos, dude is legit insane

[@aarond0623]

Stefan: "Parents should always listen to their kids." Kids: "Mom, dad, I think I may be transgender." Stefan: "Wait no not that."

[@sorryifoldcomment8596]

Hey, if you don't like school, you don't have to be apart of this school. And if you don't like the opposite gender...you don't have to be apart of this family! 🤗 Equality

[@gyz9599]

Ansa Seppalainen are you done

[@Odinsday]

Mechanical Junkie I wouldn’t wish that fate on my worst enemy.

[@dpersonal4187]

@Mechanical Junkie Thanks for trotting out your bigotry for all to see.

[@dpersonal4187]

@Mechanical Junkie Poor Stefan! So discriminated against. So downtrodden. Such a wonderful person. Bwaaaaaa.... kzbin.info/www/bejne/ooe0gH-OZtx3d8U poor white person

[@sophiabrown2493]

THANK YOU for spitting facts. Honestly as a girl I can’t count the times I’ve been ACTUALLY mistreated by men, not REJECTED but abused, manipulated, taken advantage of, sexually harassed, groped, had drinks spiked and yet I don’t have some weird hatred for all men or would ever consider harming someone? I’ll never understand the boohoo poor lil virgin mentality, anyone supporting it needs to grow up.

[@itsathing3369]

You go girl.

[@MikoyanGurevichMiG21]

A sense of nuance like these is what keeps you away from the equally just as psychotic "#killallmen" types.

[@acommenter3939]

Jesus Christ, if this ALL actually happened to you, you should consider therapy.

[@itsathing3369]

@@acommenter3939 Yeah maybe she should.

[@cam4636]

@@acommenter3939 "if." Tell me you've never listened to any woman ever without telling me you've never listened to any woman ever. This is common basic shit that everyone who is or is mistaken for female goes through.

[@jamesoblivion]

"Let's set aside the white supremacy and misogyny, and examine all the completely normal things that happened to this kid, and collect enough straws to build a...oh, I dunno, some kind of...man of straw?"

[@johnnyspin6346]

Elliot rodger was not white. He was half Asian

[@thehighwayman8776]

@@johnnyspin6346 nobody said that he was white?

[@allyli1718]

@@johnnyspin6346 don’t need to be white to be white supremacist. My family is Asian and still acts like white men are the best thing in the world sometimes. It’s astounding

[@jackkraken3888]

Nice

[@veronicavieyra4392]

He was as much white as he was asian. Half.

[@tristanneal9552]

Stefan: It's disrespectful to the victims when people [liberals] try to make political statements out of tragedies like this one. Stefan: *Proceeds to push his political agenda based on the tragedy.*

[@byronnotbryon8605]

Typically a agenda is informed by opinion.

[@Rellikan]

The political agenda is? That Hollywood is mostly filled with left-leaning people (fact) and that Elliot Rodger targetted people based on their race (fact) and gender (fact). Those are just facts. What can you refute it with?

[@byronnotbryon8605]

@@Rellikan ummm.. And none of that had anything to do with the post.. Need to work harder at changing the subject.

[@Rellikan]

@@byronnotbryon8605 Not changing the subject. Stefam was focusing on the straws that created the horrible person that is Elliot Rodger. That is not disrespectful. If you went to the original video you would find that one of the parents of the victims actually posted a thank you comment about it.

[@byronnotbryon8605]

And you missed the point that he pushed his polictical beliefs as straws after saying liberals shouldn't push their beliefs in conjunction with his manifesto.

[@reeseadams7063]

OH MY GOD THE NEW SETUP IS JUST AS SMUG AND PERFECT AS YOU SAID

[@goctagonrecovery3270]

“I know how Eliot felt and I admire him so much. Is this a bad thing?” Yes... yes it is. Get some help.

[@shinygiveaways1920]

What the fuck has he done admirably? Literally the opposite. Definition of CUCK.

[@CCROGGY]

“All it takes is one bad day” -Joker

[@ghoost8943]

​@@CCROGGY we live in a society

[@theragoooverlord5021]

No One can debunk the rodge

[@floreroafloreril1458]

@@CCROGGY There are a shit ton of people who live through pretty bad days on a near daily basis and none of them become murderers. 💀

[@ishouldhaveknown1101]

Elliot had an extremely privileged childhood. All those ‘super terrible’ experiences he described are nothing more than some unpleasant moments almost every kid has to go through. Yet guys like Stefan try so hard to portray him as some ‘poor guy’ who was terribly wronged by his parents and by society so that he basically had no other choice than to kill people. That’s an insult to the millions of people in this world who actually had terrible childhoods and were beaten, abused, neglected by their parents or by others and who still somehow managed not to go on a killing spree and hating half of the Earth’s population. But yeah, poor Elliot had to go to a camp once and random women didn’t just come up to him and sucked his dick because he bought himself some nice expensive stuff. What an injustice!!! Poor little Elliot!!!

[@theviewer6889]

@@cosmicraynullificationsqua7667 Only if they're offered good legal protection.

[@cosmicraynullificationsqua7667]

@@theviewer6889 Hookers earn enough to pay for their own protection and human trafficking would still be illegal. I know girls who have panic buttons linked to a security firm.

[@Galvion1980]

@@cosmicraynullificationsqua7667 I support decriminalization of sex work, but that wouldn't have helped in Elliot Rogers' case: He wanted to get it for FREE, because he had such an overblown sense of entitlement. And what if a sex worker turns down a guy like Rogers, because she can smell the evil on him? (A lot of pros develop a veritable Spidey-sense!) He would just have felt entitled to murder sex workers, as many assholes feel already...

[@FreddieGonza]

@@Galvion1980 I think it's not fair to distance yourself from people by saying they're evil, as if you wouldn't turn evil if we pushed some buttons on ya

[@Galvion1980]

@@FreddieGonza Yes, every action a person undertakes is a result of "buttons being pushed". Nobody bears any responsibility for their own actions. Everything is everybody else's fault. Your argument is impecable. You are very smart. Why are you so offended by me calling a murderer evil? If you assume I would commit murder if you were to "push my buttons", whatever...you're in no position to do so. Why do you have so much more sympathy for a killer than his victims? I've had a whole lot of my buttons pushed in my life (abuse, bullying, assault, you name it) and yet, I have not murdered anyone. And I didn't grow up wealthy and spoilt like Sad Boy Elliot. Wow, I must be a real saint! Or maybe I'm just a halfway decent person who understands a few baselines of human civilization, like...murder is wrong!

[@XMysticHerox]

There is a very simple reason Stefan says so many ridiculous things to deflect from Rogers ideology and that it was the motivation for the shooting. Because he almost completely shares his ideology. Of course he has to deflect.

[@timmydirtyrat6015]

I wish he would just say it, it is so obvious, he is just as extreme as those mouth breathers on incel.me and r/braincels but instead he acts like some fair centrist.

[@Elvalley]

He doesn't want to "make it political" when making it political would make his side look bad, but he's quick to blame the left and their talk of redistribution for Rodgers' entitlement. Also, like many right-leaning youtube "thinkers", he's quick to pass political talking points as "unbiased facts".

[@vice2versa]

@@timmydirtyrat6015 no he just understand that nature and psychology of women unlike you dumb fucks

[@michaelotero3909]

“I started talking to my daughter in the womb about sex.” This man is almost so absurd it’s surreal.

[@john.james.110]

*Puts face up to stomach* "Listen here, darling. When a man of sufficient means meets a woman of optimal sexual market value, they will perform an unspeakable act involving the genitalia. This will cause new life to spring forth. This life will be forever stained with the insoluble birthmark of the mother's iniquity."

[@technopoptart]

@@john.james.110 if only i could upvote this post twice

[@Caddyleadz]

When a man talks to a baby inside a mother's stomach it's absurd, when a women does it its healthy and beneficial to the child. I'm perceiving some bias in your comments.

[@technopoptart]

@@Caddyleadz only if that woman in the mother, otherwise it is just as worthless and weird an endeavor. the fetus is not capable of understanding speech and through the noisy moving body of it's mother it reasonably cannot hear much if anything. if the mother is doing it then the mother is receiving some sort of (hopefully) positive stimulation and which could conceivably be passed on to the child hormonally though to be honest that is a generous opinion. likely its no different from if someone outside of the mother spoke to the fetus which is to say it's not for the fetus' benefit so much as it is for the speaker's also molyneux is creepy and weird and the joke is that he would be no less creepy and weird to his unborn child than he would to any other female person

[@Caddyleadz]

@@technopoptart he was making a joke about making sure to talk to your children at a young age... Witch hunts should only happen in 3rd world countries. This is what passes for weird and creepy in 2019? Have you seen the freaks out there......

[@johncerasi]

Stefan takes Elliot at his word 100% of the time which is very strange. This kid was clearly emotionally erratic and had a very strange and twisted view of the world. You don't think that worldview colored the way he wrote this manifesto, Stefan?

[@ratedpending]

whenever he talks about soumaya it's just like BREAKING: raging racist misogynist didn't like an African woman that's more successful than he

[@gRinchY-op5vr]

That was my thinking when this manifesto came out, like...how much of this tripe can we REALLY take at face value??

