Well There's Your Problem | Episode 104: Sinking of the S.S. El Faro

[@BirdieRumia]

Animations on the slides? With this WTYP strides boldly into the 1990s. Looking forward to the comemmorative POG set.

[@nicktorrid]

Oh you mean THE DESKTOP PUBLISHING REVOLUTION??

[@GaldirEonai]

It's like Strongbad getting a new Compy model...

[@leaffinite2001]

@@mmmd5692 god i wish adhd was sequestered to the 90s i was born in 2001 and could do without it

[@hyperbolicchamber661]

The Windows Movie Maker program just got released, too. Perfect timing.

[@leaffinite2001]

@Andrew McFadden im glad things turned out well

[@chillzedd8179]

Oh my god this guy wont stop diverting into sports! Im here for the engineering! I'm wearing a blue oxford shirt buttoned up with a pocket protector. I'm sitting here in the Boeing factory and I just want to learn about engineering disasters and I'm really upset.

[@tompain9735]

you have patents on your walls now.

[@boydsinclair7606]

Sure you could find info about engineering disasters in Boeings records.... 🤔

[@BriarLeaf00]

Contract or Union?

[@ItzGuerrero]

Go down to the shop floor

[@TheRealColBosch]

Look out the window!

[@NotJustBikes]

You had me at "without Liam." Edit: aww it's only 10 minutes in and I already miss Liam. 😢

[@adamwhite2364]

I think we found the problem 😕

[@alecward895]

Liam is the worst. Because his absence ruined this episode.

[@Man2quilla]

Can't wait for his reply, lmao

[@Bisquick]

#NayLiam

[@MrTaxiRob]

actionable threats are as much a part of the podcast as engineering disasters and slides

[@GigasGMX]

Tom has created a monster by teaching Justin and Alice about animated slideshows.

[@CykoruKun]

I am sure Justin is to lazy to put that into practice

[@GoredonTheDestroyer]

@@CykoruKun That, or he'll forget how to do it in a week and we'll be back to business as usual here at WTYP Productions, LLC.

[@creampop8553]

@@CykoruKun he tried using a gif and it failed lmao

[@ThePwnageHobo]

Luckily, nothing come of it

[@AbsolXGuardian]

Gd imagine being one of Tom's students and discovering what's basically a lecture from your teacher but unchained. Also as a high school student I can absolutely second that you need to dunk on the kids to establish dominance.

[@usr_name3980]

"Love Boats, Hate Capitalism" is something I want printed in a Live Laugh Love style home decor.

[@usr_name3980]

Also "Alcohol, Adderall, Caffine, Sleep Deprivation, Taurine, Creatine, and Cum." Gotta have that on my wall

[@debrasue2793]

"Girls, Goths, & Gays" has long been something i desire in this vein

[@theoneandonlymichaelmccormick]

Cope Seethe Mald.

[@DistractedGlobeGuy]

"'Ate capi'o'ism. Luv me boa's. Simpo' as."

[@maloyberg]

XD

[@Jonathan-zf6ho]

I love how Alice’s fractions of a law degree gets smaller and smaller as time goes on

[@postoctobrist]

grade deflation

[@danielkorladis7869]

depreciation

[@blackvulture6818]

The half life of a degree is very short

[@Madhouse_Media]

It's prorated like the warranty on a car battery.

[@quantumblauthor7300]

​@@blackvulture6818 Alzheimer's is a side effect of experiential radiation

[@GracefulStars]

The officer saying "ruh-roh" on the bridge recording has corrupted my brain. I know have to all physically stop myself from saying "ruh-roh" anytime even the most minor problem happens at work.

[@AsbestosMuffins]

"Mayday mayday mayday, this is the ss el fero, we have lost propulsion IN THE MIDDLE OF A FUCKING HURRICANE!" lost my shit lol this is why I give you guys money for quality commentary

[@spambot7110]

turns out when he gets really mad he sounds like Bob the Tomato from Veggie Tales

[@JPR3D]

"Free communication with the sea" sounds like the nautical equivalent to "Rapid unscheduled dissembly".

[@imsoawesome2013]

You guys should just get Tom to sub in if any of you are unable from now on. He can be the official substitute teacher for the podcast. I can only imagine the pure chaos if he subs in for Alice or Roz.

[@fuzzydunlop7928]

He is very good.

[@madtheorist1856]

Podcast substitute teacher is exactly his energy in this episode and he's the type that knows he can only do his best to fill in for one day so he's going to have some fun with it

[@thomasdjonesn]

To be honest the only line that I can think of from "Red October" that applies to this episode is "You arrogant ass, you've killed us!"

[@ebnertra0004]

"Red October's turned _into_ the path of the torpedo!" *Mother of God*

[@robin8404]

"a free surface effect, but the liquid is cars" sounds like a particularly florid NUMTOT description of a highway at rush hour

[@jupitersscourge]

who knew electing fetterman would be such a shit idea

[@jilliansmaniotto2326]

lol right? this is like a time capsule

[@johnfitzgerald4456]

Exactly right. And now the shit and rotting meat spawns maggots. Disgusting that's my point.