[@Tobelia]

It definitely comes across as weird for Molyneux to sympathise with every single trivial complaint rather than dismissing it as self-centred whining. I wonder how he would have approached this if Rodger was a woman.

[@EmperorTigerstar]

Stephan Molyneux is an Olympic gold medal mental gymnast.

[@TheFiresloth]

His points always seems to fall flat on their face for me.

[@virtoerto5207]

Wait... isn't this my internet history teacher just commenting?

[@CJBetcherMolandfreak]

Virto Erto it’s always interesting to see that about half of the prominent KZbin historians are reasonable leftists and the other half jerk off to the idea of re-creating empires.

[@lanceash]

He's a pig.

[@BeastNationXIV]

Yeah...but did he win that gold medal with a broken freakin' neck? (That's a wrestling joke. Don't worry if you don't get it.) 🤣

[@LimeyLassen]

Stefan: This kid was a lone crazy person with a bad mother, don't get political about it Also Stefan: White men are being replaced and someone needs to do something about it

[@itsthatsebguy93]

I don't see the hypocrisy here. I mean i don't like Stephanie Mollynox. Elliot Roger was an Asian kid dude

[@lopez.jacinto.6726]

@@itsthatsebguy93 Really? Well there will always be those who don't want to see.

[@dinospumoni5611]

Walrus Guy those are some impressive imaginary facts you made up p.s. “white” isn’t a race or ethnic group and therefore are logically incapable of having genocide committed against them except in nation-level or culture-level subgroups independently (e.g. genocide can be committed on Norwegians, but not on “white Western people”) and that’s the least of the stupidity and lack of education in your comment... I’m not sure you said a single correct thing outside of accurately quoting the UN (just before misreading then)

[@lopez.jacinto.6726]

@Walrus Guy Well, if you don't give them job contracts how do you want immigrants to pay taxes? If they have to hide for the fear of being separated from their kids... How do you want them to pay taxes? That's hipocresy.

[@KeiKoAbyss]

@Walrus Guy Man, white people are so dramatic, calling genocide just because some people dont want to fuck them and taxes lol. White genocide is a myth my dude, no one is forcing white people not to have kids, it's just our definitions of what is "white" naturally results in the "white" population shrinking because people with only one white parent are often not considered white themselves.

[@eccentriastes6273]

I only have one nitpick with this video, which is that My Twisted World isn't, as you and most others call it, a manifesto, at least not primarily. It is first and foremost an autobiography. It's actually striking how much time he spends narrating seemingly irrelevant events and how little time spelling out an ideology or agenda. I think this is important because the reason Elliot wrote an autobiography is because _he wanted_ us to do what Molyneux does, to understand his crime in terms of his experiences and how he personally was wronged by society, to see him as a victim of circumstance. So it's very easy for Molyneux to talk about building up straws, because that's what Elliot's book itself is implicitly doing. Molyneux is just taking it at face value, which is obviously a pretty questionable way to approach a book like this.

[@abizombie90]

THANK YOU! I was thinking the exact same thing! Rodger is an unreliable narrator, period, and for Stefan to take it at face value either shows an incredible lack of forethought OR a calculated oversight to push his own agenda. I don’t know which would be worse.

[@jasonkilley]

On point

[@dellaliz1610]

This 💯 He wrote the narrative that got him to his actions, so picking through it and 1) using to find the reason for his crime and 2) taking it all at face value is isn’t exactly adding value to that conversation.

[@bangarang3810]

Apparently you have magic powers where you can read minds

[@OjoRojo40]

@@bangarang3810 Nah it's just called text analysis.

[@nienkeh301]

The idea that this guy has a daughter is frightening. Imagine being a girl and growing up with a hyper conservative, misogynist father like stefan

[@nienkeh301]

@ i'm not particularly fond of conservatism but i did say 'hyper conservative' + 'misogynist' for this purpose. I recognize that stefan is not representative of conservative people

[@drpibisback7680]

She's doubtlessly joining a large crowd throughout history.

[@cam4636]

@@malgorzatawojtys9846 Yes, we already said he's hyper conservative and misogynist.

[@TheMoistestNugget]

can we get her a relief fund or something: :(

[@heckoff7904]

Just gotta hope his weirdly positive beliefs about hands-off parenting he (maybe used to) have affect his parenting. Idk exactly what he believes anymore, but his whole thing used to be about how much he hates parents pushing onto children. That's what he got his early following from.

[@OriLOK2]

Elliot Roger: *recounts a normal developmental experience for a teenager* Stefan: Yet another straw that leads to MASS MURDER.

[@Giganfan2k1]

Theoretically he is technically correct. For as long as we have had societies we have had empty vessel sociopaths/psychopaths. If you want to understand why he did what he did look to McVay, or the Canadian dude that tried to copy Dexter. They had nothing in them so they let society fill them up. That was never enough so they killed.

[@justjess6636]

@@Giganfan2k1 They're serial killers.

[@aaronsmith1023]

This would be so pants-pissingly hilarious if it weren't actually true.

[@Caraphatash]

men like Stefan really would blame anything but maybe Elliot Rodger just hated women

[@stoutyyyy]

Sum Arbor McVeigh wasn’t a psychopath, he was an anarchist with very clear and stated motives.

[@tehgrrl]

As someone from an actually abusive household, this guys logic is infuriating

[@basedbattledroid3507]

Same

[@oldishandwoke-ish1181]

tehgrrl And insulting to real abuse survivors like yourself. "His mother woke him up early and told him he had to go to camp". Omg, what a monster! 🙄

[@alexbellington9243]

He had to go on vacation to Morroco to stay in a mansion. Can't believe the suffering he went through lol.

[@oldishandwoke-ish1181]

Alex Bellington Abuse! Abuse!

[@neilagangitlog]

Same 😩

[@daiselol]

That clip of Stefan Molyneux on race is the epitome of 'I'm not racist, _but_ ...'

[@NoProHarrie]

It's "I'm not racist, but" to the third power

[@alexsmith2910]

Absolutely.

[@Izzrules]

“...but I am an empiricist!”

[@sorryifoldcomment8596]

Thank God Elliot Rodger is at least half white! 🙄 Well, AND had pale complexion. If this was a half white/half black man I kiiinda doubt he'd be so kind. (I'm just spitballing though LOL... wouldn't want to imply ole Stephen might just be a tad racist now would I!)

[@CoryMck]

@@AnHeC decades of research that has been disproven decades ago? You're categorically wrong, sit with that.

[@n3v3rg01ngback]

“I’m an empiricist. Now I’ll indulge in a mix of confirmation bias and unsupported generalizations. Let’s get hypocritical.”

[@benb2399]

It's disrespectful to the victims to politicize this. Anyway, he did it because of liberalism

[@juicejumper]

Ah yes the racist misogynistic whackjob killed all those non-white people and women because them god damn *LIBRULS*

[@tompatterson1548]

but what if the victims explicitly ask for it?

[@rxbenzo3302]

*inceldom

[@spong2548]

YEAH GET EPICLY ROASTED LIBTARDS, LIBERALS HAYE BLACK PEOPLE RIGHT? Honestly though fuck off with these politics, if anything he was an incelble

[@thisrandomdude2880]

I always jest that the problem with the right is that they hate liberals for the wrong reasons, and Stefan is a prime example of this (Sorry to any liberal in the comments, but y'all are stinking with centrist vibes XP).

[@Manorjames]

Something: *occurs* Stefan: This is surely the fault of single moms.

[@TheMorganVEVO]

That's basically him. Lol. I remember watching one of his videos years ago in which he interviews a woman simply because she wasn't a single mom. That's literally it.. I guess it's such an accomplishment to him that it warranted a whole interview.

[@samiamrg7]

Yeah, really. The man has some serious parent complexes.

[@DB-sd3cw]

It usually is though

[@Manorjames]

Stefan, go away

[@DB-sd3cw]

@@Manorjames sorry you dont like the truth, it's just a fact that stefan fires off hard cold facts that people dont and opportunists without original thoughts like this channel simply appeal to that offended group to gain views and subscriptions.

[@Dutchwheelchair]

Stefan Molyneux blames the women. What an surprise.

[@ussishkingang7194]

ravioliandsalsiccia what are you trying to say ?

[@a.carneirozhu8104]

@ravioliandsalsiccia No. Elliot Rodger has as much of a free will as we do. The distribution of responsibility does nothing but whine; if not the parents, and in turn the society, and in turn, the cruel, cruel universe, would we all not be serial killers? Our understanding of sentience and accountability would never permit this: to believe otherwise is to attribute him to either the status of a god or subhuman.

[@a.carneirozhu8104]

@ravioliandsalsiccia Apparently women can't comment without being judged. Nice move. I'm not saying that he is not a product of his environment. I hold the belief that almost all that is human in us is nurtured and not nature; that the experiences we have are what define us. However, his murdering, his disgusting actions, should not be blamed on those around him. If they were, I'm afraid the judicial system would be quite the joke. It is not attributed on a whole to Elliot, though; his trauma, mental stability, and more than unhealthy habits can all be traced back to childhood incidents, but his actions are results of his own doing. A note: either the part I was responding to was deleted, or my sleepless nights have caught up to me, because that comment was a little bit out of place (and quite rude, sorry lol), and I honest-to-god do not remember writing or thinking about it.

[@fuckoff565]

The entire situation with Elliot Rodgers, much like every other spree killer, was a product of both nuture and nature. He was suffering from severe untreated depression, which is a common occurrence with spree killers in perticular. In almost every instance where a spree killer isn't apprehended or shot, the killer will take their own life, as that is ultimately the final goal of these types of mass murderers. They're fed up with the world and want to end it all, but take revenge against the world that they blame for their trouble in a final act of defiance. Most of what Elliot had gone through is the same ordeal hundreds of millions of kids around the world go through. Pretty much normal teenage angst and him being socially inept. He is a good example on how a privileged upbringing is ultimately meaningless if the parents have headass syndrome. His father in particular was one such case. Still, his mental fortitude was ultimately a result of nature and from an early age, if his manifesto is a credible source into his psyche, then he was always highly likely to develop mental issues. Children who show early signs on mental issues will almost always see these issues manifest in their teenage years, as the development of the brain and hormones is at its peak there. It was a circle of negligence, lacking observation of his parents, social isolation from his peers, his own highly agressive and apprehensive attitude towards people, weak mental fortitude and very possible undiagnosed behavioral disorders which caused him to commit his act. It was planned to a degree but a very impulsive and sudden decision, which is made evident by the way he executed it.

[@azarinevil]

@ravioliandsalsiccia My little sister is a psychopath.. she was born that way. We grew up in the same half-decent home and had mediocre parents. There is this idea that psychopaths and sociopaths are some how not inherently evil, well they are inherently selfish aholes with zero remorse or empathy. They will sell you a happy "I'm capable of being a reasonable person" right up until they stab you to death. They love fools who will fall for their BS blame shifting and see them as redeemable.. easy prey.

[@kathlenedaniels9401]

My childhood was similar to Eliot Rodgers, in the framework that Stephan uses here. In many ways it was much less trivial, instead of being unprepared for summer camp, I was unprepared for the many illnesses my father would face, unsure if each hospital visit would be the last time I saw him alive. My mother was cruel and abused prescription pills, buying them from people she worked with with money we didn’t have. I was isolated, homeschooled my whole life and taught a warped worldview that I learned was utterly untrue at a late age. I even found lewd pictures of my mother on my dads laptop. Somehow I didn’t turn out to be a murderer and a racist. Big Joel is absolutely correct in his assessment that Eliot Rodger is a monster of his own creation, and the thing largely responsible for eliots crimes is Eliot.

[@lukebruce5234]

You're a woman lol. You've always been liked by boys.

[@jellysecret]

@@lukebruce5234 we arent just women, were people. people who (just like you) have been liked and disliked, have been loved and hated. whoever is convincing you that we arent fully human is lying. theyre trying to make you more isolated from us, trying to use our natural instinct to tell you to fuck off as proof that we could never understand you. so please, re-evaluate the choices in your life that made THAT your first response here.

[@lukebruce5234]

@@jellysecret what the fuck are you even talking about

[@neofromthewarnerbrothersic145]

@@lukebruce5234 You really think all women are just automatically "liked by boys" for their entire lives? More importantly, you think being "liked by boys" somehow removes the trauma from all traumatic experiences? You are fucking delusional, and you sound like Eliot. Annika is right - I don't know what caused THAT to be your knee-jerk response, but it's appalling.

[@vice2versa]

What makes you think your life was anything like Elliot Rodger???? were you as severally mentally screwed up like him??? were you suicidal to the point that your life and anything you did no longer mattered??? were you severely bullied to the point you had to move schools??? did you have severe social anxiety disorder that made every single social interaction extremely painful and embarrassing???? Did you care and obsess over every detail about peoples thoughts about you to the point it caused extreme pain and hatred??? you are most likely a neurotypical person so you really shouldn't be comparing your life to Elliot Rodger just so you could make some weak attempt at a self righteous argument.

[@DreadBirate]

These people seem to think that ideology has no effect on people’s actions.

[@kseriousr]

@brandon roberts It does. The materials are there, all you need are people motivated enough to take those to the extreme. Those motivations however often comes independent of said materials. 'Oh, the west is responsible for your misery, let's go teach them a lesson.'

[@LimeyLassen]

They don't really believe that. If they did they wouldn't bother spreading their ideology. It's just an excuse they make to distract people.

[@alexsmith2910]

Facts don't care about their delusions.

[@Michael-kp4bd]

@@LimeyLassen no, most of them believe it. The inconsistency is lost in them, and the fear of the other is very intense and pathological. They don't think themselves into these positions, but they aren't faking it.

[@PalitoSelvatico]

They believe it, but they refuse to admit its THEIR ideology the one that gets people killed. So they have to invent ways to twist everything

[@qualifiedarmchaircritic]

15:30 "Damaging Female Experience" Every time I have to listen to that patronising stef-moly-drawl I am having a Damaging Male Experience

[@michaelcavanaugh971]

0noregrets0 every time stefan talks i’d like to give him a damaging male experience (ง’̀-‘́)ง

[@zachjollimore4339]

@@johannageisel5390 Stefan is the 30-50 feral hogs you need to defend your children from.

[@johannageisel5390]

@@zachjollimore4339 Yes.

[@knickknackgurl07]

@0noregrets0 got you to 666 likes. You're welcome. Hope you enjoyed this positive female experience!

[@BarrySlisk]

@@johannageisel5390 "I have impulse control, but the feeling is still there." Well, deep inside you are evil. This is also why you are a leftist. Leftist secretly love violence.

[@serpenking]

I understand the reasons for not showing his face but my goodness the thumbnail of faceless elliot rodgers is nightmarish

[@awkwardnerd.]

It's what made me click on the video

[@UltimateKyuubiFox]

It should be.

[@soyborne.bornmadeandundone1342]

I don't get it. I think he's a much better lookin dude than me. Thinner than me. Not going bald like me. I know tastes vary from person to person because of opinions and all that... But I'm apparently way smoother with the ladies lol. I think his problem is that he was a stupid asshole...

[@lumen8341]

@@soyborne.bornmadeandundone1342 he was another entitled privileged brat who whined about not getting his way. if he had just stuck it out he'd have lived a normal life, probably with all the shit he actually wanted, thanks to his money. but he was too much of a whiny bitch to stick it out. how people idolize him is beyond me. listening to his manifesto is just... ugh! SO MUCH WHINING!

[@GabrielTheMagolorMain]

Fancy Snake It was purposeful, not just because he says he won’t show his pictures or his videos, but to represent the notion of not giving any of these killers notoriety. 30-40 years ago he would have been a Manson or a Nightstalker, I do think it’s important as a society that we move away from that whenever we can. Here it’s possible. With the El Paso shooter I kept seeing people say not to give him press, not even to talk about his manifesto. That I disagree with, motives matter, we need to talk about them. I’d prefer never showing their faces or publishing their names, but there’s too much room for criticism and people wouldn’t believe who the press describes them to be, so that wouldn’t work. It’s a fine line, here it was completely doable, and I have to think it was intentionally symbolic of the thought that we shouldn’t let these people get the fame that they’re seeking, that we shouldn’t contribute to them going down as Manson’s and Ted Bundy’s.

[@anais3337]

What Stephan consistently forgets in his “analysis” is that almost all these experiences elliot describes are.... not unique. And most people that go through these things don’t end up murdering people.

[@ASMRcomic]

That bit about Stefan talking to his daughter about sex while she was still in the womb made me do a double take wtf dude...

[@jeffengel2607]

I get a little sick every time I'm reminded Molyneux has a daughter. That poor girl.

[@sorryifoldcomment8596]

@@jeffengel2607 me too. I literally forget because it's so awful. Same with Philip/Sargon of Akkad. It's like traumatic memory. My brain uncontrollably blocks it out of my consciousness to protect itself... until I'm occasionally reminded and have to vomit all over again.

[@Memetic-Info-Hazard-Handler]

Haha that's funny but you know that's not what he said We can take apart arguments without inventing comments

[@sorryifoldcomment8596]

How does Stephen Molyneux sleep at night knowing he is contributing to the destruction of our great civilization by bringing into the world such an evil and shameless creature. 🙄 For shame!

[@ASMRcomic]

​@@Memetic-Info-Hazard-Handler I'm aware that he actually meant that he was just talking to her in general, not talking specifically about sex. It's still a good example of how careless he is with his words and how creepy he is in general. Also, I'm not trying to take apart his garbage arguments, I'm just making fun of him.

[@jarmarmarn4323]

Personally I always liked the big comfy-looking couch aesthetic, but who am I to stand in the way of progress?

[@leoseling4413]

I like the new look, though. It's less comfy but... I don't know how to put it. It radiates a certain smugness.

[@pleggli]

I like the cool element

[@Mlafleur1864]

My boi big Joel going big chair instead of big couch

[@jincyquones]

I miss the days of the extremely wrinkled cream-colored bed sheet.