[@robotmafiagaming]

Time makes fools of us all...

[@Bepples]

Electing Fetterman was a good idea.

[@dayoldbaguettes]

it more just feel sad now. what we said we wanted and could (maybe) have had

[@s4nari]

The diversions that Tom takes from the main topic are the heart and soul of what this podcast is all about. He should be a regular so that episodes (when combined with Liam's and Alice's meanderings) take even longer than the typical hour and a half sojourn.

[@johannageisel5390]

~ 14:30 The Podcastle doctrine ~19:20 In Germany we call cross-legged sitting "Schneidersitz" - "tailor's sit", because tailors used to sit on their large tables like that. As a German who is handsewing an apron while listening to this podcast, I'm fully allowed to sit in this position without it being cultural appropriation. Only, I don't want to sit like it. ^ ^

[@iamjustkiwi]

Best of luck on the apron, hope it comes out well, mad respect for anyone doing handcrafting

[@johannageisel5390]

@@iamjustkiwi Thanks :) The apron is the least complicated of all the parts - I basically only make it because I know I won't be able to completly retailor the dress until the event I want to wear it for, so I need to hide the front lower part of it until I get to it. XD The apron is only a rectangular piece of linen with a waistband.

[@KHK14]

Swedes do too! "Skräddarsitta" or "sitta skräddare"!

[@ubermenschen01]

That is also the supposed reason for the Sartorius muscle's name.

[@wojtektaracinski7977]

We call it "sitting Turkish style" here in Poland, because.... honestly, I have no idea?

[@dylanchouinard6141]

Already ten minutes in and the phrase “Dr. Oz is a crypto-Kemalist” has been created. This is gonna be good

[@Wafflepudding]

You're such a tease for people that just started watching

[@dylanchouinard6141]

@@Wafflepudding Also Anime Karl Marx edit: and load master

[@andrewkelley9405]

@@dylanchouinard6141 I just got to those bits and I was not prepared for those gems.

[@seymoarsalvage]

In a interview of the wife of one of the crew, she said "I would've thrown the captain overboard"

[@sholem_bond]

yep, gotta get rid of the useless extra weight to fix that list

[@tenkiforecast]

Last random weather thing - If you want a fiasco, go look up the story of "Typhoon Cobra", or how Admiral Bull Halsey decided to ignore weather reports and sailed his entire fleet into a *Category 5 Typhoon* Turns out that's what it takes to bend the end of an aircraft cruiser down a full 90 degrees.

[@alexroselle]

There’s even a “Hunt for Red October” drop for that … “Your conclusions were all wrong, Ryan! Hallsey acted stupidly.”

[@TheStig_TG]

@Aditya Chavarkar Note the storm was also power-full enough to break *Multiple* destroyers in half

[@andrewgause6971]

Drachenifel has an excellent video on that.

[@masonhoover165]

@@andrewgause6971drachinifel mentioned 😊

[@Max._Power]

as far as landing dunks on kids as a teacher within the ethics guidelines, a friend of mine who is a teacher told me about a teacher who made it through teaching college and the student teaching process to get his own class for the first time in placement, just so he could *bully highschool students* , he got fired out of the program after his first week in class for encouraging his class to bully a student and making a girl cry after accusing her of trying to seduce him because she *crouched, NOT BENT, down to pick up a pencil she dropped* . imagine being so traumatized by highschool that you go all the way through teachers college just to bully kids

[@tompain9735]

Yeah, ofc I was being sarcastic. There are some absolutely awful people who I question why they became teachers. We’re here to help youth grow and develop into adults, not give them a complex. I’m the teacher the little chuds make fun of in the lunch room because I send them to the principal when they misgender a trans kid or use a homophobic slur. But they won’t say shit to my face because I can bench press them.

[@adamwhite2364]

I wonder if he became a cop after that because that's big cop energy

[@gonzoengineering4894]

Should've gone for phys Ed

[@laseryk]

I had a high school history teacher who made no secret of openly despising all students, especially freshmen. He wore his belt with the buckle to the side, and told anyone who asked that he did it because students always have their belt buckles in front. He would also rush through all the boring dates and shit, so he had more time to teach us about all the really juicy, scandalous parts of history. One of my favorite teachers in high school. Long live Mr. Caldwell.

[@KurtisHord]

Dudes rock

[@AsbestosMuffins]

I'd just call this the Nedelin effect, for when you deliberately engineer a dangerous situation and then by sheer stubbornness create a catastrophe because of it that results in immense instant loss of life

[@ironlynx9512]

1:36:53 This is the kind of situation where the Crew Resource Management Manual says that an acceptable course of action is mutiny

[@sholem_bond]

They 100% should have chosen mutiny. I understand risking being fired is scary, but getting fired > dying, imho.

[@leifsprout]

It's funny but that is what NTSB reports say when a plane crashes with a hierarchical captain. They blame the co-pilot for not taking over when the captain is being an idiot. Examples of plane crashes that the NTSB partially blames the co-pilot for not taking control from the captain: Tenerife - KLM United 173 First Air 6560

[@toprope_]

Please look into accidents on the Great Lakes if you “liked” covering this type of disaster. There’s decades of mining towns ruled by companies (NMU town Marquette was a huge coal and iron port until it became a college city more or less) and overworked sailors working on some of the most intense waters that aren’t in the middle of the ocean. Edmund Fitzgerald is the big one but there are dozens of wrecks and stories that are both actual freak of nature accidents and some that a company would love to write off as one in the history books.

[@roseschneider729]

Honestly the wrecks in Superior alone could warrant their own podcast

[@LtBob38]

But also, read the NTSB report for the Fitz, there were a lot of safety things the company didn't bother with

[@DistractedGlobeGuy]

My personal favourite is that time an entire fleet of railcar ferries sank in a blizzard halfway between Milwaukee and Detroit because the railcars just rolled back into the ramps and smashed them off the ships. You know, because RO/RO ferries are designed specifically to deliver cargo and passengers to the bottom as efficiently as possible.

[@mimisezlol]

The great lakes cases are extra creepy because lakes like superior are a perfect storm for preserving the ships they take. The bottom of Superior is cold and anoxic; the craft and the crew alike lay down there, all but forgotten by time. That's why the Edmund Fitzgerald was declared a graveyard I think?

[@NicoPonder]

miss Liam but Tom was the perfect guy to tag in, this is fuckin hilarious

[@tompain9735]

thank you, bother Liam to write the Catholicism episode so I have an excuse to be back on

[@hellabisys]

@@tompain9735 Oh, hey, it's you! I second the opinion of the person above, you made this into a real banger of an episode

[@TalesOfWar]

@@tompain9735 Yey, Tom!

[@plantain.1739]

You're only saying that because your Russian Tom's cousin.

[@ClaudiaNW]

@@tompain9735 The Catholicism episode should involve someone reading posts from Canon Law Made Easy to Justin, while he sits there in increasing bafflement at the teachings of his own religion.

[@BrandonJudy]

whenever liam isn't on the pod, all the other hosts should ask "where's Liam?"

[@mgkleym]

A cry of Nay Liam should be uttered.

[@fuzzydunlop7928]

He finally committed to the program as a CIA asset. He's on assignment.

[@farmerfella]

I'm sorry, but this is driving me crazy. That's a reference to something. To what is it a reference?

[@walkthroughguy3418]

@@farmerfella The Simpsons. The Poochy episode.

[@farmerfella]

@@walkthroughguy3418 thank you!

[@notthedroidsyourelookingfo4026]

I'm waiting for some tech bro to say "we just need to make ships hurricane-proof", because all solutions must be technical in nature and we mustn't ever learn to simply *not do* something.

[@thisguyducky]

Honestly Tom is hilarious and is one of my favorite guests on the show. But also I miss our angriest boy Liam.

[@tompain9735]

wish Liam was on it too!

[@birkobird]

We want Liam! We want interruptions! We want tangents! On-topic discussion is counterrevolutionary!

[@minikawildflower]

based tangent

[@tompain9735]

Tom is known for never going on tangents.

[@verager2493]

It just isn't the same without censored actionable death threats

[@Turbobuttes]

I miss the yelling and badly adjusted microphone input levels even after he got a better microphone.

[@tompain9735]

@@verager2493 oh there’s one about 2 hours in or so

[@jaysea5939]

Liam may not be in this episode but I'll still "Yay Liam!" (Yay Alice, Yay Roz, Yay Tom et al)

[@nicktorrid]

I can "Yay Liam" through the tears, I can do this, just breathe. Y-yay Liaauuu-huh-huh-huuuuuuuuuuh

[@cas013500]

Yay Liam!

[@GONEmypurpleflapjack]

yay Liam!

[@cvbnmjghutgd]

Best episode in a long time. This guest should do a podcast about boats as well as sports

[@kickinit7881]

let me tell y'all, as someone w adhd this is the earliest i've ever been to something in my life. yay tom.

[@MrxstGrssmnstMttckstPhlNelThot]

yay tom!

[@MrxstGrssmnstMttckstPhlNelThot]

Oh I didn't watch the episode yet and realize the guest was called Tom, I thought you were yaying yourself and I was trying to be encouraging lmao. Yay you also!

[@kickinit7881]

@@MrxstGrssmnstMttckstPhlNelThot lmao ty, that's v sweet :) yay me!

[@tenkiforecast]

As a meteorologist currently working for a private company (trying to get into NWS because it's really competitive, don't get me wrong NOAA has issues but every company does but there's a thing called health insurance I want), I have this to say to Bon Voyage. ... it takes you 6 hours to put that together. Not even feeding it into reference with the ship's planned path. All that is... *why don't you have programs that display data like that quickly?!* All that data's available publicly, put it in layers on a program, that takes 10 minutes! (Also, Accuweather is pure evil) Also, FFS, you're sailing into an area with developing Tropical Storms, and you're refusing to use a forecast more recent than one *two forecast cycles old* in an area that is inherent chaos like the Tropics. One of the reasons that Tropical Cyclones are so difficult to forecast is we have little to no data over the open ocean. Best we get are ship observations, an occasional buoy, and satellite overpasses. That's it. You don't get radar, mesonets, anything like that, and that's also assuming you get the buoys set up and someone doesn't steal everything. So in an evolving situation like a rapidly developing Tropical Cyclone...weather models go wrong *very* quickly.