[@caryssonford]

I miss the days of just voice over... 😆

[@teacup4561]

The way Stefan talks about women is genuinely terrifying. There is so much hatred in his voice. I hope one day he can recover from that because as he is now I would be scared to even be in the room with him.

[@somebodyonce5976]

He's too sucked into his worldview for that. All we can hope is that his daughter grows up emotionally healthy.

[@prettyokandy230]

probably got worse since susan yeeted him from youtube :D

[@caspermcgoangle975]

Yeah me too especially since he has a daughter

[@anahata3478]

@@somebodyonce5976 I was just as deep as he part of this world of extreme hatred towards women, muslims and leftists. Nobody is beyond reach

[@primo4915]

@@caspermcgoangle975 dude what

[@thewaronrugs8493]

when Molyneux says "I'm an empiricist", you can feel just how smart he thinks this makes him sound.

[@816Godzilla]

Stefan talks about things that most kids are forced to do by their parents like some kind war crime against Elliot

[@Michael-kp4bd]

I'm all about trying improving these issues ingrained in our culture, but these things are like... the most typical growing up experience of everyone I've every known or heard about.

[@Nenona1200]

@Aaron Heych one of the biggest Men's rights advocates cites his first traumatic experience of his mother being evil was making him take diarrhea meds when he'd been having it for 2 days. They had to "wrestle it into his mouth" and he said he knew right then she was a rights-violating monster, like all women. So apparently making children take medication that keeps them from the hospital or death is also on their list of "awful things to do to a child".

[@nuriben7910]

If you read the manifesto Elliot was essentially spoiled rotten. I could never imagine having such a privileged upbringing.

[@wanderingoryx3710]

@@nuriben7910 they reaped what they sowed

[@iz2333]

He had to close his door while beating it. Never forget.

[@samkuperman9035]

“If a child is crying about not wanting to go to school, you need to take that into account. But if your child has gender dysphoria, just completely ignore it bc they’re just delusional” Anything to absolve guilt from any cishet man that commits an atrocity

[@defensivekobra3873]

Ah, i take from this comment that the wonderous stefán somehow manages to not Believe in trans people

[@samkuperman9035]

@@defensivekobra3873 Considering the rest of his political beliefs, I would be absolutely gobsmacked if he had any positive opinion on trans people

[@defensivekobra3873]

@@samkuperman9035 yeah sounds about right

[@neothepenguin1257]

@@samkuperman9035 he doesn’t believe that trans people exist

[@neothepenguin1257]

@@samkuperman9035 I checked his Wikipedia article and the only thing I found was that the independent (news paper) called him transphobic

[@mrwalkway4740]

Literally anything bad can happen anywhere in the world and stefan will immediately upload a 44 minute long video blaming women for it

[@Clawdragoons]

I don't think this is accurate. If we figured out some bad thing happening in space, he'd probably find a way to blame women for that too.

[@oof-wi7hp]

@@Clawdragoons you got me there.jpeg

[@generationofswine-ge5rw]

Molyneux lives in my country, and it makes me sick that he uses Canada as a base for his promotion of hate, especially against women, who are usually called SJWs or "feminists," immigrants, even though he is one, so non-white immigrants, and other targets of fascism. He incites violence against these targets. We had never had a mass killing in Canada before the alt right and Trump era, with it's endorsement of racism and other forms of hatred. Already we have had two mass killings, both by white men who learned their hateful right wing propaganda on line. fuck the free speech of fascists and others who obviously don't believe in free speech except for themselves. If mass killings can be prevented by banning right wing hate sites then so what? Free speech doesn't cover conspiring to murder people and destroy democracy.

[@BarrySlisk]

@@generationofswine-ge5rw "He incites violence against these targets" Example please...

[@azarinevil]

@@generationofswine-ge5rw We had a them before Trump, you must be young.. there were a bunch back in the 80's.

[@DStecks]

Conservatives when a starving black person steals from a megacorporation: "Evil! Monster! Personal responsibility!!!" Conservatives when a white man murders a whole bunch of women: "This was because his stepmom posted noods"

[@theragoooverlord5021]

Aged badly the food stores are leaving areas with those so called starving people

[@codemonster8443]

Funnily enough blaming the mom is pushing the personal responsibility on the mother.

[@theragoooverlord5021]

@@strawberrysshortestcake2781 no conservative ever said that lol.

[@whompronnie]

@@theragoooverlord5021 Whew, swing and a miss, buddy

[@theragoooverlord5021]

@@whompronnie great you finally caught on and seen the error of your ways. I'm just glad I could help.

[@robertrulebirtannia]

"Everything but Elliot Rodger is responsible for the actions of Elliot Rodger" -Stefan Moluneux, man of personal responsibility

[@kestrelraptorial689]

Except that wasn't what Stefan was saying in his presentation.

[@robertrulebirtannia]

@@kestrelraptorial689 It is what he's saying. The rest of us just blinded by Moluneux bullshiting like you

[@kestrelraptorial689]

@@robertrulebirtannia Alright, perceive things that way . . . and watch your own family descend into a downward spiral. If I look at your videos side-by-side, or one after the other, Molyneux made his arguments and defended them far better than you did.

[@ussishkingang7194]

Kestrel raptorial look at other videos also Reach out to a wider discussion You might change your mind Might not But be open headed

[@kestrelraptorial689]

@@ussishkingang7194 I'm ten steps ahead of you. I did watch other videos around the time of the event itself, some from people saying much what you said, another good commentary by PsychologyinSeattle, and some interviews with the father himself. After all that, I still say Stefan Molyneux had the best, most comprehensive insight.

[@papalosopher]

Boy oh boy, Stefan sure knows how to talk to his audience. "YES! Stefan! YES! Every single unpleasant thing that happens to me IS enormously significant."

[@johannageisel5390]

Woman: "In seventh grade, a nice boy didn't want to share his lunch with me. Since then I only choose assholes. This was just another straw on my back, together with being made to wear uncomfortable socks."

[@sptony2718]

I snubbed my toe. It isn't sprained or anything, it's just unpleasant as fuck. That's E N O R M O U S L Y S I G N I F I C A N T...

[@vlogo4371]

Someone else not immediately bending over backwards to indulge me is a straw on my back!

[@JCLegendary]

"Is enormously significant, AND justifies my bad behavior."

[@papalosopher]

@ShaddowSabbath I will think about this.

[@hlf3769]

Elliot Rodger on video: “I’m gonna kill a bunch of women because they owe me sex and won’t give it to me” Or misogynists: “why would he have done this?” Btw Stephan can be heard empathizing with Elliot, you can hear in his voice that he is referring to other people in Elliot’s life as the “other” they are the villains and Elliot is the victim to him... this is 99% of how misogynists argue, some is raped and they think “poor man who got accused of rape” All their arguments take the perspective of the rapist it’s very telling

[@curtisnoll1292]

I've never heard anyone take the position that a genuine rapist deserves sympathy

[@hlf3769]

Curtis Noll I hope you don’t mean me?

[@curtisnoll1292]

@@hlf3769 I'm addressing you if that's what you mean

[@supermutantsam1160]

@ravioliandsalsiccia Since you don’t do a good job of writing coherent sentences, I’m going to address what I can surmise. Firstly, nobody is suggesting that women are incapable of wrongdoing, just that they aren’t responsible for causing a mass murder because they wouldn’t sleep with the man who committed it. Secondly, nobody is suggesting that Stefan is personally responsible for inciting Elliot either, just that Stefan’s political ideology mirrors Elliot’s in a very apparent way, and that his attempts to depoliticize the event seems to be in an effort to distract people from that. Of course, I expect you to dismiss both of this response out of hand, because I have little faith in someone who came to these sorts of conclusions despite all reason to be very capable of meaningful self-reflection, but regardless, know that you’re wrong.

[@user-un8jx8yo7z]

You are completely warped if you think all or even people questioning why a killer would have killed people are sympathizers. Most people question things because they don't understand them and are looking for answers to explain. Very few people actually align with a killers warped perspective. People are just trying to make sense of it all. People want to know what makes murderers murder so that it can be prevented. You're are deluded to think that if someone is trying to reason why he did it from his own thoughts and perspective that they agree with him. No sane person is going to say yeah because of his sexual frustration it was fine that he murdered people or that it was justified in any way. Also your misogynist comment does not make sense. People sympathize with people who have alleged raped people because false convictions happen often enough where people worry about if the person is innocent.

[@metademetra]

"Don't politicize this...but also video games, sexual women, and every scapegoat conservative dad talking point is responsible."

[@williamchamberlain2263]

Stefan is _everyone's_ crazy uncle.

[@theyoungottoman3533]

Molyneux is, as always, a opportunist of the worst kind. The wonderful John Berger intro helped in easing into this video however.

[@RobertB0H]

I'm surprised Stefan didn't talk about Elliot Rodger's skull shape

[@soyborne.bornmadeandundone1342]

Lol agreed. Also the name of this video should be... Why Stefan is all alone in life.