[@AbsolXGuardian]

Yeah that six hour thing made me go "wtf". NOAA data isn't in prose form, it comes out in a formulaic way. You should be able to write a computer program that parses the data itself and makes the pretty version in just the time such a thing takes to render. I'd put that at less than 10 minutes, but you know the industry. Six hours is atrocious and makes me picture Bon Voyage employees inputing each forecast into photoshop templates by hand each cycle

[@pamdemonia]

This comment thread is why I love this channel. One person rants about something you probably need 5 years professional experience post graduate degree to understand, and gets a reply! Amazing.

[@SatanicBunny666]

Software guy here (no experience with weather related applications thouhg), I agree with everything you said and you're right that as far as I understand, quicker updating should be a non-issue from the developer side of things. The off the top of my head reasons I can come up with for why this wasn't done is simple laziness and incompetence: they may not have had the skills to do it. The more sinister (and unfortunately) more probable reason is business related: this seems like a situation where greedy assholes will look at the situation and go 'hey don't put the latest data in there for free, we can sell that shit for them later as a Premium Feature(tm)." But the bigger underlying issue here seems to be that the captain had seemingly no idea that the data he was getting was old as hell.I'd think that somewhere in there it should give some kind of a time stamp for the data but then again, that doesn't mean anything. Over the course of my career so far I've seen users and testers make so many mistakes because they didn't ask for help, read the instructions, or even sometiems the UI itself.There've been cases where the program will prompt the user and ask 'are you sure you wish to proceed, any unsaved data will be lost" and people will simply not read the promt, click yes, and then go apeshit when they realize they can't get their data back... Users can be really, really dumb at times. And when you add stupid or misinformed users to a shitty and greedy tech company, you lose a ship to a hurricane, apparently.

[@AsbestosMuffins]

you'd think a guy who's used to alaska would be aware that weather can change in a matter of hours or less...

[@ultimatehamsandwich734]

@@SatanicBunny666 how hard would it be from a programmers perspective to change from "click to confirm" to "hold button for X seconds to confirm"?

[@lyingcorrectly]

24:20 Unexploded ordnance is no problem when building apartmemts, because 1) It's probably fine, you can just shake hands with danger, and 2) here in Germany almost every significant city is full of WW2 UXO so before you build anything you just have an EOD company sweep your site.

[@MannoMax]

Or you just roll with it, hire an east german construction crew, and get EOD if they donk a bomb with the digger, and it doesnt instantly go off.

[@dmrr7739]

Ships do last a long time on the Great Lakes. Until 2013, the oldest working laker was the 107-year old Challenger. It was taken out if service because the ancient engine was too expensive to repair. But it wasn’t scrapped- it was converted into a barge and is still being used. Now, the oldest are from WWII. The water preserves people too. They’re still down in the wrecks, only a little worse for wear.

[@Madhouse_Media]

And the current oldest Lake Freighter (Alpena) will be 80 years old next year.

[@sholem_bond]

Lake Superior never gives up her dead

[@thetrainhopper8992]

Speaking of shipping and larceny, my mom told me about when my grandpa was working for the Southern Pacific. He would steal milk from the reefers regularly. Along with motor oil of which I had to despose of 25 gallons of when he died in 2018....he retired in 1993. Also, he remembered when Port Chicago exploded. He was a kid and it blew his house's windows out. They lived on a farm across the bay.

[@wojtektaracinski7977]

Opposite of shipping here, but my great-grandfather used to drive coal truck in Bieszczady (a.k.a Polish part of Carpathians). Suspicious amount of coal was always missing from his transports, but his family and friends rarely had to worry about the cold

[@dfddg7560]

When Tom described how they secured the cars in hold I audibly yelled "You fucking idiots"

[@emilymcelroy3124]

Hey! Hey! Hey! The Pennsylvanians didn't just advise Ghengis Khan on food. We also advised him on political corruption and the great war between the Sheetz Tribe and the Wawa Tribe.

[@zachhoward9099]

Never had Sheetz but have had WaWa’s sandwiches and deeply enjoyed them

[@Theoddert]

Now that you're introducing more PowerPoint features such as clip art and intro pages I demand a "racecar" or "explosion" or "cheering kids" sound effect on every slide change

[@AnxiousGary]

Yes! And sound effects as each letter appears on screen.

[@jbkjbk1999]

i love how much of a tolkien nerd tom clearly is. the straight road to valinor; the nameless things that gnaw at the roots of the world. so good.

[@thomaspatterson1789]

Liam is now sleeping with the fishes. Press F to pay respects

[@HelixFlame33]

Absolutely NO respect for anyone who associates with fish!

[@iamjustkiwi]

Liam would be SO upset if we showed any respect towards anything tangentially related to fish. Fuck them fishes!

[@kjj26k]

I love that this is a part of my life. Yay Liam, Yay Alice, Yay Roz, and everyone who helps make “Well There's Your Problem!”

[@iamjustkiwi]

Same, it's like being a member of an exclusive club with the best community. I'm so glad these guys exist and got together to make this program for all of us plebs.

[@smc4229]

Fucking dying at the PDE standards slide and Alice getting upset about maybe learning something

[@shawnconway6009]

Having listened to most of these by now, I think the episodes I like the most are about bridges and boats. The reason being that the thought processes of the people in charge of building/sailing these things is fascinating. In this case, the fact that captain is utterly delusional and sailing directly into a hurricane is just astounding.

[@sarapocorn]

I‘m an aspiring teacher and the clowning within ethics guidelines so far has worked out beautifully. Great tip + hi from Switzerland.

[@BarackLesnar]

Reminds me of the airliner that broke down while flying, they called the company to ask pretty please can we land or else we'll all die? The company said "don't be so selfish, think of the shareholders" Anyway like a hundred people died when the plane fell out of the sky near San Francisco

[@alexroselle]

Yikes, which air disaster was that? I’ve learned about many of them but not that one.

[@BarackLesnar]

@@alexroselle en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alaska_Airlines_Flight_261 It crashed closer to LA, but the company was really trying to get the doomed crew to make their destination. The cause of the crash was poor maintenance. The parts that control the elevators stopped working and the plane just wanted to go down. The pilots had to roll the plane upside down to make it want to go up. All 88 people aboard died due to corporate greed. The killers were never imprisoned for this crime.

[@ChrisCVW]

Had this Captain really enjoyed The Secret? It seems like he tried to solve this with a positive attitude.

[@Hydraxonthetracker]

Oof that fetterman segment aged like the el faro at 33:32

[@whoever6458]

Two lessons: 1) Never go to sea, especially not on a ship. The only acceptable time to find oneself on a boat at sea is if you've survived the plane crash and they're coming to rescue you. You want to get on a damn boat? Well we have these lovely places called rivers and lakes which, while still dangerous, are not as suicidal as going out to sea. 2) Never trust an optimist with your life. Their words may make you feel better but, when you're life is in danger, guess what, you're not supposed to feel better until you are safer. Don't panic but also don't let some dip shit talk you out of taking reasoned actions to save your life. Knock the damn optimist out if you have to because they will get you killed. Just like reason and panic cannot coincide, reason and optimism can't either. You're going to have to save those people who panic and the optimist if you can drag anyone else out at all but better to have ten panicking people to save than one damn optimist. When they situation is shit, you should feel like shit but you shouldn't be concerned about how you fucking feel when your actual life is in danger. And, Jesus H. Christ, ask me how I know.

[@Alex-js5lg]

"Never trust an optimist with your life." I like that one.

[@zachhoward9099]

I’ll ask: How do you know?

[@louisvictor3473]

What if a Spanish guy was Egyptian? Then he would also be Scottish and immortal, and own an anachronic "katana" for some reason.

[@nathaniellindner313]

I was disappointed they didn't go there, but at least they covered Red October a little later on

[@Full_Otto_Bismarck]

Not only anachronistic but also no katana was ever folded that many times lol However its still the greatest movie ever made, Ricky Bobby said so.

[@GaldirEonai]

The difference between a "boat" and a "ship" depends on context. In a military sense for example a boat is known by a number rather than a proper name and usually carried by another vessel, while a ship has a name and is moving around on its own full-time.

[@turbo1431]

And on the Great Lakes, everything is a boat, regardless of size or power.

[@Bisquick]

Sounds like my wife.

[@WaterMan416]

@daniiel mlinarics when I was in the navy, I heard "a ship can carry a boat, but a boat can never carry a ship." But it falls apart fast because what about heavy lift ships? They can carry ships. But it is useful. Typically boats are carried by ships and don't have a permanent crew or captain. Only crewed when actually in use, often commanded by a coxswain. The direction of lean does play into it because it says a lot about construction and mass. PT boats are constructed and behave like boats, but they were operated like a ship with a permanent crew and captain. Submarines used to be carried by submarine tenders and not crewed full time very early on, so they *were* boats. Now, they're technically ships, but we call them boats because submariners love their tradition.

[@ianbelanger7459]

From the naval architecture perspective, a boat and a ship can be defined by the direct they lean when turning. Boats lean into a turn and ships lean out.