[@technopoptart]

to be fair the millimeters speak for themselves

[@Otakupatriot117]

Well, Elliot Rodger was half Asian. If we're really taking the "White supremacist" route, Elliot isn't the best poster boy for it.

[@justwannafreefx9419]

@@Otakupatriot117 internalized racism 😌

[@a147aaron]

the virgin stefan molyneux vs. the chad big joel

[@caesarspeaks]

Et Tu, Aaron? I mean there’s a reason he’s called BIG Joel

[@k80_]

The virgin stefan vs the objectively hot troubadour big joel

[@xenoblad]

I'm pretty sure Stefan has a daughter, but I get the point of the post.

[@Max-nk9xg]

"Chad Big Joel" sounds like he will drop KZbin for singing Jazz in a big band.

[@a147aaron]

Anarchist Moose buddy it’s a joke

[@archermadsen2028]

Stefan: "Lets not make this political". Also Stefan: "Elliot became a murderer because of the commies".

[@re0294]

He was just desperately grasping at straws to pick out every single thing he can justify to cover up the gaps so he doesn’t have to admit that the very ideology that he SHARES with this guy led to this event

[@The-illuminated]

Your comment doesn't make sense

[@GhostyGhost7007]

@@The-illuminated It does

[@punchgod]

ASAP Çhrønøß probably means you’re a bit dumb

[@ocelotlmunoz2799]

It seems people like Stephan are so quick to remove any sort of agency from these murderers and place the blame anywhere else (read women). And the thing that gets me most about that line of thinking is that there are countless scores of people who have endured exponentially more pain and trauma and hardship than any elliot roger ever experienced and they never shot anyone. Stop coddling violent men with toxic ideologies and hold them accountable for their actions smh.

[@oldishandwoke-ish1181]

ocelotl muñoz And the so,ution to it all is .... more of the "free" market! 🤨

[@no_peace]

I agree about molyneux and his agenda The thing about "people had it harder and THEY didn't shoot anyone" is a problem though honestly. Obviously there are components of violence in how many cultures raise young men, but i mean by the same logic, lots of young men don't shoot people. There was something wrong with him, his parents maybe sucked, it was a perfect storm and there was no adequate intervention. And he should not have had access to guns in the first place. Just in terms of research, not him specifically, some people experience extreme adversity and turn out basically fine or even great because they have temperamental resilience and they have some level of support no matter how small. Really it can be almost nothing. Other people cut a swath of destruction through the world after experiencing much less adversity, because they don't have those resources to deal with it. It affects their brain and entire body. The reason this is important is that WE, as citizens, as community members, can have an effect on this, but making it seem like an individual problem will not help. It's not an individual problem. "Psychopaths" develop as kids before they ever have a chance to become someone else. That's not on them that's on the adults around them.

[@xenonsan3110]

@@no_peace there does come a point though that it's no longer society's problem and that of the individual. Yes, we can say if maybe society wasn't so based in puritan/conservative views of sex, sexual orientation, and gender roles then he wouldnt have believed what he did. If his parents or friends caught on to his beliefs and tried to help him. If someone saw that he was struggling with mental illness and helped him seek help The fact of the matter is is that he ended up committing a crime. He himself decided to do that and by blaiming it on society it doesn't excuse that fact. Basically, everyone likes to excuse their actions by blaiming it on other things instead of taking personal responsibility (I know I've done it before although I try not to) Should we as a society all try to look out for this behaviour and help those who fall into it? Yes, absolutely but not at the cost of your personal safety, mental wellbeing, and rights. I can't force these people to go to therapy or get help, I can only suggest it. And at that point, it's no longer society's fault, but theirs for refusing help

[@theash4361]

@@xenonsan3110 I'm sorry if this is a bit too nit-picky, but blaming puritan/conservative values of gender and sexuality and a lack of professional help (which he actually did receive) is a stretch in the same manner as Molyneux blaming liberalism. You're projecting your world view into this situation, which is counterproductive.

[@xenonsan3110]

@@theash4361 it's not nit picky don't worry! Of course there are a million other things that could contribute to this situation. It's not solely one person's fault or one evil in society. I just know that personally those values harmed me growing up and I had to hid my sexuality and gender among many other things. I didnt have alot of healthy relationships until recently because subconsciously I was still thinking of the gender roles projected on me growing up. Do all conservative values and puritan values affect everyone like this? No, some of them honestly are very good values to have (such as finances). I'm just offering one explanation of many :)

[@QuintonReviews]

Skateboarding was one of the straws that broke Elliot's back and made him kill ~ Stevahhan Milnousskks

[@leiram8833]

Hi dad!

[@wanderingoryx3710]

Galaxy's Edge is garbage

[@abandonedchannel281]

Wandering Oryx That’s a hot take

[@wanderingoryx3710]

@@abandonedchannel281 Quinton's degrading back into his slumpy, unshaven mess of a self is a hot take the big black beautiful JLong Bone stated in a three hour stream.

[@theinternet1424]

Lolyneueux just keeps adding them straws until it breaks the back of another camel - the purpose of his narrative. The message is basically: Just please don't blame misogyny and other ideological problems that Roger himself made evident in his own manifesto, blame everything that ever happened to him at the same time and indulge in pointless detail!

[@sym438]

"I started chatting with my daughter when she was still in her mother's womb about having sex." Imagine presenting yourself as a reasonable man and then just casually saying something so stupid in conversation as if it's reasonable. lmao

[@adamweisshaup]

"I started chatting with my daughter when she was still in her mother's womb for heavens sake" Hearing is kind of key to understanding.

[@thespiceman9367]

A good visualization of how alt-righters present themselves as correct just because they present as calm and reasonable even when saying the most abhorrent and incorrect things

[@Tobelia]

@@adamweisshaupyeah he’s saying he spoke to his kid from the earliest days… so is his suggestion that the parents didn’t ever talk to their child, and this is why he couldn’t admit his sexual fantasies to them? Apart from being bizarre that would also be false even based on the manifesto

[@booley]

One would also think that if Molyneux was honest, he would consider that Elliot Rodger may be what is called an Unreliable Narrator. Notice how everything in Elliot's life wasn't just bad but some other person's fault?

[@YokaiX]

Tbh I always just assumed that was Elliot being his usual “psychologically incapable of taking responsibility” self.

[@Somethingwithoutatrace]

悪妖怪Evil Darth YōkaiXالشر شبح It is, and by extension he becomes an Unreliable Narrator

[@The_Mighty_Fiction]

OK, so he's an unreliable narrator, _except_ when it comes to the white supremisogyny stuff which is the super-cereal product of a lucid and rational mind? Are those the _only_ parts of the Manifesto that are reliable, then?

[@breh9243]

@@The_Mighty_Fiction yes

[@coltonphillips7781]

@@The_Mighty_Fiction like everything else, those parts are his ideological conclusions he ended up at by blaming everyone else. I dont get why you're trying to reach there.

[@Rawrbagels]

Stefan: I started talking to my daughter in the womb Stefan Molyneux to his unborn daughter: "You, my daughter, are already a second class citizen as it should and always will be. You are the death of society and the scourge of man. You are destined to subjugate yourself to a man who will hit you because he loves you and your innate worth is less than his. Love you as an object!"

[@brain_apostrophe_t]

And if your husband or child turns out to be a bad person thats your fault. Not theirs, lets not even bring up how they have control over their own lives.

[@Rawrbagels]

@@brain_apostrophe_t besides the fact that your comment seems irrelevant to the point I made; That Stefan treats women as less than human. I would say all though no parent would eve be at fault they should be considered a factor. To say "parents play no factor in the way a person turns out" would be fallacious. And obviously the amount of influence parents have on their kids varies by case. But they certainly play a large roll in the development of the person typically.

[@digdug1489]

@@Rawrbagels ??? They were agreeing with you by making a satirical joke

[@marcschwartz5676]

In the context of the video, I literally pictured him loudly giving the sex talk to a pregnant belly.

[@sweetbunnybun]

no wonder his wife divorced him and he allegedly can not see his child. that's why he's crazy and guess his wife left him because he was crazy, vicious cycle.

[@entertain7us148]

knowing that Stefan has a daughter terrifies me

[@Onoesmahpie]

Wow, not surprising though. Terrible people always have at least one kid.

[@elisabethnordin]

It makes me uncomfortable too. I wonder if there isn't a grim silver lining there that he didn't have a son though. At least self-hatred won't necessarily leave to hatred unto others. I felt ill writing this though.

[@cowboysonfilm]

@@elisabethnordin i totally see your point. as sick as it is to say, i think it mirrors something like the trolley problem.

[@patiotaiza]

That poor girl

[@jameskenny8821]

I use to watch him, lucky he only had his children a few hours a week.

[@dougthedonkey1805]

Going back to this video, I think there’s a big point you missed. Stefan takes everything Elliot days as fact. He sympathizes with him more than he does the victims. He believes him and rids him of guilt by exercising each excuse Elliot makes. A rational, skeptic reader would read Elliot’s manifesto and learn more about Elliot from it than they would learn about the world. Stefan, on the other hand, seems to have learned nothing about Elliot, and instead taken the manifesto as gospel, with the goal of learning about the world from it. Needless to say, it’s disgustingly rude and abhorring to the victims. For one supposedly so obsessed with respect, he seems to not care how much he sees eye-to-eye with their murderer.