[@IntervencionesGringas]

Liam died on the way back to his home planet

[@leaffinite2001]

The best part of this episode is that the last third had me constantly swinging from anger to sadness to laughing

[@GoodStarfish]

I love how between myself and Alice we couldn't figure out if Tom was being sarcastic about the little orange life boats

[@CatFish107]

Protip for future bridge crews: Forget what the old man is saying, who cares if you get fired for declaring a distress prematurely. If the captain won't radio for help early, just do it yourself. Let others know that you are in trouble early. "Ooopsie, didn't turn out that we needed evacuation, guess I need to find a new job" is a lot better outcome than the alternative. With modern GMDSS radios, you don't even need to speak. It will have a distress button that you either hold down, or do some kind of double tap. It will do its thing all digital like, and send out your location, and (on some models) the nature of your distress (menu diving to set the type). Just blare that out to everyone that you're sinking or on fire, or under pirate attack, whatever. Just shout help. Broadcast early and often. Chickenshit "Leadership" too afraid to be seen (found out) incompetent needs to be bypassed.

[@ebnertra0004]

Also; if the Captain is about to lead you into an obvious but easily-avoidable disaster, consider mutiny

[@cadneemountai2791]

Oh my God this guy won't stop diverting into sports! I'm here for the engineering! I'm wearing a blue Oxford shirt buttoned up with a pocket protector. I'm sitting here in the Boeing factory and I just want to learn about engineering disasters and I'm really upset.

[@TheImpossiBelle]

hey crabnee

[@cadneemountai2791]

@@TheImpossiBelle 🦑

[@iamjustkiwi]

This particular episode is so silly and full of laughs, it really made me feel good. Thanks so much y'all, this is exactly why I've been subscribed to this channel so long. So much free endorphins

[@Theoddert]

Incidently there was actually another cladding fire in East London in 2021, one of the big rich people blocks called New Providence Wharf had a flat destroyed and several floors damaged but they managed to put it out quickly. I was living in the "Eektron Tower" at the time and could see it from there, our building already had 24hr fire warden patrols because we also had flammable cladding.

[@HawkbitAlpha]

20:52 They were thinking of the MS Estonia, if anyone was wondering.

[@raycearcher5794]

If I were in charge of a shipping company I would totally give my boats names like "Elf Arrow" just soother people would have to say them on the radio. Every time another ship would have to radio the Orcish Saber of Thorns, I would laugh maniacally in my tiny windowless office in Michigan.

[@hjt091]

Just a small thing: SS is short for 'screw ship' (as in, a ship that uses a screw propeller as opposed to paddle wheels), rather than steam ship So referring to the El Faro as SS is accurate

[@tompain9735]

it can be screw ship, screw steamer, or steam ship it all works

[@TheStig_TG]

SS has many meanings in the ocean like the other comment stated, but imo most of the names like that mean propulsion, MV means motor vessel etc

[@jilliansmaniotto2326]

incorrect

[@beepthefox]

"WITHOUT LIAM!" Thems fighting words

[@tompain9735]

I fought him to get on.

[@grmpEqweer]

"With Liam" is also fighting words.

[@ThePwnageHobo]

Now in November 2023. That whole Fetterman thing isn't going so well

[@mikehjt]

Again, I love Justin's ads. His voical delivery s my favourite thing about the podcast, other than the engineering which, sometimes, if I'm drunk, I think I almost understand.

[@btomimatsucunard]

Can you do an episode on the Empress of Ireland disaster? I would love to hear Alice's reaction to being trapped in a sinking ship that slips beneath the waves in 14 minutes

[@herpmcderp7666]

Alice, Boats are different from Ships because they lean into turns. Ships lean away from turns because their center of gravity is so much higher than their source of propulsion. Submarines remain boats because their propulsion is generally in line with their center of gravity, due to their teardrop shaped hulls which are quieter underwater.

[@MrJimheeren]

Interesting

[@shannonb3499]

Shoutout to the person on Rt 202 with the "SFTY 3RD" license plate for giving me a good laugh earlier this week

[@birdy_coolbeans]

Liam needs to be louder, angrier, and have access to a time machine. Whenever Liam's not in the show, all the other hosts should be asking, "Where's Liam?"

[@VinceWhitacre]

If he had a time machine, would it not be "when's Liam?"

[@elizabethhicks4181]

@@VinceWhitacre … but no one is asking the real question: “Why is Liam?”

[@VinceWhitacre]

😥

[@EllieODaire]

The barely restrained fury at the captain relying on a shitty weather app rather than data direct from THE GOD DAMMED NHC perfectly encapsulates why I gave up on weather forecasting as a career and went into trucking. I couldn't get into the TV meteorology side because trans lol but I was doing volunteer private forecasting until I could get someone to pay me for it and the last straw was literally begging someone to go inside and take cover during a tornado and them replying "if it's my time it's my time." So anyway I spend my days driving an 80,000 pound behemoth cross country while soccer moms try to trick my Collision Mitigation System into breaking my sternum by exiting interstates from the passing lane directly across my front bumper because IT'S LESS STRESSFUL THAN TRYING TO CONVINCE AMERICANS NOT TO KILL THEMSELVES WITH BAD WEATHER. Anyway keep up the great podcasting y'all!

[@DougKingJax]

Well crap. This episode cuts close to home. It was a big deal when El Faro went down since she was ported here. There's a memorial to the crew by the port.

[@michatarka2642]

The increasing amount of Dune jokes in this podcast makes me a very happy sandworm

[@ernekid7241]

Made some Friday night Chili and there’s a new podcast! Friday night stays winning

[@MrScientifictutor]

Lesson learned: do not take vehicles into hurricanes. Good thing I learned that.

[@KO-vb4tg]

Unless it’s a hurricane hunter aircraft. That might be ok. Be sure to warn and ships you see when you’re out there though.

[@DistractedGlobeGuy]

And also don't put cars on ships.

[@ItzGuerrero]

I think you should have Tom on more often when Liam is here, personally. This is my favorite episode in a long time as much as I miss my big actionable boy on it

[@plasticsquid8914]

Even when absent, Liam steals the spotlight by replacing the guest's name in da thumbnail

[@EsplodingBomb]

The anti-guest

[@tompain9735]

liam-hauntological thought

[@a.p.2356]

The Safety Third story reminded me of the time I was working at a paintball field back in college. I had been drinking heavily the night previously, and woke that morning with the worst hangover I have ever experienced. I was the manager, I had the keys, and I was my co-worker's ride to work, so it's not like I had the option to call in sick. I poured myself into the driver's seat and went to pick up my co-worker. This co-worker was the guy I had been drinking with the night before, and was similarly afflicted. Not being a dick, I told him not to worry about coming in; I needed to be there to open the field, but he really didn't need to be. We didn't have anyone scheduled to come in that day, and the weather wasn't fantastic anyway, so I assumed it would be a very slow day. I continued to work, pausing several times to puke by the side of the road. I eventually arrived, got everything set up, and sat down to focus on not losing what little remained of my breakfast. The building was not connected to the power grid, but I left the generator off to avoid the noise. I was sipping gingerly on a gatorade, and it was nice and quiet out in the woods. Things were looking up. And then a car pulled in. And another, and another and another. From this dread convoy poured approximately 20 middle school aged boys, excitedly yelling and hollering despite the early hour. It was a goddamn birthday party. Now, normally birthday parties were reserved in advance and paid for online. That wasn't strictly necessary (largely because this field was constantly teetering on the edge of going out of business, so it wasn't like we were ever particularly busy), but it did REALLY help speed up the check in process. This group had not done that. Not only did I need to fire up the accursed generator to get the power on, but I had to get my sloshing brain to do math as each of the parents paid for their crotch spawn individually, often in cash. Waivers were signed, equipment was rented out, balls were distributed. Several of the parents gave me understanding and pitying looks. One mother in dark sunglasses even whispered "it's ok. I'm hung over too." Apparently I was not doing a good job of hiding it.

[@a.p.2356]

I managed to stumble my way through the safety speech, went over the rules, put on my mask, and staggered out onto the field to act as the ref. The mask acted as a rebreather for my stale beer/gatorade/vomit breath. The sound of the paintball guns bombarded my tender skull like a Soviet artillery barrage c. 1945 Berlin. The excited yells of the children assaulted my senses like a chainsaw on a chalkboard. At one point later in the afternoon, I excused myself from helping a young lad with his malfunctioning weapon to violently vomit behind the rental shack. My stomach was completely empty at this point, so it was instead attempting to escape my body entirely. I looked up to see the dinner-plate eyes of a 13 year old boy staring at me and stammered out "don't drink alcohol. It's bad" before shakily standing up and wobbling my way back inside. So there's a minor positive: pretty sure I scared that kid straight for life.

[@a.p.2356]

Anyway, that's the story of how I spent a cursed Sunday morning in the middle of a pitched child battle, wishing for the sweet release of death.

[@guardianbob]

Since there's no Liam, I expect Liam to release a commentary track for this episode

[@michapeikert9577]

speaking of swearing in your last moments, the last thing the black box onboard the presidential plane that crashed in smolensk was the entire cockpit crew screaming "KURWA" in unison

[@jilliansmaniotto2326]

“free surface effect but the liquid is cars” actually broke me

[@whyguy5324]

My mom has a friend whose kid graduated from Maine Maritime Academy with a few of the mariners that died on the El Faro. RIP

[@trashpanda6885]

Unionization in the US is really picking up. Almost enough to give a cynical old man some hope.

[@xmlthegreat]

rewatching this in october 2023 and uhh. Fetterman's true colours are showing up and this edition of the goddamn news feeling a little too uncomfortable.

[@robotmafiagaming]

2024 tapping in...I concur.

[@visioneerone]

the comment about the signs in Puerto Rico being in spanish brings up a memory! *many* years ago some friends and I flew in for an airshow. got our rental car, a map and directions to the show location (this was pre-satnav) and hit the road. ~10 minutes after we got on the highway our buddy with the map declared us lost as he couldn’t figure out where we were. His complaint? Every ramp getting off of the highway said it was going to a place called “Salida” but he couldn’t find any such place on the map.

[@TuesdaysArt]

I love the school district learning standards and learning expectations along with the casual structure of the podcast. The contrast intrigues me.