[@UndeadSlayer5]

He doesn’t look like someone who would worship him

[@thespiceman9367]

Yeah, it's obvious that Elliot was a privileged narcissist that acted like everyone was out to get him whenever something didn't go his way. The summer camp story for example is basically just "boo hoo, my parents made me go outside as a kid instead of letting me play video games inside all summer"

[@alexwyatt2911]

@@thespiceman9367 And, as was pointed out in this video, he _liked_ summer camp-just like his parents believed that he would.

[@lunaraydue1340]

As a psychology student, I do like to look at the circumstances in someone's life that could have led them to a certain point, all the different factors that could contribute to an unusual and tragic outcome. However, an important aspect that's often overlooked is that we DON'T and CAN'T know every single thing that happened in a person's life. As detailed as Elliot Roger's manifesto is, it's only a narrow, biased window into what HE thought were the things that led him to that point. It's impossible to be truly objective about yourself (and about others, for that matter) and we have no way of knowing what details were left out, made up, or warped. I haven't read the whole thing myself, but it's clear from what I have seen that much of what he mentions are things he's using for his own justification, trying to use to explain why he ended up like that even if it may be an illusory correlation. There ARE a lot of factors involved in this, certainly, but in the end it was his own decision to get involved in the ideology he did and plan out such a heinous event, not only because of the things that shaped his life, but how he reacted to them and chose to cope.

[@The_Mighty_Fiction]

^This. I've been trying to get this across for ages, that the Manifesto is just being used in a tug-of-blame between people trying to pull the whole thing over to their agenda. Question; as a psychology student, do you have any knowledge of psycho-pharmaceuticals? Rodger was apparently coming off risperidone, and I've read that withdrawal has a bunch of possible side effects, hallucinations, delusions, dissociation, suicidal mood swings and so on. I'm wondering if this might've been a factor in this and similar cases.

[@lunaraydue1340]

​@@The_Mighty_Fiction I have only limited knowledge of anti-psychotics, but it seems that Rodgers refused to take the medication he was perscribed at all, so I don't believe he would have been suffering from withdrawl effects. However, as a result of not taking the medication at all, the symptoms of what it was supposed to be treating would still be present and potentially getting worse, as they may have in his case. It's uncertain what specifically he was diagnosed with to be given this medication to my knowledge, but risperidone is used to treat mood disorders (most commonly schizophrenia, bipolar disorder, and irritability associated with autism), so we can infer his diagnosis was likely something along those lines and the symptoms of that could very likely be a contributing factor to his actions.

[@elisabethnordin]

Sure and its inherently difficult to pinpoint everything because everyone is different, exist on a spectrum and are triggered in different ways differently at any one moment. If there is an algorithm to predict behaviour, it will inevitably be individualistic and infinite due to infinite quasalities. Point is: not every behaviour is excusable just because it can be understandable.

[@xyaeiounn]

Reading the manifestos or musings of hideous criminals can have a corrosive effect on the reader. They all blame victims and use reason and logic as expedient tools. It's like holding a coloured lens up to the world and looking at the distorted image that results. John E Duncan's blog the Fifth Nail is an amazing example. If we find ourselves informed in any way though, that's a failing in our critical reading. Anders Breivik and the Columbine shooters faced the same troubles as anyone else, but chose to snap and lash out as a grab for relevance. Stefan is just a very weak version of that same hateful, warped outlook.

[@vice2versa]

@@xyaeiounn but that outlook exists for a reason.

[@nathanshlap]

Ahahaha Joel you're so sexy don't get your channel terminated ahaha

[@nekozombie]

ahaha that's exactly what I was thinking ahahaha

[@bookbook9495]

Nathan Shlapobersky, *confusion noises*

[@violet5188]

Noo Joe don't get terminated you're so sexy aha

[@kvdrr]

@@violet5188 proper format

[@anshagrawal254]

RIP Mumkey Jones

[@HylianKilljoy]

It is REALLY uncomforting to see a man like Molyneaux fall into the "nice guy" mentality. It reminds us that this doesn't just exist in online forums of young men, this mentality is in the real world and it's dangerous.

[@drpibisback7680]

This man has a wife! Not only did he fall into the nice guy trap, but he did so despite actually getting a woman to sleep with him! That's what really baffles me: it's one shitty thing to be angry because you feel entitled to sex and don't have it, but for someone to feel angry _on behalf_ of people who feel entitled to have sex and don't?

[@plaie7358]

I was an unsuccesful teenage boy just a few years before incel culture became a real thing, all we had was basic memes about nice guys, without a whole political Mysoginistic ideology backing it up. If i was born a few years later and i would definitely have been part of this big hate group cause of rejection and feeling unwanted.

[@MrKaneShadow]

If there's one thing I know for sure, it's that when someone pulls off a murder/suicide you should totally take their own word for everything that happened in their life because it's likely accurate and not sociopathic

[@thevioletbee5879]

Honestly I can take him at his word because his childhood sounds genuinely solid for the most part.

[@crewmatewillthrowthesehand7600]

the mental gymnastics of the far right astounds me to this day

[@alexsmith2910]

Facts don't care about their delusions.

[@Lrripper]

It's intentional bad faith done in order to achieve straight cis white male supremacy.

[@sorryifoldcomment8596]

Well you know what they say, reality has a liberal bias! 😂 (Of course, I wouldn't want to imply *objective truth* actually does exist and can be observed...that might sound "partisan" and I don't want to trigger any conservatives. 🙄

[@sorryifoldcomment8596]

@@Lrripper GASP 😰 I thought liberals were all about tolerating different faiths! So much for the "tolerant left" huh 😂

[@Eddbrain]

Alex Smith I’m gonna quote this comment someday, thank you :)

[@Amazatastic]

"kids wanting to be cool causes violence and bullying" "Misogyny doesn't tho"

[@Rellikan]

Who said those?

[@EC-yw5hg]

Gigajoule Candy it’s just a snappy summary of what Stefan’s video claimed.

[@Rellikan]

@@EC-yw5hg Stefan never claimed nor implied that misogyny doesn't cause violence or bullying. I watched the entire video on his channel and a lot of other videos unrelated to Elliot. The "cool" element he was talking about IS cancerous in youth culture. Who (besides those deemed 'cool') wouldn't agree with it? Fashion trends, Instagram girls, having the latest piece of technology, being able to take expensive trips etc. These are all things that are not virtuous. What is deemed "cool" is usually something superficial or sometimes an indulgence of a lack of self-control. He didn't say or imply that being uncool WILL cause one to become violent but its an age old common idea that being uncool is grounds for bullies to target you. This isn't controversial. I feel like people are making a big deal out of something Stefan said that's practically benign.

[@Noisius]

@@beepbopboop7727 and i believe Antifa are the new nazis and climate change is a cult.

[@Criszgz22]

@@no.8466 As men are gross. Everybody IS gross

[@albinocavewoman]

I suppose, it goes without saying, Stefan is disrespectful and opportunistic.

[@alexsmith2910]

Yes. Easiest upvote of my life. You've earned it.

[@darknessml6145]

@@alexsmith2910 "We don't use that word here"

[@kieranstark7213]

So is Elliot Rodger and other people/characters with "Nice Guy Syndrome" where the guys assault girls that ask for actual nice guys.

[@wanderingoryx3710]

One dollar

[@jimmypickles1123]

I greatly respect the work Stefan Molyneux has done to disprove the stereotype that people who wear glasses are smart.

[@veero7575]

I feel like one of the problems with his assessment is that he’s taking a lot of what’s in the manifesto at face value, not necessarily considering the person it’s coming from. Jumping through hoops and finding ‘straws on camels’ to justify a literal interpretation of events without considering the likelihood that the specifics of things that “happened to” Elliot Rogers by his own account are exaggerated if not outright falsified by nature of his own delusions.

[@Ddiaboloer]

Clearly done because Stefan Molyneux knows that his own political beliefs are the real cause of the violence and is using as many excuses to distract from that fact

[@adamblumenau6569]

Alt-Right demagogues can't operate in a framework that admits unreliable narrators exist, it would make what they're doing too obvious

[@Nenona1200]

Exactly, that's precisely what happened as well, there's stuff from his stepmother(Soumiya) who actively tried to help him, cooked for him, etc. At one point he writes about how she made him some "disgusting soup" which is a traditional dish in Morocco, where she's from, and not gross at all, but the way he writes it, it's like she cooked something she knew he would definitely hate to "punish him". He saw women saying they weren't interested as purposefully trying to hurt him. The words I've heard in regard to this kind of outlook is "wound collecting"--i.e. this collection of situations where they purposefully see everything they don't like, or find ways to dislike things, in order to justify an attack on people or a group of people they already don't like. He wrote what was essentially, the list of wounds he'd felt he collected, and he clearly was not a remotely liable narrator and reading through it, you cannot take his word as truth. I understand that it's how he *felt* things happened, but it clearly was not how they actually happened.