[@theD0gfish]

Tom is very good; please provide more Tom

[@whoever6458]

Okay so I worked at a school as a custodian once many years ago. I also used to hike on the weekends and put rum in a water bottle so that it looked like I was just drinking water while I was walking around all the health-conscious yuppies on the trails. I always refill plastic water bottles until they simply aren't suited to be refilled anymore and so the rum was in one of the typical water bottles. Well, one time, I accidentally took the bottle of rum to work. Thankfully, I always took several bottles with me and the other ones were filled with actual water. Around lunch time, I went in to get a drink of water from the bottles I had placed in the teacher's lounge fridge that morning when I had arrived. As it was lunch time, there were lots of teachers also in the lounge too. Wouldn't you know it, I happened to grab the rum-filled water bottle out of the fridge and took a huge sip from it. When I tasted the rum, I made a sour face and, knowing that several teachers had just so happened to have been looking at me when I did so, I searched desperately for a good excuse for why I had made that face while I swallowed the rum (spitting it out could only have made matters worse). Finally, I said, "Ew, mildew," as I threw that bottle back into my backpack. Then I left the teacher's lounge really quickly since I didn't have any mints or anything at all to get rid of my rum breath. I ended up washing my mouth out with soap and water (a big thanks to my grandma for threatening to do this to me because of my foul language as a child or else I wouldn't have had the idea). I ended up getting tipsy, but having no one actually know this. The principal with in a foul moon that day and yelled at all the custodians. I was lucky to be just drunk enough not to give a fuck and not so drunk as not to be able to get my work done, plus be sober before I had to drive home.

[@whoever6458]

I have also talked to numerous police officers with clear alcohol in my water bottle and/or beer in my 7-11 cup. lol It's the breath that gets you so always have some food to eat or at least some mints to disguise it if you're going to drink in public like that. Otherwise, I am a big fan of drinking in public so long as you are more careful if you go to drive. I have fallen down drunk on my bike but no one has gotten hurt other than me so that's another thing. I highly recommend walking drunk as it is more fun and doesn't hurt as much when one gets to be to the age when one's joints start to do the arthritis thing.

[@opalpersonal]

this podcast makes me consistently cry laughing more than any other piece of media, even after depressing me with the inevitable evils of rampant captilism

[@LostieTrekieTechie]

At 5:00 sucks so much that the giant guy turned out to be a genocide supporter

[@matthamm384]

Well past the start of the episode I realized what ship this was. My last job handled some of the equipment repairs for Seastar/Tote Maritime container/chassis. I remember this ship being a topic of discussion in the office after it disappeared since the stuff going in/out of Jaxport was most of what we dealt with for them.

[@nitehawk86]

41:30 a google search for "mongolian flagged ship" comes up with an article that says: "Mongolian-flagged vessels have been involved in fatal accidents, illegal smuggling, implicated in helping rogue states avoid sanctions regimes, and are currently used to host floating arsenals with no oversight."

[@nitehawk86]

Also I bet the mongolians would be down for some scrapple. They invented steak/horse tartare.

[@tompain9735]

they love running down the Delaware in a dense fog with no nav lights or audio signals

[@skonkfactory]

there's perrow's "normal accident theory", I'd like to propose that this was "inevitable disaster theory"

[@thehaprust6312]

I will point out that a Roman Emperor could also say "I have to go update my apse!"

[@zyavoosvawleilte1308]

I cant believe it has been 1/4 of an afghan war since Grenfel

[@Fuzzycuffsqt]

I always imagined an anime karl marx would look more like the walrus taxi driver guy

[@RobRoseKnows]

the lack of Liam in this episode is unnerving

[@oldmanramblingatclouds]

I wouldn't say it's nice, but it's certainly _nicer_

[@tompain9735]

You’ll live.

[@AGenericMoron]

@@tompain9735 at least until Liam gets back. After that, well uhhh Yay Liam.

[@cgunugc]

It's terrible. Who else reminds people to shout Yay Liam? I miss him so

[@marvintpandroid2213]

I feel a disturbance in the farce.

[@TrashHeapCustodian]

My only request for future episodes if animation becomes a thing is for at least one slide to use a star wipe transition

[@Madhouse_Media]

Bonus points if there's also a Kiki Stockhammer wipe.

[@full_of_blood]

tom was a fantastic guest, i hope yall have him back on some time!

[@vontosmagicmurderbag2611]

I keep hearing "Elf Arrow," and now I want to buy a boat just so I can name it that.

[@tompain9735]

fun fact: medieval assholes thought elves would shoot invisible arrows at people to make them sick

[@TheShortStory]

2:26:00 is one of the best laughs this podcast (and I) have had in a while. Lord Jesus! I appreciate you guys and gal

[@spamviking]

As a point to add to the Safety Third, Monster does in fact make a pineapple flavoured energy drink. It's effect on cum remains unknown.

[@tompain9735]

we need research on this

[@SequoiaAlexander]

Good thing we got fetterman and not those aipac people! Also I just woke up from a coma and haven’t checked the news in 9 months but this episode is great!