[@Yoarashi]

@Ddiaboloer Depressing as it is to contemplate, I think there's a fair chance that Molyneux genuinely doesn't comprehend that his ideology was the cause of what Rodger did - though I do agree he's certainly invested in trying to prove otherwise. I don't think people like Rodger or Molyneux have ever in their lives truly understood or even questioned the motivations behind their own words and actions, and aren't interested in doing so. It's all just knee-jerk reactions followed by rationalizations after the fact. People like that cannot/won't ever truly ask themselves whether their emotions, like a feeling of being mistreated by being made to go to school, might be unjustified. They can only infer that anything they don't enjoy inherently IS mistreatment. Likewise, Molyneux doesn't like the idea of being (held) responsible for what Rodger did, so to him that means he just simply isn't.

[@partylikeits1066]

@@Yoarashi yes, I think this is a pretty spot on description of the mindset of people like molyneaux and other far right agitators. They entirely lack self reflection or understanding

[@dinospumoni5611]

Didn’t know Molyneux was so into intersectionality.

[@LimeyLassen]

LOL

[@alexsmith2910]

I noticed that as well.

[@jeffengel2607]

It's the Dark Side of intersectionality. Easier, seductive - fear and anger get you there, etc.

[@youtubeisawebsite7484]

innersexually

[@fruitjuiceshibe]

Imagine being Stefan Molyneux's daughter.

[@oldishandwoke-ish1181]

Fruit Juice Shibe Grim.

[@NoddinOff.]

cassl14 the fuck is wrong with you?

[@NoddinOff.]

cassl14 You don’t know me, but what you said was repulsive, it’s clear what type of thought pattern you have.

[@NoddinOff.]

cassl14 You should stick with your crystals and detox cleanser playlists instead of letting your true colors unveil your twisted head.

[@NoddinOff.]

cassl14 This still doesn’t make sense about your tasteless joke or accusation, I don’t believe anyone here was implying or would go as far to claim he’s touching his own daughter in perverted ways. Just the fact you felt the need to say that shows your character. You’re saying he’s an incel as your excuse but he’s a married man, with a child. Honestly it really isn’t about whether you like him or not. you claim to be anti-abuse but your words are very powerful and can be used in abusive ways. Think about your own father, if some co-worker or unknown person was spreading false rumors about him touching you, would you take kindly to that? You can tell me to fuck off that’s fine, but just take a second to realize the scoop of your words and how they may influence others to spread false accusations.

[@Ivytheherbert]

"Please don't politicise this tragedy" usually means "political views I agree with helped to cause this tragedy".

[@enbyennui]

"Cultural M-" Broke: "-arxism" Woke: "-ystification"

[@chase9234]

Joke: "-olyneux"

[@thisrandomdude2880]

Absurd: "-ayonnaise"

[@spoderthepro6398]

Incel: anifest destiny

[@phillipsiebold8351]

Toke: alarkey

[@BeepSmile]

Art Critic: "egazord"

[@louisa9914]

if you pop enough straws on the camel, you've got yourself a strawman

[@johannageisel5390]

This deserves more upvotes.

[@johannageisel5390]

@Christopher Stanley Uhm, the straw is atop the camel. I know there are instances, when one camel is somehow on top of another, but in these instances the upper camel is more towards the rear end of the lower camel. But when you put the straw onto the camel's back, it's in the place of a human rider. Therefore, it'll form a straw man, not a straw camel. Now I wonder what straw camels might have to do with needle eyes.

[@yaeli_i_guess]

Oof. Good comment

[@-whatthefuckdidyoujustfuck3405]

This video summarized in one comment

[@dominickperez2952]

@@-whatthefuckdidyoujustfuck3405 Stefan's or Joel's?

[@LunarChaos]

He practiced self-isolation at different points in time. He had people reach out to him to be his friend, and he rejected them. How much you wanna bet he rejected some 'ugly' girl because she wasn't his 'type'. Guess who sends their kids to camp?! Parents that FUCKING work. Omg the world ends because my parent doesn't want me to sit at home unsupervised. He had a BMW, didn't have to worry about paying for college, probably would have a had a good job...PROBABLY WOULD HAVE FOUND A GF EVENTUALLY. Damn some people are late bloomers. Most people can't have a quality relationship until they are stable enough to be in one. And to say he didn't believe the stuff he said, come on bro. Thats like saying Kanye don't believe what he is saying. Its ironic that they keep repeating the same thing in different ways for years. But your not supposed to believe him. His parents should have been more responsible for him, and making sure they taught him the skills to connect with other people. Honestly i seen his videos...and he didnt have a good personality, and he chose to an ass to people. And to blanket this with his mental illness. Does a disservice to the millions of people who have mental health issues and don't kill people.

[@LunarChaos]

Most incels always scream how great they are, how much they have, how great of a catch they are..but when you look at them and their history. They do not have great PERSONALITIES, they want women to be beneath them. Most women are not going to be with feeling less than in a relationship.

[@rollinnollin546]

Molyneux’s analysis is also pretty...Freudian. Not just in the way he blames all of Eliot’s problems on his parents, but just his way of looking at anything bad in Eliot’s life and assuming that contributed to his violence. That was the issue with Freud, with any issue someone had, he could always explain it through his Oedipal framework, but he had no way of falsifying it, so he could never be proven wrong. Oedipal complex could explain literally anything. Moleneux basically does that, but without even having a theoretical framework to base his claims on.

[@HWalla23]

Don't lump uncle Sigmund in with this freak

[@rollinnollin546]

Basie Settle; I’m not saying Freud was an incel, I’m more so just repeating Karl Popper’s criticism of Freud in this context, cuz I think it applies. Popper never actually said Freuds analysis was wrong or useless, just not scientific. Molyneux fancies himself an “empiricist”, so I thinks the not-very-scientific nature of his way of thinking is important to point out.

[@hoominbeeing]

Nolan Jacobs Yes! This is why I am vehemently against psychology and other soft "sciences". They make conclusions with poor or unrelated "evidence".

[@joywolfe.]

Hoomin Beeing i mean I get your point but I wouldn't say it's enough to be "against psychology" lol

[@literallygaston2489]

Asgeir Listen, not every minor inconvenience I encounter will make me suicidal, like it should be clear what OP is talking about. I’m depressed because my chemical balance is fucked up, not because mum told me to do the dishes.

[@hayleighmiller9660]

i also feel like stefan being able to say that elliots parents forcing him to go to camp is one of the many valid reasons that elliot wanted to kill people is... worrying.

[@oldishandwoke-ish1181]

hayleigh miller My parents forced me to go to school! Where can I get a gun? Oh wait, I'm not a man....

[@Somethingwithoutatrace]

Jennifer Akdemir What ARE you then? A lizard? A ROBOT? perhaps BOTH?! Gasp

[@oldishandwoke-ish1181]

Tomato Chan Try a woman, my dear Tomato.

[@funkyskunk1]

Stefan “I think women should be punished for the men they choose to date because they never choose the nice guys😭😭😭” Molyneaux

[@tuumanka7974]

I only date prisoners because they’re such badass 😤🤤

[@Hanfgurkenhasser]

@@tuumanka7974 BRB killing some people.

[@theluckypoptart2945]

Have you ever noticed the guys that are angry women don't pick nice guys, aren't nice guys. They are always yelling angry men who talk down to women and wonder why we don't like them.

[@0lionheart]

@@theluckypoptart2945 true story, my old best mate (who's now bitter and angry at the world) once blew his chance with an incredibly attractive girl at one of our Halloween parties by ranting for about an hour about how modern music is terrible and basically how he has superior taste to everyone. If you ever talk to him about it, she was just leading him on because she liked the attention, and she ended up hooking up with some meathead because that's what women are like. Somehow forgetting that she hooked up with our other mate, who is a really nice and cool guy, not at all a "bro" or anything. It's honestly staggering watching some people absolutely self-sabotage social encounters, and then listen to how they perceive it. There's such a disconnect between reality and the world they live in. I've been friends with enough "nice guys" now to know they're anything but.

[@theluckypoptart2945]

@Black Pill Presentations no, the mix up is what nice is. Many people have issues knowing where boundaries are and what is socially appropriate behavior. I understand that. I'm autistic and there are many behaviors I don't understand why people do. I do understand we should do them though. "Nice" guys and girls think they are being nice but are often over stepping people's personal boundaries. Even when told they are making someone uncomfortable or scared they come off with you just aren't used to people being nice to you. Nice is respecting people boundaries. Nice is letting people get to know you at their own speed and not pushing. Nice is understanding that some just isn't into you for whatever reason and respecting that. Yes, I believe some people just play up their nice factor to get into someone's pants. Because why would it be love bombing at first. then when the person says no it's you're a dumb whore anyways or I didn't like your ugly ass anyways. If you're really a good person you don't have to tell everyone you're good. They know by your actions. Once these people understand boundaries, body language and respecting other people's space they usually end up in a relationship pretty quick. It's full just a lack of caring how others perceive actions and how it makes them feel. Just because you see something as nice doesn't mean it won't come off creepy to someone else.

[@radiobob1908]

Look, I had stepmom problems. I got rejected by lots of girls. I experienced shame over perfectly normal adolescent feelings. I had bad experiences at summer camp. I even went to an elementary school with too many complicated, arbitrary rules. But instead of murdering people, I went to therapy and transed my gender. Now I'm a relatively well-adjusted weirdo.

[@biggestastiest]

i feel like transing your gender does solve alot of problems unknown to you in your adolescence

[@legrandliseurtri7495]

That's the thing, none of Elliot's described life experiences are super unusual. Many people have messy and frustrating romance (in)experience when they're teenagers. Many people will have some unpleasant moments at summer camps. Many will be confused by the rigid structure of elementary school. There's nothing special about all this.,

[@MJFERMEZLA]

Am I the only one who remarks that this guy who claims to not put political agenda on the case of Elliot Rodger... does exactly that ? I mean he just says in the most political corectness way that it's because of video game and the lost of tradition like stay sexually abstinent when you have kids, anti-divorce, anti-prostition and pornography, that's conservatism, that's a political agenda.

[@anarcopablo]

Life it's a political agenda. Anyone who says otherwise is trying to push a political agenda. Usually an anti-life one.

[@neofromthewarnerbrothersic145]

Late response, but no, you're far from the only one to point this out. I've seen tons of comments saying the same thing.

[@bascal133]

And regarding his childhood Elliott was babied. literally he cried and his parents did everything that he wanted. they took him out of a bunch of schools, they bought him a car they bought him his own apartment, they bank rolled him buying lotto tickets, he traveled a lot and went to private events with the rich and famous. his parents actually were probably more involved than they should’ve been and he never really learn how to deal with normal life discomforts because they just fixed everything as soon as he cried

[@elisabethnordin]

Literally the opposite of what Stafan's strawman is postulating

[@comradebroosk9396]

Actually, the problem was the opposite. They weren't involved in his life enough. The reason they gave him those material possessions is the same reason you give a crying baby a lollypop: you don't want to address the real problems, you just want to quell its sorrow.

[@morbidsearch]

@@comradebroosk9396 That was the case with his father but OP describes his mother pretty well Soumeya was the only parent figure who tried to get him out of his comfort zone, and he pushed her away because of it

[@georgerogers2120]

Were they too involved? Were they not involved enough? I think maybe these are the wrong questions to be asking. I don't think we should go down the rabbit hole of asking "which specific elements of his upbringing made him a monster?" because plenty of people with comparable or worse upbringings don't become monsters, and plenty of people with better upbringings fall into the same traps as Rodger did. So there are pretty compelling reasons to think that whatever the quality of that family's parenting, we can't lay Rodger's behavior at their doorstep. There are systemic criticisms we can make and things that we might be able to attribute Rodger's behaviors to, but it's probably not appropriate to turn it into some sick version of the "how much/little should you hug your child" debate. As uncomfortable and fraught a topic as it is, I think we're gonna have to talk about incels.

[@bascal133]

@@georgerogers2120 I agree with you, I’m not arguing his parents are at fault I’m actually responding to Stefan Molynaux’s argument from the video that they are because they weren’t involved enough.

[@bellakonrad5952]

when u hear "i often have problems with white nationalism, HOWEVER" that's ur cue to skedaddle

[@snowdriftmoon]

Bella Konrad I AM AN E M P E R I C I S T

[@Rellikan]

You don't listen to him much do you? Stefan is right to feel vindicated about how easy it was for him to stage a talk in Poland. Racial homogeneity produces significantly less crime and a lot more community trust. Studies have been conducted about this between communities with varying racial diversity in the US. The authors have hesitated to publish their work for years trying to reach different conclusions.

[@andrewthen8998]

Gigajoule Candy when you zero into police placements, crime data and wealth in the neighborhood Americans and Europeans see a predominantly black and brown representation in crime are in part because of these over representations, but people like you must also recognize is that education and access to capital (like an iMac, or other “luxuries“) you wouldn’t see the level of crime because crime is downstream from poverty and if u really care about it you have to address it

[@andrewthen8998]

Gigajoule Candy Of course the study would say that Dumbass racism is extremely prevalent and wholly inescapable, past and present. Who’s surprised? Nobody. I bet they didn’t want to publish it because they thought if people read it they would think they were racists, a fact that is lost on the real racists who hold up that work as any kind of tangible proof of segregation or mass deportation or mass murder would be a good thing. Libertarian my ass, you’re another dumb Republican who hates the word Republican

[@Rellikan]

@@andrewthen8998 Crime is not downstream from poverty. The Appalachian Mountains, predominantly white are some of the poorest communities in the US. Their crime rates defy the notion that poverty causes or is highly correlated with crime. Crime causes poverty, not the other way around. The Scottish, the Irish, the English and the Welsh used to engage in open warfare against one another for their differences in culture and ethnicity. History has many examples were violence was applied along clear inter-racial and inter-ethnic lines. You realise the authors were left leaning. Also you are a bigot if you automatically assume someone is racist for showing facts that hurt your feelings. They would have been called racist by narrow-minded bigots like you if they had not taken the time and effort to sit and bend their conclusions in ways that avoided such rash accusations. Believe it or not some people that disagree with you are not evil tyrants. We have principles that we stand by; universal ethics that are not withdrawn for personal or political gain. Do not project your lack of principles onto to us. The Non-Aggression Principle is vehemently in direct collision of any form of violence. Mass murder is not moral and does not follow NAP. Violating people's freedom of assembly and association is not viable with NAP. Mass deportation of legal citizens and migrants through coercion or violent force is not in congruent with NAP. Initiating violence or coercion is not a part of the NAP.

[@mozata6838]

Something that didn't didn't hit me till just now is that Stefan, somehow, has no problem taking Elliot's assessments of other people at face value. Like at 15:53, he's just agreeing with the person who has a murderous view of women.

[@nisiwilli]

This guy have a daughter?...oh no, poor child

[@astoldbynickgerr]

Nissi Nisi what I was thinking!

[@JohnDoe-wj3lv]

Watch some of his videos with her. She seems happy and well adjusted

[@JohnDoe-wj3lv]

Ryan Kruse most people have the capacity to read other people based on their voice and interactions. Maybe that’s too much to ask from you

[@teraphIl1000]

Not gonna lie, I find the drunk guy in the painting relatable.

[@SophiefromMars]

Ways Of Seeing appears on screen, I hit that like button

[@Stampepaints]

Same

[@babahu15]

Into the Bergerverse

[@jalexoneschanel1356]

Unrelated but cultural mysticism is ALSO responsible for queer erasure throughout history. The Athenians viewed the portrayal of Achilles and Patroclus in the Iliad as a tragic love story, fated to end violently and much too soon. Yet centuries later, the notion that fictional heroes might have been anything other than straight is cultural mysticism at its best. They were intimate friends and battle companions, so the loss of one would surely be painful. But is it painful enough to seek violent revenge? Is it painful enough to go on a completely heterosexual rampage, seeking to destroy all even remotely aligned with the killer of a friend? A platoon-mate? A fellow soldier? Perhaps not.. but for a lover? Most people would go at least that far. Cultural mysticism requires a fundamental divorce from the reality in which the events occurred, and the fundamental assumption that every single event and slight was another step towards an outcome which is presumed to be inevitable but was in fact very much avoidable.

[@Ploskkky]

The more I learn about him, the creepier and creepier Stefan Molyneux becomes.

[@maxine3978]

Eggs

[@robertwoods8939]

I know you're creepy but what about me?

[@sugarblunt]

I feel so bad for his daughter and wife my god

[@robertwoods8939]

I feel bad for me having found big no talent joel.

[@clintwood731]

@@robertwoods8939 boohoo, want me to play the smallest violin for you?

[@tellthetruthna8523]

His wife is an adult who should know better. She enables him at the expense of her own daughter. Pretty sick.

[@jadedjimmy]

Big Joel, I have to admit that my opinion of you was not of the highest at first. Your atrociously incorrect and wrong analysis of the beloved classic Over the Hedge first gave me the assumption that you were just a sillyhead. Then I watched more analyses and your endearing awkwardness grew on me and my love of you is now bursting out like an alien. You have come such a long way and while I do agree with you on every single one of your videos except for one, we can agree to disagree on Over the Hedge. Thank you for everything, Big Joel.

[@jadedjimmy]

@@ljesak It is in my eyes, Keith. It is in my eyes.

[@Humorless_Wokescold]

@@ljesak That's the joke

[@Humorless_Wokescold]

@@ljesak I get ya. As a fellow lover of objectively trash media I've been in that situation once or twice

[@AFrogInTheStars]

That is why i refuse to watch that video. I know i wont like it.

[@nootnewt3]

I like Big Joel but his Over the Hedge analysis was objectively wrong because that movie is fantastic.

[@Cratoz911]

You know what is funny when Stefan lists all those things that might contributed to Elliott's ideology (according to Stefan), he forgots to list himself as he is also one of reasons why people fall into such hateful ideologies. He is a contributer

[@ts4gv]

great point for stefan’s video to be honest, he’r need to count up all the reasons that Elliot cared so much about gender & politics beliefs and add each of them to the straw pile